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I don't want to criticize Tom, I won't criticize Tom, but the fact is I would have been happier if he wouldn't have played him, said Accorsi, who had such a strong conviction on Manning that he engineered a draft-day trade with the Chargers to get him. |
but I (think I) remember thinking at the time that even though they might be over .500, that they sucked and weren't going anywhere.
I don't see them doing the same thing again if they're over .500. They were not beholden to Warner in any way whatsoever; he was a mercenary. (I say that as someone who doesn't think they 'owe' Eli a damn thing).
But, if they're under .500 8-10 games into the season, they need to pull the trigger. If they miss the playoffs, don't get a top 5-10 pick, and also don't get 6-8 legitimate games of experience for Jones, that's about the maximum level of failure that can be made of this season from a long-term organizational perspective as far as I'm concerned.
But from a football perspective, the 2004 plan seemed to work out just fine regardless of Ernie's objections.
Beating a dead horse here, but a vet stop gap would have made the transition a lot easier.
No one would have cared if we benched Fitz Magic or Tyrod Taylor week 6
I am hoping Eli makes this a moot point for now and next year.
There is a big difference here though. Coughlin versus Shurmur. Tom was a Welly favorite, was a coach on a Giants championship team, and had a lot of prior success as a Head Coach. He was going to have a little more room to implement the program but wanted to get to it quicker with Eli.
Shurmur. What if Eli plays well all year and the Giants miss playoffs at 9-7? Re-sign Eli?, insert Jones next year with what team expectations? Can Shurmur go three years without the playoffs in that scenario? Cloudy for me.
good observation
The thing is, even the pros don't know. As great of a player as Tiki was he couldn't see the forest for the trees. I hate that saying but it's applicable.
Eli needed a lot of seasoning though.... you saw flashes after year one but he really wasn't ready. Jones on the other hand already looks like a Bona fide pro. Should be interesting... lol
I want to see Jones play this year and get some meaningful experience, but not unless/until it's clear that the team isn't going anywhere in 2019, or unless/until it becomes overwhelmingly clear through whatever scenario that Jones gives the team a better chance to win at that moment.
While I do think it's in the best interest long-term for Jones to get some legitimate experience in 2019, there are also 50 other non-QBs on the roster, many of which will only have a few years in this league - it's not fair to them to have a chunk of their career cast aside in favor of one player's development.
I think many coaches would rather throw the QB in and let him deal with it. There is something to be said of baptism under fire as they say.
The military places officer candidates under extreme stress early on. Why? How one handles stress is a great indicator of leadership potential. TC was a big military fan and his QB needed to be a leader.
Secondly, Shurmur's system is infinitely more QB friendly than Coughlin's. Plus Jones has feet that can scoot.
I remember a moment of him almost breaking under the pressure of it all. It was at that game where he threw something like 4ints. Shockey was running the wrong routes and being an idiot. Fans were yelling at him from the stands that “he’s not a Manning”. The cameras caught Kareem McKenzie going up to Eli and telling him to hang in there.
The article makes some good observations and it’s always great to get some Accorsi quotes. I love hearing Accorsi talk about the Giants.
Secondly, Shurmur's system is infinitely more QB friendly than Coughlin's. Plus Jones has feet that can scoot.
Um, sorry to tell you this, but Eli is a legend to many.
I remember a moment of him almost breaking under the pressure of it all. It was at that game where he threw something like 4ints. Shockey was running the wrong routes and being an idiot. Fans were yelling at him from the stands that “he’s not a Manning”. The cameras caught Kareem McKenzie going up to Eli and telling him to hang in there.
The article makes some good observations and it’s always great to get some Accorsi quotes. I love hearing Accorsi talk about the Giants.
The Vikings game? That was in 2007, but yeah, that was a tough one.
Eli dying on the field of old age.
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Eli’s transition was one of the most brutal of any QB coming in. The Giants and fans are lucky Eli is so damn mentally strong.
I remember a moment of him almost breaking under the pressure of it all. It was at that game where he threw something like 4ints. Shockey was running the wrong routes and being an idiot. Fans were yelling at him from the stands that “he’s not a Manning”. The cameras caught Kareem McKenzie going up to Eli and telling him to hang in there.
The article makes some good observations and it’s always great to get some Accorsi quotes. I love hearing Accorsi talk about the Giants.
The Vikings game? That was in 2007, but yeah, that was a tough one.
Yes! Thank you. Just a brutal day for the young QB. Hard to watch
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what are the dangers of not making a transition?
Eli dying on the field of old age.
would be a bad look, indeed
Dogs and cats, living together...
Dogs and cats, living together...
the world is already upside down, wouldn't this be the last straw?
After what happen to McAdoo and the upper management hanging him out for the change. (he did blow it going to Geno Smith)
Also, will Gettleman stay out of the decision as Accorsi did?
I personally don't think Shurmur has the balls to pull the plug and Manning will play out the whole season even if it 4-12 year.
Also about the team. It had guys like Strahan, Tiki, Toomer, and Shockey that weren't interested in the growing pains of a rookie QB. I think this roster is different in that it doesn't have those kind of veterans. This team has a lot of young guys who could be around with Daniel Jones and the older players are basically short-term guys.
Good article. I read it yesterday and was going to create a thread about it too.
Dogs and cats, living together...
Shurmur's system makes it easier for a rookie to come in and play as a newbie. It's flexible and and will allow Jones to play to his strengths.
Coughlin's was a rigid system that a QB had to adapt to, not visa versa.
That's the difference.
I am hoping Eli makes this a moot point for now and next year.
There is a big difference here though. Coughlin versus Shurmur. Tom was a Welly favorite, was a coach on a Giants championship team, and had a lot of prior success as a Head Coach. He was going to have a little more room to implement the program but wanted to get to it quicker with Eli.
Shurmur. What if Eli plays well all year and the Giants miss playoffs at 9-7? Re-sign Eli?, insert Jones next year with what team expectations? Can Shurmur go three years without the playoffs in that scenario? Cloudy for me.
I don’t believe there is anything short of winning the Super Bowl that keeps Jones from being the starter next season.
I get some fans have such allegiance to Eli they don’t want to let go.
But can’t see how Jones sitting two seasons is in the best interest of the team
joeinpa.....I believe Eli will have one last run in him. If not then the team should move to Jones immediately. I said "cloudy" in the event that the team and Eli play very well and fall a little short. Sorry, but I would not be ready to pass the torch to Jones with a team that had Super Bowl aspirations the following year. Also "cloudy" is what do you do with Shurmur. Give him till the fourth year to get in the playoffs?