drills him (should have been a penalty) and then tries to rip his head/helmet off by the facemask while he's on the ground defenseless? Seriously? Garrett deserves whatever he gets. Pouncey deserves something for the kick but Rudolph shouldn't get anything. And a kick to the nuts? No way. His foot landed where it landed only because of the position he was put in.
RE: RE: RE: Regardless of the nature of playing football, Â
bashing someone’s skull in with a weapon falls outside the confines of playing football, so no, it doesn’t really matter if we’re talking about professional sports, a desk job, or any other profession, testosterone flowing or not or whatever the fuck difference that makes, you can’t do that shit. Ignorant ass clown.
I clearly said I do not condone it. And he should be suspended for the whole season.. but to say it does not make a difference whether it happened on a foobtall field or at a desk job? Its not a desk job, these players assault one another on basically every play. Implying its the same and that no mitigating factors should be taken into account is an ignorant stance on this issue.
They play a game, they don’t assault each other every play. That’s why we have referees who throw flags when players actions fall outside the confines of what is legal in regards to the game. You can’t hold, you can’t block in the back, you can’t grab someone by the face mask, and you sure as fuck can’t use a helmet as a weapon to attempt to bash someone’s head in. You can’t do that.
Yeah I don't think anyone is saying that it's okay. Pushing, punching, tackling etc that would all be assault at your normal desk job... but like you said its a game ..a game that involves physical violence and where we make it okay. Again, Myles should receive punishment, but how can you tell me that the ramifications for Garret's act should be the same as if he worked your normal office job?
RE: RE: RE: RE: Regardless of the nature of playing football, Â
bashing someone’s skull in with a weapon falls outside the confines of playing football, so no, it doesn’t really matter if we’re talking about professional sports, a desk job, or any other profession, testosterone flowing or not or whatever the fuck difference that makes, you can’t do that shit. Ignorant ass clown.
I clearly said I do not condone it. And he should be suspended for the whole season.. but to say it does not make a difference whether it happened on a foobtall field or at a desk job? Its not a desk job, these players assault one another on basically every play. Implying its the same and that no mitigating factors should be taken into account is an ignorant stance on this issue.
They play a game, they don’t assault each other every play. That’s why we have referees who throw flags when players actions fall outside the confines of what is legal in regards to the game. You can’t hold, you can’t block in the back, you can’t grab someone by the face mask, and you sure as fuck can’t use a helmet as a weapon to attempt to bash someone’s head in. You can’t do that.
Yeah I don't think anyone is saying that it's okay. Pushing, punching, tackling etc that would all be assault at your normal desk job... but like you said its a game ..a game that involves physical violence and where we make it okay. Again, Myles should receive punishment, but how can you tell me that the ramifications for Garret's act should be the same as if he worked your normal office job?
He still operates within the confines and the laws of the United States of America. Yes, a certain level of liberty is given to sports that isn't given to the general public. The analogy was given due to the fact that Garrett went outside of the imaginary boundaries of acceptable behavior and used a weapon to try and cause blunt trauma to another player. The analogy was given since you chalked it up to football players been football players and that anyone who thinks he should be suspended is a wimp (ie: "there are so many wimps these days"); which sort of implies you think its acceptable behavior in everyday society also.
Bans for life? “Indefinite” suspensions? Please. The punishment should fit the crime. Rudolph is not dead and evidently he isn’t even going to miss a game.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Regardless of the nature of playing football, Â
bashing someone’s skull in with a weapon falls outside the confines of playing football, so no, it doesn’t really matter if we’re talking about professional sports, a desk job, or any other profession, testosterone flowing or not or whatever the fuck difference that makes, you can’t do that shit. Ignorant ass clown.
I clearly said I do not condone it. And he should be suspended for the whole season.. but to say it does not make a difference whether it happened on a foobtall field or at a desk job? Its not a desk job, these players assault one another on basically every play. Implying its the same and that no mitigating factors should be taken into account is an ignorant stance on this issue.
They play a game, they don’t assault each other every play. That’s why we have referees who throw flags when players actions fall outside the confines of what is legal in regards to the game. You can’t hold, you can’t block in the back, you can’t grab someone by the face mask, and you sure as fuck can’t use a helmet as a weapon to attempt to bash someone’s head in. You can’t do that.
Yeah I don't think anyone is saying that it's okay. Pushing, punching, tackling etc that would all be assault at your normal desk job... but like you said its a game ..a game that involves physical violence and where we make it okay. Again, Myles should receive punishment, but how can you tell me that the ramifications for Garret's act should be the same as if he worked your normal office job?
He still operates within the confines and the laws of the United States of America. Yes, a certain level of liberty is given to sports that isn't given to the general public. The analogy was given due to the fact that Garrett went outside of the imaginary boundaries of acceptable behavior and used a weapon to try and cause blunt trauma to another player. The analogy was given since you chalked it up to football players been football players and that anyone who thinks he should be suspended is a wimp (ie: "there are so many wimps these days"); which sort of implies you think its acceptable behavior in everyday society also.
No that's not what I said, I agree with the suspension. I was talking about those who wanted a lifetime ban. Like I said previously, there are mitigating factors that should be taken into account just as we do in the legal system- where state of mind plays a pivotal role in punishment.
A football player who is having his helmet yanked on and being confronted by three members of the other team has a different state of mind than some wacko at your office job who decides to hit his coworker with a computer. IM NOT SAYING ITS OKAY OR HE SHOULD NOT BE OUT FOR THE YEAR...im saying its two different worlds.
I have no idea who anyone could defend Garrett or blame Rudolph at all. It’s beyond absurd. If this guy was killed or seriously harmed, Garrett would deserve prison time. A completely wreckless and dangerous move. He seems like a real piece of shit.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Regardless of the nature of playing football, Â
bashing someone’s skull in with a weapon falls outside the confines of playing football, so no, it doesn’t really matter if we’re talking about professional sports, a desk job, or any other profession, testosterone flowing or not or whatever the fuck difference that makes, you can’t do that shit. Ignorant ass clown.
I clearly said I do not condone it. And he should be suspended for the whole season.. but to say it does not make a difference whether it happened on a foobtall field or at a desk job? Its not a desk job, these players assault one another on basically every play. Implying its the same and that no mitigating factors should be taken into account is an ignorant stance on this issue.
They play a game, they don’t assault each other every play. That’s why we have referees who throw flags when players actions fall outside the confines of what is legal in regards to the game. You can’t hold, you can’t block in the back, you can’t grab someone by the face mask, and you sure as fuck can’t use a helmet as a weapon to attempt to bash someone’s head in. You can’t do that.
Yeah I don't think anyone is saying that it's okay. Pushing, punching, tackling etc that would all be assault at your normal desk job... but like you said its a game ..a game that involves physical violence and where we make it okay. Again, Myles should receive punishment, but how can you tell me that the ramifications for Garret's act should be the same as if he worked your normal office job?
He still operates within the confines and the laws of the United States of America. Yes, a certain level of liberty is given to sports that isn't given to the general public. The analogy was given due to the fact that Garrett went outside of the imaginary boundaries of acceptable behavior and used a weapon to try and cause blunt trauma to another player. The analogy was given since you chalked it up to football players been football players and that anyone who thinks he should be suspended is a wimp (ie: "there are so many wimps these days"); which sort of implies you think its acceptable behavior in everyday society also.
No that's not what I said, I agree with the suspension. I was talking about those who wanted a lifetime ban. Like I said previously, there are mitigating factors that should be taken into account just as we do in the legal system- where state of mind plays a pivotal role in punishment.
A football player who is having his helmet yanked on and being confronted by three members of the other team has a different state of mind than some wacko at your office job who decides to hit his coworker with a computer. IM NOT SAYING ITS OKAY OR HE SHOULD NOT BE OUT FOR THE YEAR...im saying its two different worlds.
let's try this a different way: Can you clarify your statement of the below?
"Exactly...and something similar happened between two olinemen back in 2013-and only a 4 game suspension came out of that. Some people are actually calling for Garrett to get banned for life. So many wimps these days."
I'm not understanding why people that think he should be banned from the NFL are wimps? What is wimpy about thinking a player using a 6 lb object as a blunt weapon doesn't belong in the NFL have to do with being a wimp? What if he had connected and killed Rudolph -- would a simple suspension be OK with you?
Was a hollow plastic shell lined with cushioning material. It’s not like he hit the “victim” with a bowling ball.
Seriously? I mean, you've got to be kidding me, right? Talk about minimizing something really terrible.
That plastic shell swung at someone's noggin could easily severely injure or even kill that person. Now put that in the hand of a physical beast like Garrett, and I guarantee you that if you got hit with it, you would be out, potentially permanently.
often leads to concussions and potentially even worse. Remove one of the helmets from the head, and swing the other one with full force of your arm at the now exposed human skull.
You really must be a terrible attorney to make such a dumb argument.
Rudolph's actions instigated and escalated the situation, but I don't think a suspension was warranted. A fine, yes. He did try to rip off Garrett's helmet first and escalated the conflict further.
ITA. One can believe this to be true while at the same time recognizing that Garrett tried to assault someone with a weapon and deserved whatever suspension he got.
Was a hollow plastic shell lined with cushioning material. It’s not like he hit the “victim” with a bowling ball.
Just a reminder - the cushion is inside the helmet. Garrett tried to hit him with the outside of the helmet.
May be time for you re-acquaint yourself with the what today's helmet feels like. It's basically six pounds of hard plastic and metal. Then add in a big, fit human being doing a full wind up, reverse bolo punch move with it to inflict damage and...well, you are much closer to a bowling ball than a nerf ball.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Regardless of the nature of playing football, Â
bashing someone’s skull in with a weapon falls outside the confines of playing football, so no, it doesn’t really matter if we’re talking about professional sports, a desk job, or any other profession, testosterone flowing or not or whatever the fuck difference that makes, you can’t do that shit. Ignorant ass clown.
I clearly said I do not condone it. And he should be suspended for the whole season.. but to say it does not make a difference whether it happened on a foobtall field or at a desk job? Its not a desk job, these players assault one another on basically every play. Implying its the same and that no mitigating factors should be taken into account is an ignorant stance on this issue.
They play a game, they don’t assault each other every play. That’s why we have referees who throw flags when players actions fall outside the confines of what is legal in regards to the game. You can’t hold, you can’t block in the back, you can’t grab someone by the face mask, and you sure as fuck can’t use a helmet as a weapon to attempt to bash someone’s head in. You can’t do that.
Yeah I don't think anyone is saying that it's okay. Pushing, punching, tackling etc that would all be assault at your normal desk job... but like you said its a game ..a game that involves physical violence and where we make it okay. Again, Myles should receive punishment, but how can you tell me that the ramifications for Garret's act should be the same as if he worked your normal office job?
He still operates within the confines and the laws of the United States of America. Yes, a certain level of liberty is given to sports that isn't given to the general public. The analogy was given due to the fact that Garrett went outside of the imaginary boundaries of acceptable behavior and used a weapon to try and cause blunt trauma to another player. The analogy was given since you chalked it up to football players been football players and that anyone who thinks he should be suspended is a wimp (ie: "there are so many wimps these days"); which sort of implies you think its acceptable behavior in everyday society also.
No that's not what I said, I agree with the suspension. I was talking about those who wanted a lifetime ban. Like I said previously, there are mitigating factors that should be taken into account just as we do in the legal system- where state of mind plays a pivotal role in punishment.
A football player who is having his helmet yanked on and being confronted by three members of the other team has a different state of mind than some wacko at your office job who decides to hit his coworker with a computer. IM NOT SAYING ITS OKAY OR HE SHOULD NOT BE OUT FOR THE YEAR...im saying its two different worlds.
let's try this a different way: Can you clarify your statement of the below?
"Exactly...and something similar happened between two olinemen back in 2013-and only a 4 game suspension came out of that. Some people are actually calling for Garrett to get banned for life. So many wimps these days."
I'm not understanding why people that think he should be banned from the NFL are wimps? What is wimpy about thinking a player using a 6 lb object as a blunt weapon doesn't belong in the NFL have to do with being a wimp? What if he had connected and killed Rudolph -- would a simple suspension be OK with you?
Because decades and even years ago this would not be the huge story it is now. That said, I'm glad the NFL and its viewer's are taking these things more seriously. My point is that society today has become extremely sensitive and reactionary.
could swing a helmet at a players head, and it was totally cool. Player safety is for pussies! How sensitive we have become as a society that we get this riled up about this kind of stuff? And this CTE nonsense? What a bunch of wimps!! You’re not tough unless you’re fine with traumatic head injuries and living out your retirement years as a vegetable, the youth today are too soft!
apologies after the fact are all meaningless, if you didn't mean to do Â
years before we knew what we do now about concussions and repeated head traumas. I can’t tell you how many times I was told to stop being a pussy and get back in the game after I had likely sustained a concussion during a play. I loved and still love the game of football, the toughness it takes to play, and the hitting. There’s nothing soft about advocating for player safety. I wish we had known these things back when I played. There’s nothing tough about advocating for less safety and more violence in the game, it’s just fucking stupid.
Those helmets are heavy and as hard as a bowling ball. If he had hit him cleanly with the crown of the swung helmet he could definitely have broken his skull.
An old NFL Films story on either the Rams ( of the ‘60s and ‘70s) or Merlin Olson, where he was taking on the whole ‘49s team and swinging his helmet around. Anyone else remember this or what happened to Olson as a result of this). Thanks.
start arresting players when they move outside of the rules of the game . This a case. Any one on this board takes a helmet and uses it on someone else would be in jail..for assault.
Every Sunday, there are literally thousands of aggressive interactions between totally amped athletes. And every Sunday a small minority lead to skirmishes. But virtually none lead to grabbing a helmet and banging a guy's head with it.
The overwhelming majority can play a physical game, and respect the boundaries. That's what makes the game beautiful and amazing.
The ones, or really one, who cannot, don't deserve to play.
I must've watched the clip 20 times, and IMO, aside from the fact that Gerret swung the helmet, a "weapon", what Pouncey did, "vigilante justice" against a guy already on the ground and restrained by others, is WORSE. Especially the repeated kicks, it's multiple attacks, vs a single helmet swing.
I get the NFL going after Gerret, but IMO they're letting Pouncey off the hook way too easily.
Folks saying it's OK because he's defending his QB are totally wrong. It's vigilantism, and every bit as much an out if control, over the top overreaction just as the helmet swing was...
But Pouncey is a Steeler, beloved like the Packers are by NFL officials.
start arresting players when they move outside of the rules of the game . This a case. Any one on this board takes a helmet and uses it on someone else would be in jail..for assault.
From a legal standpoint, what Pouncey did was assault as well.
Although, both Pouncey's and Gerret's actions could be defended from charges, I think, on the basis that they neither man inflicted bodily harm on their intended victims.
I must've watched the clip 20 times, and IMO, aside from the fact that Gerret swung the helmet, a "weapon", what Pouncey did, "vigilante justice" against a guy already on the ground and restrained by others, is WORSE. Especially the repeated kicks, it's multiple attacks, vs a single helmet swing.
I get the NFL going after Gerret, but IMO they're letting Pouncey off the hook way too easily.
Folks saying it's OK because he's defending his QB are totally wrong. It's vigilantism, and every bit as much an out if control, over the top overreaction just as the helmet swing was...
But Pouncey is a Steeler, beloved like the Packers are by NFL officials.
Because the NFL doesn't care about that, they only care about the optics.
RE: How exactly are Pouncey's actions any less offensive than Gerret's? Â
I must've watched the clip 20 times, and IMO, aside from the fact that Gerret swung the helmet, a "weapon", what Pouncey did, "vigilante justice" against a guy already on the ground and restrained by others, is WORSE. Especially the repeated kicks, it's multiple attacks, vs a single helmet swing.
I get the NFL going after Gerret, but IMO they're letting Pouncey off the hook way too easily.
Folks saying it's OK because he's defending his QB are totally wrong. It's vigilantism, and every bit as much an out if control, over the top overreaction just as the helmet swing was...
But Pouncey is a Steeler, beloved like the Packers are by NFL officials.
Pouncey got three games.
Who is to say Garrett wasn’t going to swing the helmet again if Pouncey and Villanueva don’t take down the goon and then try to beat the piss out of him?
Do you want Pouncey to try and reason with a 6’4” 275 maniac swinging a weapon?
Those helmets are heavy and as hard as a bowling ball. If he had hit him cleanly with the crown of the swung helmet he could definitely have broken his skull.
Would coulda shoulda. He didn't. Rudolph's not dead, not even injured and won't miss a game. What do you want to do with the guy who hit the receiver so hard, the receiver's ear was bleeding? Shot at sunrise?
I know there are individuals here (for example LakeGeorge) who have a difficult time with the concepts of proportionality of punishment, intent, and contributory acts which require thought and judgment, but that does not mean those concepts don't exist and should not be considered.
Those helmets are heavy and as hard as a bowling ball. If he had hit him cleanly with the crown of the swung helmet he could definitely have broken his skull.
Would coulda shoulda. He didn't. Rudolph's not dead, not even injured and won't miss a game. What do you want to do with the guy who hit the receiver so hard, the receiver's ear was bleeding? Shot at sunrise?
I know there are individuals here (for example LakeGeorge) who have a difficult time with the concepts of proportionality of punishment, intent, and contributory acts which require thought and judgment, but that does not mean those concepts don't exist and should not be considered.
That's a really long way of trying to claim that you're not simply just an asshole. And it didn't work.
Who is to say Garrett wasn’t going to swing the helmet again if Pouncey and Villanueva don’t take down the goon and then try to beat the piss out of him?
Perhaps you are the one whose perspective is lost?
Consider the 2nd half of your statement again...
The "then try to beat the piss out if him" part. Yeah Garret was a 265# maniac who'd completely lost all self control... And Pouncey and Villanueva are 600+# of man muscle who had already subdued Garret and held him down on the ground while Poncey continued to attack Garrett with blows all over Garret's body with punches and kicks, both!
The three game suspension says something about the NFL'S view of Pouncey's actions, and my criticism was pointed more at the poster(s) here who commented that Pouncey's actions were "rightly justified" or something along those lines.
WUT?
RE: RE: How exactly are Pouncey's actions any less offensive than Gerret's? Â
I must've watched the clip 20 times, and IMO, aside from the fact that Gerret swung the helmet, a "weapon", what Pouncey did, "vigilante justice" against a guy already on the ground and restrained by others, is WORSE...
Because the NFL doesn't care about that, they only care about the optics.
Zeke I agree, it's the "optics" NFL officials care about, about "the optics" are partially or even largely determined by the media. I found it interesting and highly prejudicial that the video clips replayed literally hundreds of times focused on Garret's swing of the helmet. Both Rudolph's instigating acts and Pouncey's retributional slug and kick fest - his literally mugging of the prone Garret - were edited out of most of the replays I saw broadcast and rebroadcast showing the incident. For the purpose of creating a timely video-byte of history, Garret got relatively screwed by the media.
That's not EXCUSING Garret in any way, shape or form. It's pointing out that justice wasn't doled out in equal rations.
Garrett is getting the focus, because Garret escalated the situation outside of the norms of the game. All of the ugliness that ensued is because of him. The focus should be on him.
Pouncey should have just sat on him to control the situation. He didn't need to beat on him and crossed the line. He should be sat down for 3 games.
RE: RE: RE: How exactly are Pouncey's actions any less offensive than Gerret's? Â
I must've watched the clip 20 times, and IMO, aside from the fact that Gerret swung the helmet, a "weapon", what Pouncey did, "vigilante justice" against a guy already on the ground and restrained by others, is WORSE...
Because the NFL doesn't care about that, they only care about the optics.
Zeke I agree, it's the "optics" NFL officials care about, about "the optics" are partially or even largely determined by the media. I found it interesting and highly prejudicial that the video clips replayed literally hundreds of times focused on Garret's swing of the helmet. Both Rudolph's instigating acts and Pouncey's retributional slug and kick fest - his literally mugging of the prone Garret - were edited out of most of the replays I saw broadcast and rebroadcast showing the incident. For the purpose of creating a timely video-byte of history, Garret got relatively screwed by the media.
That's not EXCUSING Garret in any way, shape or form. It's pointing out that justice wasn't doled out in equal rations.
Yes “aside from the fact he swung his helmet, a “weapon”.
You can’t be serious with this right? That action isn’t anywhere close to someone punching and kicking a guy in helmet and pads.
And the “prejudicial” coverage is focused on the helmet swing because of how dangerous and outrageous an act it was. Never seen before in the NFL. I don’t you or people realize how dangerous it was. It’s remarkable Rudolph wasn’t severely injured or killed.
Pouncey Did wrong was the kick. And the kick is being overblown It was a fade way kick with no force.
The punches? He just saw an assault as Garrett hit a player in the head with a helmet. Throwing blows to get the guy down? Nothing wrong with that and it should have not factored into the suspension.
I can’t believe he got 3 games. That’s way too much after reacting to what Garrett did.
It was interesting to watch Fox pregame today and they Â
we're all pissed Rudolph didn't get a suspension for escalating it. It was done until Rudolph ran in there with his hair on fire when two of his o lineman holding Garrett back.
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In comment 14680385 732NYG said:
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bashing someone’s skull in with a weapon falls outside the confines of playing football, so no, it doesn’t really matter if we’re talking about professional sports, a desk job, or any other profession, testosterone flowing or not or whatever the fuck difference that makes, you can’t do that shit. Ignorant ass clown.
I clearly said I do not condone it. And he should be suspended for the whole season.. but to say it does not make a difference whether it happened on a foobtall field or at a desk job? Its not a desk job, these players assault one another on basically every play. Implying its the same and that no mitigating factors should be taken into account is an ignorant stance on this issue.
They play a game, they don’t assault each other every play. That’s why we have referees who throw flags when players actions fall outside the confines of what is legal in regards to the game. You can’t hold, you can’t block in the back, you can’t grab someone by the face mask, and you sure as fuck can’t use a helmet as a weapon to attempt to bash someone’s head in. You can’t do that.
Yeah I don't think anyone is saying that it's okay. Pushing, punching, tackling etc that would all be assault at your normal desk job... but like you said its a game ..a game that involves physical violence and where we make it okay. Again, Myles should receive punishment, but how can you tell me that the ramifications for Garret's act should be the same as if he worked your normal office job?
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In comment 14680403 nyballa0891 said:
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In comment 14680385 732NYG said:
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bashing someone’s skull in with a weapon falls outside the confines of playing football, so no, it doesn’t really matter if we’re talking about professional sports, a desk job, or any other profession, testosterone flowing or not or whatever the fuck difference that makes, you can’t do that shit. Ignorant ass clown.
I clearly said I do not condone it. And he should be suspended for the whole season.. but to say it does not make a difference whether it happened on a foobtall field or at a desk job? Its not a desk job, these players assault one another on basically every play. Implying its the same and that no mitigating factors should be taken into account is an ignorant stance on this issue.
They play a game, they don’t assault each other every play. That’s why we have referees who throw flags when players actions fall outside the confines of what is legal in regards to the game. You can’t hold, you can’t block in the back, you can’t grab someone by the face mask, and you sure as fuck can’t use a helmet as a weapon to attempt to bash someone’s head in. You can’t do that.
Yeah I don't think anyone is saying that it's okay. Pushing, punching, tackling etc that would all be assault at your normal desk job... but like you said its a game ..a game that involves physical violence and where we make it okay. Again, Myles should receive punishment, but how can you tell me that the ramifications for Garret's act should be the same as if he worked your normal office job?
He still operates within the confines and the laws of the United States of America. Yes, a certain level of liberty is given to sports that isn't given to the general public. The analogy was given due to the fact that Garrett went outside of the imaginary boundaries of acceptable behavior and used a weapon to try and cause blunt trauma to another player. The analogy was given since you chalked it up to football players been football players and that anyone who thinks he should be suspended is a wimp (ie: "there are so many wimps these days"); which sort of implies you think its acceptable behavior in everyday society also.
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In comment 14680409 732NYG said:
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In comment 14680403 nyballa0891 said:
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In comment 14680385 732NYG said:
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bashing someone’s skull in with a weapon falls outside the confines of playing football, so no, it doesn’t really matter if we’re talking about professional sports, a desk job, or any other profession, testosterone flowing or not or whatever the fuck difference that makes, you can’t do that shit. Ignorant ass clown.
I clearly said I do not condone it. And he should be suspended for the whole season.. but to say it does not make a difference whether it happened on a foobtall field or at a desk job? Its not a desk job, these players assault one another on basically every play. Implying its the same and that no mitigating factors should be taken into account is an ignorant stance on this issue.
They play a game, they don’t assault each other every play. That’s why we have referees who throw flags when players actions fall outside the confines of what is legal in regards to the game. You can’t hold, you can’t block in the back, you can’t grab someone by the face mask, and you sure as fuck can’t use a helmet as a weapon to attempt to bash someone’s head in. You can’t do that.
Yeah I don't think anyone is saying that it's okay. Pushing, punching, tackling etc that would all be assault at your normal desk job... but like you said its a game ..a game that involves physical violence and where we make it okay. Again, Myles should receive punishment, but how can you tell me that the ramifications for Garret's act should be the same as if he worked your normal office job?
He still operates within the confines and the laws of the United States of America. Yes, a certain level of liberty is given to sports that isn't given to the general public. The analogy was given due to the fact that Garrett went outside of the imaginary boundaries of acceptable behavior and used a weapon to try and cause blunt trauma to another player. The analogy was given since you chalked it up to football players been football players and that anyone who thinks he should be suspended is a wimp (ie: "there are so many wimps these days"); which sort of implies you think its acceptable behavior in everyday society also.
No that's not what I said, I agree with the suspension. I was talking about those who wanted a lifetime ban. Like I said previously, there are mitigating factors that should be taken into account just as we do in the legal system- where state of mind plays a pivotal role in punishment.
A football player who is having his helmet yanked on and being confronted by three members of the other team has a different state of mind than some wacko at your office job who decides to hit his coworker with a computer. IM NOT SAYING ITS OKAY OR HE SHOULD NOT BE OUT FOR THE YEAR...im saying its two different worlds.
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In comment 14680421 nyballa0891 said:
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In comment 14680409 732NYG said:
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In comment 14680403 nyballa0891 said:
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In comment 14680385 732NYG said:
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bashing someone’s skull in with a weapon falls outside the confines of playing football, so no, it doesn’t really matter if we’re talking about professional sports, a desk job, or any other profession, testosterone flowing or not or whatever the fuck difference that makes, you can’t do that shit. Ignorant ass clown.
I clearly said I do not condone it. And he should be suspended for the whole season.. but to say it does not make a difference whether it happened on a foobtall field or at a desk job? Its not a desk job, these players assault one another on basically every play. Implying its the same and that no mitigating factors should be taken into account is an ignorant stance on this issue.
They play a game, they don’t assault each other every play. That’s why we have referees who throw flags when players actions fall outside the confines of what is legal in regards to the game. You can’t hold, you can’t block in the back, you can’t grab someone by the face mask, and you sure as fuck can’t use a helmet as a weapon to attempt to bash someone’s head in. You can’t do that.
Yeah I don't think anyone is saying that it's okay. Pushing, punching, tackling etc that would all be assault at your normal desk job... but like you said its a game ..a game that involves physical violence and where we make it okay. Again, Myles should receive punishment, but how can you tell me that the ramifications for Garret's act should be the same as if he worked your normal office job?
He still operates within the confines and the laws of the United States of America. Yes, a certain level of liberty is given to sports that isn't given to the general public. The analogy was given due to the fact that Garrett went outside of the imaginary boundaries of acceptable behavior and used a weapon to try and cause blunt trauma to another player. The analogy was given since you chalked it up to football players been football players and that anyone who thinks he should be suspended is a wimp (ie: "there are so many wimps these days"); which sort of implies you think its acceptable behavior in everyday society also.
No that's not what I said, I agree with the suspension. I was talking about those who wanted a lifetime ban. Like I said previously, there are mitigating factors that should be taken into account just as we do in the legal system- where state of mind plays a pivotal role in punishment.
A football player who is having his helmet yanked on and being confronted by three members of the other team has a different state of mind than some wacko at your office job who decides to hit his coworker with a computer. IM NOT SAYING ITS OKAY OR HE SHOULD NOT BE OUT FOR THE YEAR...im saying its two different worlds.
let's try this a different way: Can you clarify your statement of the below?
"Exactly...and something similar happened between two olinemen back in 2013-and only a 4 game suspension came out of that. Some people are actually calling for Garrett to get banned for life. So many wimps these days."
I'm not understanding why people that think he should be banned from the NFL are wimps? What is wimpy about thinking a player using a 6 lb object as a blunt weapon doesn't belong in the NFL have to do with being a wimp? What if he had connected and killed Rudolph -- would a simple suspension be OK with you?
Seriously? I mean, you've got to be kidding me, right? Talk about minimizing something really terrible.
That plastic shell swung at someone's noggin could easily severely injure or even kill that person. Now put that in the hand of a physical beast like Garrett, and I guarantee you that if you got hit with it, you would be out, potentially permanently.
You really must be a terrible attorney to make such a dumb argument.
"Come on Myles. Get with the program. Every thug gotta have a fall guy."
Rudolph's actions instigated and escalated the situation, but I don't think a suspension was warranted. A fine, yes. He did try to rip off Garrett's helmet first and escalated the conflict further.
ITA. One can believe this to be true while at the same time recognizing that Garrett tried to assault someone with a weapon and deserved whatever suspension he got.
Just a reminder - the cushion is inside the helmet. Garrett tried to hit him with the outside of the helmet.
May be time for you re-acquaint yourself with the what today's helmet feels like. It's basically six pounds of hard plastic and metal. Then add in a big, fit human being doing a full wind up, reverse bolo punch move with it to inflict damage and...well, you are much closer to a bowling ball than a nerf ball.
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bashing someone’s skull in with a weapon falls outside the confines of playing football, so no, it doesn’t really matter if we’re talking about professional sports, a desk job, or any other profession, testosterone flowing or not or whatever the fuck difference that makes, you can’t do that shit. Ignorant ass clown.
I clearly said I do not condone it. And he should be suspended for the whole season.. but to say it does not make a difference whether it happened on a foobtall field or at a desk job? Its not a desk job, these players assault one another on basically every play. Implying its the same and that no mitigating factors should be taken into account is an ignorant stance on this issue.
They play a game, they don’t assault each other every play. That’s why we have referees who throw flags when players actions fall outside the confines of what is legal in regards to the game. You can’t hold, you can’t block in the back, you can’t grab someone by the face mask, and you sure as fuck can’t use a helmet as a weapon to attempt to bash someone’s head in. You can’t do that.
Yeah I don't think anyone is saying that it's okay. Pushing, punching, tackling etc that would all be assault at your normal desk job... but like you said its a game ..a game that involves physical violence and where we make it okay. Again, Myles should receive punishment, but how can you tell me that the ramifications for Garret's act should be the same as if he worked your normal office job?
He still operates within the confines and the laws of the United States of America. Yes, a certain level of liberty is given to sports that isn't given to the general public. The analogy was given due to the fact that Garrett went outside of the imaginary boundaries of acceptable behavior and used a weapon to try and cause blunt trauma to another player. The analogy was given since you chalked it up to football players been football players and that anyone who thinks he should be suspended is a wimp (ie: "there are so many wimps these days"); which sort of implies you think its acceptable behavior in everyday society also.
No that's not what I said, I agree with the suspension. I was talking about those who wanted a lifetime ban. Like I said previously, there are mitigating factors that should be taken into account just as we do in the legal system- where state of mind plays a pivotal role in punishment.
A football player who is having his helmet yanked on and being confronted by three members of the other team has a different state of mind than some wacko at your office job who decides to hit his coworker with a computer. IM NOT SAYING ITS OKAY OR HE SHOULD NOT BE OUT FOR THE YEAR...im saying its two different worlds.
let's try this a different way: Can you clarify your statement of the below?
"Exactly...and something similar happened between two olinemen back in 2013-and only a 4 game suspension came out of that. Some people are actually calling for Garrett to get banned for life. So many wimps these days."
I'm not understanding why people that think he should be banned from the NFL are wimps? What is wimpy about thinking a player using a 6 lb object as a blunt weapon doesn't belong in the NFL have to do with being a wimp? What if he had connected and killed Rudolph -- would a simple suspension be OK with you?
Because decades and even years ago this would not be the huge story it is now. That said, I'm glad the NFL and its viewer's are taking these things more seriously. My point is that society today has become extremely sensitive and reactionary.
Obtuse. Is it deliberate?
What a shock - HJ has the contrarian/douche take.
Your description is an embarrassing joke.
yeahhh....obviously you have never played the game on any kind of competitive level other than with your My Little Pony app....
Flat wrong
Typical homer, doesn't know what the fuck he is talking about, but it doesn't stop him from opening his face.
The overwhelming majority can play a physical game, and respect the boundaries. That's what makes the game beautiful and amazing.
The ones, or really one, who cannot, don't deserve to play.
I love the image of Greg killing someone with a sheet of newspaper, but that softie couldn’t kill a fly with a rolled up newspaper...🤣
I get the NFL going after Gerret, but IMO they're letting Pouncey off the hook way too easily.
Folks saying it's OK because he's defending his QB are totally wrong. It's vigilantism, and every bit as much an out if control, over the top overreaction just as the helmet swing was...
But Pouncey is a Steeler, beloved like the Packers are by NFL officials.
From a legal standpoint, what Pouncey did was assault as well.
Although, both Pouncey's and Gerret's actions could be defended from charges, I think, on the basis that they neither man inflicted bodily harm on their intended victims.
You think the lawyers ruined sports? The police would kill kill it.
You think the lawyers ruined sports? The police would kill kill it.
Agree 100% too. Wasn't suggesting it. But I think the league might use legal guidelines to make their punishments handed down...
more impartial.
I get the NFL going after Gerret, but IMO they're letting Pouncey off the hook way too easily.
Folks saying it's OK because he's defending his QB are totally wrong. It's vigilantism, and every bit as much an out if control, over the top overreaction just as the helmet swing was...
But Pouncey is a Steeler, beloved like the Packers are by NFL officials.
Because the NFL doesn't care about that, they only care about the optics.
I get the NFL going after Gerret, but IMO they're letting Pouncey off the hook way too easily.
Folks saying it's OK because he's defending his QB are totally wrong. It's vigilantism, and every bit as much an out if control, over the top overreaction just as the helmet swing was...
But Pouncey is a Steeler, beloved like the Packers are by NFL officials.
Pouncey got three games.
Who is to say Garrett wasn’t going to swing the helmet again if Pouncey and Villanueva don’t take down the goon and then try to beat the piss out of him?
Do you want Pouncey to try and reason with a 6’4” 275 maniac swinging a weapon?
Get some perspective on this...
I know there are individuals here (for example LakeGeorge) who have a difficult time with the concepts of proportionality of punishment, intent, and contributory acts which require thought and judgment, but that does not mean those concepts don't exist and should not be considered.
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Those helmets are heavy and as hard as a bowling ball. If he had hit him cleanly with the crown of the swung helmet he could definitely have broken his skull.
Would coulda shoulda. He didn't. Rudolph's not dead, not even injured and won't miss a game. What do you want to do with the guy who hit the receiver so hard, the receiver's ear was bleeding? Shot at sunrise?
I know there are individuals here (for example LakeGeorge) who have a difficult time with the concepts of proportionality of punishment, intent, and contributory acts which require thought and judgment, but that does not mean those concepts don't exist and should not be considered.
That's a really long way of trying to claim that you're not simply just an asshole. And it didn't work.
Garrett could have easily murdered someone on a football with his actions. Does anything else matter?
Perhaps you are the one whose perspective is lost?
Consider the 2nd half of your statement again...
The "then try to beat the piss out if him" part. Yeah Garret was a 265# maniac who'd completely lost all self control... And Pouncey and Villanueva are 600+# of man muscle who had already subdued Garret and held him down on the ground while Poncey continued to attack Garrett with blows all over Garret's body with punches and kicks, both!
The three game suspension says something about the NFL'S view of Pouncey's actions, and my criticism was pointed more at the poster(s) here who commented that Pouncey's actions were "rightly justified" or something along those lines.
WUT?
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I must've watched the clip 20 times, and IMO, aside from the fact that Gerret swung the helmet, a "weapon", what Pouncey did, "vigilante justice" against a guy already on the ground and restrained by others, is WORSE...
Because the NFL doesn't care about that, they only care about the optics.
Zeke I agree, it's the "optics" NFL officials care about, about "the optics" are partially or even largely determined by the media. I found it interesting and highly prejudicial that the video clips replayed literally hundreds of times focused on Garret's swing of the helmet. Both Rudolph's instigating acts and Pouncey's retributional slug and kick fest - his literally mugging of the prone Garret - were edited out of most of the replays I saw broadcast and rebroadcast showing the incident. For the purpose of creating a timely video-byte of history, Garret got relatively screwed by the media.
That's not EXCUSING Garret in any way, shape or form. It's pointing out that justice wasn't doled out in equal rations.
Pouncey should have just sat on him to control the situation. He didn't need to beat on him and crossed the line. He should be sat down for 3 games.
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In comment 14680663 BlueLou'sBack said:
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I must've watched the clip 20 times, and IMO, aside from the fact that Gerret swung the helmet, a "weapon", what Pouncey did, "vigilante justice" against a guy already on the ground and restrained by others, is WORSE...
Because the NFL doesn't care about that, they only care about the optics.
Zeke I agree, it's the "optics" NFL officials care about, about "the optics" are partially or even largely determined by the media. I found it interesting and highly prejudicial that the video clips replayed literally hundreds of times focused on Garret's swing of the helmet. Both Rudolph's instigating acts and Pouncey's retributional slug and kick fest - his literally mugging of the prone Garret - were edited out of most of the replays I saw broadcast and rebroadcast showing the incident. For the purpose of creating a timely video-byte of history, Garret got relatively screwed by the media.
That's not EXCUSING Garret in any way, shape or form. It's pointing out that justice wasn't doled out in equal rations.
Yes “aside from the fact he swung his helmet, a “weapon”.
You can’t be serious with this right? That action isn’t anywhere close to someone punching and kicking a guy in helmet and pads.
And the “prejudicial” coverage is focused on the helmet swing because of how dangerous and outrageous an act it was. Never seen before in the NFL. I don’t you or people realize how dangerous it was. It’s remarkable Rudolph wasn’t severely injured or killed.
The punches? He just saw an assault as Garrett hit a player in the head with a helmet. Throwing blows to get the guy down? Nothing wrong with that and it should have not factored into the suspension.
I can’t believe he got 3 games. That’s way too much after reacting to what Garrett did.