Isaiah Simmons is the perfect pick for Judge’s new direction

Because he just doesn’t have that thick build you like to see in a LB

But I think his versatility is a great point. He does not really have a natural position, yet he can play multiple positions

If he is there at 4, I think Giants take him .

Does that automatically mean he will be a good player no matter where you put him on an NFL field?

He isn't a corner
He isn't a centerfield, great zone safety
He isn't a monster edge rusher

And is he really going to be a Roquon Smith or Devin White type ILB? I dont think so. And I love this guy Simmons, just still uncertain how it all translates to the next level. #4 is sure-thing/blue chip range... dont fuck it up DG

he lined up all over the place and made a HUGE impact in their games...he's a difference maker
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Shows up to the combine weighing 237+ and blows the pants off the place. Love his energy and instincts, he is a football player. Him or Okudah would be great additions

to me.

...in past drafts, but that was before Gettleman took over the scouting department. Hard to predict what the "new and improved" scouting department will think of a size/speed LB/S without an easily defined position, but you have to love his stat line from the 2019 season.

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Simmons led Clemson in tackles (102), tackles for a loss (16) and sacks (8) this season, while also making three interceptions, eight pass breakups and a forced fumble. He made seven tackles, a sack and two pass breakups in the national championship game.

He's definitely 1st round value, but is he in the mix with several other clearcut 1st round picks or is he what you want with a top five pick? Right now the draft seems divided into the top 3 of Burrow, Young, and Okudah, the two wild card QBs (Tua and Herbert), and then comes a mix of Simmons, Jeudy, Derrick Brown, Lamb, Andrew Thomas, and two or three others probably. But it's still January. Senior Bowl practices, the combine, and the private workouts will surely shake things up a bit, but hard to tell if the shake up will be in the Giants favor or not. Some guys unexpectedly rise, some guys unexpectedly fall. Ideally its Tua and Herbert who blow people away in interviews and workouts (and are cleared medically).
p.s.--I wouldn't mind if the Giants dropped out of the top ten altogether if it meant a return that included a 1st round pick in 2021.

I just think he’sa liability either setting an NFL edge on the outside or shedding NFL guards up the middle nor do I think he’s an every down safety.

I’m in the avoiding low floor mood this year.

Upside there.
Downside too great at4

A player needs to know his best position. He may play different positions, but as a first rounder he should only be selected for his excellence at his best position. That would be my take.

Without giving up any of his strength is really something. I like this kid a lot.

But what we need most is a LT. The OL needs to be addressed with a couple of high picks.

His game in my eyes doesn’t translate. Blessed to play on the defense he did which offered him free rush lanes to the qb. Again watch the full games anytime he’s contacted by a lineman or a WR he’s out of the picture. He’s easily blocked. He plays way off the ball basically as a safety. In the NfL he cannot cover WRs the way he did in college. He’ll strictly be a safety who’s job is to cover a tight end. However any nfl team will see him on the field and immediately run at him. To me he’s going to b position less unfortunately it isn’t basketball so that matters. Carry on with the Simmons love fest.

In comment 14785245 LakeGeorgeGiant said:

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to me.

Enlighten us...

like we did with Pugh,Richburg and Flowers. Best impact player available.

Simmons is all over the field. he's a good tackler and he's disruptive because of how easily he covers distance on the field.

however, if you watch the 2nd half against LSU you'll see a couple of examples of how quickly he can be taken out of a play with contact. I don't know if this can be remedied but I'm sure our coaches/scouts will figure it out.

In comment 14785270 johnnyb said:

Quote:

But what we need most is a LT. The OL needs to be addressed with a couple of high picks.

You take BPA. You don’t force the pick. That could be Simmons or Okudah. Not sure it’s one of the OTs.

that can help our defense...

In comment 14785288 RobCarpenter said:

Quote:

In comment 14785270 johnnyb said: Quote: But what we need most is a LT. The OL needs to be addressed with a couple of high picks. You take BPA. You don’t force the pick. That could be Simmons or Okudah. Not sure it’s one of the OTs.

+1

Picking at 4 we want a guy most likely to be a perennial pro bowl type. Preferably an elite defender IMO, whether Okudah or Simmons. Or Young if by some miracle the Skins and Lions pass on him

In comment 14785256 Milton said:

Quote:

...in past drafts, but that was before Gettleman took over the scouting department. Hard to predict what the "new and improved" scouting department will think of a size/speed LB/S without an easily defined position, but you have to love his stat line from the 2019 season. Quote: Simmons led Clemson in tackles (102), tackles for a loss (16) and sacks (8) this season, while also making three interceptions, eight pass breakups and a forced fumble. He made seven tackles, a sack and two pass breakups in the national championship game. He's definitely 1st round value, but is he in the mix with several other clearcut 1st round picks or is he what you want with a top five pick? Right now the draft seems divided into the top 3 of Burrow, Young, and Okudah, the two wild card QBs (Tua and Herbert), and then comes a mix of Simmons, Jeudy, Derrick Brown, Lamb, Andrew Thomas, and two or three others probably. But it's still January. Senior Bowl practices, the combine, and the private workouts will surely shake things up a bit, but hard to tell if the shake up will be in the Giants favor or not. Some guys unexpectedly rise, some guys unexpectedly fall. Ideally its Tua and Herbert who blow people away in interviews and workouts (and are cleared medically). p.s.--I wouldn't mind if the Giants dropped out of the top ten altogether if it meant a return that included a 1st round pick in 2021.

I think this is a pretty good framing of what we're looking at. I don't think Lamb ends up at this altitude, but I think Delpit sneaks back toward the top, along with maybe Raekwon Davis and Rashard Lawrence, depending on exactly how copycat the league gets for the 49ers DL.

In comment 14785294 mfsd said:

Quote:

In comment 14785288 RobCarpenter said: Quote: In comment 14785270 johnnyb said: Quote: But what we need most is a LT. The OL needs to be addressed with a couple of high picks. You take BPA. You don’t force the pick. That could be Simmons or Okudah. Not sure it’s one of the OTs. +1 Picking at 4 we want a guy most likely to be a perennial pro bowl type. Preferably an elite defender IMO, whether Okudah or Simmons. Or Young if by some miracle the Skins and Lions pass on him

The last time there was a clear cut top player in the draft kind of defensive lineman, he slipped to #6, played for that team for 4.5 years and then got traded before his second contract to a desperate non-contender right before his free agency.

If Young slides, it could be fortuitous or it could be a tease.

In comment 14785301 Gatorade Dunk said:

Quote:

In comment 14785294 mfsd said: Quote: In comment 14785288 RobCarpenter said: Quote: In comment 14785270 johnnyb said: Quote: But what we need most is a LT. The OL needs to be addressed with a couple of high picks. You take BPA. You don’t force the pick. That could be Simmons or Okudah. Not sure it’s one of the OTs. +1 Picking at 4 we want a guy most likely to be a perennial pro bowl type. Preferably an elite defender IMO, whether Okudah or Simmons. Or Young if by some miracle the Skins and Lions pass on him The last time there was a clear cut top player in the draft kind of defensive lineman, he slipped to #6, played for that team for 4.5 years and then got traded before his second contract to a desperate non-contender right before his free agency. If Young slides, it could be fortuitous or it could be a tease.

I see what you did there:)

Draft is always a crap shoot...which is why I want to see us draft the closest we can find to a sure thing, not force a reach pick who fits a need

I’m leaning Okudah right now. All Pro caliber CB makes everything else on defense that much easier

In comment 14785303 mfsd said:

Quote:

In comment 14785301 Gatorade Dunk said: Quote: In comment 14785294 mfsd said: Quote: In comment 14785288 RobCarpenter said: Quote: In comment 14785270 johnnyb said: Quote: But what we need most is a LT. The OL needs to be addressed with a couple of high picks. You take BPA. You don’t force the pick. That could be Simmons or Okudah. Not sure it’s one of the OTs. +1 Picking at 4 we want a guy most likely to be a perennial pro bowl type. Preferably an elite defender IMO, whether Okudah or Simmons. Or Young if by some miracle the Skins and Lions pass on him The last time there was a clear cut top player in the draft kind of defensive lineman, he slipped to #6, played for that team for 4.5 years and then got traded before his second contract to a desperate non-contender right before his free agency. If Young slides, it could be fortuitous or it could be a tease. I see what you did there:) Draft is always a crap shoot...which is why I want to see us draft the closest we can find to a sure thing, not force a reach pick who fits a need I’m leaning Okudah right now. All Pro caliber CB makes everything else on defense that much easier

All Pro Calibre pass rushers make a secondary

You assess an LB by his play, not by obsessing over his body size.

If 1980 LT was in this draft, there would be people here who’d find “flaws” and argue against picking him.

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I remember a player very similar in size, body type, played linebacker and safety, was fast, very similar, Brad Van Pelt, he did pretty good, he was as fast or athletic as Simmons either.

The times I have seen him, which granted was only a couple, he wasn't a thumper which means he likely can't play LB in the NFL. So I am worried about where he would play in the NFL. Sometimes guys like this get away with a lot in college because of their athletic ability, but you can't do that in the NFL

can his speed/bend be really special there? The versatility is great and I've seen enough to be confident in him being good everywhere.

Can he also be great somewhere? It's a projection since he moved around so much but I lean yes on the edge.

In comment 14785273 Saquads26 said:

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In comment 14785245 LakeGeorgeGiant said: Quote: to me. Enlighten us...

He is a tweener. Does he have the physicality for LB in the NFL? If not is he worth a top 5 pick to play safety? Will he play at an elite level at either position? I'm not convinced.

He may very well be a very good player at the next level, but I'm not on board with a tweener at #4. They need an instant starter at a position of need.

Not saying I do but the NFL is tough on guys who fall in the middle. If he can play one position at a really high level and then do other things well, that's fine. But if he's a little of this, little of that then I'd be careful.

But he has some impressive quickness & agility for a man his size.
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What do you want from a top 5 pick? A guy who can make an impact on the field for all 3 downs.

In a base 4-3, he's your run and chase WILL or will be an above average blitzer given his length and athleticism
In a 3-4, he can line up at WILB or as an EDGE rusher (presently, I think he's equivocal with Zo Carter as a rusher)
In nickel, he's going to be one of your 2 LBs
In a big nickel, he's your 3rd safety/play $backer
In dime, he can probably even play slot

His range makes him a 3 down player in zone coverage regardless of the offensive formation. In man coverage, if there's a TE, he'll eliminate them.

He's basically a bigger, faster and well, more talent Jabrill Peppers. Having the two of them around will open up any playbook.

The argument about taking on blockers is also kind of not a big issue. Almost everybody coming out of college has that issue. And the whole point of investing so much in those porky guys up front is to help occupy blockers so you can have ultra-athletic back seven run and chase. Why do you think Cory Littleton, who's about 230 lbs dripping wet is so successful? Donald and Brockers command respect. Joe Schobert? Cleveland (before they messed it up) had a nasty front four.

Simmons isn't the only good pick at #4, but should feel just fine about him if he is THE pick.

Isaiah Simmons by alignment for Clemson in 2019:

* Safety: 218 snaps
* Slot CB: 286 snaps
* OLB: 160 snaps
* ILB/MLB: 120 snaps
* Perimeter CB: 17 snaps

He rushed the passer 71 times and had *7* sacks.
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Detroit may take him with the third pick. Hope that is not the case. Perfect choice for an innovative HC who wants to play outside the box with special guys like IS. All over the field.

Would love to end up with one of Ohio State studs.

There is a substantial chance that Okudah is there screaming at #4. With the release of JJ this is a premium position, a position of need, and a bpa all in alignment.

So yes, let's crap around and take Simmons.

Starting to see who it's gonna be this year

In comment 14785486 Bob in Newburgh said:

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There is a substantial chance that Okudah is there screaming at #4. With the release of JJ this is a premium position, a position of need, and a bpa all in alignment. So yes, let's crap around and take Simmons.

. Would be happy with either one at #4, Both are instant starters on this teams defense and for years to come. Do not want a developmental OL because they are hit and miss. At #4 you have to get a generational starter. IMO.

While now. I, without a doubt, think he’s the pick at 4 unless Okudah is there. He fits exactly what they want in a player: Versatile. Can play anywhere on defense, he even showed that he could cover WRs like a DB in the Chip.

That Simmons isn’t a top 10 talent are the same dumbasses who no next to nothing about football and just regurgitate what they hear other dumb ass people who don’t know the game say.

In comment 14785861 tyrik13 said:

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That Simmons isn’t a top 10 talent are the same dumbasses who no next to nothing about football and just regurgitate what they hear other dumb ass people who don’t know the game say.

So basically at least 25% of BBI.

Forget his athleticism and be honest - where has he looked like he can play LB in the NFL and deal with an opponents run game

The closer he gets to the LOS the worse he looks. He looks great blitzing when no one is in front of him

Shaq Thompson was viewed like this, but actually played majority of LB in college

I don’t want him at pick 4

We don’t want someone moving up to the Lions 3 hole and snagging him, do we?

Although, I would not object to UDUHAH as my 4 pick.