We are one game out in the division. We are obviously not winning the Super Bowl this year, but if this division wants to allow us to back into a 9-7 division title while we're still a year away from truly competing, I'll take it.
RE: It's regrettable that our GM didn't understand this fact Â
Eli Apple was on a rookie contract with two years left including option.
A total joke that we didn't get more than a 4th for Apple.
Wait, you think someone would've given up more for Apple? Based on what? Do you have a comparable trade you can point to where some other GM got substantially more for a comparable player?
No, and to think that Giants would at this point Â
is nuts. I don't know why people are so willing to throw away this season already, they only lost 4 games, and the last two were to really good teams, when they were clearly not at their strongest.
May be a little optimistic, but even as an organization, only having played 2 division games, none against the Eagles, and we are going to make them stronger, all for a lousy low end third round pick?
I disagree. IIRC, Snacks had the same 1.5 years remaining on his deal at roughly the same amount of cap cost to the acquiring team (I think Jenkins is $1.5-2M more). But DTs are valued far less than CBs, particularly a DT that only plays 50% of the D snaps.
Apple is a mediocre number 2 corner, getting a 4th for him was a good Â
Fuck helping the Eagles. We're 1 game out. Win some football games and stay in this race. I'm tired of relegating every year to losing. Go out and win.
in the secondary. even if jenkins isn't the ideal mentor type, you can't just have all first-year players back there. beal might see his first game action in two years and now people want to unload our only good veteran corner for a 3rd- and to the eagles? give me a break.
Jenkins is not part of the rebuild. He will have to be replaced either next season or the following season so getting a 3rd could be a good value even if it is the eagles.
We have Beal coming back and Ballentine showed some promise in preseason so I would like to see what we have. Yes we are 1 game out but realistically we are behind 12 teams for 6 playoff spots. Our chances are not great from an NFC wildcard standpoint and we are 3rd in a division behind 2 teams that have better rosters.
You trade players when they are not in the future plan and this would be a prime example of a guy that has been a good Giant but no longer part of the solution. Our season will not be won or lost because we traded away Jenkins but we may be able to get a better idea of what we have in Beal an Ballentine to see if they really are potential starters in this league.
RE: RE: It's regrettable that our GM didn't understand this fact Â
Eli Apple was on a rookie contract with two years left including option.
A total joke that we didn't get more than a 4th for Apple.
Wait, you think someone would've given up more for Apple? Based on what? Do you have a comparable trade you can point to where some other GM got substantially more for a comparable player?
There are no comparable trades because no other GM's don't give up on 10th overall draft picks who's shown promise with 3 years left on their rookie deals. Ca you show me any GM that has made such a trade?
I disagree. IIRC, Snacks had the same 1.5 years remaining on his deal at roughly the same amount of cap cost to the acquiring team (I think Jenkins is $1.5-2M more). But DTs are valued far less than CBs, particularly a DT that only plays 50% of the D snaps.
I hear what you are saying...but I'm factoring in Snacks being very very good at what he does (or did) a run stopping 2 down DT, and Jackrabbit aint exactly lighting the world on fire in the secondary. I'd argue he's in the bottom half of corners right now. He's not a shutdown corner.
Gun to my head I bet we hang on to him, if we lose the next 2... all bets are off.
RE: RE: RE: It's regrettable that our GM didn't understand this fact Â
Eli Apple was on a rookie contract with two years left including option.
A total joke that we didn't get more than a 4th for Apple.
Wait, you think someone would've given up more for Apple? Based on what? Do you have a comparable trade you can point to where some other GM got substantially more for a comparable player?
There are no comparable trades because no other GM's don't give up on 10th overall draft picks who's shown promise with 3 years left on their rookie deals. Ca you show me any GM that has made such a trade?
Well the Rams traded Greg Robinson (2nd overall) for a 6th round pick. He had 1 full year + option remaining.
The Browns traded Corey Coleman (15th overall) after 2 seasons for a 7th round pick (in the subsequent draft).
Justin Gilbert (8th overall) was traded after just one season for a future 6th round pick.
Eli Apple was a promising corner? He is exactly as advertised at OSU Â
That said, I think it is a fair possibility it could happen. Howie listens to the fan base (sometimes to his detriment), and they are clamoring for CB help. If they can't/don't get Jalen Ramsey ( think 2 firsts was the unofficial asking price ), they won't care about a theoretically low second rounder.
I know this team is rebuilding but what kind of message does that send to basically sell to a division opponent that we are only 1 game behind 6 weeks in?
Fuck that. Let's stop this mentality and win some football games.
I know this team is rebuilding but what kind of message does that send to basically sell to a division opponent that we are only 1 game behind 6 weeks in?
Fuck that. Let's stop this mentality and win some football games.
we are not ready to compete yet. Trade JJ for what you can get and don't look back.
I want to say this as well ... BUT you want to keep morale up and a vet CB is not a bad move ... his contract is still cheap he has 1 or 2 yrs left...his early issues was mental not physical
We are 3 years away from being a serious team which needs to be built through the Draft.
No team is 3 years away in the NFL. Especially with a young QB on a rookie deal. The Giants should be operating as if they're a year away tops. The idea of being 3 years away is an excuse people put in their heads to justify losing football. The NFL doesn't work this way anymore.
We are 3 years away from being a serious team which needs to be built through the Draft.
No team is 3 years away in the NFL. Especially with a young QB on a rookie deal. The Giants should be operating as if they're a year away tops. The idea of being 3 years away is an excuse people put in their heads to justify losing football. The NFL doesn't work this way anymore.
And further to this, this is why it drives me nuts about the idea of keeping Shurmur around next season even if we lose double digit games again this year. It would be wasting a year.
Look at what the Ravens did last year as an example. They entered the season with a fading vet QB in Flacco and a rookie QB in Jackson. In week 9 they lost to the Steelers (in Baltimore) to drop to 4-5. The Steelers improved to 5-2-1.
So to summarize, the Ravens entered their week 10 bye coming off a home loss that pushed a division rival to 2.5 games ahead of them in the loss column. That is a far worse situation than the one in which the Giants find themselves now. Baltimore went on to win the division with a 10-6 record to Pittsburgh's 9-6-1.
The Giants are very much in the race, and should act accordingly. And if they falter to a 6 win season, people should be held accountable starting with the GM and head coach.
Would I offer a hated division rival intimate details about... Â
I know this team is rebuilding but what kind of message does that send to basically sell to a division opponent that we are only 1 game behind 6 weeks in?
Fuck that. Let's stop this mentality and win some football games.
YES!
We are one game out of first. This kind of talk is disheartening. I am not saying we are good, but lets give it a chance fellas.
I know this team is rebuilding but what kind of message does that send to basically sell to a division opponent that we are only 1 game behind 6 weeks in?
Fuck that. Let's stop this mentality and win some football games.
Thank you..JFC!
What a difference a game makes .! After watching the hapless
Jets beat the almighty Cowboys and The Eagles getting
smoked by Minnesota the Bye week was a welcome Jones can
shake the two losses where I am sure he learned a bit more
and a chance to heal up and get some weapons back
Lets see if we can win a few more and stay in this
thing seen enough losing .Lets be ready for the Cards and
get back on track .!
We are 3 years away from being a serious team which needs to be built through the Draft.
No team is 3 years away in the NFL. Especially with a young QB on a rookie deal. The Giants should be operating as if they're a year away tops. The idea of being 3 years away is an excuse people put in their heads to justify losing football. The NFL doesn't work this way anymore.
The biggest factor is are you going to pay Jenkins 15M again next year to be an average corner. If not, getting some comp vs. just cutting him is the right answer.
The biggest factor is are you going to pay Jenkins 15M again next year to be an average corner. If not, getting some comp vs. just cutting him is the right answer.
I doubt Jenkins is here next year. They save $11.5 mill letting him go. They eat $3.5 in dead cap for the bonus paid out.
For what he has done this year, they either play one of the young guys or get a vet to play there for a lot less.
Yes, I would trade him, but seeing the Cowboys and Eagles are playing poorly, I doubt they do.
Don't know if a draft pick is the priority but if you've drafted Beal,Ballentine & Love &,as of yet,they've seen no defensive snaps-what gets them on the field? And,if we are a year away as most say,with all the kids we've drafted needing experience then how do they get that experience w/o getting defensive snaps? Sure,I'd like to sneak in & possibly win the conference at 9-7,but that would mean going 7-3 the rest of the way,best case scenario! So,it boils down to short term vs long term goals this season. I don't know which is best,but I do know we have to play these kids going forward!
Not only do we add another draft asset next year (most likely 3 3rds next year if you assume we get a 3rd for Collins compensatory pick). We also need to see if Sam Beal and Corey Ballentine can play. If they can play we don’t have to pump money into corner next year in FA. We can focus on FS and linebackers (inside and outside). If Beal proves he can’t stay healthy and ballentine looks overwhelmed
We probably need to sign a starter corner alongside barker.
If not we probably can get away with a barker, Beal, ballentine, love corner group next year with maybe one vet.
Not only do I want the draft asset I want to free up minutes for the young guys to get snaps over the 2nd half of the year.
A total joke that we didn't get more than a 4th for Apple.
We are one game out in the division. We are obviously not winning the Super Bowl this year, but if this division wants to allow us to back into a 9-7 division title while we're still a year away from truly competing, I'll take it.
Quote:
Eli Apple was on a rookie contract with two years left including option.
A total joke that we didn't get more than a 4th for Apple.
Wait, you think someone would've given up more for Apple? Based on what? Do you have a comparable trade you can point to where some other GM got substantially more for a comparable player?
May be a little optimistic, but even as an organization, only having played 2 division games, none against the Eagles, and we are going to make them stronger, all for a lousy low end third round pick?
Forget it.
That is worth it, thought I hate more and more dead money into 2020.
I disagree. IIRC, Snacks had the same 1.5 years remaining on his deal at roughly the same amount of cap cost to the acquiring team (I think Jenkins is $1.5-2M more). But DTs are valued far less than CBs, particularly a DT that only plays 50% of the D snaps.
We have Beal coming back and Ballentine showed some promise in preseason so I would like to see what we have. Yes we are 1 game out but realistically we are behind 12 teams for 6 playoff spots. Our chances are not great from an NFC wildcard standpoint and we are 3rd in a division behind 2 teams that have better rosters.
You trade players when they are not in the future plan and this would be a prime example of a guy that has been a good Giant but no longer part of the solution. Our season will not be won or lost because we traded away Jenkins but we may be able to get a better idea of what we have in Beal an Ballentine to see if they really are potential starters in this league.
Quote:
Quote:
Eli Apple was on a rookie contract with two years left including option.
A total joke that we didn't get more than a 4th for Apple.
Wait, you think someone would've given up more for Apple? Based on what? Do you have a comparable trade you can point to where some other GM got substantially more for a comparable player?
There are no comparable trades because no other GM's don't give up on 10th overall draft picks who's shown promise with 3 years left on their rookie deals. Ca you show me any GM that has made such a trade?
It is incredible how comfortable we've become with losing.
Might be worth a phone call.
Quote:
5th, if that
I disagree. IIRC, Snacks had the same 1.5 years remaining on his deal at roughly the same amount of cap cost to the acquiring team (I think Jenkins is $1.5-2M more). But DTs are valued far less than CBs, particularly a DT that only plays 50% of the D snaps.
I hear what you are saying...but I'm factoring in Snacks being very very good at what he does (or did) a run stopping 2 down DT, and Jackrabbit aint exactly lighting the world on fire in the secondary. I'd argue he's in the bottom half of corners right now. He's not a shutdown corner.
Gun to my head I bet we hang on to him, if we lose the next 2... all bets are off.
Quote:
In comment 14629489 Tesla said:
Quote:
Quote:
Eli Apple was on a rookie contract with two years left including option.
A total joke that we didn't get more than a 4th for Apple.
Wait, you think someone would've given up more for Apple? Based on what? Do you have a comparable trade you can point to where some other GM got substantially more for a comparable player?
There are no comparable trades because no other GM's don't give up on 10th overall draft picks who's shown promise with 3 years left on their rookie deals. Ca you show me any GM that has made such a trade?
Well the Rams traded Greg Robinson (2nd overall) for a 6th round pick. He had 1 full year + option remaining.
The Browns traded Corey Coleman (15th overall) after 2 seasons for a 7th round pick (in the subsequent draft).
Justin Gilbert (8th overall) was traded after just one season for a future 6th round pick.
Fuck that. Let's stop this mentality and win some football games.
Thank you..JFC!
Fuck that. Let's stop this mentality and win some football games.
A-fucking-men.
I want to say this as well ... BUT you want to keep morale up and a vet CB is not a bad move ... his contract is still cheap he has 1 or 2 yrs left...his early issues was mental not physical
It is incredible how comfortable we've become with losing.
Exactly. People act like the Giants are 4 games back and winless. Loser mentality around here.
Bye-bye Jackrabbit.
Why?
We are 3 years away from being a serious team which needs to be built through the Draft.
While I don't think we will win the division, we are still in this thing.
Bye-bye Jackrabbit.
Why?
We are 3 years away from being a serious team which needs to be built through the Draft.
No team is 3 years away in the NFL. Especially with a young QB on a rookie deal. The Giants should be operating as if they're a year away tops. The idea of being 3 years away is an excuse people put in their heads to justify losing football. The NFL doesn't work this way anymore.
Quote:
Bye-bye Jackrabbit.
Why?
We are 3 years away from being a serious team which needs to be built through the Draft.
No team is 3 years away in the NFL. Especially with a young QB on a rookie deal. The Giants should be operating as if they're a year away tops. The idea of being 3 years away is an excuse people put in their heads to justify losing football. The NFL doesn't work this way anymore.
And further to this, this is why it drives me nuts about the idea of keeping Shurmur around next season even if we lose double digit games again this year. It would be wasting a year.
So to summarize, the Ravens entered their week 10 bye coming off a home loss that pushed a division rival to 2.5 games ahead of them in the loss column. That is a far worse situation than the one in which the Giants find themselves now. Baltimore went on to win the division with a 10-6 record to Pittsburgh's 9-6-1.
The Giants are very much in the race, and should act accordingly. And if they falter to a 6 win season, people should be held accountable starting with the GM and head coach.
Hell no.
Fuck that. Let's stop this mentality and win some football games.
YES!
We are one game out of first. This kind of talk is disheartening. I am not saying we are good, but lets give it a chance fellas.
Uh, who cares about saving the second half of his salary?
Quote:
I know this team is rebuilding but what kind of message does that send to basically sell to a division opponent that we are only 1 game behind 6 weeks in?
Fuck that. Let's stop this mentality and win some football games.
Thank you..JFC!
What a difference a game makes .! After watching the hapless
Jets beat the almighty Cowboys and The Eagles getting
smoked by Minnesota the Bye week was a welcome Jones can
shake the two losses where I am sure he learned a bit more
and a chance to heal up and get some weapons back
Lets see if we can win a few more and stay in this
thing seen enough losing .Lets be ready for the Cards and
get back on track .!
But draft picks!!!
Quote:
Bye-bye Jackrabbit.
Why?
We are 3 years away from being a serious team which needs to be built through the Draft.
No team is 3 years away in the NFL. Especially with a young QB on a rookie deal. The Giants should be operating as if they're a year away tops. The idea of being 3 years away is an excuse people put in their heads to justify losing football. The NFL doesn't work this way anymore.
Giants 2013-2019 (six-plus years) 40-62 (.392 winning percentage)
I doubt Jenkins is here next year. They save $11.5 mill letting him go. They eat $3.5 in dead cap for the bonus paid out.
For what he has done this year, they either play one of the young guys or get a vet to play there for a lot less.
Yes, I would trade him, but seeing the Cowboys and Eagles are playing poorly, I doubt they do.
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with trading away players is getting silly.
But draft picks!!!
Don't know if a draft pick is the priority but if you've drafted Beal,Ballentine & Love &,as of yet,they've seen no defensive snaps-what gets them on the field? And,if we are a year away as most say,with all the kids we've drafted needing experience then how do they get that experience w/o getting defensive snaps? Sure,I'd like to sneak in & possibly win the conference at 9-7,but that would mean going 7-3 the rest of the way,best case scenario! So,it boils down to short term vs long term goals this season. I don't know which is best,but I do know we have to play these kids going forward!
We probably need to sign a starter corner alongside barker.
If not we probably can get away with a barker, Beal, ballentine, love corner group next year with maybe one vet.
Not only do I want the draft asset I want to free up minutes for the young guys to get snaps over the 2nd half of the year.
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with trading away players is getting silly.
But draft picks!!!
Who needs middle round draft picks!!! I don’t know it’s only how the pats has supplemented there dynasty over the past 15 years.