This is the only outcome that would actually excite me.
Young combo, worked together for a long time (and were college teammates) and have had a ton of success. I know, I know, BB is why the Pats win yada yada. But these two have no doubt played a big part. You could give them the keys and a ton of rope and be confident that you're ahead of the curve and not behind it for once. And they could theoretically bring stability for a decade+.
Unfortunately it seems like Caserio is destined for Houston and I'm sure Mara will just take the easy way and bring Rivera in and keep Gettleman, but if we wan't a fresh start you can't do better than these two IMO.
id be cool with the combo but rivera has proven he can win and he has proven to be a strong HC who knows how to run a team.
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Why don't people ever learn from history?
Kinda like Belichick's first gig in Cleveland and then backing out of the Jets job?
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and backing out on Indy wreaks of doosh.
Kinda like Belichick's first gig in Cleveland and then backing out of the Jets job?
Makes perfect sense. I mean, look at how well the Shurmur/Belichick failings in Cleveland comparisons worked out.
Please stop.
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Why don't people ever learn from history?
I understand the BB coaching tree, to date, has failed miserably. But Caserio has been with that orgnaization the ENTIRE dynasty, he is the man upstairs who has constantly unearthed talent (granted BB gets everyone to overacheive) while drafting in the bottom 5 every year.
McDaniels is vital enough that they couldn't welcome him back fast enough and are rumored to want to hand him the HC position after BB leaves. My take is he's learned a lot from his failures in Denver and BB (who, as everyone knows, also failed his first time around).
I'm not against learning from that past, but I'm not willing to close the door on their futures because Romeo Crennel sucked either.
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In comment 14712646 JonC said:
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and backing out on Indy wreaks of doosh.
Kinda like Belichick's first gig in Cleveland and then backing out of the Jets job?
Makes perfect sense. I mean, look at how well the Shurmur/Belichick failings in Cleveland comparisons worked out.
Please stop.
So just b/c Shurmur didn't improve in his second head coaching gig, I should stop with literally an exact analogy of two almost identical situations? That makes sense.
I also don't know what some of you expect. Anyone we bring in is going to have a blemish on their resume.
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and backing out on Indy wreaks of doosh.
Kinda like Belichick's first gig in Cleveland and then backing out of the Jets job?
Eh, I felt like Belichick should've been a known entity in the positive for George Young. McDaniels is no BB.
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In comment 14712647 Josh in the City said:
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In comment 14712646 JonC said:
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and backing out on Indy wreaks of doosh.
Kinda like Belichick's first gig in Cleveland and then backing out of the Jets job?
Makes perfect sense. I mean, look at how well the Shurmur/Belichick failings in Cleveland comparisons worked out.
Please stop.
So just b/c Shurmur didn't improve in his second head coaching gig, I should stop with literally an exact analogy of two almost identical situations? That makes sense.
You should literally stop with any comparisons to Bill Belichicks road to success. Or pretty much anything Patriots-related. They are and always will be the exception. I swear, you guys never learn with this crap. We've seen a ton of coaches leave the Patriots and fail in one way or another. Crennel, Weis, McDaniels, Patricia, Pioli as a GM - am I missing anyone?
Just stop.
That's besides the fact that the entire logic behind the argument (individual A first failed and then succeeded, ergo individual B will also succeed after first failing) is nonsense.
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In comment 14712662 Brown Recluse said:
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In comment 14712647 Josh in the City said:
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In comment 14712646 JonC said:
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and backing out on Indy wreaks of doosh.
Kinda like Belichick's first gig in Cleveland and then backing out of the Jets job?
Makes perfect sense. I mean, look at how well the Shurmur/Belichick failings in Cleveland comparisons worked out.
Please stop.
So just b/c Shurmur didn't improve in his second head coaching gig, I should stop with literally an exact analogy of two almost identical situations? That makes sense.
You should literally stop with any comparisons to Bill Belichicks road to success. Or pretty much anything Patriots-related. They are and always will be the exception. I swear, you guys never learn with this crap. We've seen a ton of coaches leave the Patriots and fail in one way or another. Crennel, Weis, McDaniels, Patricia, Pioli as a GM - am I missing anyone?
Just stop.
I'm sorry but this is just a loser's way of thinking. These assistants are not all the same. McDaniels grew up in the Patriots system and has literally transformed that offense to fit his talent better than any coach I can remember. BB is NOT an offensive guru, he's a defensive genius. But the Pats continuously morph their offense to fit their personnel and I will absolutely give McDaniels some of that credit. Throw in the fact that Caserio has been in the front office for almost the entire tenure and I would love to see what he can do without BB. I think that combo would be exciting and would love to see them come here together.
McDaniels was a failure though. Despite making the playoffs he still finished 8-8 his first season with the Broncos and then next season went 3-9 before he was canned. He's been as bad as every other coordinator that left New England for a HC gig.
His record in SF was a winning one every year except the last which was 8-8.
Coming out of the college ranks he will have a good understanding of the players coming out in the draft over the next few years as well.
And yes, I am totally comfortable with letting him make personnel decisions or hiring someone he can work with as the GM.
Mara and Tisch need to think outside the box and not go back to old Giants / retreads.
And also inexplicably benched Brandon Marshall if I recall. He is not head coaching material.
Matt Rhule has done it at Baylor and Temple, these guys have been in the bigs for a combined 35 seasons, most of them wildly successful. Yes, it's hard to discern how much is BB but how can we say 2 major players of the pats dynasty, who are both young and in their prime, is not a tremendous 'get' for this org?
Nothing against Rhule but these guys come in with a much more robust resume and rolodex. What would Rhule's staff look like? The Giants need NFL guys.
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In comment 14712681 Josh in the City said:
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In comment 14712662 Brown Recluse said:
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In comment 14712647 Josh in the City said:
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In comment 14712646 JonC said:
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and backing out on Indy wreaks of doosh.
Kinda like Belichick's first gig in Cleveland and then backing out of the Jets job?
Makes perfect sense. I mean, look at how well the Shurmur/Belichick failings in Cleveland comparisons worked out.
Please stop.
So just b/c Shurmur didn't improve in his second head coaching gig, I should stop with literally an exact analogy of two almost identical situations? That makes sense.
You should literally stop with any comparisons to Bill Belichicks road to success. Or pretty much anything Patriots-related. They are and always will be the exception. I swear, you guys never learn with this crap. We've seen a ton of coaches leave the Patriots and fail in one way or another. Crennel, Weis, McDaniels, Patricia, Pioli as a GM - am I missing anyone?
Just stop.
I'm sorry but this is just a loser's way of thinking. These assistants are not all the same. McDaniels grew up in the Patriots system and has literally transformed that offense to fit his talent better than any coach I can remember. BB is NOT an offensive guru, he's a defensive genius. But the Pats continuously morph their offense to fit their personnel and I will absolutely give McDaniels some of that credit. Throw in the fact that Caserio has been in the front office for almost the entire tenure and I would love to see what he can do without BB. I think that combo would be exciting and would love to see them come here together.
McDaniels had his chance at being a HC and he squandered it horribly. That Broncos team was an absolute mess. But yeah - sounds exciting. Can't wait for the drama in the lockerroom and the player sound bites throwing each other under the bus in the media. Sounds like McAdoo part 2.
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Why don't people ever learn from history?
Bill O'Brien has done pretty well.
So is BB. And Shurmur seems like a nice guy....how's that working out. Let's prioritize winning. I don't want some colossal douchebag, but I think McDaniels will have a list of people waiting to give him another shot....we should be on it.
Also, of course, a lot of BB guys failed. Most HCs failed including BB. The point is that if you get the right coach with the right GM and the personnel is there, can they succeed? There are very few coaches like Parcelss that go from situation to situation and win. I would prefer Harbaugh, but I would not sneeze or be upset with Daniels because Romeo failed, Patricia failed, Weiss failed at college, etc etc.
And Jay Cutler has what ground to stand on exactly?
And again, he was 33, a kid running a football team. I'm guessing he has a lot of regrets and learned a lot since then. But don't let that get in the way of the flaming.
What do you mean, wtf am I saying? I think its stated pretty clearly.
On one hand, you give him all the credit in the world for the Patriots offense and learning under the greatest head coach in NFL history, but then on the other hand you want to blame his failings as a HC simply on his age? Thats ridiculous. You'd think all that time under Belichicks tutelage might have taught him a thing or two. His behavior with the Colts was just more of the same. I highly doubt he's changed much.
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When has any Patriots coach or exec left New England and been successful elsewhere? Remember Scott Pioli? That worked out well for KC. Lets go through the list of awesome head coaches that have left the Patriots.
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Why don't people ever learn from history?
Bill O'Brien has done pretty well.
Bill O'Brien has been underwhelming. His Texans should be blowing the doors off opponents. He's a middling coach the likes of Jason Garrett.
I'm not even advocating for McDaniels, but the close-mindedness about him is pretty ridiculous.
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Broncos HC, had the team's franchise QB, Jay Cutler, demanding a trade because he felt he couldn't trust McDaniels. This is definitely the guy to resuscitate the Giants organization.
And also inexplicably benched Brandon Marshall if I recall. He is not head coaching material.
And what type of players did Cutler and Marshall prove to be after that point? There's a reason they bounced around.
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Wtf are you saying? Put the situation in context. McDaniels was 33 yrs old...youngest coach in NFL history and was learning on the job. He was inexperienced and immature. There's a reason BB wanted him back after his stint in Denver and I expect him to be significantly improved in his next go around.
What do you mean, wtf am I saying? I think its stated pretty clearly.
On one hand, you give him all the credit in the world for the Patriots offense and learning under the greatest head coach in NFL history, but then on the other hand you want to blame his failings as a HC simply on his age? Thats ridiculous. You'd think all that time under Belichicks tutelage might have taught him a thing or two. His behavior with the Colts was just more of the same. I highly doubt he's changed much.
Umm, yea that's exactly what I'm doing. Giving him credit for continuously morphing that offense to fit his personnel while also being too immature to run the entire football operation at just 33 yrs old. Those two statements aren't, and shouldn't be mutually exclusive. He clearly wasn't ready to be in that position at such a young age. But BB clearly respects him and gives him a ton of credit for that offense and I would think he learned from his mistakes (which were more about personality/ego than about his ability to coach...unlike Shurmur). I would absolutely love to give him his second shot.
I'm not even advocating for McDaniels, but the close-mindedness about him is pretty ridiculous.
I dont think I'm being close-minded at all. I just refuse to dismiss his failings on the grounds of being "too young." 32 isn't THAT young. And having spent as much time as he did with Belichick and knowing how Belichick is, its even more alarming that he acted the way he did in Denver. Hard pass for me.
Name someone with zero blemishes on their resume...
Name someone with zero blemishes on their resume...
Its not about having blemishes...I just don't buy the whole bit about learning from mistakes. There's probably a good reason why second chance coaches rarely ever succeed after failing on the first try, the current Giants coach included.
in all seriousness i told me friends we should hire an AI to be coach. hell "Ask Madden" from a copy of Madden 2005 would suffice.
we can have Siri and Alexa as offensive and Defensive coordinators
His record in SF was a winning one every year except the last which was 8-8.
Coming out of the college ranks he will have a good understanding of the players coming out in the draft over the next few years as well.
And yes, I am totally comfortable with letting him make personnel decisions or hiring someone he can work with as the GM.
Mara and Tisch need to think outside the box and not go back to old Giants / retreads.
This is the best answer out there in terms of a proven WINNING NFL HC
a)If McDaniels was so vital, why didn't the Patriots offense skip a beat in the three years he was in Denver and St. Louis? Yeah, they welcomed him back - they also welcomed Romeo Crennel back as well. Wanna hire him?
b)There is no legitimate comparison between Belichick's tenure in Cleveland and McDaniels in Denver.