Do you want Jones to start? Why, Why not?
Unless Eli has a game for the ages, if we lose, I want to see Jones permanently.
Why?
I think he is better fit and has upside. Eli is going to get worse, Jones will get better. After just a few games of NFL starting experience, I believe Jones will give us a better chance to win.
Because.
He is a better fit for Shurmur's offense.
He is more athletic and can buy some time with his feat to extend a play or run for a first down.
He better suited than Eli is at this point in their respective careers to make off schedule plays. This team needs those plays.
It will be time to try something else instead of doing the same thing and hoping for a different outcome.
However consider the following.
If we are 0-2, what is that going to look and sound like for Eli and his family? Ugly.
0-3? Shudder.
It will give the people that hate Eli, there are unfortunately many, that will take great pleasure in shitting on the end of what should be a celebrated HoF career.
The newspaper headlines, the lead story of every NFL pregame show, every week. If we are not doing well, I want them to go to Jones sooner than later.
However, if the Giants are .500 or better, Eli is staying in.
Quote:
and learn how it all works. You want to see him go into New England on a short week on a Thursday Night in Week 6? That might be worse than Eli in Baltimore in 2004 which forced Warner to come off the bench just to salvage Eli's psyche. Eli should get these 6 weeks to start the season and evaluate after the Pats game. If this season is in the shitter and/or Eli is not scoring points, give Jones the final 10 games.
Eli survived that Baltimore game. It didn't ruin him.
I have a feeling Jones would be similarly resilient.
He got benched after posting a 0.0 QBR and said in one of the books written it was the first time he questioned himself in league. I wouldn't throw Jones to the wolves on a short week just to see how he does. He can get that trial by fire later in the season with the Monday Night game at Philly.
And for better or worse, it matters to the Giants how they handle this transition from Eli. You can argue this point, but it's moot because that's not how Mara operates.
The Giants have made it pretty clear that Eli is not coming back next year. I don't give a shit what Mara or Gettleman says in the press about Eli, look at their actions. Bottom line they used the #6 pick in the draft on Jones and did not extend Eli to get cap relief this year when they could have used it with all the dead money on it from Odell. The Giants are clearing the decks in 2020 to go completely fresh.
I'm sure the Giants want Eli to start every game, because that means the team is winning and competitive and they do the "KC model". But unless this defense improves, if the record shows that the Giants will not contend, they have to sit Eli and get a head start on 2020.
Quote:
If you are at the game and Eli gets pulled, please cheer, it might be the last time you get to do it in a game. No Luck embarrassment, please.
this is a stupid question, but wouldn't cheers be interpreted as being for Jones, not Eli?
A chant may be better but should probably be reserved for when he starts the game on the bench
I don't think that making week 6 in Foxboro his first start would be particularly wise, but I have no fear of it doing damage to his future. The guy is either the goods or he isn't.
I'm of the belief that experience is good, and adversity is experience. Create as much game tape and as much practice time (as "the guy") as you can.
The OL this season is an NFL-caliber unit. It's not one scenario (like the last 2 seasons) where simply having him take the snap is placing him in danger of long-term emotional damage.
Quote:
In comment 14568299 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
and learn how it all works. You want to see him go into New England on a short week on a Thursday Night in Week 6? That might be worse than Eli in Baltimore in 2004 which forced Warner to come off the bench just to salvage Eli's psyche. Eli should get these 6 weeks to start the season and evaluate after the Pats game. If this season is in the shitter and/or Eli is not scoring points, give Jones the final 10 games.
Eli survived that Baltimore game. It didn't ruin him.
I have a feeling Jones would be similarly resilient.
He got benched after posting a 0.0 QBR and said in one of the books written it was the first time he questioned himself in league. I wouldn't throw Jones to the wolves on a short week just to see how he does. He can get that trial by fire later in the season with the Monday Night game at Philly.
And for better or worse, it matters to the Giants how they handle this transition from Eli. You can argue this point, but it's moot because that's not how Mara operates.
The Giants have made it pretty clear that Eli is not coming back next year. I don't give a shit what Mara or Gettleman says in the press about Eli, look at their actions. Bottom line they used the #6 pick in the draft on Jones and did not extend Eli to get cap relief this year when they could have used it with all the dead money on it from Odell. The Giants are clearing the decks in 2020 to go completely fresh.
I'm sure the Giants want Eli to start every game, because that means the team is winning and competitive and they do the "KC model". But unless this defense improves, if the record shows that the Giants will not contend, they have to sit Eli and get a head start on 2020.
This is spot on and keep in mind 1 loss is already in the books. Unless we're all on drugs, you have to figure the Pats are going to hang an L on us as well on the road, on a short week.
That means for team to be 4-2 or 3-3 (minimum) which probably keeps Eli at the helm beyond what is probably the softest stretch of schedule, NYG needs to go 4-0 or 3-1 in the next month.
What I Think They Should Do: You are not winning the Super Bowl this year, Jones should play the minute you think he is ready.
What They Will Do: Jones won't start until we're eliminated or clearly out of it.
That's not really the point.
All speculation, your "no way" is just as valid as what I am saying. I can't argue.
Just like we thought, Dallas and Philly look much more talented than us. Maybe the Redskins too. If that is so, there isn't any string arguments to keep trotting Eli out there.
2 very important things happen by starting Jones.
He gets live regular season NFL game experience. It is the ONLY experience that matters. Anyone arguing against nfl game experience is trying to defend the indefensible.
The Giants get to evaluate Jones in NFL games before the 2020 draft. The more information they have on Jones the better.
Well, it's kind of the most important issue for the franchise.
Quote:
I just don't give a crap anymore. I don't think Joens would have fared any better than Eli yesterday. Different results but same outcome.
That's not really the point.
I think it would be good for him to sit a bit longer personally. I think he gets a good benefit from learning the pro game not thrown into the fire right away. I'm guessing we will be out of contention before December and once that becomes a known commodity, start him. Just how I see it.
I'm guessing we will be out of contention before December .
That is really optimistic, we will be out of contention before November
Quote:
I'm guessing we will be out of contention before December .
That is really optimistic, we will be out of contention before November
Yep I considered November but I am trying to stay just a little bit optimistic. Ugh. I am so tired of watching crappy football and being out of it so early.
Well at least after every loss, which looks like pretty often with this defense.
I think you run Eli out there a few more times, and when it's obvious the ship is going nowhere, you start Jones. Bring Eli back in for the last home game of the season to take one final turn at the helm and then send him off into retirement.
No. Grin
Actually, if the Giants win next week you won't hear about it again from me until week 4, only if the Giants lose week 3. Let me type something extremely obnoxious. My starting Daniel Jones chart.
0-2 start Jones
1-3 start Jones
2-4 start Jones
3-5 start Jones
4-6 start Jones
If at any point Manning gets to 2 games under 500 that should be the barometer to start Jones. if he doesn't get there he is one game away from five hundred or better and I think you keep starting him.
The knowledge gained from watching is as important as the experience the QB gets.
I am a consumer. I want to see the someone with upside unless Eli shows us something markedly better really fast.
I do. No way we make the playoffs in 2005 if Eli doesn’t play I. 2004.
The difference in Eli from the beginning of his rookie year to the end was night & day, and it was because he played.
Playoffs?
Free Agency discussions?
Who are u?
And that the surrounding team is good enough to make sure he doesn't get killed, and that also ruins his confidence.
And as was previously pointed out, probably not a good idea to play him against a SB contender, especially on a short week for his first game.
As long as those conditions are met, play the kid and get the early part of the learning curve out of the way sooner when nobody cares, rather than next year, when it may matter.
They really need too. Or this will fly off the handle esp if no sign of improvement on defense
Have to agree we could be 1-5 going into Arizona then that
would be the time to start Jones . Buffalo might be our only
win although I have hope we could rebound be 3-3 but I wouldn't want Jones playing Minnesota or Patriots .
We shall see . actually ESPN has us starting out 1-6
Yeah that's not quite true. The OL aside from Remmers was actually pretty good Sunday. Don't forget Engram, and Ellison and Sterling Shepard are not awful by any means, and Jack Rabbit had a good game.
We don't know what we have yet in the young secondary guys. That was a tough first game but I imagine they will start to get better as the year goes on. Certainly can't get any worse.
2) It gives Jones a decent amount of time to get used to the NFL games and prep
3) NE will be a blowout
4) One or two games won't matter, if Jones comes in the season is over anyway
Is that what that was on sunday? could've fooled me. We put up slightly more resistance than the lowly Dolphins.
Playing Jones isn't going to ruin him. This offense is a dink and dunk offense. Jones can just as easily average 7 yards an attempt.