Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

MNF: Lions @ Packers.

SFGFNCGiantsFan : 10/14/2019 8:16 pm
Haven't seen much of Detroit this season, but they've been a pleasant surprise. That said, I expect the Pack to come out with a win.
Pages: 1 2 3 <<Prev | Show All |
Falcons and Lions undeniably both lost on the back of very bad calls.  
Zeke's Alibi : 10/14/2019 11:54 pm : link
Good job NFL, how many games can you do next week? 3? 4?
RE: RE: These fucking refs  
santacruzom : 10/15/2019 12:11 am : link
In comment 14629007 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
In comment 14629000 montanagiant said:


Quote:


Twice Detroit got fucked by that LT flopping




These calls are pathetic. The NFL needs to take challenges out and just have a video replay guy who change wrong calls. Those were not penalties.


PFT has a pretty good take on it all.
Pair of pantom calls on Trey Flowers - ( New Window )
RE: RE: RE: These fucking refs  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 10/15/2019 12:24 am : link
In comment 14629050 santacruzom said:
Quote:
In comment 14629007 jvm52106 said:


Quote:


In comment 14629000 montanagiant said:


Quote:


Twice Detroit got fucked by that LT flopping




These calls are pathetic. The NFL needs to take challenges out and just have a video replay guy who change wrong calls. Those were not penalties.



PFT has a pretty good take on it all. Pair of pantom calls on Trey Flowers - ( New Window )


Yeah, but their solution is more instant replay? Right... that will fix the problem! (sarcasm off)
How much longer before you see something like in Easy Money  
ghost718 : 10/15/2019 12:30 am : link
with the jockey in the lead applying a little break.

That ref has got to be reprimanded in front of the  
NYRiese : 10/15/2019 12:32 am : link
video replay and told that his performance hurts the VIEWING pleasure of ALL NFL games and asked for an explanation of his decision.
Then he should be fired right then and there and given a good swift kick in the ass.
F#$&*k NFL refereeing.
that PFT article is a succinct yet perfect description of  
markky : 10/15/2019 1:06 am : link
the situation. it's not just our viewing pleasure that's out the window, this will effect the gambling in which the NFL has a stake.

it's unbelievable that the NFL is letting this happen. I know I end up pissed off weekly during games in which I have no rooting interest. I know this is a solvable problem because i'm rarely aggravated by NCAAF officiating. not once yet this year.
RE: That ref has got to be reprimanded in front of the  
Leg of Theismann : 10/15/2019 5:28 am : link
In comment 14629063 NYRiese said:
Quote:
video replay and told that his performance hurts the VIEWING pleasure of ALL NFL games and asked for an explanation of his decision.
Then he should be fired right then and there and given a good swift kick in the ass.
F#$&*k NFL refereeing.


I donít understand why they arenít instructed to only call what you see, not what you think you see. Are they? If you donít literally see the hand on the face mask, itís not a penalty. Iíd you donít literally see the helmet hit the helmet, itís not helmet to helmet!!! Donít assume a penalty happened be sheís it looks like it based on the playerís movement or reaction. Thatís second hand evidence, and it should be clear visual evidence. Are there not enough penalties called that we canít move to a standard/criteria of that distinct and definitive nature????
Sorry for typos  
Leg of Theismann : 10/15/2019 5:28 am : link
On my phone
Have I got this right?  
M.S. : 10/15/2019 7:07 am : link

NFL Refs 23
Detroit Lions 22
RE: RE: RE: RE: These fucking refs  
Cap'n Bluebeard : 10/15/2019 7:27 am : link
In comment 14629057 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:



Yeah, but their solution is more instant replay? Right... that will fix the problem! (sarcasm off)


I don't think that necessarily has to be the case. If there were an official in a booth in the stadium constantly reviewing on-field action, that would mitigate the stoppages if he could buzz down to the officials (like the way a coach talks to players in their helmet). Think about all the times the officials huddle together to see how they can best screw up the call and how much quicker those conferences could be if there were a dedicated video guy buzzing in and saying "Hands never touched the facemask" or whatever.
College does not have this problem because they have embraced replay  
Zeke's Alibi : 10/15/2019 7:42 am : link
and their refs are younger.

The NFL also needs to fox the grading system. They need to weigh phantom calls much more negatively. This would drastically reduce the number of calls a game.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: These fucking refs  
section125 : 10/15/2019 7:43 am : link
In comment 14629094 Cap'n Bluebeard said:
Quote:
In comment 14629057 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:





Yeah, but their solution is more instant replay? Right... that will fix the problem! (sarcasm off)



I don't think that necessarily has to be the case. If there were an official in a booth in the stadium constantly reviewing on-field action, that would mitigate the stoppages if he could buzz down to the officials (like the way a coach talks to players in their helmet). Think about all the times the officials huddle together to see how they can best screw up the call and how much quicker those conferences could be if there were a dedicated video guy buzzing in and saying "Hands never touched the facemask" or whatever.


NCAA has a video review ref at the game that can stop play for a review..so there is precedent and it is quick and easy. But the Officials will not allow it.
Eric in college the replay system is much tighter, takes about half  
Zeke's Alibi : 10/15/2019 7:43 am : link
the time.
I didnt see it so I looked  
Kevin(formerly Tiki4Six) : 10/15/2019 8:21 am : link
at it on Youtube... Man, these refs need to be replaced. That was 2 disgraceful calls. The LT threw his head back on purpose to make it look like Flowers had his hands on the Neck/Facemask. Booger was right to go off...
The really..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 10/15/2019 8:26 am : link
kick to the nuts is on the second call, the Packers player is actually grabbing Flower's facemask.

It is an absolute travesty
pretty amazing to me  
ryanmkeane : 10/15/2019 8:33 am : link
that the NFL can't figure this out. How can Goodell watch this and think this is good for the game? College Football, for all the terrible flaws that the NCAA brings to the table, the actual game product is fantastic.
RE: Eric in college the replay system is much tighter, takes about half  
ryanmkeane : 10/15/2019 8:34 am : link
In comment 14629100 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
the time.

Agreed, everything "in game" with college is really good, keeps the flow going and minimal replay reviews. If there is something dicey, it almost always gets resolved within a minute or two.
The worst part is  
ryanmkeane : 10/15/2019 8:35 am : link
at the end of the season, that loss will probably end up costing the Lions a playoff shot.
It is..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 10/15/2019 8:37 am : link
a divisional loss which really impacts tie-breakers and it was a Conference loss.

Those calls had as much of a direct impact on the outcome as the calls in the Saints game did, and the Lions will be lucky to get an apology letter for it.
RE: Oh, gee, look.  
Greg from LI : 10/15/2019 8:39 am : link
In comment 14629041 Mr. Bungle said:
Quote:
I don't even watch these games anymore. Years ago, I wouldn't miss a snap, no matter which teams were playing. What a pile of garbage this sport has become.


It's been a long time since I paid much attention to games not involving the Giants.
RE: pretty amazing to me  
bw in dc : 10/15/2019 8:56 am : link
In comment 14629142 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
that the NFL can't figure this out. How can Goodell watch this and think this is good for the game? College Football, for all the terrible flaws that the NCAA brings to the table, the actual game product is fantastic.


I honestly think the NFL loves the controversy. It just adds to the drama and keeps people/media talking about the NFL. The NFL is really just another TV show. A drama. An on going soap opera...

Unless ratings materially change, the NFL will continue to laugh all the way to the bank....
RE: RE: pretty amazing to me  
Mike from Ohio : 10/15/2019 9:45 am : link
In comment 14629190 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14629142 ryanmkeane said:


Quote:


that the NFL can't figure this out. How can Goodell watch this and think this is good for the game? College Football, for all the terrible flaws that the NCAA brings to the table, the actual game product is fantastic.



I honestly think the NFL loves the controversy. It just adds to the drama and keeps people/media talking about the NFL. The NFL is really just another TV show. A drama. An on going soap opera...

Unless ratings materially change, the NFL will continue to laugh all the way to the bank....


There might actually be something to this. It is getting harder and harder to believe that Al Riveron and Roger Goodell are actually this incompetent. Basic incompetence, sure. But this is getting to a level of ridiculousness that seems almost intentional.

Does the league follow the belief that there is no such thing as bad PR? Why did the refs last night seem to revel in calling some of the penalties they called that were so bad?

"Pass interference...DEFENSE!!!! That is a FIRST DOWN!!!"

I am not one for conspiracy theories, but it is getting difficult to explain this away to incompetence by otherwise functional adults.
I hate the nfl refs  
5BowlsSoon : 10/15/2019 9:48 am : link
Just about all are incompetent. Fouls should only be called if obvious and egregious.
Same shit  
NikkiMac : 10/15/2019 10:10 am : link
With Cowboys Jets iirc their wasnít many penalties in that game being called until the last drive when they tried to influence a win by the cowboys
NFL should be looking at that or how about Giants vs Patriots for most of that game they only called penalties on the Giants wtf
What seriously should..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 10/15/2019 10:18 am : link
have been an outcome of the Giants-Pats game is the cancelling of using replay for PI.

When it became brutally apparent that a PI wasn't going to be overturned because it didn't impact the outcome of a game - it should be immediately abandoned, because it is just another example of an inconsistent and arbitrary application of the rules.
RE: What seriously should..  
Zeke's Alibi : 10/15/2019 10:25 am : link
In comment 14629288 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
have been an outcome of the Giants-Pats game is the cancelling of using replay for PI.

When it became brutally apparent that a PI wasn't going to be overturned because it didn't impact the outcome of a game - it should be immediately abandoned, because it is just another example of an inconsistent and arbitrary application of the rules.


This shit show is going to come to a head during the playoffs when they start overturning calls that haven't been all year. Or not overturning PI. They've literally set themselves up for failure. There are going to be angry people on both sides.
I'm going to laugh..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 10/15/2019 10:27 am : link
when this year a playoff game is impacted by a non-call on a blatant facemask, or calling two bullshit hands to the face penalties in a final drive to seal a win.

They don't have a recourse to change those calls. So will next year make even more penalties reviewable??
RE: RE: That ref has got to be reprimanded in front of the  
jhibb : 10/15/2019 10:52 am : link
In comment 14629078 Leg of Theismann said:

Quote:

I donít understand why they arenít instructed to only call what you see, not what you think you see. Are they? If you donít literally see the hand on the face mask, itís not a penalty. Iíd you donít literally see the helmet hit the helmet, itís not helmet to helmet!!! Donít assume a penalty happened be sheís it looks like it based on the playerís movement or reaction. Thatís second hand evidence, and it should be clear visual evidence. Are there not enough penalties called that we canít move to a standard/criteria of that distinct and definitive nature????


I'm no expert on the matter, but I think that is a little too simplistic view of the complicated role your mind plays in what you "see." The human mind is continuously filling in gaps when interpreting the signals coming from the eyes. Because of this, it very well could be that the close proximity of the hand to the face and the movement of the offensive lineman's head (seemingly in response to it) all caused the ref to actually see hands to the face.

To be clear, I'm not trying to excuse the refs. It's possible he consciously thought there must be hands to the face even though he didn't see it. But I think it's also possible that he actually saw hands to the face because his brain filled in the gaps before it even registered as something seen.
Steve Serby -  
section125 : 10/15/2019 10:58 am : link
spot on..
Referees.. - ( New Window )
Replay  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 10/15/2019 11:28 am : link
has made the existing system EVEN MORE corrupt.

It's not a solution. It's part of the problem.
RE: Replay  
Zeke's Alibi : 10/15/2019 11:37 am : link
In comment 14629400 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
has made the existing system EVEN MORE corrupt.

It's not a solution. It's part of the problem.


It's the way they handle replay. The college game has it down to a science with a replay ref dedicated to every game that has final say. The problem is the NFL looks at replay as a way to add a few more commercial breaks and have put the ref on the field in charge who is going to be biased towards the call on the field. Replay is part of the solution, but the implementation has been horrible.
Refs  
Mark in ATL : 10/15/2019 11:49 am : link
It would not surprise me if teams are spending considerable amount of time scouting the refs for their next game. I bet you Belichek does.
RE: RE: Replay  
section125 : 10/15/2019 11:53 am : link
In comment 14629413 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
In comment 14629400 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


has made the existing system EVEN MORE corrupt.

It's not a solution. It's part of the problem.



It's the way they handle replay. The college game has it down to a science with a replay ref dedicated to every game that has final say. The problem is the NFL looks at replay as a way to add a few more commercial breaks and have put the ref on the field in charge who is going to be biased towards the call on the field. Replay is part of the solution, but the implementation has been horrible.


This is 100% correct. The NCAA has it correct. It is quick, it sees mistakes and corrects them - impartially. No on field referee to back his buddies and either see or not see a play that backs the on field call. No NY review to do the same.
The only way to end this is to scrap it and start over even if it means dismissing all the exiting officials who in my opinion are disregarding the rules committee has set down.
I saw both "hands to the face"...  
BillKo : 10/15/2019 11:53 am : link
.....and both were obviously missed.

Having said that, I don't any penalties should be reviewable.

And how PI is handled proves it (although I honestly can't tell how the heck they are approaching evaluating PI upon review).

Also, let's change "unnecessary roughness" to "helmet to helmet" contact just for the sake of vernacular.

Last night, a Lion player was simply trying to intercept a pass and got called for "roughing". There was no intent of roughing.

RE: RE: RE: RE: These fucking refs  
santacruzom : 10/15/2019 12:29 pm : link
In comment 14629057 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:

Yeah, but their solution is more instant replay? Right... that will fix the problem! (sarcasm off)


That's among their proposals, but only because there's no sense in reviewing some things and not others.

But I like the idea they advocate of just having a guy watch every play. In the time it currently takes the on-field refs to deliberate, that guy will have had access to multiple angles and can make a more informed decision.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: These fucking refs  
giants#1 : 10/15/2019 12:32 pm : link
In comment 14629514 santacruzom said:
Quote:
In comment 14629057 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:



Yeah, but their solution is more instant replay? Right... that will fix the problem! (sarcasm off)



That's among their proposals, but only because there's no sense in reviewing some things and not others.

But I like the idea they advocate of just having a guy watch every play. In the time it currently takes the on-field refs to deliberate, that guy will have had access to multiple angles and can make a more informed decision.


As slow as some of the refs are, by the time the BJ jogs in to confer with the other refs, the ref in the sky could review it, take a dump, and still grab some coffee before informing the BJ he needs his prescription checked.
RE: I saw both  
giants#1 : 10/15/2019 12:34 pm : link
In comment 14629438 BillKo said:
Quote:
.....and both were obviously missed.

Having said that, I don't any penalties should be reviewable.

And how PI is handled proves it (although I honestly can't tell how the heck they are approaching evaluating PI upon review).

Also, let's change "unnecessary roughness" to "helmet to helmet" contact just for the sake of vernacular.

Last night, a Lion player was simply trying to intercept a pass and got called for "roughing". There was no intent of roughing.


You can get flagged for "unnecessary roughness" without helmet to helmet contact though. Hitting a runner late out of bounds would be one example. Or simply pushing guys into the pile after the whistle.
RE: RE: I saw both  
section125 : 10/15/2019 12:46 pm : link
In comment 14629521 giants#1 said:
Quote:
In comment 14629438 BillKo said:


Quote:


.....and both were obviously missed.

Having said that, I don't any penalties should be reviewable.

And how PI is handled proves it (although I honestly can't tell how the heck they are approaching evaluating PI upon review).

Also, let's change "unnecessary roughness" to "helmet to helmet" contact just for the sake of vernacular.

Last night, a Lion player was simply trying to intercept a pass and got called for "roughing". There was no intent of roughing.




You can get flagged for "unnecessary roughness" without helmet to helmet contact though. Hitting a runner late out of bounds would be one example. Or simply pushing guys into the pile after the whistle.


If you remember, Landon Collins dove for an interception, I believe caught it(IIRC) and was called for helmet to helmet. What referees continuously make mistakes on is that the defense has as much right to the ball in the air as the offense.
It was clear in the replays that the safety was making a play on the ball. In all fairness why wasn't the WR called?
RE: I'm so over the...  
allstarjim : 10/15/2019 1:02 pm : link
In comment 14629033 bw in dc said:
Quote:
"The referees have a tough job" mantra.

Guess what? Too f-cking bad. Then got people who are younger, more physically fit, better trained, etc to actually call a better game.


That's such a bad take. There are good officials who are older. There are problems with some of the officiating, but their ages aren't one of them.
RE: RE: I'm so over the...  
Zeke's Alibi : 10/15/2019 1:45 pm : link
In comment 14629559 allstarjim said:
Quote:
In comment 14629033 bw in dc said:


Quote:


"The referees have a tough job" mantra.

Guess what? Too f-cking bad. Then got people who are younger, more physically fit, better trained, etc to actually call a better game.



That's such a bad take. There are good officials who are older. There are problems with some of the officiating, but their ages aren't one of them.


Like Walt Coleman. Like it or not aging decreases your ability to process information, there is a ton of scientific evidence of this. Processing the game in real time on the field with these super athletes is much different than from the comfort of your couch. The best referees are in college and are usually in that sweet spot in their 40's, with enough experience, but haven't been significantly affected by cognitive decline yet. Soccer understands this, but I have no idea why football doesn't address the issue.
what are we considering "older"  
giants#1 : 10/15/2019 1:50 pm : link
early 50s is a lot different than early 60s.
I haven't sen a team jobbed like the lions, maybe ever.  
since1925 : 10/15/2019 1:50 pm : link
The first phantom HTF penalty kept a drive alive and the Packers scored a TD.

The second one robbed the Lions of any chance for a comeback.

The league should apologize and the ref should be suspended.
PFT had another good point  
santacruzom : 10/15/2019 2:11 pm : link
When the league has officiating issues like this AND does not appear to be overly concerned about addressing or even acknowledging them, it provides fertile ground for the growth of conspiracy theories.
RE: RE: RE: I saw both  
BillKo : 10/15/2019 2:20 pm : link
In comment 14629543 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 14629521 giants#1 said:


Quote:


In comment 14629438 BillKo said:


Quote:


.....and both were obviously missed.

Having said that, I don't any penalties should be reviewable.

And how PI is handled proves it (although I honestly can't tell how the heck they are approaching evaluating PI upon review).

Also, let's change "unnecessary roughness" to "helmet to helmet" contact just for the sake of vernacular.

Last night, a Lion player was simply trying to intercept a pass and got called for "roughing". There was no intent of roughing.




You can get flagged for "unnecessary roughness" without helmet to helmet contact though. Hitting a runner late out of bounds would be one example. Or simply pushing guys into the pile after the whistle.



If you remember, Landon Collins dove for an interception, I believe caught it(IIRC) and was called for helmet to helmet. What referees continuously make mistakes on is that the defense has as much right to the ball in the air as the offense.
It was clear in the replays that the safety was making a play on the ball. In all fairness why wasn't the WR called?


Remember it well, versus the Panthers last year.
RE: RE: I saw both  
BillKo : 10/15/2019 2:22 pm : link
In comment 14629521 giants#1 said:
Quote:
In comment 14629438 BillKo said:


Quote:


.....and both were obviously missed.

Having said that, I don't any penalties should be reviewable.

And how PI is handled proves it (although I honestly can't tell how the heck they are approaching evaluating PI upon review).

Also, let's change "unnecessary roughness" to "helmet to helmet" contact just for the sake of vernacular.

Last night, a Lion player was simply trying to intercept a pass and got called for "roughing". There was no intent of roughing.




You can get flagged for "unnecessary roughness" without helmet to helmet contact though. Hitting a runner late out of bounds would be one example. Or simply pushing guys into the pile after the whistle.


Definitely. But my point is, when helmet to helmet occurs, call it that. Regardless if it's unnecessary or simply by mistake (as was the case last night).

Just sorta makes it easier to grasp, and also when you call it that way, it's more in tune what the call really is. Regardless of intent, helmet to helmet is an actual penalty.
RE: RE: I'm so over the...  
bw in dc : 10/15/2019 3:07 pm : link
In comment 14629559 allstarjim said:
Quote:
In comment 14629033 bw in dc said:


Quote:


"The referees have a tough job" mantra.

Guess what? Too f-cking bad. Then got people who are younger, more physically fit, better trained, etc to actually call a better game.



That's such a bad take. There are good officials who are older. There are problems with some of the officiating, but their ages aren't one of them.



Are you sure? I'm seeing some very old men out there who don't move very well in a game that is being played by bigger, faster, quicker, stronger athletes. And many of the referees aren't going to be doing Orange Therapy commercials any time soon...

Harsh? I guess. But in a game that moves as fast as the NFL it seems logical to want it judged by people who are capable of moving adequately to properly judge the game...
I don't know why more..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 10/15/2019 3:34 pm : link
attention wasn't given to the Collins flag. He was called for that flag on a play where he intercepted it.

Think about that. He dove to catch a ball and he was flagged for a penalty for a hit on a defenseless receiver.

He was the first player to touch the ball too.
RE: RE: RE: I'm so over the...  
Big Blue '56 : 10/15/2019 3:52 pm : link
In comment 14629703 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14629559 allstarjim said:


Quote:


In comment 14629033 bw in dc said:


Quote:


"The referees have a tough job" mantra.

Guess what? Too f-cking bad. Then got people who are younger, more physically fit, better trained, etc to actually call a better game.



That's such a bad take. There are good officials who are older. There are problems with some of the officiating, but their ages aren't one of them.




Are you sure? I'm seeing some very old men out there who don't move very well in a game that is being played by bigger, faster, quicker, stronger athletes. And many of the referees aren't going to be doing Orange Therapy commercials any time soon...

Harsh? I guess. But in a game that moves as fast as the NFL it seems logical to want it judged by people who are capable of moving adequately to properly judge the game...


Orange Theory
RE: I don't know why more..  
BillKo : 10/15/2019 4:07 pm : link
In comment 14629727 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
attention wasn't given to the Collins flag. He was called for that flag on a play where he intercepted it.

Think about that. He dove to catch a ball and he was flagged for a penalty for a hit on a defenseless receiver.

He was the first player to touch the ball too.


We simply were destined to lose that game.

Icing on the cake: In Philly, they cut away right before the kick to go to Eagles/Vikings.

Took me about 2 minutes to find coverage of what exactly happened..............the pain!!!!
RE: I don't know why more..  
section125 : 10/15/2019 7:28 pm : link
In comment 14629727 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
attention wasn't given to the Collins flag. He was called for that flag on a play where he intercepted it.

Think about that. He dove to catch a ball and he was flagged for a penalty for a hit on a defenseless receiver.

He was the first player to touch the ball too.


When I brought that up I thought it was the Eagles that that happened. I don't get this calling defensive players for penalties when the receivers were technically as guilty if either one was guilty...
Pages: 1 2 3 <<Prev | Show All |
Back to the Corner