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I don't think Cowboys coaching changes were an upgrade

Eric from BBI : Admin : 1/18/2020 10:32 am
I admit I'm biased, but I'm not sure I would trade Garrett/Marinelli for McCarthy/Nolan.
On the other hand  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 1/18/2020 10:34 am : link
Washington could be much better.
Maybe slightly at Head Coach, but certainly not at DC  
Ben in Tampa : 1/18/2020 10:34 am : link
I think the McCarthy era is a short one in Dallas
Washington will be as good  
since1925 : 1/18/2020 10:35 am : link
as Haskins allows.
RE: Maybe slightly at Head Coach, but certainly not at DC  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 1/18/2020 10:36 am : link
In comment 14784578 Ben in Tampa said:
Quote:
I think the McCarthy era is a short one in Dallas


McCarthy actually doesn't look healthy to me.
But Eric  
Nine-Tails : 1/18/2020 10:37 am : link
Jerry heard bells. They spent a night together
I'm not sure coaching is really the problem  
DavidinBMNY : 1/18/2020 10:38 am : link
With the Giants, Washington or Dallas.

Giants ownership has a muddled power structure, and has a situation where Mara takes on more then he should.

Washington - Snyder is a meddling owner and the franchise has been poorly run. Let's pick Haskins even if the HC doesn't want him. Good idea.

Dallas - Jones is to controlling.


Definitely with the Giants there were issues with coordinaters trying to coordinate and be HC. Bad idea hard for anyone. And Bettcher was a poor choice as a DC that was a bad decision by the muddled power structure.

I just think the 3 teams problems are higher up the food chain and none of them resolved and none of them will resolve.

I
Won't last  
bronxct1 : 1/18/2020 10:38 am : link
I think they may get off to a hot start as McCarthy pulls some things out that he has been working on during his year off. I think after his first season it will be interesting to see if he keeps evolving or falls back to his old ways.
I think Marinelliís abscence  
Reb8thVA : 1/18/2020 10:38 am : link
Is going to hurt them badly. I think he managed to turn a bunch of disparate parts into a pretty effective defense.
RE: On the other hand  
Jay on the Island : 1/18/2020 10:38 am : link
In comment 14784576 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Washington could be much better.

Funny I was just having this conversation with my friend two days ago. I mentioned how underwhelming Dallas' hires have been while they lost some good coaches in Marinelli, Richard, and Colombo.

I also said how disappointed I was that Washington has built a strong staff and I am genuinely concerned about Washington. Their defense has underachieved as SF did prior to this year. Once they add Chase Young we could see that defense take off under Del Rio.
Yeah I will be  
TrueBlue56 : 1/18/2020 10:40 am : link
Curious to see how McCarthy does. His staff does seem underwhelming in comparison to who they had.

I think the redskins definitely downgraded with their offensive line coach. Callahan was able to get the most out of the least. I don't know how anyone would be able to get more out of what he did.
McCarthy will be prepared.  
Pete in MD : 1/18/2020 10:41 am : link
Or at least he will pretend to be prepared.
RE: On the other hand  
Giants38 : 1/18/2020 10:45 am : link
In comment 14784576 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Washington could be much better.


Washington could be better, but I don't think it is because Rivera is there. Guice was not healthy this year, McClaurin missed time, and obviously Haskins is young. If those guys get healthy and develop, they should be better. And obviously they stand to get Chase Young, which won't hurt.

I was scared as heck that we would hire Rivera here because of his connection to Gettleman. That is a pitfall I think we avoided.
RE: I'm not sure coaching is really the problem  
Eman11 : 1/18/2020 10:49 am : link
In comment 14784584 DavidinBMNY said:
Quote:
With the Giants, Washington or Dallas.

Giants ownership has a muddled power structure, and has a situation where Mara takes on more then he should.

Washington - Snyder is a meddling owner and the franchise has been poorly run. Let's pick Haskins even if the HC doesn't want him. Good idea.

Dallas - Jones is to controlling.


Definitely with the Giants there were issues with coordinaters trying to coordinate and be HC. Bad idea hard for anyone. And Bettcher was a poor choice as a DC that was a bad decision by the muddled power structure.

I just think the 3 teams problems are higher up the food chain and none of them resolved and none of them will resolve.

I


I haven't paid close enough attention to the other teams to know and I'm not trying yo be a jerk here but I don't see how you could've watched the Giants under Shurmur and his staff and not see coaching was a huge problem.

It might not have been their only problem but I think it's was most definitely their biggest. They never corrected mistakes or made adjustments to name just a couple of the coaching problems I saw.
...  
ryanmkeane : 1/18/2020 10:54 am : link
now that Garrett can remove himself from the Jerry era I think heís going to have a chip on his shoulder as our OC. He can just do his thing and get this offense back to being a top 5 unit. I know itís probably stupid but Iíve been thinking about this ever since he was being considered for the role.
RE: RE: I'm not sure coaching is really the problem  
Giants38 : 1/18/2020 11:02 am : link
In comment 14784603 Eman11 said:
Quote:
In comment 14784584 DavidinBMNY said:


Quote:


With the Giants, Washington or Dallas.

Giants ownership has a muddled power structure, and has a situation where Mara takes on more then he should.

Washington - Snyder is a meddling owner and the franchise has been poorly run. Let's pick Haskins even if the HC doesn't want him. Good idea.

Dallas - Jones is to controlling.


Definitely with the Giants there were issues with coordinaters trying to coordinate and be HC. Bad idea hard for anyone. And Bettcher was a poor choice as a DC that was a bad decision by the muddled power structure.

I just think the 3 teams problems are higher up the food chain and none of them resolved and none of them will resolve.

I



I haven't paid close enough attention to the other teams to know and I'm not trying yo be a jerk here but I don't see how you could've watched the Giants under Shurmur and his staff and not see coaching was a huge problem.

It might not have been their only problem but I think it's was most definitely their biggest. They never corrected mistakes or made adjustments to name just a couple of the coaching problems I saw.


Look, the Giants have a talent problem. Belichick wasn't going to come in here week 1 and win. Coaches help, but none of that matters until we get more talent.

Where we failed in past years was growing the players we had, particularly on D. And I've never seen a worse assembled crew of LBs in my life. It was also embarrassing watching defensive players run different plays on any given snap. No one was on the same page.

We're focused a lot on OC, but the defensive coaches absolutely have to develop our DL and DBs. There is talent there with Tomlinson, Lawrence, BJ Hill, Carter, X-Man, Baker, Beal, Ballentine, and Love.
RE: RE: RE: I'm not sure coaching is really the problem  
Eman11 : 1/18/2020 11:15 am : link
In comment 14784617 Giants38 said:
Quote:
In comment 14784603 Eman11 said:


Quote:


In comment 14784584 DavidinBMNY said:


Quote:


With the Giants, Washington or Dallas.

Giants ownership has a muddled power structure, and has a situation where Mara takes on more then he should.

Washington - Snyder is a meddling owner and the franchise has been poorly run. Let's pick Haskins even if the HC doesn't want him. Good idea.

Dallas - Jones is to controlling.


Definitely with the Giants there were issues with coordinaters trying to coordinate and be HC. Bad idea hard for anyone. And Bettcher was a poor choice as a DC that was a bad decision by the muddled power structure.

I just think the 3 teams problems are higher up the food chain and none of them resolved and none of them will resolve.

I



I haven't paid close enough attention to the other teams to know and I'm not trying yo be a jerk here but I don't see how you could've watched the Giants under Shurmur and his staff and not see coaching was a huge problem.

It might not have been their only problem but I think it's was most definitely their biggest. They never corrected mistakes or made adjustments to name just a couple of the coaching problems I saw.



Look, the Giants have a talent problem. Belichick wasn't going to come in here week 1 and win. Coaches help, but none of that matters until we get more talent.

Where we failed in past years was growing the players we had, particularly on D. And I've never seen a worse assembled crew of LBs in my life. It was also embarrassing watching defensive players run different plays on any given snap. No one was on the same page.

We're focused a lot on OC, but the defensive coaches absolutely have to develop our DL and DBs. There is talent there with Tomlinson, Lawrence, BJ Hill, Carter, X-Man, Baker, Beal, Ballentine, and Love.


Ok maybe I need another cup of coffee to wake up but I'm confused by your post as you seem to be saying two different things.

You say it's a talent problem and even BB couldn't come right in and win but then say no one was on the same page. Isn't that on coaching?

Then you go on to talk about the talent there is on D. How exactly is there a talent problem if there is talent?

Seems obvious to me it was coaching that couldn't get the most out of what talent they have.
I think Cowboys downgraded  
Peter from NH (formerly CT) : 1/18/2020 11:17 am : link
...
I've been on record as a non believer in McCarthy for years.  
Torrag : 1/18/2020 11:20 am : link
We dodged a bullet there. Rivera I could have gotten behind but not that guy.
RE: RE: Maybe slightly at Head Coach, but certainly not at DC  
JINTin Adirondacks : 1/18/2020 11:20 am : link
In comment 14784580 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 14784578 Ben in Tampa said:


Quote:


I think the McCarthy era is a short one in Dallas



McCarthy actually doesn't look healthy to me.


+1 1st thing that came to mind seeing him at presser
I said this  
TommyWiseau : 1/18/2020 11:20 am : link
Before we hired Judge and before McCarthy was hired by Dallas, I'd rather have Garrett as HC along with his coaching staff then have anything to do with McCarthy. Marinelli is damn good coach, Gruden was smart to bring him in as soon as he was available.
Mike McCarthy NOT calling the offensive plays will be odd.  
Mr. Bungle : 1/18/2020 11:26 am : link
I'm not really sure what McCarthy brings to the table other than his offensive philosophy and playbook.
RE: RE: RE: RE: I'm not sure coaching is really the problem  
Giants38 : 1/18/2020 11:28 am : link
In comment 14784633 Eman11 said:
Quote:
In comment 14784617 Giants38 said:


Quote:


In comment 14784603 Eman11 said:


Quote:


In comment 14784584 DavidinBMNY said:


Quote:


With the Giants, Washington or Dallas.

Giants ownership has a muddled power structure, and has a situation where Mara takes on more then he should.

Washington - Snyder is a meddling owner and the franchise has been poorly run. Let's pick Haskins even if the HC doesn't want him. Good idea.

Dallas - Jones is to controlling.


Definitely with the Giants there were issues with coordinaters trying to coordinate and be HC. Bad idea hard for anyone. And Bettcher was a poor choice as a DC that was a bad decision by the muddled power structure.

I just think the 3 teams problems are higher up the food chain and none of them resolved and none of them will resolve.

I



I haven't paid close enough attention to the other teams to know and I'm not trying yo be a jerk here but I don't see how you could've watched the Giants under Shurmur and his staff and not see coaching was a huge problem.

It might not have been their only problem but I think it's was most definitely their biggest. They never corrected mistakes or made adjustments to name just a couple of the coaching problems I saw.



Look, the Giants have a talent problem. Belichick wasn't going to come in here week 1 and win. Coaches help, but none of that matters until we get more talent.

Where we failed in past years was growing the players we had, particularly on D. And I've never seen a worse assembled crew of LBs in my life. It was also embarrassing watching defensive players run different plays on any given snap. No one was on the same page.

We're focused a lot on OC, but the defensive coaches absolutely have to develop our DL and DBs. There is talent there with Tomlinson, Lawrence, BJ Hill, Carter, X-Man, Baker, Beal, Ballentine, and Love.



Ok maybe I need another cup of coffee to wake up but I'm confused by your post as you seem to be saying two different things.

You say it's a talent problem and even BB couldn't come right in and win but then say no one was on the same page. Isn't that on coaching?

Then you go on to talk about the talent there is on D. How exactly is there a talent problem if there is talent?

Seems obvious to me it was coaching that couldn't get the most out of what talent they have.


Fair enough. Let me clarify. We still need EDGE guys, because none of the guys we have are going to be dominant pass rushers. X-Man has the most potential, and Carter can be a contributor, but we need more there.

But really, our LBs are an abject embarrassment. Even if Connelly comes back strong and builds on the nice couple games he had, our LBs are simply terrible. I'm hoping Beal, Baker, and Ballentine are the answer at DB, but we don't know yet.
RE: Mike McCarthy NOT calling the offensive plays will be odd.  
FStubbs : 1/18/2020 11:34 am : link
In comment 14784661 Mr. Bungle said:
Quote:
I'm not really sure what McCarthy brings to the table other than his offensive philosophy and playbook.


Dallas seems determined to make Kellen Moore a thing. Keep at it, Jerruh.
RE: Mike McCarthy NOT calling the offensive plays will be odd.  
morrison40 : 1/18/2020 11:35 am : link
Yes odd indeed, since he said in his interview with P King that this time around he would not only call the plays but do the complete install during the week, something he had gotten away from. Now it appears he was desperate to get another HC job, and was willing to bend to Jerryís wishes.
Also, he almost broke down in that interview describing how much being a HC meant to him and his family AKA ego.


In comment 14784661 Mr. Bungle said:
Quote:
I'm not really sure what McCarthy brings to the table other than his offensive philosophy and playbook.
When you think about how hard nfl coaches work  
Jim in Forest Hills : 1/18/2020 11:38 am : link
sleeping at the office, 7 day work weeks, etc, there has to be a serious need to want to coach, to be competitive.

That's my biggest concern with McCarthy, the rumors he put it on autopilot. If those are true, it is so friggin hard to come back and sustain that for a full season. I'm sure there is an initial rush but it must be a tremendous grind. Can McCarthy be that dedicated over the year? That would be my question with him.
Their staff is a downgrade  
moespree : 1/18/2020 11:39 am : link
The HC is an upgrade (probably).
Might be lateral.  
mattlawson : 1/18/2020 1:06 pm : link
Washington got a big upgrade. I think we JUST got upgraded substantially with Garret
Itís going to be real fun  
Simms11 : 1/18/2020 1:23 pm : link
watching JG match wits with Nolan. JG going back to Dallas is going to be a very fun watch!
RE: RE: Mike McCarthy NOT calling the offensive plays will be odd.  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/18/2020 2:18 pm : link
In comment 14784675 FStubbs said:
Quote:
In comment 14784661 Mr. Bungle said:


Quote:


I'm not really sure what McCarthy brings to the table other than his offensive philosophy and playbook.



Dallas seems determined to make Kellen Moore a thing. Keep at it, Jerruh.


Yup.

And if the season ended Week 6 last year, Moore would have been coach of the year. It's like Jerrah blocked out the rest of the season.
RE: I think Marinelliís abscence  
LauderdaleMatty : 1/18/2020 2:46 pm : link
In comment 14784586 Reb8thVA said:
Quote:
Is going to hurt them badly. I think he managed to turn a bunch of disparate parts into a pretty effective defense.


Jones keeps tinkering w thst staff. They added Richard when Marinelli was among Chicken salad out of chicken shit. Not that Richard isnít a good coach but Jones keeps messing w coaching and has for years.
McCarthy feels like Wade Phillips part 2..  
Sean : 1/18/2020 2:47 pm : link
I think Kellen Moore is the future HC there.
RE: McCarthy feels like Wade Phillips part 2..  
eric2425ny : 1/18/2020 3:34 pm : link
In comment 14784845 Sean said:
Quote:
I think Kellen Moore is the future HC there.


I was watching a Cowboys game last year and they showed Moore and my wife was like that guy has really bad ďpig face.Ē I couldnít stop laughing.
RE: McCarthy will be prepared.  
Saquads26 : 1/18/2020 3:41 pm : link
In comment 14784590 Pete in MD said:
Quote:
Or at least he will pretend to be prepared.


His year off ďpreparingĒ looks like it was at every fast food place imaginable.
RE: RE: Maybe slightly at Head Coach, but certainly not at DC  
Scuzzlebutt : 1/18/2020 3:53 pm : link
In comment 14784580 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 14784578 Ben in Tampa said:


Quote:


I think the McCarthy era is a short one in Dallas



McCarthy actually doesn't look healthy to me.


I was thinking that too. McCarthy looks old... like he aged a lot over the past year or two.
Provided they're healthy and not too old for the job  
GeofromNJ : 1/18/2020 4:40 pm : link
I prefer McCarthy/Nolan over Garrett/Marinelli based on history.
RE: I'm not sure coaching is really the problem  
djm : 1/18/2020 5:40 pm : link
In comment 14784584 DavidinBMNY said:
Quote:
With the Giants, Washington or Dallas.

Giants ownership has a muddled power structure, and has a situation where Mara takes on more then he should.

Washington - Snyder is a meddling owner and the franchise has been poorly run. Let's pick Haskins even if the HC doesn't want him. Good idea.

Dallas - Jones is to controlling.


Definitely with the Giants there were issues with coordinaters trying to coordinate and be HC. Bad idea hard for anyone. And Bettcher was a poor choice as a DC that was a bad decision by the muddled power structure.

I just think the 3 teams problems are higher up the food chain and none of them resolved and none of them will resolve.

I


Youíre condemning the giants, Dallas and the skins over ownership, but leaving out Philly? Ok you can kill the skins got snyder. Jones has his issues but Dallas has been far from bad. Philly gets my respect as they are the best team in this division, lately. They won a title 2 years ago. Well deserved praise, but their owner is clearly meddling.

Giants might be losing just because hired the wrong guys lately. Could be simple as that. Hopefully he hired the right guy in judge. If judge is the right guy, Mara wonít be an issue here and I think we all know that.

Mara hires the HC. I donít think he does much else of anything. Heís clearly displayed a willingness to let the GM and HC do their thing. Heís granted them autonomy time and time again.
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