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My thoughts-Judge and the hiring of his coordinators/coaches

YANKEE28 : 1/10/2020 10:49 pm
Well it has been a few days since Giants fans learned about the decision to hire Joe Judge as Head Coach.

Yesterday we heard him speak, and I think we learned a lot from his 7 minute opening statement.

Fans have been looking for some rumors or leaks on who he will hire to assemble his staff, yet we are hearing nothing. To me, that's a very good thing.

For far too long, we have seen newly hired Head Coaches predictably bring on many of their buddies to create their staff. Face it, when it comes to creating a staff, most of what we see in the NFL is the "good old boys club".

Over the years, yours truly has correctly predicted right here on BBI many coaches that would be hired by a new Head Coach. Its not because of any inside information I had, but rather educated guesses based on who the new Head Coach has crossed paths with over his career.

I hope and believe that Head Coach Judge will use a different approach. An issue with hiring your friends and coaches that you have worked with previously, is that it greatly limits the pool of candidates that you consider.

Look at new Carolina coach Matt Rhule. Nothing is official yet, but it sure seems like he is following the old way, and bringing on staff that most fans could easily predict, because Rhule has worked with them in the past.

I can't imagine a harder out of the gate job for a Head Coach then selecting his coordinators. Usually when a Head Coach is hired, the coordinators are named within 24-48 hours. Did a face to face interview take place? Were other candidates given proper consideration? Probably not.

I think, with the little I learned and heard from Coach Judge yesterday, is that he is very well organized and will carefully consider not only coaches he has worked with previously, but perhaps coaches that he has admired when he had to coach against them. Perhaps an opposing coach he has admired after reviewing game film. He already has told us he plans to interview every current Giants coach.

Certainly Coach Judge will consider coaches he has been with on the same staff. Certainly Coach Judge will get suggestions on hires from his agent, Jimmy Sexton, who undoubtedly has clients that are currently unemployed coaches. But at the end of the day, I think Coach Judge is moving forward with an open plan to take his time and find the very best candidates that he believes will help him succeed.

2 weeks ago, no Giants fan, and certainly not the owners were seriously considering hiring Judge. But that changed after a long face to face meeting and the result was that we were all surprised.

This fan is hoping that the search for coordinators and coaches will be similar. Long face to face meetings with candidates Judge has interest. Take your time. Do your homework. And put together the best staff, rather than just bringing in your friends and coaches whose greatest attribute is that they worked with you in the past.

Great post  
Jolly Blue Giant : 1/10/2020 10:53 pm : link
Thank you!
I think weíll  
Daniel in MI : 1/10/2020 10:58 pm : link
See a mixed bag. Itís hard for a coach to assemble a great staff right away. Heís got to hire all position coaches and coordinators at once. Heís got to do it asap, and a lot of guys he might want might not be available, willing to move right now, etc. I expect a good staff, but one that gets refined over time.
Nice post Y28  
battttles : 1/10/2020 11:03 pm : link
On the other hand, we also know that urgency matters when it comes to these jobs.

Rhule looking at Joe Brady, which is seemingly positive and not predictable for him.

O'Connell joining the Rams since McDaniels didn't immediately secure the Browns job.

Due diligence, yes, but when you hire a HC who was planning and expecting to be a HC, you're also likely hiring someone with a plan for his staff.
A question  
YANKEE28 : 1/10/2020 11:09 pm : link
I wish that the media had asked Judge yesterday was "Would you consider hiring any of the candidates you just competed against for the Giants Head Coaching job"

I would have liked to hear Judge answer that question.

Certainly the most obvious name here is Kris Richards, who is currently the only other candidate currently unemployed.
batttles  
YANKEE28 : 1/10/2020 11:17 pm : link
I will respectfully disagree with the term urgency in your post.

We have the best 8 teams in the league still in the playoffs. Moving with great urgency eliminates the coaches of those teams from Judge's search if he hires his staff quickly.

If it takes Judge several weeks to build his best staff, I am comfortable with that and don't see a downside.

He did give a clue during his press conference  
Jolly Blue Giant : 1/10/2020 11:20 pm : link
Quote:
as far as being a head coach, you canít fabricate that experience. And as a young head coach, Iím going to lean on Dave Gettleman, Iím going to lean on the assistants I hire, Iím going to lean on having the right people in the building to fill in some of the blanks that I may have.


That tells me heís looking for assistants with head coaching experience.
RE: batttles  
battttles : 1/10/2020 11:22 pm : link
In comment 14772823 YANKEE28 said:
Quote:
I will respectfully disagree with the term urgency in your post.

We have the best 8 teams in the league still in the playoffs. Moving with great urgency eliminates the coaches of those teams from Judge's search if he hires his staff quickly.

If it takes Judge several weeks to build his best staff, I am comfortable with that and don't see a downside.


Good point, re: playoff team staffs
RE: A question  
Leg of Theismann : 1/10/2020 11:23 pm : link
In comment 14772818 YANKEE28 said:
Quote:
I wish that the media had asked Judge yesterday was "Would you consider hiring any of the candidates you just competed against for the Giants Head Coaching job"

I would have liked to hear Judge answer that question.

Certainly the most obvious name here is Kris Richards, who is currently the only other candidate currently unemployed.


I would love to see Kris Richard come on in some capacity. If not as the DC, then at least the same position he had last year (defensive backs coach and defensive passing game coordinator). All the young raw talented guys we have back there (Baker, Love, Beal, Ballentine, Peppers, Okudah potentially) would benefit greatly from a young and hungry motivator like Richard.
Good stuff, Yankee28  
Anakim : 1/10/2020 11:26 pm : link
But you're an asshat! I would hope you had a lil' inside info :)
8 teams still in playoffs  
Bill in UT : 1/10/2020 11:31 pm : link
Y28, correct me if I'm wrong. Among these teams he's pretty much restricted to guys whose contracts are up, if you're looking at lateral moves. Unless he's looking at moving an assistant up to coordinator. Any idea whose contracts may be up or who he would look to promote? I've seen a lot of comments that he might want to have guys with previous coordinator experience in those positions.
Anakim  
YANKEE28 : 1/10/2020 11:35 pm : link
Well maybe a little bit....................

Bill in Ut  
YANKEE28 : 1/10/2020 11:39 pm : link
I really know very little about coach Judge.

I am simply speculating on how I think (and hope) he will handle this process.

I have no idea who, if any, current playoff coaches are on his radar.

You are correct that to get a coach currently under contract, it would require an upgraded title.
A really good post YANK  
montanagiant : 1/10/2020 11:53 pm : link
I agree with you on pretty much everything
RE: batttles  
UConn4523 : 1/10/2020 11:55 pm : link
In comment 14772823 YANKEE28 said:
Quote:
I will respectfully disagree with the term urgency in your post.

We have the best 8 teams in the league still in the playoffs. Moving with great urgency eliminates the coaches of those teams from Judge's search if he hires his staff quickly.

If it takes Judge several weeks to build his best staff, I am comfortable with that and don't see a downside.


He would have said heís not in position to answer that right now. Donít think we would have gotten anything.
Whoever he brings in as coordinators will  
Simms11 : 1/10/2020 11:57 pm : link
have to show that they are scheme diverse, as heís stated in his PC. I will point out that Bettcher was scheme diverse, however, couldnít lead this defense. Im sure that will be a huge consideration in his selection for OC and DC.
RE: 8 teams still in playoffs  
Giants38 : 1/11/2020 12:16 am : link
In comment 14772829 Bill in UT said:
Quote:
Y28, correct me if I'm wrong. Among these teams he's pretty much restricted to guys whose contracts are up, if you're looking at lateral moves. Unless he's looking at moving an assistant up to coordinator. Any idea whose contracts may be up or who he would look to promote? I've seen a lot of comments that he might want to have guys with previous coordinator experience in those positions.


I'm not sure about that. I think a few years ago the NFL changed the rules so that Head Coaches are grouped together and assistant coaches are grouped together. So we can't just interview someone for OC when they were QB coach elsewhere. Essentially, we need team permission to do that.

It is disappointing to hear that Rhule is pursuing Joe Brady as OC. He is my #1 choice for OC here, though I'm not sure that is very realistic anyway. Besides, it is a bit surprising given that all we heard was that he would be bringing Sean Ryan with him. Joe Brady was phenomenal at LSU this year, and even though he has a ridiculous amount of talent to work with, he is a big time reason that the talent there has taken the jumps they have.
really warming up to Wilks  
Platos : 1/11/2020 12:20 am : link
hopefully DG made the call
It's not about hiring friends  
Milton : 1/11/2020 1:40 am : link
It's about hiring people you know you can work with and you know shares your vision.
If you heard him On Joe and Evan  
Rflairr : 1/11/2020 2:13 am : link
You can bet Freddie Kitchens is going to be on his staff in some capacity. I think RBs coach
I think what some of you are missing is Judge ssid he wants to be  
robbieballs2003 : 1/11/2020 5:51 am : link
multiple. Most of the names thrown out (Richard, Marinelli, Wilks, etc.) are all strictly 4-3 guys. Let me say this, it is much easier for a 3-4 guy to be multiple and switch to a 4-3 than the opposite. I would really expect someone with more of a 3-4 background to be named the DC.
Nice post Y28.  
Big Blue '56 : 1/11/2020 8:09 am : link
Most importantly, how are you doing/feeling?
RE: Nice post Y28.  
Danny Kanell : 1/11/2020 8:22 am : link
In comment 14772929 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
Most importantly, how are you doing/feeling?


Welcome back!
Counterargument  
Mike in NY : 1/11/2020 8:23 am : link
A Head Coach and his staff need to have the same vision for the franchise. You donít need an OL coach developing a zone blocking scheme while the OC wants to play smash mouth football. If you look at the Giants under Shurmur, there were plenty of times it looked like one portion of the offense or defense was doing one thing and another part was doing something else. I think that was a function of Gettleman forcing certain coaches on Shurmur who did not understand what his direction was.
RE: RE: Nice post Y28.  
Big Blue '56 : 1/11/2020 8:26 am : link
In comment 14772935 Danny Kanell said:
Quote:
In comment 14772929 Big Blue '56 said:


Quote:


Most importantly, how are you doing/feeling?



Welcome back!


Thanks buddy. Needed a break from all the angst/anger (some justified, some not, imo). :)
Great post Y28  
5BowlsSoon : 1/11/2020 8:31 am : link
Iím happy when I wake up in the morning and do not see any names of people hired, especially OC and DC. Like you, I would like to think he is interviewing them too, even if done through FaceTime.

Based on what he said, he has HIGH expectations for his coaches, so I think this demands for him to do due diligence too. That canít be done overnight. Letís see, he was offered the job on Monday and today is Saturday. Iím thinking he may also have been reaching out to people he was considering before his interview so I think he probably has now had time to at least interview them since Tuesday. Knowing his personality type, I have a feeling he and whoever is working with him have been relentless putting names together, so I would not be surprised knowing he probably already Has made offers to several people as we speak. I canít imagine no one blew him away after talking with them on Thursday or Friday.

But, I hope he waits until at least this weekend is over which will allow for him to choose people from 4 other playoff teams. We shall see.
Judge seems to be a guy that will  
Jimmy Googs : 1/11/2020 8:35 am : link
be able to at least identify a great staff.

Hopefully he can land them as well.

Agree with everything Y28 said  
Mike from Ohio : 1/11/2020 8:44 am : link
Selfishly we all want to hear something ASAP, and preferably the names we personally like. But these are important decisions and I expect Judge and the team are doing their due diligence.

My only concern with Judge is because he is young, he may not have the same network of contacts as a guy like McCarthy or Rivera. Now that can be good because you donít just get them getting the band back together, but it also means he doesnít know these guys as well and some learning curve will likely be necessary between coach and staff that other teams may not have.

I guess the point here is I donít see it as a negative that he will not be naming staff as quickly as other new HCs. Hopefully that indicates he is being picky about who he wants, which is a good thing.
It is also clear he values  
Jay in Toronto : 1/11/2020 8:50 am : link
Teaching and flexibility in teaching style in the coaching portfolio.

I suspect that is featured more in college. Jim Leonhard the DC at Wisconsin would be ideal on several criteria, but as a Badger Fan I would be very unhappy were that to happen.
RE: It is also clear he values  
Mike in NY : 1/11/2020 9:06 am : link
In comment 14772968 Jay in Toronto said:
Quote:
Teaching and flexibility in teaching style in the coaching portfolio.

I suspect that is featured more in college. Jim Leonhard the DC at Wisconsin would be ideal on several criteria, but as a Badger Fan I would be very unhappy were that to happen.


Speaking of Wisconsin coaches, what about Bobby April III as LB Coach? He does have NFL experience and he is the son of a longtime Special Teams coach.
Good Morning  
YANKEE28 : 1/11/2020 9:19 am : link
BB56.

I am doing OK. Thanks for asking.

You can probably measure my 40 time with a sun dial, and my short shuttle is now more like a short shuffle, but no complaints.

Hope things are well with you.
RE: Nice post Y28.  
Klaatu : 1/11/2020 9:34 am : link
In comment 14772929 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
Most importantly, how are you doing/feeling?


Doc, where the hell have you been? I just reached out to a Mod to see if something happened to you that I wasn't aware of, and bang...here you are.
Yankee28  
dune69 : 1/11/2020 10:11 am : link
I always enjoy your posts and threads. There is always substantive information and reasoning in your subject at hand. Much like Bill2, I never miss when you guys speak.

In this case, your point on the potential playoff coaching candidates is very pertinent and I would be concerned if Judge put together his full staff in a few days. However, if there is a coach or two he really covets, he should move quickly before they are gobbled up.
RE: It is also clear he values  
KeoweeFan : 1/11/2020 10:23 am : link
In comment 14772968 Jay in Toronto said:
Quote:
Teaching and flexibility in teaching style in the coaching portfolio.

I suspect that is featured more in college. Jim Leonhard the DC at Wisconsin would be ideal on several criteria, but as a Badger Fan I would be very unhappy were that to happen.

Included in the big picture of a teaching and learning philosophy is an organization's process to develop young players in a way that keeps down the number of free agents needed to fill holes (Grow your own). That then influences how you construct and utilize a practice squad.
Green Bay was a great model for this several years ago and I expected McAdoo to copy. Sigh.
Kris Richard  
bc4life : 1/11/2020 10:26 am : link
comes in and does a great job - you're looking for a new DC in a year or two. How much does Judge weigh that into consideration?
dune69  
YANKEE28 : 1/11/2020 10:32 am : link
Thanks for that.

I attached a resume of Dan Lanning. Last year, Lanning was a finalist for the Frank Broyles Award (an annual award that goes to the best assistant coach in college football-this years winner was Joe Brady at LSU).

I am not suggesting that Judge will hire Lanning, but rather I am trying to show the type of background and resume that I believe would be of great interest to Coach Judge.

In this same thread, the name Jim Leonhard was also mentioned. Another perfect example of the type of coach that could interest Judge.
Link - ( New Window )
YANKEE28:  
giant power : 1/11/2020 11:21 am : link
You continue your long tradition of being one of the very best posters on this site. I am never concerned about having to endure some lame content when I see your handle above a post. As reverenced to to a long and stellar tradition, your use of our beloved Yanks as a handle is most appropriate. Hopefully you will soon be changing that handle to YANKEE29!!
Echoing others here, itís always a treat to read your posts, Y28.  
yatqb : 1/11/2020 11:31 am : link
As a psychologist, I often had to assess whether a person was more impulsive or more deliberate. Clearly, Judge falls on the deliberate end of the spectrum. There are positives to that, but at times one can miss opportunities if not acted upon promptly. Letís hope that Coach finds the right balance.
RE: Kris Richard  
Rflairr : 1/11/2020 11:35 am : link
In comment 14773063 bc4life said:
Quote:
comes in and does a great job - you're looking for a new DC in a year or two. How much does Judge weigh that into consideration?


You canít worry about that. Or youíre stuck with hiring a pool of guys like Dom Capers!
I'm not suggesting that Judge should have  
Bill in UT : 1/11/2020 11:39 am : link
his whole staff in place immediately. I do hope that he's concentrating on his coordinators so his first choice doesn't get snapped up. Also, when he gets his coordinators in place, he'll have 2 more good minds and football people to incorporate in the search for the rest of the staff, making his job easier
Not sure if this article has been posted here yet  
TheWalrus : 1/11/2020 11:39 am : link
But there was a lot of speculation about 3 coaches that were reportedly going to join him at Mississippi State if he had gotten the job.

Will Hall- Tulane Offensive Coordinator
Tosh Lupoi- Cleveland Browns Defensive Line Coach
Jody Wright- Cleveland Browns Offensive Assistant

"A Look At Some of the Key Assistants Joe Judge Would Like To Bring To Starkville" - ( New Window )
RE: Kris Richard  
TheWalrus : 1/11/2020 11:41 am : link
In comment 14773063 bc4life said:
Quote:
comes in and does a great job - you're looking for a new DC in a year or two. How much does Judge weigh that into consideration?


Wouldn't that mean we were pretty successful if people are trying to poach our coordinators? Sounds like a good problem if you ask me.
RE: RE: Kris Richard  
Bill in UT : 1/11/2020 12:09 pm : link
In comment 14773175 TheWalrus said:
Quote:
In comment 14773063 bc4life said:


Quote:


comes in and does a great job - you're looking for a new DC in a year or two. How much does Judge weigh that into consideration?



Wouldn't that mean we were pretty successful if people are trying to poach our coordinators? Sounds like a good problem if you ask me.


I could be wrong in my interpretation, but I thought when Judge said he didn't want to hire people "with agendas", he meant avoiding coaches who are already looking a job ahead.
Y28  
dune69 : 1/11/2020 12:51 pm : link
I was not familiar with Lanning. He is the type of young coach that might fit on the squad even if he starts as a linebacker or db coach. My guess is that Judge is familiar with Lanning and a few more like him. Looking forward to seeing the complete staff as is everyone.
Walrus Good find there  
cosmicj : 1/11/2020 1:01 pm : link
Will Hallís wiki entry is linked

May fit in as an offensive position coach
Will Hall - ( New Window )
Tosh Lupoi was just hired as Falcons Defensive line coach  
cosmicj : 1/11/2020 1:03 pm : link
So he is likely out if the picture.
Tosh Lupoi - ( New Window )
Jody Wright was special assistant to Freddie Kitchens in  
cosmicj : 1/11/2020 1:05 pm : link
Cleveland. He worked at Bama, too, and looks to be out of a job. Thatís a guy who is definitely a possibility.
Whether the process takes 2 days or 2 months  
Red_White_and_Big_Blue : 1/11/2020 1:09 pm : link
We HAVE to get these coordinators right.

Coughlin looked horrible when he had bad coordinators and really good when he had good ones.

This can be said about most coaches.

Great points everybody ...  
Manny in CA : 1/11/2020 1:57 pm : link

(1) He is looking for experience

(2) There is outstanding talent available in the eight play-off teams

(3) The strongest impression he made on me is that he "keeps his cards close to his chest"; just like he refused to talk about the players (not praising or discrediting anyone)

The biggest question, in my mind is who is going to be his shadow "bench coach". Belichick has Ernie Adams (who not even the players know exactly what he does). It's more than analysis, it's about identifying and executing subtle advantage at opportune times.

More important than any of the coordinators (who have come and gone) is THE constant, Dante Scarnecchia, his O-line coach. I hope Judge finds someone similar to him

Marv Lewis  
5BowlsSoon : 1/11/2020 2:13 pm : link
Seems like the best to me. He would give JJ that experience and opinion he values and before he became HC, he was the man running a defense.
RE: Kris Richard  
GloryDayz : 1/11/2020 2:46 pm : link
In comment 14773063 bc4life said:
Quote:
comes in and does a great job - you're looking for a new DC in a year or two. How much does Judge weigh that into consideration?


Thats a good problem to have.

If they're a HC candidate, it means the coached their unit very well... which is what you want as a HC.

SI  
BSIMatt : 1/11/2020 6:13 pm : link
Reports Brady and LSU agree to 3 year extension.
Sources: Joe Brady Agrees to Contract Extension With LSU - ( New Window )
RE: SI  
Bill in UT : 1/11/2020 6:22 pm : link
In comment 14773521 BSIMatt said:
Quote:
Reports Brady and LSU agree to 3 year extension. Sources: Joe Brady Agrees to Contract Extension With LSU - ( New Window )


Brady can thank Rhule for getting him a big raise
Bill in UT  
bc4life : 1/11/2020 7:31 pm : link
I don't think that's what ha meant. Being ambitious isn't having an agenda, just means you are looking for bigger opportunities when they present themselves.
an example of an agenda might  
bc4life : 1/11/2020 7:32 pm : link
be compartmentalizing your unit. For example, Buddy Ryan as DC of the Bears
The conditions on the contract are that he can  
BSIMatt : 1/11/2020 8:18 pm : link
Leave for a nfl position or college HC position, but not college assistant. So he could still end up in NFL. though it doesnít seem it will be this year.
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