In fact, its a little suspicious. Remember several years back where the Steelers signed LeGarrette Blount as a FA, only to get him back several weeks into the season after he jogged off the field before the game was over.
Funny how the antics get what they want- and then end up in a better spot...
In fact, its a little suspicious. Remember several years back where the Steelers signed LeGarrette Blount as a FA, only to get him back several weeks into the season after he jogged off the field before the game was over.
Funny how the antics get what they want- and then end up in a better spot...
Because everyone wants to play there and win a SB. And it's "the Patriots Way" -- if he fucks up, BB will cut him in a heartbeat. It'll be part of his deal. And he'll accept that because it's the Pats.
$9M is just the signing bonus. It's a 1 yr deal worth up to $15M. Pats are certainly betting a good chunk of change that he'll keep it together this year and not become a problem.
The Patriots were trending on twitter right after Brown was released. lol. Bill will cut him in an instant if he doesn't act like a good soldier.
Well they just gave him a $9 million signing bonus
This is fishy as hell and probably pre-meditated by both camps but the Raiders are really a bunch of assclowns for not suspending brown a few weeks instead of pulling this, and the trade to begin with and Mayock in general is completely in over his head in the role. He’s Matt Millen bad at this.
This is fishy as hell and probably pre-meditated by both camps but the Raiders are really a bunch of assclowns for not suspending brown a few weeks instead of pulling this, and the trade to begin with and Mayock in general is completely in over his head in the role. He’s Matt Millen bad at this.
This isn't on Mayock. It's on the $10M Man - Gruden. Mayock is essentially the CPA and Chief Compliance Officer for Gruden...
It really isn't. He went scorched earth in oakland over the helmet and the fines. It happens when you have unstable people in your organization. It's their nature to be unpredictable.
Bill will have no more control over whether Brown keeps it together than anyone else. Why? Because anything can be the match that starts his fire. It doesn't need to be rational or justified. It just has to happen.
So we'll have to wait and see what happens in new england. If he pulls the same junk he did in oakland the results will be the same. He'll be on the street earning no money. 'Guarantee' or not in the NFL if you violate the CBA or contractual language you don't get paid.
This is fishy as hell and probably pre-meditated by both camps but the Raiders are really a bunch of assclowns for not suspending brown a few weeks instead of pulling this, and the trade to begin with and Mayock in general is completely in over his head in the role. He’s Matt Millen bad at this.
This isn't on Mayock. It's on the $10M Man - Gruden. Mayock is essentially the CPA and Chief Compliance Officer for Gruden...
Mayock is the idiot who decided to fine AB 65k for missing meaningless practices in August when he’s been in the league over a decade. Did the cowboys fine Zeke and make him go game to game this year for skipping the entire camp?
It’s a Mickey Mouse, cheap organization with a GM way out of his depth. It’s not like anyone loved their draft this year either. Yes Gruden Bears some responsibility here too but he did come across as on ABs side throughout all the helmet etc issues - mayock continuously antagonized
Ocho was stinko done when he went to the pats. Brown isn’t physically done not by a long shot. He will go nuts this year for the pats probably on and off the field. But he’s going to produce big.
This is fishy as hell and probably pre-meditated by both camps but the Raiders are really a bunch of assclowns for not suspending brown a few weeks instead of pulling this, and the trade to begin with and Mayock in general is completely in over his head in the role. He’s Matt Millen bad at this.
This isn't on Mayock. It's on the $10M Man - Gruden. Mayock is essentially the CPA and Chief Compliance Officer for Gruden...
Mayock is the idiot who decided to fine AB 65k for missing meaningless practices in August when he’s been in the league over a decade. Did the cowboys fine Zeke and make him go game to game this year for skipping the entire camp?
It’s a Mickey Mouse, cheap organization with a GM way out of his depth. It’s not like anyone loved their draft this year either. Yes Gruden Bears some responsibility here too but he did come across as on ABs side throughout all the helmet etc issues - mayock continuously antagonized
give people the ability to choose their own destiny, or they will find their own way to choose it.
NFL is gonna be the binary land of 1-year deals and huge cap-breaking overpays and nothing in between. I think we’re also done seeing skill-players fight through injuries
You have no idea how to run an organization. Seriously you are clueless. If a team doesn't have accountability it doesn't win games. If Brown tries anything like this in new england or anywhere else the result will be the same. He'll be on the sidewalk. Think.
Mayock is the idiot who decided to fine AB 65k for missing meaningless practices in August when he’s been in the league over a decade. Did the cowboys fine Zeke and make him go game to game this year for skipping the entire camp?
It’s a Mickey Mouse, cheap organization with a GM way out of his depth. It’s not like anyone loved their draft this year either. Yes Gruden Bears some responsibility here too but he did come across as on ABs side throughout all the helmet etc issues - mayock continuously antagonized
I can certainly see your point. But what if it was a good cop/bad cap move where Gruden tells Mayock to fine him; and Gruden completes the ruse by gathering around the press to tell them how much he loves AB?
Do you really think Gruden didn't sign off on those fines?
'go nuts this year for the pats probably on and off the field.' Â
give people the ability to choose their own destiny, or they will find their own way to choose it.
NFL is gonna be the binary land of 1-year deals and huge cap-breaking overpays and nothing in between. I think we’re also done seeing skill-players fight through injuries
Mayock is the idiot who decided to fine AB 65k for missing meaningless practices in August when he’s been in the league over a decade. Did the cowboys fine Zeke and make him go game to game this year for skipping the entire camp?
It’s a Mickey Mouse, cheap organization with a GM way out of his depth. It’s not like anyone loved their draft this year either. Yes Gruden Bears some responsibility here too but he did come across as on ABs side throughout all the helmet etc issues - mayock continuously antagonized
I can certainly see your point. But what if it was a good cop/bad cap move where Gruden tells Mayock to fine him; and Gruden completes the ruse by gathering around the press to tell them how much he loves AB?
Do you really think Gruden didn't sign off on those fines?
It’s hard to know the politics of whats going on out there. But when you antagonize a star non qb player all summer (and give up a third for him during the spring when no one else was interested in acquiring him), then fine and cut him - 4 hours later the GOAT signs the same player for 15 mil, 9 mil in signing bonus — you look and are waaaay out of your depth
Matt Millen II
Gruden definitely looks stupid here too. The whole organization is an embarrassment
yeah I did in one of the fantasy football threads. Someone was being offered a trade for AB and I told the guy to hold onto him because he will end up on the Patriots
You don't pay attention very well. It's not guaranteed if he screws up and is a bad citizen there. He only gets his money if he plays by the rules.
If he was willing and able to do that he'd still be in oakland. Maybe he's worried enough about earning that $15M that he'll show up, shut up and play. We'll see.
(and often BBI-posted apporach) and added a good locker-room guys that help with the culture...
C'mon, this is obviously a dice roll for NE, and they are maybe the one team in the league where they can make these situations work - having a coach like Bill B and QB like Brady can help fix some of those 'culture' issues...and if the antics keep up, Belichick will cut him too.
The fines were a fairly standard deal, and AB freaked out for no reason. Maybe he wanted to be cut. But most teams can't handle distractions like this - they can drag the whole team down, hell look at PIT last year....
According to an earlier post of cap space for all 32 teams Â
Fair enough. From what I've observed he doesn't seem to have it all together right now. Fear of losing $15M would make me behave better too though. We'll see.
RE: RE: Belichick is obviously following the NY Giant approach Â
(and often BBI-posted apporach) and added a good locker-room guys that help with the culture...
C'mon, this is obviously a dice roll for NE, and they are maybe the one team in the league where they can make these situations work - having a coach like Bill B and QB like Brady can help fix some of those 'culture' issues...and if the antics keep up, Belichick will cut him too.
You don't pay attention very well. It's not guaranteed if he screws up and is a bad citizen there. He only gets his money if he plays by the rules.
If he was willing and able to do that he'd still be in oakland. Maybe he's worried enough about earning that $15M that he'll show up, shut up and play. We'll see.
I haven’t seen the details - signing bonus usually means... you get that right away? What did I miss?
When assessing who's actually crazy in a relationship -- typically the analysis revolves around if either party 'coincidentally' runs into a lot crazy situations outside of the relationship.
That wouldn't help in this scenario.
RE: RE: RE: Belichick is obviously following the NY Giant approach Â
(and often BBI-posted apporach) and added a good locker-room guys that help with the culture...
C'mon, this is obviously a dice roll for NE, and they are maybe the one team in the league where they can make these situations work - having a coach like Bill B and QB like Brady can help fix some of those 'culture' issues...and if the antics keep up, Belichick will cut him too.
Uh, ya' think? You missed the point...
A reference to the many moves made this year, such as moving a talented WR who may have caused some locker room issues? I get it just don't see the point to take a shot at the team we all supposedly root for...I wasn't a huge fan of the Beckham deal at first, and his antics never approached the AB level, but he's gone, we got a decent return, and I'm excited to see what the team can do this season.
If there's more involved here, maybe I don't spend enough time on BBI and it did go over my head. But there do seem to be quite a few people around here who take any chance to take a shot at the team the are supposedly fans of - and yes, they haven't given us a ton to root for lately, but a rebuild was needed and I for one like quite a few of the moves made...
Little Bill will reign him in, the champioship game now goes through Â
There's no doubt in my mind that OBJ would rather be in NY, CA, or FL than CL or any other midwestern city. I think it's quite possible he demands either a trade or an astronomical sum of money after this year.
It’s hard to know the politics of whats going on out there. But when you antagonize a star non qb player all summer (and give up a third for him during the spring when no one else was interested in acquiring him), then fine and cut him - 4 hours later the GOAT signs the same player for 15 mil, 9 mil in signing bonus — you look and are waaaay out of your depth
Matt Millen II
Gruden definitely looks stupid here too. The whole organization is an embarrassment
It really isn't to me. Mark Davis gave Gruden $100M to run the organization. Essentially, he's wearing the same hat has Belichick. Mayock is basically the Chief Administration Officer, making sure they are cap compliant, crossing their T's, dotting their I's, and, this is what he's good at, doing player personnel.
So I would be stunned if Mayock did ANYTHING is this lunacy that Gruden didn't know and sign off on...
I think Oak looks bad for trading for him and giving him a contract in the 1st place. The fines weren't anything out of the ordinary, Brown just blew them up (kinda like he's made a huge deal of everything since he moved to Oak, like his frozen feet, helmet, etc...). This is more on Brown's reaction, unless there's something more we don't know about. But Oak knew this was a risk after last year, and took it knowing this kind of thing could/would happen.
It's different for a team like NE that is more veteran and has that 'culture' in place already...I'd guess Brown knows it's best behavior or he's gone - but NE has proved before they can make these situations work, unlike most teams...
They also know when it isn't working and won't allow the situation to become toxic. He'd just be sent packing.
What would be interesting is if he comes in, settles down, plays great...then in week 15 loses his shit. Haha I'd love to see bill put in that situation.
This is the first time I can recall a team trying to go after a guys guaranteed money after fines. Gruden seemed ready to move on. And “just win baby”
They had to do it. You thought they were going to be just ok with the way the last few days have gone, patted him on the back and moved on.
They did what they needed to do. They weren't going to risk AB being a nightmare over the longterm period of the contract.
They let AB just play he gets all that money, and there are no repercussions if he fucks up again. They needed to gain control again. He could have gained every penny of that money back if he just shut up and play football that point.
I think Oak looks bad for trading for him and giving him a contract in the 1st place. The fines weren't anything out of the ordinary, Brown just blew them up (kinda like he's made a huge deal of everything since he moved to Oak, like his frozen feet, helmet, etc...). This is more on Brown's reaction, unless there's something more we don't know about. But Oak knew this was a risk after last year, and took it knowing this kind of thing could/would happen.
It's different for a team like NE that is more veteran and has that 'culture' in place already...I'd guess Brown knows it's best behavior or he's gone - but NE has proved before they can make these situations work, unlike most teams...
As you surmise above, simply put...the Pats don't need anybody to do anything other than their job on the field. Their winning culture will be intact whether AB is on the team or not.
his locker room. He cares about talent apparently.
This is a dumb comment. The culture is already set in New England. If Brown doesn’t buy in they’ll dump him like they’ve done with plenty of other players.
In comment 14562733 Gman11 said:
[quote] Now all guys have to do is insult the GM and act like a lunatic so they can sign with another team. [/quote
Yes Ageed. Not good
I guess AB sets all the WR Diva precedents. The last one he set was a major reason why the Giants decided to move OBJ. At least that was part of the narrative here.
his locker room. He cares about talent apparently.
This is a dumb comment. The culture is already set in New England. If Brown doesn’t buy in they’ll dump him as they’ve done with plenty of other players.
You win with talent, not a Russian roulette of street FAs. Bill gets it.
In comment 14562733 Gman11 said:
[quote] Now all guys have to do is insult the GM and act like a lunatic so they can sign with another team. [/quote
Yes Ageed. Not good
I guess AB sets all the WR Diva precedents. The last one he set was a major reason why the Giants decided to move OBJ. At least that was part of the narrative here.
And that narrative is looking a lot closer to reality than it was a week ago.
the Pats basically have an ironclad culture. So they aren't going to be phased by the AB Show because they know BB will cut bait without any hesitation.
Therefore, this becomes low risk, high reward. The most malleable sports franchise ever - in my eyes - will either make it work with AB or likely make it work without him...
I think Oak looks bad for trading for him and giving him a contract in the 1st place. The fines weren't anything out of the ordinary, Brown just blew them up (kinda like he's made a huge deal of everything since he moved to Oak, like his frozen feet, helmet, etc...). This is more on Brown's reaction, unless there's something more we don't know about. But Oak knew this was a risk after last year, and took it knowing this kind of thing could/would happen.
It's different for a team like NE that is more veteran and has that 'culture' in place already...I'd guess Brown knows it's best behavior or he's gone - but NE has proved before they can make these situations work, unlike most teams...
As you surmise above, simply put...the Pats don't need anybody to do anything other than their job on the field. Their winning culture will be intact whether AB is on the team or not.
Different situation than the Giants currently though - we're trying to build that. I wouldn't have wanted them to sign AB, I doubt it would have worked out here. We're still building that culture
Anyway not trying to argue as it seems we kinda agree here...just hoping the moves we made work out for the upcoming season and beyond. The eve of the season has me excited, despite our team being closer to the beginning of a rebuild than the end
his locker room. He cares about talent apparently.
This is a dumb comment. The culture is already set in New England. If Brown doesn’t buy in they’ll dump him as they’ve done with plenty of other players.
You win with talent, not a Russian roulette of street FAs. Bill gets it.
You don’t get it. Organizational stability and a strong culture in New England allows Bill to take shots like this. Ironically none of his WR moves like this have worked out in the past outside of Moss, where they came up short in the SB.
the Pats basically have an ironclad culture. So they aren't going to be phased by the AB Show because they know BB will cut bait without any hesitation.
Therefore, this becomes low risk, high reward. The most malleable sports franchise ever - in my eyes - will either make it work with AB or likely make it work without him...
after 4:00PM. Most speculation, whether serious or not, all name New England as a landing spot. It's announced he is a Patriot within 45 minutes. This has tampering all over it, and it started weeks ago. I've never seen a player try so hard to get cut. Issues with his helmet, feet, the fines, the fucking apology, and then the youtube video. I wonder what Vontaze Burfict will do to him next time they play against each other.
his locker room. He cares about talent apparently.
This is a dumb comment. The culture is already set in New England. If Brown doesn’t buy in they’ll dump him as they’ve done with plenty of other players.
You win with talent, not a Russian roulette of street FAs. Bill gets it.
I don't think looking at the Pats, and concluding they win solely based in superior talent as opposed to system/culture, is really an accurate reading of the situation. Many would argue the opposite - the Pats are willing to walk away from talent that doesn't buy in to the system, but that culture does allow them to gamble sometimes and see if they can recover a talent that has had issues elsewhere...knowing they will cut bait if that player doesn't follow the rules...
It’s hard to know the politics of whats going on out there. But when you antagonize a star non qb player all summer (and give up a third for him during the spring when no one else was interested in acquiring him), then fine and cut him - 4 hours later the GOAT signs the same player for 15 mil, 9 mil in signing bonus — you look and are waaaay out of your depth
Matt Millen II
Gruden definitely looks stupid here too. The whole organization is an embarrassment
How did he antagonize Brown? Brown openly disrespected him in front of the entire team. This was after the whole foot incident where he came and went in camp. Then the helmet incident where he just disappeared for days without notice. He wasn't fined for that. Then he mocks the Raiders for fining him on social media. Mayock was not the antagonist here.
Brown was a warrior in Pittsburgh. He never said a word about anything and got no bad press until Pitt didn't want to pay him. He took the money from Oakland, got out there and probably realized it was a clown car.
He will go to the Pats and do what he did in Pittsburgh- catch passes, score td's, make the playoffs and go for a ring.
You culture warriors are all so full of shit. You want a good culture? acquire talent and win games and the culture will take care of itself.
This is fishy as hell and probably pre-meditated by both camps but the Raiders are really a bunch of assclowns for not suspending brown a few weeks instead of pulling this, and the trade to begin with and Mayock in general is completely in over his head in the role. He’s Matt Millen bad at this.
This isn't on Mayock. It's on the $10M Man - Gruden. Mayock is essentially the CPA and Chief Compliance Officer for Gruden...
Mayock is the idiot who decided to fine AB 65k for missing meaningless practices in August when he’s been in the league over a decade. Did the cowboys fine Zeke and make him go game to game this year for skipping the entire camp?
It’s a Mickey Mouse, cheap organization with a GM way out of his depth. It’s not like anyone loved their draft this year either. Yes Gruden Bears some responsibility here too but he did come across as on ABs side throughout all the helmet etc issues - mayock continuously antagonized
Might need to call the Giants a Mickry Mouse organization, too. Watch America's Game Super Bowl XLII. Strahan got fined for missing training camp. Suggested if he should have skipped training camp and paid the fine every year.
The deal is done within one hour of when the bell rang and the Pats give him all that guaranteed money???? This smells really bad and I am sure the league is not at all thrilled with the way this has unfolded. Who would give that much guaranteed money to a guy who has acted the way he has acted over the last year??? Answer... nobody unless you had inside information. Throw in the fact that his agent Drew Rosenhaus is also a major sleeze bag and this needs to be looked at VERY carefully by the league.
I'm confused. Given the Raiders are moving to Lost Wages, they seem to be unloading talent and collecting draft picks, right? So why the hell did they sign AB to begin with?
It seem to me to be counter strategic to begin with. Whoever led this decision to sign AB should be looked at critically. Because it is a royal screw up.
The deal is done within one hour of when the bell rang and the Pats give him all that guaranteed money???? This smells really bad and I am sure the league is not at all thrilled with the way this has unfolded. Who would give that much guaranteed money to a guy who has acted the way he has acted over the last year??? Answer... nobody unless you had inside information. Throw in the fact that his agent Drew Rosenhaus is also a major sleeze bag and this needs to be looked at VERY carefully by the league.
Tampering.
Belichek would sell his soul to win. Unbelievable.
I guarantee you that drew rosenhaus was working the phones immediately after the raiders notified him that Antonio brown was going to be released. He is allowed to do that. Teams could talk numbers and even have an agreement in place. But the team just couldn't officially sign him until 4 PM.
I have no idea how many teams had any real interest (I would bet not many), but you don't need many. You need one team willing to pay and the Patriots did.
wanted to be a Raider, he wanted to go to a contender. I honestly think he did all he could to get his ass released so he can sign with the team he really wanted to be a part of. He is crazy but not that crazy
Patriots tend to cut people who start whining, particularly about how much they should be paid. I am curious to see what happens, if AB keeps his mouth shut and does great job on the field. Is he going to command what he wants with the Patriots at that point? I doubt it.
Patriots tend to cut people who start whining, particularly about how much they should be paid. I am curious to see what happens, if AB keeps his mouth shut and does great job on the field. Is he going to command what he wants with the Patriots at that point? I doubt it.
it's a 1 year deal. he can do whatever he wants next year as can the Patriots.
I think I heard it about 5-6 years ago from someone on here..
We all heard it 16 years ago almost to the day when the Patriots cut Lawyer Milloy and Tom Jackson said "let me be clear this team hates their coach, he's lost the locker room"
yet, like a cockroach in a nuclear bomb, Belichick doesn't just survive, he thrives, while all those around him perish.
RE: RE: RE: Beginning of the end for the Pats... Â
We all heard it 16 years ago almost to the day when the Patriots cut Lawyer Milloy and Tom Jackson said "let me be clear this team hates their coach, he's lost the locker room"
yet, like a cockroach in a nuclear bomb, Belichick doesn't just survive, he thrives, while all those around him perish.
And traded Richard Seymour. And didn't re-sign Willie McGuinest. Traded Jamie Collins. Let Deion Branch walk...etc, etc, etc...
RE: RE: RE: RE: Beginning of the end for the Pats... Â
We all heard it 16 years ago almost to the day when the Patriots cut Lawyer Milloy and Tom Jackson said "let me be clear this team hates their coach, he's lost the locker room"
yet, like a cockroach in a nuclear bomb, Belichick doesn't just survive, he thrives, while all those around him perish.
And traded Richard Seymour. And didn't re-sign Willie McGuinest. Traded Jamie Collins. Let Deion Branch walk...etc, etc, etc...
traded Deion Branch for a 1st round pick. LOL.
let Nate Solder walk.
let Vereen walk
let Asante Samuel walk
let Wilfork walk
let Welker walk
traded Randy Moss
so much more, the Patriots will survive until Belichick hangs them up.
Brown was a warrior in Pittsburgh. He never said a word about anything and got no bad press until Pitt didn't want to pay him. He took the money from Oakland, got out there and probably realized it was a clown car.
He will go to the Pats and do what he did in Pittsburgh- catch passes, score td's, make the playoffs and go for a ring.
You culture warriors are all so full of shit. You want a good culture? acquire talent and win games and the culture will take care of itself.
You’re full of shit. There’s a reason the Steelers shipped him out of town for pennies on the dollar despite insane production the last 6 years.
Do you own a TV? Have you seen Brown recently? The guy is a clown. This is a gamble the Pats can take because they don’t need him to him games.
That once again pats being shady pats. Never fails. If it isn’t every year it’s every other year something weird happens with this franchise. This whole brown thing reeks of being weird. Belichick has to be the best and shadiest HC all time. Not even close.
That once again pats being shady pats. Never fails. If it isn’t every year it’s every other year something weird happens with this franchise. This whole brown thing reeks of being weird. Belichick has to be the best and shadiest HC all time. Not even close.
He's playing chess and almost everyone else is learning how to color inside the lines.
This is fishy as hell and probably pre-meditated by both camps but the Raiders are really a bunch of assclowns for not suspending brown a few weeks instead of pulling this, and the trade to begin with and Mayock in general is completely in over his head in the role. He’s Matt Millen bad at this.
This isn't on Mayock. It's on the $10M Man - Gruden. Mayock is essentially the CPA and Chief Compliance Officer for Gruden...
Mayock is the idiot who decided to fine AB 65k for missing meaningless practices in August when he’s been in the league over a decade. Did the cowboys fine Zeke and make him go game to game this year for skipping the entire camp?
It’s a Mickey Mouse, cheap organization with a GM way out of his depth. It’s not like anyone loved their draft this year either. Yes Gruden Bears some responsibility here too but he did come across as on ABs side throughout all the helmet etc issues - mayock continuously antagonized
Might need to call the Giants a Mickry Mouse organization, too. Watch America's Game Super Bowl XLII. Strahan got fined for missing training camp. Suggested if he should have skipped training camp and paid the fine every year.
The Giants and Strahan negotiated a *heavily* discounted fine for Strahan missing all of camp that year. Brown was fined $65K for missing something like 3 practices. Not at all similar.
And the Giants didn't go after MS' guarantees either.
That once again pats being shady pats. Never fails. If it isn’t every year it’s every other year something weird happens with this franchise. This whole brown thing reeks of being weird. Belichick has to be the best and shadiest HC all time. Not even close.
He didn’t want Pittsburgh to feel like they won by trading him where they felt like. So he played bonkers until they cut him.
It’s clear he wants a ring. And he wants to stick it to Pittsburgh. New England is one of their biggest rivals of the last 15 years. And the best shot for a ring.
This was his plan from the day he got traded. I think he was expecting the Raiders to balk when he demanded more money but they complied. So he had to go the crazy route to get cut.
what are you arguing? You think if AB “just missed some practice” it would have gone down this way? He dragged that franchise in the mud, spit on them and then wiped his ass with them.
How is Strahans offseason that year at all comparable to Browns?
I guarantee you that drew rosenhaus was working the phones immediately after the raiders notified him that Antonio brown was going to be released. He is allowed to do that. Teams could talk numbers and even have an agreement in place. But the team just couldn't officially sign him until 4 PM.
I have no idea how many teams had any real interest (I would bet not many), but you don't need many. You need one team willing to pay and the Patriots did.
LOL, yeah ok. When the Raiders continuously escalated, clearly Drew took a temperature check with some preferred destinations and got indications of interest and guaranteed amounts from others (and as the best agent in the business, I'm sure he knows how to ask the questions without anyone being guilty) - when the Raiders for some bizarre reason elected to take away guaranteed money and notified of "zero" separation pay... it then became an easy decision for AB to release the video Friday night, and demand for release at something like 5am west coast time this morning.
He didn’t want Pittsburgh to feel like they won by trading him where they felt like. So he played bonkers until they cut him.
It’s clear he wants a ring. And he wants to stick it to Pittsburgh. New England is one of their biggest rivals of the last 15 years. And the best shot for a ring.
This was his plan from the day he got traded. I think he was expecting the Raiders to balk when he demanded more money but they complied. So he had to go the crazy route to get cut.
Mission accomplished.
If that's true, which I can't rule out at this point, you have to say Brown and Rosenhaus pulled off quite a sting operation...
He didn’t want Pittsburgh to feel like they won by trading him where they felt like. So he played bonkers until they cut him.
It’s clear he wants a ring. And he wants to stick it to Pittsburgh. New England is one of their biggest rivals of the last 15 years. And the best shot for a ring.
This was his plan from the day he got traded. I think he was expecting the Raiders to balk when he demanded more money but they complied. So he had to go the crazy route to get cut.
Mission accomplished.
If that's true, which I can't rule out at this point, you have to say Brown and Rosenhaus pulled off quite a sting operation...
It makes the most sense to me. Not sure if he knew NE would scoop him up, but he knew someone good would and he didn’t want Pitt feeling like they won by trading him.
what are you arguing? You think if AB “just missed some practice” it would have gone down this way? He dragged that franchise in the mud, spit on them and then wiped his ass with them.
How is Strahans offseason that year at all comparable to Browns?
I didn't bring up Strahan's offseason, someone else tried to make the comparison. But even watching Hard Knocks you saw he was in game shape, working hard off the field, and doing enough on the field in practice with Carr to be ready for week 1.
I see some of these other comments about how NFL is becoming more like NBA... I guess for non-QBs, I just have a players side here. I think the franchise/designation stuff is utter horseshit, the 5th year team option on rookie contracts is horseshit, the fact that QBs now make $35mm a year, while other great players at their positions make 1/5 to 1/3 of that is horeshit… the whole thing just needs a complete overhaul.
It just doesn't make sense to me that premier players in the league rarely get to decide where they can play and on what $ terms (again - non QBs who are really overpaid now - looking at you Kirk Cousins) -- but guys the next level down get multi year deals.
Not good for AB - I don't like what he did to Oakland fans (but fuck Mayock, he's a tool... and Gruden was an idiot here too) -- but its hard to feel sorry for a franchise that just cut Brandon Marshall a few days earlier because he couldn't recover from his injury in time (again, I know those are the rules - but the whole model/system is broken)
Its hard to know when he wanted this. Did he want this in Paris when he was working out and got the frostbite? By all accounts he was intensely working out all offseason.
Did he want this when he was arguing for his old helmet?
Or did he want this when the Raiders were nickle and diming (65k) their one superstar on the team, and then taking away his guaranteed money when he verbally yelled at the "CPA and Gruden's glorified t's and dot i's college scout guy" (as referenced by money above) in front of others?
He's certainly happy to be in NE now though, no argument there. He gets back at Mayock, maybe Gruden, and the Steelers, and gets to play for a superbowl contender too. Near term costs him $15-20 million guaranteed, but he might make that back in his next deal and like he's said in the past, he doesn't need the money anymore anyway.
Interesting bit of trivia: Richard Seymour bought my brother's 1965 Lincoln Continental convertible @15 years ago. Two years after, my brother got a call out of the blue from Richard Seymour's business manager asking if by chance he had a spare ignition key: Richard had lost the two keys that went with the car.
You have no idea how to run an organization. Seriously you are clueless. If a team doesn't have accountability it doesn't win games. If Brown tries anything like this in new england or anywhere else the result will be the same. He'll be on the sidewalk. Think.
One the truly dumbest posts I have ever read.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Beginning of the end for the Pats... Â
Interesting bit of trivia: Richard Seymour bought my brother's 1965 Lincoln Continental convertible @15 years ago. Two years after, my brother got a call out of the blue from Richard Seymour's business manager asking if by chance he had a spare ignition key: Richard had lost the two keys that went with the car.
That's it. Carry on.
did this Richard Seymour spell his last name "Seymore"?
I once bought a lebaron that belonged to a famous actor.
what are you arguing? You think if AB “just missed some practice” it would have gone down this way? He dragged that franchise in the mud, spit on them and then wiped his ass with them.
How is Strahans offseason that year at all comparable to Browns?
I didn't bring up Strahan's offseason, someone else tried to make the comparison. But even watching Hard Knocks you saw he was in game shape, working hard off the field, and doing enough on the field in practice with Carr to be ready for week 1.
I see some of these other comments about how NFL is becoming more like NBA... I guess for non-QBs, I just have a players side here. I think the franchise/designation stuff is utter horseshit, the 5th year team option on rookie contracts is horseshit, the fact that QBs now make $35mm a year, while other great players at their positions make 1/5 to 1/3 of that is horeshit… the whole thing just needs a complete overhaul.
It just doesn't make sense to me that premier players in the league rarely get to decide where they can play and on what $ terms (again - non QBs who are really overpaid now - looking at you Kirk Cousins) -- but guys the next level down get multi year deals.
Not good for AB - I don't like what he did to Oakland fans (but fuck Mayock, he's a tool... and Gruden was an idiot here too) -- but its hard to feel sorry for a franchise that just cut Brandon Marshall a few days earlier because he couldn't recover from his injury in time (again, I know those are the rules - but the whole model/system is broken)
When teams consistently demonstrate they can win championships with marginal QB play, the economics will change. Until then it is what it is. AB being in/out won’t move the line that much. Brady being in/out moves the line substantially. That goes for every team with a decent starting QB.
A productive AB might make it easier for the Pats to win a SB, but he’s not the difference between winning and losing for the Pats.
Interesting bit of trivia: Richard Seymour bought my brother's 1965 Lincoln Continental convertible @15 years ago. Two years after, my brother got a call out of the blue from Richard Seymour's business manager asking if by chance he had a spare ignition key: Richard had lost the two keys that went with the car.
That's it. Carry on.
What's the point, that your brother's an idiot for selling a car like that?
if he wasn’t he wouldn’t be in football shape to even be able to pull this off.
Sounds like you didn’t watch the video of him calling his grandmother screaming “I’m free”. He hates it there, his plan the entire time was to get released. If he plays well this year he makes all the money back in his next contract + the much better marketing opportunities that will come with being in NE vs that crater of a franchise.
or anyone else thinks he shouldn’t have been fined. Sure the writing on the paper says he was fined for practice but don’t you think threatening to beat the shit out of the GM and allegedly calling him a cracker just maaaaaaayyyyybbbbee had something to do with it?
Players have been fined for far less. I’m legitimately baffled by why anyone would have an issue with the fine.
if he wasn’t he wouldn’t be in football shape to even be able to pull this off.
Sounds like you didn’t watch the video of him calling his grandmother screaming “I’m free”. He hates it there, his plan the entire time was to get released. If he plays well this year he makes all the money back in his next contract + the much better marketing opportunities that will come with being in NE vs that crater of a franchise.
No idea why you keep blaming Mayock.
Yeah, because it’s just that simple. If he is squeaky clean for 16 + games (aka when hell freezes over) teams will forget what a jackass he is!
or anyone else thinks he shouldn’t have been fined. Sure the writing on the paper says he was fined for practice but don’t you think threatening to beat the shit out of the GM and allegedly calling him a cracker just maaaaaaayyyyybbbbee had something to do with it?
Players have been fined for far less. I’m legitimately baffled by why anyone would have an issue with the fine.
I'm not sure why anyone would or should disagree with any of that.
Brown was a warrior in Pittsburgh. He never said a word about anything and got no bad press until Pitt didn't want to pay him. He took the money from Oakland, got out there and probably realized it was a clown car.
He will go to the Pats and do what he did in Pittsburgh- catch passes, score td's, make the playoffs and go for a ring.
You culture warriors are all so full of shit. You want a good culture? acquire talent and win games and the culture will take care of itself.
You’re full of shit. There’s a reason the Steelers shipped him out of town for pennies on the dollar despite insane production the last 6 years.
Do you own a TV? Have you seen Brown recently? The guy is a clown. This is a gamble the Pats can take because they don’t need him to him games.
Yeah genius, there was; they have JuJu and didn't want to pay Brown.
The Pats aren't gambling a damn thing. They just picked up the best receiver in football and a guy who has been a warrior his whole csreer on a bargain contract and it cost them nothing. And people wonder why they are in the hunt every frigging year. Their offense is an embarrassment of riches. We will be trying to complete passes to Benny Fowler and Hands Latimer but hey, everyone will be pals at the team bowling event!
Brown was a warrior in Pittsburgh. He never said a word about anything and got no bad press until Pitt didn't want to pay him. He took the money from Oakland, got out there and probably realized it was a clown car.
He will go to the Pats and do what he did in Pittsburgh- catch passes, score td's, make the playoffs and go for a ring.
You culture warriors are all so full of shit. You want a good culture? acquire talent and win games and the culture will take care of itself.
You’re full of shit. There’s a reason the Steelers shipped him out of town for pennies on the dollar despite insane production the last 6 years.
Do you own a TV? Have you seen Brown recently? The guy is a clown. This is a gamble the Pats can take because they don’t need him to him games.
Yeah genius, there was; they have JuJu and didn't want to pay Brown.
The Pats aren't gambling a damn thing. They just picked up the best receiver in football and a guy who has been a warrior his whole csreer on a bargain contract and it cost them nothing. And people wonder why they are in the hunt every frigging year. Their offense is an embarrassment of riches. We will be trying to complete passes to Benny Fowler and Hands Latimer but hey, everyone will be pals at the team bowling event!
Do you live under a rock? There are reports that Tomlin and the Steelers grew tired of covering up his antics. There was a public dispute between Ben and Brown. It wasn’t as simple as the Steelers lowballing Brown and Brown forcing their hand. If it was just about money the Steelers would’ve been able to get more than a 3rd for Brown.
It is a gamble for the Pats, albeit a low risk gamble. There is some money involved. But the differentiator is the fact that the Pats don’t need Brown to be a winner. They can win with or without him. But a sane Brown makes the path to another Lombardi trophy easier.
That Organization is light years ahead of the rest. As long as BB is around, they will continue to win championships.. They do whatever they want, they are different from the rest of the league that runs like robots. Maybe that might be the key.
It's annoying when players act like petulant children and essentially wind up rewarded it for it by landing on their feet somewhere better. None of this is good for football. It sets a shitty precedent and I think it sucks.
AB should be embarrassed by the way he acted. He was never a victim here. He's just a fucking asshole.
Wasn’t Corey Dillon a problem (or became one) in Cincy? Â
LOL. Until BB calls it quits, they'll be fine. He's the GOAT. Wish he came home to us, but se la vie. Still got 2-3-08 & 2-5-12.
And for the record, I love BB. Great coach. Great Giant. He loves our organization too.
It's c'est la vie. Not trying to be a dick or sound smart, I don't know french either, but i find it helpful when i make mistakes and people tell me i'm not doing it right.
Him getting traded to the Browns brought him to Mayfield and Landry (even though he ostensibly didn't want to be there; LA instead). A player can't "complain" his way out of this situation when he's traded to a team that looks promising with his close friends on that team.
All fan-fiction I know, but it's new to think that a player can force himself out of a situation to get to a better one.
Who knows if OBJ could have been on NE if the circumstances were different.
That Organization is light years ahead of the rest. As long as BB is around, they will continue to win championships.. They do whatever they want, they are different from the rest of the league that runs like robots. Maybe that might be the key.
That Organization is light years ahead of the rest. As long as BB is around, they will continue to win championships.. They do whatever they want, they are different from the rest of the league that runs like robots. Maybe that might be the key.
Him getting traded to the Browns brought him to Mayfield and Landry (even though he ostensibly didn't want to be there; LA instead). A player can't "complain" his way out of this situation when he's traded to a team that looks promising with his close friends on that team.
All fan-fiction I know, but it's new to think that a player can force himself out of a situation to get to a better one.
Who knows if OBJ could have been on NE if the circumstances were different.
They will trade him to Oakland, refuse to report, get released and signed by the Pats
It's annoying when players act like petulant children and essentially wind up rewarded it for it by landing on their feet somewhere better. None of this is good for football. It sets a shitty precedent and I think it sucks.
AB should be embarrassed by the way he acted. He was never a victim here. He's just a fucking asshole.
Just think what an asset this guy will be in the Pats' clubhouse . . .
Why the raiders released him, but I would have forced brown's hand. Fine him, rescind the signing bonus and if he didn't report, deactivate him and eventually put him on the did not report list. I would not have released him. Make him sit out the tear if he chose to do so.
Jay Glazer: Raiders decided on Thursday they were done Â
That didn't pan out, so voiding the guarantees and getting AB to ask for release got Raiders what they wanted.
Also, there were three teams in on AB after his release, and he was talking on phone to another head coach fifteen minutes before reaching deal with Pats.
It's annoying when players act like petulant children and essentially wind up rewarded it for it by landing on their feet somewhere better. None of this is good for football. It sets a shitty precedent and I think it sucks.
AB should be embarrassed by the way he acted. He was never a victim here. He's just a fucking asshole.
Just think what an asset this guy will be in the Pats' clubhouse . . .
I'm really not sure what to expect.
I see a huge standard deviation at play here. I can see AB settling in, buying-in, and being a huge part of another Patriots deep run.
Or, I can see AB back in the headlines in a few weeks shopping for a new team. As he's been sent packing because he violated team rules.
has shown they care not about laws. To them, rules are made to be broken. I'm almost certain that something between the Pats and AB was worked out prior to Brown's release. Because of their past, they are guilty until proven innocent.
has shown they care not about laws. To them, rules are made to be broken. I'm almost certain that something between the Pats and AB was worked out prior to Brown's release. Because of their past, they are guilty until proven innocent.
Funny how the antics get what they want- and then end up in a better spot...
Funny how the antics get what they want- and then end up in a better spot...
Mark Daniels
@MarkDanielsPJ
·
1m
Patriots wide receivers:
Julian Edelman
Antonio Brown
Josh Gordon
Demaryius Thomas
Phillip Dorsett
Jakobi Meyers
Gunner Olszewski
IR: N’Keal Harry; PUP: Cameron Meredith
I was just thinking the same damn thing.
Crazy like a fox...??
Not much time to get him ready, but maybe they put a couple plays in for him.
No.
Mark Daniels
@MarkDanielsPJ
·
1m
Patriots wide receivers:
Julian Edelman
Antonio Brown
Josh Gordon
Demaryius Thomas
Phillip Dorsett
Jakobi Meyers
Gunner Olszewski
IR: N’Keal Harry; PUP: Cameron Meredith
Looks like Little Bill has something cooking.
It might be a mistake.
At which point that Pat Machine will simply bag him up, put up on the curb for pick-up, and move on "to Cincinnati".
That's the signing bonus.
Total comp is $15M.
Quote:
year deal for $9M.
That's the signing bonus.
Total comp is $15M.
"up to" $15M
Haynesworth.
$9M is just the signing bonus. It's a 1 yr deal worth up to $15M. Pats are certainly betting a good chunk of change that he'll keep it together this year and not become a problem.
Haynesworthless?
Well they just gave him a $9 million signing bonus
This is fishy as hell and probably pre-meditated by both camps but the Raiders are really a bunch of assclowns for not suspending brown a few weeks instead of pulling this, and the trade to begin with and Mayock in general is completely in over his head in the role. He’s Matt Millen bad at this.
That's the signing bonus.
Total comp is $15M.
"up to" $15M
Correct. It was implied... ;)
Haha you do that! See how far it takes you.
This is fishy as hell and probably pre-meditated by both camps but the Raiders are really a bunch of assclowns for not suspending brown a few weeks instead of pulling this, and the trade to begin with and Mayock in general is completely in over his head in the role. He’s Matt Millen bad at this.
This isn't on Mayock. It's on the $10M Man - Gruden. Mayock is essentially the CPA and Chief Compliance Officer for Gruden...
this contract happened way too quickly IMO.
Seriously something you'd see in the NBA or something.
It'll be WWE when Brown explodes on the sideline with anger wafter Brady misses him and Belichick calmly walks over and Tasers Brown...
Bill will have no more control over whether Brown keeps it together than anyone else. Why? Because anything can be the match that starts his fire. It doesn't need to be rational or justified. It just has to happen.
So we'll have to wait and see what happens in new england. If he pulls the same junk he did in oakland the results will be the same. He'll be on the street earning no money. 'Guarantee' or not in the NFL if you violate the CBA or contractual language you don't get paid.
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This is fishy as hell and probably pre-meditated by both camps but the Raiders are really a bunch of assclowns for not suspending brown a few weeks instead of pulling this, and the trade to begin with and Mayock in general is completely in over his head in the role. He’s Matt Millen bad at this.
This isn't on Mayock. It's on the $10M Man - Gruden. Mayock is essentially the CPA and Chief Compliance Officer for Gruden...
Mayock is the idiot who decided to fine AB 65k for missing meaningless practices in August when he’s been in the league over a decade. Did the cowboys fine Zeke and make him go game to game this year for skipping the entire camp?
It’s a Mickey Mouse, cheap organization with a GM way out of his depth. It’s not like anyone loved their draft this year either. Yes Gruden Bears some responsibility here too but he did come across as on ABs side throughout all the helmet etc issues - mayock continuously antagonized
Ocho was stinko done when he went to the pats. Brown isn’t physically done not by a long shot. He will go nuts this year for the pats probably on and off the field. But he’s going to produce big.
Quote:
In comment 14562721 MetsAreBack said:
Quote:
This is fishy as hell and probably pre-meditated by both camps but the Raiders are really a bunch of assclowns for not suspending brown a few weeks instead of pulling this, and the trade to begin with and Mayock in general is completely in over his head in the role. He’s Matt Millen bad at this.
This isn't on Mayock. It's on the $10M Man - Gruden. Mayock is essentially the CPA and Chief Compliance Officer for Gruden...
Mayock is the idiot who decided to fine AB 65k for missing meaningless practices in August when he’s been in the league over a decade. Did the cowboys fine Zeke and make him go game to game this year for skipping the entire camp?
It’s a Mickey Mouse, cheap organization with a GM way out of his depth. It’s not like anyone loved their draft this year either. Yes Gruden Bears some responsibility here too but he did come across as on ABs side throughout all the helmet etc issues - mayock continuously antagonized
Mayock is the idiot? JFC
NFL is gonna be the binary land of 1-year deals and huge cap-breaking overpays and nothing in between. I think we’re also done seeing skill-players fight through injuries
Bill not following the sage advice on BBI
Mayock is the idiot who decided to fine AB 65k for missing meaningless practices in August when he’s been in the league over a decade. Did the cowboys fine Zeke and make him go game to game this year for skipping the entire camp?
It’s a Mickey Mouse, cheap organization with a GM way out of his depth. It’s not like anyone loved their draft this year either. Yes Gruden Bears some responsibility here too but he did come across as on ABs side throughout all the helmet etc issues - mayock continuously antagonized
I can certainly see your point. But what if it was a good cop/bad cap move where Gruden tells Mayock to fine him; and Gruden completes the ruse by gathering around the press to tell them how much he loves AB?
Do you really think Gruden didn't sign off on those fines?
NFL is gonna be the binary land of 1-year deals and huge cap-breaking overpays and nothing in between. I think we’re also done seeing skill-players fight through injuries
And the world is going to end in 12 years
Quote:
Now all guys have to do is insult the GM and act like a lunatic so they can sign with another team.
Seriously something you'd see in the NBA or something.
DonQuixote : 5:09 pm : link : reply
... that is moving the NFL toward the NBA model.
The only control over player behavior a team has is where it draws the line in the sand. In other words give them enough rope and see what happens.
And only teams like the Pats can take risks like this.
This isn't a new precedent. This is just an anomaly.
Quote:
Mayock is the idiot who decided to fine AB 65k for missing meaningless practices in August when he’s been in the league over a decade. Did the cowboys fine Zeke and make him go game to game this year for skipping the entire camp?
It’s a Mickey Mouse, cheap organization with a GM way out of his depth. It’s not like anyone loved their draft this year either. Yes Gruden Bears some responsibility here too but he did come across as on ABs side throughout all the helmet etc issues - mayock continuously antagonized
I can certainly see your point. But what if it was a good cop/bad cap move where Gruden tells Mayock to fine him; and Gruden completes the ruse by gathering around the press to tell them how much he loves AB?
Do you really think Gruden didn't sign off on those fines?
It’s hard to know the politics of whats going on out there. But when you antagonize a star non qb player all summer (and give up a third for him during the spring when no one else was interested in acquiring him), then fine and cut him - 4 hours later the GOAT signs the same player for 15 mil, 9 mil in signing bonus — you look and are waaaay out of your depth
Matt Millen II
Gruden definitely looks stupid here too. The whole organization is an embarrassment
just like Mayock. Wasn't it simple for him too?
Ten million guaranteed.
Personally I think Brown is more unstable than Moss and this one will be a headache for Bill that doesn't end well. It's all guess work though.
Maybe IR Demaryius Thomas.
yeah I did in one of the fantasy football threads. Someone was being offered a trade for AB and I told the guy to hold onto him because he will end up on the Patriots
That's the bottomline no one gets
If he was willing and able to do that he'd still be in oakland. Maybe he's worried enough about earning that $15M that he'll show up, shut up and play. We'll see.
The only control over player behavior a team has is where it draws the line in the sand. In other words give them enough rope and see what happens.
I think Bill is gambling that AB will be on his best behavior to prove everyone wrong
I was referring to BBI diagnosing him with CTE or tracing his problems to his childhood.
C'mon, this is obviously a dice roll for NE, and they are maybe the one team in the league where they can make these situations work - having a coach like Bill B and QB like Brady can help fix some of those 'culture' issues...and if the antics keep up, Belichick will cut him too.
The fines were a fairly standard deal, and AB freaked out for no reason. Maybe he wanted to be cut. But most teams can't handle distractions like this - they can drag the whole team down, hell look at PIT last year....
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(and often BBI-posted apporach) and added a good locker-room guys that help with the culture...
C'mon, this is obviously a dice roll for NE, and they are maybe the one team in the league where they can make these situations work - having a coach like Bill B and QB like Brady can help fix some of those 'culture' issues...and if the antics keep up, Belichick will cut him too.
Uh, ya' think? You missed the point...
Quote:
Either AB works out or Bill cuts him
That's the bottomline no one gets
Pretty sure everyone gets this.
the Raiders just cut him painlessly - more painlessly than the Patriots probably can.
No idea what "no one gets" means. Pretty sure everyone gets this.
The NFL is really a tough watch. It’s rivaling the NBA fast and hard right now in corniness.
If he was willing and able to do that he'd still be in oakland. Maybe he's worried enough about earning that $15M that he'll show up, shut up and play. We'll see.
I haven’t seen the details - signing bonus usually means... you get that right away? What did I miss?
That wouldn't help in this scenario.
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In comment 14562758 Jimmy Googs said:
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(and often BBI-posted apporach) and added a good locker-room guys that help with the culture...
C'mon, this is obviously a dice roll for NE, and they are maybe the one team in the league where they can make these situations work - having a coach like Bill B and QB like Brady can help fix some of those 'culture' issues...and if the antics keep up, Belichick will cut him too.
Uh, ya' think? You missed the point...
A reference to the many moves made this year, such as moving a talented WR who may have caused some locker room issues? I get it just don't see the point to take a shot at the team we all supposedly root for...I wasn't a huge fan of the Beckham deal at first, and his antics never approached the AB level, but he's gone, we got a decent return, and I'm excited to see what the team can do this season.
If there's more involved here, maybe I don't spend enough time on BBI and it did go over my head. But there do seem to be quite a few people around here who take any chance to take a shot at the team the are supposedly fans of - and yes, they haven't given us a ton to root for lately, but a rebuild was needed and I for one like quite a few of the moves made...
Ha, I saw what you did there.
There's no doubt in my mind that OBJ would rather be in NY, CA, or FL than CL or any other midwestern city. I think it's quite possible he demands either a trade or an astronomical sum of money after this year.
It’s hard to know the politics of whats going on out there. But when you antagonize a star non qb player all summer (and give up a third for him during the spring when no one else was interested in acquiring him), then fine and cut him - 4 hours later the GOAT signs the same player for 15 mil, 9 mil in signing bonus — you look and are waaaay out of your depth
Matt Millen II
Gruden definitely looks stupid here too. The whole organization is an embarrassment
It really isn't to me. Mark Davis gave Gruden $100M to run the organization. Essentially, he's wearing the same hat has Belichick. Mayock is basically the Chief Administration Officer, making sure they are cap compliant, crossing their T's, dotting their I's, and, this is what he's good at, doing player personnel.
So I would be stunned if Mayock did ANYTHING is this lunacy that Gruden didn't know and sign off on...
It's on Brown and shame on Gruden if he even thought about not backing Mike in this.
It's different for a team like NE that is more veteran and has that 'culture' in place already...I'd guess Brown knows it's best behavior or he's gone - but NE has proved before they can make these situations work, unlike most teams...
Not is isn’t. Mayock probably wanted him gone anyway so he actually gets what he likely wanted.
AB has no one to blame but himself but that doesn’t even hold true because he wanted to get released all along.
The big loser is Gruden. Just a chicken shit way to run a franchise. Mayock should leave him to rot.
Agree
What would be interesting is if he comes in, settles down, plays great...then in week 15 loses his shit. Haha I'd love to see bill put in that situation.
[quote] Now all guys have to do is insult the GM and act like a lunatic so they can sign with another team. [/quote
Yes Ageed. Not good
They had to do it. You thought they were going to be just ok with the way the last few days have gone, patted him on the back and moved on.
They did what they needed to do. They weren't going to risk AB being a nightmare over the longterm period of the contract.
They let AB just play he gets all that money, and there are no repercussions if he fucks up again. They needed to gain control again. He could have gained every penny of that money back if he just shut up and play football that point.
It's different for a team like NE that is more veteran and has that 'culture' in place already...I'd guess Brown knows it's best behavior or he's gone - but NE has proved before they can make these situations work, unlike most teams...
As you surmise above, simply put...the Pats don't need anybody to do anything other than their job on the field. Their winning culture will be intact whether AB is on the team or not.
This is a dumb comment. The culture is already set in New England. If Brown doesn’t buy in they’ll dump him like they’ve done with plenty of other players.
[quote] Now all guys have to do is insult the GM and act like a lunatic so they can sign with another team. [/quote
Yes Ageed. Not good
I guess AB sets all the WR Diva precedents. The last one he set was a major reason why the Giants decided to move OBJ. At least that was part of the narrative here.
a 3rd round pick (for Bryant)
a 3rd and 5th round pick (for Brown)
for 19 catches.
that's a bad use of resources.
Quote:
his locker room. He cares about talent apparently.
This is a dumb comment. The culture is already set in New England. If Brown doesn’t buy in they’ll dump him as they’ve done with plenty of other players.
You win with talent, not a Russian roulette of street FAs. Bill gets it.
Quote:
In comment 14562733 Gman11 said:
[quote] Now all guys have to do is insult the GM and act like a lunatic so they can sign with another team. [/quote
Yes Ageed. Not good
I guess AB sets all the WR Diva precedents. The last one he set was a major reason why the Giants decided to move OBJ. At least that was part of the narrative here.
And that narrative is looking a lot closer to reality than it was a week ago.
Therefore, this becomes low risk, high reward. The most malleable sports franchise ever - in my eyes - will either make it work with AB or likely make it work without him...
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I think Oak looks bad for trading for him and giving him a contract in the 1st place. The fines weren't anything out of the ordinary, Brown just blew them up (kinda like he's made a huge deal of everything since he moved to Oak, like his frozen feet, helmet, etc...). This is more on Brown's reaction, unless there's something more we don't know about. But Oak knew this was a risk after last year, and took it knowing this kind of thing could/would happen.
It's different for a team like NE that is more veteran and has that 'culture' in place already...I'd guess Brown knows it's best behavior or he's gone - but NE has proved before they can make these situations work, unlike most teams...
As you surmise above, simply put...the Pats don't need anybody to do anything other than their job on the field. Their winning culture will be intact whether AB is on the team or not.
Different situation than the Giants currently though - we're trying to build that. I wouldn't have wanted them to sign AB, I doubt it would have worked out here. We're still building that culture
Anyway not trying to argue as it seems we kinda agree here...just hoping the moves we made work out for the upcoming season and beyond. The eve of the season has me excited, despite our team being closer to the beginning of a rebuild than the end
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In comment 14562746 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
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his locker room. He cares about talent apparently.
This is a dumb comment. The culture is already set in New England. If Brown doesn’t buy in they’ll dump him as they’ve done with plenty of other players.
You win with talent, not a Russian roulette of street FAs. Bill gets it.
You don’t get it. Organizational stability and a strong culture in New England allows Bill to take shots like this. Ironically none of his WR moves like this have worked out in the past outside of Moss, where they came up short in the SB.
Therefore, this becomes low risk, high reward. The most malleable sports franchise ever - in my eyes - will either make it work with AB or likely make it work without him...
Exactly, just like with Josh Gordon last year.
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In comment 14562746 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
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his locker room. He cares about talent apparently.
This is a dumb comment. The culture is already set in New England. If Brown doesn’t buy in they’ll dump him as they’ve done with plenty of other players.
You win with talent, not a Russian roulette of street FAs. Bill gets it.
I don't think looking at the Pats, and concluding they win solely based in superior talent as opposed to system/culture, is really an accurate reading of the situation. Many would argue the opposite - the Pats are willing to walk away from talent that doesn't buy in to the system, but that culture does allow them to gamble sometimes and see if they can recover a talent that has had issues elsewhere...knowing they will cut bait if that player doesn't follow the rules...
It’s hard to know the politics of whats going on out there. But when you antagonize a star non qb player all summer (and give up a third for him during the spring when no one else was interested in acquiring him), then fine and cut him - 4 hours later the GOAT signs the same player for 15 mil, 9 mil in signing bonus — you look and are waaaay out of your depth
Matt Millen II
Gruden definitely looks stupid here too. The whole organization is an embarrassment
How did he antagonize Brown? Brown openly disrespected him in front of the entire team. This was after the whole foot incident where he came and went in camp. Then the helmet incident where he just disappeared for days without notice. He wasn't fined for that. Then he mocks the Raiders for fining him on social media. Mayock was not the antagonist here.
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and this wasn't a long con to get the hell off the Raiders and to the Patriots to exact his revenge on Big Ben?
I was just thinking the same damn thing.
Crazy like a fox...??
Yep. Sure looks that way. He'll probably suit up for Sunday.
He will go to the Pats and do what he did in Pittsburgh- catch passes, score td's, make the playoffs and go for a ring.
You culture warriors are all so full of shit. You want a good culture? acquire talent and win games and the culture will take care of itself.
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In comment 14562721 MetsAreBack said:
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This is fishy as hell and probably pre-meditated by both camps but the Raiders are really a bunch of assclowns for not suspending brown a few weeks instead of pulling this, and the trade to begin with and Mayock in general is completely in over his head in the role. He’s Matt Millen bad at this.
This isn't on Mayock. It's on the $10M Man - Gruden. Mayock is essentially the CPA and Chief Compliance Officer for Gruden...
Mayock is the idiot who decided to fine AB 65k for missing meaningless practices in August when he’s been in the league over a decade. Did the cowboys fine Zeke and make him go game to game this year for skipping the entire camp?
It’s a Mickey Mouse, cheap organization with a GM way out of his depth. It’s not like anyone loved their draft this year either. Yes Gruden Bears some responsibility here too but he did come across as on ABs side throughout all the helmet etc issues - mayock continuously antagonized
Might need to call the Giants a Mickry Mouse organization, too. Watch America's Game Super Bowl XLII. Strahan got fined for missing training camp. Suggested if he should have skipped training camp and paid the fine every year.
I don’t necessarily think it was a conspiracy. But it’s on the table. I was just waiting for Brown to slip up in his call to his Grandma.
End of the day I think he did whatever he could to get released and sign where he wanted to, but something smells a little funny too.
they were a pretty good bet to be in the AFC Championship game already.
I wonder what made him change his mind about the Raiders? He practically as begging to be let go.
We have week 1 tomorrow
It seem to me to be counter strategic to begin with. Whoever led this decision to sign AB should be looked at critically. Because it is a royal screw up.
Tampering.
Belichek would sell his soul to win. Unbelievable.
I agree, this needs to be a "gate".
How about....AB/BB-Gate
I have no idea how many teams had any real interest (I would bet not many), but you don't need many. You need one team willing to pay and the Patriots did.
it's a 1 year deal. he can do whatever he wants next year as can the Patriots.
I think I heard it about 5-6 years ago from someone on here..
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...just watch. You heard it here first.
I think I heard it about 5-6 years ago from someone on here..
We all heard it 16 years ago almost to the day when the Patriots cut Lawyer Milloy and Tom Jackson said "let me be clear this team hates their coach, he's lost the locker room"
yet, like a cockroach in a nuclear bomb, Belichick doesn't just survive, he thrives, while all those around him perish.
We all heard it 16 years ago almost to the day when the Patriots cut Lawyer Milloy and Tom Jackson said "let me be clear this team hates their coach, he's lost the locker room"
yet, like a cockroach in a nuclear bomb, Belichick doesn't just survive, he thrives, while all those around him perish.
And traded Richard Seymour. And didn't re-sign Willie McGuinest. Traded Jamie Collins. Let Deion Branch walk...etc, etc, etc...
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We all heard it 16 years ago almost to the day when the Patriots cut Lawyer Milloy and Tom Jackson said "let me be clear this team hates their coach, he's lost the locker room"
yet, like a cockroach in a nuclear bomb, Belichick doesn't just survive, he thrives, while all those around him perish.
And traded Richard Seymour. And didn't re-sign Willie McGuinest. Traded Jamie Collins. Let Deion Branch walk...etc, etc, etc...
traded Deion Branch for a 1st round pick. LOL.
let Nate Solder walk.
let Vereen walk
let Asante Samuel walk
let Wilfork walk
let Welker walk
traded Randy Moss
so much more, the Patriots will survive until Belichick hangs them up.
He will go to the Pats and do what he did in Pittsburgh- catch passes, score td's, make the playoffs and go for a ring.
You culture warriors are all so full of shit. You want a good culture? acquire talent and win games and the culture will take care of itself.
You’re full of shit. There’s a reason the Steelers shipped him out of town for pennies on the dollar despite insane production the last 6 years.
Do you own a TV? Have you seen Brown recently? The guy is a clown. This is a gamble the Pats can take because they don’t need him to him games.
And for the record, I love BB. Great coach. Great Giant. He loves our organization too.
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...just watch. You heard it here first.
I think I heard it about 5-6 years ago from someone on here..
Yeah yeah yeah sure
He's playing chess and almost everyone else is learning how to color inside the lines.
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In comment 14562725 bw in dc said:
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In comment 14562721 MetsAreBack said:
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This is fishy as hell and probably pre-meditated by both camps but the Raiders are really a bunch of assclowns for not suspending brown a few weeks instead of pulling this, and the trade to begin with and Mayock in general is completely in over his head in the role. He’s Matt Millen bad at this.
This isn't on Mayock. It's on the $10M Man - Gruden. Mayock is essentially the CPA and Chief Compliance Officer for Gruden...
Mayock is the idiot who decided to fine AB 65k for missing meaningless practices in August when he’s been in the league over a decade. Did the cowboys fine Zeke and make him go game to game this year for skipping the entire camp?
It’s a Mickey Mouse, cheap organization with a GM way out of his depth. It’s not like anyone loved their draft this year either. Yes Gruden Bears some responsibility here too but he did come across as on ABs side throughout all the helmet etc issues - mayock continuously antagonized
Might need to call the Giants a Mickry Mouse organization, too. Watch America's Game Super Bowl XLII. Strahan got fined for missing training camp. Suggested if he should have skipped training camp and paid the fine every year.
The Giants and Strahan negotiated a *heavily* discounted fine for Strahan missing all of camp that year. Brown was fined $65K for missing something like 3 practices. Not at all similar.
And the Giants didn't go after MS' guarantees either.
But you'd love it and him if were with the Giants
It’s clear he wants a ring. And he wants to stick it to Pittsburgh. New England is one of their biggest rivals of the last 15 years. And the best shot for a ring.
This was his plan from the day he got traded. I think he was expecting the Raiders to balk when he demanded more money but they complied. So he had to go the crazy route to get cut.
Mission accomplished.
How is Strahans offseason that year at all comparable to Browns?
I have no idea how many teams had any real interest (I would bet not many), but you don't need many. You need one team willing to pay and the Patriots did.
LOL, yeah ok. When the Raiders continuously escalated, clearly Drew took a temperature check with some preferred destinations and got indications of interest and guaranteed amounts from others (and as the best agent in the business, I'm sure he knows how to ask the questions without anyone being guilty) - when the Raiders for some bizarre reason elected to take away guaranteed money and notified of "zero" separation pay... it then became an easy decision for AB to release the video Friday night, and demand for release at something like 5am west coast time this morning.
It’s clear he wants a ring. And he wants to stick it to Pittsburgh. New England is one of their biggest rivals of the last 15 years. And the best shot for a ring.
This was his plan from the day he got traded. I think he was expecting the Raiders to balk when he demanded more money but they complied. So he had to go the crazy route to get cut.
Mission accomplished.
If that's true, which I can't rule out at this point, you have to say Brown and Rosenhaus pulled off quite a sting operation...
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He didn’t want Pittsburgh to feel like they won by trading him where they felt like. So he played bonkers until they cut him.
It’s clear he wants a ring. And he wants to stick it to Pittsburgh. New England is one of their biggest rivals of the last 15 years. And the best shot for a ring.
This was his plan from the day he got traded. I think he was expecting the Raiders to balk when he demanded more money but they complied. So he had to go the crazy route to get cut.
Mission accomplished.
If that's true, which I can't rule out at this point, you have to say Brown and Rosenhaus pulled off quite a sting operation...
It makes the most sense to me. Not sure if he knew NE would scoop him up, but he knew someone good would and he didn’t want Pitt feeling like they won by trading him.
How is Strahans offseason that year at all comparable to Browns?
I didn't bring up Strahan's offseason, someone else tried to make the comparison. But even watching Hard Knocks you saw he was in game shape, working hard off the field, and doing enough on the field in practice with Carr to be ready for week 1.
I see some of these other comments about how NFL is becoming more like NBA... I guess for non-QBs, I just have a players side here. I think the franchise/designation stuff is utter horseshit, the 5th year team option on rookie contracts is horseshit, the fact that QBs now make $35mm a year, while other great players at their positions make 1/5 to 1/3 of that is horeshit… the whole thing just needs a complete overhaul.
It just doesn't make sense to me that premier players in the league rarely get to decide where they can play and on what $ terms (again - non QBs who are really overpaid now - looking at you Kirk Cousins) -- but guys the next level down get multi year deals.
Not good for AB - I don't like what he did to Oakland fans (but fuck Mayock, he's a tool... and Gruden was an idiot here too) -- but its hard to feel sorry for a franchise that just cut Brandon Marshall a few days earlier because he couldn't recover from his injury in time (again, I know those are the rules - but the whole model/system is broken)
Its hard to know when he wanted this. Did he want this in Paris when he was working out and got the frostbite? By all accounts he was intensely working out all offseason.
Did he want this when he was arguing for his old helmet?
Or did he want this when the Raiders were nickle and diming (65k) their one superstar on the team, and then taking away his guaranteed money when he verbally yelled at the "CPA and Gruden's glorified t's and dot i's college scout guy" (as referenced by money above) in front of others?
He's certainly happy to be in NE now though, no argument there. He gets back at Mayock, maybe Gruden, and the Steelers, and gets to play for a superbowl contender too. Near term costs him $15-20 million guaranteed, but he might make that back in his next deal and like he's said in the past, he doesn't need the money anymore anyway.
Mu guess is this was a plan for a while. Crazy but it is what it is.
If the Patriots win another Super Bowl and he is a big part of it will anyone remember this? Brown does not think so and I would not either
And traded Richard Seymour...etc, etc, etc...
Interesting bit of trivia: Richard Seymour bought my brother's 1965 Lincoln Continental convertible @15 years ago. Two years after, my brother got a call out of the blue from Richard Seymour's business manager asking if by chance he had a spare ignition key: Richard had lost the two keys that went with the car.
That's it. Carry on.
One the truly dumbest posts I have ever read.
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In comment 14562910 pjcas18 said:
And traded Richard Seymour...etc, etc, etc...
Interesting bit of trivia: Richard Seymour bought my brother's 1965 Lincoln Continental convertible @15 years ago. Two years after, my brother got a call out of the blue from Richard Seymour's business manager asking if by chance he had a spare ignition key: Richard had lost the two keys that went with the car.
That's it. Carry on.
did this Richard Seymour spell his last name "Seymore"?
I once bought a lebaron that belonged to a famous actor.
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what are you arguing? You think if AB “just missed some practice” it would have gone down this way? He dragged that franchise in the mud, spit on them and then wiped his ass with them.
How is Strahans offseason that year at all comparable to Browns?
I didn't bring up Strahan's offseason, someone else tried to make the comparison. But even watching Hard Knocks you saw he was in game shape, working hard off the field, and doing enough on the field in practice with Carr to be ready for week 1.
I see some of these other comments about how NFL is becoming more like NBA... I guess for non-QBs, I just have a players side here. I think the franchise/designation stuff is utter horseshit, the 5th year team option on rookie contracts is horseshit, the fact that QBs now make $35mm a year, while other great players at their positions make 1/5 to 1/3 of that is horeshit… the whole thing just needs a complete overhaul.
It just doesn't make sense to me that premier players in the league rarely get to decide where they can play and on what $ terms (again - non QBs who are really overpaid now - looking at you Kirk Cousins) -- but guys the next level down get multi year deals.
Not good for AB - I don't like what he did to Oakland fans (but fuck Mayock, he's a tool... and Gruden was an idiot here too) -- but its hard to feel sorry for a franchise that just cut Brandon Marshall a few days earlier because he couldn't recover from his injury in time (again, I know those are the rules - but the whole model/system is broken)
When teams consistently demonstrate they can win championships with marginal QB play, the economics will change. Until then it is what it is. AB being in/out won’t move the line that much. Brady being in/out moves the line substantially. That goes for every team with a decent starting QB.
A productive AB might make it easier for the Pats to win a SB, but he’s not the difference between winning and losing for the Pats.
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In comment 14562910 pjcas18 said:
And traded Richard Seymour...etc, etc, etc...
Interesting bit of trivia: Richard Seymour bought my brother's 1965 Lincoln Continental convertible @15 years ago. Two years after, my brother got a call out of the blue from Richard Seymour's business manager asking if by chance he had a spare ignition key: Richard had lost the two keys that went with the car.
That's it. Carry on.
What's the point, that your brother's an idiot for selling a car like that?
Sounds like you didn’t watch the video of him calling his grandmother screaming “I’m free”. He hates it there, his plan the entire time was to get released. If he plays well this year he makes all the money back in his next contract + the much better marketing opportunities that will come with being in NE vs that crater of a franchise.
No idea why you keep blaming Mayock.
Players have been fined for far less. I’m legitimately baffled by why anyone would have an issue with the fine.
Sounds like you didn’t watch the video of him calling his grandmother screaming “I’m free”. He hates it there, his plan the entire time was to get released. If he plays well this year he makes all the money back in his next contract + the much better marketing opportunities that will come with being in NE vs that crater of a franchise.
No idea why you keep blaming Mayock.
Yeah, because it’s just that simple. If he is squeaky clean for 16 + games (aka when hell freezes over) teams will forget what a jackass he is!
Players have been fined for far less. I’m legitimately baffled by why anyone would have an issue with the fine.
I'm not sure why anyone would or should disagree with any of that.
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Brown was a warrior in Pittsburgh. He never said a word about anything and got no bad press until Pitt didn't want to pay him. He took the money from Oakland, got out there and probably realized it was a clown car.
He will go to the Pats and do what he did in Pittsburgh- catch passes, score td's, make the playoffs and go for a ring.
You culture warriors are all so full of shit. You want a good culture? acquire talent and win games and the culture will take care of itself.
You’re full of shit. There’s a reason the Steelers shipped him out of town for pennies on the dollar despite insane production the last 6 years.
Do you own a TV? Have you seen Brown recently? The guy is a clown. This is a gamble the Pats can take because they don’t need him to him games.
The Pats aren't gambling a damn thing. They just picked up the best receiver in football and a guy who has been a warrior his whole csreer on a bargain contract and it cost them nothing. And people wonder why they are in the hunt every frigging year. Their offense is an embarrassment of riches. We will be trying to complete passes to Benny Fowler and Hands Latimer but hey, everyone will be pals at the team bowling event!
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In comment 14562858 HomerJones45 said:
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Brown was a warrior in Pittsburgh. He never said a word about anything and got no bad press until Pitt didn't want to pay him. He took the money from Oakland, got out there and probably realized it was a clown car.
He will go to the Pats and do what he did in Pittsburgh- catch passes, score td's, make the playoffs and go for a ring.
You culture warriors are all so full of shit. You want a good culture? acquire talent and win games and the culture will take care of itself.
You’re full of shit. There’s a reason the Steelers shipped him out of town for pennies on the dollar despite insane production the last 6 years.
Do you own a TV? Have you seen Brown recently? The guy is a clown. This is a gamble the Pats can take because they don’t need him to him games.
Yeah genius, there was; they have JuJu and didn't want to pay Brown.
The Pats aren't gambling a damn thing. They just picked up the best receiver in football and a guy who has been a warrior his whole csreer on a bargain contract and it cost them nothing. And people wonder why they are in the hunt every frigging year. Their offense is an embarrassment of riches. We will be trying to complete passes to Benny Fowler and Hands Latimer but hey, everyone will be pals at the team bowling event!
Do you live under a rock? There are reports that Tomlin and the Steelers grew tired of covering up his antics. There was a public dispute between Ben and Brown. It wasn’t as simple as the Steelers lowballing Brown and Brown forcing their hand. If it was just about money the Steelers would’ve been able to get more than a 3rd for Brown.
It is a gamble for the Pats, albeit a low risk gamble. There is some money involved. But the differentiator is the fact that the Pats don’t need Brown to be a winner. They can win with or without him. But a sane Brown makes the path to another Lombardi trophy easier.
The release me tweet was too obvious.
AB should be embarrassed by the way he acted. He was never a victim here. He's just a fucking asshole.
And for the record, I love BB. Great coach. Great Giant. He loves our organization too.
It's c'est la vie. Not trying to be a dick or sound smart, I don't know french either, but i find it helpful when i make mistakes and people tell me i'm not doing it right.
All fan-fiction I know, but it's new to think that a player can force himself out of a situation to get to a better one.
Who knows if OBJ could have been on NE if the circumstances were different.
That's your take-away here? Wow.
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That Organization is light years ahead of the rest. As long as BB is around, they will continue to win championships.. They do whatever they want, they are different from the rest of the league that runs like robots. Maybe that might be the key.
That's your take-away here? Wow.
Consider the poster...
Pretty much every take is awful.
All fan-fiction I know, but it's new to think that a player can force himself out of a situation to get to a better one.
Who knows if OBJ could have been on NE if the circumstances were different.
They will trade him to Oakland, refuse to report, get released and signed by the Pats
Patriots initially offered a first rounder to get Brown from Pittsburgh. Steelers chose the weaker Oakland offer to keep him away from New England.
And now he's a Patriot anyway.
AB should be embarrassed by the way he acted. He was never a victim here. He's just a fucking asshole.
Just think what an asset this guy will be in the Pats' clubhouse . . .
Mayock’s fault?
That didn't pan out, so voiding the guarantees and getting AB to ask for release got Raiders what they wanted.
Also, there were three teams in on AB after his release, and he was talking on phone to another head coach fifteen minutes before reaching deal with Pats.
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It's annoying when players act like petulant children and essentially wind up rewarded it for it by landing on their feet somewhere better. None of this is good for football. It sets a shitty precedent and I think it sucks.
AB should be embarrassed by the way he acted. He was never a victim here. He's just a fucking asshole.
Just think what an asset this guy will be in the Pats' clubhouse . . .
I'm really not sure what to expect.
I see a huge standard deviation at play here. I can see AB settling in, buying-in, and being a huge part of another Patriots deep run.
Or, I can see AB back in the headlines in a few weeks shopping for a new team. As he's been sent packing because he violated team rules.
Did you want Jints Central to sign SB?