This is going to be a big story in the morning. For those of you who did not stay up late, Garrett ripped the helmet off of Mason Rudolph and swung it at him, connecting with Rudolph's head. Rudolph seems fine, but the act itself was incredibly dangerous and Garrett might have an unprecedented suspension coming his way. Possibly season ending.
And Pouncey, although I can't blame him, went nuts on Garrett with punches and kicked him in the head and neck area while he was pinned. All of this and there was :08 seconds left in the game.
And these two teams play again in two weeks.
This is the most Browns thing ever. The defense just played a great game, Mayfield was good, they ran the ball well, and physically beat a division rival they hadn't beaten in what, 5 years I think Joe Buck said? They get a huge win, the game is ending, and their best defensive player puts himself in a situation where he may not play again this season.
This is worse than Haynesworth.
Just watched the video. I didn't see anyone getting kicked in the balls. If there was some of that going on from a different angle then it was probably because Garrett wouldn't get the hell off of him.
No excuses. This guy deserves a hefty suspension.
However, if the core issue is losing control on a football field, I point out that:
A) Pouncey was not involved in the initial scrum of I presume escalating rage on the part of Rudolph and Garret
B) Intervenes several seconds later - when it was essentially over
C) Did not need to
D) Hits a guy being held on the ground
E) Moves around and standing kicks him in the head
imo, I don't know what actually happened with Rudolph, but it sure doesn't look right
Garret should get a substantial suspension
Pouncey is by far and away the most out of control, unfair and dirtiest player in the drama. And could have caused a concussion.
imo, Pouncey should get a long suspension and would not bother me if he got the longest.
Two guys got into it. One went over the top. Pouncey was actually the guy most out of control with minimal provocation for doing so
Bill, I respectfully disagree with you about pouncey having minimal provocation and did not need to. He was right there as Garrett swung the helmet and immediately started throwing punches. He was defending his qb and Garrett was crazed and was still fighting on the ground.
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Race is relevant. The closest thing I can remember was the Miami player doing this in that crazy melee.
There's a narrative going around that Rudolph might've said something racist in that tussle. I think it stems from the fact that Mason rudolph is A Giant supporter of a certain Autocrat. It's unsubstantiated, but that's a theory going around.
It will be terrible if that narrative takes hold. Mason Rudolph never had any incidents in high school, and when he comes back to the area, he spends time with his ex-teammates, almost all of whom are African-American. He'd be one of the least likely people to start spouting off racist comments.
Pouncey is by far and away the most out of control, unfair and dirtiest player in the drama. And could have caused a concussion.
Um... not so sure about that take
Pretty sure swinging a helmet and hitting someone in the head is far and away more : out of control, unfair, dirty & can cause a concussion
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With tensions already high that is something that can definitely send you over the edge.
Just watched the video. I didn't see anyone getting kicked in the balls. If there was some of that going on from a different angle then it was probably because Garrett wouldn't get the hell off of him.
No excuses. This guy deserves a hefty suspension.
I don't know how you missed that, he stomped Garrett in the man parts when he was on the ground.
I’m not excusing Garrett’s reaction. To me Rudolph has justification to file criminal assault charges.
He could have walked away? Victim blaming much?
A teammate comes in to protect his teammate at all costs and he is the real person to blame here?
Come the fuck on...
I don’t hate anyone or anything and work hard not to be biased. While he may be pinned I e seen enough fights where someone gets back up after being pinned. He was still a threat as it was a matter of a few seconds. One Garrett brought a weapon to the fight gloves are off.
How so?
The shit you read on this board.....
Seriously?...no one is saying what Pouncey did was right, but he was kicking a helmeted individual with his foot and hand, which neither are harder than the helmet on Garrett's head.
Garrett literally swung a weapon at another man's exposed head. I've heard of people getting knocked out or have more severe head injuries for less of a hit. It's almost a miracle that Rudolph wasn't seriously hurt since a helmet connecting with a head can be severely damaging or even fatal.
Give me a damn break. A lot of people were stupid, but what Garrett did is far worse than what anyone else did last night.
Garrett needs to be suspended indefinitely until the league figures this out. I'm thinking a full year at a minimum.
Rudolph and the Steelers involved should be fined and miss time as well.
Inexcusable. Period.
Go for it.
What? How in the world could you possibly have that take on this? Garrett basically swung a weapon and is lucky if there aren't any criminal charges coming his way. He could've killed Rudolph or at least severely injured him.
Pouncey throwing punches isn't even close to being as dangerous. Garrett being in full pads and helmet probably didn't even feel the punches or attempted kicks by Pouncey. In fact I'd say Pouncey had a better chance of hurting his own hand than any part of Garrett.
@rydunleavy
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29m
Damon Harrison similarly swung a helmet at teammate Will Hernandez in #Giants practice last year during a ‘no video allowed’ period. He missed. He was traded by midseason
Remember that happening, but never really tied it to him being traded. Not a crazy theory that it contributed.
Maybe it is just here on BBI, because all the sports talk I have heard thus far is all talking about Garrett and his indefinite suspension. No one is calling Pouncey out, in fact, many of the former players are giving him praise for sticking up for this teammate.
Pouncey did what players are taught to do - stand up for their teammate. What isn't taught is to take a piece of equipment and use it as a weapon.
Ah...no I don't bother with the punches when restraining Garret.
Im talking about kicking him in the head after he was restrained and down. That specific action
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It appears to me he nearly took Garrett’s helmet off first. I can’t tell whether Rudolph intended to, but it’s not unreasonable to interpret it this way. Rudolph later joined back in the scrum, without helmet, where he could have walked away.
I’m not excusing Garrett’s reaction. To me Rudolph has justification to file criminal assault charges.
He could have walked away? Victim blaming much?
It's not victim blaming. It's telling the entire story, which often doesn't happen in these cases. 99.99% of everyone thinks Garrett tried to assault Rudolph with a weapon. It's not wrong to say Rudolph precipitated the event by overreacting and trying to pull Garrett's helmet off.
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With tensions already high that is something that can definitely send you over the edge.
Just watched the video. I didn't see anyone getting kicked in the balls. If there was some of that going on from a different angle then it was probably because Garrett wouldn't get the hell off of him.
No excuses. This guy deserves a hefty suspension.
Nah the 'grab' was as Rudolph got up after the helmet was ripped off, there was potentially a 'kick' to the balls by Rudolph immediately after the tackle before the helmet came off. None of it excuses Garrett. And frankly it's not clear from the still that Rudolph actually grabbed/punched him in the junk (some of the video looks that way) and the 'kick' looks pretty accidental as Rudolph is tipped.
The 'grab'
The 'kick'
@rydunleavy
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29m
Damon Harrison similarly swung a helmet at teammate Will Hernandez in #Giants practice last year during a ‘no video allowed’ period. He missed. He was traded by midseason
You didn’t hear about that? I’m not so sure that incident is why he was traded though, seems like a stretch.
I don't think it's worse than Garrett's by a longshot - had he landed cleanly with the helmet and not the mask/pad, he could have crippled or killed Rudolph. Pouncey punching a guy down on the ground and kicking him has precedent, and while it's not exactly acceptable behavior it hasn't resulted in any serious injury to date.
Both of them should get suspensions. Not sure how lengthy Garrett's will be only because of how unusual the situation is. The NFL makes a big stink about player safety, don't think they can't walk past this one.
@rydunleavy
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29m
Damon Harrison similarly swung a helmet at teammate Will Hernandez in #Giants practice last year during a ‘no video allowed’ period. He missed. He was traded by midseason
This was a topic on BBI at the time. Where was the outrage? Where were the calls for lifetime bans and cops at Snacks locker?
Hell, people are still pissed at Gettleman for only getting a 5th rounder.
Garrett is a scumbag and deserves to be suspended. But all of this faux outrage is ridiculous.
Just that ...nothing else. Don't assume its football.
What happens in a court of law? Assault with intent to cause significant harm?
Each part of the sequence stands on its own in a court of law. Defending my friend after what happened earlier at the bar...isn't a defense. Man is responsible for each action ?
Or do we disagree?
Ah...no I don't bother with the punches when restraining Garret.
Im talking about kicking him in the head after he was restrained and down. That specific action
We seem to be the only ones on the same page about this. It isn't like we are out here saying Garrett shouldn't be getting a season long suspension, but Pouncey should as well. You can't even do that shit in MMA, and Garrett is completely defenseless.
Myles Garrett appeared very chill to me in the Hard Knocks episodes he was on. FWIW, if I were a talk show host, I'd get Rudolph and Garrett on as guests together. That would be good TV.
Pouncey did what players are taught to do - stand up for their teammate. What isn't taught is to take a piece of equipment and use it as a weapon.
Players should never throw punches or kicks, but lets be real here, Garrett just swung a helmet at his quarterback.
Pouncey will probably get a game or so suspension, but the coaching staff isn't going to say a word to him about it because linemen are trained to protect their QB.
Would have been interesting to see how Hernandez would have reacted in Pouncey's position.
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Ryan Dunleavy
@rydunleavy
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29m
Damon Harrison similarly swung a helmet at teammate Will Hernandez in #Giants practice last year during a ‘no video allowed’ period. He missed. He was traded by midseason
This was a topic on BBI at the time. Where was the outrage? Where were the calls for lifetime bans and cops at Snacks locker?
Hell, people are still pissed at Gettleman for only getting a 5th rounder.
Garrett is a scumbag and deserves to be suspended. But all of this faux outrage is ridiculous.
I know most people would assume you're joking because of how ridiculous your post is, but you realize that tweet is about the extent of what most people know about that incident?
This was broadcast on live television then replayed about a thousand times after.
I don't think it's worse than Garrett's by a longshot - had he landed cleanly with the helmet and not the mask/pad, he could have crippled or killed Rudolph. Pouncey punching a guy down on the ground and kicking him has precedent, and while it's not exactly acceptable behavior it hasn't resulted in any serious injury to date.
Both of them should get suspensions. Not sure how lengthy Garrett's will be only because of how unusual the situation is. The NFL makes a big stink about player safety, don't think they can't walk past this one.
I doubt Pouncey gets suspended in light of the situation and the fact he was ejected. Other guys who throw punches don't get suspensions.
No suspension for Green.
2. I generally am very much against hitting people who are down; you won the fight, no need to seriously hurt someone.
Even with (1) and (2), I can't get very mad at Pouncey here. If someone tries to assault your friend with a deadly weapon, it's very likely you're going to lose your sh**. He was sticking up for his QB who could have been maimed.
He could’ve cracked Rudolph’s skull possibly ending his Career or worse. He should lose his job playing in the NFL is a privilege.
Yeh the people that are flat out excusing them from any repercussions here is odd. Like I understand why all players did what they did here, but it isn't an excuse and they should be seeing some hefty suspensions.
Hard to see Rudolph’s hand and just how that happened or what was happening but I don’t see Rudolph really pulling on Garrett’s helmet like he’s trying to take it off.
That said, Garrett could have killed the QB.
then he kicked a guy being held on the ground in the head.
Garret being very wrong is true and stands on its own.
Ditto Pouncey
one guy was in a fracus and lost control. one guy self nominated himself a righteous avenger after the fact and under no threat.
imo, both suck
and Rudolph may as well. I don't get the hand stuck in the facemask contention as clearly. If on purpose is a lot different than inadvertently stuck
I doubt Pouncey gets suspended in light of the situation and the fact he was ejected. Other guys who throw punches don't get suspensions.
No suspension for Green.
Don't get me wrong - I'd suspend Pouncey, if for nothing else than the kick which would easily have been far worse than all the punches.
(which, having only played football at lower levels, I can't for the life of me understand throwing punches to the head of a player with a helmet on)
I don't know what the NFL will do. They'll likely just fine him, but I think his behavior warrants a suspension as well.
Talk about someone else who should lose their job
In a vacuum cannot really be viewed because Pouncey didn't just go off on Garrett unprovoked. He went after him after seeing the guy take a piece of equipment and use it as a weapon. I'm not saying he shouldn't face disciplinary action, but I'd much more buy the explanation from Pouncey that he lost his shit after seeing what Garrett did.
And here's a point that needs to be made too - the whole event was unnecessary. There were 6 seconds left in the game. The Browns already had a win. Garrett could have just pointed to the scoreboard and walked off the field.
Pouncey isn't devoid of fault, but he's doing what players are taught from a young age - have your teammate's back.
However, if the core issue is losing control on a football field, I point out that:
A) Pouncey was not involved in the initial scrum of I presume escalating rage on the part of Rudolph and Garret
B) Intervenes several seconds later - when it was essentially over
C) Did not need to
D) Hits a guy being held on the ground
E) Moves around and standing kicks him in the head
imo, I don't know what actually happened with Rudolph, but it sure doesn't look right
Garret should get a substantial suspension
Pouncey is by far and away the most out of control, unfair and dirtiest player in the drama. And could have caused a concussion.
imo, Pouncey should get a long suspension and would not bother me if he got the longest.
Two guys got into it. One went over the top. Pouncey was actually the guy most out of control with minimal provocation for doing so
Pounced shouldn’t be suspended at all. He was defending his teammate he wasn’t out of line at all
Sure Pouncy deserves time off. But Garret better sit 5 games. Period and all the other stuff will get sorted out.
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In comment 14679894 Eric from BBI said:
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Ryan Dunleavy
@rydunleavy
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29m
Damon Harrison similarly swung a helmet at teammate Will Hernandez in #Giants practice last year during a ‘no video allowed’ period. He missed. He was traded by midseason
This was a topic on BBI at the time. Where was the outrage? Where were the calls for lifetime bans and cops at Snacks locker?
Hell, people are still pissed at Gettleman for only getting a 5th rounder.
Garrett is a scumbag and deserves to be suspended. But all of this faux outrage is ridiculous.
I know most people would assume you're joking because of how ridiculous your post is, but you realize that tweet is about the extent of what most people know about that incident?
This was broadcast on live television then replayed about a thousand times after.
There was a lengthy thread here shortly after it happened. Zero outrage.
So your point is this was so outrageous simply because it was televised?
The only differences between the Snacks incident and the Garrett one were that it was televised and Garrett connected with the helmet.
In the Snacks situation no one here called for so much as a suspension. Here the twitter mob is calling for a lifetime ban and jail time.
Again, last night was pretty egregious and the optics are bad for the league. Garrett should get a lengthy suspension.
But the faux outrage is definitely over the top and a little hypocritical when our own player did the same shit to a teammate in training camp.
Again, both players need to be suspended.