Well, who knew that Dave TE goes beyond just his NFL and College Football scouting. His scouting services includes basketball and baseball as well (maybe hockey too).
Anyway, he did a podcast over the weekend with a few Yankee tidbits.
- He said he's hearing that Cole will go to one of the big boys and unlike a usual Boras client, will look to sign earlier than later. Yankees and Dodgers the two biggest contenders for him. If he wants West Coast, he's going to Dodgers
- He thinks the Yankees will talk to Cole and Strausburg, but will end up signing Wheeler from the Mets because they know he's been in the NY scene and he will cost much less than the big 2.
- Yankees are looking to make a splash with a trade. Right now they've got 4 trade chips lined up- Andujar, Frazier, Florial, and Deivi Garcia. Yankees are going to go after Lindor as the Indians know he's going to leave in 2 years and his value is at his highest. If they can't agree to a deal for Lindor, than some part of that package could be used to land Clevinger.
- Didi will end up Cincinnati, especially if the Yankees get Lindor
- Red Sox are screwed with Mookie Betts because everyone knows he's testing free agency no matter what, so the Sox are in a tough spot to trade him. They need to dump money.
Anyway, I could see Wheeler to the Yankees, even though I want Cole. But interesting that he thinks Cole will sign early and not wait until February again. He thinks Boras wants to set the market early and let the rest fall into place with the others.
And I'll keep banging the drum for Lindor until that situation is resolved one way or another
Despite Greg from LI's dislike of Wheeler, I have a feeling that is who the Yankees want. Much cheaper and with the new analytics folks hoping to turn him into Gerrit Cole part deux and that is a possibility.
That is an expensive price for Lindor, but what a great leadoff guy. Move DJLM to the 3 hole behind Judge and in front of Stanton, or leave DJ as leadoff and Lindor to 3 hole?
I'm not sure I understand your disdain for Wheeler, besides maybe tweaking Mets fans. He's better than Eovaldi. Coming off two very strong seasons and the underlying numbers mostly check out
I was suprised by that too, but you look at it and he's turning 29 in December. He broke in later and he's arbitration eligible and will cost a pretty penny there. As he enters his 30s, his trade value starts to go down. It seems like the Indians are prioritizing trading guys a little earlier to re-stock their team and trim payroll. Hence the Lindor stuff.
Despite Greg from LI's dislike of Wheeler, I have a feeling that is who the Yankees want. Much cheaper and with the new analytics folks hoping to turn him into Gerrit Cole part deux and that is a possibility.
Aside from the fact the Yankees have little to no recent history of elevating pitchers from their previous form, all of Wheeler's numbers are inferior to Cole's pre-trade with the slight exception of strikeouts. They can sign Wheeler, but if they're expecting him to be better than a number three starter, I think they're fooling themselves.
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Despite Greg from LI's dislike of Wheeler, I have a feeling that is who the Yankees want. Much cheaper and with the new analytics folks hoping to turn him into Gerrit Cole part deux and that is a possibility.
Aside from the fact the Yankees have little to no recent history of elevating pitchers from their previous form, all of Wheeler's numbers are inferior to Cole's pre-trade with the slight exception of strikeouts. They can sign Wheeler, but if they're expecting him to be better than a number three starter, I think they're fooling themselves.
If they see his "stuff" is upgradeable, then I think they go for him. I haven't a clue. To me Wheeler is a big arm with little meaningful results(probably like you all). Admittedly, that Yanks are better at position player evals, but it is remarkable what they got from Urshela, Voit and Tauchman that other teams did not see.
Both are certainly on the Hall of Fame track. They could be a historic duo.
I don't see a big spend in FA for a top guy, including a Wheeler type.
I don't see a big spend in FA for a top guy, including a Wheeler type.
I agree. I think they will stay the course, add another #3, another BP arm, and will make a big play for Lindor.
I’ll drive him myself
Yeah I don't really think Lindor would be the best use of trade chips, but for that package plus Frazier abso bleeping lutely.
Haha, yeah I don't either but sign me the fuck up for that.
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Andujar, Deivi, and Oswald Peraza gets Lindor. Suffice it to say I don't.
Haha, yeah I don't either but sign me the fuck up for that.
Probably Frazier too.
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The Yankees would be crazy pass on that deal.
Yeah I don't really think Lindor would be the best use of trade chips, but for that package plus Frazier abso bleeping lutely.
Lindor would be a great help to the lineup and defense. Have no problem using assets for him especially if we use our strongest asset(money) for cole or strasburg
Yankee related:
- In addition to Lindor and Clevinger, the Yankees are asking the Indians about Shane Bieber, trying to get one of those guys for the package above.
- Yankees have a fallback with Arizona for one of their outfielders for Robbie Ray, who has been a target forever for Cashman
- Yankees see Garcia as a guy similar to Sheffield in that he got exposed a little in AAA, and he will be a reliever more than a starter and they want to move him while he's hot. Dave says that Florial is super overrated at this point
- In a very interesting comment, the Cubs are shopping everyone right now. And there have been discussions of Ellsbury for Yu Darvish. It would be a swap of bad contracts, with the Cubs eating money as well as Ellsbury is off the books after this year.
In Mets/Yankees: When Brodie said that there will be no more personal catchers, that was a shot at Thor. He is hearing that Thor will be traded by the deadline, but if a team comes with a package in the Winter, the Mets could deal him in December. Yankees will come knocking since they tried to get Thor and/or Wheeler last July.
In Mets news- Mets are in on Jackie Bradley Jr. as the Red Sox need to cut back on salary.
In other team info
- Josh Donaldson looking to get paid and could end up in LA with the Dodgers
- Cole might have considered San Francisco, but when they got Kapler he won't go there
- Phillies are in on Cole and Strasburg, but probably won't land either. Will go after MadBum, who could end up in Philly or with the Braves
- Kris Bryant from the Cubs is available for a #2 pitcher, but as said above in the Darvish thing, the entire roster is up for discussion in a trade.
- When the Pirates finally get around to hiring a GM and manager, Starling Marte will be available for teams looking for a CF.
just to be clear, Greg, this means you're taking on 4 years and $81M of Yu.
versus 1 year and ~$27M (including buyout) on Ells.
I just fainted
Well that would be quite something if true.
Um. Mike Trout is within the last 10 years so... no.
Greg,
Trout was the #2 prospect in baseball before coming up. Dominguez may end up being incredible but he's not currently viewed as the best prospect in 10 years c'mon. Heck, Harper was viewed as the next Mantle. Strasburg was viewed as a generational talent as a SP, Ohtani, Buxton was viewed as a phenom, Soto, Acuna. There have been some ridiculously highly regarded prospects over the past 10 years.
this is fun to hear!
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and last tidbit, Jasson Dominguez is the best prospect MLB has seen in over 10 years and he will be in the Bronx in 3 years, similar to Ken Griffey Jr. coming up as a teenager and starting in CF.
Um. Mike Trout is within the last 10 years so... no.
Dan, This is from Dave TE and other scouts he's talked with. Said he's the next Mike Trout actually, but the comp of coming up as a teenager was like Griffey Jr. and Soto.
We did see the entire 2014 IFA class flame out, there are no sure things when it comes to Latin kids, no matter how perfect they seem on paper. Granted, Dominguez is head and shoulders above them, but you just never know.
The last time we signed a top ranked amateur and have him actually contribute, it was Sanchez, and it took him what, 5-6 years?
Mantle was something. I think he only weighed 165/170 when he came up and in 1956 (56 in '56) he only weighed 175/180, iirc from the books I read.
Amazing with all that power he was about the same speed home to first as Willie Wilson of the KC Royals - like 3.5 sec home to 1st.
FWIW, B-R has him listed at 5'11" 195.
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Trades are a-comin'
Jasson - ( New Window )
FWIW, B-R has him listed at 5'11" 195.
In 1956? 195 lbs, I remember that weight in the late 60s. Probably 210 with a few beers downed.
Hey, probably 35-40 years since I read it. And of course, I could/probably am be wrong, I just remember that he seemed awful light to hit that many HRs...
He could fly, but we all remember(maybe you don't, ha) the destroyed legs and hobbling around in LF until they had to move him to 1B.
You guys are splitting hairs. Point is he’s a phenom. If he isn’t the best prospect he’s certainly one of the best. Works for me.
You are going to bring a common sense perspective?
I don't know. Mods catch you and its curtains for djm.
On a serious note, hope you are well
FWIW, B-R has him listed at 5'11" 195.
Im sure we agree that endless possible dissective era to era comparisons are going to go in circles.
Mantle was a great baseball player. Not the greatest, but easily within the top 25 to ever play the now more than a century old game
And Tom Tresh, etc.
Murcer was a good player, though, who had two legitimately great seasons for them in 1971-72.
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Roy White actually had a really underrated career and was a very good player, but he never produced a season close to Murcer's '71-72. White even had an excellent 1971, hitting .292/.388/.469......but Murcer hit .331/.427/.543.
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He wasn't.
Really ? I don't remember that. Murcer was a fine player, but I don't recall anyone ever saying he was the next Mantle. He wasn't even considered their best offensive player at the time, Roy White was.
Actually it was Ross Moschitto (sp?)
Roy White actually had a really underrated career and was a very good player, but he never produced a season close to Murcer's '71-72. White even had an excellent 1971, hitting .292/.388/.469......but Murcer hit .331/.427/.543.
Greg is 100% correct as far as the hype. I was there, I remember it. It is also why I brought up Tom Tresh (hey he was a failed SS just like Mickey) and wore #6(IIRC) just like Mickey.
I was there when Murcer was in his prime. Nobody thought he'd be the next Mickey Mantle. He had good power in an era in which pitching dominated and he played for a power starved team. He was a very good but not great center fielder, he had good but not great speed and although he was a home run threat he didn't hit for great average. Both Roy White and Danny Cater hit for higher average. Also comparing Murcer to Tom Tresh is ridiculous. Tresh came up in 1962 and was gone by the time Murcer came up in 1969.
When Murcer joined the Yankees, the team's Public Relations Department seized upon those similarities and floated predictions that Murcer would become "another Mickey Mantle." But Murcer never could live up to those comparisons to one of the game's greats. Nobody could.
From the NYT eulogy:
This one, from the Daily News, mentions both Tresh and Murcer:
all the "next Mantles" - ( New Window )
This wouldn't shock me. Cleveland faces real financial constraints. If adding a 33 year old Kluber coming off of a lost season helps to maximize the haul they get from moving a cornerstone piece like Lindor, I don't think they get hesitate to do it.
Once you're in a place where (believe that) your best interests involve moving a player of Lindor's caliber, parting with a mid-30s SP who's really good but has let you down in some big spots is almost a logical next step.
If you want to be reminded how screwy awards voting in baseball used to be, look at the 1971 MVP vote. Murcer hit .331/.427/.543 yet only finished 8th in the MVP voting behind....Freddie Patek.
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Good vid. He has a strong upper body (for a 16 yo) planted on top of runner's legs. Hopefully he has the maturity to handle to heap of expectations already being thrown his way. I read he likes to work on his game so this is a start.
Bound for Cooperstown.
Ron, with all due respect, Murcer was absolutely hyped as the next Mickey Mantle. Was it before and just as he got to the Bronx? Yes.
Was it after he did get to the Bronx and everyone saw him? No.
But he absolutely and positively(as was Tommy Tresh) hyped as the next Mickey Mantle.
You are right, he was not the player in any respect that Mickey was. There is not one thing, except maybe personal integrity, that he was better at than Mickey. But that does not mean that the Yanks did not hype Bobby as the next Mickey Mantle.
hmm - I see 8 pm ET is the deadline so maybe yet to come this evening.