Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

You gotta love this quote from Paul Schwartz's article

Tony in Tampa : 11/11/2019 7:59 am
"Shurmur showed no emotion as he dissected the latest loss. Players in the locker room did not appear stunned and the only real anger on display came from Peppers when he could not locate the keys to his car for several minutes until an attendant found them deep in his duffle bag"

Also it's pretty to easy to spew out some cliches like:
-this losing is unacceptable or
-put this one on me and
-deep down I know this is a good team and we want the fans to have faith and stay with us

when there's no accountability.

Those are the kinda things you say to your parents or teacher when you screwed up and promise you will do better.
Giants apologize, call for change after Jets embarrassment - ( New Window )
speaking of apologies and owning up...  
Drewcon40 : 11/11/2019 8:09 am : link
.....all week I tried to post reasons why the Giants could win this game. I wanted this one bad. I am not sure if it is because of who we lost to or that there is a bye week, I really feel tested as a fan.

Eric was right - even the Handley/mid 90s era Giants were much more fun. Maybe it's nostalgia or the fact that the NFL has changed but that proud feeling of rooting for this team in the late 80s / early 90s seems like we will never see again.

Now we have Jamal Adams trolling us and not that that Jets team is a superbowl contender - they f'ing one upped us yesterday and that is tough to swallow.
According to Garafolo on GMF today  
superspynyg : 11/11/2019 8:12 am : link
Peppers was not the only one angry. Mara leftbthe buikding with his head down and would not talk to anyone.

Will he do anything? Prob not. But he is pissed!
Maybe this is the kick in the ass  
johnnyb : 11/11/2019 8:13 am : link
this team needed. The emotionless Pat Shurmur speaks volumes. Change is needed and this embarrassment hopefully forces management and ownership to take a closer look.
RE: Maybe this is the kick in the ass  
Blue21 : 11/11/2019 8:16 am : link
In comment 14674583 johnnyb said:
Quote:
this team needed. The emotionless Pat Shurmur speaks volumes. Change is needed and this embarrassment hopefully forces management and ownership to take a closer look.


I hope this is the kick in the ass Mara needed.
Mara cares about optics,  
Section331 : 11/11/2019 8:16 am : link
and the optics of losing to a bad Jets team aren't good. He won't fire Shurmur now, but the ice underneath him is getting thin.
...  
christian : 11/11/2019 8:21 am : link
This is why I've never bought the fairy dust of culture.

The Giants have a talent and coaching problem.

When and only when they upgrade the talent and coaching will they win, and only then will they have a better culture.

The previous group were loud mouths and got loud when they lost. This group is more respectful and has a better temperament. I suspect they'll just go quietly and apathetically.
"get rid of all the bad culture guys and winning will happen"  
Ten Ton Hammer : 11/11/2019 8:23 am : link
So I was told.
RE: Mara cares about optics,  
superspynyg : 11/11/2019 8:23 am : link
In comment 14674591 Section331 said:
Quote:
and the optics of losing to a bad Jets team aren't good. He won't fire Shurmur now, but the ice underneath him is getting thin.


No but fire some of the other coaches might be coming. The DC and Oline coach.
question regarding accountability  
UConn4523 : 11/11/2019 8:26 am : link
what do people mean by this? Outside of getting fired how does one hold Shurmur accountable?

I want him fired, but I always read about accountability and I have no idea what it means and how it can be measured by fans.
I think the Ice is late spring like  
jvm52106 : 11/11/2019 8:33 am : link
and honestly more likely Shurmur is wearing a life vest at the moment. This team is pathetic. The slow starts alone speak volumes. Week after week we just look so inept and that is the worse part of all of this. It doesn't even look like guys are surprised at their poor, bumbling play.

For all the shit the Jets get I will say this, they could have folded their tents after losing Darnold and then Trevor S and having to make to with Faulk at QB. But, they were still fighting. They beat the Cowboys and now they have beaten us.

To be honest, look at how this team was put together-

Eli was retained, when it was clear age and the erosion of the Oline had zapped him of any real ability to be THIS teams QB.

We compound that mystery by having Tanney on board as a 3rd QB.

We trade OBJ (which was NEEDED) but for some reason in that rebuild move we keep EM (see above). These two things do not go together at all.

We draft a RB #2 in the draft thinking we can build around him but, we still have not fixed the Oline. Remmers is a fail. Solder was a high priced signing designed around a quick turn around and run back to the playoffs. That turn around didn't happen and now he is on borrowed time at best. That signing is a D to possibly F now.

Draft- we keep drafting pieces but I am not sure we know what the puzzle is supposed to look like. 3-4 teams are not built around 3 or 4 DLinemen, they are built around Dlinemen who are cogs and the stars are at LB. We have ZERO stars at LB and we have very similar cogs at DL.

Add in the issues in the secondary where we keep trying to draft on the outside and ignore the middle and you have what we have today which is a defense that gets excited when they get a sack here or there and then give up a 3rd and who cares yardage wise.. We can't cover a book and we make senior citizens like Jason Witten look like Tony Gonzales in his prime.

To say I am now apathetic to this team would be an insult to apathy.
RE: According to Garafolo on GMF today  
TyreeHelmet : 11/11/2019 8:41 am : link
In comment 14674582 superspynyg said:
Quote:
Peppers was not the only one angry. Mara leftbthe buikding with his head down and would not talk to anyone.

Will he do anything? Prob not. But he is pissed!


Maybe he’ll charge more PSLs, even though “he really doesn’t want to”.
What  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 11/11/2019 8:53 am : link
was the Gettleman quote? I don't want guys who want to win, I want guys who hate to lose?
RE:  
DC Gmen Fan : 11/11/2019 9:16 am : link
In comment 14674610 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
So I was told.


meh well we weren't doing much with those guys either
RE: What  
Rjanyg : 11/11/2019 9:20 am : link
In comment 14674713 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
was the Gettleman quote? I don't want guys who want to win, I want guys who hate to lose?


Yes, plus the other cliche mantra of
- run the ball
- stop the run
- rush the passer

Can we do any of these things well?
RE: According to Garafolo on GMF today  
micky : 11/11/2019 9:25 am : link
In comment 14674582 superspynyg said:
Quote:
Peppers was not the only one angry. Mara leftbthe buikding with his head down and would not talk to anyone.

Will he do anything? Prob not. But he is pissed!


Oh boy Opie's is a little tiffed! Oh boy

RE: speaking of apologies and owning up...  
eclipz928 : 11/11/2019 9:36 am : link
In comment 14674574 Drewcon40 said:
Quote:

Eric was right - even the Handley/mid 90s era Giants were much more fun. Maybe it's nostalgia or the fact that the NFL has changed but that proud feeling of rooting for this team in the late 80s / early 90s seems like we will never see again.

Part of that is due to the way this roster was cleared out - barely any of these players have been around for more than a season or two. Hard to feel any attachment to a team when you don't even know these guys.

And the way things are going, it's probably a bad idea to form any attachments - this team could be clearing out the roster again sooner than we think.
RE: I think the Ice is late spring like  
Giantophile : 11/11/2019 9:37 am : link
In comment 14674650 jvm52106 said:
Quote:

To be honest, look at how this team was put together-

Eli was retained, when it was clear age and the erosion of the Oline had zapped him of any real ability to be THIS teams QB.

We compound that mystery by having Tanney on board as a 3rd QB.

We trade OBJ (which was NEEDED) but for some reason in that rebuild move we keep EM (see above). These two things do not go together at all.....

.......To say I am now apathetic to this team would be an insult to apathy.


+1
RE: RE: According to Garafolo on GMF today  
mdc1 : 11/11/2019 9:37 am : link
In comment 14674672 TyreeHelmet said:
Quote:
In comment 14674582 superspynyg said:


Quote:


Peppers was not the only one angry. Mara leftbthe buikding with his head down and would not talk to anyone.

Will he do anything? Prob not. But he is pissed!



Maybe he’ll charge more PSLs, even though “he really doesn’t want to”.


He is like the owners of ski resorts, they can charge anything they like as they know that the same set of fools will take the offering and not complain as that market is defined. No need to discount or make changes to make them happy, they accept it. In this case, losing.
oh man  
Rory B. Bellows : 11/11/2019 10:09 am : link
I do NOT want to be the owner's suite chair today. I may get gently shoved....a little bit that way > :D
Shurmurball  
rocco8112 : 11/11/2019 10:27 am : link
..perhaps with some more time they will win, he did inherit a 3 - 13 squad.
Culture matters enormously  
Go Terps : 11/11/2019 10:33 am : link
The problem is that the culture is (or at least should be) set by the head coach, and we've got Pat Shurmur. And the players know the GM above him is also bad at his job, and got his position because he's part of the Giants "family".

The players aren't stupid. They talk to other players from good organizations. They know they're trapped in a bad situation.
A lot of people probably aren’t going to like this  
NikkiMac : 11/11/2019 11:13 am : link
But the problems start with the retaining of Eli and his high salary for the last 5 years then all the number one picks we’ve lost in the last Flowers Pugh Richburg Apple Collins OBJ ..... Engram always hurt and now a lifetime losing coach who is stubborn to boot .... more or less these are the contributing factors in the Giants demise amongst others
At least they found Peppers' car keys.  
St. Jimmy : 11/11/2019 11:26 am : link
It turned out better than when his duffle bag was stolen in Cleveland.
Heavy use of sedatives  
idiotsavant : 11/11/2019 11:30 am : link
Mood stabilizers, Prozac - combined with tanking.

That, and nobody wants to be considered too rough or wild for the club invite, cucumber sandwiches, toast points , ascots and cardigans.
RE: Culture matters enormously  
aGiantGuy : 11/11/2019 12:27 pm : link
In comment 14675045 Go Terps said:
Quote:
The problem is that the culture is (or at least should be) set by the head coach, and we've got Pat Shurmur. And the players know the GM above him is also bad at his job, and got his position because he's part of the Giants "family".

The players aren't stupid. They talk to other players from good organizations. They know they're trapped in a bad situation.

The players know that the GM above him is also bad at his job??? The players were brought in by that GM and retained by that GM, wouldn’t that be admitting that they themselves suck as players. Hard to take that statement seriously. A lot of you lambasted the Golden Tate signing, he’s having a better year than Obj after missing 4 games. And I’m not saying Gettleman can’t be judged, but the analysis on here is lazy and it’s demanding of perfection. We deserve better coaching, but Gettleman, I’m happy with what he’s given us and I trust his ability to draft well which is a major priority for me.
RE:  
RDJR : 11/11/2019 12:44 pm : link
In comment 14674610 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
So I was told.


Regardless of what we were told anyone that has played organized sports on winning teams knows that this was a bunch of baloney. Great teams have jerks and malcontents on them too. It's just that they are "our jerks and malcontents" and the team and leadership figures out how to deal with them because they help the team win.

This culture thing was just a way to placate fans and justify management for jettisoning certain players, who would still be here if the team was winning. Sick of the "culture" and "adult" cliches. Start winning and all that goes away. Magically there won't be a culture or adult issue.
Back to the Corner