As noted earlier, Pauline’s sources have told him that if the Giants head coaching job opens up, he’s interested in the position. However, Allbright reports that Rhule would want near-total authority. Would Giants general manager Dave Gettleman be willing to concede power to Rhule?
but I do not want him to basically be the HC and GM. Few can handle that much responsibility. Now I completely agree that he should be the one to choose his entire staff. The Jets were fools for forcing a staff on him.
As noted earlier, Pauline’s sources have told him that if the Giants head coaching job opens up, he’s interested in the position. However, Allbright reports that Rhule would want near-total authority. Would Giants general manager Dave Gettleman be willing to concede power to Rhule?
I think this is exactly why you're hearing reports the DG is in trouble. because they'd do it for Rhule
As noted earlier, Pauline’s sources have told him that if the Giants head coaching job opens up, he’s interested in the position. However, Allbright reports that Rhule would want near-total authority. Would Giants general manager Dave Gettleman be willing to concede power to Rhule?
I think this is exactly why you're hearing reports the DG is in trouble. because they'd do it for Rhule
Agreed, I think they know that some of the candidates they like to replace Shurmur will want final say over the roster which is something that Gettleman will not be willing to do.
Would ownership go with him as an unknown in the NFL? Â
or would they go with the established veteran coach that has had success, like Rivera. Two coaches in a row gone after two years. Taking a flyer on Rhule would be a risk. He’s turned around College programs, but the NFL is a different animal altogether. As much as I like Rhule, I don’t think ownership would go in that direction and also give him ultimate control on top of it all?!
I think this is exactly why you're hearing reports the DG is in trouble. because they'd do it for Rhule
I'm not a Rhule guy, but I'd be all for a person wearing both hats - HC and GM.
Something like this would require a major overhaul in football operations at Jints Central. But I think they are too stuck in the their box to take this chance...
As noted earlier, Pauline’s sources have told him that if the Giants head coaching job opens up, he’s interested in the position. However, Allbright reports that Rhule would want near-total authority. Would Giants general manager Dave Gettleman be willing to concede power to Rhule?
I think this is exactly why you're hearing reports the DG is in trouble. because they'd do it for Rhule
I like DG, but would absolutely consider telling DG to cede some control with an eye to all of it transitioning to Rhule after DG retires. If he said no, then I’d thank him for his time.
Rhule is my first choice. Giants better be really fucking smart here. If they love this guy, and he checks A LOT of boxes, don’t get too cute. Let rhule hire his own staff. Give the guy what he wants and be done with it.
I like DG, but would absolutely consider telling DG to cede some control with an eye to all of it transitioning to Rhule after DG retires. If he said no, then I’d thank him for his time.
Ideal offseason, Nick Caserio as GM with Rhule as HC.
1 - Previous ties to the organization while at the same time would represent significant change from the current team. This should satisfy Mara and Tisch
2 - Prior head coaching experience. He's not a coordinator who's being promoted. He has head coaching experience at 2 different schools and turned around both programs
Of course it is. They're the frickin NY Giants. I also understand his desire for control. If you're family and economic success are on the line why would you trust anyone else with your fate?
This may now be a change the franchise would consider. Mara/Tisch may be able to convince DG to take on a lower profile roll with personnel in order to bring in an elite coaching candidate.
As noted earlier, Pauline’s sources have told him that if the Giants head coaching job opens up, he’s interested in the position. However, Allbright reports that Rhule would want near-total authority. Would Giants general manager Dave Gettleman be willing to concede power to Rhule?
Well see. Giants hired a big fine HC before in coughlin and even Reeves. Stranger things have happened.
He will have a say in who the ultimate GM is and they will work together based on shared philosophy. The GM can be hired AFTER the coach.
Correct. Very similar to how Seattle hired Pete Carroll.
Carroll picked the GM John Schneider, who has been with him since Day 1. Schneider does all the GM stuff and then runs it by Carroll. They then come to a consensus.
As it appears, the Giants have Gettleman, who picks the players while Shurmur sits in the corner. Of course, this can become an issue when you are talking about "hog mollies" and toughness and you have a coach who loves to put the ball up in the air more than run it. This can lead to players on your roster that are mismatched based on the philosophies of the GM and the HC.
1 - Previous ties to the organization while at the same time would represent significant change from the current team. This should satisfy Mara and Tisch
2 - Prior head coaching experience. He's not a coordinator who's being promoted. He has head coaching experience at 2 different schools and turned around both programs
3 - Local guy with roots to NYC
Because of #1, I want to disqualify Rhule. I'm so tired of these prerequisites that someone has to have worked for the Giants, grew up in the northeast, coached at a college in the northeast, was a Giant fan, etc.
or would they go with the established veteran coach that has had success, like Rivera. Two coaches in a row gone after two years. Taking a flyer on Rhule would be a risk. He’s turned around College programs, but the NFL is a different animal altogether. As much as I like Rhule, I don’t think ownership would go in that direction and also give him ultimate control on top of it all?!
Rhule has so many more legit pelts than both shurm and mcadoo combined. He’s a leader. He’s done nothing but resurrect teams in his own image. Shurm and Big Ben never came close to that. Yea he’s a risk in the college HC sense but every candidate comes with risk or warts.
He will have a say in who the ultimate GM is and they will work together based on shared philosophy. The GM can be hired AFTER the coach.
Correct. Very similar to how Seattle hired Pete Carroll.
Carroll picked the GM John Schneider, who has been with him since Day 1. Schneider does all the GM stuff and then runs it by Carroll. They then come to a consensus.
As it appears, the Giants have Gettleman, who picks the players while Shurmur sits in the corner. Of course, this can become an issue when you are talking about "hog mollies" and toughness and you have a coach who loves to put the ball up in the air more than run it. This can lead to players on your roster that are mismatched based on the philosophies of the GM and the HC.
Very good point. Buffalo followed a similar model. The GM and coach are nearly indistinguishable in philosophy.
1 - Previous ties to the organization while at the same time would represent significant change from the current team. This should satisfy Mara and Tisch
2 - Prior head coaching experience. He's not a coordinator who's being promoted. He has head coaching experience at 2 different schools and turned around both programs
3 - Local guy with roots to NYC
Because of #1, I want to disqualify Rhule. I'm so tired of these prerequisites that someone has to have worked for the Giants, grew up in the northeast, coached at a college in the northeast, was a Giant fan, etc.
Why are any of those advantages?
Re #1 - he was the assistant offensive line coach. i wouldn't hold that against him lol. but when you look at the current ownership, you have 1 owner who likes familiarity and another who wants change. they def need change. i think this might be enough to placate mara and do what needs to be done
I honestly just don't know enough about the guy. I just know that he's the Baylor coach and they're the #7 team in the country. Literally all I know. Why is he the man for the job? And why are we so sure his talents will translate as an NFL HC (and possibly GM)?
1 - Previous ties to the organization while at the same time would represent significant change from the current team. This should satisfy Mara and Tisch
2 - Prior head coaching experience. He's not a coordinator who's being promoted. He has head coaching experience at 2 different schools and turned around both programs
3 - Local guy with roots to NYC
Because of #1, I want to disqualify Rhule. I'm so tired of these prerequisites that someone has to have worked for the Giants, grew up in the northeast, coached at a college in the northeast, was a Giant fan, etc.
Why are any of those advantages?
Dude just fucking stop already. Belichick has ties too you gonna fucking disqualify him too???
This shitty wreck of a franchise has more championships than MOST. Yes they suck and have for years now but just stop with this stupid act.
Correct. Very similar to how Seattle hired Pete Carroll.
Carroll picked the GM John Schneider, who has been with him since Day 1. Schneider does all the GM stuff and then runs it by Carroll. They then come to a consensus.
Just to be clear, Carroll didn't pick his own GM. Leiweke gave him a list of four candidates and Carroll had to pick the one he wanted. Which was Scheider.
I honestly just don't know enough about the guy. I just know that he's the Baylor coach and they're the #7 team in the country. Literally all I know. Why is he the man for the job? And why are we so sure his talents will translate as an NFL HC (and possibly GM)?
One of the strengths appears to be his success with reclamation projects - like Baylor and Temple.
But Al Golden built Temple first. It slipped after he left, and Rhule got it back on track, but Golden built the house and foundation...
Baylor? Briles, before he got caught up in the assault scandal, built them into a powerhouse. He built a great recruiting pipeline. The scandal set the university back but top players still wanted to attend. So Rhule essentially restored their credit and got the lights back on...but he didn't built them. Briles did.
When you read the article it sounds more like a reference to his sticking point when interviewing with the Jets, after the Jets told him that he would not be the final say on who his assistant coaches would be. I would imagine this was about Gregg Williams as DC. The Jets finalized the hiring of Gase and Williams on the same day last January.
Everything I’ve read about Rhule says he is a big team culture and character guy, part of the reason he took on the Baylor challenge. No way Williams and Rhule could have existed in the same space. Williams would have been undoing everything Rhule was trying to create. Notice the comment about not willing to be in an “arranged marriage”. Assuming marriage means two people here, it again sounds like he may have been opposed to having Williams as DC.
This may not have to do with player personnel decisions
The more i agree that the head coach might need to be the most important guy in the organization. The GM needs to be in lockstep with the coach. This doesn’t sound so bad.
Don’t know if Rhule is the guy but I’d love to see them give him a shot. You need a “culture creator” you need a guy to create and identity. Giants are bad enough and young enough where a college approach might work out. And he’s a pro guy anyway.
When you read the article it sounds more like a reference to his sticking point when interviewing with the Jets, after the Jets told him that he would not be the final say on who his assistant coaches would be. I would imagine this was about Gregg Williams as DC. The Jets finalized the hiring of Gase and Williams on the same day last January.
The article does mention near total control when discussing the unlikelihood of Rhule working with Gettleman. We all know Gettleman isn't going to relinquish power over to a young coach with no NFL head coaching experience.
When you read the article it sounds more like a reference to his sticking point when interviewing with the Jets, after the Jets told him that he would not be the final say on who his assistant coaches would be. I would imagine this was about Gregg Williams as DC. The Jets finalized the hiring of Gase and Williams on the same day last January.
The article does mention near total control when discussing the unlikelihood of Rhule working with Gettleman. We all know Gettleman isn't going to relinquish power over to a young coach with no NFL head coaching experience.
I believe that reference is inserted by the writer and is not a direct quote or citation from the source.
You certainly could be right. Rhule may want some personnel control and Gettleman may not want that. But it’s not really Gettleman’s call.
I believe that reference is inserted by the writer and is not a direct quote or citation from the source.
You certainly could be right. Rhule may want some personnel control and Gettleman may not want that. But it’s not really Gettleman’s call.
Yeah I just saw that, I'm hoping that he is willing to settle for just having full autonomy when it comes to his staff especially if the Giants replace Gettleman and have a shot at Nick Caserio. Obviously the new GM will listen to Rhule on the type of players he wants for his scheme but I would prefer the GM to have final say to take pressure off of the HC.
One of the benefits of hiring a successful college coach is that they have been in the recruiting business for the last several years and they have insights on the players who will be drafted for the next few years because they have already scouted them.
This was huge for JJ in Dallas. I saw him talk about it in an interview once. He knew Aikman, Smith, etc. from their high school and college days. This would be a reason to give Rhule total control if he comes here.
don't see the Giants hiring Rhule. His buyout from Baylor is enormous IIRC.
From what I understand, the enormous buyout number is for other college jobs. The number for an NFL job is supposedly dramatically less. But I don't have a source to cite, unfortunately.
Yeah I'll pass, the NFL is entirely different game for each of those positions. I prefer a head coach with (successful) NFL experience anyway. Rivera is the guy, he's proven to be a good head coach at this level. We cant afford any more experimentation.
Shurmur had a hell of a resume and prior coaching experience Â
Scoffing at the idea of college guys doesn't seem productive when there really isn't much of an indicator of who's going to be a success at coaching at this level. Guys have come from college and had success. Lifelong, high level NFL coordinators have been flaming disasters.
One of the benefits of hiring a successful college coach is that they have been in the recruiting business for the last several years and they have insights on the players who will be drafted for the next few years because they have already scouted them.
This was huge for JJ in Dallas. I saw him talk about it in an interview once. He knew Aikman, Smith, etc. from their high school and college days. This would be a reason to give Rhule total control if he comes here.
Works for me. Can'tbe any worse than what we've got now. Give Rhule a candidate that will work in lock step with him a la Pete Carrol and Schneider in Seattle.
Quote:
As noted earlier, Pauline’s sources have told him that if the Giants head coaching job opens up, he’s interested in the position. However, Allbright reports that Rhule would want near-total authority. Would Giants general manager Dave Gettleman be willing to concede power to Rhule?
I think this is exactly why you're hearing reports the DG is in trouble. because they'd do it for Rhule
Quote:
is going to be a non-starter based on this:
Quote:
As noted earlier, Pauline’s sources have told him that if the Giants head coaching job opens up, he’s interested in the position. However, Allbright reports that Rhule would want near-total authority. Would Giants general manager Dave Gettleman be willing to concede power to Rhule?
I think this is exactly why you're hearing reports the DG is in trouble. because they'd do it for Rhule
Agreed, I think they know that some of the candidates they like to replace Shurmur will want final say over the roster which is something that Gettleman will not be willing to do.
I think this is exactly why you're hearing reports the DG is in trouble. because they'd do it for Rhule
I'm not a Rhule guy, but I'd be all for a person wearing both hats - HC and GM.
Something like this would require a major overhaul in football operations at Jints Central. But I think they are too stuck in the their box to take this chance...
Quote:
is going to be a non-starter based on this:
Quote:
As noted earlier, Pauline’s sources have told him that if the Giants head coaching job opens up, he’s interested in the position. However, Allbright reports that Rhule would want near-total authority. Would Giants general manager Dave Gettleman be willing to concede power to Rhule?
I think this is exactly why you're hearing reports the DG is in trouble. because they'd do it for Rhule
I like DG, but would absolutely consider telling DG to cede some control with an eye to all of it transitioning to Rhule after DG retires. If he said no, then I’d thank him for his time.
He coached at Temple and is currently the HC at Baylor where he resurrected the program.
Let’s start with giving him an interview first before we give him “whatever he wants”.
This guy would have to do a big job here to match the hype he gets.
I like DG, but would absolutely consider telling DG to cede some control with an eye to all of it transitioning to Rhule after DG retires. If he said no, then I’d thank him for his time.
Ideal offseason, Nick Caserio as GM with Rhule as HC.
2 - Prior head coaching experience. He's not a coordinator who's being promoted. He has head coaching experience at 2 different schools and turned around both programs
3 - Local guy with roots to NYC
This may now be a change the franchise would consider. Mara/Tisch may be able to convince DG to take on a lower profile roll with personnel in order to bring in an elite coaching candidate.
Quote:
As noted earlier, Pauline’s sources have told him that if the Giants head coaching job opens up, he’s interested in the position. However, Allbright reports that Rhule would want near-total authority. Would Giants general manager Dave Gettleman be willing to concede power to Rhule?
Well see. Giants hired a big fine HC before in coughlin and even Reeves. Stranger things have happened.
Correct. Very similar to how Seattle hired Pete Carroll.
Carroll picked the GM John Schneider, who has been with him since Day 1. Schneider does all the GM stuff and then runs it by Carroll. They then come to a consensus.
As it appears, the Giants have Gettleman, who picks the players while Shurmur sits in the corner. Of course, this can become an issue when you are talking about "hog mollies" and toughness and you have a coach who loves to put the ball up in the air more than run it. This can lead to players on your roster that are mismatched based on the philosophies of the GM and the HC.
2 - Prior head coaching experience. He's not a coordinator who's being promoted. He has head coaching experience at 2 different schools and turned around both programs
3 - Local guy with roots to NYC
Because of #1, I want to disqualify Rhule. I'm so tired of these prerequisites that someone has to have worked for the Giants, grew up in the northeast, coached at a college in the northeast, was a Giant fan, etc.
Why are any of those advantages?
Rhule has so many more legit pelts than both shurm and mcadoo combined. He’s a leader. He’s done nothing but resurrect teams in his own image. Shurm and Big Ben never came close to that. Yea he’s a risk in the college HC sense but every candidate comes with risk or warts.
Quote:
He will have a say in who the ultimate GM is and they will work together based on shared philosophy. The GM can be hired AFTER the coach.
Correct. Very similar to how Seattle hired Pete Carroll.
Carroll picked the GM John Schneider, who has been with him since Day 1. Schneider does all the GM stuff and then runs it by Carroll. They then come to a consensus.
As it appears, the Giants have Gettleman, who picks the players while Shurmur sits in the corner. Of course, this can become an issue when you are talking about "hog mollies" and toughness and you have a coach who loves to put the ball up in the air more than run it. This can lead to players on your roster that are mismatched based on the philosophies of the GM and the HC.
Very good point. Buffalo followed a similar model. The GM and coach are nearly indistinguishable in philosophy.
Quote:
1 - Previous ties to the organization while at the same time would represent significant change from the current team. This should satisfy Mara and Tisch
2 - Prior head coaching experience. He's not a coordinator who's being promoted. He has head coaching experience at 2 different schools and turned around both programs
3 - Local guy with roots to NYC
Because of #1, I want to disqualify Rhule. I'm so tired of these prerequisites that someone has to have worked for the Giants, grew up in the northeast, coached at a college in the northeast, was a Giant fan, etc.
Why are any of those advantages?
Re #1 - he was the assistant offensive line coach. i wouldn't hold that against him lol. but when you look at the current ownership, you have 1 owner who likes familiarity and another who wants change. they def need change. i think this might be enough to placate mara and do what needs to be done
Quote:
1 - Previous ties to the organization while at the same time would represent significant change from the current team. This should satisfy Mara and Tisch
2 - Prior head coaching experience. He's not a coordinator who's being promoted. He has head coaching experience at 2 different schools and turned around both programs
3 - Local guy with roots to NYC
Because of #1, I want to disqualify Rhule. I'm so tired of these prerequisites that someone has to have worked for the Giants, grew up in the northeast, coached at a college in the northeast, was a Giant fan, etc.
Why are any of those advantages?
Dude just fucking stop already. Belichick has ties too you gonna fucking disqualify him too???
This shitty wreck of a franchise has more championships than MOST. Yes they suck and have for years now but just stop with this stupid act.
Correct. Very similar to how Seattle hired Pete Carroll.
Carroll picked the GM John Schneider, who has been with him since Day 1. Schneider does all the GM stuff and then runs it by Carroll. They then come to a consensus.
Just to be clear, Carroll didn't pick his own GM. Leiweke gave him a list of four candidates and Carroll had to pick the one he wanted. Which was Scheider.
I do worry that Mara will go for the proven McCarthy/Rivera/Garrett route. Rhule is worth the risk imo.
Dude just fucking stop already. Belichick has ties too you gonna fucking disqualify him too???
This shitty wreck of a franchise has more championships than MOST. Yes they suck and have for years now but just stop with this stupid act.
BB is obviously the exception to that rule.
I feel like outside of BB, not a lot of guys who demand full control are very successful.
One of the strengths appears to be his success with reclamation projects - like Baylor and Temple.
But Al Golden built Temple first. It slipped after he left, and Rhule got it back on track, but Golden built the house and foundation...
Baylor? Briles, before he got caught up in the assault scandal, built them into a powerhouse. He built a great recruiting pipeline. The scandal set the university back but top players still wanted to attend. So Rhule essentially restored their credit and got the lights back on...but he didn't built them. Briles did.
I feel like outside of BB, not a lot of guys who demand full control are very successful.
Mike Shanahan had it at Denver. Paul Holmgren had it at Seattle. Both got to Super Bowls. Gruden has it now in Oakland.
When you read the article it sounds more like a reference to his sticking point when interviewing with the Jets, after the Jets told him that he would not be the final say on who his assistant coaches would be. I would imagine this was about Gregg Williams as DC. The Jets finalized the hiring of Gase and Williams on the same day last January.
Everything I’ve read about Rhule says he is a big team culture and character guy, part of the reason he took on the Baylor challenge. No way Williams and Rhule could have existed in the same space. Williams would have been undoing everything Rhule was trying to create. Notice the comment about not willing to be in an “arranged marriage”. Assuming marriage means two people here, it again sounds like he may have been opposed to having Williams as DC.
This may not have to do with player personnel decisions
Don’t know if Rhule is the guy but I’d love to see them give him a shot. You need a “culture creator” you need a guy to create and identity. Giants are bad enough and young enough where a college approach might work out. And he’s a pro guy anyway.
When you read the article it sounds more like a reference to his sticking point when interviewing with the Jets, after the Jets told him that he would not be the final say on who his assistant coaches would be. I would imagine this was about Gregg Williams as DC. The Jets finalized the hiring of Gase and Williams on the same day last January.
The article does mention near total control when discussing the unlikelihood of Rhule working with Gettleman. We all know Gettleman isn't going to relinquish power over to a young coach with no NFL head coaching experience.
Quote:
We don’t know what “near total control” means.
When you read the article it sounds more like a reference to his sticking point when interviewing with the Jets, after the Jets told him that he would not be the final say on who his assistant coaches would be. I would imagine this was about Gregg Williams as DC. The Jets finalized the hiring of Gase and Williams on the same day last January.
The article does mention near total control when discussing the unlikelihood of Rhule working with Gettleman. We all know Gettleman isn't going to relinquish power over to a young coach with no NFL head coaching experience.
I believe that reference is inserted by the writer and is not a direct quote or citation from the source.
You certainly could be right. Rhule may want some personnel control and Gettleman may not want that. But it’s not really Gettleman’s call.
I believe that reference is inserted by the writer and is not a direct quote or citation from the source.
You certainly could be right. Rhule may want some personnel control and Gettleman may not want that. But it’s not really Gettleman’s call.
Yeah I just saw that, I'm hoping that he is willing to settle for just having full autonomy when it comes to his staff especially if the Giants replace Gettleman and have a shot at Nick Caserio. Obviously the new GM will listen to Rhule on the type of players he wants for his scheme but I would prefer the GM to have final say to take pressure off of the HC.
Buyout for a college team is 30 million. It’s been reported that a NFL Buyout is extremely low and won’t be an issue.
Baylor had been a tire fire of NCAA sanctions in the wake of Art Briles before he took over. He's rebuilt programs at Temple and Baylor.
If you are looking for me to tell you a narrative, that should give you the answer right there.
The Giants Way!! Let's mock it everyone.
This was huge for JJ in Dallas. I saw him talk about it in an interview once. He knew Aikman, Smith, etc. from their high school and college days. This would be a reason to give Rhule total control if he comes here.
From what I understand, the enormous buyout number is for other college jobs. The number for an NFL job is supposedly dramatically less. But I don't have a source to cite, unfortunately.
Yeah I'll pass, the NFL is entirely different game for each of those positions. I prefer a head coach with (successful) NFL experience anyway. Rivera is the guy, he's proven to be a good head coach at this level. We cant afford any more experimentation.
Scoffing at the idea of college guys doesn't seem productive when there really isn't much of an indicator of who's going to be a success at coaching at this level. Guys have come from college and had success. Lifelong, high level NFL coordinators have been flaming disasters.
This was huge for JJ in Dallas. I saw him talk about it in an interview once. He knew Aikman, Smith, etc. from their high school and college days. This would be a reason to give Rhule total control if he comes here.
Works for me. Can'tbe any worse than what we've got now. Give Rhule a candidate that will work in lock step with him a la Pete Carrol and Schneider in Seattle.