Did we pay Eli 18 million for two games?

Mara and Tisch.
They're good for it, though.

pay anything.

He had a roster bonus of $5 million in March. If the Giants would have cut him before then they would have saved $23 million.

Now the tricky part is this was obviously before the draft so there was no guarantee they'd get the QB they wanted. They also would have had to sign a bridge QB which would have probably been around $15-$18 million unless they were going to take a chance on the draft.

Eli will most likely see the field again this year

I don't remember paying him any of that. If you mean as a fan I think my share is no more than a $1.00. I'll gladly pay that for the only Giants' player to ever to win 2 SB MVPs.

Point is, so what. Not sure why this is such a big deal and keeps coming up. It's not like that money was going to get the Giants to the SB this year or the next. Both parties had a contract and both parties are honoring that contract.

Get over it. It's done.

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or we screamed we were taking a QB in the draft.

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Mara was asked about what he thought of the direction of the team.

His reply was he was happy with the past two drafts. I imagine that was after seeing Jones during camp as a big reason as well as the focus strengthening the lines.

So I would thing DG is safe but PS still has to prove himself this year imo.

Honest question

25% of the $188M salary cap.

Vernon is on Reese, but Beckham ($16M) is on Gettleman and Eli ($23M) could have been cut to save $17M prior to March.

None of this is hindsight.

In comment 14584091 Sy'56 said:

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Honest question

i was about to ask the same thing

why does anyone care about this stuff?

all i care about is winning on Sundays

it's fair to say we because if you're on the hook for PSL's it is your money.

In comment 14584091 Sy'56 said:

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Honest question

+ 1 Now the answer to this ^^^question has me interested!

In comment 14584125 arniefez said:

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it's fair to say we because if you're on the hook for PSL's it is your money.

Do we season ticket holders have voting rights?

is strange on here.

Eli is going to help Jones with preparation, guidance, handling the game, the media. etc. Who is a better role model for Jones at this stage?

Money well spent not to mention they were not cutting him.

In comment 14584125 arniefez said:

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it's fair to say we because if you're on the hook for PSL's it is your money.

Really?

Are you saying that if we didn't sign Eli (or Beckham, or Tate, or whoever, or whoever, or whoever....) you wouldn't have to pay for PSL's? or even as much?

1) Sitting him after two games was obviously NOT the initial plan

2) Plans change
2a) The team is not a contender and
2b) Jones is far ahead of the curve

3) It’s not your money

That's why it matters.

In comment 14584107 Go Terps said:

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25% of the $188M salary cap. Vernon is on Reese, but Beckham ($16M) is on Gettleman and Eli ($23M) could have been cut to save $17M prior to March. None of this is hindsight.

Well tbf the 16 million bought us some cheap assets (whether or not they turn out to be worth it remains to be seen) and there is no way if you like DJ you could cut Eli prior to March. I would have cut him after the draft, but the 5 million would be well worth it so you don't tip your hand and have to trade premium assets away to move up. Playing the media in the draft is one thing DG did well this year.

but I really don't think this line of inquiry is any of your business, nor appropriate, nor is it yours or our money that was used.

In comment 14584091 Sy'56 said:

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Honest question

I don't care, but I am curious. And, of course, If I was the owner and ran a company, I would be angry with my executives for wasting my money. This has nothing to do with Eli, I am glad he is taking the money , but when an executive sells an owner on a plan, I would figure that wasting his money would be a problem.

In comment 14584155 gidiefor said:

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but I really don't think this line of inquiry is any of your business, nor appropriate, nor is it yours or our money that was used.

I am not trying to be difficult, but I cannot understand how an 18 million dollar decision by a football team I support is not an appropriate line of inquiry. I should also add that besides the salary cap (which is fungible and can always be manipulated) there are cash limits to what teams will spend. No clue what ours is, but our owners must have set some sort of budget.

when you say ours -- your line of inquiry veers into the ridiculous

and with appropriate contract structures keep them in the future?

the OBJ and Eli contracts were DG mistakes.

In comment 14584225 gidiefor said:

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when you say ours -- your line of inquiry veers into the ridiculous

that is an absurd criticism. Ok substitute "our" to the "team I support" and "we" to the "new York Giants."

In comment 14584212 Essex said:

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In comment 14584155 gidiefor said: Quote: but I really don't think this line of inquiry is any of your business, nor appropriate, nor is it yours or our money that was used. I am not trying to be difficult, but I cannot understand how an 18 million dollar decision by a football team I support is not an appropriate line of inquiry. I should also add that besides the salary cap (which is fungible and can always be manipulated) there are cash limits to what teams will spend. No clue what ours is, but our owners must have set some sort of budget.

I understand your line of thinking. Some people are ultra sensitive right now regarding Eli. They paid what they had to and screw them he deserved it. I don't think they could have played it differenlty. Maybe they really thought the defense would be good enough. Hell the media had me sold. The O-line seems improved. SB has room to run and the QB had more than 2 seconds to get rid of the ball.....I digress, again.

In comment 14584234 markky said:

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and with appropriate contract structures keep them in the future? the OBJ and Eli contracts were DG mistakes.

In hindsight maybe, but hindsight is a pretty lame view of things.

In comment 14584242 Brown Recluse said:

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In comment 14584234 markky said: Quote: and with appropriate contract structures keep them in the future? the OBJ and Eli contracts were DG mistakes. In hindsight maybe, but hindsight is a pretty lame view of things.

Isn't that a pretty important view when you are assessing job performance. Nobody is going to bat 1.000 but you have to be right sometimes on the big deal.

In comment 14584091 Sy'56 said:

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Honest question

because it took us a grand total of 2 fucking games to accept what we already knew..
he was fucking toast. and THAT is 18 million, we could have spent/spend on say......ANY better player.

And what QB would you have liked them to sign to replace him and how much would it cost? What other player would they then be able to afford that would make any difference? The team would be in the same situation at 0 - 2 and possibly would have made it cost more to obtain Jones are not get him at all since the whole league would know the Giants would most likely take a QB. If the Bengals liked him that much they would have definitely jumped the Giants to get him.

Out of loyalty and appreciation John Mara wanted Eli to get his entire contract.

Can you name one free agent that was available that the Giants didn't sign because of cap space used by Eli? I think it had little impact.

Players receive 16 direct deposits or checks for their compensation.

I watched.

In comment 14584088 Lines of Scrimmage said:

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Mara was asked about what he thought of the direction of the team. His reply was he was happy with the past two drafts. I imagine that was after seeing Jones during camp as a big reason as well as the focus strengthening the lines. So I would thing DG is safe but PS still has to prove himself this year imo.

which proves he doesn't know his ass from a two base hit.

is ridiculous. I wouldn't personally phrase it like that, but he's obviously emotionally invested in the team and it's a fair question - cap space can roll over, that $18 mil could have been very valuable for the rebuild.

I don't disagree with the decision, but it's valid to gripe about it.

You should hope the Giants don't go on another free agent shopping spree like Reese did. As you recall it left the team paralyzed and in shambles.

In comment 14584155 gidiefor said:

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but I really don't think this line of inquiry is any of your business, nor appropriate, nor is it yours or our money that was used.

Insofar as the conversation remains focused on the way the Giants manage the salary cap, I don't think it's inappropriate in any way.

In comment 14584437 GiantEgo said:

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You should hope the Giants don't go on another free agent shopping spree like Reese did. As you recall it left the team paralyzed and in shambles.

...did get us 11-5 the year directly after, mostly on the strength of the defense.

In comment 14584326 GiantEgo said:

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Out of loyalty and appreciation John Mara wanted Eli to get his entire contract. Can you name one free agent that was available that the Giants didn't sign because of cap space used by Eli? I think it had little impact.

It would have made Solder's restructure unnecessary and would have created additional cap room in 2020 even if they built the team exactly the same way, just sans Eli (in which case the cap room created by his release minus the amount they freed up by restructuring Solder would apply to 2020 as a rollover).

Now that's probably not the way it would have played out, but to simply make it about free agents they could have signed this year is inaccurate since they could have rolled the cap space forward into 2020 and would not have had to make the moves they did for in-season cap space this year.

And just to correct one repeated and completely inaccurate notion, the Giants would not have needed in any universe to spend 18M on a stop a gap QB.

Fitzpatrick - 7M guaranteed
Taylor - 6M guaranteed
Bridgewater - 7.25M guaranteed
RG3 - 2M guaranteed
McCarron - 2.5M guaranteed

The Giants easily could have spent 7M on a stop gap and save 16M dollars if they had cut Manning.

In comment 14584516 christian said:

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And just to correct one repeated and completely inaccurate notion, the Giants would not have needed in any universe to spend 18M on a stop a gap QB. Fitzpatrick - 7M guaranteed Taylor - 6M guaranteed Bridgewater - 7.25M guaranteed RG3 - 2M guaranteed McCarron - 2.5M guaranteed The Giants easily could have spent 7M on a stop gap and save 16M dollars if they had cut Manning.

Why would Fitzpatrick sign with the Giants. He wants to survive.

In comment 14584135 Lines of Scrimmage said:

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is strange on here. Eli is going to help Jones with preparation, guidance, handling the game, the media. etc. Who is a better role model for Jones at this stage? Money well spent not to mention they were not cutting him.

How do you know this? He has sat for a total of eight games his entire career. It would not be unusual if he is not the best backup in the world. He may not even have a clue how to convey the knowledge of all the things you mention after being a starting QB for 15 years. One just doesn’t become a coach/mentor overnight.

In comment 14584533 SJGiant said:

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In comment 14584516 christian said: Quote: And just to correct one repeated and completely inaccurate notion, the Giants would not have needed in any universe to spend 18M on a stop a gap QB. Fitzpatrick - 7M guaranteed Taylor - 6M guaranteed Bridgewater - 7.25M guaranteed RG3 - 2M guaranteed McCarron - 2.5M guaranteed The Giants easily could have spent 7M on a stop gap and save 16M dollars if they had cut Manning. Why would Fitzpatrick sign with the Giants. He wants to survive.

The only team I'd pick the Giants above as a QB is actually the Dolphins.

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In comment 14584516 christian said:

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And just to correct one repeated and completely inaccurate notion, the Giants would not have needed in any universe to spend 18M on a stop a gap QB. Fitzpatrick - 7M guaranteed Taylor - 6M guaranteed Bridgewater - 7.25M guaranteed RG3 - 2M guaranteed McCarron - 2.5M guaranteed The Giants easily could have spent 7M on a stop gap and save 16M dollars if they had cut Manning.

Ok so they save $10-12m and have an undeniably worse QB? What purpose does that serve? It's not like it's future money saved, he had 1 year left so the uses of that money were restricted to the FA that were available like Deone Buchanon or Daryl Williams (who has supposedly been bad). Or another Golden Tate for everyone to say it was a mistake to sign.

Am I the only one who thinks that for the $10m difference it was worth it to roll the dice on Eli in his second year in the system while also knowing even if not, he's an ideal mentor/team leader? When is the last time any of those guys sniffed the numbers Eli put up even last year? Have any of them ever hit 4k yards or 20+ tds in a single season?

In comment 14584686 Eric on Li said:

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In comment 14584516 christian said: Quote: And just to correct one repeated and completely inaccurate notion, the Giants would not have needed in any universe to spend 18M on a stop a gap QB. Fitzpatrick - 7M guaranteed Taylor - 6M guaranteed Bridgewater - 7.25M guaranteed RG3 - 2M guaranteed McCarron - 2.5M guaranteed The Giants easily could have spent 7M on a stop gap and save 16M dollars if they had cut Manning. Ok so they save $10-12m and have an undeniably worse QB? What purpose does that serve? It's not like it's future money saved, he had 1 year left so the uses of that money were restricted to the FA that were available like Deone Buchanon or Daryl Williams (who has supposedly been bad). Or another Golden Tate for everyone to say it was a mistake to sign. Am I the only one who thinks that for the $10m difference it was worth it to roll the dice on Eli in his second year in the system while also knowing even if not, he's an ideal mentor/team leader? When is the last time any of those guys sniffed the numbers Eli put up even last year? Have any of them ever hit 4k yards or 20+ tds in a single season?

What do you mean "it's not like it's future money saved"? That's precisely what it is. You can roll over unused cap space to the following season, so it absolutely would have been future money saved. And it might have made it unnecessary for them to restructure Solder's contract, which would also be future money saved.

As for Eli being a mentor, that remains to be seen - he's never had to be one before, and the cast of developmental QBs that have come through the doors behind him haven't been cause for anyone to claim that Eli possesses these great mentoring skills. He's always been a leader by example - we'll see now if that's a role that can happen from the sidelines.

In comment 14584670 Go Terps said:

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. Link - ( New Window )

Good memory lane there...

In comment 14584769 bw in dc said:

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In comment 14584670 Go Terps said: Quote: . Link - ( New Window ) Good memory lane there...

Some good opinions on there.

And some...not so much

There are posters on this site who consistently don't know what they're talking about, and that thread is littered with them.