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FA Edge Rusher Yannick Ngakoue hinting about the Giants

YANKEE28 : 1/13/2020 2:53 pm
Last week we saw a quote from Justin Tuck, indicating that he would knows Ngakoue and would be thrilled to see him sign this offseason with the Giants and wear his #91.

Today, Ngakoue posts a picture of Lawrence Taylor on his Twitter page.

Who knows whats up, but imagine that the Jags are in CAP hell and the Giants have the money to sign the best edge rusher in this years Free Agency.
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RE: We need an upgrade from Golden  
Klaatu : 1/13/2020 4:17 pm : link
In comment 14777193 Rudy5757 said:
Quote:
Golden is a nice player off the bench in a Pass Rusher roll, he is not a guy you want as a full time starter or as your #1 option. He will command a lot on the market so probably wont be resigned.

I would like to see what the coaches can do with Carter. In a limited role I think he can do well. I also dont want him as a starter. same with Xman.

We need to sign a guy like Ngakoue and then a second tier FA or maybe a grizzled vet on a mid to lower contract. We have to invest at the positions of greatest need OT, ER, C and yes a CB. Get Judge some pieces to work with.


The odds are that we're going to re-sign Williams, if for no other reason than DG probably doesn't want to look like an even bigger idiot after trading for him, for letting him walk after eight games. The question is for how much? He's not worth what a premier ER like Ngakoue is, but I don't trust DG not to overpay him. Can we afford to do that and also sign a guy like Ngakoue (or Dante Fowler, or Bud Dupree)? I hope we can, but I'm no capologist. Far from it, in fact.

Add to that the pressing need (in my view) to sign a starting-caliber ILB, plus an OT, OC and a DB, and it seems to me the money's going to dry up fairly quickly. But again, I'm no capologist.

I'd rather not sign an aging veteran DE/OLB/ER, certainly not one on the shady side of 30, looking for one last payday. Might as well keep Golden. However, I'll throw a couple of names out there, guys who are still young, fit JonC's profile, but who don't have the production of a Ngakoue or a Shaq Barrett, and should , in theory, come a lot cheaper: Carl Nassib and Aaron Lynch.
LW at $18M per and Golden at $12M per or more  
JonC : 1/13/2020 4:18 pm : link
is precisely what I would avoid ...
If you bring Yannick  
giant power : 1/13/2020 4:19 pm : link
here, were does he play. He is not know for being stout against the run. He has played end in a 4/3 front. Does he have the goods to play out in space as an OLB in a 3/4 front?
RE: LW at $18M per and Golden at $12M per or more  
Klaatu : 1/13/2020 4:20 pm : link
In comment 14777309 JonC said:
Quote:
is precisely what I would avoid ...


You and me both.
I would much rather over pay him..  
2cents : 1/13/2020 4:21 pm : link
then over pay golden.
There is no way  
BigBlueNH : 1/13/2020 4:23 pm : link
that we re-sign Golden AND sign Ngakoue. Free agents won't come cheap - they are routinely overpaid. We can't afford to throw that much $$ at 1 position. Same reason we can't go out and sign 2 premium OTs. If we sign Ngakoue or Juden or someone of that caliber, we won't be re-signing Golden, who played just well enough to get himself a nice payday.
I like LW  
JonC : 1/13/2020 4:24 pm : link
but pray DG doesn't double down on him. $12M per I can live with, otherwise I let him walk too.
RE: I like LW  
Mr. Bungle : 1/13/2020 4:34 pm : link
In comment 14777328 JonC said:
Quote:
but pray DG doesn't double down on him. $12M per I can live with, otherwise I let him walk too.

I'm not getting my hopes up about Gettleman avoiding a double-down. But if I'm looking for optimism, I think of how he basically admitted to getting Omameh so wrong so quickly.
JonC  
Bill2 : 1/13/2020 4:43 pm : link
I agree on Golden. I think he gets effort sacks. I think we need a prime mover first step killer from the edge.

Now he would have gotten more sacks if we had an effective set of DB's

But I think LW allows greater scheme diversity and depth. And he also was limited by having no edge that needed double line attention

I think pressure up the middle is faster to disrupt the QB eyes and Qb footwork options in an NFL that gets the ball out faster...allowing effort sack guys to be more effective cleaning up a bad pocket than they other wise would be
Bill2  
JonC : 1/13/2020 4:47 pm : link
Completely agree, but in a capped league the overpay is tough to swallow if the number for LW is is north of $15M. We need the Edge talent more, imo.
Great...  
Brown_Hornet : 1/13/2020 4:55 pm : link
...thread.

Thanks!
RE: Thank you, Nick Foles!  
LauderdaleMatty : 1/13/2020 4:59 pm : link
In comment 14777008 George from PA said:
Quote:
.


This. What a dumb fucking move Granted heís better than Trent Dilfer but not a whole lot. Right place right time. That contract was just dumb. Sales Minny and Cousins. Teams thing themselves to average QBs is now the norm but letís it get ok excited. Heís not here and God knows what the contract may be. Vernonís deal should be a cautionary tale. It saying he wonít be great but once bitten.....
YANKEE28  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 1/13/2020 5:00 pm : link
I don't see the picture of LT on his feed.
RE: I like LW  
Milton : 1/13/2020 5:07 pm : link
In comment 14777328 JonC said:
Quote:
but pray DG doesn't double down on him. $12M per I can live with, otherwise I let him walk too.
If they can't sign him, they should use the transition tag on him. Last year it was $12.4M for a DT. Let him find out his market value and then match it. It's not like he's gonna get an outrageous offer from another team. He's just not that kind of player.
RE: YANKEE28  
EddieNYG : 1/13/2020 5:08 pm : link
In comment 14777395 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I don't see the picture of LT on his feed.


Eric,

It was on his IG story.

Art Stapleton took a screen shot of it and posted it on his twitter page.
Link - ( New Window )
Ngakoue's  
mittenedman : 1/13/2020 5:09 pm : link
a big time pass rusher. Reminds of Osi
Ngakoue ain't going anywhere  
Milton : 1/13/2020 5:22 pm : link
Caldwell isn't going to begin his reign by losing Ngakoue. If they have to franchise tag him, they will figure it out.
p.s--the guy is listed at 6'2" 246lbs.
Milton  
JonC : 1/13/2020 5:33 pm : link
Agree completely.
RE: Ngakoue ain't going anywhere  
Diver_Down : 1/13/2020 5:41 pm : link
In comment 14777430 Milton said:
Quote:
Caldwell isn't going to begin his reign by losing Ngakoue. If they have to franchise tag him, they will figure it out.
p.s--the guy is listed at 6'2" 246lbs.


Begin his reign? He was already in charge before Tom snipped his nuts. While Tom was labeled the "Millenial Meany" and fired, Dave and Doug are likely on the hot seat with no other scapegoats to shield them. Dave was hired in 2013.

They have some heavy lifting to do with their cap. Either release players (a whole lot to fit a $17M tag) or mortgage the future cap with restructures. They are $1.2M under the 2020 cap.
RE: LW at $18M per and Golden at $12M per or more  
AcidTest : 1/13/2020 5:51 pm : link
In comment 14777309 JonC said:
Quote:
is precisely what I would avoid ...


Agreed. But I don't want to get into a bidding war for Yannick either, which is what will happen if he becomes a FA. I'd rather not sign any big name FAs. Building the team through the draft and the second wave of FAs is better.
RE: RE: LW at $18M per and Golden at $12M per or more  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 1/13/2020 5:56 pm : link
In comment 14777478 AcidTest said:
Quote:
In comment 14777309 JonC said:


Quote:


is precisely what I would avoid ...



Agreed. But I don't want to get into a bidding war for Yannick either, which is what will happen if he becomes a FA. I'd rather not sign any big name FAs. Building the team through the draft and the second wave of FAs is better.

Best is a multiphasic aporoach, one or two big long contracts and a combination of not so big and shorter contracts. Worst thing you can do is what Reese did and sign a bunch of players to big long contracts at once.
Not worried  
idiotsavant : 1/13/2020 6:05 pm : link
Your going to have a bunch of dbacks and next drafts lbs and S still on first contracts for a while.

So the D side can handle market price for Williams and Golden. Maybe +1, short contracts to coincide for back 7 redoo
RE: Stick with Carter  
Jay on the Island : 1/13/2020 7:29 pm : link
In comment 14777139 JonC said:
Quote:
but absolutely provide him competition.

Agreed, even if the Giants add Ngakoue, please let this happen, the Giants can't go into next season with Carter and Ximines competing for the starting job opposite him. Both players are good backups who will hopefully progress into starters but they have to plan as if that won't happen.

I know it will cost a fortune but the Giants would be wise to sign both Ngakoue and RT Jack Conklin in free agency.
RE: Bill2  
Jimmy Googs : 1/13/2020 7:35 pm : link
In comment 14777369 JonC said:
Quote:
Completely agree, but in a capped league the overpay is tough to swallow if the number for LW is is north of $15M. We need the Edge talent more, imo.


Its north of $15M.

Been discussed a lot when this silly deal went down to pull him in for a look...
RE: If you bring Yannick  
WillVAB : 1/13/2020 8:38 pm : link
In comment 14777310 giant power said:
Quote:
here, were does he play. He is not know for being stout against the run. He has played end in a 4/3 front. Does he have the goods to play out in space as an OLB in a 3/4 front?


This. Heís not a good run defender.

If heís elite off the edge rushing the passer I can live with it given how stout the rest of the DL is vs the run. Osi wasnít a great run defender but the rest of the front compensated.

I donít know. My preference is Dupree but if they go with Yannick I can get behind it. Giants need elite pass rushers in the worst way.
What if we moved Carter inside  
robbieballs2003 : 1/13/2020 9:07 pm : link
And signed him with Golden? That would look pretty damn good along with Connelly and that DL.
Not only  
TommyWiseau : 1/13/2020 9:31 pm : link
Does the Jags need to make 17 or so Mil in cap space to sign him, they need to have enough cap to sign two first round picks and the rest of their class. Plus buffer room for in season moves. They are currently 1.2 million OVER the 2020 cap (top 51 salaries).
I still hate the LW trade  
arniefez : 1/13/2020 9:34 pm : link
but i'd sign him at his higher market value than Golden. Golden is a bad team stats player.
Golden to me is Robert Ayers 2.0  
eric2425ny : 1/13/2020 10:37 pm : link
solid player who flashes from time to time but not worth big dollars.
golden had 12.5 sacks in Arizona  
bc4life : 1/14/2020 8:10 am : link
then the injury, working his way back after the injury this year he had double digit sacks. cannot overpay for him but he's a good player
RE: Not only  
Breeze_94 : 1/14/2020 11:11 pm : link
In comment 14777867 TommyWiseau said:
Quote:
Does the Jags need to make 17 or so Mil in cap space to sign him, they need to have enough cap to sign two first round picks and the rest of their class. Plus buffer room for in season moves. They are currently 1.2 million OVER the 2020 cap (top 51 salaries).


Jags cap situation not as bad as you'd think.

Cutting Marcell Dareus will clear $20 million alone towards the cap. Plus a few other guys- Jake Ryan, Marqise Lee, Calais Campbell, DJ Hayden etc- I played around with their cap on OTC and was able to get to $54 million in cap space.
RE: LW at $18M per and Golden at $12M per or more  
santacruzom : 1/15/2020 12:03 am : link
In comment 14777309 JonC said:
Quote:
is precisely what I would avoid ...


That's funny, because it's very close to what I expect.
RE: LW at $18M per and Golden at $12M per or more  
bw in dc : 1/15/2020 12:30 am : link
In comment 14777309 JonC said:
Quote:
is precisely what I would avoid ...


Golden at $12M/yr is an absolute steal. You wouldn't take that a double digit sack guy at that price? Take a look at the salaries of edge rushers these days...

The problem salary is paying an LW for $18M/yr to be a redundancy.
Edge - ( New Window )
Ngakoue is worth a look...  
bw in dc : 1/15/2020 12:33 am : link
I like that he forces a lot of fumbles. He's forced 14 in 4 years and one of those years was a zero. So he seems to have a knack. And this team needs to desperately start creating turnovers...
RE: LW at $18M per and Golden at $12M per or more  
BlueLou'sBack : 1/15/2020 12:34 am : link
In comment 14777309 JonC said:
Quote:
is precisely what I would avoid ...


I imagine DG gets LW done at something close to 18 mil per, but the details will be better than what that sounds like as a buffer against LW not panning out as expected by year 3...

And I think they let Golden walk and get maybe Leonard Floyd or Ziggy Ansah or someone similar on a short (1 or 2 year) prove it deal.

If the Bears cut/waive Floyd, look for the Giants to pursue him.
RE: RE: LW at $18M per and Golden at $12M per or more  
BlueLou'sBack : 1/15/2020 12:38 am : link
In comment 14779742 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14777309 JonC said:


Quote:


is precisely what I would avoid ...



Golden at $12M/yr is an absolute steal. You wouldn't take that a double digit sack guy at that price? Take a look at the salaries of edge rushers these days...

The problem salary is paying an LW for $18M/yr to be a redundancy. Edge - ( New Window )


The problem is, Golden's stats outshine what you see on the field from him. He's a high effort guy, but not an ER anyone schemes for or worries about. Better to find another guy with more upside, who might be taking a prove it deal.
Golden at $12M I'm totally fine with  
Leg of Theismann : 1/15/2020 12:45 am : link
LW at $18M?? Seriously? what has that guy done in this league to deserve close to 20 mill per season? Seriously that just does not sound right for a guy who has done nothing but under-perform relative to where he was drafted.

We did a better job stopping the run the 2nd half of the season with him here but not $18M better.
RE: RE: RE: LW at $18M per and Golden at $12M per or more  
bw in dc : 1/15/2020 1:02 am : link
In comment 14779748 BlueLou'sBack said:
Quote:

The problem is, Golden's stats outshine what you see on the field from him. He's a high effort guy, but not an ER anyone schemes for or worries about. Better to find another guy with more upside, who might be taking a prove it deal.


I'm not sure what Golden's market is going to be. But we should stay in touch with him just to monitor it. Guy had double digit sacks without another complimentary threat and he had almost 20 tackles for loss (tops on the team).

I like the idea of looking for the diamond in the rough.

But I do not want to re-sign LW at the likely zone of $18M. At this point, I'd rather eat the loss of the picks and let him go. And use that money saved to find solutions for our other many holes.
He just liked an Instagram post  
Saquads26 : 1/15/2020 10:13 am : link
from a fan page Giantszone that tagged him. Basically a done deal 😂
https://www.instagram.com/p/B7UtJ-PF2yQ/?igshid=wryv0p3vmxye - ( New Window )
Not seeing the Jags tagging him  
LakeGeorgeGiant : 1/15/2020 10:50 am : link
They'd need to clear some serious cap space.
RE: Golden at $12M I'm totally fine with  
jcn56 : 1/15/2020 11:13 am : link
In comment 14779750 Leg of Theismann said:
Quote:
LW at $18M?? Seriously? what has that guy done in this league to deserve close to 20 mill per season? Seriously that just does not sound right for a guy who has done nothing but under-perform relative to where he was drafted.

We did a better job stopping the run the 2nd half of the season with him here but not $18M better.


His arrival also happened to coincide with a weaker part of the schedule. Philly gashed the Giants with Boston Scott, LW or no LW.

If we had to overpay for one of them, I'd much rather overpay for Golden. I'm afraid it's going to be the other way around.
RE: Not seeing the Jags tagging him  
Saquads26 : 1/15/2020 11:13 am : link
In comment 14780160 LakeGeorgeGiant said:
Quote:
They'd need to clear some serious cap space.


Youíre right they are actually in the red according to sportrac lol. Heís clearly interested in coming here. Giants would be foolish not to return the interest. They have the money. Let Williams and/or Golden walk if you have to. Get this guy and Conklin
Since Ngakoue was a Gettleman draft selection  
BlueLou'sBack : 1/15/2020 11:40 am : link
in 2016 and a 1st team all pro in 2017, it seems obvious he's flagging DG for an offer to play for the Giants, no doubt at top dollar for an ER/DE.

I guess it's more DG than Giants related, and very much about the Giants' cap space vs the Panthers.

He would probably cost a fortune though, that's what good proven ERs make.

Of the three likely high priced options among Ngakoue, Williams and Golden I doubt DG would sign more than two of them, if that. Maybe just one of them and a "shot in the dark prove it type" deal for someone else, (like Floyd).

But it sure looks like Ngakoue is trying to flag down DG like a yellow cab on B'way after the theaters let out.

I imagine DG has a solid understanding of Ngakoue's worth to the Giants, vs Williams's or Golden's worth.
Umm...  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/15/2020 11:50 am : link
What the hell are you smoking?? It can't just be a pork butt!

Quote:
Since Ngakoue was a Gettleman draft selection
BlueLou'sBack : 11:40 am : link : reply
in 2016 and a 1st team all pro in 2017, it seems obvious he's flagging DG for an offer to play for the Giants, no doubt at top dollar for an ER/DE.

I guess it's more DG than Giants related, and very much about the Giants' cap space vs the Panthers.
RE: Since Ngakoue was a Gettleman draft selection  
JB_in_DC : 1/15/2020 11:57 am : link
You're getting your jungle cats confused.
RE: Since Ngakoue was a Gettleman draft selection  
Saquads26 : 1/15/2020 11:58 am : link
In comment 14780261 BlueLou'sBack said:
Quote:
in 2016 and a 1st team all pro in 2017, it seems obvious he's flagging DG for an offer to play for the Giants, no doubt at top dollar for an ER/DE.

I guess it's more DG than Giants related, and very much about the Giants' cap space vs the Panthers.

He would probably cost a fortune though, that's what good proven ERs make.

Of the three likely high priced options among Ngakoue, Williams and Golden I doubt DG would sign more than two of them, if that. Maybe just one of them and a "shot in the dark prove it type" deal for someone else, (like Floyd).

But it sure looks like Ngakoue is trying to flag down DG like a yellow cab on B'way after the theaters let out.

I imagine DG has a solid understanding of Ngakoue's worth to the Giants, vs Williams's or Golden's worth.


Heís a Jaguar not a Panther
RE: RE: LW at $18M per and Golden at $12M per or more  
JonC : 1/15/2020 4:20 pm : link
In comment 14779744 BlueLou'sBack said:
Quote:
In comment 14777309 JonC said:


Quote:


is precisely what I would avoid ...



I imagine DG gets LW done at something close to 18 mil per, but the details will be better than what that sounds like as a buffer against LW not panning out as expected by year 3...

And I think they let Golden walk and get maybe Leonard Floyd or Ziggy Ansah or someone similar on a short (1 or 2 year) prove it deal.

If the Bears cut/waive Floyd, look for the Giants to pursue him.


Yuck, I have no interest in LW at $18M per. No fan of Floyd either, hopefully NYG interest in him left with Reese.
RE: RE: LW at $18M per and Golden at $12M per or more  
JonC : 1/15/2020 4:21 pm : link
In comment 14779742 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14777309 JonC said:


Quote:


is precisely what I would avoid ...



Golden at $12M/yr is an absolute steal. You wouldn't take that a double digit sack guy at that price? Take a look at the salaries of edge rushers these days...

The problem salary is paying an LW for $18M/yr to be a redundancy. Edge - ( New Window )


My view on this roster in the short term is spend very carefully. Golden for $12M on short term deal is ok. I would not spend 5/60 on him, however.
Yeah, it's like I saw "Cats" and blew a gasket there  
BlueLou'sBack : 1/15/2020 11:27 pm : link
on Jacksonville vs Carolina, and who drafted whom.

So throw that "connection" out with the bath water.

I'll stick to the theory that DG will look for someone like Golden was this past year, looking to establish (or restablish) himself as a viable ER, on a "prove it" deal.
RE: RE: RE: LW at $18M per and Golden at $12M per or more  
bw in dc : 1/15/2020 11:35 pm : link
In comment 14780827 JonC said:
Quote:

Golden at $12M/yr is an absolute steal. You wouldn't take that a double digit sack guy at that price? Take a look at the salaries of edge rushers these days...

The problem salary is paying an LW for $18M/yr to be a redundancy. Edge - ( New Window )



My view on this roster in the short term is spend very carefully. Golden for $12M on short term deal is ok. I would not spend 5/60 on him, however.


Exactly. No way 5 years.

Tops, I would go $33M/3yrs, $15M guaranteed.

Ideally, I would prefer $24M/2yrs, $10M guaranteed.
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