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How bad was the Giants 2012 draft class?

JoeyBigBlue : 9/12/2019 9:16 am
After coming off a Super Bowl win, this has to go down as the worse draft class in my fandom (Iím 36 years). Was this the draft that started the decline of Jerry Reese.
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What's with the Wilsn defenders?  
nyg9298 : 9/12/2019 10:33 am : link
The dude stunk! He only had one good game in his career and fumbled all the time. I hated that pick so much.

Another thing that I and others have to remember is that Wilson had his one and only career game against literally the worst defense of all time. Wasn't it Spags Saints?
Didn't David Wilson  
Jay on the Island : 9/12/2019 10:33 am : link
set a record for most all purpose yards in a game versus the Saints in 2012?
RE: Didn't David Wilson  
UConn4523 : 9/12/2019 10:39 am : link
In comment 14572496 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
set a record for most all purpose yards in a game versus the Saints in 2012?


Apparently he should have been a finished product his rookie year. I really donít understand the hate. That pick could have led to a more forward thinking rushing attack. Instead we had RBs running like they were stuck in mud for the next 6 years. I guess that was a better option.
504 career rushing yards....100 of which were against the worst D  
Greg from LI : 9/12/2019 10:39 am : link
in league history at that time.
the failure to get a good RB later  
Greg from LI : 9/12/2019 10:41 am : link
doesn't mean that David Wilson didn't suck
Wonít argue with you  
UConn4523 : 9/12/2019 10:47 am : link
between him not coming in hot out the gates and going to VT, it just isnít worth my time.

Iíd like to think that Wilson would/could have been the first step into having a more modern offense, weíll never know. But if you are so sure he would have been terrible then alrighty, you win.
Wilson probably would have been a good starter  
widmerseyebrow : 9/12/2019 10:48 am : link
It's all moot though because even if he remained healthy, that was the beginning of the offensive line dark age. A guy like him would have gotten obliterated.
RE: David Wilson  
BillT : 9/12/2019 10:48 am : link
In comment 14572394 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
was not a good pick. I am not talking about injury but, he was a guy who Coughlin was not going to start because he can't block (so pass pro would always be an issue), he fumbles and was a bit of Jack of all trades master of none. He was not physical. He wasn't overly instinctive and he wasn't the most natural pass catcher. We reached for him there.

Exactly. Most importantly he was never going to be able to execute the protection schemes that would have allowed him to be a regular contributor. Great pick in round 3 or 4.
2011 would give it a run  
Section331 : 9/12/2019 10:49 am : link
for its money. Amukamara and a pile of dogshit. 2013 wasn't very good either. you can't whiff on 3 drafts in a row, and 4 out of 5, and expect to remain competitive.
RE: the failure to get a good RB later  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 9/12/2019 10:50 am : link
In comment 14572515 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
doesn't mean that David Wilson didn't suck


He absolutely didnít suck. If you want to say we should have drafted a Tackle or Guard at that pick that is 100% fine. He didnít suck as a player he played really well when he did see the field his rookie season and his second season he played 2 games behind the worst line we have had even in the string of bad lines we have recently had and got hurt and that was the end of his career.
RE: RE: David Wilson  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 9/12/2019 10:54 am : link
In comment 14572533 BillT said:
Quote:
In comment 14572394 jvm52106 said:


Quote:


was not a good pick. I am not talking about injury but, he was a guy who Coughlin was not going to start because he can't block (so pass pro would always be an issue), he fumbles and was a bit of Jack of all trades master of none. He was not physical. He wasn't overly instinctive and he wasn't the most natural pass catcher. We reached for him there.


Exactly. Most importantly he was never going to be able to execute the protection schemes that would have allowed him to be a regular contributor. Great pick in round 3 or 4.


Coughlin definitely had a say in that pick so the whole argument is dogshit. Along with most RBs need training on pass blocking in the NFL as rookies.
Big TC supporter  
Lines of Scrimmage : 9/12/2019 11:01 am : link
However, I wonder if his loyalty hurt the franchise. He won two Super Bowls with Snee, Diehl, McKenzie, etc.

I thought Ross was the big culprit and he gradually greatly influenced Reese over time but TC may not have been on board with replacing those linemen, particularly his son in law. One area Bill Belichick stands far about is his ability to move on from players even those he helped him achieve great success.

His time had passed but to leave Reese/Ross was to stay continued the misery.
I think you have to remember  
RollBlue : 9/12/2019 11:02 am : link
they were picking last in 2012 when evaluating. People on here praising DG when he inherited the 2nd overall pick, and "earned" the 6th overall pick. Having said that, looks like he may have hit a HR in picking Barkley last year, and Jones this year - IF Jones does indeed pan out. Having just said that, still need competent coaching, something lacking since about 2014.
RE: Didn't David Wilson  
chuckydee9 : 9/12/2019 11:10 am : link
In comment 14572496 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
set a record for most all purpose yards in a game versus the Saints in 2012?


In 21 game she had 1 good game.. everyone remembers that.. how many remember the negatives that coaches care about Pass protection? Ball protection? Overall he had 504 yards in 21 games 42 receiving yards in 15 targets.. and in 121 touches he had 3 fumbles.. Good coaches don't play players like that..

1st round RBs are expected to produce right off the bat.. he couldn't even if he played up to his potential he wasn't worthy of a first round pick..
RE: RE: Didn't David Wilson  
chuckydee9 : 9/12/2019 11:11 am : link
In comment 14572572 chuckydee9 said:
Quote:
In comment 14572496 Jay on the Island said:


Quote:


set a record for most all purpose yards in a game versus the Saints in 2012?



In 21 game she had 1 good game.. everyone remembers that.. how many remember the negatives that coaches care about Pass protection? Ball protection? Overall he had 504 yards in 21 games 42 receiving yards in 15 targets.. and in 121 touches he had 3 fumbles.. Good coaches don't play players like that..

1st round RBs are expected to produce right off the bat.. he couldn't even if he played up to his potential he wasn't worthy of a first round pick..


It was supposed to the
games he*

not game she..
Wilson heralded our poor drafting  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 9/12/2019 11:13 am : link
Total panic reach pick because we got jumped for Muscle Hamster with our loose lip FO.
RE: The  
Pete in MD : 9/12/2019 11:20 am : link
In comment 14572438 AcidTest said:
Quote:
Giants had Cordy Glenn rated higher than David Wilson IIRC, but wanted a RB.

This was the bigger problem. OL was a definite need and they opted for the "shiny new toy" over a higher-rated player. Glenn would gave started at RT right away and eventually moved to LT when Beatty got hurt.


Yeah, it was a shitty draft. However, look at the entire NFL.  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 9/12/2019 11:26 am : link
There were a lot of shitty drafts and I'm setting the bar for a good draft extremely low (2 good starters). And the list gets shorter when you remove teams for not keeping "good" players beyond their first contract.
Meh  
Mike in Long Beach : 9/12/2019 11:34 am : link
We got unlucky with Wilson. And Randle, for all his faults, did have his moments with us and managed quality production for a #2 WR for his short-lived career.

Rounds 3 through 7 weren't good, but you don't often snag big players there.

It's a bad draft, don't get me wrong. But I'm not nauseated by it.
RE: Yeah, it was a shitty draft. However, look at the entire NFL.  
jcn56 : 9/12/2019 11:39 am : link
In comment 14572602 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
Quote:
There were a lot of shitty drafts and I'm setting the bar for a good draft extremely low (2 good starters). And the list gets shorter when you remove teams for not keeping "good" players beyond their first contract.


Also adjust for picking 32nd overall.
RE: I remember wanting a RB  
jeffusedtobeonwebtv : 9/12/2019 11:45 am : link
In comment 14572409 figgy2989 said:
Quote:
And really thought they had a shot at Doug Martin (who I still believe was their #1 target). When the Bucs drafted him right before, nothing against David Wilson, but always felt like he was the consolation prize.


They probably thought they were about to be able to draft Doug Martin, but then the Bucs traded up to get him one pick before the Giants.
David Wilson  
WillVAB : 9/12/2019 11:52 am : link
Good track athlete, terrible football player.

Terrible pick then terrible pick now.
Ahmad Bradshaw couldn't pass block a lick  
widmerseyebrow : 9/12/2019 11:56 am : link
when he first came into the league, so I don't know why people think that Wilson would not have improved in that area.
RE: David Wilson  
Gregorio : 9/12/2019 12:34 pm : link
In comment 14572394 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
was not a good pick. I am not talking about injury but, ...


but on the bright side, Wilson could do 25 consecutive back flips. That could have been some good half time entertainment.
IMO  
mrvax : 9/12/2019 12:55 pm : link
Wilson would have been a terrific scat back. His quicks were amazing. His 4.4ypc on the league's worst Oline is not too shabby. He was electric on kick off returns.

For the posters who imagine Wilson was picked only because Reese leaked his desire for Martin, WRONG.

Right here on BBI during the 2012 first round, a trusted person emailed Eric From BBI (this site's owner) a note saying that Wilson would be the Giants pick and not Martin.

This person asked Eric not to post that fact until after the draft. Think I'm full of it? Email Eric and ask him for yourself.

Seriously folks, have a great Giant day!
RE: David Wilson  
Dave : 9/12/2019 1:29 pm : link
In comment 14572394 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
was not a good pick. I am not talking about injury but, he was a guy who Coughlin was not going to start because he can't block (so pass pro would always be an issue), he fumbles and was a bit of Jack of all trades master of none. He was not physical. He wasn't overly instinctive and he wasn't the most natural pass catcher. We reached for him there.


This!

alot of people seem to think he was awesome, idk, he was an ok kick off returner and change of pace back imo
RE: RE: David Wilson  
M.S. : 9/12/2019 1:32 pm : link
In comment 14572786 Dave said:
Quote:
In comment 14572394 jvm52106 said:


Quote:


was not a good pick. I am not talking about injury but, he was a guy who Coughlin was not going to start because he can't block (so pass pro would always be an issue), he fumbles and was a bit of Jack of all trades master of none. He was not physical. He wasn't overly instinctive and he wasn't the most natural pass catcher. We reached for him there.



This!

alot of people seem to think he was awesome, idk, he was an ok kick off returner and change of pace back imo

Just "an OK" kick off returner???

Uhh, no.
RE: Didn't David Wilson  
Stan in LA : 9/12/2019 1:32 pm : link
In comment 14572496 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
set a record for most all purpose yards in a game versus the Saints in 2012?

Yeah, and he was also going to be an Olympic Triple Jumper. In his dreams, maybe.
David Wilson  
JoeyBigBlue : 9/12/2019 2:51 pm : link
Was a homelessí man Saquon Barkley. It was a bad pick.
RE: IMO  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 9/12/2019 3:56 pm : link
In comment 14572736 mrvax said:
Quote:
Wilson would have been a terrific scat back. His quicks were amazing. His 4.4ypc on the league's worst Oline is not too shabby. He was electric on kick off returns.

For the posters who imagine Wilson was picked only because Reese leaked his desire for Martin, WRONG.

Right here on BBI during the 2012 first round, a trusted person emailed Eric From BBI (this site's owner) a note saying that Wilson would be the Giants pick and not Martin.

This person asked Eric not to post that fact until after the draft. Think I'm full of it? Email Eric and ask him for yourself.

Seriously folks, have a great Giant day!

I hope that trusted person is on the unemployment line with Reese and Mcadoo.
RE: RE: IMO  
mrvax : 9/12/2019 4:47 pm : link
In comment 14573070 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:


I hope that trusted person is on the unemployment line with Reese and Mcadoo.


WTH? Tipping off Eric is a patriotic thing to do. Coach, you are a weird BBI poster.
Number one factor that contributed to Reeseís downfall  
Vanzetti : 9/12/2019 4:56 pm : link
Injuries

Nicks, Cruz, Snee, Bass, Trrrell Thomas, David Wilson and Tuck all going down with career ending injuries or injuries that left them s shell of their former selves. All in 1-2 year period. And other keys guys, like Osi and Diego, just got old
Number Two factor  
Vanzetti : 9/12/2019 5:00 pm : link
The decision not to rebuild but do a patch job with lesser free agents

Having Eli and Coughlin probably contributed to that decision. After 2011 miracle, another super bowl seemed possible even if you were a 9 win team

RE: Number one factor that contributed to Reeseís downfall  
Greg from LI : 9/12/2019 5:16 pm : link
In comment 14573142 Vanzetti said:
Quote:
Injuries

Nicks, Cruz, Snee, Bass, Trrrell Thomas, David Wilson and Tuck all going down with career ending injuries or injuries that left them s shell of their former selves. All in 1-2 year period. And other keys guys, like Osi and Diego, just got old


Kenny Phillips, Steve Smith, Rich Seubert, hell, even Jonathan Goff. Remember him? Took over the MLB job in 2010, looked pretty good, never played again.
RE: Number one factor that contributed to Reeseís downfall  
WillVAB : 9/12/2019 5:53 pm : link
In comment 14573142 Vanzetti said:
Quote:
Injuries

Nicks, Cruz, Snee, Bass, Trrrell Thomas, David Wilson and Tuck all going down with career ending injuries or injuries that left them s shell of their former selves. All in 1-2 year period. And other keys guys, like Osi and Diego, just got old


Nicks, Cruz, KP, and SS were bad luck. The rest, not so much. Either bad players or had major injury issues in college (hence why they were picked where they were).
That is an ugly, ugly list. Hideous.  
81_Great_Dane : 9/12/2019 5:54 pm : link
Wilson was actually 2nd team All-Pro as a returner and was probably the best kickoff returner I have seen in almost 50 years of watching the Giants. His fumbling was exaggerated. Look up his stats -- he fumbled on national TV so people labeled him a fumbler. Not really.

The Giants kept Mosely and cut McCants. McCants caught on elsewhere and turned out to be a competent NFL lineman. Mosely didn't develop. The choice of which guy to keep and which guy to let go is on the coach.
The draft problem  
Ike#88 : 9/12/2019 7:25 pm : link
was not getting Eli a decent tight end after Boss got hurt.
RE: RE: Number one factor that contributed to Reeseís downfall  
jcn56 : 9/12/2019 7:28 pm : link
In comment 14573186 WillVAB said:
Quote:
In comment 14573142 Vanzetti said:


Quote:


Injuries

Nicks, Cruz, Snee, Bass, Trrrell Thomas, David Wilson and Tuck all going down with career ending injuries or injuries that left them s shell of their former selves. All in 1-2 year period. And other keys guys, like Osi and Diego, just got old



Nicks, Cruz, KP, and SS were bad luck. The rest, not so much. Either bad players or had major injury issues in college (hence why they were picked where they were).


The fact that you lumped Tuck is just brilliant. The Giants don't win two SBs without him.
RE: RE: RE: Number one factor that contributed to Reeseís downfall  
Vanzetti : 9/12/2019 11:30 pm : link
In comment 14573276 jcn56 said:
Quote:
In comment 14573186 WillVAB said:


Quote:


In comment 14573142 Vanzetti said:


Quote:


Injuries

Nicks, Cruz, Snee, Bass, Trrrell Thomas, David Wilson and Tuck all going down with career ending injuries or injuries that left them s shell of their former selves. All in 1-2 year period. And other keys guys, like Osi and Diego, just got old



Nicks, Cruz, KP, and SS were bad luck. The rest, not so much. Either bad players or had major injury issues in college (hence why they were picked where they were).



The fact that you lumped Tuck is just brilliant. The Giants don't win two SBs without him.


Thatís the point. Tuck was arguably the best player on the field in 2011 playoff run and then the shoulder injury wore him down. He was never the same player afterwards.

But Giants kept trying to win one more with that group and it just wasnít happening because of injuries and aging

I think it was a really understandable mistake. But a mistake nonetheless

RE: Number one factor that contributed to Reeseís downfall  
mrvax : 9/13/2019 12:03 am : link
In comment 14573532 Vanzetti said:
Quote:

Thatís the point. Tuck was arguably the best player on the field in 2011 playoff run and then the shoulder injury wore him down. He was never the same player afterwards.

But Giants kept trying to win one more with that group and it just wasnít happening because of injuries and aging

I think it was a really understandable mistake. But a mistake nonetheless


Wasn't Tuck's serious injury due to a Dallas Oline guy that leg whipped him to stop a sack or am I mixed up with another Giant?
This decade of Giants football  
cjac : 9/13/2019 8:39 am : link
is almost as bad as the 90s

the only difference is that Eli Manning has morphed from Phil Simms into Dave Brown
Recognizing the Giants had to re-tool at so many positions  
Jimmy Googs : 9/13/2019 8:44 am : link
the 2011, 2012 and 2013 draft classes were a complete disaster. Even the players that have stuck in the NFL since those drafts gave the NY Giants so little production.

I still think we are digging out of that mess...
I think it's some kind of football karma  
arniefez : 9/13/2019 8:55 am : link
that the 1st pick of the Chris Mara error was Rocky Thomson II.
I knew it was a matter of time before someone blamed this year's mess  
WillieYoung : 9/13/2019 9:13 am : link
on the 2012 draft class.
David wilson  
giantfan2000 : 9/13/2019 10:50 am : link
made the pro bowl that year as kick returner
yes, he was a very good kick returner  
Greg from LI : 9/13/2019 10:59 am : link
If that's all you get from a first round pick, then it was a lousy pick.
RE: RE: RE: Number one factor that contributed to Reeseís downfall  
WillVAB : 9/14/2019 11:12 am : link
In comment 14573276 jcn56 said:
Quote:
In comment 14573186 WillVAB said:


Quote:


In comment 14573142 Vanzetti said:


Quote:


Injuries

Nicks, Cruz, Snee, Bass, Trrrell Thomas, David Wilson and Tuck all going down with career ending injuries or injuries that left them s shell of their former selves. All in 1-2 year period. And other keys guys, like Osi and Diego, just got old



Nicks, Cruz, KP, and SS were bad luck. The rest, not so much. Either bad players or had major injury issues in college (hence why they were picked where they were).



The fact that you lumped Tuck is just brilliant. The Giants don't win two SBs without him.


Tuck was a great player but injuries hurt his career. The point is people here lamented bad injury luck for years, but Reese consistently targeted guys in the draft who fell due to injury.

Some of it was bad luck, some of it wasnít. When youíre going after injured players as value picks, itís going to catch up to you at some point.
...  
christian : 9/14/2019 11:27 am : link
Why do I get the feeling in 2025 fans will still be blaming Reese's drafts for the state of the team.

This is Gettleman's defense through and through with basically all high asset or high resource players. He also chose to move the best offensive player on the team to bolster the defense.

The Giants are not digging out of anything Reese did.
My digging comment was about how those drafting failures  
Jimmy Googs : 9/14/2019 11:38 am : link
resulted in making other poor decisions over the years out of desperate need, which then beget more problems throughout the roster as areas did not get proper attention/resources/depth etc.

Its not hard to see how bad decisions can amplify a deteriorating situation...
And, in my opinion, those ridiculous draft classes of 2011-2013  
Jimmy Googs : 9/14/2019 11:44 am : link
and how little they produced resulted in reach picks in future years...


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