I just watched DG’s recap of the 2018 season and I understand this guy isn’t going to sit up there and say we suck. But he really thinks this team made progress in 2018 and that 2019 was going to be a better year. This guy loves to toot his own horn. Nothing can be done or said today to save DG or PS job. DG caused this mess and PS couldn’t coach a high school team.
We need fresh minds in this org and build it up.
DG 2018 Recap - (
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Saquon was exploding and was offensive rookie of the year.
It's not hard to see why he thought there was improvement.
The common view of this team was that they weren't going to hit the playoffs but they were heading in the right direction. Nobody thought they would struggle to get more than two wins all season.
Saquon was exploding and was offensive rookie of the year.
It's not hard to see why he thought there was improvement.
Many of us saw through the facade.
Saquon was exploding and was offensive rookie of the year.
It's not hard to see why he thought there was improvement.
I get it I thought we were going to have a decent year(7 or 8 wins) but 2019 Giants just prove why PS and DG can’t return next year. We won’t win under them.
Shurmer is an OC. Nothing more.
Shurmer is an OC. Nothing more.
Strong second half missing the last 4 games of that season...I don't think so...
Shurmer is an OC. Nothing more.
Strong second half missing the last 4 games of that season...I don't think so...
Saquon was exploding and was offensive rookie of the year.
It's not hard to see why he thought there was improvement.
So was Shurmur an okay coach last year then?
This team basically requires an entire Oline, impact players on the Dline, CBs who can cover, WRs who scare a defense, and Lbs. Many of those are the same needs as the end of the 2017 season. We won't really know what the qb is until the end of next season, so we can't say for certain whether that position has even been filled. Other than filling the running back position, not really sure what DG has done to inspire confidence that he can fix this mess.
Saquon was exploding and was offensive rookie of the year.
It's not hard to see why he thought there was improvement.
So he drafted a QB with a top 6 pick and brought in two new starters on the oline because the offense was humming along as hoped?
He was wrong about this team and he needs to be accountable for that.
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We went from averaging 18 points per game in the first 8 games to 27 points per game in the last 8.
Saquon was exploding and was offensive rookie of the year.
It's not hard to see why he thought there was improvement.
So was Shurmur an okay coach last year then?
I thought so. I was definitely more than willing to see how he was going to improve on that in year two. He fell flat on his face.
Do you see me advocating keeping Shurmer at all?
Under Shurmur, in his first year, they broke 20 points 10 times, 30 points 6 times, and 40 points once.
In the last 8 games, they broke 30 points 40 times, and 20 points 7 times.
Barkley was the third rookie in history to break 2000 yards from scrimmage, and had 15 TD's.
Again, there were reasons to believe this team was improving.
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In comment 14699822 Britt in VA said:
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We went from averaging 18 points per game in the first 8 games to 27 points per game in the last 8.
Saquon was exploding and was offensive rookie of the year.
It's not hard to see why he thought there was improvement.
So was Shurmur an okay coach last year then?
I thought so. I was definitely more than willing to see how he was going to improve on that in year two. He fell flat on his face.
Do you see me advocating keeping Shurmer at all?
Just trying to reconcile whats the difference if everything was so good 2H2018. We tried Eli in 2019 and that failed. We changed QBs and thats not lighting it up. Barkley was out/hurt but then again so was OBJ last year.
Maybe everything wasn't so good in 2H2018...
maybe DG said to the owners we are going to suck but we'll play the young guys and 2020 when we have FA money and another high draft pick we will compete for a Superbowl very much like Elis 2nd year in the league.
You are never going to hear the truth.
Under Shurmur, in his first year, they broke 20 points 10 times, 30 points 6 times, and 40 points once.
In the last 8 games, they broke 30 points 40 times, and 20 points 7 times.
Barkley was the third rookie in history to break 2000 yards from scrimmage, and had 15 TD's.
Again, there were reasons to believe this team was improving.
Yet, they took Daniel Jones #6 & passed on an impact defensive player. This is where the “no plan” talk comes into play.
If you thought the team was truly on the upswing, why draft Jones & bail on Eli week 3? We were paying Eli anyway.
How do you defend this?
Here's some brutal honesty:
- Saquon Barkley has 3 TDs and less than 900 total yards on the season with 4 games left to play
- The quality of quarterback play has actually dropped after Eli was pulled for Daniel Jones
- The 2018 draft class is flopping
- The offensive line is a complete disaster from tackle to tackle
- DeAndre Baker has played his way into the doghouse and there are plays where his effort is pathetic
- This is the worst roster the Giants have had since the Jimmy Carter administration
7-21.
Saquon was exploding and was offensive rookie of the year.
It's not hard to see why he thought there was improvement.
Here's some brutal honesty:
- Saquon Barkley has 3 TDs and less than 900 total yards on the season with 4 games left to play
- The quality of quarterback play has actually dropped after Eli was pulled for Daniel Jones
- The 2018 draft class is flopping
- The offensive line is a complete disaster from tackle to tackle
- DeAndre Baker has played his way into the doghouse and there are plays where his effort is pathetic
- This is the worst roster the Giants have had since the Jimmy Carter administration
7-21.
Well said. The state of the Franchise is poor at best. There are some glimmers of hope with Jones, but you can also see his flaws.
It is entirely possible this thing gets blown up again in 2021.
Added:
Jones
Lawrence
Baker
Peppers
Zeitler
Williams
Lost:
OBJ
Losing is a disease...
Or
Struggle with Daniel....(one would think Daniel play which is mostly encouraging .....would produce more wins, but (see defense not ready to compete) lousy coaching....and individual vreak downs.....you name it....they have experience it.
They KEPT Eli & drafted Jones at 6. Terps & Francesa were 100% on their take on this. It made no sense.
Gettleman/Shurmur preached progress then passed on drafting BPA at 6 & bailed on him week 3.
Someone tell me the plan?
The hope was that he could sit for a year because the team would have continued to build on what came before in 2018 and might have made enough of a leap to compete.
It didn't, it was clear that Eli was ineffective with what was around him, and they made the move.
The hope was that he could sit for a year because the team would have continued to build on what came before in 2018 and might have made enough of a leap to compete.
It didn't, it was clear that Eli was ineffective with what was around him, and they made the move.
We can’t score 20 points with the offense as is now. Eli moved the ball very well at Dallas. DG/PS kept harping on the end of last season, but that was all BS.
This thread is about how dare Dave Gettleman tell us the team was improving after last season.
I posted why he would think it was improving and say that.
Of course, once again, hindsight is 20/20.
- 22 TDs
- 24 turnovers
- 19.2 PPG
- 2 wins & 10 losses
For this, and I swear I'm not making this up, the Giants have paid $28M in cap space and the 6th pick overall in the 2019 draft.
They KEPT Eli & drafted Jones at 6. Terps & Francesa were 100% on their take on this. It made no sense.
Gettleman/Shurmur preached progress then passed on drafting BPA at 6 & bailed on him week 3.
Someone tell me the plan?
That entire scenario never made sense. If you keep Eli, draft Josh Allen and go for it. Draft Jones, cut Eli, use the cap space towards a better team. They went halfway and you see the result. DG was an idiot for touting progress but I smell Mara's influence here with regards to Eli.
Cutting Eli or not cutting Eli has been beaten to death, not going to rehash that.
You're not serious with that, are you? There were a bunch of us (not just me...far from it) saying how stupid this approach would be this time last year.
This isn't something that just "happened" to the Giants. They brought it on themselves.
Look did I think they would win with Eli? No. But if he's there, then you have to give him a chance at winning. Drafting Barkley goes along those lines. But to then draft Jones at 6? It never made sense.
Saquon was exploding and was offensive rookie of the year.
It's not hard to see why he thought there was improvement.
It's his job to look beyond hollow victories and fool's gold statistics.
More importantly, it's his job to be right. Even if last year's 2nd half wasn't a complete mirage, it's the GM's job to do a proper evaluation.
He failed.
I said all offseason that the second Cowboys game was meaningless to them and really proved nothing as far as the Giants were concerned, and there were an awful lot of people who strenuously disagreed.
I know DG is returning. I also believe Shurmur will be brought back because the moron Mara game him a 5 year contract and will want continuity. But my opinion is both need to go December 30. Opinion and reality are two different things.
Unfortunately I think December 2,2020 we will be having these same conversations of firing Dave and Pat and start all over.
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Of course, once again, hindsight is 20/20.
You're not serious with that, are you? There were a bunch of us (not just me...far from it) saying how stupid this approach would be this time last year.
This isn't something that just "happened" to the Giants. They brought it on themselves.
And we all got blasted for it by the usuals. There is no progress being made, I fear for Jones because I think he may be a casualty of the instability within the organization when I think he has potential to be a top 10 qb.
The organization is the doormat of the league.
For years we've done the one change at a time approach until the Eli debacle, and now we are going down the same path again. The proof is on the field, both the GM and coach need to go.
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We went from averaging 18 points per game in the first 8 games to 27 points per game in the last 8.
Saquon was exploding and was offensive rookie of the year.
It's not hard to see why he thought there was improvement.
There were legit reasons to question the competition and QBs we faced. Yes, QBs don't play defense. It is much easier to play offense with a lead and good field position. Opposing QBs have strong impact on that. Go back and look at the QBs we faced.
bingo
This team basically requires an entire Oline, impact players on the Dline, CBs who can cover, WRs who scare a defense, and Lbs. Many of those are the same needs as the end of the 2017 season. We won't really know what the qb is until the end of next season, so we can't say for certain whether that position has even been filled. Other than filling the running back position, not really sure what DG has done to inspire confidence that he can fix this mess.
It was a fairly large miscalculation that has left the team better in some areas (mostly because of drafting early) yet the same/worse in so many others. Most importantly, it has further delayed the timeline for this team to stabilize and reasonably compete versus the rest of the league.
Did I miss anything?
no GM in the league is going to tell you they aren't heading in the right direction. could you imagine the backlash?
no GM in the league is going to tell you they aren't heading in the right direction. could you imagine the backlash?
That backlash you are hearing is the football world telling the Giants they clearly aren't heading in the right direction.
Can you imagine that?
He's a buffoon, like the coach we hired. Both of them need to be shown the door.
I know the NBA isn't a 1:1 example, but jesus, the Philadelphia 76ers basically sent 75 percent of their fan base (not to mention the national media) into a rage doing a complete multi-year tear-down, often not even trying to compete. They traded their reigning rookie-of-the-year player 30 games into his second season for god's sake.
Now, they are a perennial 50-win team and have the no.1 attendance in the league.
Hell, even the Dolphins appear to be having a lot more fun with their blatant rebuild than the Giants.
It was a fairly large miscalculation that has left the team better in some areas (mostly because of drafting early) yet the same/worse in so many others. Most importantly, it has further delayed the timeline for this team to stabilize and reasonably compete versus the rest of the league.
Did I miss anything?