Let's say we finish 4-12, 5-11. Right now, that's probably realistic considering we still got the Jets, Fins, & Skins. And, for argument's sake, let's say we spring an upset over the Bears to get that 5th.
So that's back to back 5-11 seasons. Sadly, the owner can't be fired so Johnny Boy is going nowhere. Gettleman...eh. He's done some good things, but his signings have been atrocious & the thought of him with tons of $ to spend this offseason gives me a great deal of pause. I think we all agree that Shurmur is a complete boob who should be given a one way ticket out of town.
But what I totally expect to happen is that Bettcher, who completely sucks, to be given the axe & other minor staff changes, but that DG & Shurmur to be given another year. Now, knowing that they're on their last leash, they make completely near sighted moves that'll come to bite us in the ass a year or two down the road.
What I guess I'm trying to say is that Go Terps was right: we gotta clean house, lest these characters even put us further in the hole trying to save their own asses.
But I don't expect that. Again, I'll be shocked if Shurmur isn't our HC next September. And I'll be shocked if we're not in the same position come Election Day 2020. I asked this ? in the game thread last night & I still don't have a good answer: How is this team any better on 11/5/19 than it was on 11/5/18? Is it even worse?
Good times all around.
They will spend $100M and try to make a run.
I hope i'm wrong.
Jets, Redskins and Dolphins? That's all I got.
"nobody is angrier than me", "nobody is more frustrated than me", "next year we need to see progress" and his personal favorite...."everyone is on notice"
He'll say this over and over in a press conference, then he'll say it in one on one print interviews, then he'll say it on radio interviews, then you won't see or hear from him again.
Jets, Dolphins, Redskins is the path to 5. Woo hoo!
Very bad news.
They will take the easy road and middle of the road.
Shurmur- put down the play callng and be a HC. Hire an OC or Shula makes the calls. I prefer none of the above but its what I think is realistic
betther- gone. Scapegoat or bad coach. Whatever . If smart, Giants bring in a DC that can take over and they want to be a HC if Shurmur doesn't win in 2020
Its the easy middle of the road don't admit your mistake approach
BBI will go through the motions again next season.
They will spend $100M and try to make a run.
Where are they finding $100M? How much dead money will they take on to claw an additional $40M in cap space?
Shula, goes and a new OC comes in (possibly to call plays) and some other assistants also gone.
McGaughey stays
Shurmur stays
Gettleman stays
Solder is cut and replaced as is Ogletree, Jenkins still on the team
HC gets fired next off season
gettleman "retires" in three years and Abrams takes over
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is this team going to win five games?
Jets, Redskins and Dolphins? That's all I got.
I guess I can take up the XFL......
I don't either. I think we'll be lucky to win two more games, and there is the real possibility we may not win any.
probably a few position coach changes
Very likely: the meddlesome Maras continue screwing up the team no matter what happens on the surface.
I stand by that.
And if he isn't?
Don't bother tuning into the 2020 Season.
I agree. I can't fathom Pat Shurmur being given a third season here. He's that bad.
There's ZERO sense bringing him back, and starting off horrid again and firing him mid-season in 2020, or worse, waiting for the 2020 season to end.
Do it now. Get a guy in here who buys into Jones/Barkley and has a vision going forward with DG.
Shurmur is way too passive. We. Need. Energy.
they have to be thinking about it at this point.
I can't underline enough that Gettleman is as much of a problem as Shurmur.
Gettleman isn't going anywhere.
I can't underline enough that Gettleman is as much of a problem as Shurmur.
I don't know.....DG isn't calling those red zone sequences......
I can't underline enough that Gettleman is as much of a problem as Shurmur.
I have to be honest, I have been somewhat of a Gettleman (for lack of a better word) supporter this year due to the last 2 drafts. A thread was started I think last night comparing the Giants roster to the Cowboys. Jesus Christ has he done a terrible overall job.
With games against the Jets, Dolphins & Skins. This team may finish 3-4 and go 5-11 & we’ll hear “arrow is pointing up” - this is my biggest fear. Before you say there are no more wins on the schedule, it happened last year.
Sadly.
Betcher is not a big enough scale goat for the last two seadons
I also think Betcher is gone this year as scapegoat excuse phase 1. But its def WAY too late to change the entire defensive scheme back to a 4-3. So much useless time and assets wasted on 3-4 D-Lineman the past two years its scary.
HC gets fired next off season
gettleman "retires" in three years and Abrams takes over
Maggie Gray on the radio today called the rebuild a shell game, and she couldn't be more right. Unfortunately, I see exactly what you're predicting as happening, and the win totals will stay right where they are.
The DC will be the scapegoat, he is gone, which solves nothing in that this is not a tem fighting hard that is blowing leads late. This is a garbage team that can not bang for four quarters. Endless mental error, can't run the ball, can't stop the run, pace the league in big plays given up, poor offensive efficiency, turnover prone just a sorry group that is firmly planted on the ass end of the NFL.
To me this falls on the head man. He is not the guy. He lost with Cleveland and is losing now. People are watching this team and see improvement?
He will be back in my mind unless the team loses out. They should promote the special teams coach.
Gettleman and Shurmer haven't earned the right to be back if the team is, in all liklihood, worse at the conclusion of 2019 as it was when they walked through the door.
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I don't think we will win all three of those games.
I don't either. I think we'll be lucky to win two more games, and there is the real possibility we may not win any.
IMO if they lose all 3 vs the Jets, Phins and Skins, then Shurmur will be out.
Mara needs to decide if DG goes this year, or gives him a vote of confidence that allows DG to make decisions long term. But I think what Mara will actually do is his usual “this is unacceptable” but then do nothing other than for e a coordinator out. That will lead to more bandaid signings and a longer string of losing seasons.
I think that's probably what it takes. Maybe even losing 2 of those. Short of that, some assistants get let go but the current regime stays largely intact.
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DC gets fired this offseason
HC gets fired next off season
gettleman "retires" in three years and Abrams takes over
Maggie Gray on the radio today called the rebuild a shell game, and she couldn't be more right. Unfortunately, I see exactly what you're predicting as happening, and the win totals will stay right where they are.
And when you have highly-respected posters on this board saying they think the rebuild is actually going to take more like "4 or 5 years" then you know there is a literal shell game going on and we're all fooled by it. You can't take 4 or 5 years to rebuild in the NFL because by then your original rookie crop is already coming due for contracts/free-agency and you're experiencing turnover. You need to get good and stay good about 2-3 years into a rebuild otherwise your toast and your team is just a revolving door of JAGs, has-beens, and clowns.
HC gets fired next off season
gettleman "retires" in three years and Abrams takes over
The day Abrams takes over as GM is the day I'm done with this team for good. He can't even manage to negotiate a contract without the same boilerplate guarantees for a scrub like Tanney that top contact like Eli's gets. He fucking sucks - I'm tired of tiptoeing around it.
Like an unproven OC and a retread DC who had already set the NFL record for the worst defense of all time?
Yeah, I think we can manage to brace ourselves for that outcome.
I agree with this. Maybe the Oline coach too. Everyone else stays. Remember when a lot of people on BBI were afraid Bettcher would only be here a year then get gobbled up by some team to be their head coach. We should be so lucky.
I've been wondering about this too. Don't they own 50%? It's not a majority, and Mara may have some kind of agreement that he'll stay involved, but business is business. Leave aside short term financial matters - long-term it can't help the value of the franchise to suck every year. If I were a 50% owner I'd want the other guy to get out of the way.
History does not suggest this.
2. Kevin Abrams is promoted to GM.
3. Pat Shurmur is fired and replaced with Matt Rhule. Rhule will be comfortable with the structure as he’s been in the building before & will get a chance to build a program.
I also think (or maybe hope) the Maras have recognized the error of their ways changing assistants with Coughlin and thinking that would solve structural issues with the organization. Yes it worked when they made him can Hufnagl/Tim Lewis, but that's because Coughlin was more than salvageable - he had a track record of winning elsewhere and had some success in his first few years here. Shurmur appears unsalvageable and has no track record of success as a head coach anywhere.
They need a coach who is a leader and knows how to win who can change the culture. When they moved on from Coughlin, Reese was not that guy and he couldn't find that guy. Mcadoo was not that guy. And Gettleman failed in his hiring of Shurmur who looks just as bad as the rest. There aren't many of those guys out there but they desperately need to find one.
I hope not and I'm inclined to agree, but that's what the majority of the predictions are on this thread. I think this group either goes on a miracle run and finishes on a big win streak or they are gone. So in other words I think they are gone (the coaching staff not DG).
Stability is what this franchise is comfortable with and wants. I think they shuffle coordinators or make him give up playcalling.
Stability is what this franchise is comfortable with and wants. I think they shuffle coordinators or make him give up playcalling.
Not rush to judgments? Say that to Dan Reeves & Ben McAdoo. I don’t get that narrative. Fassel was promptly fired after his first bad year.
Shurmur is 7-18 here. I highly doubt he gets another year. He’s awful.
Rinse, wash, repeat. Yadda yadda yadda
If Jones is on his back, throws interceptions, fumbles the ball away, and Barkley gets stoned the whole game.
God forbid if we have a serious injury to one of our "foundational players".
And after the game the press conference is riddled with "we were in the right position, we just have to execute better, make a play, make a tackle, etc."
I think its possible that Shurmur buys time by giving up playcalling.
He was hired with the mindset that he is a QB whisperer. He failed with Eli. DJ has the tools, but Shurmur bears the responsibility to gameplan and harness it. Not answer the question with "hey I',m trying to feature Barkley What else do you want me to do. They have to block and he has to run. Shrug."
End of season Shurmur is fired due to no offensive progress with DJ, in fact maybe even setting him back.
GM doesn't hire the coach. Mara has seen enough.
Eric: please give me specific examples of situations where the Giants did NOT fire a coach who was this bad in recent history? I’m curious because you are stating that with such conviction,
And he'll look at this year as mulligan#2 for Shurmur because (1) Eli fell over the cliff, (2)Jones started the majority of the games as a rookie, (3) injuries to Barkley, Engram, and Shepherd, (4) Tate's suspension, and (5) the D was laden with inexperience and youth. Which will benefit Bettcher. And I think Bettcher got a quasi-vote of confidence with the LW trade because he'll be a vital piece in the 3-4.
Finally, Gettleman is endowed with certain "Giants Way" rights, and that allows for a minimum tenure of at least five years.
So the circular error will continue into 2020...
If they lose to the Jets, Bettcher is toast right away. He's likely gone at the end of the season barring a dramatic/miraculous improvement on defense. They need a new voice on D, they aren't listening or getting it with this guy. He's in over his head.
I am not sure - I don't even think this Jets game means a lot to them as to if Shurmur loses he is on the hot seat.
Unfortunately, we are in a cycle of mediocrity where we are few years away.
Remember 2007 and 2011, before we went on those runs we were much better than we are now but still complained about mediocrity. I think 2007 was the "Skittish" remark and 2011 was when Steve Young called us a "middling team".
I think ownership gives this crew (with a new DC) another year.
I don't necessarily like it but that's what I'd expect.