Daniel Jones' Last Three Games

Very happy with him. Best thing going for us right now.

Good thing it's the most important decision that DG got right.

If DJ shows some a more acute awareness in/around the pocket by the end of the year than we see today, I will love the pick.

in the last two games, he has outrushed Barkley. The offense isn't great and injuries have been a BIG issue, but the DEFENSE is the reason the Giants are so pathetic. Because of Jones, the Giants offense is playing well enough to win.

but his obliviousness in the pocket is a bad sign and not something easily corrected. I call it Kerry Collins syndrome. Having no clue who's around you and how much time you have.

Steve Young was on ESPN before the Cowboys game saying the same thing: feeling/escaping the rush is innate. You either have it or you don't. And in Steve's opinion, Jones had to start showing it right away because there were red flags.

Accurate, good arm, tough, resilient, athletic - more than worthy of a #6 overall selection. Fumbles are the obvious flaw, but Eli fumbled every time you breathed on him, too. A good line and receivers that get open in less that five seconds will cut the fumbles considerably.

We have no defense whatsoever. The jets just scored 27 on us, we are every QBs dream matchup. Whens the last time a struggling qb played us and kept struggling? IDK but its been awhile. How do you fix that? Draft a qb 2 years in a row. The sad part is would anyone be surprised if our shit FO did this horrible stupid idea.

a great point and it is the overwhelming concern with Jones. He does not feel the rush at all. I like the bravery and eyes downfield but FFS man you have to feel some of this rush.

That being said, Young improved mightily as a QB over the years. Jones has made a great start to his career all in all but he's not a sure thing.

is part of the solution, not the problem.

In comment 14675189 English Alaister said:

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a great point and it is the overwhelming concern with Jones. He does not feel the rush at all. I like the bravery and eyes downfield but FFS man you have to feel some of this rush. That being said, Young improved mightily as a QB over the years. Jones has made a great start to his career all in all but he's not a sure thing.

Tough to feel anything with the lack of oline support we have. He's not getting hit while trying to escape. He's getting it right up the gut, in his face.

You put him on a real line, the kid is going to absolute destroy teams

With the Giants, the rest of the team is holding Danny Dimes back. He has shown that he has all the tools necessary to be a successful qb. The question is whether he can eliminate the mistakes - that's the difference between him being a Matt Stafford type player or being an elite qb who will compete for titles.

It really says something about how truly awful the GM has otherwise been that he may have actually hit on a franchise qb, and still done enough wrong to warrant being run out of town.

would help Jones immensely as would blitz recognition. Maybe it's his ankle but Barkley needs to do a better job in blitz pickup. Jones can play. Btw, the only other Giant QB to throw 4 Tds/game twice in a season was Eli Manning (2010).

In comment 14675190 AcidTest said:

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is part of the solution, not the problem.

+1

Imagine Jones & Barkley playing in Andy Reid's offense (for example).
They would light it up. Barkley would be Brian Westbrook/Shady McCoy on crack.

And you know what? Mahomes isn't the MVP of the league under Pat Shurmur with the Giants. The problem with these players is a bad organization and hopefully they won't be ruined.

too bad the rest of the team is garbage

The fumbling stuff needs to be corrected.

If he fixes it he’s going to be a star in this league.

If he doesn’t he will eventually find the bench.

It’s that simple.

In comment 14675162 mittenedman said:

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but his obliviousness in the pocket is a bad sign and not something easily corrected. I call it Kerry Collins syndrome. Having no clue who's around you and how much time you have. Steve Young was on ESPN before the Cowboys game saying the same thing: feeling/escaping the rush is innate. You either have it or you don't. And in Steve's opinion, Jones had to start showing it right away because there were red flags.

this.

jones is bad at sensing pressure, sensing when to move in the pocket, and it often results in turnovers that directly lead to points for the other team. it's not remotely looked to be getting better through these eight games.

i don't care if he throws for 4 TDs in a losing effort when he's gifting points to the opposing team on a regular or even semi-regular basis.

people are too ready and eager to crown him.

In comment 14675189 English Alaister said:

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a great point and it is the overwhelming concern with Jones. He does not feel the rush at all. I like the bravery and eyes downfield but FFS man you have to feel some of this rush. That being said, Young improved mightily as a QB over the years. Jones has made a great start to his career all in all but he's not a sure thing.

Agree with this. I liked the pick and he has great intangibles but the lack of pocket awareness every single play has me biting my fingernails.

Peyton Mannings NFL debut and it's looks pretty similar sans fumbles....Be patient, don't overreact, it took a couple years for the colts to get better with Peyton.

We have our QB. It's the rest of the roster that's the issue.

is that a tool that can help train him in the off season about becoming more aware of his surroundings during the games?

Keep this kid healthy for the last 6 games, and focus on this issue all off season. I'm sure Cuthbert will have some input on his training as well.

They are major, puts our shitty defense in even shittier situations and a part of the reasons for losing.

Teams that lose the turn over differential don't win.


BUT, Jones at least provides hope.

Only time will tell.

In comment 14675189 English Alaister said:

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a great point and it is the overwhelming concern with Jones. He does not feel the rush at all. I like the bravery and eyes downfield but FFS man you have to feel some of this rush. That being said, Young improved mightily as a QB over the years. Jones has made a great start to his career all in all but he's not a sure thing.

Where as players like Eli, Baker and quite a few others panic and throw way too early. This is the NFL, I would rather a guy stand tall and learn than bail and panic.

Should be accounted for. At least lost fumbles.

We hit a home run with the most important position in sports.

Yes the fumbles are a problem but I’d rather it be a fumbling issue than an interception issue.

Also, imagine what he would do with people who can block for him and his running back and a competent coaching staff. And some experience.

He’s going to be a top 5 QB in the league in the next few years. I’m 100% convinced.

and focusing on the positive stats - framing the narrative with a sharpshooter fallacy. Overall, he looks promising, but it difficult to overlook the fumbles/sacks. While we all realize our OL is trash, that hasn't changed in the better part of a decade and doesn't look to change in the immediate future. Jones needs to show that he can play behind a suspect line. So far he hasn't. 13 fumbles can't just be overlooked. We hope that he is able to correct it, but it isn't guaranteed. If he continues, he will not be a starting NFL QB. In addition are the 32 sacks he has taken. It isn't heroic/courageous to be looking downfield while getting clobbered. He needs to speed up his reads and internal clock to get rid of the ball.

At the end of the season, will he have been sacked more than 50 times? Will he eclipse 20 fumbles?

just about every other QB in the league. it directly leads to sacks and fumbles. whether the problem is entirely on him, or whether it is a fundamental flaw with shurmur's offense is hard to know. but through eight games jones has almost twice as many giveaways as touchdown passes. he is just as a big a reason why the team is 2-7 as anyone else is.

In comment 14675444 Diver_Down said:

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and focusing on the positive stats - framing the narrative with a sharpshooter fallacy. Overall, he looks promising, but it difficult to overlook the fumbles/sacks. While we all realize our OL is trash, that hasn't changed in the better part of a decade and doesn't look to change in the immediate future. Jones needs to show that he can play behind a suspect line. So far he hasn't. 13 fumbles can't just be overlooked. We hope that he is able to correct it, but it isn't guaranteed. If he continues, he will not be a starting NFL QB. In addition are the 32 sacks he has taken. It isn't heroic/courageous to be looking downfield while getting clobbered. He needs to speed up his reads and internal clock to get rid of the ball. At the end of the season, will he have been sacked more than 50 times? Will he eclipse 20 fumbles?

The sample size is his last three games. We could go back further but the downpour against Arizona and the game against the Pats I don't think are particularly indicative of what's happening.

I also put giant fucking asterisks at the top and very plainly stated the fumbles are a concern. So I'm not really sure what your point is. Yes, the fumbles are concern. Outside of that he's been excellent.

He has shown good accuracy and made plays with his legs. He also fumbles like crazy and holds the ball too long.

U can’t just highlight the good and ignore the bad. Eli always knew how to get rid of the ball and read the field quickly. It’s the most difficult part of being a QB. Jones could very well get better but he might not

Saying Giants hit a home run is typical BBI over praise of a player simply because he is new. Last year, it was about how what great picks Hill and Hernandez were. Saquon was a generational talent.

It’s very rare that you can evaluate a player after only 8 games. The only one that comes to mind is LT. And I guarantee you Jones is no LT

In comment 14675443 Danny Kanell said:

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We hit a home run with the most important position in sports. Yes the fumbles are a problem but I’d rather it be a fumbling issue than an interception issue. Also, imagine what he would do with people who can block for him and his running back and a competent coaching staff. And some experience. He’s going to be a top 5 QB in the league in the next few years. I’m 100% convinced.

+1.

And imagine how much better he (and the offense) would be if we had 2018 Barkley running back there this year instead of whatever the hell version of Barkley we're trotting out there this year.

Josh Allen has had seven sacks in nine games. He looks like he will have a pretty nice career.

In comment 14675523 since1925 said:

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Josh Allen has had seven sacks in nine games. He looks like he will have a pretty nice career.

With how awful our defense is, who our DC is, and the scheme, I have to wonder how many sacks Allen would have here.

Great with everything but with one obvious flaw. You hope he can get plastic surgery. I would hate to have his incredible potential go to waste. He's extremely likable too.

as others have pointed out. so it's two things: shitty pocket awareness, and fumbles. you could also add in a third: holding onto the ball too long. the problems are bigger than a lot on here seem to want to believe.

so the nosejob metaphor is not quite accurate. he's more like a chick with a banging body but who needs a complete facelift or you'd only wanna do her from behind.

i realize in another awful season like this one fans want desperately to believe that the giants knocked it out of the park with jones. i do too. but so far he's been a mixed bag, has many more turnovers than scoring plays, and his much-touted mobility has not really been a factor in any game outside of his first start v. tampa bay. he has a long way to go.

Anyone see a possible correlation?

In comment 14675492 Dave in Hoboken said:

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In comment 14675443 Danny Kanell said: Quote: We hit a home run with the most important position in sports. Yes the fumbles are a problem but I’d rather it be a fumbling issue than an interception issue. Also, imagine what he would do with people who can block for him and his running back and a competent coaching staff. And some experience. He’s going to be a top 5 QB in the league in the next few years. I’m 100% convinced. +1. And imagine how much better he (and the offense) would be if we had 2018 Barkley running back there this year instead of whatever the hell version of Barkley we're trotting out there this year.

Maybe Jones is the reason you don't have circa 2018 Barkley.

It's been the same pattern now over and over: stop Barkley, don't bother doubling anyone, rush the passer, collect the TO's. It's worked what 6 or 7 times in a row now.

In comment 14675162 mittenedman said:

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but his obliviousness in the pocket is a bad sign and not something easily corrected. I call it Kerry Collins syndrome. Having no clue who's around you and how much time you have. Steve Young was on ESPN before the Cowboys game saying the same thing: feeling/escaping the rush is innate. You either have it or you don't. And in Steve's opinion, Jones had to start showing it right away because there were red flags.

Yup, agree here. Jones lacks that pocket awareness, can that be taught? I sure hope so.

The kid has the goods. A rare but important bright spot

There’s reason to be optimistic but there’s still plenty of reason to worry too. I think it’s just too soon to tell. This whole business of even playing in the the first year is relatively new to the NFL for QBs. I still think we need to wait until season three to really know.

I’ll say this though, so far, he makes some nice throws but there seems like something’s off with his clock. Even when he’s running it’s like there’s a delay between when he slides and when he should slide. Fixable? Maybe. But it’s not a home run yet.

In comment 14675766 HomerJones45 said:

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Anyone see a possible correlation?

Yes, we are behind so early that we throw more. 4th Quarter, down two scores as well.

. . . waiting for a receiver to get open. I don't think he's indecisive.

In comment 14675371 Tom in NY said:

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is that a tool that can help train him in the off season about becoming more aware of his surroundings during the games? Keep this kid healthy for the last 6 games, and focus on this issue all off season. I'm sure Cuthbert will have some input on his training as well.

I was thinking about him using Virtual Reality to fix those issue in the off-season too. Cutcliff could also be a real good resource in the off-season.

In comment 14675869 Ralph.C said:

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. . . waiting for a receiver to get open. I don't think he's indecisive.

I think that is part of it. There’s not a lot of separation being made from our guys.

He absolutely needs to improve his pocket awareness. But overall been so impressed by his ability to keep the offense competitive during an incredible rash of injuries to his skill players. Don’t think he’s had everyone out there together yet.

Also hasn’t had a run game to speak of during this indoctrination.

Lot of great skills being shown. Very impressed by how he’s generated a rapport with Slayton. He’s performed admirably overall given his situation. Really hopeful that the pocket awareness can be improved. Because that’s the obvious red flag here. But 9:1 td:int in his last three is super impressive coming without a healthy Barkley, no Sheppard and no engram last week.

Hoping we get to see him behind a solid oline next year.

Jones is holding the ball to b/c he's trying to make a play. He is an old-school gunslinger. Not b/c he can't 'feel the rush'.

Detroit and the Jets are two absolutely wretched defenses.

In comment 14676241 Greg from LI said:

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Detroit and the Jets are two absolutely wretched defenses.

Jets are #2 against the run, skewed abit by AFC east #s and the Leonard trade, but still, they are not that bad. Mia will be bad.

take it with a grain of salt.

Quote:

The Hall of Fame quarterback, who won three Super Bowls with the 49ers in the late ’80s and early ’90s, told Bloomberg, in a profile published Thursday, he would have quit his TV job many years ago if his partners at HGGC didn’t use his celebrity to invite potential clients to their various stadium suites. Steve Young with the 49ers in 1999AP “My wife hates football, and my kids don’t really care,” Young told the magazine. “I see myself as a deal guy first. I’ve put football behind me. Roger Staubach once told me — and I’ll never forget it: ‘When you retire, run. Never look back.’ ” Young admitted he puts the minimum effort into his analyst job, spending barely two hours on game preparation and bolting to the suite after he appears on-air to try to lock up deals. He said he rarely even pays attention to the game — a negligence you think would be a deal-breaker for the Worldwide Leader, which prides itself on its NFL coverage, particularly in Monday’s primetime slot.

-Emphasis mine


Link - ( New Window )

seem to be at moments when we are just getting a little momentum. They are at bad spots.

they do count, and can't be discounted (duh).

but all things considered, his improvement is incredibly encouraging. issue is that his fumbles can put is in the hole early - but IMO he looks better than eli did his rookie year

He has line and reduced weaponry. And they don’t game plan for his mobility, which means he gets hit more and faster.

In comment 14675773 HomerJones45 said:

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In comment 14675492 Dave in Hoboken said: Quote: In comment 14675443 Danny Kanell said: Quote: We hit a home run with the most important position in sports. Yes the fumbles are a problem but I’d rather it be a fumbling issue than an interception issue. Also, imagine what he would do with people who can block for him and his running back and a competent coaching staff. And some experience. He’s going to be a top 5 QB in the league in the next few years. I’m 100% convinced. +1. And imagine how much better he (and the offense) would be if we had 2018 Barkley running back there this year instead of whatever the hell version of Barkley we're trotting out there this year. Maybe Jones is the reason you don't have circa 2018 Barkley. It's been the same pattern now over and over: stop Barkley, don't bother doubling anyone, rush the passer, collect the TO's. It's worked what 6 or 7 times in a row now.

Barkley shouldn't be so easy to stop, though. He's been dubbed a future HOF'er since the day he was drafted and was great last year.

In comment 14676244 stoneman said:

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Jets are #2 against the run, skewed abit by AFC east #s and the Leonard trade, but still, they are not that bad. Mia will be bad.

26th in passing yards allowed. They're also decimated by injuries at this point.

how was the play"