There is a chance he played his last snap this year so 10 games in do you guys have confidence in the pick?
Positives
Love the accuracy
The arm
The behaviour and thougness
Negatives
The fumbles obviously although I think they were some improvements last game seems to have two hands on the ball more.
Interceptions feel like he threw a lot of passes that should have been intercepted and got a little lucky on that front, to be seen.
Unknown
Ability to diagnose the defense and change the play at the line.
We don't know how much freedom he has.
Maybe we will find out more if the running game is better with Eli in.
Overall
B+ for a rookie I'm impressed he has some qualities you can't teach.
Just saw too much inconsistency.
So, at this point I'm a "C" on Jones.
And it's not the fumbles (which are a problem - which I believe is correctable) or the interceptions, it's the arm.
He seems accurate enough, and makes decent reads and puts the ball in a good spot most of the time.
my issue is it seems like his passes take too long to get where they're going.
people can flame this as criticism or cite some stat, but when I watch Jones throw outs and deep balls he just doesn't seem to have zip on the ball.
He's not Chad Pennington, but it also seems noticeable to me.
Hope I'm wrong or hope it's just me.
A lot of times I feel I see him lock on to a guy, and throw it into coverage. And a good amount of time, he somehow fits it in there anyway. I like him though. Clear tools.
On the other hand,hypothetically, if Jones would be available in a trade do you believe that the Giants could even get a #1 pick for him? I am not sure that they could get a second round pick for him.
On the other hand,hypothetically, if Jones would be available in a trade do you believe that the Giants could even get a #1 pick for him? I am not sure that they could get a second round pick for him.
HAHAHA
Please note that the Cards got a second and a fifth for Rosen, but sure, Jones wouldn't get a second round pick.
His lack of field generalship partly due to inexperience further makes any definitive conclusions about future success problematic. I would like to see, when given permission , DJ reading the defense and changing the play at the line of scrimmage . If he's good and successful at that I believe we might have our present and future QB.
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He has had some really good moments with some really good throws. He does lack pocket awareness as for a player with his athletic ability you don't see avoiding the rush very well. He runs when he sees the opportunity but I haven't seen many plays where he has moved very well in the pocket to escape a sack and make a play.
On the other hand,hypothetically, if Jones would be available in a trade do you believe that the Giants could even get a #1 pick for him? I am not sure that they could get a second round pick for him.
HAHAHA
Please note that the Cards got a second and a fifth for Rosen, but sure, Jones wouldn't get a second round pick.
Trading sounds silly at this point. Teams would line up for a #1 and another pick. He's going to be good . Just needs coaching and to hold onto the ball and more experience.
The TO's, especially the fumbles, has to be fixed. And it's not like it's a new problem either, he had fumbling issues at Duke. He's not going to be an NFL QB fumbling 20x/yr.
Jones makes tough tight throws. HE IS ONLY A ROOKIE WHO NEVER PLAYED WITH TALENT! He also misses half his talent on O per game. I give him an 8/10. Rookie wise? He only loses 2 for the fumbles. His only bad decision game was last week, he made some terrible, terrible reads. Stared down WR's, into INT's, etc.
Our next HC will do very well with this pick, I think the whole FO and coaching staff is gone, but they got this pick absolutely right.
Also - I give ZERO shits about the fumbles. I'm 100% certain that will be addressed.
He holds onto the ball to long, but that's correctable.
He doesn't have a rocket arm, but his ball placement and timing is excellent. He's made some holy sh-t! throws, too.
He is not a run first guy, but can definitely move the chains with his legs in a big spot.
I've seen enough to feel pretty confident that he'll be a solid starter for us under our new head coach.
Some were claiming that the Giants had the worst wide receivers in the NFL coming into the season. Now that's clearly not true but it's not like they have Beckham out there anymore either.
If the Giants fix the offensive line I expect to see Jones take a huge step forward.
Just saw too much inconsistency.
So, at this point I'm a "C" on Jones.
And it's not the fumbles (which are a problem - which I believe is correctable) or the interceptions, it's the arm.
He seems accurate enough, and makes decent reads and puts the ball in a good spot most of the time.
my issue is it seems like his passes take too long to get where they're going.
people can flame this as criticism or cite some stat, but when I watch Jones throw outs and deep balls he just doesn't seem to have zip on the ball.
He's not Chad Pennington, but it also seems noticeable to me.
Hope I'm wrong or hope it's just me.
That's funny, because I called him a more athletic Chad Pennington a few weeks ago.
Pennington was actually a very good QB, injuries just caught up with. He was very accurate and had great anticipation.
I'm expect DJ's arm strength to get a little better too in the offseason.
There were too many problems with the offense and the play calling to judge a first year player.
If you're judging him solely on 'dealing with adversity' he gets an A-.
Jones did a great job under the circumstances; taking over in week #3, having limited access to the starting RB, WR and TE, the terrible OL and maybe most important, the terrible play calling he had to endure. We know we've got something, but it's not clear what.
Excellent accuracy, tough, plays the part of QB. Wants to be here.
The pocket awareness - and fumbles - will get better especially as the line gets better.
He's playing with literally crap right now in what looks like a predictable offense, I mean, even his best piece in SB is struggling and looks like an average back.
Guy's going it alone............
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I was not an eli fan until 2007.
Just saw too much inconsistency.
So, at this point I'm a "C" on Jones.
And it's not the fumbles (which are a problem - which I believe is correctable) or the interceptions, it's the arm.
He seems accurate enough, and makes decent reads and puts the ball in a good spot most of the time.
my issue is it seems like his passes take too long to get where they're going.
people can flame this as criticism or cite some stat, but when I watch Jones throw outs and deep balls he just doesn't seem to have zip on the ball.
He's not Chad Pennington, but it also seems noticeable to me.
Hope I'm wrong or hope it's just me.
That's funny, because I called him a more athletic Chad Pennington a few weeks ago.
Pennington was actually a very good QB, injuries just caught up with. He was very accurate and had great anticipation.
I'm expect DJ's arm strength to get a little better too in the offseason.
Chad Pennington was a decent QB, problem was he was limited by weak arm strength before the injuries. I don't think Jones arm strength is limiting like Pennington's. But I do notice he doesn't have the strongest arm - especially on the throws i mentioned.
Anyway, I've seen what I've needed to seen from him. He's our next franchise QB and I expect to have success with him behind center.
Despite the abysmal coaching staff, horrible offensive line, and lack of skill players this season, he was still impressive.
There were too many problems with the offense and the play calling to judge a first year player.
If you're judging him solely on 'dealing with adversity' he gets an A-.
Jones did a great job under the circumstances; taking over in week #3, having limited access to the starting RB, WR and TE, the terrible OL and maybe most important, the terrible play calling he had to endure. We know we've got something, but it's not clear what.
I agree with this.
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than Incomplete.
There were too many problems with the offense and the play calling to judge a first year player.
If you're judging him solely on 'dealing with adversity' he gets an A-.
Jones did a great job under the circumstances; taking over in week #3, having limited access to the starting RB, WR and TE, the terrible OL and maybe most important, the terrible play calling he had to endure. We know we've got something, but it's not clear what.
I agree with this.
I also agree. Really my main concern with him is his pocket presence. But INC is also my opinion.
Tannehill has a bigger arm I think, and probably runs better (at least he did pre knee injury). I've always been big on Tannehill, I think he's suffered from being in bad situations and really, that's got a ton to do with what success you have sometimes. Maybe in TN with good coaching - which I think they have - will really bring out his best.
I think people underestimate how much better DJ will be - all around - after a year of film study, and just understanding what the heck is going on out there. He's a rookie. Experience is a huge deal.
If you watch a player like Rodgers or Mahomes, they have significant velocity on their throws which makes it tougher for defensive players to get into position in time to make a play. Jones hasn't displayed have that kind of arm talent.
I like him as a player but his ceiling is somewhat limited based on his physical tools. If we build a good team around him I think he can be a winner but I don't see him every being an elite QB in the league.
That's my two cents, take it for what it's worth.
He has an accurate arm, though not rocket- strong enough, toughness and smarts. The ball will come out quicker as he gets more experience.
If he is a guy who can consistently sit in the 8-10 range in this league you can with a lot of games with that and likely a championship or two.
He has great character. He has good enough passing skills.
It's already been written about how favorably his stat line compares to historical first round QB's but those are somewhat apples to oranges even if it's just because of it being a different era, so the big to me is that he stacks up well relative to peers, which will hopefully continue looking good going forward:
Josh Allen had a 50 something percent comp percentage last year and more INTs than TDs. This year he's made big improvements but even with that they currently have similar stat lines.
Darnold had some moments but has been plagued by the same inconsistency he showed at USC, continuing to be more INT prone than Jones even in his 2nd year.
Rosen looks like he's a bust. Haskins looks like Rosen did last year, but it's still really early.
Even Lamar Jackson's 7 starts last year probably had more negatives if we are being honest - 12 fumbles, just 6 tds passing, under 60%. 4 turnovers and under 50% completions in his 1 playoff game. Obviously there were both flashes of the amazing MVP season we are seeing this year and growing pains - the hallmarks of just about every rookie QB including the great ones.
Mayfield is obviously the outlier in how good he looked last year but then taking big steps back this year so hard to evaluate right now. Gun to my head I'd probably still take Baker over Jones, though he seems like a really bad personality fit for NY so maybe not.
The really obvious key going forward is that we need to hope the coaching staff and Jones himself can just keep progressing because improving even incrementally in certain areas can have a big impact. Make better decisions, be more efficient, cut down mistakes, or in other words all the things you expect to need a rookie QB to improve upon. He's the least of my concerns going forward - finding the right coaches and continuing to improve the team around him are far bigger challenges.
Good grief.
He was the offenses best player in the time it played.
For a rookie QB i give him an A-. He did much better this year than I thought he would do this year. As everyone mentions and knows, besides the fumbles, he's been prettier darn impressive after being thrown into action so early.
In terms of future prognostication, this is a bit tricky, and may itself need to be defined more, but I give a solid A. He will be 10+ year starter in the league barring injuries or other freak circumstances. Now that's the expectation you want for a #6 pick, so like I said, maybe this itself needs to be defined more, but I say when you pick a QB and you get your 10 year starter that's an A.
In terms of what how he performed this year, relative to how other NFL starting QBs would have performed with THIS team, I give him a C-. Most NFL starters would have performed better than him. Keep in mind this is ruthless grading. I'm simply saying at least 16 other NFL QBs would have done better than him - meaning a C is average. That does also mean he performed better than how at least 1/3 of the rest of the league's starters would have done with this team. That's pretty good for a rookie.
Suffice to say I'm pleased. But he really needs to develop his strategy as a runner better. Which I think he will. Bc if he doesn't then we're gonna see him in and out of the lineup with injuries and that's gonna hurt the team.
In terms of play: C. In terms of draft value: F.
Once DC's had some film on him after his first three appearances or so, he has completed 59% of his passes for 1796 yards, 6 ypa, 15 td and 9 picks. Middling numbers. Minshew, who was a 6th round pick, has done as well if not better. DC's don't seem convinced; they have gone all-out to stop Barkley and seem to care less about Jones.
All of the weaknesses mentioned in his draft profile: ball handling leading to to's, the tell-tale patting of the ball before throwing, lack of pocket awareness, iffy long pass ability, waiting too long to cut it loose, trying to throw into tight windows (and he has gotten away with some of that- hard to think it will continue without more to), throwing it up when pressured have all continued. I think he started off hot, got all of you thinking stud and has regressed to what he really is.
Hard to think that he is going to improve all that much more. This guy was a 4 year starter under a professional qb coach in a major conference. He is what many thought he would be- high floor, low ceiling. Some great games, some awful games, a lot of meh. Worth the 6th pick in the whole draft? At the moment, you have to say no, the pundits were right- safe pick later in the first round maybe, maybe second round.
He was the offenses best player in the time it played.
C -. That's his grade for the games that counted. He produced two wins, one where the defense gave up 3 points. He basically played one half of winning football, the second half against the Bucs. That was great but it was a blip.
His proclivity for turnovers can NOT be ignored. It was very bad. He moves tough his progression slowly. He hasn't proven he can do it faster. His short area passing was very good. Further down the field, not so much. It's hard to do but you have to ignore preseason where he shined. The Giants were undefeated in preseason. It means nothing.
He can be a very good QB. Players often are much improved in season two (see Landon Collins). I root for every player in blue to succeed. I want him to be great. But this thread is not a projection, it's about a QB who was very average this year.
As for not getting the ball out quick enough...it's an issue but it's also a sign of the player's courage and desire to try to make something happen. It's certainly not bad to have a QB with courage. However, that too, I feel will correct with experience. He's not the first rookie QB in history to need experience to adjust to the pocket collapsing on him and when to get rid of the ball. This is a problem that hurt Aikman in year 1 and he corrected.
So I would say a good year overall. Better than most people expected if we're to be honest about it.
As for not getting the ball out quick enough...it's an issue but it's also a sign of the player's courage and desire to try to make something happen. It's certainly not bad to have a QB with courage. However, that too, I feel will correct with experience. He's not the first rookie QB in history to need experience to adjust to the pocket collapsing on him and when to get rid of the ball. This is a problem that hurt Aikman in year 1 and he corrected.
So I would say a good year overall. Better than most people expected if we're to be honest about it.
The issues go much further than just the fumbles. That's just the most glaring one that everyone easily notices.
In terms of play: C. In terms of draft value: F.
Once DC's had some film on him after his first three appearances or so, he has completed 59% of his passes for 1796 yards, 6 ypa, 15 td and 9 picks. Middling numbers. Minshew, who was a 6th round pick, has done as well if not better. DC's don't seem convinced; they have gone all-out to stop Barkley and seem to care less about Jones.
All of the weaknesses mentioned in his draft profile: ball handling leading to to's, the tell-tale patting of the ball before throwing, lack of pocket awareness, iffy long pass ability, waiting too long to cut it loose, trying to throw into tight windows (and he has gotten away with some of that- hard to think it will continue without more to), throwing it up when pressured have all continued. I think he started off hot, got all of you thinking stud and has regressed to what he really is.
Hard to think that he is going to improve all that much more. This guy was a 4 year starter under a professional qb coach in a major conference. He is what many thought he would be- high floor, low ceiling. Some great games, some awful games, a lot of meh. Worth the 6th pick in the whole draft? At the moment, you have to say no, the pundits were right- safe pick later in the first round maybe, maybe second round.
He was actually a three year starter at Duke, and I'm not sure how that line of thinking leads to you thinking he won't improve. Peyton and Eli both improved by leaps and bounds after their rookie seasons, and they were older than Jones at that point.
Not to mention Minshew has had a running game and a respectable defense to help his cause.
The pocket awareness and turnovers are a huge problem, though. You might be able to live with it if he were hugely productive, but he hasn't been at 6.4 YPA and the offense not even averaging 20 PPG. I was hoping to see him run the ball more too.
A lot of that is on the incompetent coaching staff and poor team around him, but he's got a lot of improvement to make if he's going to be the guy a couple years and a new coach from now.
Actually, I should say "deserve to be the guy". I suspect he's on scholarship based on his draft position and the Giants' desire to recreate Eli.
Prime Tom Brady would look bad in this offense.
That said - he is trending the wrong way which is generally a bad sign. Contrast with Eli, who clicked vs. the Steelers and you could see very clearly he was going to be a good quarterback.
The relevant point is that the Giants are a catastrophe. The roster is filled with poor players, a handful of a good ones (I really like a healthy Shepard), and not a single elite one.
ZERO players on the roster from 2014, 2015, 2016 (save SS, now experiencing the Giants WR curse), blah from 2017, blah from 2018 after SB (and even him right now...)
Even if the Giant could turn this dumpster fire around - and there is zero indication they're capable of that - how many years does it take? What happens to Jones in that time period?
There is no warranted optimism present about the NYG.
If you watch a player like Rodgers or Mahomes, they have significant velocity on their throws which makes it tougher for defensive players to get into position in time to make a play. Jones hasn't displayed have that kind of arm talent.
I like him as a player but his ceiling is somewhat limited based on his physical tools. If we build a good team around him I think he can be a winner but I don't see him every being an elite QB in the league.
That's my two cents, take it for what it's worth.
This is a pretty good write-up.
Jones has made some very nice throws on the run to his left. The athleticism he exhibited at Duke seems to have conveyed. Why we haven't exploited that and his mobility more is beyond me...
Perhaps this staff is trying to get him to focus on being more of a pocket passer?? I don't know, but it's very strange.
Jones is a very big mixed bag. He looks like a more athletic Eli. And the Eli part is the propensity to turn the ball over at an alarming rate. It's very bad. While there is this theme that it can be fixed with coaching, keep in mind it never got coached out of Eli's game. Eli's was a turnover machine. It's probably why his record only hovers around .500.
So this is a huge red flag with Jones. If there are no material signs of improvement by next year, we need to move on.
he did pretty dang good.
you could see him struggling more as the season progressed, with the OL, running game, receivers regressed/injured. It's a good time to rest him and get reset before shell shock sets in.
He looks to be a QB with promise. Someone who can be a QB on a successful team. Hopefully, the OL and receiving group can be built up. With a toolkit upgrade, the offense will not be the side that loses games. That's what you should realistically expect from any new QB.
I think he passed that test, with flying colors. I like his accuracy most of the time. I like how he stands in under pressure. I like his athleticism. His arm seems sufficient.
He certainly looked better than Eli did as a rookie most of the time, and Eli had more talent and better coaching.
Consider the following when grading DJ:
- The OL has been wretched, he's almost always under pressure and it often comes up the middle
- We don't have a murderer's row of offensive home run hitters. And for what we do have, he has not EVER had all the "weapons" on the field together. Tate missed his DJ's first 2 games. SB was hurt his first game. Then Shep was out. The EE was out. He's never had all his weapons.
- He's been carrying the load as our run game has been virtually nil. We lose first down so often he's in 2nd and 3rd and long too often.
- Play calling has not exactly seemed creative to maximize what talent we do have.
- He has often had to play from behind because our D gave up 2 TDs in the first 2 drives. When we get leads we generally give them right back. So he's had to press, especially in final minutes with D's having their ears pinned back vs our stellar OL.
- He's been let down by the kicking game missing very makable FGs that would have helped the points he's put on the board, changed field position, etc.
Given all that, I think he's been pretty solid. He's kept his head, kept fighting, not blamed or pointed fingers, Eli seems to say his behind the scenes work ethic is good. So, I'd say early returns are good, with a chance to be very good with some improvement, experience, and help around him.
The main knock on him is turnovers. Some of this is bad luck (fumbles not recovered). Some bad OL play (hit as he throws). Some is ball security (not holding on well). Some is rookie mistakes (misreads, bad throws, holding the ball too long, not giving up on plays that are dead). Whatever it is, he's been a turnover machine and it HAS to improve. I think it will, but until it does turnovers are issue #1 and 1A. Turnovers correlate too highly with losing to be tolerable.
Second is just normal rookie development, holding the ball, trying to fit into too tight a window, reading more complex Ds, learning when to give up on a play, etc. This stuff I have little doubt will improve with experience and the game slowing down for him. And, frankly, some of it is just being a competitive player. I'd hate to have a QB that quickly gives up on plays or won't try to fit in a ball. So, some mistakes of aggression I'll live with. No point playing it safe when we're in come from behind mode all the time.