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And so it begins, players questioning coaches

V.I.G. : 12/1/2019 7:13 pm
Quote:
Giants CB Janoris Jenkins is not happy with DC James Bettcher. ďYouíve got to use your weapons. Iím the only one in the league that doesnít travel (w/the opponents top WR). I donít understand why ...Ē


Quote:
... Itís common sense. Iím on the left side of the field all game. I get two passes thrown my way. All the top corners in the league travel. Rabbit doesnít travel anymore.Ē

https://twitter.com/rvacchianosny/status/1201250461279555585 - ( New Window )
I wouldíve bet all four Lombardi Trophies  
bceagle05 : 12/1/2019 7:14 pm : link
that it was Jenkins. Amazing this loser survived the ongoing Gettleman purge.
Heís not wrong  
cjac : 12/1/2019 7:15 pm : link
But he shouldnít be saying it
RE: I wouldíve bet all four Lombardi Trophies  
V.I.G. : 12/1/2019 7:16 pm : link
In comment 14698391 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
that it was Jenkins. Amazing this loser survived the ongoing Gettleman purge.

either way, both rabbit and bettch are likely gone next year
He's correct  
arniefez : 12/1/2019 7:17 pm : link
The DC is not the Giants problem though. The HC is the problem. The DC works for the HC. The HC is in charge of the whole team not just calling the horrible plays.
I buried the comment  
Diver_Down : 12/1/2019 7:17 pm : link
in another thread a few hours ago.
Rabbit Doesn't Travel Anymore - ( New Window )
The coaches need to go  
Matt in SGS : 12/1/2019 7:18 pm : link
but Jenkins isn't a top corner anymore so the fact that he doesn't "travel" is probably a good thing. Let's go back to the footage in Tampa when the only thing that stopped Evans was the end zone.

And when you have rookie corners on the field, you are going to see offenses go after them. That's part of the deal.

Still, I would expect to hear more "unnamed" sources in the remaining few weeks questioning this staff. But perhaps it's just part of the historic youth the Giants have, or whatever nonsense Shurmur was spewing.
If we were in contention for a playoff spot, he should travel. But  
Ira : 12/1/2019 7:19 pm : link
the way they're doing it now gives the young defensive backs valuable experience covering better players.
anyone  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 12/1/2019 7:19 pm : link
surprised? And anyone surprised that it is Jenkins?

He's not wrong. But I still don't understand why they didn't trade him. They'll lament that and not moving Evan Engram.
He's somewhat right, but  
section125 : 12/1/2019 7:19 pm : link
it would also help if he didn't commit his PI or hold weekly and then perform a phantom tackle or two.
He's got balls  
Jay on the Island : 12/1/2019 7:21 pm : link
For the second week in a row he took a boneheaded penalty on 3rd down when they made a stop. Against the Bears instead of punting they were awarded a 1st down and scored a TD on the very next play. He's made similar mistakes this year.
He's not wrong though  
Giantfan21 : 12/1/2019 7:21 pm : link
Im sure there are a lot of players questioning the coaches but jenkins is the only one with balls to say anything
RE: anyone  
Jay on the Island : 12/1/2019 7:22 pm : link
In comment 14698403 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
surprised? And anyone surprised that it is Jenkins?

He's not wrong. But I still don't understand why they didn't trade him. They'll lament that and not moving Evan Engram.

Agreed, I have no idea why they didn't move him at the deadline.
RE: The coaches need to go  
FStubbs : 12/1/2019 7:22 pm : link
In comment 14698400 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
but Jenkins isn't a top corner anymore so the fact that he doesn't "travel" is probably a good thing. Let's go back to the footage in Tampa when the only thing that stopped Evans was the end zone.

And when you have rookie corners on the field, you are going to see offenses go after them. That's part of the deal.

Still, I would expect to hear more "unnamed" sources in the remaining few weeks questioning this staff. But perhaps it's just part of the historic youth the Giants have, or whatever nonsense Shurmur was spewing.


Barkley's questioning the practices.
RE: He's correct  
section125 : 12/1/2019 7:22 pm : link
In comment 14698395 arniefez said:
Quote:
The DC is not the Giants problem though. The HC is the problem. The DC works for the HC. The HC is in charge of the whole team not just calling the horrible plays.


No Bettcher is a problem. His defenses suck. Really suck.
RE: anyone  
morrison40 : 12/1/2019 7:23 pm : link
Agreed, Engram has no future with this team, that I can see

n comment 14698403 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
surprised? And anyone surprised that it is Jenkins?

He's not wrong. But I still don't understand why they didn't trade him. They'll lament that and not moving Evan Engram.
Surprised the bullshit didnít start weeks ago.  
The_Boss : 12/1/2019 7:24 pm : link
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Letís be real  
Biteymax22 : 12/1/2019 7:24 pm : link
The fans are questioning the coaches, the media is questioning the coaches, Iím sure the players have been for quite some time. This is what happens when you spend 28 games making stupid decisions, bad play calls and rolling out bad game plans.

Shurmur has lost the team, its obvious by their play.
RE: RE: anyone  
Diver_Down : 12/1/2019 7:26 pm : link
In comment 14698418 morrison40 said:
Quote:
Agreed, Engram has no future with this team, that I can see

n comment 14698403 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


surprised? And anyone surprised that it is Jenkins?

He's not wrong. But I still don't understand why they didn't trade him. They'll lament that and not moving Evan Engram.



Don't be surprised if he is traded before the draft. It will make the decision on his 5th year option another team's decision.
Jackrabbit  
GiantsRage2007 : 12/1/2019 7:28 pm : link
Had some ďbusiness decisionsĒ under McAdoo in 2017 & last year as well. He also gave up 3 td to Mike Evans in Tampa.

I agree with Eric, not sure why he wasnít traded. Anyone and everyone who spoke out ever in the media was jettisoned by DG. Not sure how he survived.

I donít think itís a stretch to say he wonít be back next year.
Carl Banks  
joeinpa : 12/1/2019 7:28 pm : link
In the post game criticized a defensive that keeps putting players, in this case Haley, in situations where they cannot succeed.
Huge Janoris Jenkins fan here...  
M.S. : 12/1/2019 7:28 pm : link

...and I have no problem whatsoever that he came out and said that.

It's not like this team is in a tight race and any dissension would be an unwanted distraction.

RE: Carl Banks  
M.S. : 12/1/2019 7:29 pm : link
In comment 14698426 joeinpa said:
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In the post game criticized a defensive that keeps putting players, in this case Haley, in situations where they cannot succeed.

Exactly.

It's like Betcher wants to expose Grant Haley.

I say: WTF???
It's pretty funny  
Jay on the Island : 12/1/2019 7:30 pm : link
Remember back to the offseason when the coaches and FO were discussing why they brought Jenkins back. They raved about his leadership and value as a mentor for the young DB's. I don't think this is what they envisioned.
RE: Carl Banks  
Jay on the Island : 12/1/2019 7:31 pm : link
In comment 14698426 joeinpa said:
Quote:
In the post game criticized a defensive that keeps putting players, in this case Haley, in situations where they cannot succeed.

It's a great question. Why have they kept sending Bethea out there all season long when he's getting beaten badly every week?
Janoris Jenkins deserves a lot better than the Giants...  
M.S. : 12/1/2019 7:32 pm : link

...shit show.

And don't worry about him if the Giants cut bait.

He's a high-end cover guy and he will be starting next season, hopefully with a franchise that isn't wallowing in its own ineptitude.
he's right.  
japanhead : 12/1/2019 7:33 pm : link
bettcher has been as awful with the defense as shurmur has been with the offense. the team is 2-10 for a reason and it's not because jenkins is some kind of has been. jenkins is the best player in the secondary and by a long shot. people want him gone because he made an obvious point in a lost season when the team is about to lose out?

the coaching is so bad it's criminal.
Jenkins may be right (probably is)  
Scuzzlebutt : 12/1/2019 7:47 pm : link
But he is a quitter and a loser and I am shocked they allowed him to hang around and poison the minds of our young DBs. He obviously quit in 2017 and I will never respect him after witnessing that.

Also - he is the only one inside or outside the Giants org that considers him a top corner.
RE: anyone  
ron mexico : 12/1/2019 8:15 pm : link
In comment 14698403 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
surprised? And anyone surprised that it is Jenkins?

He's not wrong. But I still don't understand why they didn't trade him. They'll lament that and not moving Evan Engram.


Because their coaching and GMing for their jobs. Same reason they trade for soon to be free agent Leonard Williams, completely short term win now to save my ass actions
RE: RE: Carl Banks  
V.I.G. : 12/1/2019 8:18 pm : link
In comment 14698432 M.S. said:
Quote:

Exactly.

It's like Betcher wants to expose Grant Haley.

I say: WTF???

IF BY EXPOSE, DO YOU MEAN PUT A GUY THAT SHOULDN'T BE ON AN NFL ROSTER ON THE FIELD AFTER THE ROOKIE NICKEL WAS CONCUSSED?

HALEY SUCKS IN MAN, HE SUCKS IN ZONE.
I canít believe the shade this guy gets on here  
rasbutant : 12/1/2019 8:41 pm : link
One of the best corners this team has had, continues to play at a high level even as he ages. Has always been strong tackler and puts is nose in there to support the run. He has a couple whiff tackles here and there and yíall act like he is trash.
RE: Jenkins may be right (probably is)  
japanhead : 12/1/2019 8:51 pm : link
In comment 14698473 Scuzzlebutt said:
Quote:
But he is a quitter and a loser and I am shocked they allowed him to hang around and poison the minds of our young DBs. He obviously quit in 2017 and I will never respect him after witnessing that.

Also - he is the only one inside or outside the Giants org that considers him a top corner.


jenkins is the one who was trying to mentor baker by making him aware of the importance of taking mental reps in preseason when he was hurt. baker apparently blew him off.

more than half the team quit in 2017, it's the reason there was a coach and gm change, with various players shipped off. if jenkins were poison as you claim, why would the new regime have kept him around? im not saying he's perfect but he is the best DB on the team and the point he made about bettcher is on point.

if the giants part ways with him you think he's not going to get multiple offers from other teams? get real man.
Strong run supporter ???  
Dave on the UWS : 12/1/2019 8:54 pm : link
WTF? He's been a liability in run support his whole career. It's part of the reason the Giants were able to get him in the first place. I would bet Shurmur and Bettcher lobied DG not to trade him, because of all the youth in the secondary.
At this point let them talk.  
bradshaw44 : 12/1/2019 8:56 pm : link
Show Mara the captain has lost control of the ship. Only way to right the ship.
RE: anyone  
EricJ : 12/1/2019 8:59 pm : link
In comment 14698403 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
surprised? And anyone surprised that it is Jenkins?

He's not wrong. But I still don't understand why they didn't trade him. They'll lament that and not moving Evan Engram.


Eric, you still need a willing trade partner. If another team wanted both Jenkins and Engram at a fair price, we would have traded.

Maybe we were offered very little. Should we have taken ANY offer? I am sure you know what this place would be like if we only got a 6th round pick for Jenkins and a 5th for Engram.
In retrospect, trading Jenkins would probably have been smart  
SGMen : 12/1/2019 9:05 pm : link
We'd have saved a few dollars this year and just played our youth more.

I don't see Jenkins on this team next year anyway. Unless we get a new coaching staff which we will.
...  
christian : 12/1/2019 9:06 pm : link
Jenkins gets taken to the shed when he's the primary cover on a big dog WR.

He's actually been player much, much better since Bettcher hasn't been moving him.

Jenkins is a total IQ test. He's been terrible for almost 3 years now, and getting paid like an All Pro.
RE: anyone  
Zeke's Alibi : 12/1/2019 9:09 pm : link
In comment 14698403 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
surprised? And anyone surprised that it is Jenkins?

He's not wrong. But I still don't understand why they didn't trade him. They'll lament that and not moving Evan Engram.


Fuck that. He's sick of the bullshit. He has shitty bosses and he's stuck in a bad situation. Reminds me of the military. They should have moved on Engram, he is not worth the second contract he'll be seeking.
RE: RE: Jenkins may be right (probably is)  
Scuzzlebutt : 12/1/2019 9:10 pm : link
In comment 14698680 japanhead said:
Quote:
In comment 14698473 Scuzzlebutt said:


Quote:


But he is a quitter and a loser and I am shocked they allowed him to hang around and poison the minds of our young DBs. He obviously quit in 2017 and I will never respect him after witnessing that.

Also - he is the only one inside or outside the Giants org that considers him a top corner.



jenkins is the one who was trying to mentor baker by making him aware of the importance of taking mental reps in preseason when he was hurt. baker apparently blew him off.

more than half the team quit in 2017, it's the reason there was a coach and gm change, with various players shipped off. if jenkins were poison as you claim, why would the new regime have kept him around? im not saying he's perfect but he is the best DB on the team and the point he made about bettcher is on point.

if the giants part ways with him you think he's not going to get multiple offers from other teams? get real man.


Jenkins was one of the main ringleaders among the quitters in 2017. Just because others quit doesnít make it ok. After one game of purposely not covering or tackling even the media was calling him out on it.

I am sure he will get signed elsewhere in the league when he leaves the Giants, but that doesnít mean his is a top corner. There are many examples of loser players hanging around the league on multiple teams for years. It does not change the fact that he is an average CB at best. He is a quitter and a loser. There is ample evidence to support both of those claims.
RE: ...  
Zeke's Alibi : 12/1/2019 9:10 pm : link
In comment 14698717 christian said:
Quote:
Jenkins gets taken to the shed when he's the primary cover on a big dog WR.

He's actually been player much, much better since Bettcher hasn't been moving him.

Jenkins is a total IQ test. He's been terrible for almost 3 years now, and getting paid like an All Pro.


Jenkins isn't the top corner like when he got here, but even at his age he's way better than what we have currently.
By the way  
Scuzzlebutt : 12/1/2019 9:11 pm : link
Why do you think the Rams let him walk?
Whatever one thinks of Jenkins,  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 12/1/2019 9:16 pm : link
the defensive gameplan today was quite simply moronic. The Packers have ONE good receiver. The Giants have one halfway decent corner. Most teams would either put their best corner on the opponent's best receiver or use their weaker corner with ample safety (or in some cases, another corner or LB) help. The Giants chose to do neither. Rookies were manned up with Adams frequently with no help.
RE: RE: ...  
christian : 12/1/2019 9:19 pm : link
In comment 14698732 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
In comment 14698717 christian said:


Quote:


Jenkins gets taken to the shed when he's the primary cover on a big dog WR.

He's actually been player much, much better since Bettcher hasn't been moving him.

Jenkins is a total IQ test. He's been terrible for almost 3 years now, and getting paid like an All Pro.



Jenkins isn't the top corner like when he got here, but even at his age he's way better than what we have currently.


Janoris Jenkins was statistically dreadful last year.

He was targeted 101 times and gave up 63 catches. He had a 98 passer rating against. He gave up 6 TDs and 780+ yards.

Then this year in 2/3 first games he's actually following the lead guy at Buffalo and at Tampa and gives up 105 and 184 yards respectively.

If he's going to get popped for 100+ yards, and take 10+ targets, no way should he be the primary cover on the man guy.
Let it burn!  
Bavaro_the_Mafioso : 12/1/2019 10:24 pm : link
And, who wants to defend the bettcher
RE: He's correct  
LauderdaleMatty : 12/1/2019 10:38 pm : link
In comment 14698395 arniefez said:
Quote:
The DC is not the Giants problem though. The HC is the problem. The DC works for the HC. The HC is in charge of the whole team not just calling the horrible plays.


Seriously? Heís a big part of the problem. he and Shurmur are neck neck. Heís full as big a fucking moron as his boss. Scheme over all else. Another McAdoo. A guy with preconceived ideas that suck and no matter how much his schemes fail its the players always. Again and again. Devoid of talent. Hey guys go elsewhere and get better. This is a replay of Lewis and Sheridan. The good news is we should be rid of both soon enough.
Do it.. let Jenkins cover other teams top WR  
Rick in Dallas : 12/2/2019 7:02 am : link
He would get burned. He is not a top cover CB anymore. Expose him for what he is: AVERAGE
DG should have traded him!!!
RE: Do it.. let Jenkins cover other teams top WR  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 12/2/2019 8:10 am : link
In comment 14699031 Rick in Dallas said:
Quote:
He would get burned. He is not a top cover CB anymore. Expose him for what he is: AVERAGE
DG should have traded him!!!


Are Grant Haley, Sam Beal, DeAndre Baker, or Corey Ballantine even average in single coverage against a player of Devante Adams' caliber? Of course not. That's why the DC is a moron. Jenkins is hardly Deion Sanders in his prime, but it's almost unfair to use these other guys the way they were used yesterday.
Sorry that came across differently than I meant it  
arniefez : 12/2/2019 8:23 am : link
The DC is 100% incompetent. A horror show. But the HC is a bigger problem. A good HC would have stepped in and forced his DC to make changes. The DC is not the Giants biggest coaching problem he is symptom of the HC.
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