The Giants have stunk since 2012. The record since 2012 is 49-73. One playoff appearance in that time. The worst record in Football since 2017.
A loser culture and it starts with John Mara's decision making in that time period. Take a look:
2012 - Misses playoffs as defending champs
2013 - 1st losing season in the Coughlin era
2014 - Keeps Coughlin, forces coordinator change (McAdoo)
2015 - Keeps Coughlin, forces coordinator change (Spagnuolo)
2016 - Fires Coughlin, Keeps Reese, Hires McAdoo, Keeps Staff
2017 - Fires McAdoo, Fires Reese
2018 - Keeps Eli, Hires Gettleman, Hires Shurmur
2019 - Drafts Jones, Keeps Eli
years and years of half measures. He has no vision for the franchise, absolutely no creativity and no balls. Is there really any question as to why this organization is now a bottom-tier ball club in the NFL?
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I'll be happy to explain it to you. Took over a 4-12 country club, went 6-10 the next year and 11-5 and playoffs the year after that.
Amazing what can be accomplished when there are people in the front office and the sidelines who know their business.
Sorry if it appeared that I was criticizing your hero Homer, but I was just pointing out a fact. And as far as 2003 goes, losing 50 games to injury might have had something to do with that 4-12 record.
I hope you are enjoying this new era of Giants football; joepa's post about having everything happen the way you wanted it and not being happy with the result sent the spear flying into your chest.
It's damn near impossible to sustain the level of success the Giants did when Eli was in his prime and TC was a major part of that success.
In a 8 year stretch from 2005-2012 the NYG never had a losing season, made the playoffs 5 times and won the SB twice.
That's a stretch that few coaches, QBs or franchises have ever had.
Of course, just like with every NFL franchise that has gone through stretches of success like this, things change.
Players come off their primes, teams get old all at once, GMs make decisions that miss, unexpected events take place (like injuries), the HC's message isn't as strong as it once was and his influence over the team wanes, and then new HC come in and aren't as effective as management hoped.
It's all cyclical for every team...except, seemingly, the NE Patriots.
the bad decisions of this franchise started when Chris Mara became Ex VP in 2011
and the best part is he can't get fired
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This forum demanded that Killdrive, then Old man Coughlin, then Jerry Reach and Mcadoodoo be fired and you got it. Now it's Dinosaur Dave and milquetoast Murmur and it's no balls half measure Mara. Shameful bunch of chicken littles had been begging for the blow up and now can't handle the climb back up.
I know I know, Dinosaur Dave and Murmur aren't capable of fielding and coaching a winner. If I can't see that by now, I don't know what I'm watching right?
Yes, because everyone on BBI agrees with everyone else. We're looking at 10 wins in 3 years, I can't imagine why fans would be upset.
When did we blow it up? We didn't, its exactly why we people are calling him half measure Mara. And if you can't see that PS is a loser of a head coach I don't know what to tell you.
This is the most negative I've been about this orginization ever and its mostly because PS is such a blindingly obvious bad coach that if we bring him back in 2020 I'll have zero faith in this orginization and Mara moving forward. If its true DG is stumping for him because he doesn't challenge his authority, which wouldn't surprise me, he can go to. And this is coming from someone that wanted him back in 2020 before the season regardless of what happened and expected about 6/7 wins.
I'm preemptively pissed at Mara because we already have a playbook what hes going to do, keep the HC and fire the coordinators. One problem in that plan is Shurmur sucks and he isn't TC. If you give him a talented roster he will find ways to lose games. It wouldn't even shock me if we make playoffs next year with him helming the ship, but he is never winning a SB. Bad coaches don't do that, occassionaly a mediocre one sneaks in, but not bad ones.
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I have said over and over
the bad decisions of this franchise started when Chris Mara became Ex VP in 2011
and the best part is he can't get fired
does he really have influence though when it comes to key decisions?
either he is making bad decisions or doing nothing at all.
Either way not much of a case to keep him around.
Remember he was there every step of the way in a position of authority when Reese and Ross were dismantling the team.
I mean, sure he can make recommendations, but is DG really using that information??
It’s been a crappy stretch, I get it. But I think there was one main bad decision that’s been far-reaching: keeping Reese too long. His team building and player assessments sucked, we’ve been living with the consequences ever since. (Even then, I understand why Mara trusted him in that role, given the two championships.) Everything else has sprung from that.
Believing that Mara was the one insisting on keeping Eli is the only thing stopping the fanbase from fully eviscerating DG. He's made a lot of questionable decisions, chief among them attempting to build around Eli rather than begin the rebuild immediately upon arrival. If that was at Mara's insistence, it's disappointing but forgivable. If it was based on Gettleman's own self-assessment of the roster, then we actually downgraded from Reese.
This forum wanted a young mobile quarterback. You got it.
This forum wanted the 3-4. You got it.
This forum wants vets benched and the youth to play yet loses their minds when games are lost because of the youth's growing pains. Can't handle failed coaching strategies built on the wildly inconsistent nature of playing the youth.
This forum demanded that Killdrive, then Old man Coughlin, then Jerry Reach and Mcadoodoo be fired and you got it. Now it's Dinosaur Dave and milquetoast Murmur and it's no balls half measure Mara. Shameful bunch of chicken littles had been begging for the blow up and now can't handle the climb back up.
I know I know, Dinosaur Dave and Murmur aren't capable of fielding and coaching a winner. If I can't see that by now, I don't know what I'm watching right?
Excellent post. Everytime Shurmur makes a boneheaded move, I send a text to my buddy, who would fit in really well around here, "hey, are you still happy Coughlin and Gilbride are gone?"
Continuity shmontinuety Fire this inept stubborn coach !!!!!
The Superbowl run in 2011 masked a sustained period of mediocrity from 2009-2013, in which the Giants were only a combined six games above .500 for the regular season.
If you think this idea is crazy, well, this discussion was on the table here at BBI in 2013. There was measured debate about whether it made sense to cut ties with Eli, since the rebuilding process was likely to be painful and it would make more sense to do him a solid and send him to a better team in need of a QB, like the Texans.
Most of the criticism of Coughlin and Reese was in full swing by 2013 as well...The underwhelming second half-of-season performances, the poor roster construction, etc. The Giants just elected to remove Gilbride at the time.
sustained period of mediocrity from 09-13? they were 8-8 in '09, 10-6 in '10 (missed playoffs, barely), 9-7 wildcard/SB champs in '11 and 9-7 missed playoffs in '12 after nicks went down. the wheels fell off in 2013, sure, but all of the teams prior to that season were competitive. it is understandable that mara would give coughlin/reese a chance to turn things around. he decisions since 2017 have been disasterous, sure, but i don't knock him for sticking w/ coughlin and reese for a few more years after their second SB win in five years.
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To invest time reading this forum. I know the rabid frustrated "bbier" isn't indicative of all of Giants fans, but there isn't a single football thread that isn't littered with this garbage. Get a grip.
This forum wanted a young mobile quarterback. You got it.
This forum wanted the 3-4. You got it.
This forum wants vets benched and the youth to play yet loses their minds when games are lost because of the youth's growing pains. Can't handle failed coaching strategies built on the wildly inconsistent nature of playing the youth.
This forum demanded that Killdrive, then Old man Coughlin, then Jerry Reach and Mcadoodoo be fired and you got it. Now it's Dinosaur Dave and milquetoast Murmur and it's no balls half measure Mara. Shameful bunch of chicken littles had been begging for the blow up and now can't handle the climb back up.
I know I know, Dinosaur Dave and Murmur aren't capable of fielding and coaching a winner. If I can't see that by now, I don't know what I'm watching right?
Excellent post. Everytime Shurmur makes a boneheaded move, I send a text to my buddy, who would fit in really well around here, "hey, are you still happy Coughlin and Gilbride are gone?"
It was absolutely the correct time to move on from TC. However every decision since then has been garbage. They needed an outside voice then to take over. Instead we got retreads and people "they're comfortable with" who have done nothing but drive the franchise further into the ground.
I don't understand this "marble in the can" about getting rid of Eli as far back as 2013. Seems it was impractical if not impossible then as it was in 2018.
Regardless, Mara and the GMs have done an incredibly lousy job bringing in a top notch coaching staff and rebuilding this team despite Eli Manning on the team.
And that is despite the last two drafts by the current GM. His FAs generally have not been any good.
Lousy job of setting expectations with the media and the fans.
This forum wanted a young mobile quarterback. You got it.
This forum wanted the 3-4. You got it.
This forum wants vets benched and the youth to play yet loses their minds when games are lost because of the youth's growing pains. Can't handle failed coaching strategies built on the wildly inconsistent nature of playing the youth.
This forum demanded that Killdrive, then Old man Coughlin, then Jerry Reach and Mcadoodoo be fired and you got it. Now it's Dinosaur Dave and milquetoast Murmur and it's no balls half measure Mara. Shameful bunch of chicken littles had been begging for the blow up and now can't handle the climb back up.
I know I know, Dinosaur Dave and Murmur aren't capable of fielding and coaching a winner. If I can't see that by now, I don't know what I'm watching right?
I don't believe it's that people can't handle the climb back up, it's just a fundamental disagreement with how the climb back up has been attempted thus far. They're old and have no young prospects at some critical positions, and they throw big money at over-30 players.
For all the talk about rebuilding the offensive line, the tackles are two old, fading veterans. The center is a never-was.
They attempted to fix one of the safety spots with "ageless" antoine bethea and had no young player to compete for the job.
The head coach they're trusting to rebuild a program hasn't won anywhere.