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In hindsight, hiring Accorsi as a consultant was a disaster

Eric from BBI : Admin : 12/10/2019 1:24 am
Many of us had a real queasy feeling about this as soon as it was predictably announced.

The problem the Giants have moving forward is that John Mara doesn't seem to have a feel for running a professional football team.

And he's listening to the wrong people.

God help the Giants.
guy retired in 06  
Platos : 12/10/2019 1:26 am : link
and we brought him in as a consultant.... unreal
.  
moespree : 12/10/2019 1:28 am : link
As long as you can talk about 1972 Baltimore Colts offensive line...you'll get a recommendation from Ernie.
It was a great decision  
MookGiants : 12/10/2019 1:28 am : link
Gettleman is doing a great job. Just ask a lot of BBI. It's all Shurmur's fault, DG is doing a great job just let him hire another coach, he definitely deserves to hire a 2nd coach after hiring Shurmur.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 12/10/2019 1:29 am : link
I'm pissed off.

17-3 over the Eagles. They lose a bunch of players to injuries. They're done.

All we have to do is get a few first downs, maybe a field goal.

We can't even do that against a BAD football team.

And we all felt it falling apart as soon as it was 17-10. It was only a matter of time.
ernie accorsi is like 80  
japanhead : 12/10/2019 1:38 am : link
years old. he shouldn't be consulting for anyone, he's probably half senile. the 70s generally aren't the kindest decade for sharp and innovative thinking.
RE: ...  
MookGiants : 12/10/2019 1:39 am : link
In comment 14711722 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I'm pissed off.

17-3 over the Eagles. They lose a bunch of players to injuries. They're done.

All we have to do is get a few first downs, maybe a field goal.

We can't even do that against a BAD football team.

And we all felt it falling apart as soon as it was 17-10. It was only a matter of time.


When you have a clueless GM who hires an equally clueless head coach and gives that head coach one of the two worst rosters in the entire sport, this is what you get.

Daniel Jones is the only good decision he made.

Saw this disaster coming the second this clown drafted Barkley. No running back is worth that pick. I would have rather swing and miss on a premium position than take a guy that has to be one of the best ever to ever justify being picked that high.

If another team would give up a 1st round pick for Barkley in the off-season, I'd trade him in a second. By the time the Giants are good Barkley's going to be commanding a huge payday and likely have his best years behind him already.

I would not even consider giving him a big long term contract. The Giants will almost certainly make the mistake of doing that. Fans would hate it if they traded him for a 1st rounder in the off-season but it would 100% be the right move.
This organization is lost  
Go Terps : 12/10/2019 1:46 am : link
They need to conduct an exhaustive interview process for a new head coach/head of football operations. Then tell whomever gets the job to treat this like an expansion team. No sacred cows, all players available to trade.

Blank slate.
The Tisch comments are the most hopeful i've been about the team  
NoGainDayne : 12/10/2019 1:53 am : link
in a while.

I don't think it will be an easy sell to get the organizational changes at the top that this team needs but at least there is a shot because Tisch is understandably fed up.

Wish Dolan had a co-owner. Still say the chances of these changes aren't super high but there is a shot IMO.
They paid Ernie  
bluepepper : 12/10/2019 2:00 am : link
To recommend the guy they were always going to hire. I’d have more respect for John if he had just named DG the GM out of the gate and skipped the charade.
RE: This organization is lost  
MookGiants : 12/10/2019 2:02 am : link
In comment 14711735 Go Terps said:
Quote:
They need to conduct an exhaustive interview process for a new head coach/head of football operations. Then tell whomever gets the job to treat this like an expansion team. No sacred cows, all players available to trade.

Blank slate.


Certainly the Giants can't trade the touched by the hand of God running back that they have. Hell, they should give him his 100 million dollar contract now.
RE: ...  
Banks : 12/10/2019 2:36 am : link
In comment 14711722 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I'm pissed off.

17-3 over the Eagles. They lose a bunch of players to injuries. They're done.

All we have to do is get a few first downs, maybe a field goal.

We can't even do that against a BAD football team.

And we all felt it falling apart as soon as it was 17-10. It was only a matter of time.

When the eagles scored that td I told my eagles gf that it's over. Giants are losing this game. She said that the eagles suck and we are still up and I re-assured it was all but official. That's the way it's been. I have no faith in this team. It's depressing that the best football we've seen was the 2nd half of last year.
'Many of us had a real queasy feeling about this'...  
Torrag : 12/10/2019 2:55 am : link
and many of us were relieved they were getting an intelligent, experienced, successful NFL lifer executives input on the hire. Rather than go it alone.

It hasn't been all good decisions by DG but it never is by anyone. I'm still going to stay patient and see how this offseason plays out. I think his job is safe for now.

So far my big worry is threefold, two misses on large contracts that went to Ogletree and Solder and hiring Shurmur. Those situations aren't working out at all. On the other hand he got the OBJ trade correct and I like the talent acquired via the Draft.

It was a disaster when DG walked in the door. With so many working parts in disarray mistakes were bound to happen. So far he's identified them when they've occurred, cut our losses and moved on. If he continues in that vein I believe better times will arrive sooner than later.
RE: It was a great decision  
Leg of Theismann : 12/10/2019 3:27 am : link
In comment 14711720 MookGiants said:
Quote:
Gettleman is doing a great job. Just ask a lot of BBI. It's all Shurmur's fault, DG is doing a great job just let him hire another coach, he definitely deserves to hire a 2nd coach after hiring Shurmur.


When your players play a full half of dominant football and go into the locker room with a 17-3 lead, and then you come back out and the other team makes a few adjustments here and there all of a sudden scores 20 unanswered points and your offense moves the ball 30 yards in the 2nd half, that to me is on coaching. A similar thing happened in last year's game in Philly, it was like Deja Vu. Shurmur has a lead and blows it because Pederson simply out-adjusts him, out-thinks him, out-COACHES him. I actually think Pederson is a perfect example to highlight how bad Shurmur is because he is such a cerebral guy and Shurmur is such a moron. Pederson can take a bad team and coach them up to be tied for the division lead in a bad NFCE, while Shurmur literally only brings out the worst in his players because he doesn't know how to in-game adjust or how to coach a football team in general.

Mind you, DG is no genius himself, but I would say he is less to blame than Shurmur based on SOME of the talent I've seen flashes of here and there and a couple of moves he's made that were fairly savvy (of course there were other moves I very much didn't like, but you win some you lose some). I think DG is certainly less at fault than Shurmur, but that said I don't even care at this point about any sort of "continuity" or whatever, I'm tired of rooting for a dinosaur franchise and I want NYG to bring in people fit to manage and coach in the 2020s. So I'm simply saying DG is less at fault but I still wouldn't mind seeing him canned. Shurmur is clear-cut #1 on my shit-list though, by far.
And to hell dragging out these former gms as consultants  
micky : 12/10/2019 5:03 am : link
Bc this this, if a move, good ole mara will drag out mr Acorsi again. In house crap
RE: 'Many of us had a real queasy feeling about this'...  
Ned In Atlanta : 12/10/2019 5:07 am : link
In comment 14711753 Torrag said:
Quote:
and many of us were relieved they were getting an intelligent, experienced, successful NFL lifer executives input on the hire. Rather than go it alone.

It hasn't been all good decisions by DG but it never is by anyone. I'm still going to stay patient and see how this offseason plays out. I think his job is safe for now.

So far my big worry is threefold, two misses on large contracts that went to Ogletree and Solder and hiring Shurmur. Those situations aren't working out at all. On the other hand he got the OBJ trade correct and I like the talent acquired via the Draft.

It was a disaster when DG walked in the door. With so many working parts in disarray mistakes were bound to happen. So far he's identified them when they've occurred, cut our losses and moved on. If he continues in that vein I believe better times will arrive sooner than later.


He hired his friend. It was nepotism dressed up as a GM search
Uh oh  
Les in TO : 12/10/2019 5:58 am : link
You insulted the Giants Way. The Mara Defense League will eviscerate this post by 9am
Of course it was a disaster.  
Silver Spoon : 12/10/2019 6:00 am : link
Many people thought it was a mistake, because Ernie knew who he was leaning towards before the “interviews”. That’s how this organization is run, with little imagination. It’s now the laughingstock of the NFL.
RE: RE: ...  
FStubbs : 12/10/2019 7:15 am : link
In comment 14711730 MookGiants said:
Quote:
In comment 14711722 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


I'm pissed off.

17-3 over the Eagles. They lose a bunch of players to injuries. They're done.

All we have to do is get a few first downs, maybe a field goal.

We can't even do that against a BAD football team.

And we all felt it falling apart as soon as it was 17-10. It was only a matter of time.



When you have a clueless GM who hires an equally clueless head coach and gives that head coach one of the two worst rosters in the entire sport, this is what you get.

Daniel Jones is the only good decision he made.

Saw this disaster coming the second this clown drafted Barkley. No running back is worth that pick. I would have rather swing and miss on a premium position than take a guy that has to be one of the best ever to ever justify being picked that high.

If another team would give up a 1st round pick for Barkley in the off-season, I'd trade him in a second. By the time the Giants are good Barkley's going to be commanding a huge payday and likely have his best years behind him already.

I would not even consider giving him a big long term contract. The Giants will almost certainly make the mistake of doing that. Fans would hate it if they traded him for a 1st rounder in the off-season but it would 100% be the right move.


The problem is the other 31 teams in the league are smarter than that. Nobody would trade a first round pick for Barkley.
Hindsight?  
jlukes : 12/10/2019 7:16 am : link
most of us said it was not a good idea when it was first announced
We were out coached uncle a massive way  
Rjanyg : 12/10/2019 7:17 am : link
Hell, they kept the TE to help Solder and it actually made it worse because he tripped Solder on one play, then pushed him wide of Solder.

The next time our defense can feel a screen pass and defend it will be the first.

Our players actually played pretty well. The rookies are getting better. Slayton is a stud. Baker May have had his best game. Dex Lawrence is a beast. Ximines had 2 sacks. Love is showing he has ability. Beal is basically a rookie and looked to be the target, but he looks to be an NFL corner.

If people want to blame Gettlemen for Shurmur and Ogletree, fine. But this is not a bad team. The coaching is very bad.
The only thing I'd hire Accorsi to consult for  
Ten Ton Hammer : 12/10/2019 7:22 am : link
is scouting QBs.
Accorsi hired Gettleman...  
bw in dc : 12/10/2019 7:32 am : link
and then Gettleman hired Shurmur.

And then Gettleman proceeded to draft, acquire, and trade for this poor roster so it could be poorly coached by Shurmur and his horrible staff.

"Giants Way" football. There is no substitute.
The funny thing is  
mittenedman : 12/10/2019 7:36 am : link
why would Mara need Accorsi to recommend Gettleman?
I might have blue colored glasses  
armstead98 : 12/10/2019 7:42 am : link
But I think the young players on this team are as promising as I can remember in the last 20 years.

Sure DG hasn't been perfect and he's had to work out of cap hell but he's got an eye for talent that Reese didn't.

Shurmer is an abomination. If we had a halfway decent coach, let alone a good one, this team would be much closer to .500 and arguably in 1st in a terrible division.

My vote is to get get rid of the coaching staff and give DG more time, but he doesn't get to pick the coach.
RE: The funny thing is  
bw in dc : 12/10/2019 7:43 am : link
In comment 14711873 mittenedman said:
Quote:
why would Mara need Accorsi to recommend Gettleman?


I thought about that, too.

I wonder if Accorsi cold called Mara and asked him if could lead the search. And that he said had a great candidate in mind - Gettleman.
RE: I might have blue colored glasses  
Gatorade Dunk : 12/10/2019 7:48 am : link
In comment 14711881 armstead98 said:
Quote:
Sure DG hasn't been perfect and he's had to work out of cap hell but he's got an eye for talent that Reese didn't.

Especially the cap hell that he created for himself.
RE: RE: I might have blue colored glasses  
armstead98 : 12/10/2019 7:51 am : link
In comment 14711892 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 14711881 armstead98 said:


Quote:


Sure DG hasn't been perfect and he's had to work out of cap hell but he's got an eye for talent that Reese didn't.


Especially the cap hell that he created for himself.


There was nothing he could really do until 2020. I'd be willing to give him next year.

I guess part of my concern is I have zero faith that the next GM will be any better and actually expect them to be worse.

At least with a new coach it can't get worse.
Can you imagine if Steve Tisch  
section125 : 12/10/2019 8:10 am : link
is the impetus for correcting this folly?
RE: RE: RE: I might have blue colored glasses  
Gatorade Dunk : 12/10/2019 8:12 am : link
In comment 14711896 armstead98 said:
Quote:
In comment 14711892 Gatorade Dunk said:


Quote:


In comment 14711881 armstead98 said:


Quote:


Sure DG hasn't been perfect and he's had to work out of cap hell but he's got an eye for talent that Reese didn't.


Especially the cap hell that he created for himself.



There was nothing he could really do until 2020. I'd be willing to give him next year.

I guess part of my concern is I have zero faith that the next GM will be any better and actually expect them to be worse.

At least with a new coach it can't get worse.

There was nothing he could really do?

He could have not signed Solder, not signed Omameh, not signed Stewart, not signed Barwin, not signed Mauro, not signed Martin, not signed Bethea, not traded for Ogletree, not signed Beckham to a huge contract before trading him, not restructured Solder and Ellison to push more of their money into 2020 and 2021...

Should I continue? Gettleman has fucked up the cap management in ways that should require intent.
RE: RE: It was a great decision  
Victor in CT : 12/10/2019 8:25 am : link
In comment 14711757 Leg of Theismann said:
Quote:
In comment 14711720 MookGiants said:


Quote:


Gettleman is doing a great job. Just ask a lot of BBI. It's all Shurmur's fault, DG is doing a great job just let him hire another coach, he definitely deserves to hire a 2nd coach after hiring Shurmur.



When your players play a full half of dominant football and go into the locker room with a 17-3 lead, and then you come back out and the other team makes a few adjustments here and there all of a sudden scores 20 unanswered points and your offense moves the ball 30 yards in the 2nd half, that to me is on coaching. A similar thing happened in last year's game in Philly, it was like Deja Vu. Shurmur has a lead and blows it because Pederson simply out-adjusts him, out-thinks him, out-COACHES him. I actually think Pederson is a perfect example to highlight how bad Shurmur is because he is such a cerebral guy and Shurmur is such a moron. Pederson can take a bad team and coach them up to be tied for the division lead in a bad NFCE, while Shurmur literally only brings out the worst in his players because he doesn't know how to in-game adjust or how to coach a football team in general.

Mind you, DG is no genius himself, but I would say he is less to blame than Shurmur based on SOME of the talent I've seen flashes of here and there and a couple of moves he's made that were fairly savvy (of course there were other moves I very much didn't like, but you win some you lose some). I think DG is certainly less at fault than Shurmur, but that said I don't even care at this point about any sort of "continuity" or whatever, I'm tired of rooting for a dinosaur franchise and I want NYG to bring in people fit to manage and coach in the 2020s. So I'm simply saying DG is less at fault but I still wouldn't mind seeing him canned. Shurmur is clear-cut #1 on my shit-list though, by far.


Agreed. Well said
RE: The funny thing is  
Les in TO : 12/10/2019 8:30 am : link
In comment 14711873 mittenedman said:
Quote:
why would Mara need Accorsi to recommend Gettleman?
maybe Mara wanted to do a broader survey of candidates but ol nosferatu convinced him that mr G was the perfect choice
Gettleman  
ajr2456 : 12/10/2019 8:32 am : link
Can not be left in charge of an offseason where the Giants will likely be picking 2 and have $70 million in cap space.

The franchise has been set back far enough
The worst part is we're going to repeat the cycle....  
Tesla : 12/10/2019 8:35 am : link
after DG fails again next year and Mara is forced to fire him what are the odds he turns to Accorsi once again to help find he next GM? 90%? 95? 99%?

Rinse and repeat is the true "Giants way."
Giants  
TyreeHelmet : 12/10/2019 9:13 am : link
Look at what the Steelers did once Cowher was retiring. Everyone was expecting them to hire within- either Whisenhunt or Grimm. Instead they went with an outsider in Tomlin. Probably wasn't a popular move within the franchise or with the fans, but it was the right move.

Now look at the Giants. They seem to refuse to look outside their circle. Not a smart way to do business and its cost them dearly.
RE: The worst part is we're going to repeat the cycle....  
moespree : 12/10/2019 12:56 pm : link
In comment 14711993 Tesla said:
Quote:
after DG fails again next year and Mara is forced to fire him what are the odds he turns to Accorsi once again to help find he next GM? 90%? 95? 99%?

Rinse and repeat is the true "Giants way."


And Ernie will recommend....Kevin Abrams.
It is endlessly amusing to me that the Gettleman defenders  
Greg from LI : 12/10/2019 1:01 pm : link
are very excited about him "cutting bait quickly".......sure, he fucks up all the time and makes asinine moves, but then he gets rid of the shitty player he acquired quickly! Yay!
RE: It is endlessly amusing to me that the Gettleman defenders  
FStubbs : 12/14/2019 6:16 pm : link
In comment 14712957 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
are very excited about him "cutting bait quickly".......sure, he fucks up all the time and makes asinine moves, but then he gets rid of the shitty player he acquired quickly! Yay!


I'm no Gettleman defender and I'd like him gone, but I will give him credit for that much. A lot of GMs hang on to mistakes for far too long.
RE: RE: It was a great decision  
.McL. : 12/14/2019 9:08 pm : link
In comment 14711757 Leg of Theismann said:
Quote:
In comment 14711720 MookGiants said:


Quote:


Gettleman is doing a great job. Just ask a lot of BBI. It's all Shurmur's fault, DG is doing a great job just let him hire another coach, he definitely deserves to hire a 2nd coach after hiring Shurmur.



When your players play a full half of dominant football and go into the locker room with a 17-3 lead, and then you come back out and the other team makes a few adjustments here and there all of a sudden scores 20 unanswered points and your offense moves the ball 30 yards in the 2nd half, that to me is on coaching. A similar thing happened in last year's game in Philly, it was like Deja Vu. Shurmur has a lead and blows it because Pederson simply out-adjusts him, out-thinks him, out-COACHES him. I actually think Pederson is a perfect example to highlight how bad Shurmur is because he is such a cerebral guy and Shurmur is such a moron. Pederson can take a bad team and coach them up to be tied for the division lead in a bad NFCE, while Shurmur literally only brings out the worst in his players because he doesn't know how to in-game adjust or how to coach a football team in general.

Mind you, DG is no genius himself, but I would say he is less to blame than Shurmur based on SOME of the talent I've seen flashes of here and there and a couple of moves he's made that were fairly savvy (of course there were other moves I very much didn't like, but you win some you lose some). I think DG is certainly less at fault than Shurmur, but that said I don't even care at this point about any sort of "continuity" or whatever, I'm tired of rooting for a dinosaur franchise and I want NYG to bring in people fit to manage and coach in the 2020s. So I'm simply saying DG is less at fault but I still wouldn't mind seeing him canned. Shurmur is clear-cut #1 on my shit-list though, by far.

Right its just a player or two and a new coach...
Don't you realize that is what all bad teams tell themselves.
There isn't an NFL team that doesn't look at the Giants as a joke... The Eagle players took this game for granted in the first half. Even as bad as the Giants are, you can't do that in the NFL. They woke up in the second half.
See how easy it is to see things differently.
Oh, the Eagles out coached the Giants as well. The whole fish is rotten.
Not sure the whole thing went down the way you guys may think....  
EricJ : 12/14/2019 9:41 pm : link
I believe it went like this with no proof at all. Just a theory...

Mara hires Acorsi as a consultant so it appears as though the GM decision is being made by a professional with experience. I also believe Mara was targeting Gettleman even before hiring Acorsi. The Acorsi thing was more about fan optics and a second opinion.

Mara also made the decision on Shurmur. Gettleman may have provided a list of candidates to Mara and offered his two cents... but in the end, this was Mara's hire too.

So, we can kill Gettleman all day when it comes to roster moves, but I think we need to give the blame here to the owner.
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