Hey guys. Stuck between rock and hard place here. Just looking for advice. My daughter tried out for 6th grade volleyball but was cut from team this week along with 3 other girls. At 1st I told her that I was proud of her for giving 100% and trying as she has never played the sport before.
This morning I find out that the team kept a student that is in special ed. This student is handicapped and cant physically play as the other girls. Still, I think this is good for the team to keep her and let her play. Its 6th grade and she deserves to feel the part of the team. The problem I'm having, is my 12 yo doesn't look at it like this. She says it's not fair as she constantly outplayed this girl and deserved to make the team. Her and my wife want to contact school district which I want no part of doing.
How do you guys feel about this? Am I wrong for wanting to sit this one out? I say let it go, and let that poor girl enjoy herself, but then I have my own daughter beating herself up over this? I will not have anything to do with contacting the school over this.
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In comment 14573887 give66 said:
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a student can be denied a spot regardless of skill level. Do they cut the weak math students out of algebra?
Yes - if you're in 8th grade, only certain kids can take algebra. The others have to wait.
I don't know about your district but in mine if the kid is capable of taking it in 8th grade and wants to they do not deny anybody no matter how much extra it costs the district.
My wife is a teacher. I have two kids in public school. I myself went to public school. I have literally never heard of this kind of course scheduling. In 99.9% of the rest of the world, kids get placed in classes based on their demonstrated abilities. A low-performing student doesn't get placed in advanced classes just ti give it a try.
I didn't make the JV baseball team as a 9th grader. They kept 5 football players who had hardly played baseball before. I don't even think a coach watched anything I did in tryouts.
That Summer, I pitched a perfect game in Babe Ruth and led the team in almost every pitching and hitting category. The varsity coach came to one of the games and pulled me aside afterwards and said "You should come out for the team next year". I told him I had the previous year and was cut. He said "next year will be different".
Played varsity the next three years as a starter.
Don't worry about who else has made the team - work on how your daughter can make the team.
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In comment 14573944 Eli Wilson said:
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In comment 14573887 give66 said:
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a student can be denied a spot regardless of skill level. Do they cut the weak math students out of algebra?
Yes - if you're in 8th grade, only certain kids can take algebra. The others have to wait.
I don't know about your district but in mine if the kid is capable of taking it in 8th grade and wants to they do not deny anybody no matter how much extra it costs the district.
My wife is a teacher. I have two kids in public school. I myself went to public school. I have literally never heard of this kind of course scheduling. In 99.9% of the rest of the world, kids get placed in classes based on their demonstrated abilities. A low-performing student doesn't get placed in advanced classes just ti give it a try.
My point is from the OP's post it seems his daughter is perfectly capable of playing on the volleyball team and is being denied. If she was capable of taking algebra in 8th grade there is no way she would be denied a spot in a class.
Its a public school. They all should be playing
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No the other girl is most likely not playing.
Its a public school. They all should be playing
I think you meant to say an entry level rec league team....
a. there is a finite number of players most sports teams can accept, there are very few "everybody makes the team' sports in competitive sports.
b. there is also no expectation that "everyone plays" even in public schools.
it's not surprising that some kids have entitlement mentality when adults have these perceptions.
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In comment 14574022 mdthedream said:
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No the other girl is most likely not playing.
Its a public school. They all should be playing
Cute meme(you hitting that?) but just because it has been done this way for so long doesn't make it right.
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In comment 14574066 give66 said:
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In comment 14574022 mdthedream said:
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No the other girl is most likely not playing.
Its a public school. They all should be playing
Cute meme(you hitting that?) but just because it has been done this way for so long doesn't make it right.
HAHAHA! A sex joke! Hilarious!
OK, so say the school has 1000 students and 200 want to play on the soccer team. Do 200 kids make the soccer team? Do you hire 9 more coaches and make 10 soccer teams? I am not sure you are thinking this one through to the conclusion.
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In comment 14574068 Chris in Philly said:
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In comment 14574066 give66 said:
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In comment 14574022 mdthedream said:
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No the other girl is most likely not playing.
Its a public school. They all should be playing
Cute meme(you hitting that?) but just because it has been done this way for so long doesn't make it right.
HAHAHA! A sex joke! Hilarious!
OK, so say the school has 1000 students and 200 want to play on the soccer team. Do 200 kids make the soccer team? Do you hire 9 more coaches and make 10 soccer teams? I am not sure you are thinking this one through to the conclusion.
Yes I am thinking it through.
This post is glorious.
There isn't some God-given right that if you play on a team that you are given any chance to succeed. It doesn't work that way in sports and it doesn't work that way in life.
But be mindful of alternatives; she might find her true passion. I remember trying out for HS basketball and getting cut and then joining the drama club instead. Got me beat up all the time. So, maybe choose wisely.
There isn't some God-given right that if you play on a team that you are given any chance to succeed. It doesn't work that way in sports and it doesn't work that way in life.
The next level is...and you actually do hear this a lot, even for varsity sports...is that all the kids on the team should get to play (even equal times)...because it's not about winning.
There isn't some God-given right that if you play on a team that you are given any chance to succeed. It doesn't work that way in sports and it doesn't work that way in life.
No divine rights or entitlement. If you are capable and willing to put in the work you should play just like in any other part of school. If that takes 1 coach or twenty coaches it doesnt matter.
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Why is it "right" for every person to play? This entitlement shit has gotten fucking ridiculous.
There isn't some God-given right that if you play on a team that you are given any chance to succeed. It doesn't work that way in sports and it doesn't work that way in life.
No divine rights or entitlement. If you are capable and willing to put in the work you should play just like in any other part of school. If that takes 1 coach or twenty coaches it doesnt matter.
Must be nice to live in a school district with no limit on budgets and no knowledge of competition or reality
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Why is it "right" for every person to play? This entitlement shit has gotten fucking ridiculous.
There isn't some God-given right that if you play on a team that you are given any chance to succeed. It doesn't work that way in sports and it doesn't work that way in life.
The next level is...and you actually do hear this a lot, even for varsity sports...is that all the kids on the team should get to play (even equal times)...because it's not about winning.
Totally agree with that. It is not about winning, Its about learning and growing
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Why is it "right" for every person to play? This entitlement shit has gotten fucking ridiculous.
There isn't some God-given right that if you play on a team that you are given any chance to succeed. It doesn't work that way in sports and it doesn't work that way in life.
No divine rights or entitlement. If you are capable and willing to put in the work you should play just like in any other part of school. If that takes 1 coach or twenty coaches it doesnt matter.
this is the hill you are going to die on?
my high school had 200 kids try out for our hockey team.
20 kids made it.
you think because the other 180 kids were technically capable and willing to put in the work they should play?
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In comment 14574094 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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Why is it "right" for every person to play? This entitlement shit has gotten fucking ridiculous.
There isn't some God-given right that if you play on a team that you are given any chance to succeed. It doesn't work that way in sports and it doesn't work that way in life.
The next level is...and you actually do hear this a lot, even for varsity sports...is that all the kids on the team should get to play (even equal times)...because it's not about winning.
Totally agree with that. It is not about winning, Its about learning and growing
And everyone should get the same grade in algebra.
Hey - I know who can be my first victim, um er patient!!
Hey - I know who can be my first victim, um er patient!!
I'm not sure he could qualify.
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In comment 14574094 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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Why is it "right" for every person to play? This entitlement shit has gotten fucking ridiculous.
There isn't some God-given right that if you play on a team that you are given any chance to succeed. It doesn't work that way in sports and it doesn't work that way in life.
No divine rights or entitlement. If you are capable and willing to put in the work you should play just like in any other part of school. If that takes 1 coach or twenty coaches it doesnt matter.
this is the hill you are going to die on?
my high school had 200 kids try out for our hockey team.
20 kids made it.
you think because the other 180 kids were technically capable and willing to put in the work they should play?
Yes. It is a public service and we are all equal citizens.
"here you go in for 6 seconds, and then you go in for seconds, and then ..."
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In comment 14574104 give66 said:
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In comment 14574094 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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Why is it "right" for every person to play? This entitlement shit has gotten fucking ridiculous.
There isn't some God-given right that if you play on a team that you are given any chance to succeed. It doesn't work that way in sports and it doesn't work that way in life.
No divine rights or entitlement. If you are capable and willing to put in the work you should play just like in any other part of school. If that takes 1 coach or twenty coaches it doesnt matter.
this is the hill you are going to die on?
my high school had 200 kids try out for our hockey team.
20 kids made it.
you think because the other 180 kids were technically capable and willing to put in the work they should play?
Yes. It is a public service and we are all equal citizens.
this has to be trolling
when it comes to athletic ability (and almost any other trait), we are assuredly *not* equal citizens.
I should have gotten my daughter some instruction early on with B-ball, would have helped big time.
Did not make the same mistake with my son and he thrived.
After about 28 school sports seasons, my one observation I wanted to pass along is that most parents are never happy:
1) kid makes team but not playing - not happy
2) Kid makes team, plays, but does not play enough - not happy
3) Kid make team plays, but does not play the position the parents want them to play - not happy
4) Kid makes team, plays, plays the position that the parent thinks they should play, but doesn't get the ball enough - not happy
and so on......
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My son plays soccer.
This post is glorious.
I have failed as a father, yes
She'll probably learn more there anyways. A lot of school coaches have no idea what they are doing. They'll tell the kids to do drills and hustle, but probably won't really give any real individualized instructions on the finer points of technique.
If you sign her up for regular workshops with a real pro or former pro (someone with an AVP Ranking) and you'll look like a hero.
(and please ignore the 'and' from the last sentence in my past)
when it comes to athletic ability (and almost any other trait), we are assuredly *not* equal citizens.
Agreed we are not equal in our abilities but that doesn't mean the services meted out by government should be biased in favor of people with higher ability.
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and it should be patently obvious..
when it comes to athletic ability (and almost any other trait), we are assuredly *not* equal citizens.
Agreed we are not equal in our abilities but that doesn't mean the services meted out by government should be biased in favor of people with higher ability.
What are you talking about. SPorts is not an entitlement program, it's a competitive venture.
The recommendation would be to have your daughter practice and improve. My daughter plays on a travel soccer team (year up) and is a keeper. She won't play keeper at first on this team because she's in sixth grade. The 8th grade keeper will get to play. They don't look at who's good and who's bad as much as their ages. She is going to come off the bench and play the field.
I think it's part of the learning process of life that kids need to know not everything is handed to them.
Her older brother I invested time and money on a hitting coach. After three years he makes any team he tries out for and always starts. If you have a big bat they will always find a spot for you.
You mentioned your daughter never played volleyball before. if she is extremely interested and really wants to do it then spend the time working with her to get her skills up and if she eclipses you are skills get her a Coach that can help her do that. If she can jump real high and block the ball they will find a spot for her, if she can serve real well and dig on the back line they will find a spot for her. At 11 I think it's important just for them to find something they like to do and they can work at. They are kids have a need to have fun at the same time.
You should get a participation ribbon for Delusion Class....
Totally agree with that. It is not about winning, Its about learning and growing
Are you Bernie or Roz Focker?
You should get a participation ribbon for Delusion Class....
Who's paying for the coaches, uniforms, fields,refs etc Santa Claus?
It’s obviously not allowed in public schools but my high school essentially cut gym and ensured that through sophomore year 90% of the kids were on a sports team. (Fielded two freshman basketball teams + jv + varsity for instance). Which do you think was better for the fringe athletes - gym or a team?
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are services meted out by Government??
You should get a participation ribbon for Delusion Class....
Who's paying for the coaches, uniforms, fields,refs etc Santa Claus?
Depends on the sport. My son plays lacrosse. It is self-funded. I guess that gives them liberty to be heartless bastards while those funded by the school district have to play all comers, right??
It is such a moronic stance.
It was a nightmare.
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In comment 14574428 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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are services meted out by Government??
You should get a participation ribbon for Delusion Class....
Who's paying for the coaches, uniforms, fields,refs etc Santa Claus?
Depends on the sport. My son plays lacrosse. It is self-funded. I guess that gives them liberty to be heartless bastards while those funded by the school district have to play all comers, right??
It is such a moronic stance.
Sorry if you cant wrap your head around the paradox I am pointing out.
If we have 100 physics students who are capable of passing we don't say well we will only take the top twenty students and the rest of you can go pound sand come back next year. We must have competition! Only the best can participate in Physics. How would we ever hire 4 extra teachers for these 80 students anyway? Yet we accept this situation in athletics.
If these sports teams are so important that the schools should provide them then anyone that is capable should be accommodated in some way to participate.
They both need to get it through their heads that your daughter's exclusion has absolutely nothing to do with the disabled girl's inclusion. Nothing. Zero. Nada. If it were possible to decouple the issues, maybe you could tactfully raise the question of why anyone has to be cut. Under the circumstances, though, it's going to be difficult to keep the subjects separate. Hence, best to let your daughter back away with dignity, work on her game and try again next fall.