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1st sign that a QB change is coming soon:

Tom in NY : 9/16/2019 12:21 pm
From this morning's Shurmur conference call:


Dan Duggan
@DDuggan21
Shurmur said Eliís been the starter to this point. He wouldnít commit to anything beyond that. Said theyíre looking at everything going forward.
12:18 PM ∑ Sep 16, 2019∑Twitter for iPhone
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That would seem to be a big red flare in the sky to me.
Dan Duggan twitter - ( New Window )
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:24 pm : link
New York Giants
@Giants

7m
Coach Shurmur: Cody Latimer has a concussion. Sterling Shepard is improving from his concussion.
Drink plenty of fluids this week Daniel  
figgy2989 : 9/16/2019 12:24 pm : link
Going to be very hot down in Tampa.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:24 pm : link
Jordan Raanan
@JordanRaanan

3m
Pat Shurmur won't fully commit to Eli Manning as the starter. He says that "he's been our starter so far." They evaluate every position every week. When told that he's leaving Daniel Jones vs Eli open for debate, Shurmur says he "understands."
It needs to be this week  
jvm52106 : 9/16/2019 12:24 pm : link
as the Bucs defense is not solid and the away crowd will not be so hostile that he gets flustered. A home crowd, with huge expectations would be shitty if he struggles.

Now is the time.

I know, others scoffed at this but, playoff possible teams with QB issues- Jags, Steelers, Saints so far, could come a calling for a VET as insurance. We could get a loaf a bread and I would be happy.

Either way, the Giants need to play Jones NOW!
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:25 pm : link
Art Stapleton
@art_stapleton

1m
Pat Shurmur leaves door open to making a change at quarterback, but says thatís the case for all positions. Discussion will be had internally, but not ready to talk about any of the options publicly. #NYGiants
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Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:25 pm : link
Mike Garafolo
@MikeGarafolo

27s
I mean, from the minute they turned the card in at the draft, they knew the situation. As did Eli. If itís not imminent, itís on deck.
I would not make the switch  
cactus : 9/16/2019 12:25 pm : link
until Shepard and Tate are playing. There's very little separation there for Eli to take advantage of, it's not going to be any different for Jones. Do they really want to put him into a situation like he was in at Duke???
I think Eli starts  
Matt in SGS : 9/16/2019 12:25 pm : link
and if the Giants struggle after the 1Q or first half, Eli's getting the hook. That's what I'm reading here.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:26 pm : link
Ian Rapoport
@RapSheet

46s
#Giants coach Pat Shurmur leaves the door open...
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:27 pm : link
GiantsWFAN
@giantswfan

1m
#Giants #Shurmur - focus is on winning the next game while keeping long-term view in mind
RE: I would not make the switch  
PEEJ : 9/16/2019 12:27 pm : link
In comment 14580177 cactus said:
Quote:
until Shepard and Tate are playing. There's very little separation there for Eli to take advantage of, it's not going to be any different for Jones. Do they really want to put him into a situation like he was in at Duke???

On the flip-side, Jones is familiar with the 2nd string WRS.
.  
DanMetroMan : 9/16/2019 12:28 pm : link

Jason La Canfora
@JasonLaCanfora

38s
Giants are ever so gradually cracking the door to a potential QB change that seems frankly inevitable to most. Team admits that QB position should be under review like everything else
.  
Kyle in NY : 9/16/2019 12:28 pm : link
I'm getting the sense that Shurmur would like to make the switch. Frustration is building
RE: I think Eli starts  
figgy2989 : 9/16/2019 12:28 pm : link
In comment 14580178 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
and if the Giants struggle after the 1Q or first half, Eli's getting the hook. That's what I'm reading here.


See, I don't agree with this. If they want Jones to be the starter, he needs to get his reps in with the first team during the week. By doing what you said, you are just setting him up for failure.
Allows them to keep his career record at .500  
FranknWeezer : 9/16/2019 12:28 pm : link
and retain the option to "start" him one last time late in the season if by chance we are playing a team that has tanked, somehow sucks worse than we do or is resting its starters for the playoffs.
I'll believe it when I see it.  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/16/2019 12:28 pm : link
I think if they get to 0-4 they make a change.
RE: I think Eli starts  
jvm52106 : 9/16/2019 12:29 pm : link
In comment 14580178 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
and if the Giants struggle after the 1Q or first half, Eli's getting the hook. That's what I'm reading here.


Quite possibly but, kind of a shitty thing for Jones. You go in if the 1st line struggles and you are behind and had less than the full work week with the starters.

Cut the cord PS.. It is fucking time..

Grandpa can't see or hear and shouldn't be driving anymore. The dog is lame, no more hunting trips. The bananas are ready for making bread not straight up eating any more...

It is Jones time!
its happening  
Br00klyn : 9/16/2019 12:29 pm : link
its really happening
RE: ...  
aka dbrny : 9/16/2019 12:29 pm : link
In comment 14580165 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
New York Giants
@Giants

7m
Coach Shurmur: Cody Latimer has a concussion. Sterling Shepard is improving from his concussion.


If the NFL was serious about player safety, they would allow a coaches challenge on helmet to helmet. That was a serious hit/non-call.
Going to happen  
Thegratefulhead : 9/16/2019 12:29 pm : link
For all the reason I listed all week, if we lost in Buffalo, Jones should start.

It sucks to be ownership and GM right now.

One thing can change that entirely and flip it on its heels.

Daniel Jones wins in Tampa.

All of a sudden everything is pointing up.

It is happening, they just haven't told Eli yet.
RE: RE: I would not make the switch  
aka dbrny : 9/16/2019 12:29 pm : link
In comment 14580185 PEEJ said:
Quote:
In comment 14580177 cactus said:


Quote:


until Shepard and Tate are playing. There's very little separation there for Eli to take advantage of, it's not going to be any different for Jones. Do they really want to put him into a situation like he was in at Duke???


On the flip-side, Jones is familiar with the 2nd string WRS.


That's so funny its sad
RE: RE: I think Eli starts  
ron mexico : 9/16/2019 12:30 pm : link
In comment 14580191 figgy2989 said:
Quote:
In comment 14580178 Matt in SGS said:


Quote:


and if the Giants struggle after the 1Q or first half, Eli's getting the hook. That's what I'm reading here.



See, I don't agree with this. If they want Jones to be the starter, he needs to get his reps in with the first team during the week. By doing what you said, you are just setting him up for failure.


I agree 100%

either way he needs to start taking some of Eli's practice reps
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:30 pm : link
Paul Schwartz
@NYPost_Schwartz

1m
Pat Shurmur said he does not want to be dishonest. He simply is not ready to say Eli Manning starts the next game.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:31 pm : link
GiantsWFAN
@giantswfan

36s
#Shumur - DSlayton will practice this week...he is closer
RE: I think Eli starts  
cjac : 9/16/2019 12:31 pm : link
In comment 14580178 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
and if the Giants struggle after the 1Q or first half, Eli's getting the hook. That's what I'm reading here.


I think thats a terrible idea, just start him
Mara & DG putting out feelers immediately  
Canton : 9/16/2019 12:31 pm : link
to see how the media and fans react to Shurnur's statement. If it's less volatile than McAdoo's, I feel it's all systems go with Daniel Jones, this week or the next.
Wait another game or so  
Elisha10 : 9/16/2019 12:32 pm : link
Eli is right behind Big Ben in all time yards and TD passes, yes I care!
RE: Wait another game or so  
jvm52106 : 9/16/2019 12:35 pm : link
In comment 14580217 Elisha10 said:
Quote:
Eli is right behind Big Ben in all time yards and TD passes, yes I care!


Get off the site Archie... Your sons have multiple SB victories and MVP;s, it is time.,..
RE: I would not make the switch  
prdave73 : 9/16/2019 12:35 pm : link
In comment 14580177 cactus said:
Quote:
until Shepard and Tate are playing. There's very little separation there for Eli to take advantage of, it's not going to be any different for Jones. Do they really want to put him into a situation like he was in at Duke???


Agree 100%. You donít want to put that much pressure on a rookie. Without any help, it can just hurt him more. Last thing we need is for all the Giants rookies to suck ass..
Starting DJ is the right move  
LG in NYC : 9/16/2019 12:35 pm : link
Funny, McAdoo gets vilified here and (mostly) for good reason... but he saw the writing on the wall with Eli long before most others were willing to accept it.

He handled it horribly and didn't have a #6 draft pick on the bench to transition to... but in the end, he was right about the need for a change at QB.
If Drew Brees  
Joey in VA : 9/16/2019 12:35 pm : link
Is out for an extended period of time I call the Saints. Eli can play on that offense.
RE: If Drew Brees  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:37 pm : link
In comment 14580232 Joey in VA said:
Quote:
Is out for an extended period of time I call the Saints. Eli can play on that offense.


Joey, there are a number of places now where Eli could end up. He had better understand his position here.
RE: If Drew Brees  
Br00klyn : 9/16/2019 12:38 pm : link
In comment 14580232 Joey in VA said:
Quote:
Is out for an extended period of time I call the Saints. Eli can play on that offense.


He is not better than many QB's in the league at this point, Teddy B included
Guys, Guys, Hold On - Mara needs to hear what Francesser says  
V.I.G. : 9/16/2019 12:38 pm : link
before Mara signs off.
RE: ...  
Danny Kanell : 9/16/2019 12:39 pm : link
In comment 14580207 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Paul Schwartz
@NYPost_Schwartz

1m
Pat Shurmur said he does not want to be dishonest. He simply is not ready to say Eli Manning starts the next game.


This is the most telling. I think it's happening this week and it should.
RE: If Drew Brees  
V.I.G. : 9/16/2019 12:40 pm : link
In comment 14580232 Joey in VA said:
Quote:
Is out for an extended period of time I call the Saints. Eli can play on that offense.

what makes you think the Saints want Eli?
I think they should make the move  
Section331 : 9/16/2019 12:41 pm : link
sooner rather than later, but I wouldnít do it on the road at TB. Let him start the following week at home v WASH.
Nobody is trading for Eli.  
Zeke's Alibi : 9/16/2019 12:41 pm : link
.
In a strange  
Jon in NYC : 9/16/2019 12:42 pm : link
twist of fate, Eli replaces Big Ben in Pittsburgh.
RE: ...  
Jon in NYC : 9/16/2019 12:43 pm : link
In comment 14580208 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
GiantsWFAN
@giantswfan

36s
#Shumur - DSlayton will practice this week...he is closer


I'm excited about Slayton. He has produced all spring/summer when healthy
RE: RE: If Drew Brees  
Big Rick in FL : 9/16/2019 12:43 pm : link
In comment 14580241 Br00klyn said:
Quote:
In comment 14580232 Joey in VA said:


Quote:


Is out for an extended period of time I call the Saints. Eli can play on that offense.



He is not better than many QB's in the league at this point, Teddy B included


I don't think Eli is good at all. He's better than Bridgewater.

Bridgewater plays with some of the best weapons in the game and a very good OL. Here are his numbers in 2 games with the Saints.

He's completing 58% of his passes for 283 yards with 1 TD and 1 INT and 1 fumble lost.
Shurmur could also just be toying with Tampa  
Jimmy Meatballs : 9/16/2019 12:44 pm : link
so they have to game plan for 2 QBís
RE: RE: RE: If Drew Brees  
V.I.G. : 9/16/2019 12:45 pm : link
In comment 14580256 Big Rick in FL said:
Quote:

He's completing 58% of his passes for 283 yards with 1 TD and 1 INT and 1 fumble lost.

kind of late 30s eli numbers, no?
RE: In a strange  
nygiants16 : 9/16/2019 12:46 pm : link
In comment 14580253 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
twist of fate, Eli replaces Big Ben in Pittsburgh.


they are rolling with rudolph he had a good preseason and he is their heir apparent
RE: Nobody is trading for Eli.  
Nine-Tails : 9/16/2019 12:46 pm : link
In comment 14580252 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
.


Agree, no team with playoff dreams and an injured starter are looking at Eli and be like he could keep us in the hunt. First there was the colts, they locked up Brissett, then the jags and Minshew is playing great for sixth rd pick. The Steelers have Rudolph and the saints have teddy
RE: If Drew Brees  
Dave : 9/16/2019 12:46 pm : link
In comment 14580232 Joey in VA said:
Quote:
Is out for an extended period of time I call the Saints. Eli can play on that offense.


THIS!
Nobody  
AcidTest : 9/16/2019 12:46 pm : link
is trading for Eli, even if he was willing to waive his no trade clause. He can't move, and nobody wants his contract.

Shurmur knows that the only way he can justify a disastrous season is to put Jones in and say that any mistakes are the function of him being a rookie. I also think Shurmur is understandably frustrated that Eli can't run his offense, which needs a mobile QB. How much of his playbook can't be used because Eli is completely immobile?
Unless DJ  
HoustonGiant : 9/16/2019 12:47 pm : link
has a killer swim move and can get to the QB, it doesn't matter.
RE: Wait another game or so  
myquealer : 9/16/2019 12:47 pm : link
In comment 14580217 Elisha10 said:
Quote:
Eli is right behind Big Ben in all time yards and TD passes, yes I care!


Wow, only one TD and 8 yards behind, and with Ben out for the season, he might be done.
Here  
AcidTest : 9/16/2019 12:48 pm : link
is what I think may happen:

Eli starts the game, but Jones replaces him if Eli falters and the Giants get down by 14 points. If that doesn't happen, then Jones starts against the Redskins.
RE: RE: ...  
Vanzetti : 9/16/2019 12:48 pm : link
In comment 14580196 aka dbrny said:
Quote:
In comment 14580165 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


New York Giants
@Giants

7m
Coach Shurmur: Cody Latimer has a concussion. Sterling Shepard is improving from his concussion.



If the NFL was serious about player safety, they would allow a coaches challenge on helmet to helmet. That was a serious hit/non-call.



Excellent point. You basically nailed their hypocrisy
People who think there's a trade market for Eli  
Heisenberg : 9/16/2019 12:50 pm : link
are pretty much delusional.
RE: Shurmur could also just be toying with Tampa  
Diver_Down : 9/16/2019 12:50 pm : link
In comment 14580259 Jimmy Meatballs said:
Quote:
so they have to game plan for 2 QBís


With Tampa, they have to game plan for 4 QBs. They never know which version of Winston they will get.
RE: Here  
Br00klyn : 9/16/2019 12:50 pm : link
In comment 14580276 AcidTest said:
Quote:
is what I think may happen:

Eli starts the game, but Jones replaces him if Eli falters and the Giants get down by 14 points. If that doesn't happen, then Jones starts against the Redskins.


I just dont see the point, let the kid know hes starting and give him the week to prepare. Try to set him up with the best chance to succeed
The biggest downside playing Jones  
Go Terps : 9/16/2019 12:51 pm : link
If he plays well it will obscure the fact that Gettleman and Shurmur are incompetent and need to be replaced.

Jones could be Joe Montana and it won't matter with these people running the team. Eli is shot and needs to be replaced immediately, but we shouldn't lose sight that his continued pathetic presence is a symptom of a much larger and deeper problem.
RE: RE: Shurmur could also just be toying with Tampa  
Jon in NYC : 9/16/2019 12:51 pm : link
In comment 14580287 Diver_Down said:
Quote:
In comment 14580259 Jimmy Meatballs said:


Quote:


so they have to game plan for 2 QBís



With Tampa, they have to game plan for 4 QBs. They never know which version of Winston they will get.


Wow this was a great post.
I disagree that Eli  
mittenedman : 9/16/2019 12:51 pm : link
would look good anywhere. He is not an NFL QB anymore. He is as done as any player Iíve seen, and actually has been for years now.
RE: RE: RE: RE: If Drew Brees  
Big Rick in FL : 9/16/2019 12:53 pm : link
In comment 14580265 V.I.G. said:
Quote:
In comment 14580256 Big Rick in FL said:


Quote:



He's completing 58% of his passes for 283 yards with 1 TD and 1 INT and 1 fumble lost.


kind of late 30s eli numbers, no?


Sadly even Eli's numbers have been better
RE: The biggest downside playing Jones  
hitdog42 : 9/16/2019 12:53 pm : link
In comment 14580290 Go Terps said:
Quote:
If he plays well it will obscure the fact that Gettleman and Shurmur are incompetent and need to be replaced.

Jones could be Joe Montana and it won't matter with these people running the team. Eli is shot and needs to be replaced immediately, but we shouldn't lose sight that his continued pathetic presence is a symptom of a much larger and deeper problem.


facts
RE: RE: Shurmur could also just be toying with Tampa  
Nine-Tails : 9/16/2019 12:54 pm : link
In comment 14580287 Diver_Down said:
Quote:
In comment 14580259 Jimmy Meatballs said:


Quote:


so they have to game plan for 2 QBís



With Tampa, they have to game plan for 4 QBs. They never know which version of Winston they will get.


I think it comes down to if they can force turnovers. Itís given that Winston will move the ball. If we canít get turnovers, heíll light it up against us
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:54 pm : link
Ryan Dunleavy
@rydunleavy

46s
Eli Manning is handling questions about his shaken job security like a pro but finally said Ďletís stay away from the ifs...í #giants
RE: The biggest downside playing Jones  
V.I.G. : 9/16/2019 12:55 pm : link
In comment 14580290 Go Terps said:
Quote:
If he plays well it will obscure the fact that Gettleman and Shurmur are incompetent and need to be replaced.

Jones could be Joe Montana and it won't matter with these people running the team. Eli is shot and needs to be replaced immediately, but we shouldn't lose sight that his continued pathetic presence is a symptom of a much larger and deeper problem.

That makes little sense. If jones is the goods doesnít that show that DG did his job and shurmur can run an offense with another QB? If anything it shows that Mara didnít do his by interfering.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:56 pm : link
New York Giants
@Giants

1m
Eli Manning: We have a stud running back in Saquon, so we know teams are going to try to stop the run...we have to throw the ball better than we have been, especially on third downs.
So let me make sure i understand this  
arniefez : 9/16/2019 12:56 pm : link
HC with a .294 winning percentage is thinking about playing his rookie QB after 2 games? Probably the only chance he has to be back next year so it makes perfect sense.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:56 pm : link
Dan Duggan
@DDuggan21

14s
Eli said nothing changes for him. Heís getting ready to play this week.
This is a very bad way to do this  
Rudy5757 : 9/16/2019 12:56 pm : link
Even if Shurmur was to make a change, you dont do it in the media. By handling it this was he is basically saying I want to make a change but I have to wait for ownership to give me permission. He is creating a media feeding frenzy.

While I believe that Jones should start, this is once again the wrong way to handle the situation. Make the decision, tell the players 1st, then tell the media.

This franchise is a joke from ownership down to the coach
Oline  
RIGiantsguy : 9/16/2019 12:57 pm : link
The oline is (knock on wood) relatively healthy right now. It's only fair to give Jones a chance behind the same protection Eli has been afforded this year. Why wait to throw Jones in there when injuries pile up, the weather gets worse and the schedule gets harder. This move makes too much sense....
RE: Wait another game or so  
japanhead : 9/16/2019 12:57 pm : link
In comment 14580217 Elisha10 said:
Quote:
Eli is right behind Big Ben in all time yards and TD passes, yes I care!


as sad as it makes me to say it, ben has shown himself to be the better quarterback and a few more one-TD performances from eli won't change that. ben has more yards and TD passes than eli and he's done it in about 16 fewer games played.
Funny thing: It's been almost exactly 40 years...  
Big Blue Blogger : 9/16/2019 12:57 pm : link
...since the winless 1979 Giants gave the #7 pick in the Draft his first start, against... Tampa Bay. Seems like yesterday.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:58 pm : link
Dan Duggan
@DDuggan21

59s
Replying to
@DDuggan21
Eli said hos conversations with Shurmur since yesterday have been no different. He said itís not important to get clarity on his situation.
RE: ...  
eli4life : 9/16/2019 12:59 pm : link
In comment 14580301 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Ryan Dunleavy
@rydunleavy

46s
Eli Manning is handling questions about his shaken job security like a pro but finally said Ďletís stay away from the ifs...í #giants


Sadly when you have a great player at the end of his career it ends like this more times than not.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:59 pm : link
Tom Rock
@TomRock_Newsday

29s
Eli after a few questions about the possibility of a change at quarterback:

ďLetís stay away from the ifs.Ē
And BBI starts  
exiled : 9/16/2019 12:59 pm : link
dancing in the street
RE: ...  
JPinstripes : 9/16/2019 12:59 pm : link
In comment 14580310 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Dan Duggan
@DDuggan21

14s
Eli said nothing changes for him. Heís getting ready to play this week.


Why change a thing if you're Eli making a cool 1.5M weekly (in season)???
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 12:59 pm : link
Paul Schwartz
@NYPost_Schwartz

20s
Eli Manning just finished his media session/inquisition. Said heís preparing to play as usual. Hasnít heard anything from Shurmur to suggest otherwise.
Sounded weary of the subject of his job security that his head coach decided to make public today.
RE: Oline  
AcidTest : 9/16/2019 1:00 pm : link
In comment 14580312 RIGiantsguy said:
Quote:
The oline is (knock on wood) relatively healthy right now. It's only fair to give Jones a chance behind the same protection Eli has been afforded this year. Why wait to throw Jones in there when injuries pile up, the weather gets worse and the schedule gets harder. This move makes too much sense....


Excellent point, and one that isn't often noted. Jones has the best chance to succeed while we are still relatively healthy, and the weather is still good.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 1:01 pm : link
Jordan Raanan
@JordanRaanan

47s
Eli Manning says at this pt ďnothing changes.Ē He says there havenít been any conversations w/coaches + management about starting status. Says Giants ď0-2 and looking for answers. I get it. When you draft a guy early and youíre not winning games, these were going to come up.Ē
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 1:01 pm : link
Tom Rock
@TomRock_Newsday

30s
Tough day for the 2004 quarterback class.
Put the kid in  
PetesHereNow : 9/16/2019 1:02 pm : link
Stop with the twisting in the wind of an all time great Giant. It is clear this is not a winning team. Might as well get the kid the game experience.
Not sure  
Tim in VA : 9/16/2019 1:02 pm : link
Why anybody gives a shit. We're going nowhere with our coaching staff.
RE: Not sure  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 1:03 pm : link
In comment 14580336 Tim in VA said:
Quote:
Why anybody gives a shit. We're going nowhere with our coaching staff.


You don't think the move away from a QB who has been starting for this team since 2004 is a big deal?
could this be shurmur trying to put pressure on mara?  
nygiants16 : 9/16/2019 1:03 pm : link
if he had free reign to make a change and if he wants to make a change he wouls jist do it, no reason to put it out in the media...
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/16/2019 1:04 pm : link
I hoping Shurmur screws with all of us and starts Tanney. /s
shurmur is handling this poorly (shocker)  
GiantsFan84 : 9/16/2019 1:05 pm : link
there is no need for eli to be out there answering these types of questions.
Based on his his tone and body language  
jlukes : 9/16/2019 1:06 pm : link
I truly believe Shurmur has his hands tied by ownership. It looks and sounds like he wants Jones on the field
RE: ...  
cjac : 9/16/2019 1:07 pm : link
In comment 14580342 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I hoping Shurmur screws with all of us and starts Tanney. /s


HAHAHAAHA, can you imagine?
RE: shurmur is handling this poorly (shocker)  
nygiants16 : 9/16/2019 1:07 pm : link
In comment 14580343 GiantsFan84 said:
Quote:
there is no need for eli to be out there answering these types of questions.


eli would be answering these type of questions whether shurmur said something or didnt say something
Agree that the way Shurmur is handling this is awful...  
Tesla : 9/16/2019 1:07 pm : link
either make a change or don't.....but don't drop a bomb like this if you're not 100% ready to make the change. And even if they're not sure what they're doing this week just say Eli's is our starting QB. And if you come out tomorrow and say we've made a change of plans, Jones is starting vs. TB, then so what....the story isn't going to be that you lied to the media on Monday, it's going to be that you've made the switch at QB's.

Shurmur is just really dreadful when dealing with the media.
RE: Based on his his tone and body language  
AcidTest : 9/16/2019 1:08 pm : link
In comment 14580347 jlukes said:
Quote:
I truly believe Shurmur has his hands tied by ownership. It looks and sounds like he wants Jones on the field


Quite possibly. As I said, most of Shurmur's offense is predicated on having a mobile QB, which as we saw yesterday with Allen, is an enormous advantage in today's NFL.
I think the right thing to do  
Jay on the Island : 9/16/2019 1:08 pm : link
Is to release Eli and allow him the opportunity to latch on with a team like the Saints, Steelers, or Jags that lost their starting QB.

I am hoping that the reason they kept Alex Tanney on the roster was in case they started off poorly and made the switch to Jones. Releasing Eli would allow him to try to find a starting job elsewhere while the Giants open up a lot of cap room to carry over into next year.
RE: Agree that the way Shurmur is handling this is awful...  
nygiants16 : 9/16/2019 1:10 pm : link
In comment 14580354 Tesla said:
Quote:
either make a change or don't.....but don't drop a bomb like this if you're not 100% ready to make the change. And even if they're not sure what they're doing this week just say Eli's is our starting QB. And if you come out tomorrow and say we've made a change of plans, Jones is starting vs. TB, then so what....the story isn't going to be that you lied to the media on Monday, it's going to be that you've made the switch at QB's.

Shurmur is just really dreadful when dealing with the media.


what if shurmur is ready to make a change and is being met with resistance?
RE: This is a very bad way to do this  
Zeke's Alibi : 9/16/2019 1:10 pm : link
In comment 14580311 Rudy5757 said:
Quote:
Even if Shurmur was to make a change, you dont do it in the media. By handling it this was he is basically saying I want to make a change but I have to wait for ownership to give me permission. He is creating a media feeding frenzy.

While I believe that Jones should start, this is once again the wrong way to handle the situation. Make the decision, tell the players 1st, then tell the media.

This franchise is a joke from ownership down to the coach


Maybe that is the point. It seems like pressure is coming from all sides on this issue, coaches, fans, media. You know John Mara doesn't want to do it after two weeks, but he really needs to listen to what literally everyone else is saying.
RE: RE: Not sure  
Tim in VA : 9/16/2019 1:10 pm : link
In comment 14580339 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 14580336 Tim in VA said:


Quote:


Why anybody gives a shit. We're going nowhere with our coaching staff.



You don't think the move away from a QB who has been starting for this team since 2004 is a big deal?


In and of itself it is but to what end? Will it make us a contender in the next 2 seasons? No, and that has nothing to do with Daniel Jones and everything to do with an inept coaching staff (again) that will not be replaced soon enough. Not to mention the likelihood of getting a good replacement.
Unless They Win in TB (or lose a very competitive game)  
Rong5611 : 9/16/2019 1:12 pm : link
It will be the Washington game. Jones starting will sell tickets, merchandise and refreshments - more money for the owners.
since eli played week 1 his contract is fully guaranteed  
ron mexico : 9/16/2019 1:12 pm : link
the only way we would get cap relief is if there is offset language in the contract which we probably didn't require of him.

Eli actually has value as a seasoned vet back up on this team. More value than he has as a starter.

Based on his play from Duke, he is not great at protecting himself. There is no reason to ship Eli off if we are paying him anyway, he might be needed later in the season.
RE: The biggest downside playing Jones  
lax counsel : 9/16/2019 1:13 pm : link
In comment 14580290 Go Terps said:
Quote:
If he plays well it will obscure the fact that Gettleman and Shurmur are incompetent and need to be replaced.

Jones could be Joe Montana and it won't matter with these people running the team. Eli is shot and needs to be replaced immediately, but we shouldn't lose sight that his continued pathetic presence is a symptom of a much larger and deeper problem.


Agreed, if Jones turns out to be the player he was in preseason, it's going to mask a lot of organizational deficiencies and may save a lot of jobs and continue with the status quo.
I want to see  
JPinstripes : 9/16/2019 1:13 pm : link
Shurmur's offense operate with a mobile QB like D. Jones.
RE: RE: RE: Not sure  
nygiants16 : 9/16/2019 1:14 pm : link
In comment 14580369 Tim in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 14580339 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


In comment 14580336 Tim in VA said:


Quote:


Why anybody gives a shit. We're going nowhere with our coaching staff.



You don't think the move away from a QB who has been starting for this team since 2004 is a big deal?



In and of itself it is but to what end? Will it make us a contender in the next 2 seasons? No, and that has nothing to do with Daniel Jones and everything to do with an inept coaching staff (again) that will not be replaced soon enough. Not to mention the likelihood of getting a good replacement.


funny people said the same thing after eli's first year
RE: RE: Wait another game or so  
HomerJones45 : 9/16/2019 1:15 pm : link
In comment 14580229 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
In comment 14580217 Elisha10 said:


Quote:


Eli is right behind Big Ben in all time yards and TD passes, yes I care!



Get off the site Archie... Your sons have multiple SB victories and MVP;s, it is time.,..
You've played that "it is time" meme over and over again starting with Gilbride. It's working out well.
RE:  
Mr. Bungle : 9/16/2019 1:15 pm : link
In comment 14580172 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
the Bucs defense is not solid

The Bucs defense looked great on Thursday in Carolina.
RE: Not sure  
HomerJones45 : 9/16/2019 1:17 pm : link
In comment 14580336 Tim in VA said:
Quote:
Why anybody gives a shit. We're going nowhere with our coaching staff.
Or this front office. This is like rooting for an expansion team.
RE: ...  
Mdgiantsfan : 9/16/2019 1:20 pm : link
In comment 14580342 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I hoping Shurmur screws with all of us and starts Tanney. /s


😂
nygiants16  
Tesla : 9/16/2019 1:22 pm : link
Quote:
what if shurmur is ready to make a change and is being met with resistance?


Yeah, this was my initial reaction as well actually. This is Shurmur's way of putting pressure on Mara. But that's a dangerous game he's playing....Mara's not likely to appreciate Shurmur handling that kind of a dispute via the media.

Oh to be a fly on the wall in "Jints Central" today!
RE: Based on his his tone and body language  
Blue Dream : 9/16/2019 1:22 pm : link
In comment 14580347 jlukes said:
Quote:
I truly believe Shurmur has his hands tied by ownership. It looks and sounds like he wants Jones on the field


Shurmur is the coach, it is his decision who plays and who doesn't. John Mara can't stop him from doing it. The only thing Mara could do is fire him for defying his wishes or get rid of Jones to take the option away from him. So the only question is does Shurmur have the balls to do what needs to be done?
RE: RE: Based on his his tone and body language  
nygiants16 : 9/16/2019 1:24 pm : link
In comment 14580408 Blue Dream said:
Quote:
In comment 14580347 jlukes said:


Quote:


I truly believe Shurmur has his hands tied by ownership. It looks and sounds like he wants Jones on the field



Shurmur is the coach, it is his decision who plays and who doesn't. John Mara can't stop him from doing it. The only thing Mara could do is fire him for defying his wishes or get rid of Jones to take the option away from him. So the only question is does Shurmur have the balls to do what needs to be done?


you dont sctually believe this do you? you thibk shurmur can bench eli? he absolutely has to get the ok
Mara said that its Shurmurs decision  
cjac : 9/16/2019 1:26 pm : link
Gettleman said the same thing
I actually agree with Blue Dream...  
Tesla : 9/16/2019 1:27 pm : link
he's right. Shurmur is the coach, it's his team right now. If he says Jones start, Jones will start. Mara's only recourse would be to fire him on the spot like he did McAdoo.

Problem is this time the fans would be nearly 100% on Shurmur's side.
RE: ...  
GeofromNJ : 9/16/2019 1:29 pm : link
In comment 14580165 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
New York Giants
@Giants

7m
Coach Shurmur: Cody Latimer has a concussion. Sterling Shepard is improving from his concussion.

Eric, How close to all football players (except kickers) come to having at least one concussion per game?
I kind of donít care anymore...  
trueblueinpw : 9/16/2019 1:29 pm : link
Eli isnít what he was, I think we all know that. The NFL isnít what it was. And the Giants arenít what they once were either.

One thing I will say, Iím tired of Eli being the person everyone is pointing at as the problem. Heís part of the problem? Ok. But the Giants are fucking pathetic and have been for many years now. Let the kid start and let everyone else start to be accountable for their part in making the Giants the 2nd worst team in the NFL.
RE: RE: RE: Based on his his tone and body language  
Blue Dream : 9/16/2019 1:30 pm : link
In comment 14580412 nygiants16 said:
Quote:







you dont sctually believe this do you? you thibk shurmur can bench eli? he absolutely has to get the ok


He absolutely could go against Mara's wishes and dare him to do something about it
Pleasantly  
Les in TO : 9/16/2019 1:30 pm : link
Surprised
RE: RE: Wait another game or so  
PatersonPlank : 9/16/2019 1:32 pm : link
In comment 14580314 japanhead said:
Quote:
In comment 14580217 Elisha10 said:


Quote:


Eli is right behind Big Ben in all time yards and TD passes, yes I care!



as sad as it makes me to say it, ben has shown himself to be the better quarterback and a few more one-TD performances from eli won't change that. ben has more yards and TD passes than eli and he's done it in about 16 fewer games played.


Ben also has had a good OL, a good running game with Bell (and others), and Antonio Brown/Juju/others. His surrounding talent for the past 5 years has been much much better. Same goes for Rivers

All 3 are done now however, and you can probably put Brees on the list too
ron mexico  
arniefez : 9/16/2019 1:36 pm : link
smart post. I agree that if Jones starts soon Eli will play again this year and not because of lack of performance by Jones but the odds he makes it through 13 or 14 games unhurt.
Feeling the heat....  
nzyme : 9/16/2019 1:42 pm : link
You can lose, still look like you know what your doing, and still show promise. Right now this season has NONE of those characteristics and Shurmur knows it!

I have the feeling Shurmur is saying to himself "If I have to go out I'm at least going to go out with the guy who has some upside".
Shurmur  
Lines of Scrimmage : 9/16/2019 1:42 pm : link
is not making these statements without DG and Mara on board. Who knows, maybe the Tisch side wants to move on and is pressuring the switch.

At this point if Eli and the lose again it's over for him. Maybe Eli finally had enough as well.
RE: RE: Based on his his tone and body language  
Matt in SGS : 9/16/2019 1:43 pm : link
In comment 14580408 Blue Dream said:
Quote:
In comment 14580347 jlukes said:


Quote:


I truly believe Shurmur has his hands tied by ownership. It looks and sounds like he wants Jones on the field



Shurmur is the coach, it is his decision who plays and who doesn't. John Mara can't stop him from doing it. The only thing Mara could do is fire him for defying his wishes or get rid of Jones to take the option away from him. So the only question is does Shurmur have the balls to do what needs to be done?


The Giants drafted Jones at #6 and didn't extend Eli despite all the dead cap money from the Odell trade. Everyone knows which way the wind is blowing here. Mara and Gettleman likely wanted Eli to play as long as possible this season but they all knew he's not coming back in 2020. However, getting blown out by Dallas, on the road and a much better team is one thing. Losing by 2 TDs at home vs. a Bills team that went 6-10 last year shows that this team isn't doing anything and not playing Jones is just delaying the obvious.

The Giants have been extremely respectful to Eli. I'm sure somewhere in John Mara's mind he wanted to see the transition from Eli to the new QB much better than how Simms was shown the door during the Rangers Stanley Cup Parade, which Simms is still pissed about.
RE: So let me make sure i understand this  
Festina Lente : 9/16/2019 1:43 pm : link
In comment 14580308 arniefez said:
Quote:
HC with a .294 winning percentage is thinking about playing his rookie QB after 2 games? Probably the only chance he has to be back next year so it makes perfect sense.


I don't mean to be cynical but it does seem that this is Shurmur's best chance at job security. I wonder if it happens, what percentage of the change is down to PS needing to "do something right now" vs what is best for the long term future of the NYG at this point.
RE: Shurmur  
Thegratefulhead : 9/16/2019 1:46 pm : link
In comment 14580461 Lines of Scrimmage said:
Quote:
is not making these statements without DG and Mara on board. Who knows, maybe the Tisch side wants to move on and is pressuring the switch.

At this point if Eli and the lose again it's over for him. Maybe Eli finally had enough as well.
I said during the preseason that Shurmur's HC W/L record would make him feel the heat sooner rather than later if we started losing and that he would feel pressure to start Jones because of it. This appears accurate now. It was met with some resistance.
RE: RE: So let me make sure i understand this  
Matt in SGS : 9/16/2019 1:46 pm : link
In comment 14580465 Festina Lente said:
Quote:
In comment 14580308 arniefez said:


Quote:


HC with a .294 winning percentage is thinking about playing his rookie QB after 2 games? Probably the only chance he has to be back next year so it makes perfect sense.



I don't mean to be cynical but it does seem that this is Shurmur's best chance at job security. I wonder if it happens, what percentage of the change is down to PS needing to "do something right now" vs what is best for the long term future of the NYG at this point.


For sure it's better job security, since the measuring stick will be, is Jones playing better in December. His early lumps and losses will be expected. The only way Shurmur will be gone is if Jones does not get better or goes backwards, but that would seem to be unlikely. A guy like Jones should only get better with more experience.
RE: I kind of donít care anymore...  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 9/16/2019 1:46 pm : link
In comment 14580426 trueblueinpw said:
Quote:
Eli isnít what he was, I think we all know that. The NFL isnít what it was. And the Giants arenít what they once were either.

One thing I will say, Iím tired of Eli being the person everyone is pointing at as the problem. Heís part of the problem? Ok. But the Giants are fucking pathetic and have been for many years now. Let the kid start and let everyone else start to be accountable for their part in making the Giants the 2nd worst team in the NFL.


That's an inaccurate assessment of this situation. What's happening is this team as currently constructed isn't close to competing, therefore, it makes no sense to continue to waste time with Eli Manning starting when Daniel Jones is there. The organization needs to move forward while at the same time assessing whether certain people (Shurmur, Gettleman) will move forward with them too.
RE: Mara said that its Shurmurs decision  
UConn4523 : 9/16/2019 1:46 pm : link
In comment 14580416 cjac said:
Quote:
Gettleman said the same thing


And do you believe that? I donít.
RE: Mara said that its Shurmurs decision  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 9/16/2019 1:49 pm : link
In comment 14580416 cjac said:
Quote:
Gettleman said the same thing


And subway station floors taste like lollipops.
RE: I think Eli starts  
Blue21 : 9/16/2019 1:51 pm : link
In comment 14580178 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
and if the Giants struggle after the 1Q or first half, Eli's getting the hook. That's what I'm reading here.


This would make the most sense.
Matt makes a good point..  
Sean : 9/16/2019 1:51 pm : link
If Mara had a play Eli ultimatum, why would he sign off on Jones at 6?
Here we go with the half way bullshit  
Rflairr : 9/16/2019 1:53 pm : link
Show some leadership and balls. And just make the change. Donít leave both guys twisting in the wind
What I know is that I really just hate this.  
GiantSteps : 9/16/2019 1:53 pm : link
I don't see the point in starting Jones other than it will keep people interested in watching us lose with a rookie at QB. Why start him without Tate and Shep in there? Give the guy the best chance to win once they're back.

Also I think-if respect to Eli is still any kind of a priority to NYG-he should be afforded the same opportunity. AT LEAST give him a game or two with as many decent weapons on the field before he gets benched.

Alas.
RE: RE: Shurmur  
Lines of Scrimmage : 9/16/2019 1:54 pm : link
In comment 14580486 Thegratefulhead said:
Quote:
In comment 14580461 Lines of Scrimmage said:


Quote:


is not making these statements without DG and Mara on board. Who knows, maybe the Tisch side wants to move on and is pressuring the switch.

At this point if Eli and the lose again it's over for him. Maybe Eli finally had enough as well.

I said during the preseason that Shurmur's HC W/L record would make him feel the heat sooner rather than later if we started losing and that he would feel pressure to start Jones because of it. This appears accurate now. It was met with some resistance.


I agree regarding Shurmur. I don't like playing Eli most of the year and then he PS gets a pass and next year.

He has been way to passive this year in expectations. Wait till the press starts hammering his record (overall) after Eli sits. This is the downside to a second time coach. Rightfully, there is a higher expectation to win.

RE: Matt makes a good point..  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 9/16/2019 1:56 pm : link
In comment 14580506 Sean said:
Quote:
If Mara had a play Eli ultimatum, why would he sign off on Jones at 6?


Everyone on the planet knew they had to replace Eli soon. He obviously would've preferred Eli to ride off into the sunset on a high note, hence the "I hope Daniel Jones never sees the field..." because Eli is playing so well comments. That's not the reality of the situation anymore.
RE: What I know is that I really just hate this.  
cjac : 9/16/2019 1:56 pm : link
In comment 14580515 GiantSteps said:
Quote:
I don't see the point in starting Jones other than it will keep people interested in watching us lose with a rookie at QB. Why start him without Tate and Shep in there? Give the guy the best chance to win once they're back.

Also I think-if respect to Eli is still any kind of a priority to NYG-he should be afforded the same opportunity. AT LEAST give him a game or two with as many decent weapons on the field before he gets benched.

Alas.


You're kidding right, whats the point in continuing to start Eli. He cant convert a third down.
RE: ...  
Blue21 : 9/16/2019 1:56 pm : link
In comment 14580342 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I hoping Shurmur screws with all of us and starts Tanney. /s


LMAO
RE: RE: RE: So let me make sure i understand this  
ron mexico : 9/16/2019 1:56 pm : link
In comment 14580487 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
In comment 14580465 Festina Lente said:


Quote:


In comment 14580308 arniefez said:


Quote:


HC with a .294 winning percentage is thinking about playing his rookie QB after 2 games? Probably the only chance he has to be back next year so it makes perfect sense.



I don't mean to be cynical but it does seem that this is Shurmur's best chance at job security. I wonder if it happens, what percentage of the change is down to PS needing to "do something right now" vs what is best for the long term future of the NYG at this point.



For sure it's better job security, since the measuring stick will be, is Jones playing better in December. His early lumps and losses will be expected. The only way Shurmur will be gone is if Jones does not get better or goes backwards, but that would seem to be unlikely. A guy like Jones should only get better with more experience.


one counterpoint to this is: Jones was the most experienced and well coached guy coming out by a country mile.

I'm not saying this is the case, but its possible he is already near his ceiling.
RE: What I know is that I really just hate this.  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 9/16/2019 1:58 pm : link
In comment 14580515 GiantSteps said:
Quote:
I don't see the point in starting Jones other than it will keep people interested in watching us lose with a rookie at QB. Why start him without Tate and Shep in there? Give the guy the best chance to win once they're back.


I don't get this comment. Their WRs didn't play badly yesterday. Eli said he thought they played well and I don't think that was just some Eli nonsense talking point.
Making the change  
Thegratefulhead : 9/16/2019 1:58 pm : link
12% Chance to make playoffs at 0-2 That is real.

I have not heard one talking head or BBI commentator make a compelling case to start Eli next week.

I have heard, it would be mistake if isn't ready.

Got a little clue for them.

We ain't gonna know if he is ready until we put him the fuck in there.

0-2 6 of the last 7 seasons. We are all so fucking tired of it.

If we start Jones at least it will begin to feel like we are at least trying to win. FFS talk to Eli and pull off the fucking band aid.
RE: What I know is that I really just hate this.  
ron mexico : 9/16/2019 1:58 pm : link
In comment 14580515 GiantSteps said:
Quote:
I don't see the point in starting Jones other than it will keep people interested in watching us lose with a rookie at QB. Why start him without Tate and Shep in there? Give the guy the best chance to win once they're back.

Also I think-if respect to Eli is still any kind of a priority to NYG-he should be afforded the same opportunity. AT LEAST give him a game or two with as many decent weapons on the field before he gets benched.

Alas.


shep should be back this week
RE: Matt makes a good point..  
Go Terps : 9/16/2019 1:58 pm : link
In comment 14580506 Sean said:
Quote:
If Mara had a play Eli ultimatum, why would he sign off on Jones at 6?


These are the questions that arise when major decisions are made by a committee of people with different agendas and timelines:

John Mara
Steve Tisch
Chris Mara
Dave Gettleman
Kevin Abrams
Pat Shurmur
Ernie Accorsi

This is the root of the Giants' problems. Right there in that list. This group that's trapped in the '80s is what we're bringing into a competition with the Eagles and *gasp* the Patriots.

Who plays quarterback is irrelevant as long as this is the arrangement.
If Eli is benched, Jones plays  
GeofromNJ : 9/16/2019 1:59 pm : link
and Eli's sitting will not be based on any fake injury. Shurmur will simply tell Eli he's starting Jones and Eli should stand ready to come into the game in the event Jone's gets injured. I don't think Shurmur, Gettleman, or Mara/Tisch care about Eli's sensitive nature. He's being paid $23 million to lose.
So we decided to bring Eli and his fat paycheck back this year  
bceagle05 : 9/16/2019 1:59 pm : link
knowing we might pull the plug on him two games in? Sheer incompetence.

I'd wait for Tate and Shepard to return before going to Jones, but Shurmur may not be so patient. He sees two winnable games coming up in a season where wins may be tough to come by.
RE: What I know is that I really just hate this.  
cokeduplt : 9/16/2019 1:59 pm : link
In comment 14580515 GiantSteps said:
Quote:
I don't see the point in starting Jones other than it will keep people interested in watching us lose with a rookie at QB. Why start him without Tate and Shep in there? Give the guy the best chance to win once they're back.

Also I think-if respect to Eli is still any kind of a priority to NYG-he should be afforded the same opportunity. AT LEAST give him a game or two with as many decent weapons on the field before he gets benched.


Thatís crazy there is no point in playing Eli. We need to see what Jones is a soon as possible the longer we wait the longer it takes to not be a joke anymore.
Alas.
Well  
Mark from Jersey : 9/16/2019 1:59 pm : link
I hope they make a change soon. Watching DJ progress take his lumps and learn would be 100 times more interesting than watching Eli
RE: What I know is that I really just hate this.  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/16/2019 2:02 pm : link
In comment 14580515 GiantSteps said:
Quote:
I don't see the point in starting Jones other than it will keep people interested in watching us lose with a rookie at QB. Why start him without Tate and Shep in there? Give the guy the best chance to win once they're back.

Also I think-if respect to Eli is still any kind of a priority to NYG-he should be afforded the same opportunity. AT LEAST give him a game or two with as many decent weapons on the field before he gets benched.

Alas.


Game 1 the only offensive starter he was missing was Golden Tate

Golden Tate isn't the difference between a bad offense and a good one. At this point in their careers he and Sterling Shepard are copies of one another. They're #2 and Slot WRs.
Maybe Shurmur has bad body language....  
BillKo : 9/16/2019 2:03 pm : link
...because the decision is a a tough one.

He's a losing head coach with an awful W/L record. That record - his resume - is going to get worse with Jones and he probably knows it. I'm not saying Eli is going to win anything more, but Shurmur might feel safer with the vet - for now.

Starting Jones is the right thing to do now - if you're going to lose at least lose with the kid getting some experience.

But it could also cost Shurmur his job..............
RE: Matt makes a good point..  
Matt in SGS : 9/16/2019 2:03 pm : link
In comment 14580506 Sean said:
Quote:
If Mara had a play Eli ultimatum, why would he sign off on Jones at 6?


What we don't know is what was discussed in Eli's meeting with Gettleman at the end of the 2018 season when Eli took Gettleman "to the low post and won". In hindsight, I wonder if Eli told the Giants that he's done after this year and will retire. The Giants going all in on Daniel Jones and not talking extension with Eli would seem to fall within that possibility. The value of Eli right now really was to set an example for a young QB on how to prepare to be an NFL quarterback. How to go over film, game plan, etc. If Eli was never going to come back in 2020, that would hasten the need to go after Jones this past draft and not wait for the 2020 QB prospects who all seemed better.

It's quite possible that the Giants all along knew they were going to hand the reigns over to Jones this year, but figured at first it would be later. But based upon the rave reviews we heard in camp and then how he played in the pre-season, the Giants found that Jones is more NFL ready than perhaps they were initially led to believe. Even Shurmur saying "where are the people who had a problem with him and where are they now?"

The bottom line for Mara always wants to play the QB who gave you the best chance to win. Last year Shurmur laughed at Lauletta, even trashing him after the Redskins mop up duty and pretty much told the media "happy now, this guy sucks". After 2 games the Giants have come to the conclusion that Jones probably gives the Giants the same chance of winning as Eli, if not better.

And let's also face it, Mara has always reacted to fan criticism. It wasn't lost on anyone he fired McAdoo and Reese prior to the Giants homestand knowing the fans would be out with pitchforks. The pressure was off.

The fan reaction will be overwhelmingly pro-Jones now. I said at the time, the only positive for McAdoo benching Eli for Geno was that he snapped the starting streak and made it a non-issue when Eli was really really getting benched. Jones starting at home vs. the Redskins you will have a much better crowd and a forgiving crowd. If Eli has a 3 and out, the chants were coming.

The time is right now to make this move. And I thought at first they were going to bring Jones in off the bench in Tampa, but it's quite possible that now this trial balloon was floated to the press and fans that they actually make the move on Wednesday and name Jones the starter.
RE: Maybe Shurmur has bad body language....  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/16/2019 2:05 pm : link
In comment 14580551 BillKo said:
Quote:
...because the decision is a a tough one.

He's a losing head coach with an awful W/L record. That record - his resume - is going to get worse with Jones and he probably knows it. I'm not saying Eli is going to win anything more, but Shurmur might feel safer with the vet - for now.

Starting Jones is the right thing to do now - if you're going to lose at least lose with the kid getting some experience.

But it could also cost Shurmur his job..............


That's why it's stupid to leave this decision up to the head coach. He's thinking about winning as many games as possible, not what's actually best for the Giants franchise long-term. I'm not suggesting he's trying to sabotage the team, but he's thinking about his job, and coaches have an unconscious bias towards safety and veterans.
RE: The biggest downside playing Jones  
NoGainDayne : 9/16/2019 2:09 pm : link
In comment 14580290 Go Terps said:
Quote:
If he plays well it will obscure the fact that Gettleman and Shurmur are incompetent and need to be replaced.

Jones could be Joe Montana and it won't matter with these people running the team. Eli is shot and needs to be replaced immediately, but we shouldn't lose sight that his continued pathetic presence is a symptom of a much larger and deeper problem.


Yeah Iím concerned with the overall need for fans to make this equivalency.

Is there any reason to believe that the Giants could be on the right track = there arenít glaring signs that our organization doesnít seem to know how to get emerging talent able to integrate newer ideas in the building

I feel like we could go 6-10 this season and as was the pattern this offseason there would be more threads started about the arrow pointing up than our continued poor performance
RE: RE: Matt makes a good point..  
Thegratefulhead : 9/16/2019 2:11 pm : link
In comment 14580552 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
In comment 14580506 Sean said:


Quote:


If Mara had a play Eli ultimatum, why would he sign off on Jones at 6?



What we don't know is what was discussed in Eli's meeting with Gettleman at the end of the 2018 season when Eli took Gettleman "to the low post and won". In hindsight, I wonder if Eli told the Giants that he's done after this year and will retire. The Giants going all in on Daniel Jones and not talking extension with Eli would seem to fall within that possibility. The value of Eli right now really was to set an example for a young QB on how to prepare to be an NFL quarterback. How to go over film, game plan, etc. If Eli was never going to come back in 2020, that would hasten the need to go after Jones this past draft and not wait for the 2020 QB prospects who all seemed better.

It's quite possible that the Giants all along knew they were going to hand the reigns over to Jones this year, but figured at first it would be later. But based upon the rave reviews we heard in camp and then how he played in the pre-season, the Giants found that Jones is more NFL ready than perhaps they were initially led to believe. Even Shurmur saying "where are the people who had a problem with him and where are they now?"

The bottom line for Mara always wants to play the QB who gave you the best chance to win. Last year Shurmur laughed at Lauletta, even trashing him after the Redskins mop up duty and pretty much told the media "happy now, this guy sucks". After 2 games the Giants have come to the conclusion that Jones probably gives the Giants the same chance of winning as Eli, if not better.

And let's also face it, Mara has always reacted to fan criticism. It wasn't lost on anyone he fired McAdoo and Reese prior to the Giants homestand knowing the fans would be out with pitchforks. The pressure was off.

The fan reaction will be overwhelmingly pro-Jones now. I said at the time, the only positive for McAdoo benching Eli for Geno was that he snapped the starting streak and made it a non-issue when Eli was really really getting benched. Jones starting at home vs. the Redskins you will have a much better crowd and a forgiving crowd. If Eli has a 3 and out, the chants were coming.

The time is right now to make this move. And I thought at first they were going to bring Jones in off the bench in Tampa, but it's quite possible that now this trial balloon was floated to the press and fans that they actually make the move on Wednesday and name Jones the starter.
I have felt this was coming if we started 0-2 and I felt that could happen the moment the schedule was released.
cjac  
GiantSteps : 9/16/2019 2:12 pm : link
I'm not saying you're wrong about our 3rd downs, but I do think that Tate would be making catches some of our other JAGs haven't so far. I'd just like to see Eli have ONE game with the offense we wanted to start with available to him. If that still looks like absolute crap, fine.

Anyway, the biggest problem is the defense.

Jackrabbit's right
RE: RE: RE: Shurmur could also just be toying with Tampa  
Diver_Down : 9/16/2019 2:12 pm : link
In comment 14580300 Nine-Tails said:
Quote:
In comment 14580287 Diver_Down said:


Quote:


In comment 14580259 Jimmy Meatballs said:


Quote:


so they have to game plan for 2 QBís



With Tampa, they have to game plan for 4 QBs. They never know which version of Winston they will get.



I think it comes down to if they can force turnovers. Itís given that Winston will move the ball. If we canít get turnovers, heíll light it up against us


You haven't watched Winston enough. There is nothing to force. He's a Jekyll/Hyde. He's either slinging the ball around the yard to Evans or tossing to the defender. Nothing special required by the defense.
RE: Mara & DG putting out feelers immediately  
djm : 9/16/2019 2:19 pm : link
In comment 14580213 Canton said:
Quote:
to see how the media and fans react to Shurnur's statement. If it's less volatile than McAdoo's, I feel it's all systems go with Daniel Jones, this week or the next.
m

I wanted to dismiss this kind of shit but the more I really process how this franchise works the more I think this is the truth. I always knew it, sometimes Iíd even contradict my own takes here by agreeing with one side while disagreeing with something else on that same side, if you get me. But itís painfully obvious that the giants operate with one eye on the press and the other on whatís really important. Fucking jerkoffs. Really itís one guy... and only one guy. We all know who he is.
RE: RE: Mara & DG putting out feelers immediately  
Danny Kanell : 9/16/2019 2:23 pm : link
In comment 14580593 djm said:
Quote:
In comment 14580213 Canton said:


Quote:


to see how the media and fans react to Shurnur's statement. If it's less volatile than McAdoo's, I feel it's all systems go with Daniel Jones, this week or the next.

m

I wanted to dismiss this kind of shit but the more I really process how this franchise works the more I think this is the truth. I always knew it, sometimes Iíd even contradict my own takes here by agreeing with one side while disagreeing with something else on that same side, if you get me. But itís painfully obvious that the giants operate with one eye on the press and the other on whatís really important. Fucking jerkoffs. Really itís one guy... and only one guy. We all know who he is.


+1
RE: I kind of donít care anymore...  
Dinger : 9/16/2019 2:23 pm : link
In comment 14580426 trueblueinpw said:
Quote:
Eli isnít what he was, I think we all know that. The NFL isnít what it was. And the Giants arenít what they once were either.

One thing I will say, Iím tired of Eli being the person everyone is pointing at as the problem. Heís part of the problem? Ok. But the Giants are fucking pathetic and have been for many years now. Let the kid start and let everyone else start to be accountable for their part in making the Giants the 2nd worst team in the NFL.


I think this is EXACTLY where I'm at right now. You have to look at that Mcadoo playoff year as an aberration. And the poor officiating and lack of any clear plan to fix it make football a tough sport to watch now. Problem on defense is there is no one else to turn to now.
RE: Well  
family progtitioner : 9/16/2019 2:30 pm : link
In comment 14580538 Mark from Jersey said:
Quote:
I hope they make a change soon. Watching DJ progress take his lumps and learn would be 100 times more interesting than watching Eli


Jones starting would make an otherwise forgettable Giants-Tampa game must watch TV. It would make the season, even if dreadful record wise, something to look forward to instead of dread
RE: RE: Maybe Shurmur has bad body language....  
BillKo : 9/16/2019 2:30 pm : link
In comment 14580556 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 14580551 BillKo said:


Quote:


...because the decision is a a tough one.

He's a losing head coach with an awful W/L record. That record - his resume - is going to get worse with Jones and he probably knows it. I'm not saying Eli is going to win anything more, but Shurmur might feel safer with the vet - for now.

Starting Jones is the right thing to do now - if you're going to lose at least lose with the kid getting some experience.

But it could also cost Shurmur his job..............



That's why it's stupid to leave this decision up to the head coach. He's thinking about winning as many games as possible, not what's actually best for the Giants franchise long-term. I'm not suggesting he's trying to sabotage the team, but he's thinking about his job, and coaches have an unconscious bias towards safety and veterans.


When the GM starts making decisions for the HC, then you start to crumble. No coach wants that, and no coach will want to work under those conditions.

Gettleman gets to pick the players. Shurmur is involved in that to a certain degree (surely they had discussions on DJ). But once the season starts, Shurmur has to make that call. Lines of communication are obviously open, but the HC has to be able to do it his way.

If the GM doesn't like how the coach is coaching, then he fires him.
Make the switch  
Lines of Scrimmage : 9/16/2019 2:32 pm : link
as others need to show progress particularly the staff.

I think Mara is smarter than many seem to think but he is perhaps easily influenced. I would not be surprised if he was getting people saying that Eli was the issue as early as 2012-2013.

Look at the timeline; Fire Gilbride as his system was the reason for the sacks and turnovers. Install hybrid WCO with McAdoo and then it was TC. Then it was McAdoo who had poor leadership and his system stunk without TC. Now Eli is definitely the problem.

Ultimately I think the Giants lost there way. Every good team they have had has had a physical identity to it. Every one. They failed miserable in drafting and FA selection for a very long time.

Mara may have recognized this and felt let's see if we can put one more for Eli togood team together lead. Can't fault him for that.

I have no issue with replacing Eli. But the root cause has been the draft of almost 8 years of poor drafting.

I actually think Eli will still perform well with a team with a Very good OL and defense. You can say any QB can, but it is rare to find a QB who performs his best in the big moment. But at 38 the Giants need to move on imo. They don't have a very good OL and D.

I don't have it but Arcosi's scouting report was so spot on.

Hopefully when he is benched they don't make him the scapegoat. That would be a travesty. Ultimately the Giants failed Eli in the back half of his career.

Maybe another Parcells is lurking out there to pull the Giants out of this mess.
i get why people want ELI out but i think its just unfair  
GMAN4LIFE : 9/16/2019 2:33 pm : link
eli finally has a decent line and now no weapons for him to use. Its just fucked up
RE: The biggest downside playing Jones  
jcn56 : 9/16/2019 2:34 pm : link
In comment 14580290 Go Terps said:
Quote:
If he plays well it will obscure the fact that Gettleman and Shurmur are incompetent and need to be replaced.

Jones could be Joe Montana and it won't matter with these people running the team. Eli is shot and needs to be replaced immediately, but we shouldn't lose sight that his continued pathetic presence is a symptom of a much larger and deeper problem.


Yep, although at this point if he turns out to be Joe Montana I'm willing to live through a couple more years of incompetent leadership.
Changing the plan  
Dankbeerman : 9/16/2019 2:59 pm : link
no matter the course or reasoning 2 games in reeks of desperation. If they had a plan regardless of what it was and they throw it out the window now what was the point. Jones should have started game 1 if he starts game 3.

I still think Eli gets 6 losses before we pull the plug.
RE: I think Eli starts  
micky : 9/16/2019 3:00 pm : link
In comment 14580178 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
and if the Giants struggle after the 1Q or first half, Eli's getting the hook. That's what I'm reading here.


This could very well be the case. I think Sunday is Eli's last "showcase". If anything like these past 2 weeks. The hook is imminant
One interesting thing re: Manning  
DavidinBMNY : 9/16/2019 3:03 pm : link
If they do want Manning to agree to a trade, the longer he sits the more likely he would be to accept one. He won't want to hold a clipboard if he is eclipsed and Jones is starting to come into his own. He'll accept a trade under the right circumstances.

Lots of reasons to make the change, and this isn't one to make it, it just may wind up as a result.
RE: One interesting thing re: Manning  
cjac : 9/16/2019 3:07 pm : link
In comment 14580696 DavidinBMNY said:
Quote:
If they do want Manning to agree to a trade, the longer he sits the more likely he would be to accept one. He won't want to hold a clipboard if he is eclipsed and Jones is starting to come into his own. He'll accept a trade under the right circumstances.

Lots of reasons to make the change, and this isn't one to make it, it just may wind up as a result.


Why would he want to be traded, he can just wait to be a Free Agent and go where he wants next year
Michael kay is an idiot  
nygiants16 : 9/16/2019 3:16 pm : link
ripping the giants for thinking about making a change ecause he thinks they are doing it for a spark...refuses to listen to lagreca for saying this is about getting jones ready
RE: i get why people want ELI out but i think its just unfair  
V.I.G. : 9/16/2019 3:20 pm : link
In comment 14580626 GMAN4LIFE said:
Quote:
eli finally has a decent line and now no weapons for him to use. Its just fucked up

Come on already. Please?
These guys are open enough.

Eli is either
-missing them
-staring em down
-throwing too late
-or some combination of the above

Even when we had OBJ, Eli was
-missing them
-staring em down
-throwing too late
-or some combination of the above
RE: RE: I think Eli starts  
AcidTest : 9/16/2019 3:20 pm : link
In comment 14580693 micky said:
Quote:
In comment 14580178 Matt in SGS said:


Quote:


and if the Giants struggle after the 1Q or first half, Eli's getting the hook. That's what I'm reading here.



This could very well be the case. I think Sunday is Eli's last "showcase". If anything like these past 2 weeks. The hook is imminant


+2. The Giants may also feel it would be easier to bench Eli on the road than at home the following week against the Redskins. Since I expect Eli to struggle, I think there's a good chance we'll see Jones this week.
Re: Tanney  
GRBlue : 9/16/2019 3:21 pm : link
Someone nailed this when Lauletta got cut...

This is likely the reason Tanney is still around. Once they commit fully to DJ, you have to imagine Eliís camp/DG will see if thereís any value out there in a trade. Makes sense to have a vet around DJ.
RE: Changing the plan  
V.I.G. : 9/16/2019 3:21 pm : link
In comment 14580690 Dankbeerman said:
Quote:
no matter the course or reasoning 2 games in reeks of desperation. If they had a plan regardless of what it was and they throw it out the window now what was the point. Jones should have started game 1 if he starts game 3.

I still think Eli gets 6 losses before we pull the plug.

You may be right, but if we lose this weekend, BBI's servers will melt
RE: Re: Tanney  
Jay on the Island : 9/16/2019 3:23 pm : link
In comment 14580737 GRBlue said:
Quote:
Someone nailed this when Lauletta got cut...

This is likely the reason Tanney is still around. Once they commit fully to DJ, you have to imagine Eliís camp/DG will see if thereís any value out there in a trade. Makes sense to have a vet around DJ.

I've been saying this the past few days but I wasn't suggesting a trade I was suggesting releasing Eli allowing him to go to the team of his choice.
RE: RE: Changing the plan  
DavidinBMNY : 9/16/2019 3:30 pm : link
In comment 14580740 V.I.G. said:
Quote:
In comment 14580690 Dankbeerman said:


Quote:


no matter the course or reasoning 2 games in reeks of desperation. If they had a plan regardless of what it was and they throw it out the window now what was the point. Jones should have started game 1 if he starts game 3.

I still think Eli gets 6 losses before we pull the plug.


You may be right, but if we lose this weekend, BBI's servers will melt
I don't think so. There plan was based on being competitive. Meaning winning a little. If Eli just loses all the time, no point keeping him in there. There has been 1 game in 15 years another QB started. It's time to see what someone else can do. Eli has the improved OL. He's still not getting it done. Jones can also not get it done and gain valuable experience. It's time.
RE: RE: Re: Tanney  
Lines of Scrimmage : 9/16/2019 3:33 pm : link
In comment 14580743 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 14580737 GRBlue said:


Quote:


Someone nailed this when Lauletta got cut...

This is likely the reason Tanney is still around. Once they commit fully to DJ, you have to imagine Eliís camp/DG will see if thereís any value out there in a trade. Makes sense to have a vet around DJ.


I've been saying this the past few days but I wasn't suggesting a trade I was suggesting releasing Eli allowing him to go to the team of his choice.


I agree with releasing him if Eli wants to keep playing this year and there is someone out there who wants him.
RE: RE: i get why people want ELI out but i think its just unfair  
Reale01 : 9/16/2019 3:38 pm : link
In comment 14580732 V.I.G. said:
Quote:
In comment 14580626 GMAN4LIFE said:


Quote:


eli finally has a decent line and now no weapons for him to use. Its just fucked up


Come on already. Please?
These guys are open enough.

Eli is either
-missing them
-staring em down
-throwing too late
-or some combination of the above

Even when we had OBJ, Eli was
-missing them
-staring em down
-throwing too late
-or some combination of the above


IMO Eli has played much better this year. I see less panic and more decisiveness. Mostly good throws. The defense is horrible - beyond horrible.
RE: RE: i get why people want ELI out but i think its just unfair  
Nine-Tails : 9/16/2019 3:39 pm : link
In comment 14580732 V.I.G. said:
Quote:
In comment 14580626 GMAN4LIFE said:


Quote:


eli finally has a decent line and now no weapons for him to use. Its just fucked up


Come on already. Please?
These guys are open enough.

Eli is either
-missing them
-staring em down
-throwing too late
-or some combination of the above

Even when we had OBJ, Eli was
-missing them
-staring em down
-throwing too late
-or some combination of the above


Yep and many were pointing to spreading the love around without OBJ
RE: RE: RE: Re: Tanney  
Diver_Down : 9/16/2019 3:47 pm : link
In comment 14580773 Lines of Scrimmage said:
Quote:
In comment 14580743 Jay on the Island said:


Quote:


In comment 14580737 GRBlue said:


Quote:


Someone nailed this when Lauletta got cut...

This is likely the reason Tanney is still around. Once they commit fully to DJ, you have to imagine Eliís camp/DG will see if thereís any value out there in a trade. Makes sense to have a vet around DJ.


I've been saying this the past few days but I wasn't suggesting a trade I was suggesting releasing Eli allowing him to go to the team of his choice.



I agree with releasing him if Eli wants to keep playing this year and there is someone out there who wants him.


Just so that whomever floated that idea realizes there is no cap savings by releasing him. Manning has a NTC that he can waive so he is in control of where he goes. So the basis of the theory that Manning has control when released doesn't hold water. While many say he has no trade value, I disagree. If only for the purpose of saving to pay his salary and allowing Manning to continue to play, DG could work out a late round pick.
RE: Re: Tanney  
jcn56 : 9/16/2019 3:49 pm : link
In comment 14580737 GRBlue said:
Quote:
Someone nailed this when Lauletta got cut...

This is likely the reason Tanney is still around. Once they commit fully to DJ, you have to imagine Eliís camp/DG will see if thereís any value out there in a trade. Makes sense to have a vet around DJ.


That's nonsense. There are veteran QBs available - there's a good chance that Tanney himself wouldn't be on a roster if the Giants had released him.

If they go with Jones, there's no turning back, no matter how awful they are. So which veteran backup QB is irrelevant. Keeping Tanney around was just plain stupid.
RE: RE: RE: i get why people want ELI out but i think its just unfair  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/16/2019 3:50 pm : link
In comment 14580791 Reale01 said:
Quote:
In comment 14580732 V.I.G. said:


Quote:


In comment 14580626 GMAN4LIFE said:


Quote:


eli finally has a decent line and now no weapons for him to use. Its just fucked up


Come on already. Please?
These guys are open enough.

Eli is either
-missing them
-staring em down
-throwing too late
-or some combination of the above

Even when we had OBJ, Eli was
-missing them
-staring em down
-throwing too late
-or some combination of the above



IMO Eli has played much better this year. I see less panic and more decisiveness. Mostly good throws.



Where are the points? Where is the third down success? Why is the opposing defense just targeting saquon and not worried about the pass?

RE: RE: RE: i get why people want ELI out but i think its just unfair  
Nine-Tails : 9/16/2019 3:58 pm : link
In comment 14580791 Reale01 said:
Quote:
In comment 14580732 V.I.G. said:


Quote:


In comment 14580626 GMAN4LIFE said:


Quote:


eli finally has a decent line and now no weapons for him to use. Its just fucked up


Come on already. Please?
These guys are open enough.

Eli is either
-missing them
-staring em down
-throwing too late
-or some combination of the above

Even when we had OBJ, Eli was
-missing them
-staring em down
-throwing too late
-or some combination of the above



IMO Eli has played much better this year. I see less panic and more decisiveness. Mostly good throws. The defense is horrible - beyond horrible.


Hit me up with the rosemary glasses you got
RE: Changing the plan  
ron mexico : 9/16/2019 4:04 pm : link
In comment 14580690 Dankbeerman said:
Quote:
no matter the course or reasoning 2 games in reeks of desperation. If they had a plan regardless of what it was and they throw it out the window now what was the point. Jones should have started game 1 if he starts game 3.

I still think Eli gets 6 losses before we pull the plug.


yeah, the fact that it reeks of desperation and brings into question how good of a plan it was to begin, and how capable those planners are, is probably reason #1 Gettleman and Mara wont let him do it.

RE: RE: RE: RE: i get why people want ELI out but i think its just unfair  
V.I.G. : 9/16/2019 4:05 pm : link
In comment 14580835 Nine-Tails said:
Quote:
In comment 14580791 Reale01 said:

Hit me up with the rosemary glasses you got

RE: i get why people want ELI out but i think its just unfair  
jvm52106 : 9/16/2019 4:06 pm : link
In comment 14580626 GMAN4LIFE said:
Quote:
eli finally has a decent line and now no weapons for him to use. Its just fucked up


No offense but you can see Eli being unable to take players to the next level and his own play is just nothing more than bottom tier of the league. No offense but the guys Eli has are the same guys Jones would have... I truly believe Jones will get more out of them..
Why would Eli need the opportunity for both Shep and Tate?  
Matt M. : 9/16/2019 4:08 pm : link
He is supposed to be a franchise QB,which means he should be able to manufacture some wins. That is something he has done on only very rare occasions over the last few seasons.
RE: RE: RE: i get why people want ELI out but i think its just unfair  
Jimmy Googs : 9/16/2019 4:09 pm : link
In comment 14580791 Reale01 said:
Quote:



IMO Eli has played much better this year. I see less panic and more decisiveness. Mostly good throws. The defense is horrible - beyond horrible.


Maybe you're on to something...lets get the Defense out of there.
I think Eli is now just 2 games over 500 for his career  
Mike in Long Beach : 9/16/2019 4:09 pm : link
It just won't look great if he retires with a sub 500 record. I'd like to get him out of there, if for nothing else than preserved a well-earned legacy as a winner.
RE: RE: RE: i get why people want ELI out but i think its just unfair  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 9/16/2019 4:10 pm : link
In comment 14580791 Reale01 said:
Quote:
In comment 14580732 V.I.G. said:


Quote:


In comment 14580626 GMAN4LIFE said:


Quote:


eli finally has a decent line and now no weapons for him to use. Its just fucked up


Come on already. Please?
These guys are open enough.

Eli is either
-missing them
-staring em down
-throwing too late
-or some combination of the above

Even when we had OBJ, Eli was
-missing them
-staring em down
-throwing too late
-or some combination of the above



IMO Eli has played much better this year. I see less panic and more decisiveness. Mostly good throws. The defense is horrible - beyond horrible.

Shurpmur came up with the perfect gameplan to get down by two or more scores against the best pass D in the league with a decimated receiving corp.


Eli looks faster this year, was outrunning Ed Oliver ffs.
RE: I think Eli is now just 2 games over 500 for his career  
Dave in Hoboken : 9/16/2019 4:11 pm : link
In comment 14580857 Mike in Long Beach said:
Quote:
It just won't look great if he retires with a sub 500 record. I'd like to get him out of there, if for nothing else than preserved a well-earned legacy as a winner.


He's exactly .500 now, sadly.
RE: Michael kay is an idiot  
BillKo : 9/16/2019 4:12 pm : link
In comment 14580718 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
ripping the giants for thinking about making a change ecause he thinks they are doing it for a spark...refuses to listen to lagreca for saying this is about getting jones ready


Well, the team needs a spark. They have ZERO juice going right now.

And honestly, only a change at QB can do that..........
The Tanney comments are comical  
RollBlue : 9/16/2019 4:14 pm : link
he's still be on his couch if we had cut him. If they do somehow find a way to move Eli (not likely) they could easily bring back Tanney.
RE: Based on his his tone and body language  
santacruzom : 9/16/2019 4:15 pm : link
In comment 14580347 jlukes said:
Quote:
I truly believe Shurmur has his hands tied by ownership. It looks and sounds like he wants Jones on the field


It's impossible to know for sure but I absolutely would not discount that possibility. And I'm torn. On the one hand, ownership should not prevent their coach from starting the QB he believes is best-suited for his offense. On the other, the coach is fucking Pat Shurmur.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: i get why people want ELI out but i think its just unfair  
Nine-Tails : 9/16/2019 4:16 pm : link
In comment 14580843 V.I.G. said:
Quote:
In comment 14580835 Nine-Tails said:


Quote:


In comment 14580791 Reale01 said:

Hit me up with the rosemary glasses you got




Thanks man : )
RE: RE: I think Eli is now just 2 games over 500 for his career  
Mike in Long Beach : 9/16/2019 4:17 pm : link
In comment 14580862 Dave in Hoboken said:
Quote:
In comment 14580857 Mike in Long Beach said:


Quote:


It just won't look great if he retires with a sub 500 record. I'd like to get him out of there, if for nothing else than preserved a well-earned legacy as a winner.



He's exactly .500 now, sadly.


I think that's just regular season, but that is true. With the postseason he's 2 over now. 8-6, I believe.
You either believe Jints Central exists  
Jimmy Googs : 9/16/2019 4:19 pm : link
or you don't.

Pick a side.

bw - can you please keep the tally...
Never mind, He's 8-4 in the playoffs  
Mike in Long Beach : 9/16/2019 4:21 pm : link
Which puts him at 124-120 for his career.
RE: The Tanney comments are comical  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 9/16/2019 4:24 pm : link
In comment 14580870 RollBlue said:
Quote:
he's still be on his couch if we had cut him. If they do somehow find a way to move Eli (not likely) they could easily bring back Tanney.

I'm not keen on starting Jones with Shurrmur's poor decision making.

wtf is Tannet on this team??????
I think we should make the switch to Jones..  
Sean : 9/16/2019 4:30 pm : link
But, we paid Eli $23M this year to start 2 games? That money could have been invested in the defense. This is the stuff that makes people think the Giants have no plan.
RE: I think we should make the switch to Jones..  
Danny Dimes : 9/16/2019 4:35 pm : link
In comment 14580894 Sean said:
Quote:
But, we paid Eli $23M this year to start 2 games? That money could have been invested in the defense. This is the stuff that makes people think the Giants have no plan.


The contract was made 5 years ago. Eli looking like he intentionally whats to retire. Giants are dumb for not getting back sing a magic 8 ball before giving him that contract. Good news is Eli broomed me up and even gave me his head coach so that itself is worth the money
RE: I think we should make the switch to Jones..  
Mike in Long Beach : 9/16/2019 4:36 pm : link
In comment 14580894 Sean said:
Quote:
But, we paid Eli $23M this year to start 2 games? That money could have been invested in the defense. This is the stuff that makes people think the Giants have no plan.


I don't know if this is a good thing or a bad thing... but I think they did have a plan, and they really thought this was a roster capable of winning football games. So they invested in a proven commodity like Eli Manning.

But I can't decide what's worse: The team having no plan, or the team thinking what they put on the field this year was a good plan.
RE: RE: I think we should make the switch to Jones..  
jcn56 : 9/16/2019 4:42 pm : link
In comment 14580903 Mike in Long Beach said:
Quote:
In comment 14580894 Sean said:


Quote:


But, we paid Eli $23M this year to start 2 games? That money could have been invested in the defense. This is the stuff that makes people think the Giants have no plan.



I don't know if this is a good thing or a bad thing... but I think they did have a plan, and they really thought this was a roster capable of winning football games. So they invested in a proven commodity like Eli Manning.

But I can't decide what's worse: The team having no plan, or the team thinking what they put on the field this year was a good plan.


I suspect it's the latter, and that's way worse. Giving Eli one final year at gunpoint even if you think he's done, at least it means you're assessing the talent on the roster properly.

The number of stop gaps these guys have employed since 2017 leads me to believe they honestly thought this thing was close. Maybe not close in terms of a SB, but at least a winning record. And they were way off in that assessment.
RE: I think we should make the switch to Jones..  
Go Terps : 9/16/2019 4:46 pm : link
In comment 14580894 Sean said:
Quote:
But, we paid Eli $23M this year to start 2 games? That money could have been invested in the defense. This is the stuff that makes people think the Giants have no plan.


Go back to threads from February-March and you will see many of us pointing this out then. I must have listed what we could do with that money ten times.

Incompetence from Mara, Tisch, and Gettleman. Absolute incompetence.
Once Again, It"s What They're Doing, It's How...  
clatterbuck : 9/16/2019 4:48 pm : link
If the gameplan was to make the switch at the first sign of adversity and the season heading south...
If they pretty much knew the defense was going to be terrible and they were going to play the rookies to let them learn while taking their lumps...
If they knew or had a clue ditching OBJ would leave the receiving corps and the offense without a credible threat other than Barkley...
If they knew the goal was to play Jones, let him learn as much as possible while they headed toward another top-five pick and a boatload of 2020 cap room...
If they knew this season was just a second leg of multiple year "plan..."
Then they should have made the break after they drafted Jones, given Manning the opportunity for the proper send off he deserves. They should not have fostered a week-to-week speculative, BS QB controversy game that is unfair to Jones, the fan base, and grossly unfair to Manning.

It's not Manning's fault the defense sucks. It's not Manning's fault productive years were wasted on teams with dysfunctional offensive lines, dysfunctional offensive systems, and poor coaching. It's not Manning's fault management and ownership couldn't find a way to deal with a generational talent like Beckham. Team "culture" is fine but it can't cover tight ends over the middle, get the defense off the field on third down, or run the right pass route and catch the damn ball. I'm in my seventh decade of living with the Giants. I may die before I see another really good Giants team. That sucks.
RE: I would not make the switch  
mrvax : 9/16/2019 4:49 pm : link
In comment 14580177 cactus said:
Quote:
until Shepard and Tate are playing. There's very little separation there for Eli to take advantage of, it's not going to be any different for Jones. Do they really want to put him into a situation like he was in at Duke???


I'm a big Eli fan and from what I've seen, I think DJ will do better than Eli. Sure both QBs would have less than stellar WRs but Jones can make quite a few plays better just by using his legs. I'm NOT suggesting DJ should run the ball a lot either. 2-3 a game maybe, quick roll outs and ability to move quickly away from a pass rush.
RE: RE: I think we should make the switch to Jones..  
AcesUp : 9/16/2019 4:54 pm : link
In comment 14580903 Mike in Long Beach said:
Quote:
In comment 14580894 Sean said:


Quote:


But, we paid Eli $23M this year to start 2 games? That money could have been invested in the defense. This is the stuff that makes people think the Giants have no plan.



I don't know if this is a good thing or a bad thing... but I think they did have a plan, and they really thought this was a roster capable of winning football games. So they invested in a proven commodity like Eli Manning.

But I can't decide what's worse: The team having no plan, or the team thinking what they put on the field this year was a good plan.


They strongly believe in bridging a rookie with a veteran. That, the timing of his roster bonus prior to the draft, respect to Eli letting him play out his contract and a dash of hope are what led to the 23M cap number. I didn't agree with it, I felt they should have released Eli and made a move for Keenum as a cheaper bridge guy that fits this O better but it is what it is. We'd still be 0-2 now though and people would blame that move for the bad start and would be crushing the front office all the same. They had to make a decision on Eli before the offseason, before they knew they would get their QB in the draft, so it's not as egregious as some make out it to be.
There are many things to consider as to when it makes  
Jimmy Googs : 9/16/2019 4:56 pm : link
the most sense to let Jones start.

But I would hope that the team they are playing is way down at the bottom of that list...
I heard this morning Shurmur left door open  
joeinpa : 9/16/2019 5:14 pm : link
I listened to Francesa s Interview.

Surprised it took so long to surface here. If you listened to Shurmur speak of Allen extending plays and other quarterbacks around the league doing the same, pretty easy to discern he s ready to play Jones.

Not the first time I ve heard him mention this
He is a top 10 pick  
mdc1 : 9/16/2019 5:14 pm : link
seriously? Many things to consider? we are 0-2.
I wait for the fox sunday  
mdc1 : 9/16/2019 5:15 pm : link
narrative about Eli. A narrative is required by our gutless owners.
RE: I heard this morning Shurmur left door open  
Nine-Tails : 9/16/2019 5:19 pm : link
In comment 14581025 joeinpa said:
Quote:
I listened to Francesa s Interview.

Surprised it took so long to surface here. If you listened to Shurmur speak of Allen extending plays and other quarterbacks around the league doing the same, pretty easy to discern he s ready to play Jones.

Not the first time I ve heard him mention this


Also he added that Jones skillset in regards to making plays on the move is superior to Eliís
RE: RE: RE: Changing the plan  
Dankbeerman : 9/16/2019 5:25 pm : link
In comment 14580759 DavidinBMNY said:
Quote:
In comment 14580740 V.I.G. said:


Quote:


In comment 14580690 Dankbeerman said:


Quote:


no matter the course or reasoning 2 games in reeks of desperation. If they had a plan regardless of what it was and they throw it out the window now what was the point. Jones should have started game 1 if he starts game 3.

I still think Eli gets 6 losses before we pull the plug.


You may be right, but if we lose this weekend, BBI's servers will melt

I don't think so. There plan was based on being competitive. Meaning winning a little. If Eli just loses all the time, no point keeping him in there. There has been 1 game in 15 years another QB started. It's time to see what someone else can do. Eli has the improved OL. He's still not getting it done. Jones can also not get it done and gain valuable experience. It's time.


its been 2 games did they really expect they would be 2-0?
RE: So let me make sure i understand this  
81_Great_Dane : 9/16/2019 5:42 pm : link
In comment 14580308 arniefez said:
Quote:
HC with a .294 winning percentage is thinking about playing his rookie QB after 2 games? Probably the only chance he has to be back next year so it makes perfect sense.
It's also the right thing to do.
Risk of DJ Starting  
DeepBlueJint : 9/16/2019 8:25 pm : link
Offensive line appears better, no? Use Saquon to the max. I believe the Giants need to find out how pathetic or how good the current offense is with DJ. It will help determine what to do in the next off season free agency and draft.
Once the cat is out of the bag  
DavidinBMNY : 9/16/2019 8:54 pm : link
You have to commit. This team has been wishy washy on lots of things. If it's time - do it.
Eli Manning is predictable...  
Fishmanjim57 : 9/16/2019 8:57 pm : link
The entire NFL knows what he's able to do on each play in every game. They also know that his long game is done.
I know that the owners of this team are not prone to make sudden changes, and that they are very loyal to their players. Eli Manning gave them two Super Bowl Championships against a true and tested dynasty. They have promised Eli that the Giants are his team as long as he can put on the jersey.
We fans are stuck between loving what Eli gave us in the past, and what Daniel Jones could bring us in the future.
In case Mr. Mara doesn't realize it yet, the future is now.
Start Jones NOW!
Eli to the Jets  
upnyg : 9/16/2019 9:50 pm : link
Would keep Eli home, not sure the fans or ownership would want it, but the Jets look thin at QB today.
The Giants Facebook page posted  
darren in pdx : 9/16/2019 10:23 pm : link
an article about Pat Shurmur's comments today. Definitely feels like the PR team is gauging the reactions of the fans and media..Gettleman has said it's Shurmur's decision when to make the QB switch..who knows how truthful that is. My guess is that Eli gets the chance to go 0 -4 before being swapped out, but I wouldn't shocked if an announcement is made in the next couple of days..
Pat Shurmur talks Giants quarterbacks - ( New Window )
RE: RE: I think we should make the switch to Jones..  
joeinpa : 9/17/2019 6:48 am : link
In comment 14580903 Mike in Long Beach said:
Quote:
In comment 14580894 Sean said:


Quote:


But, we paid Eli $23M this year to start 2 games? That money could have been invested in the defense. This is the stuff that makes people think the Giants have no plan.



I don't know if this is a good thing or a bad thing... but I think they did have a plan, and they really thought this was a roster capable of winning football games. So they invested in a proven commodity like Eli Manning.

But I can't decide what's worse: The team having no plan, or the team thinking what they put on the field this year was a good plan.


Thinking they could win by retooling their roster has been the plan since 2012. I think it was the result of Eli taking a mediocre team in 11 to a championship.

It s led to 7 years of pretty bad football. Thinking Eli. Could lead this team to the playoffs again this season ,after watching 8-24, was beyond ridiculous.
Well at least Odell isn't making us look bad  
WillieYoung : 9/17/2019 7:22 am : link
Oh wait,,,
the is now!  
xtian : 9/17/2019 11:06 am : link
Official announcement: Jones is starting QB this Sunday against Tampa Bay.
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