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After OBJ's performance last night, what are your thoughts?

GMAN4LIFE : 9/17/2019 9:20 am
alot of analysts are now calling the trade dumb for the Giants based solely on last nights performance.

I think its still too early to say but what are your thoughts now?
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RE: Britt, since you keep harping on  
Chris684 : 9/17/2019 10:05 am : link
In comment 14582310 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
Has Barkley moved the needle any? As brilliant as he's been individually, the team is 5-13 in his young career.

See how silly this exercise is?


Wake us up when Barkley quits on the fucking team.
RE: Everybody saying the team is worse without Beckham....  
Tesla : 9/17/2019 10:06 am : link
In comment 14582274 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
Are we really?

2014: 6-10
2015: 6-10
2016: 11-5
2017: 3-13
2018: 5-11


And you predicted that Eli would actually play better without the need to throw OBJ the ball, and we'd go 10-6.

So settle down here chief and try a slice of humble pie.
RE: RE: Everybody saying the team is worse without Beckham....  
arcarsenal : 9/17/2019 10:06 am : link
In comment 14582286 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
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In comment 14582274 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


Are we really?

2014: 6-10
2015: 6-10
2016: 11-5
2017: 3-13
2018: 5-11



The one winning season we had, you could make an argument that he literally willed that team to the playoffs.


The top 5 defense we fielded that got several stops late in games probably had a little more to do with it than some fictitious narrative about Beckham "willing" the team to win all on his own...but who needs facts.
That too.  
Britt in VA : 9/17/2019 10:06 am : link
.
RE: RE: I feel EXACTLY the same as I always have  
Greg from LI : 9/17/2019 10:07 am : link
In comment 14582311 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
when asked directly if he wanted to be wanted to be a Giant he basically said he wasn't sure.


Are you aware that Phil Simms and Harry Carson both tried repeatedly to force trades to other teams prior to 1985?
RE: RE: I feel EXACTLY the same as I always have  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 9/17/2019 10:08 am : link
In comment 14582311 Britt in VA said:
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In comment 14582299 Jim in Tampa said:


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Giants should have found a way to keep a player that talented.

OBJ is certainly a prima donna but he works hard, wants to win and his teammates loved him. (Except maybe for Eli :>)
That's why you keep him.

Some of the antics were annoying and some were just weird (kicker net hugging) but I don't think the dog pissing political statement or saying mean things about Eli were such a big threat to the "culture" that he had to be traded.

Giants had (arguably) their all-time best WR and RB on the team at the same time as weapons for a young QB to work with and they blew it.

As long as your superstars are playing hard you give them a little leeway if necessary. You gon't trade him.

DG probably would have traded that troublemaker LT too. Parcells and Young found a way to work with him because as DG put it...

You don't give up on talent.



Even after all that, they paid him 90 million to stay.

4 weeks later he went on ESPN Sunday Morning with Lil Wayne sitting there and when asked directly if he wanted to be wanted to be a Giant he basically said he wasn't sure.


Man are your feelings hurt? The organization has been a disaster and continues to be a disaster.
Seems to me the only one whose feelings are hurt is Beckham.  
Britt in VA : 9/17/2019 10:08 am : link
.
RE: Considering we couldn't break 20 points on offense  
Thunderstruck27 : 9/17/2019 10:09 am : link
In comment 14582295 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
for a historic stretch.


But...Beckham...
Five years, huh?  
Greg from LI : 9/17/2019 10:09 am : link
Why? Is he going to somehow play significantly better than he did last year? What exactly do you expect to see Barkley do differently that will turn the team's fortunes around?
RE: RE: RE: Everybody saying the team is worse without Beckham....  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 9/17/2019 10:10 am : link
In comment 14582318 arcarsenal said:
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In comment 14582286 BigBlueDownTheShore said:


Quote:


In comment 14582274 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


Are we really?

2014: 6-10
2015: 6-10
2016: 11-5
2017: 3-13
2018: 5-11



The one winning season we had, you could make an argument that he literally willed that team to the playoffs.



The top 5 defense we fielded that got several stops late in games probably had a little more to do with it than some fictitious narrative about Beckham "willing" the team to win all on his own...but who needs facts.


Take away OBJs stats from that offense and do we even score enough to have a lead and win games with that great defense. The Baltimore game sticks out as one we would have lost just off the top of my head.
RE: He played well against a really bad team  
Johnny5 : 9/17/2019 10:10 am : link
In comment 14582279 djstat said:
Quote:
Back up QB. Starting MLB out. Etc.

Jets defense is not that bad. He looked good. I am still not completely sad we traded him, but he looked good last night. If he stays healthy for the rest of the year that will bum me out as well. lol
You know what I love?  
Tesla : 9/17/2019 10:11 am : link
How the Eli dead enders get so defensive when you point out his awful record as a starting QB over the past 7 years, but then around in the same breath and say we won't miss Beckham because he couldn't single handedly turn this team around.
RE: Five years, huh?  
Tesla : 9/17/2019 10:12 am : link
In comment 14582336 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
Why? Is he going to somehow play significantly better than he did last year? What exactly do you expect to see Barkley do differently that will turn the team's fortunes around?


LOL, you know he's not even gonna try to answer that one cause there is no answer.
RE: You know what I love?  
Chris684 : 9/17/2019 10:13 am : link
In comment 14582341 Tesla said:
Quote:
How the Eli dead enders get so defensive when you point out his awful record as a starting QB over the past 7 years, but then around in the same breath and say we won't miss Beckham because he couldn't single handedly turn this team around.


Yea because Giants fans STILL falling all over themselves to defend and lament the loss of Odell Beckham are the smart ones here!
RE: RE: RE: RE: Everybody saying the team is worse without Beckham....  
arcarsenal : 9/17/2019 10:14 am : link
In comment 14582337 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
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In comment 14582318 arcarsenal said:


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In comment 14582286 BigBlueDownTheShore said:


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In comment 14582274 Britt in VA said:


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Are we really?

2014: 6-10
2015: 6-10
2016: 11-5
2017: 3-13
2018: 5-11



The one winning season we had, you could make an argument that he literally willed that team to the playoffs.



The top 5 defense we fielded that got several stops late in games probably had a little more to do with it than some fictitious narrative about Beckham "willing" the team to win all on his own...but who needs facts.



Take away OBJs stats from that offense and do we even score enough to have a lead and win games with that great defense. The Baltimore game sticks out as one we would have lost just off the top of my head.


And how many games were littered with Beckham highlights in losing efforts? The one handed catch against Dallas... we lost. The diving catch into the endzone against Washington...we lost. Countless other games in 2014/15... we lost.
RE: You know what I love?  
Thunderstruck27 : 9/17/2019 10:14 am : link
In comment 14582341 Tesla said:
Quote:
How the Eli dead enders get so defensive when you point out his awful record as a starting QB over the past 7 years, but then around in the same breath and say we won't miss Beckham because he couldn't single handedly turn this team around.


Can't you want them both gone? They are both responsible for a terrible team pretty recently.
RE: RE: Five years, huh?  
Britt in VA : 9/17/2019 10:16 am : link
In comment 14582354 Tesla said:
Quote:
In comment 14582336 Greg from LI said:


Quote:


Why? Is he going to somehow play significantly better than he did last year? What exactly do you expect to see Barkley do differently that will turn the team's fortunes around?



LOL, you know he's not even gonna try to answer that one cause there is no answer.


What's your problem asshole?
RE: RE: RE: Everybody saying the team is worse without Beckham....  
Kyle in NY : 9/17/2019 10:16 am : link
In comment 14582318 arcarsenal said:
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In comment 14582286 BigBlueDownTheShore said:


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In comment 14582274 Britt in VA said:


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Are we really?

2014: 6-10
2015: 6-10
2016: 11-5
2017: 3-13
2018: 5-11



The one winning season we had, you could make an argument that he literally willed that team to the playoffs.



The top 5 defense we fielded that got several stops late in games probably had a little more to do with it than some fictitious narrative about Beckham "willing" the team to win all on his own...but who needs facts.


arc, come on. There was no bigger defender of the guy than yourself. I'm pretty sure you made similar arguments about willing the team many times through the years when debating with Terps. Of course it's ok to change your mind. I have too to some extent. But to go so far the other way with the now sarcastic mocking of those still defending Beckham...well I just think it rings a bit hollow
I have such mixed feelings to be honest  
V.I.G. : 9/17/2019 10:16 am : link
Cons
-The injuries really scared me
-He did quit late season once all was lost

Pros
-Immense talent
-He was a max effort guy
-Barkley said that no one blocked harder for him
-He wanted to win

The part that trips me up was that he was trying to tell the world what mostly all now see: Eli was holding the team back. He did it in a stupid way, yes. The method, the interview - very dumb, millennial, and ill advised. But he did it because he wanted to win. He did it after he got paid, because doing so before would be a bad financial decision.
Hasn't stopped me from dancing  
ghost718 : 9/17/2019 10:16 am : link
Thunder....  
Tesla : 9/17/2019 10:17 am : link
wanting them both gone is at least not hypocritical. But to say you can't hold our shitty record against the QB but you can hold it against or top WR is a bunch of hypocritical bullshit.
RE: .  
HomerJones45 : 9/17/2019 10:17 am : link
In comment 14582239 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
My thoughts are that the Giants paid him a lot of money to keep him here. He basically spit in their faces, couldn't even pretend to be happy here, and checks out when the team is losing.

Doesn't mean he's not a really good player. But the Giants were a bad team almost every year he was here aside from the one year we went on a defensive shopping spree and the defense carried the team most of the way.
And you guys aren't sucked in by the usual NYG method of trashing a player they got rid of- especially when they have made a bad deal? Jesus Christ, they did it with Tarkenton who went on to qb three teams to the SB and is now in the HOF. This is an old dodge this team has used for 60 years, and fans get sucked in over and over again.

Yeah, he's an odd duck; so what,if you want to win, you've got to find a way to incorporate them on the team when they are as talented as this kid or you can root for outstanding talents like Benny Fowler and Cody Corpse. You think there weren't a few oddballs on the 60's Packers or the 70's Steelers?
Responding to the OP only  
Dinger : 9/17/2019 10:18 am : link
My thoughts are its early. All any team has to do to OBJ to throw him off his game is trash talk him and hit him hard. if he makes it passed week 10 without injury I'd be surprised. If they don't have some kind of controversy in Cleveland involving him this year I'll be shocked. Its early.
just shows that all the BBI "experts"  
bc4life : 9/17/2019 10:18 am : link
who claimed that Beckham was declining and that he had lost a step were talking out of their asses.

RE: the wisdom of the trade - time will tell
RE: Why are people talking about this?  
bw in dc : 9/17/2019 10:19 am : link
In comment 14582183 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
He had plenty of these type of games as a Giant. His act grew tired. The Giants gave him a 90M contract and then he went on national TV and said he wasn't happy.


I get it.

But I think it's just glossed over and accepted that Jints Central did a good job managing OBJ's personality.

I'm not sure they did. This organization is so set in it's ways, very old school IBM, that it's not hard to imagine they couldn't adjust and figure out how to deal with OBJ.

Gettleman is 70. What is Shurmur's cred? What is Bettcher's cred? Shula's? Eli doesn't really lead in any outward fashion. So where were the resources at Jints Central to help a guy like OBJ?

I'm not absolving OBJ of his antics. But I do think the marriage break-up was more of a two way street than most realize...
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Everybody saying the team is worse without Beckham....  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 9/17/2019 10:20 am : link
In comment 14582373 arcarsenal said:
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In comment 14582337 BigBlueDownTheShore said:


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In comment 14582318 arcarsenal said:


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In comment 14582286 BigBlueDownTheShore said:


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In comment 14582274 Britt in VA said:


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Are we really?

2014: 6-10
2015: 6-10
2016: 11-5
2017: 3-13
2018: 5-11



The one winning season we had, you could make an argument that he literally willed that team to the playoffs.



The top 5 defense we fielded that got several stops late in games probably had a little more to do with it than some fictitious narrative about Beckham "willing" the team to win all on his own...but who needs facts.



Take away OBJs stats from that offense and do we even score enough to have a lead and win games with that great defense. The Baltimore game sticks out as one we would have lost just off the top of my head.



And how many games were littered with Beckham highlights in losing efforts? The one handed catch against Dallas... we lost. The diving catch into the endzone against Washington...we lost. Countless other games in 2014/15... we lost.


So still playing at a top level effort while your team is losing is a negative now? Itís his fault the entire team sucked around him?
RE: RE: I feel EXACTLY the same as I always have  
Jim in Tampa : 9/17/2019 10:20 am : link
In comment 14582311 Britt in VA said:
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In comment 14582299 Jim in Tampa said:


Quote:


Giants should have found a way to keep a player that talented.

OBJ is certainly a prima donna but he works hard, wants to win and his teammates loved him. (Except maybe for Eli :>)
That's why you keep him.

Some of the antics were annoying and some were just weird (kicker net hugging) but I don't think the dog pissing political statement or saying mean things about Eli were such a big threat to the "culture" that he had to be traded.

Giants had (arguably) their all-time best WR and RB on the team at the same time as weapons for a young QB to work with and they blew it.

As long as your superstars are playing hard you give them a little leeway if necessary. You gon't trade him.

DG probably would have traded that troublemaker LT too. Parcells and Young found a way to work with him because as DG put it...

You don't give up on talent.



Even after all that, they paid him 90 million to stay.

4 weeks later he went on ESPN Sunday Morning with Lil Wayne sitting there and when asked directly if he wanted to be wanted to be a Giant he basically said he wasn't sure.

He says stupid stuff. So what?

He goes on Twitter all the time and says more stupid stuff. Why does anyone pay attention or even care?

It would be awesome if all the players acted like pros 100% of the time like Eli and Barkley, but you don't get rid of superstars just because he makes stupid comments.

And your take that the Giants would still be 0-2 without OBJ is just dumb. No one knows what their record would be with OBJ these first two games, but there are other games to play and other seasons as well.
with OBJ  
bc4life : 9/17/2019 10:22 am : link
at least teams would have to game plan for him and Barkley - that's a heavy lift for a DC
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Everybody saying the team is worse without Beckham....  
arcarsenal : 9/17/2019 10:23 am : link
In comment 14582429 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
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In comment 14582373 arcarsenal said:


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In comment 14582337 BigBlueDownTheShore said:


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In comment 14582318 arcarsenal said:


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In comment 14582286 BigBlueDownTheShore said:


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In comment 14582274 Britt in VA said:


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Are we really?

2014: 6-10
2015: 6-10
2016: 11-5
2017: 3-13
2018: 5-11



The one winning season we had, you could make an argument that he literally willed that team to the playoffs.



The top 5 defense we fielded that got several stops late in games probably had a little more to do with it than some fictitious narrative about Beckham "willing" the team to win all on his own...but who needs facts.



Take away OBJs stats from that offense and do we even score enough to have a lead and win games with that great defense. The Baltimore game sticks out as one we would have lost just off the top of my head.



And how many games were littered with Beckham highlights in losing efforts? The one handed catch against Dallas... we lost. The diving catch into the endzone against Washington...we lost. Countless other games in 2014/15... we lost.



So still playing at a top level effort while your team is losing is a negative now? Itís his fault the entire team sucked around him?


Who said it was a negative? The point is we were a bad football team with him the same way we are without him.

They tried to keep him. They made him the highest paid WR in the sport. He didn't want to be here. Such is life.
RE: RE: RE: Five years, huh?  
Tesla : 9/17/2019 10:25 am : link
In comment 14582386 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 14582354 Tesla said:


Quote:


In comment 14582336 Greg from LI said:


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Why? Is he going to somehow play significantly better than he did last year? What exactly do you expect to see Barkley do differently that will turn the team's fortunes around?



LOL, you know he's not even gonna try to answer that one cause there is no answer.



What's your problem asshole?


U mad bro? Go ahead and answer Greg's question: over the next 4 years what can Barkley do differently that will take us from a 5 win team to an 11 win team?

Answer the question....
.  
Banks : 9/17/2019 10:31 am : link
I didn't expect his ability to decline so nothing has changed my mind about the kind of player he is. However I don't think last night should be used as an "I told you so". I think his final stats are a bit misleading. He had that ~35 yard catch on the opening drive and then about 20 yards until the 89 yarder when the Browns were expected to run out the clock with 2-3 minutes left in the 3rd. For most of the game he was invisible, but maybe that's because Mayfield looked like shit for most of it. His final stats are also a bit misleading
shocked.  
madgiantscow009 : 9/17/2019 10:44 am : link
I didn't expect him ever to score again.
RE: .  
Jim in Tampa : 9/17/2019 10:49 am : link
In comment 14582534 Banks said:
Quote:
I didn't expect his ability to decline so nothing has changed my mind about the kind of player he is. However I don't think last night should be used as an "I told you so". I think his final stats are a bit misleading. He had that ~35 yard catch on the opening drive and then about 20 yards until the 89 yarder when the Browns were expected to run out the clock with 2-3 minutes left in the 3rd. For most of the game he was invisible, but maybe that's because Mayfield looked like shit for most of it. His final stats are also a bit misleading

LOL. Yeah except for the 89 yrd game-sealing TD, OBJ was invisible. As opposed to all the Giants' receivers who were invisible the whole game, minus the 89 yrd TD.
Same 4 guys  
KDubbs : 9/17/2019 10:54 am : link
On every thread just bitch and talk shit to their fellow fans. Do you enjoy anything other than being miserable sacks of shit?
I hated the trade at the time  
RollBlue : 9/17/2019 11:07 am : link
but was hopeful we could turn the draft picks into something - jury is still out, and was hopeful Peppers was an answer at Safety, that doesn't look good at the moment. I still think they should have cut Eli back in March and keep OBJ. He's on a talent level similar to LT - and LT was certainly no saint. As a fan, I want the team to win, and for the most part, OBJ is not a bad guy (see Big Ben, A Brown). The trade is still bad as we sit here today.
Jets suck, and OBJ is still a headcase  
PatersonPlank : 9/17/2019 11:08 am : link
Nothing changed for me. I still expect the Browns to implode at some point this season
So glad he's gone.  
Since1965 : 9/17/2019 11:20 am : link
Addition by subtraction.
See what happens at the first sign of  
DC Gmen Fan : 9/17/2019 11:22 am : link
Adversity.
Knew  
Thegratefulhead : 9/17/2019 11:37 am : link
That OBJ would score a few long touchdowns this year and that every one would cause a post on BBI. I was correct.
The Giants lost a lot of games with him.  
Mr. Bungle : 9/17/2019 11:52 am : link
They look like they'll lose a lot of games without him.

He wasn't a difference-maker in terms of winning and losing, so we should all probably just give it a rest already.

Besides, he faced a completely dead Jets team last night. There are still 14 more games on the Browns calendar to evaluate him in. And almost all of them are against much better opponents.
I don't think it was a spectacular performance  
Rudy5757 : 9/17/2019 11:55 am : link
OBJ is a great player, he is going to have great games. Put the game into perspective, it was against the Jets who started their backup QB and then went to the 3rd string QB. The 89 yard catch and run was a blown coverage when the game was over. He had a great catch and a solid performance up until the 89 yarder. You can't judge a trade on one game, we got back picks so they need time to develop as well. If you look at it like it was Peppers for OBJ, yes they got the better of us but we have 2 other young players that have shown promise.

I liked that we traded him away. DJ needs a fresh start and he can be the leader of this team. I like the talent of OBJ but cant stand the antics. Yes the players all love OBJ but he is not a guy you want leading your team.
RE: The Giants lost a lot of games with him.  
hitdog42 : 9/17/2019 11:57 am : link
In comment 14582998 Mr. Bungle said:
Quote:
They look like they'll lose a lot of games without him.

He wasn't a difference-maker in terms of winning and losing, so we should all probably just give it a rest already.

Besides, he faced a completely dead Jets team last night. There are still 14 more games on the Browns calendar to evaluate him in. And almost all of them are against much better opponents.


he actually carried a awful offense to the playoffs with the help of a great defense... and good end of game coaching... things many pretend didnt happen because the bias is to dislike and sh$t on anyone that has left the dumpster fire to feel better about people current running and playing for the dumpster fire



I fully expected OBJ to have a big game  
ZogZerg : 9/17/2019 12:03 pm : link
But, Cleveland didn't need him to win that game.
Jets couldn't move the ball at all and when they did they committed a penalty.

So, looks good in stat book, but Cleveland wins that game with out OBJ playing.



RE: RE: The Giants lost a lot of games with him.  
Mr. Bungle : 9/17/2019 12:06 pm : link
In comment 14583028 hitdog42 said:
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In comment 14582998 Mr. Bungle said:


Quote:


They look like they'll lose a lot of games without him.

He wasn't a difference-maker in terms of winning and losing, so we should all probably just give it a rest already.

Besides, he faced a completely dead Jets team last night. There are still 14 more games on the Browns calendar to evaluate him in. And almost all of them are against much better opponents.



he actually carried a awful offense to the playoffs with the help of a great defense... and good end of game coaching... things many pretend didnt happen because the bias is to dislike and sh$t on anyone that has left the dumpster fire to feel better about people current running and playing for the dumpster fire



And proceeded to embarrass himself and play like dogshit in that playoff game.

Great argument. What a hero he was for the Giants.
GREAT player that we could certainly use right now.  
Dave in Hoboken : 9/17/2019 12:07 pm : link
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RE: RE: RE: The Giants lost a lot of games with him.  
hitdog42 : 9/17/2019 12:33 pm : link
In comment 14583078 Mr. Bungle said:
Quote:
In comment 14583028 hitdog42 said:


Quote:


In comment 14582998 Mr. Bungle said:


Quote:


They look like they'll lose a lot of games without him.

He wasn't a difference-maker in terms of winning and losing, so we should all probably just give it a rest already.

Besides, he faced a completely dead Jets team last night. There are still 14 more games on the Browns calendar to evaluate him in. And almost all of them are against much better opponents.



he actually carried a awful offense to the playoffs with the help of a great defense... and good end of game coaching... things many pretend didnt happen because the bias is to dislike and sh$t on anyone that has left the dumpster fire to feel better about people current running and playing for the dumpster fire





And proceeded to embarrass himself and play like dogshit in that playoff game.

Great argument. What a hero he was for the Giants.


who said he was a hero? a lot of guys played like sh$t in a first playoff game. it does not mean they are losing players. whether they are on a boat or in their basement playing video games- who cares- he played terrible.

the argument is that it is pathetic to selectively forget 2016 as happening on the "win side"--- and then sit here and quote the 2017 record as part of his losing contribution when he was hurt all year- exposing even more the dumpster fire that we became.
Take out the one play where the D screwed up  
Stan in LA : 9/17/2019 12:41 pm : link
And he was nothing special. Just like he looked in their 1st game.
RE: Knew  
gmenatlarge : 9/17/2019 1:38 pm : link
In comment 14582924 Thegratefulhead said:
Quote:
That OBJ would score a few long touchdowns this year and that every one would cause a post on BBI. I was correct.



Try not to sprain something patting yourself on the back there Nostradamus, I mean who could have predicted that, amazing!
Stan  
bc4life : 9/17/2019 4:25 pm : link
you mean the one handed 30 yard catch?
RE: Last night's performance is irrelevant.  
Giantz_comeback : 9/17/2019 4:55 pm : link
In comment 14582217 Mad Mike said:
Quote:
Does anyone not recognize he's a tremendous talent who can do fantastic things on the field? The issue is a) can he keep his head on straight, behave himself, etc... so he's able to consistently play and not be a distraction, and (much more importantly imo) b) can he stay healthy enough to consistently stay on the field performing at a high level.

Nothing that happened last night was surprising, nor did it in any way answer the questions that led the Giants to trade him.


Yup
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