I am frustrated--6 of the last 7 years have been basically

On Sundays this team is badly coached. The games are poorly managed and they've done a terrible job of building the game plan around their best player.

While it's easy and comfortable to blame Reese for everything, that doesn't capture the whole issue.

with any kind of regularity with the talent on this team is absurd.

They are deficient in so many areas that it's impossible for them to compete with over half the teams in the league. There's only so much game planning and in game decisions that can influence a game.

Blaming Shurmer for the Giants L's this year and last is lazy.

Is we not only have more injuries than most, we also don’t get our players back on the field as fast as most. I’m not looking at one season but over the past 20 years. In the 80s our players played injured or not. Either our trainers have performed miserable or the medical care we give our injured players is subpar. I just can’t understand how we carry draft picks who haven’t practiced in two years. Something is drastically wrong here fellas. Maybe we are too loyal to these employees also.

They've drafted 9 players on defense in the past two years. Outside of Lawrence (a pick I loved, and by far my favorite of all of Gettleman's , and to a lesser extent Connelly briefly before he got hurt, none of of them have really shined thus far.

No, I'm not trying to judge a draft less than two seasons in, but there's a lot of exaggeration going on here.

exaggeration because of how piss poor the previous drafts have been

for better draft positioning. We're in a rebuild, no use wasting it with a 7-9 record, or God forbid, an 8-8 record.

This is part of sports. Some seasons are good, some seasons are bad. Going through the losing makes the winning even sweeter.

It would be nice, though, if there were more good seasons and fewer bad seasons. We see the Steelers do it year after year. The Patriots. The Ravens are consistently in contention. The Seahawks haven't stunk for a long time. At some point you have to look at the Giants and ask: WTF is going on over there?

be heading in the right direction. I think it is too early to tell. Gettleman's drafts look promising but we will have to see how they pan out with a proper amount of time.

I guess my frustration derives from the fact that so much has gone wrong (wasting Eli, the Reese drafts, the poor on the field product) and many of the things that have gone right such as Barkley, Shepard, Connelly, Engram etc are now injured (some habitually like Engram and Shepard). Couple that with we are going to have a hard time evaluating the promising Jones because of these injuries. It is like getting a car that you think might be as good as a Corvette but told you can't go higher than second gear. it is just frustrating. I guess if Jones is lights out great and keeps improving without a supporting cast than we know he will be great. My guess, though, is that he will struggle and it will have little to do with him.

And even if we were to assume Jones was good, which I think is a good assumption, we do not know how good he is at this point. Is he Elite? Is he Romo or Matt Ryan good? Or maybe something like Dalton? I feel like the season has become a lost season because, even if we don't win which I expected, how much will we be able to evaluate from this mess on the offensive side of the ball with all these injures.

It is just frustrating.

In comment 14618943 Essex said:

Quote:

be heading in the right direction. I think it is too early to tell. Gettleman's drafts look promising but we will have to see how they pan out with a proper amount of time. I guess my frustration derives from the fact that so much has gone wrong (wasting Eli, the Reese drafts, the poor on the field product) and many of the things that have gone right such as Barkley, Shepard, Connelly, Engram etc are now injured (some habitually like Engram and Shepard). Couple that with we are going to have a hard time evaluating the promising Jones because of these injuries. It is like getting a car that you think might be as good as a Corvette but told you can't go higher than second gear. it is just frustrating. I guess if Jones is lights out great and keeps improving without a supporting cast than we know he will be great. My guess, though, is that he will struggle and it will have little to do with him. And even if we were to assume Jones was good, which I think is a good assumption, we do not know how good he is at this point. Is he Elite? Is he Romo or Matt Ryan good? Or maybe something like Dalton? I feel like the season has become a lost season because, even if we don't win which I expected, how much will we be able to evaluate from this mess on the offensive side of the ball with all these injures. It is just frustrating.

The injuries suck, and put a damper on things, but the season is not a lost season - mainly because Jones is getting game reps and we have some young pieces on defense that can improve.

And Barkley looks like he will be coming back in the near future.

In comment 14618881 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

They've drafted 9 players on defense in the past two years. Outside of Lawrence (a pick I loved, and by far my favorite of all of Gettleman's , and to a lesser extent Connelly briefly before he got hurt, none of of them have really shined thus far. No, I'm not trying to judge a draft less than two seasons in, but there's a lot of exaggeration going on here.

I think this is unfair. BJ Hill is a good player. He might not be All-Pro, but he was a good pick and was a 3rd rounder. You want 3rd rounders to be starting caliber, and Hill is that.

Also Ximines, another 3rd rounder, looks like he's coming on as a pass rusher. It is way too early to judge this rookie class though, either way. 6 of those 9 guys are rookies, and they did get a good player in Hill last year, with Carter still a TBD, and McIntosh will probably wash out.

And we'll see with Beal, which would make 10 defensive picks.

One of the easiest divisions AFCEast what a joke for the last 15 years or so

The Ravens have only had the Steelers to worry about

Now the NFC East has how many Super Bowls under their belt

I think overall the NFC East is the toughest division

He had one big game against the Bears last year, but outside of that he's been average at best.

Depends on Gettleman scouting the prospective HC ranks for individuals he thinks will become premier leaders. In fact, I’d say that’s Gettleman’s most important job right now. If that guy is out there, they need to bring him in here as the new coach as soon as possible.

It doesn’t matter what Shurmur does the rest of the season. The book on him is in: he’s a competent NFL lifer. He’s actually done some nice work developing some of the young players, but there are also glaring problems which make it certain he won’t lead the team to its next trophy.

That’s my way of saying that the next big step for the franchise isn’t a new left tackle or free safety, but a very strong head coach. Just like with Parcells in his second season or when Coughlin arrived, that hire will completely change the mood of the franchise and the tone of the games.

In comment 14618876 Dnew15 said:

Quote:

with any kind of regularity with the talent on this team is absurd. They are deficient in so many areas that it's impossible for them to compete with over half the teams in the league. There's only so much game planning and in game decisions that can influence a game. Blaming Shurmer for the Giants L's this year and last is lazy.

There is truth to this. So it needs to be factored.

On the other hand, there is an aspect of coaching where you need to be able to develop talent. While I think Shurmur knows, for example, where he wants to be offensively to fit onto today's game, I just don't view him as coach who has those skills to develop. And that's a huge piece of coaching - being able to take talent and mold and sculpt it.

Does anyone have any legitimate confidence that Bettcher can develop talent? That Hal Hunter can? That Shula can?

I guess these guys have their signature ideas and can implement their ideas on the field. But who really knows beyond that...

I'm starting to think this coaching staff across the board is at best a C.

And that's just not good enough...

has really gutted the talent level on this team. It is going to take another couple of good drafts to make this a solid 10-plus win team.

And, not only do good drafts and solid management create a pool of talent, they help create a winning culture that, to some degree, perpetuates itself. As someone mentioned above, when was the last time the Patriots, Seahawks, Steelers, Packers, or Ravens were really a "bad" team, even with different players year after year?

to develop.

Next year if there aren't great strides - I'm with you.

But I think EE is better. I think that SS is better. I think that Slayton is better than the day the Giants drafted him. Lawerence seems to be getting better by the game. Connelly certainly seemed to be developing nicely.

They are finally drafting football players - not just athletes and its giving the coaching staff a fighting chance to start developing players.

In comment 14618995 cosmicj said:

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Depends on Gettleman scouting the prospective HC ranks for individuals he thinks will become premier leaders. In fact, I’d say that’s Gettleman’s most important job right now. If that guy is out there, they need to bring him in here as the new coach as soon as possible. It doesn’t matter what Shurmur does the rest of the season. The book on him is in: he’s a competent NFL lifer. He’s actually done some nice work developing some of the young players, but there are also glaring problems which make it certain he won’t lead the team to its next trophy. That’s my way of saying that the next big step for the franchise isn’t a new left tackle or free safety, but a very strong head coach. Just like with Parcells in his second season or when Coughlin arrived, that hire will completely change the mood of the franchise and the tone of the games.

This is a great post. I'll add that there is a prevailing sentiment that the Giants have bottomed out and are now on the ascendancy, as if their fortunes follow a sine wave.

This is not so. Just because the team has been really bad for a few years doesn't mean it's now due to be good. Potential pitfalls are everywhere, and the biggest one is not the talent or lack thereof; it's the manner in which this team is managed and coached.

We've seen well coached, talent-poor teams. We know what that looks like. That is not what we're seeing with these Giants.

They are not well coached. As long as that continues it won't matter how much talent we accumulate.

In comment 14618995 cosmicj said:

Quote:

Depends on Gettleman scouting the prospective HC ranks for individuals he thinks will become premier leaders. In fact, I’d say that’s Gettleman’s most important job right now. If that guy is out there, they need to bring him in here as the new coach as soon as possible. It doesn’t matter what Shurmur does the rest of the season. The book on him is in: he’s a competent NFL lifer. He’s actually done some nice work developing some of the young players, but there are also glaring problems which make it certain he won’t lead the team to its next trophy. That’s my way of saying that the next big step for the franchise isn’t a new left tackle or free safety, but a very strong head coach. Just like with Parcells in his second season or when Coughlin arrived, that hire will completely change the mood of the franchise and the tone of the games.

strong post...

the glaring coaching mistakes that are so egregious that you can say definitively that he can't take a team to the next level.

What exactly are they?

It's not like the guy is punting on 3rd down or anything.

In comment 14618995 cosmicj said:

Quote:

Depends on Gettleman scouting the prospective HC ranks for individuals he thinks will become premier leaders. In fact, I’d say that’s Gettleman’s most important job right now. If that guy is out there, they need to bring him in here as the new coach as soon as possible. It doesn’t matter what Shurmur does the rest of the season. The book on him is in: he’s a competent NFL lifer. He’s actually done some nice work developing some of the young players, but there are also glaring problems which make it certain he won’t lead the team to its next trophy. That’s my way of saying that the next big step for the franchise isn’t a new left tackle or free safety, but a very strong head coach. Just like with Parcells in his second season or when Coughlin arrived, that hire will completely change the mood of the franchise and the tone of the games.

Thats not how this org operates. They have to fire the current guy before targeting the new guy. I can just about guarantee no one in the org is looking for new HCs

In comment 14618958 allstarjim said:

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In comment 14618881 Greg from LI said: Quote: They've drafted 9 players on defense in the past two years. Outside of Lawrence (a pick I loved, and by far my favorite of all of Gettleman's , and to a lesser extent Connelly briefly before he got hurt, none of of them have really shined thus far. No, I'm not trying to judge a draft less than two seasons in, but there's a lot of exaggeration going on here. I think this is unfair. BJ Hill is a good player. He might not be All-Pro, but he was a good pick and was a 3rd rounder. You want 3rd rounders to be starting caliber, and Hill is that. Also Ximines, another 3rd rounder, looks like he's coming on as a pass rusher. It is way too early to judge this rookie class though, either way. 6 of those 9 guys are rookies, and they did get a good player in Hill last year, with Carter still a TBD, and McIntosh will probably wash out. And we'll see with Beal, which would make 10 defensive picks.

Well thats telling. 10 Defensive picks. 2 first rounders a second rounder 4 3rd rounders and 3 in the later rounds(4 if you count the practice squad). There should be some talent there. I think you can see it in our Dline. Maybe Connelly can be capable. But for this team to have shown so little progress on defense I think you have to wonder where this issue lies. Poor talent evaluation (considering some of the FA pickups as well), poor player development, poor scheme/coachin or is it 'other'? I'm not looking for them to be the '86 bears but, to my eyes, I don't see progress from this year to last and THAT is what is discouraging.

In comment 14619093 Dinger said:

Quote:

In comment 14618958 allstarjim said: Quote: In comment 14618881 Greg from LI said: Quote: They've drafted 9 players on defense in the past two years. Outside of Lawrence (a pick I loved, and by far my favorite of all of Gettleman's , and to a lesser extent Connelly briefly before he got hurt, none of of them have really shined thus far. No, I'm not trying to judge a draft less than two seasons in, but there's a lot of exaggeration going on here. I think this is unfair. BJ Hill is a good player. He might not be All-Pro, but he was a good pick and was a 3rd rounder. You want 3rd rounders to be starting caliber, and Hill is that. Also Ximines, another 3rd rounder, looks like he's coming on as a pass rusher. It is way too early to judge this rookie class though, either way. 6 of those 9 guys are rookies, and they did get a good player in Hill last year, with Carter still a TBD, and McIntosh will probably wash out. And we'll see with Beal, which would make 10 defensive picks. Well thats telling. 10 Defensive picks. 2 first rounders a second rounder 4 3rd rounders and 3 in the later rounds(4 if you count the practice squad). There should be some talent there. I think you can see it in our Dline. Maybe Connelly can be capable. But for this team to have shown so little progress on defense I think you have to wonder where this issue lies. Poor talent evaluation (considering some of the FA pickups as well), poor player development, poor scheme/coachin or is it 'other'? I'm not looking for them to be the '86 bears but, to my eyes, I don't see progress from this year to last and THAT is what is discouraging.

There are multiple new starters on the D, several of whom are rookies.

Connelly was showing that he was much more than just capable.

.

Who out there do you think the Giants should be targeting that is the significantly better than Shurmer?

I also think many are advocating that we throw every defensive draft pick that we have from the last two years out on the field - effective immediately...otherwise it's a coaching flaw seems a bit misguided.

It's going to take years to dig out of the mismanagement of this team from Reece/MacAdoo and yes even TC.

Putting all the blame on Shurmer right now seems a bit harsh.

Shurmur is an easy target. But largely a misplaced target.

Blaming him, or giving him the weight of the blame, gives too much cover to the guy who picks players in free agency, trades players, and selects players in the drafts. And it presumes that DG is in fact doing his job well. But I don't know how anyone can say that with any certainty at this point.

The product on the field every Sunday is much more a reflection of Gettleman than Shurmur at this point.

I would bet a considerably large amount of money that if you gave Shurmur sodium penthothal he would tell you without any delay he never wanted Eli to be his QB in the first place. He simply had NO choice.

I agree, but I also think that's the same for DG too. I'm guessing he took the job knowing he'd have to make it work with Eli.

2020 is the year that we get to see what everyone on this team is made of. It sucks we have to wait yet another year for it but it is what it is. Hard to judge anyone on anything when we've trotted out an expensive, washed up NY legend at QB the last few years.

He clearly isn't the only problem.

But he just as clearly isn't the solution.

why he's clearly not the solution?

The guy is being asked to make filet with hot dog meat.

In comment 14619189 Go Terps said:

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He clearly isn't the only problem. But he just as clearly isn't the solution.

I don't think that's clear. But I think he's on a clock. We need to see some results — and I'd say those results have to be obvious in about a month. Seriously. Second half of this season. If the team looks the same, that's a coaching problem.

the clock started ticking on DG and PS the minute they started Jones.

This isn't clear to people at this point? I'm surprised...

that he's not a good HC - but haven't really given any examples of what your referring to.

THere have been - questionable decisions - but I can't think of anything that was horrific off the top of my head.

Maybe I'm missing something.

Poor timeout usage, poor clock management, misuse of Barkley, and his team generally looking unprepared. Blown coverage and blocking assignments, the ridiculous public Lauletta comments last year, the frequent excuse making for poor performance...

I really thought this was generally accepted.

Are there really people out there that see Shurmur coaching this team to 10 or more wins at any point? Really?

it would be before Terps dragged out his “hire a consultant”, poorly run organization” shtick. For those who don’t know here, we’ve been subjected to this for what 5+ yrs now. I’ve lost track.
The rebuttal is they have the SAME management structure now that’s brought 4 Super Bowls so they must be doing something right.
Also they have Duel ownership. They by definition means there will be more voices. What’s the alternative, one of them sells?
The real issue are WHO the voices are. Reese and Ross proved to be a big failure. Chris Mara, who really knows what he knows and what input he has. The talent level seems to be heading in the right direction under Gettleman. The reality is until they win again, no one will really be able to say with conviction, why they lost since 2011. During the “Wilderness years” it was pretty obvious. Wellington’s way of running things was passed by and he didn’t adjust. So, management was a disaster. Neither myself, Terps or anyone else can be sure why this team has been so poor for a decade. The players were poor, why were they drafted (or signed). We all have our opinions.

mismanagement of the draft. There's a reason that DG has came into GM positions twice and he is the ONLY person he's fired. It is going to take 3 years to get out of this hole, but if we aren't in the playoffs next year, short of DJ suffering a major injury, it will be time to move on. FA is kind of a crapshoot, but that will give DG 3 years of drafts. Thats enough to build a playoff roster.

In comment 14618787 Dinger said:

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In comment 14618712 exiled said: Quote: of an era. Now we’re watching the beginning of an era. I know we’re seeing the same challenges and similar outcomes, but it has a different feel. I mean, if Eli played last Sunday with precisely the same results, his performance would’ve been panned. With Jones, it just reflects growing pains (and terrible pass protection). You don’t feel that, Essex? The optimism? I can't speak for Essex, but I am more relieved than optimistic. Having who appears to be a keeper at QB is a great step forward. But after SB46 we had a great QB. we proceeded to draft poorly and/or not develop players we did draft and maybe had one or two decent teams. I have to agree that I'm worried that its deeper than just a GM or coaching change. I don't know Chris Mara's role as VP of player personnel and I am not sure where these two fit in: Director of Player Personnnel: Mark Koncz Director of Pro Personnel: Ken Sternfeld But we don't seem to be developing prospects well and we don't seem to know the FA market well. I also think it has to do with the coaches developing players and creating a game play that works best with those players. I doesn't seem like most of our players are as well 'prepare' or 'coached' as other teams at our level(DJ seemingly the exception). So I guess I have hope that we can build around this QB better than we did around the last one, just not seeing it yet.

SB is another Tiki Barber and Jones looks to be a quality QB. Other than those 2 first-round picks, this team has marginal players. DG is unimpressive with overpaying underperforming veteran unrestricted FA signings (eg, J Stewart, N Solder, A Bethea, Ogletree). I saw the huge dump of players last year, but this team is not better in any way than the 2016 team and is on par to match the dismal 2017 team. Giants would be 1-4 without a missed cup shot FG in TB. At this rate this team is heading for a 3-win or 4-win season. Gettleman is DR. Dump’em, but the players we now have are unimpressive. World class STINK at defense; it’s embarrassing.

In comment 14619221 Go Terps said:

Quote:

Poor timeout usage, poor clock management, misuse of Barkley, and his team generally looking unprepared. Blown coverage and blocking assignments, the ridiculous public Lauletta comments last year, the frequent excuse making for poor performance... I really thought this was generally accepted. Are there really people out there that see Shurmur coaching this team to 10 or more wins at any point? Really?

NO. As Ron White, the comedian, says: You can’t fix stupid. They extends all through the FO and into ownership.

And these aren't "wilderness years"?

These have been the worst years the Giants have had in 40 years. Worse than Handley. Worse than Reeves. Since Hurricane Sandy this organization is 43-66.

The reasons for this stretch of pathetic football are numerous, and they didn't all go out the door with Reese no matter how badly we want to kid ourselves into thinking otherwise. Recruiting an outside voice to analyze performance is what smart organizations do in times of success, let alone in times as embarrassing as these.

The CBA and rules changes have completely transformed the NFL even since our 2011 Super Bowl...at what point do we admit that this organization is lost at sea with regards to how a football team is run in the current era?

In comment 14619316 Go Terps said:

Quote:

And these aren't "wilderness years"? These have been the worst years the Giants have had in 40 years. Worse than Handley. Worse than Reeves. Since Hurricane Sandy this organization is 43-66. The reasons for this stretch of pathetic football are numerous, and they didn't all go out the door with Reese no matter how badly we want to kid ourselves into thinking otherwise. Recruiting an outside voice to analyze performance is what smart organizations do in times of success, let alone in times as embarrassing as these. The CBA and rules changes have completely transformed the NFL even since our 2011 Super Bowl...at what point do we admit that this organization is lost at sea with regards to how a football team is run in the current era?

We have a rookie QB that can change the trajectory of the franchise. Saying this is premature.

In comment 14619316 Go Terps said:

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Recruiting an outside voice to analyze performance is what smart organizations do in times of success, let alone in times as embarrassing as these.

I have little doubt Mara thinks he is accomplishing this by bringing in Accorsi.

In comment 14619093 Dinger said:

Quote:

In comment 14618958 allstarjim said: Quote: In comment 14618881 Greg from LI said: Quote: They've drafted 9 players on defense in the past two years. Outside of Lawrence (a pick I loved, and by far my favorite of all of Gettleman's , and to a lesser extent Connelly briefly before he got hurt, none of of them have really shined thus far. No, I'm not trying to judge a draft less than two seasons in, but there's a lot of exaggeration going on here. I think this is unfair. BJ Hill is a good player. He might not be All-Pro, but he was a good pick and was a 3rd rounder. You want 3rd rounders to be starting caliber, and Hill is that. Also Ximines, another 3rd rounder, looks like he's coming on as a pass rusher. It is way too early to judge this rookie class though, either way. 6 of those 9 guys are rookies, and they did get a good player in Hill last year, with Carter still a TBD, and McIntosh will probably wash out. And we'll see with Beal, which would make 10 defensive picks. Well thats telling. 10 Defensive picks. 2 first rounders a second rounder 4 3rd rounders and 3 in the later rounds(4 if you count the practice squad). There should be some talent there. I think you can see it in our Dline. Maybe Connelly can be capable. But for this team to have shown so little progress on defense I think you have to wonder where this issue lies. Poor talent evaluation (considering some of the FA pickups as well), poor player development, poor scheme/coachin or is it 'other'? I'm not looking for them to be the '86 bears but, to my eyes, I don't see progress from this year to last and THAT is what is discouraging.

I see a defense that has made significant strides in the past year. But shit, if you want to blow it up again after 5 games when there has been demonstrable improvement with a handful of rookies that are projectable, I don't think you have much nuance in how NFL players are developed.

In comment 14619389 bw in dc said:

Quote:

In comment 14619316 Go Terps said: Quote: Recruiting an outside voice to analyze performance is what smart organizations do in times of success, let alone in times as embarrassing as these. I have little doubt Mara thinks he is accomplishing this by bringing in Accorsi.

The ironic things is that you know who else brought in Accorsi a couple of years ago?

The Colts. The same colts that have become BBI's darling team.

We are nothing if we aren't hypocritical and contradictory....

is far different than Accorsi "consulting" with the Giants.

Accorsi was the GM for the Colts for two years back in the early '80s. And his only claim to fame there was the Elway Saga during the draft.

Accorsi was here for 9 years, selected one of the most revered Giants ever (Eli) and won a historic SB. At Jints Central, he is royalty. And he knows exactly what makes that organization tick and what fits the Mara profile. There is nothing about his involvement with the fake GM search that was new and refreshing.

He is far from an independent voice.

It's time to get over Reese. The Giants have had 8 top 100 picks since he's left, have a new coach, a new QB, and 45+ new players overall. They have spent virtually every single dollar against the cap the last 2 years.

The draft picks Reese made 10 years ago have no bearing on this team. The draft picks Reese made 5 years ago statistically had little chance to have a bearing on this team.

This team isn't pieced together with low value players. The offensive line has a high priced UFA, a 2nd round pick, a mid range UFA, and a high priced trade acquisition. The running back is the former 2nd over all pick. The WR group has a 2nd round pick and high priced UFA. The tight end group has a 1st round pick and well paid UFA.

The defensive line compromises of a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round pick. The edge rushers are two 3rd round picks, a well paid UFA, and a former very good player who's playing great this year. One of the inside linebackers is a very high priced trade acquisition.

The SS is a a former 1st round pick. The corner group consists of high priced UFA, a 1st round pick, and a 3rd round pick.

The only low asset players who were slated to be starters were Halopio, Latimer, Haley, Bethea, and Davis.

do you have? I’ve managed in health care for 35 years. There are “always” consultants, official or otherwise giving their opinions. Sometimes good often times not. If you think John Mara has sat for 8!years in his office looked at things and said “gee I don’t think I’ll ask anyone’s advice” then I have multiple bridges to sell you. ESPECIALLY, since he saw what happened to his father during said wilderness years, by running things all himself. What Mara is MOST guilty of, is trusting his GM too much and allowing his franchise to be run into the ground. By asking Accorsi”s opinion about a new GM, that was a change in how he had been operating. So far, Gettleman seems to have things pointed in the right direction. You’re entitled to your opinion Terps, I just think it’s overly arrogant.

In comment 14619129 Dnew15 said:

Quote:

Who out there do you think the Giants should be targeting that is the significantly better than Shurmur?... Putting all the blame on Shurmer right now seems a bit harsh.

I guarantee you that there are coordinators and college coaches out there who will be impressing the league in the 2020s. I don’t have the knowledge to spot those men but it damn well is Gettleman’s job and he needs to identify them.

No one is blaming Shurmur for everything. That’s a straw man. He is not incompetent and, in fact, I feel for him because he’s worked very hard to get to this spot in his career and in both HC jobs has been dealt an absolute crap hand. But there are problems after problems after problems on game day. In the end, does anyone believe he will lead the Giants to their next trophy?

Everything else is just noise.

Looking forward to all remaining games. If Jones is real good then eventually GMEN should be able to be damn good. OFC nothing is guaranteed but the QB - if he is darn good- gives HOPE. Barkley and Jones give HOPE.

I've been on - and remain on - the 6-10 won/loss train. Just want to see Jones from week-to-week and hope that he develops into a future stud.

In comment 14619465 cosmicj said:

Quote:

In comment 14619129 Dnew15 said: Quote: Who out there do you think the Giants should be targeting that is the significantly better than Shurmur?... Putting all the blame on Shurmer right now seems a bit harsh. I guarantee you that there are coordinators and college coaches out there who will be impressing the league in the 2020s. I don’t have the knowledge to spot those men but it damn well is Gettleman’s job and he needs to identify them. No one is blaming Shurmur for everything. That’s a straw man. He is not incompetent and, in fact, I feel for him because he’s worked very hard to get to this spot in his career and in both HC jobs has been dealt an absolute crap hand. But there are problems after problems after problems on game day. In the end, does anyone believe he will lead the Giants to their next trophy?

There are people blaming a lot on Shurmur. It's not a straw man at all. It's amazing seeing the posts on this board last week to this week. Not much should have changed, but one loss later everyone goes from talking about playoffs to saying Gettleman and Shurmur aren't fit for their jobs. It truly is amazing.

You have a QB-guru type of head coach with a rookie QB who is developing. I think some patience is warranted to allow Shurmur to do his thing for a couple of years. I want to see what Shurmur does with Jones through the 2022 season. I think you can fairly judge at least Shurmur by then, but prior to that, let them do their jobs without this inane babble.

Why is it far different??

Quote:

Accorsi consulting with the Colts... bw in dc : 10/8/2019 10:10 pm : link : reply is far different than Accorsi "consulting" with the Giants.

Both teams hired the same consultant to drive a search. The only way it is different is to drive yet anther useless reference to "Jints Central".

In comment 14618696 Ira said:

Quote:

What I'm pleased with is that we're finally building a nucleus of talent young players for the future.

PLAYOFFS? PLAYOFFS! WHO SAID ANYTHING ABOUT PLAYOFFS!