for display only
Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

Remind me why we traded a Day 2 pick for an impending FA

Anakim : 11/10/2019 4:29 pm
Leonard Williams is a fine player. I still think he has potential to be a very good player in this league, but why the fuck would you trade a Day 2 pick WHEN YOU'RE NOT EVEN SNIFFING THE PLAYOFFS? Couple that with the fact that he's going to want big bucks in the offseason...

I don't mean to beat a dead horse, but how the hell could ownership sign off on this? It's malpractice. Even if you don't believe in building through the draft, how could you draft ANYTHING, let alone a Day 2 pick, for an impending free agent IN A WASTED SEASON?



Clean the house. Get rid of the coaching staff and front office. Mismanagement all around.
Pages: 1 2 | Show All |  Next>>
How about we wait and see if we sign him before judging the trade  
steve in ky : 11/10/2019 4:32 pm : link
.
Because theyre going to sign him  
Giants in 07 : 11/10/2019 4:33 pm : link
.
RE: How about we wait and see if we sign him before judging the trade  
Anakim : 11/10/2019 4:33 pm : link
In comment 14672676 steve in ky said:
Quote:
.


I don't care if he balls out for the rest of the season. This team is going nowhere and they NEED draft capital, especially Day 2 picks.


Why couldn't we sign him in free agency? You think whichever team traded for him would franchise him? Williams was sure to hit the open market.
Amen brother.  
WalterSobchak : 11/10/2019 4:34 pm : link
This trade baffeled me . Another in the long line of terrible Ghettoman moves. I think our GMs only good move was shipping Beckham out.
No this team needs 25 year old talent while we have our QB on rookie  
Zeke's Alibi : 11/10/2019 4:35 pm : link
deal, but keep crying.
RE: RE: How about we wait and see if we sign him before judging the trade  
steve in ky : 11/10/2019 4:36 pm : link
In comment 14672689 Anakim said:
Quote:
In comment 14672676 steve in ky said:


Quote:


.



I don't care if he balls out for the rest of the season. This team is going nowhere and they NEED draft capital, especially Day 2 picks.


Why couldn't we sign him in free agency? You think whichever team traded for him would franchise him? Williams was sure to hit the open market.


Surely you are smart enough to understand a team that trades for him likely has an inside track at signing him long term.
RE: Because theyre going to sign him  
Stan in LA : 11/10/2019 4:36 pm : link
In comment 14672687 Giants in 07 said:
Quote:
.

AND he won't count against FA signings for comp. picks now.
if we sign him in FA  
SuperGiantMan : 11/10/2019 4:36 pm : link
We lose a compensatory 3rd round pick, which is exactly what we gave up to get him. I'm not at all sure whether this pick would be higher or lower that our own natural 3rd, but the price is about the same. If we sign him, it's kind of a wash and we get to see him in action. If we DON'T sign him, it's one of the most eggregiously terrible trades I've ever seen and I think it's an immediately fireable offense.
Yes better  
XBRONX : 11/10/2019 4:37 pm : link
to draft a shot in the dark.
Why couldnt they sign him as a free agent?  
arniefez : 11/10/2019 4:37 pm : link
Why did they give up a top 75 pick for him. Think about how stupid your GM needs to be to be fleeced by the Jets. You think Williams is going to sign with the Giants at some kind of a discount after these next 6 games?
Anyone trying to defend the move is blind...  
mphbullet36 : 11/10/2019 4:38 pm : link
This isnt the giants regime that gets the benefit of the doubt this is one of the worst trades of all time considering he is a FA and they gave up a premium pick that will be in the top 5 for the right to pay a mediocre player that we dont even need. Against the worst offensive line in the league where was he today?

We are going to pay him big money of where he was drafted not his worthy play.
RE: RE: How about we wait and see if we sign him before judging the trade  
Big Rick in FL : 11/10/2019 4:40 pm : link
In comment 14672689 Anakim said:
Quote:
In comment 14672676 steve in ky said:


Quote:


.



I don't care if he balls out for the rest of the season. This team is going nowhere and they NEED draft capital, especially Day 2 picks.


Why couldn't we sign him in free agency? You think whichever team traded for him would franchise him? Williams was sure to hit the open market.


Are we going to get a better player in the 3rd round? I don't think so. You have a QB & RB on a rookie deal. These are the kind of guys you can go after. I think he's played very well so far. I read he had 5 QB pressures in the Cowboys game and had a good amount today.
RE: Anyone trying to defend the move is blind...  
Big Rick in FL : 11/10/2019 4:41 pm : link
In comment 14672729 mphbullet36 said:
Quote:
This isnt the giants regime that gets the benefit of the doubt this is one of the worst trades of all time considering he is a FA and they gave up a premium pick that will be in the top 5 for the right to pay a mediocre player that we dont even need. Against the worst offensive line in the league where was he today?

We are going to pay him big money of where he was drafted not his worthy play.


Did you even watch the game? Leonard Williams was awesome today. He had 4 QB hits and plenty of other pressure. Would have had a sack if Darnold didn't make a reckless pass.
RE: RE: Because theyre going to sign him  
mphbullet36 : 11/10/2019 4:41 pm : link
In comment 14672712 Stan in LA said:
Quote:
In comment 14672687 Giants in 07 said:


Quote:


.

What a ridiculous justification the giants have no worthy FA that are going to sign away to get a comp pick. Its an atrocious trade.
AND he won't count against FA signings for comp. picks now.
RE: RE: Anyone trying to defend the move is blind...  
mphbullet36 : 11/10/2019 4:42 pm : link
In comment 14672760 Big Rick in FL said:
Quote:
In comment 14672729 mphbullet36 said:


Quote:


This isnt the giants regime that gets the benefit of the doubt this is one of the worst trades of all time considering he is a FA and they gave up a premium pick that will be in the top 5 for the right to pay a mediocre player that we dont even need. Against the worst offensive line in the league where was he today?

We are going to pay him big money of where he was drafted not his worthy play.



Did you even watch the game? Leonard Williams was awesome today. He had 4 QB hits and plenty of other pressure. Would have had a sack if Darnold didn't make a reckless pass.


They gave up 34 pts vs a team avg 12 pts not one played awesome give me a break
It gives the Giants  
fkap : 11/10/2019 4:50 pm : link
to right to be the first team to throw oodles of money at him. It has to be at the higher end of what he thinks he can get in FA, or he won't sign the deal.

Is it really worth a very high 3rd and a likely 4th for that right?

It is a highly questionable trade.

A single 4th, maybe. Not the package given up.
RE: RE: RE: How about we wait and see if we sign him before judging the trade  
Anakim : 11/10/2019 4:52 pm : link
In comment 14672710 steve in ky said:
Quote:
In comment 14672689 Anakim said:


Quote:


In comment 14672676 steve in ky said:


Quote:


.



I don't care if he balls out for the rest of the season. This team is going nowhere and they NEED draft capital, especially Day 2 picks.


Why couldn't we sign him in free agency? You think whichever team traded for him would franchise him? Williams was sure to hit the open market.



Surely you are smart enough to understand a team that trades for him likely has an inside track at signing him long term.


As opposed to him getting more on the open market?
RE: RE: RE: How about we wait and see if we sign him before judging the trade  
Anakim : 11/10/2019 4:54 pm : link
In comment 14672751 Big Rick in FL said:
Quote:
In comment 14672689 Anakim said:


Quote:


In comment 14672676 steve in ky said:


Quote:


.



I don't care if he balls out for the rest of the season. This team is going nowhere and they NEED draft capital, especially Day 2 picks.


Why couldn't we sign him in free agency? You think whichever team traded for him would franchise him? Williams was sure to hit the open market.



Are we going to get a better player in the 3rd round? I don't think so. You have a QB & RB on a rookie deal. These are the kind of guys you can go after. I think he's played very well so far. I read he had 5 QB pressures in the Cowboys game and had a good amount today.


I'm sorry, but that's ridiculous. First off, who are you to say that we won't be getting a better player in the third round? NOT TO MENTION, we'd be getting a player in his rookie deal, which is what? A tenth of what Leonard Williams will be receiving in his next contract? Second, such being the case, would you argue that it's not prudent to build though the draft?
this was a stupid trade when they made it  
GiantsFan84 : 11/10/2019 4:54 pm : link
Williams has been an average to slightly above average player since entering the league. He's the epitome of the player you DON'T overpay as a free agent.

So DG says hold my beer. Not only do I want to overpay him, I want to trade for him when my team stinks for the right to overpay him first.

The trade also shows there is no cohesion between the front office and the coaching staff. If we are only playing 2 DL at a time, why even make the trade?
RE: RE: Anyone trying to defend the move is blind...  
Anakim : 11/10/2019 4:55 pm : link
In comment 14672760 Big Rick in FL said:
Quote:
In comment 14672729 mphbullet36 said:


Quote:


This isnt the giants regime that gets the benefit of the doubt this is one of the worst trades of all time considering he is a FA and they gave up a premium pick that will be in the top 5 for the right to pay a mediocre player that we dont even need. Against the worst offensive line in the league where was he today?

We are going to pay him big money of where he was drafted not his worthy play.



Did you even watch the game? Leonard Williams was awesome today. He had 4 QB hits and plenty of other pressure. Would have had a sack if Darnold didn't make a reckless pass.


No one is arguing the merits of Leonard Williams. I think he's a fine player and he has room for growth. But this is the type of move you make if you're in contention OR if he's signed longterm.
This move looks worse and worse every week.  
Vin_Cuccs : 11/10/2019 4:59 pm : link
Fireable offense??
Maybe we should've traded most of our picks for impending free  
Anakim : 11/10/2019 5:01 pm : link
agents. After all, we have the cap space and it's not like those picks will be better than anyone we trade for...
Thought WIlliams played pretty  
section125 : 11/10/2019 5:05 pm : link
well. If there was a disruptive play, he was in on it.

What a surprise Anakim starting a numbskull thread.
Because he's young, our best DL player, and we will sign him  
PatersonPlank : 11/10/2019 5:07 pm : link
thats why
RE: Thought WIlliams played pretty  
Anakim : 11/10/2019 5:07 pm : link
In comment 14672984 section125 said:
Quote:
well. If there was a disruptive play, he was in on it.

What a surprise Anakim starting a numbskull thread.



WHO. THE. FUCK. CARES. ABOUT. WHAT. HE. DOES. THIS. YEAR?


Numbskull thread? Numbskull thread would be anyone defending this move. It makes NO SENSE, ABSOLUTELY ZERO FUCKING SENSE, to trade for an impending free agent when you're not in playoff contention.
The problem was the Giants thought they were getting Q Williams  
Danny Dimes : 11/10/2019 5:08 pm : link
It's an honest mistake, one that you expect bad teams to make
RE: The problem was the Giants thought they were getting Q Williams  
Anakim : 11/10/2019 5:09 pm : link
In comment 14673000 Danny Dimes said:
Quote:
It's an honest mistake, one that you expect bad teams to make



That would make a ton of sense because at least Quinnen Williams is signed beyond this wasted season.
You build in the trenches  
xman : 11/10/2019 5:10 pm : link
like SF. It can turn around fast
RE: RE: Anyone trying to defend the move is blind...  
HomerJones45 : 11/10/2019 5:10 pm : link
In comment 14672760 Big Rick in FL said:
Quote:
In comment 14672729 mphbullet36 said:


Quote:


This isnt the giants regime that gets the benefit of the doubt this is one of the worst trades of all time considering he is a FA and they gave up a premium pick that will be in the top 5 for the right to pay a mediocre player that we dont even need. Against the worst offensive line in the league where was he today?

We are going to pay him big money of where he was drafted not his worthy play.



Did you even watch the game? Leonard Williams was awesome today. He had 4 QB hits and plenty of other pressure. Would have had a sack if Darnold didn't make a reckless pass.
Yes, playing for his FA contract. And he will be awesome for the team that backs the truck up and pays him. Dave better say to Leonard's agent "how much do you want? Ok here."
He's a perfect scheme fit  
AcesUp : 11/10/2019 5:18 pm : link
For our DC that is probably a coin flip to be coaching here in December. Now LW and his agent have the Giants and DG over a barrell to sign him to a top of the market deal when there's a high likelihood we'll be playing in a completely different scheme (and possibly position) next year.

I initially thought that they had backchannelled a contract and he'd be signed shortly after the trade, with this being a vote of confidence for the coaching staff. However, I don't think DG looks at all the angles when making his moves. It's all about the player and he gets tunnel vision. He's a scout.
transition tag  
George from PA : 11/10/2019 5:19 pm : link
Guys, we wont be losing him next year
RE: RE: RE: How about we wait and see if we sign him before judging the trade  
JesseS : 11/10/2019 5:24 pm : link
In comment 14672710 steve in ky said:
Quote:
In comment 14672689 Anakim said:


Quote:


In comment 14672676 steve in ky said:


Quote:


.



I don't care if he balls out for the rest of the season. This team is going nowhere and they NEED draft capital, especially Day 2 picks.


Why couldn't we sign him in free agency? You think whichever team traded for him would franchise him? Williams was sure to hit the open market.



Surely you are smart enough to understand a team that trades for him likely has an inside track at signing him long term.


There's a reason this isn't common practice. Off the top of my head, I just don't recall this happening. Have the Giants found a loophole in acquiring talent or it it likely that other teams don't use draft capital for this for a reason. I'm going with Occam's razor here.
RE: This move looks worse and worse every week.  
Go Terps : 11/10/2019 5:26 pm : link
In comment 14672944 Vin_Cuccs said:
Quote:
Fireable offense??


There have been so many fireable offenses from Gettleman at this point that you have to think he won't be fired.
would YOU sign with the Giants?  
Kanavis : 11/10/2019 5:31 pm : link
After they loose to the Jets? After they get blown out repeatedly playing any of the good teams remaining on the schedule. After they fire Betcher, the person who's scheme you fit.

I wouldn't. I am not sure he will. I don't think this was a good move. If so, you would see better franchises doing this more regularly.

We gave up a 3rd and a 5th for no reason.
RE: How about we wait and see if we sign him before judging the trade  
Justlurking : 11/10/2019 5:32 pm : link
In comment 14672676 steve in ky said:
Quote:
.


Why? Made no sense then, now or ever. Enough with this how about we wait bullshit. This franchise is a fucking DISASTER.
RE: It gives the Giants  
jcn56 : 11/10/2019 5:34 pm : link
In comment 14672852 fkap said:
Quote:
to right to be the first team to throw oodles of money at him. It has to be at the higher end of what he thinks he can get in FA, or he won't sign the deal.

Is it really worth a very high 3rd and a likely 4th for that right?

It is a highly questionable trade.

A single 4th, maybe. Not the package given up.


Not even the 4th. What it basically gives them above any other participant in the FA market is the ability to tag him.

Leonard Williams' play to date hasn't been worth a tag of any sort.

You could say that the audition might be worth the 4th - but considering the fact that the team has been lousy with 3rd and 4th round picks forever, a big part of why they currently stink, giving up those two picks for a guy who likely could have been acquired with cash only is ridiculous.
RE: would YOU sign with the Giants?  
mdc1 : 11/10/2019 6:23 pm : link
In comment 14673134 Kanavis said:
Quote:
After they loose to the Jets? After they get blown out repeatedly playing any of the good teams remaining on the schedule. After they fire Betcher, the person who's scheme you fit.

I wouldn't. I am not sure he will. I don't think this was a good move. If so, you would see better franchises doing this more regularly.

We gave up a 3rd and a 5th for no reason.


This is going to become a looming problem in the future if we keep Shurmur and Dave, many do not want to come to the stinch of a losing culture. The NFL should have a website like Glassdoor that allows players to describe their environment as places to work....would be interesting and cut through the BS and facts.

RE: RE: Because theyre going to sign him  
Mr. Bungle : 11/10/2019 6:28 pm : link
In comment 14672712 Stan in LA said:
Quote:
In comment 14672687 Giants in 07 said:


Quote:


.


AND he won't count against FA signings for comp. picks now.

So you cough up draft picks to avoid...not gettimg a draft pick?

Sounds brilliant.
RE: RE: How about we wait and see if we sign him before judging the trade  
steve in ky : 11/10/2019 7:41 pm : link
In comment 14673137 Justlurking said:
Quote:
In comment 14672676 steve in ky said:


Quote:


.



Why? Made no sense then, now or ever. Enough with this how about we wait bullshit. This franchise is a fucking DISASTER.


Why should their losing effect ones ability to wait until all information is in prior to forming a final opinion about whether or not a trade was worth it?

I get the frustration but it should negate common sense.
It made no sense  
pjcas18 : 11/10/2019 7:51 pm : link
to make this trade. I was very critical of it and got blasted by the ball washers because of course fans can't possibly know more than the professionals.
Don't be surprised  
Marty866b : 11/10/2019 8:43 pm : link
If (when)Williams doesn't sign with the Giants. Leonard is probably tired of losing and sees their is no future of winning anything with the Giants and will most likely look around fielding offers after the season. Some folks think he will go back to the west coast because he is a USC guy, but, Leonard is actually a Florida kid.
BTW, Gettleman is an idiot. I wish DG nothing but the best of health and to retire to a nice senior community somewhere.
mph  
XBRONX : 11/10/2019 8:47 pm : link
buy some glasses
This..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 11/10/2019 8:49 pm : link
thread continues the push to over-exaggerate everything.

The term "fireable offense" loses more meaning every time Go Terps uses it.

At this point, it's basically become a compliment, because it is said weekly as if being over the top is somehow supposed to strengthen a point.

Very few GM's or coaches have singular events that are "fireable offenses", especially when seen through the lens of immediate judgment.
RE: This..  
Go Terps : 11/10/2019 8:52 pm : link
In comment 14673853 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
thread continues the push to over-exaggerate everything.

The term "fireable offense" loses more meaning every time Go Terps uses it.

At this point, it's basically become a compliment, because it is said weekly as if being over the top is somehow supposed to strengthen a point.

Very few GM's or coaches have singular events that are "fireable offenses", especially when seen through the lens of immediate judgment.


I don't think you're in any position to talk about any other posters, as wrong as you've been on Gettleman. Might want to just stick to starting threads whining about the refs.
LOL..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 11/10/2019 9:01 pm : link
We already have a "right" and "wrong" on Gettleman?

That's part of the fucking problem.

My goal isn't to be right. I'm a fan of the team and want them to succeed. Is throwing invective at everyone in the organization going to change that?

The real truth is that nobody here is right. And people bitching for the past two years that we didn't draft a QB don't earn special points. People saying that Gettleman was a sham hire and here to be a yes man don't get a special reward.

You want a scorecard?? Fuck - you seemingly want to declare winners after the first drive of the game. Using that logic, the Giants had a great first two weeks of the season!

Based on your checklist of "fireable offenses", John Lynch would've been fired last season. That's why immediacy is the folly of morons.
Your Defender of the Faith jacket  
Jimmy Googs : 11/10/2019 9:03 pm : link
must be back from the cleaners...
Yeah I don't understand how you can judge Gettleman yet, PS  
Zeke's Alibi : 11/10/2019 9:03 pm : link
On the other hand its plain as day to me he's a bad coach. I did not get the vibe the Jets were more talented than us, quite the opposite in fact.
RE: LOL..  
Sean : 11/10/2019 9:05 pm : link
In comment 14673897 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
We already have a "right" and "wrong" on Gettleman?

That's part of the fucking problem.

My goal isn't to be right. I'm a fan of the team and want them to succeed. Is throwing invective at everyone in the organization going to change that?

The real truth is that nobody here is right. And people bitching for the past two years that we didn't draft a QB don't earn special points. People saying that Gettleman was a sham hire and here to be a yes man don't get a special reward.

You want a scorecard?? Fuck - you seemingly want to declare winners after the first drive of the game. Using that logic, the Giants had a great first two weeks of the season!

Based on your checklist of "fireable offenses", John Lynch would've been fired last season. That's why immediacy is the folly of morons.


Do you believe Shurmur & Gettleman will be here 3 years from now? Were they hired with the intention that this was a 5 year plan with no threat of being fired?
If you want the Giants to succeed,  
Go Terps : 11/10/2019 9:07 pm : link
than go whatever you can to get Gettleman the hell out of the building, because he sucks at his job.
*do  
Go Terps : 11/10/2019 9:08 pm : link
.
Pages: 1 2 | Show All |  Next>>
Back to the Corner