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PFF: Dwayne Haskins is a better QB than Daniel Jones

CY2020 : 12/4/2019 10:00 am
Have at it, Giants fans.
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I swear  
Sy'56 : 12/4/2019 10:02 am : link
They put stuff out there to get reactions so that it gets clicks / mentions / attention . That is how they make money
PFF  
Chip : 12/4/2019 10:03 am : link
is a joke
Oh well, guess that’s that  
Oscar : 12/4/2019 10:03 am : link
.
Nobody will take that seriously  
Mike from Ohio : 12/4/2019 10:03 am : link
nor should they. Nothing to have at.
Also ahead of Darnold, Josh Arnold, and Andy Dalton....  
Britt in VA : 12/4/2019 10:03 am : link
okay.
according to that list  
giants#1 : 12/4/2019 10:04 am : link
Tannehill is also better than Aaron Rodgers and Pat Mahomes.
Great first post  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 12/4/2019 10:04 am : link
They aren’t turning a blind eye to the massive amounts of turnovers Daniel Jones has had. Haskins has a worse oline then the Giants and isn’t fumbling left and right.
RE: according to that list  
Britt in VA : 12/4/2019 10:05 am : link
In comment 14702426 giants#1 said:
Quote:
Tannehill is also better than Aaron Rodgers and Pat Mahomes.


haha
Thread title is misleading.....  
George from PA : 12/4/2019 10:08 am : link
Ranking has as much to do with comptetion.

I am sure the Jones/Haskins comparison as well as Darnold....will continue.

But so far, Jones passes eyetest, Haskin does not
They don't want to admit how wrong they were before the draft  
Ira : 12/4/2019 10:10 am : link
.
RE: Great first post  
giants#1 : 12/4/2019 10:11 am : link
In comment 14702427 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
Quote:
They aren’t turning a blind eye to the massive amounts of turnovers Daniel Jones has had. Haskins has a worse oline then the Giants and isn’t fumbling left and right.


The fumbles are definitely an issue, but Haskins has thrown 2 TDs in 4 starts and has 3 starts with 0 TD passes. Jones has thrown at least 1 TD in every start.

Haskins has also completed only 54% of his passes for a 6.0 yards/att and with a 4.5% INT rate. Jones has completed 61.6% of his passes for 6.4 yards/att and a 3.0% INT rate.

Finally, in his 4 starts the Skins average 18.5 ppg. In Jones' 10 starts, the Giants average 19.9 ppg.

Outside of not fumbling when he gets hit/sacked (admittedly a big concern that Jones needs to fix), how has Haskins been better?
Too early to tell of course  
arniefez : 12/4/2019 10:12 am : link
Haskins has barley played. He has a stronger arm but is less accurate so far. I'll take accurate over strength but Jones needs to protect the ball better.
RE: Too early to tell of course  
CY2020 : 12/4/2019 10:14 am : link
In comment 14702444 arniefez said:
Quote:
Haskins has barley played. He has a stronger arm but is less accurate so far. I'll take accurate over strength but Jones needs to protect the ball better.


"He has a stronger arm"

No...he does not. Jones has the stronger arm. See below:


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I don't read anything about either in thise articles  
Blue21 : 12/4/2019 10:14 am : link
that defines. What a joke. Time will tell. Still too early to say.
RE: RE: Great first post  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 12/4/2019 10:20 am : link
In comment 14702443 giants#1 said:
Quote:
In comment 14702427 BigBlueDownTheShore said:


Quote:


They aren’t turning a blind eye to the massive amounts of turnovers Daniel Jones has had. Haskins has a worse oline then the Giants and isn’t fumbling left and right.



The fumbles are definitely an issue, but Haskins has thrown 2 TDs in 4 starts and has 3 starts with 0 TD passes. Jones has thrown at least 1 TD in every start.

Haskins has also completed only 54% of his passes for a 6.0 yards/att and with a 4.5% INT rate. Jones has completed 61.6% of his passes for 6.4 yards/att and a 3.0% INT rate.

Finally, in his 4 starts the Skins average 18.5 ppg. In Jones' 10 starts, the Giants average 19.9 ppg.

Outside of not fumbling when he gets hit/sacked (admittedly a big concern that Jones needs to fix), how has Haskins been better?


I’m not saying Haskins is better, just pointing out turnovers are just a bigger part of the equation in their analysis.

To early to completely judge both players. It’s not inaccurate to say DJ is a turn over machine right now and that hurts the team more then it helps.
his fumbles have definitely killed them  
giants#1 : 12/4/2019 10:22 am : link
But I think fumbling is far more correctable than poor decision making and/or the inability to fit throws into tight windows. Outside of last game, Jones has been very good on both those accounts.
I didn't open but it must have been written by  
carpoon : 12/4/2019 10:29 am : link
Chris Carter.;)).
The fumbling will be fixed by a better OL.
He might be one day.  
Mike in Long Beach : 12/4/2019 10:30 am : link
He isn't now.

And whether he is or isn't now has little impact on what either will be. It's a stupid thing to talk about at this stage. But I get that's how it goes.
RE: his fumbles have definitely killed them  
BlueVinnie : 12/4/2019 10:34 am : link
In comment 14702457 giants#1 said:
Quote:
But I think fumbling is far more correctable than poor decision making and/or the inability to fit throws into tight windows. Outside of last game, Jones has been very good on both those accounts.


It's way too early to call which QB will be better long term but it is fun to debate. Full disclosure, prior to the draft I was not a Haskins fan at all. My preference was to draft defense or OT at 1.06 and Drew Lock at 1.17.

That being said, I think you are overrating Jones' decision making. I wouldn't be too giddy over the INT%. He has made a fairly significant number of horrendous throws over the last 6 weeks or so that should have been picked off.
Way to early either way  
Lines of Scrimmage : 12/4/2019 10:35 am : link
As for Jones, I will wait till he has a strong OL and defense that is at minimum average with a strong Head Coach.

I hope the Giants can provide a cast as good as Eli had from 2005-2012 including a great coach.
Talking heads say all finds of crap, they have to in order to keep  
SterlingArcher : 12/4/2019 10:42 am : link
their jobs. Come back in 5 years and let's see who is still standing.
Lamar Jackson's doing pretty well  
Southern Man : 12/4/2019 10:50 am : link
with that noodle arm of his (and his many Y1 fumbles). Velocity is a stat, and like all stats, should be viewed in the greater context.

Putting arm strength aside, Jones has many positive intangibles that don't show up on the stat sheet. Haskins, to this point, has shown a number of negative intangibles.
To be fair  
Mike from Ohio : 12/4/2019 10:55 am : link
if you didn't open the link, it is not an article on how Haskins is better than Jones. It is a ranking of all NFL QBs based on their own metrics (which they choose and weight as they see fit). In the rankings, Haskins is higher than Jones. As pointed out, they also have Tannehill ranked higher than Rodgers and Mahomes. Nobody is suggesting Tannehill is better than either of those guys.

The thread title is very misleading.
To be fair, it's easier for Haskins to "avoid turnover worthy plays"  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 12/4/2019 11:11 am : link
when he attempts less than 30 passes in 3 of his 4 starts.

Jones has yet to attempt less than 30 passes in a game through 10 starts.

Even Washington's interim coach is smarter than Pat Shurmur.
PFF is a joke  
Stan in LA : 12/4/2019 11:22 am : link
Always has been, always will.
Well 2 TD's and 6 interceptions...  
barens : 12/4/2019 11:24 am : link
Duh!!
Haskins  
Archer : 12/4/2019 11:42 am : link
Haskins may some day become a good NFL QB.
But he is awful.

Haskins makes two or three nice throws a game but has not demonstrated any consistency.

The Redskins are playing better because of a good offensive line and a productive running game.

The person who wrote the article clearly doesn't watch the Washington games. Haskins does not past the eye test.


I am not defending Jones as he has his foibles but the author must be a Skins fan.
DG sucks  
Darth Paul : 12/4/2019 11:45 am : link
Passed on him...
PFF...  
bw in dc : 12/4/2019 11:45 am : link
has jumped the shark.

Again.
BWAHAHAHAH  
NYG007 : 12/4/2019 12:04 pm : link
thanks for making my day today, I needed a laugh at this time
It's not a future projection - it's a scorecard  
V.I.G. : 12/4/2019 12:04 pm : link
And by the scorecard - DJ's turnovers have really lowered him.

Quote:
his No. 3 ranking in turnover-worthy play percentage (5.5%) looms large. He’s made ill-advised decisions, but it’s his pocket presence and subsequent fumbles that have been the biggest issue.

I don't think that's unfair. If he improves in turnovers, so will his PFF. If he doesn't, we'll be complaining about ball security like Tampa fans do of Jameis. I personally think he will figure it out / the OL will improve. But to dismiss the turnovers in his 2019 evaluation would be subjective and incorrect.
RE: It's not a future projection - it's a scorecard  
Darth Paul : 12/4/2019 12:10 pm : link
In comment 14702733 V.I.G. said:
Quote:
And by the scorecard - DJ's turnovers have really lowered him.



Quote:


his No. 3 ranking in turnover-worthy play percentage (5.5%) looms large. He’s made ill-advised decisions, but it’s his pocket presence and subsequent fumbles that have been the biggest issue.


I don't think that's unfair. If he improves in turnovers, so will his PFF. If he doesn't, we'll be complaining about ball security like Tampa fans do of Jameis. I personally think he will figure it out / the OL will improve. But to dismiss the turnovers in his 2019 evaluation would be subjective and incorrect.


But what is his score if we ignore his fumbles. They are not his fault anyway. So I heard on BBI.
ha, Haskins makes Andy Dalton look like Johnny Unitas  
gtt350 : 12/4/2019 12:15 pm : link
.
Jones vs Haskins wrong question  
SgtDog : 12/4/2019 2:05 pm : link
The question should be would the Giants be better with Allen instead of Jones. This year I would say Absolutely yes but 3 or 5 years?
Dwayne Haskins  
charlito : 12/4/2019 6:31 pm : link
2 touchdowns, 6 interceptions
It's almost all turnovers  
pizbo : 12/4/2019 8:14 pm : link
11 interceptions
8/9 Fumbles (I actually found sources that said 8 and others said 9)

That's 19/20 turnovers which is a shit ton. Daniel has a ton of potential but until he fixes his turnover problem, he has a turnover problem. This is a non-starter for any franchise that wants to win a Superbowl. I think this is where PFF is coming from. They won't write an algorithm based on wishes and hopes. It has to come down to what is happening at this moment.

Haskins hasn't done much to win them games but he also isn't as much as a liability that Jones is under their model. That's all that PFF is saying and I'm not sure why this is controversial.
RE: It's almost all turnovers  
Diver_Down : 12/4/2019 8:29 pm : link
In comment 14703336 pizbo said:
Quote:
11 interceptions
8/9 Fumbles (I actually found sources that said 8 and others said 9)

That's 19/20 turnovers which is a shit ton. Daniel has a ton of potential but until he fixes his turnover problem, he has a turnover problem. This is a non-starter for any franchise that wants to win a Superbowl. I think this is where PFF is coming from. They won't write an algorithm based on wishes and hopes. It has to come down to what is happening at this moment.

Haskins hasn't done much to win them games but he also isn't as much as a liability that Jones is under their model. That's all that PFF is saying and I'm not sure why this is controversial.


When it comes to turnovers, it is the combination of fumbles lost and interceptions. But to see the bigger picture, we should consider all his fumbles. A few were recovered by OL that just so happened to be in the area at the right time. And others, Daniel recovered. These aren't a loss in possession, but still a negative play.

He has lost 10 fumbles, but has fumbled 15 times. He has 11 interceptions. He has 21 turnovers.

The other concern are the sacks. Not just from the physical beating, but the overall negative play and loss of yards. He has lost 263 yards on 33 sacks. More than 2 1/2 football fields in lost yardage and he hasn't played a full 16 games.
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