What's new about seeing Aaron Rogers fail in the NFC Championship game?
It doesn't seem to matter who the coach is in Green Bay, it's the same game. The man has uber QB skills; has had some of the best WRs to play with in the game; he produces all year; and then plays the same mystifying game in the playoffs either front to back or back to front. Is it the coach, the team around him, or does Aaron Rogers lack the needed assassin instinct.
He's probably going to be a first ballot Hall of Famer, and Eli Manning has one more ring than he does right now despite Rogers having several more paths to the Lombardi than Eli had, and the never ending debate of whether Eli merits being in the Hall of Fame.
It accentuates for me how fragile a path NFL greatness really is. It takes heaping spoons of talent, grit, coolness under fire, toughness, ability to execute under pressure in a timely fashion, and plain old fashioned luck. Just how great is it that Eli frikking Manning led the Giants to 2 Lombardis?!!!!!
By the way. Eli Manning beat a 49er's team just a tough as last night's team - if not tougher with shear grit and toughness. He was under much heavier fire than Roger's was for the entire game. Just how incredible was that NFC Championship game in 2012. I don;t know about you - but I will never forget it and I was on the edge of my seat the whole game. And then to follow it up by beating for the second time 6 ring Brady!!!!!
Those are thoughts running through my head all night and through this morning.
Two, he has one legit WR. Everybody else is not good unless you count Jones out of the backfield.
Three, GB's defense has been bipolar this year. They have had some amazing games and other games like last night. They have also had those types of turnarounds within games.
Imo, this has zero to do with Rodgers. That team severely overachieved this year and it showed last night.
That's why the 2011 Championship Game will always live as one of the greatest Giants games to watch.
I think younger coaches are like yaaargh analytics and passing and exciting punt returners!
That's why the 2011 Championship Game will always live as one of the greatest Giants games to watch.
But the only reason we look at Eli like that is because our D and ST played the role as well. Eli kept us in that game. It took all three phases. Comparing that game to the one last night is disingenuous. Rodgers and that O really had no shot because the game was decided on the other side of the ball. GB's defense vs. SF's offense decided that game.
Larry - I debated adding Brees to the above. It is the same story. I wanted to stay on point with last night's game and not ramble, but you are exactly on point bringing it up.
Because two more TDs and 2 point conversions make it just a 3 point game. So, instead of 3 TDs they'd need 2 TDs and a FG.
Exactly. They severely overachieved this year.
Quote:
away from that game is that Rodgers didn't want any part of taking a beating from SF's D.
That's why the 2011 Championship Game will always live as one of the greatest Giants games to watch.
But the only reason we look at Eli like that is because our D and ST played the role as well. Eli kept us in that game. It took all three phases. Comparing that game to the one last night is disingenuous. Rodgers and that O really had no shot because the game was decided on the other side of the ball. GB's defense vs. SF's offense decided that game.
That's true. But when the game was close, Rodgers didn't make the plays and then fumbled the snap. But their D wasn't getting stops and I doubt there have been many times a team running for 300 yards lost. Ever.
Rodgers’ guys didn’t...
That's why the 2011 Championship Game will always live as one of the greatest Giants games to watch.
Agree 100 percent that Rodgers wants no part of getting lit up even a fraction like Eli did in '11. Understandable sentiment, just not one that leads to a Lombardi this year.
Don't be too hard on Rodgers though, it takes an amazing football player at the QB spot to lead two magical runs cutting through the NFL'S best to reach the promised land '07 and '11 had a Hall of Fame HC too.
Good original post.
I had GB fan telling me they're better than I thought XD
I also warned a Ravens fan not to bet against Titans.
Great QBs can cover up a lot of warts. Problem is, you can't run and hide in the NFL postseason. PRetty good teams with great QBs get crushed. Every single time.
Two, he has one legit WR. Everybody else is not good unless you count Jones out of the backfield.
Three, GB's defense has been bipolar this year. They have had some amazing games and other games like last night. They have also had those types of turnarounds within games.
Imo, this has zero to do with Rodgers. That team severely overachieved this year and it showed last night.
robbie -- how many interceptions did Roger's have last night? can someone else chime in and remind me? and you are saying that last night's loss is not on Rogers. Please! Roger's big time folded last night. ANd he's done it several times before in the playoffs. He needs everything to be just right to win. The great ones can put a team on their back, and he considered one of the great ones. He just can't do it.
I was down on GB all season long. To their credit they won 14 games. Their D and ground game was much better than I thought it would be.
TO be fair here, The niners are just a nasty talented bunch. GB earned their record this season and just lost to an excellent, title winning, caliber team.
Quote:
One, they won this year due to their running game. Rodgers didn't have a typical Rodgers season. They threw it much less. That whole offense is built around the running game now. That is not the way it was under McCarthy.
Two, he has one legit WR. Everybody else is not good unless you count Jones out of the backfield.
Three, GB's defense has been bipolar this year. They have had some amazing games and other games like last night. They have also had those types of turnarounds within games.
Imo, this has zero to do with Rodgers. That team severely overachieved this year and it showed last night.
robbie -- how many interceptions did Roger's have last night? can someone else chime in and remind me? and you are saying that last night's loss is not on Rogers. Please! Roger's big time folded last night. ANd he's done it several times before in the playoffs. He needs everything to be just right to win. The great ones can put a team on their back, and he considered one of the great ones. He just can't do it.
I'm not saying he is great but you are wrong saying he has a great supporting cast. The talent on SF compared to GB is significant.
Two, he has one legit WR. Everybody else is not good unless you count Jones out of the backfield.
Three, GB's defense has been bipolar this year. They have had some amazing games and other games like last night. They have also had those types of turnarounds within games.
Imo, this has zero to do with Rodgers. That team severely overachieved this year and it showed last night.
Couldn’t agree more. I know the word “Rodgers” gets people all hot and bothered leading to some really bad takes, but Green Bay just wasn’t that good this year if you watched them weekly. I think they will be better next year because they can now focus on bolstering what’s worked (run game especially) and try to fix what isn’t (they need 1 more playmaker on D and they HAVE to get a compliment WR for Adams - someone like Cobb or a better TE or both).
Quote:
.Down 21
Because two more TDs and 2 point conversions make it just a 3 point game. So, instead of 3 TDs they'd need 2 TDs and a FG.
So they ended up down 17, needing 3 scores. Instead of down 16 needing 2.
If Jones played that game yesterday most of BBI would be annoyed with him a bit but would be CRUSHING the defense and lack of a playmaker other than Adams on offense.
That's why the 2011 Championship Game will always live as one of the greatest Giants games to watch.
This.
Rodgers whole demeanor was almost noticeably indifferent. When he fumbled the snap it was sort of like, oh well....
it doesn’t appear like he motivates or even interacts with any
of his guys either on field or sideline.
makes one still wonder about mccarthy’s side of things.
is he just a prick?
Quote:
One, they won this year due to their running game. Rodgers didn't have a typical Rodgers season. They threw it much less. That whole offense is built around the running game now. That is not the way it was under McCarthy.
Two, he has one legit WR. Everybody else is not good unless you count Jones out of the backfield.
Three, GB's defense has been bipolar this year. They have had some amazing games and other games like last night. They have also had those types of turnarounds within games.
Imo, this has zero to do with Rodgers. That team severely overachieved this year and it showed last night.
Couldn’t agree more. I know the word “Rodgers” gets people all hot and bothered leading to some really bad takes, but Green Bay just wasn’t that good this year if you watched them weekly. I think they will be better next year because they can now focus on bolstering what’s worked (run game especially) and try to fix what isn’t (they need 1 more playmaker on D and they HAVE to get a compliment WR for Adams - someone like Cobb or a better TE or both).
I think they will be worse next season. Struggling to make the playoffs, because I see Rodgers about to hit a wall or have an injury that will derail them. They had a few fortuitous games where they were basically gifted wins. The Lions and Bears games immediately come to mind. Phantom hands to the face calls helped in one of them.
Quote:
In comment 14786659 jeff57 said:
Quote:
.Down 21
Because two more TDs and 2 point conversions make it just a 3 point game. So, instead of 3 TDs they'd need 2 TDs and a FG.
So they ended up down 17, needing 3 scores. Instead of down 16 needing 2.
That's because they missed the 2 point conversion. As a coach when you are down by that much you cannot worry about missing them because if you miss it then you are already done anyway. I'm not saying it is right or wrong. You have to know how the game is playing out. Lafleur felt they were going to have many opportunities so that was his best shot at winning.
We don't know that. Obviously, no one does, but we don't know that to be true.
What we do know is that the annoited one, the Hall of Fame bound Rodgers and his Pack were simply not good enough to get that tough, underdog, victory on the road in a Conference title game.
Some players have done it, some even more than once and put the cherry on to delivering the hardware too.
Fire up the engine on the Rodgers excuse train.
I said this after XLII and repeated it after XLVI (and my mind has never changed), I’ll take many crappy seasons for a SB win every 10 years. All that has ever mattered to me since our first SB win, is the hardware. Period. End of story. For this fan.
...I'm not sure how far you can take this argument.
After all, it's not like Aaron Rodgers allowed San Fran to rush for almost 300 yards.
Green Bay was behind the 8-Ball early on. Very difficult circumstances for any QB, especially going up against the 49ers pass rush!
Yea, Aaron Rodgers didn't cover himself with any glory yesterday, but he is not the reason why Green Bay was puched to the floor and kicked in the teeth.
That would be Green Bay's defense, which raised the white flag and begged for mercy before the end of the first half.
The D allowed 300 yards rushing! The opposing QB threw the ball less than a single-wing QB.
Rodgers didn't look like he wanted any part of facing the Niners D, and I think that's a valid observation, but there aren't excuses here - they got their asses whooped.
What's the excuse now?
That's why the 2011 Championship Game will always live as one of the greatest Giants games to watch.
yep
2) That being said, the reason Rodgers had so many shots at a super bowl is due in no small part to how well he played during the regular season - at times carrying his team. We never saw a lot of Eli elevating the team around him (2011 the exception), especially at the back end of his career. That carries a lot of weight, especially with analysts;
3) While Eli played great in SF in 2011/12, made big throws, the defense and special teams made big plays as well. Rodgers could have played as well as Eli last night and still lost 37-20; and
4) This playoff run really drove home the point of getting home field advantage with a big regular season. Though the Titans made a valiant run, the days of sneaking into the playoffs as a wild card or mediocre division winner seem long gone.
The D allowed 300 yards rushing! The opposing QB threw the ball less than a single-wing QB.
Rodgers didn't look like he wanted any part of facing the Niners D, and I think that's a valid observation, but there aren't excuses here - they got their asses whooped.
Exactly. Nobody is making excuses for Rodgers but to lay this loss at one person's feet is ridiculous especially after the D got trampled all night.
Me too Larry!
What's the excuse now?
Yeah what a complete underachiever Rodgers is...
Rodgers played terribly last night. An absolute terrible fumble that was just poked out of his hand that killed a potential big play that led to points the other way, he fumbled the snap which killed a potential TD drive and another bad pick that led to points,
On top of that he looked defeated and uninterested even early in the game.
The D allowed 300 yards rushing! The opposing QB threw the ball less than a single-wing QB.
Rodgers didn't look like he wanted any part of facing the Niners D, and I think that's a valid observation, but there aren't excuses here - they got their asses whooped.
Definitely Aaron Rodgers had that look on his face that sorta said, "Why did I get out of bed this morning?"
He looks more like Sam Elliott than his younger self.
He looks more like Sam Elliott than his younger self.
In fairness, Danica Patrick wears him out. Constantly.
In any case I don’t really get the back patting on this one (not you). He’s an all time great QB, a bad playoff loss doesn’t change that.
What's the excuse now?
Are you able to go back 5 years, fire McCarthy and get someone else? If not what’s the point of your post? This isn’t elite Rodgers anymore, the years McCarthy had him for. He’s still very good, IMO but not that level anymore.
In any case I don’t really get the back patting on this one (not you). He’s an all time great QB, a bad playoff loss doesn’t change that.
Rodgers is one of my favorite QB's to have watched play. I just see him slowing down a bit, which is natural, and I think he'll be fortunate to not get injured next season. I don't think he's done, and I don't think vintage Rodgers could overcome that SF running game yesterday. But I think his glory days are behind him.
Did you all notice GB almost climb back in with two deep balls against what should have been the prevent? The secondary better play better to beat the Chiefs.
When the Giants lose it's all about everybody BUT the QB.
When the other team loses it's all about the QB.
- Yesterday's game just adds to Rodgers body of work of coming up small in the biggest games. He has more interceptions than touchdowns in NFC championship games for his career. Great player but in a big game, I choose a lot of QB's over him. You may want to dispute that he hasn't had the best teams. The 2011 Giant game is a reply to that. Best team in the league by far and he along with his team came up small. This isn't Eli vs. Rodgers. This is just the simple fact that there are better big time QB's.
- The 49ers are a very solid team from top to bottom and the Chiefs are incredibly explosive. I'll add that the Ravens matched up much better against the Chiefs than the Titans did but that is why you play the game. Other than that, I don't see much else in regards to really good teams in the league. The Titans could be in QB hell. Packers are nowhere as good as a 13-3 team should traditionally be. Patriots may have finally hit a wall. Any team can rebound very quickly and be competing. This isn't a Giants can do it this year. I actually think that the Cowboys are probably one if not the most talented team in the league.
-
What a classic game. Watching it still makes the hairs stand up on one's neck, like the Giants could still lose it.
Some thoughts:
-That was a mean game up front. SF came to play, and the Giants knew what they were getting into. Eli took every snap anticipating a nasty rush, and the guys in the trenches on both sides are getting completely boxed and banged around. Just flinging themselves at full speed into the lines. Speed, and power and fatigue and disgust from the weather that day... You don't see many games like that anymore.
-3rd down conversions. The Giants were only 7-21, but SF was 1-13. At least 6, maybe all 7 of those third downs were converted passing the ball. Deadly. Including 3rd and 15 for the 4th quarter TD to Manningham.
-Where the hell did Victor Cruz come from in 2011? He didn't just make play after play after play in season, but look at the respect that he gets from SF defense... after only 16 or so professional starts. Incredible. 10-142 in the game.
Eli highlights at SF 2011 ship - ( New Window )
Brees overall passer rating is 11 points higher at home and in one less game, he has 12 more losses on the road. GB and Rodgers has a similar dynamic on the road, but the away record is far worse.
Rodgers is actually under .500 on the road. In one more game, he has 28 additional losses.
That's why the 2011 Championship Game will always live as one of the greatest Giants games to watch.
+1
I said prior to last weeks games that I just didnt buy in to either Seattle or Green Bay, so obviously I pretty much expected yesterdays result. I really believe that Minnesota would have beaten either of those teams if they had played them.
BBI ritual this time of year. See last year's thread about Rivers after a playoff loss where the other team dropped 35 in the first half.
Quote:
away from that game is that Rodgers didn't want any part of taking a beating from SF's D.
That's why the 2011 Championship Game will always live as one of the greatest Giants games to watch.
+1
Look, it's not an Eli vs. Rodgers comparison. But Eli led the Giants on two SB runs facing literally the hardest schedule (record wise) to get there. He won 5 road games - not including the neutral site SBs - to do so. He was the SB MVP in both SBs. And he did it with Kevin Gilbride as his OC in both.
Eli is 2-0 in NFC Title Games and hasn't thrown a pick in either. Rodgers is 1-3 in 4 appearances and has more INTs to TDs. He fumbled the snap yesterday and made no effort to even recover the ball. That's not on the D, that is on him.
Eli was at his biggest in the biggest of games. Other than really the Carolina loss in his second season - in which he was terrible - Eli was routinely good to great in PO games. It is not his fault that they lost in GB in 2016 - despite the final score - where his WRs went to Mexico and then couldn't catch a thing in that game.
I'm not saying GB wasn't outmanned in that game. They were. But even Tennessee kept it close for a while against KC before dooming themselves to a loss by playing ultra conservatively.
Look at the list of QBs Eli has beaten on his way to SB titles: Rodgers; Favre; Brady (2). In all those games, the Giants were underdogs (if not massive ones). It takes a team effort to win, but tell me when Rodgers has been at his best. He was fantastic in 2010, but otherwise has not been that great in the postseason.
In the first game Rodgers didn't have either of his starting OT. So I don't think he expected this to happen again.
in replay you can see Rodgers stood there and just watched the ball
did not even make an effort to recover it ..
he definitely made an executive decision not to be part of a scrum with San Fran DL.
I mean it is the CHAMPIONSHIP GAME.. you have to make some sort of effort .
And the defense has been vastly overrated all year. Sure, they were better than last year, but still not good. Pettine relies too heavily on man, and gets burned.
I don't think any QB under those circumstances has a chance to win that game.
Rodgers didn't do that yesterday. Yea he hung up some points, and maybe you can use that as a way to defend him a little bit yesterday, but you cannot fall behind 3-4 scores in January and expect to win very often.
Eli held serve time and time again in these games and he did it against some amazingly good opposition. When Rodgers was behind 21-0 in a blink, Eli was tied with SF in that 2011 NFC title game. When Lamar Jackson got his face punched early on and often, Eli was leading the Giants down the field for back to back FG drives in that 2007 NFC title game. When Prescott was down big early on to the Packers in the 2016 divisional playoff game, Eli was jumping out early on those same packers in the 2011 divisional playoff game in GB. Fall behind big early, you're dead 9-10 times. PRescott got Dallas close, but not enough in the end.
For once I agree with you. It's strange.
Quote:
away from that game is that Rodgers didn't want any part of taking a beating from SF's D.
That's why the 2011 Championship Game will always live as one of the greatest Giants games to watch.
But the only reason we look at Eli like that is because our D and ST played the role as well. Eli kept us in that game. It took all three phases. Comparing that game to the one last night is disingenuous. Rodgers and that O really had no shot because the game was decided on the other side of the ball. GB's defense vs. SF's offense decided that game.
The other side of the coin, if GB's offense was able to sustain a drive or 2 in the first half, maybe their defense wouldnt have looked so bad, and the game wouldnt have practically been over by half time.
It goes both ways...
Weapon X Eli is the freak who chumps off playing in arctic GB and hellish SF quagmire.
The guy is still an elite QB and passer. He's got plenty left.
Strange seeing Eli fans comment on another QBs demeanor, facial expressions, etc. Just like with Eli, that shit means nothing. If they stopped the run a little there is no issue with his demeanor.
Not really seeing how Rodgers was the culprit last night.
Adams was a number two and there was a #5. All others were from practice squads, undrafted college players, or unsigned FA's.
Toss in there suspect defense it's amazing they made it to the championship game.
Quote:
In comment 14786655 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
away from that game is that Rodgers didn't want any part of taking a beating from SF's D.
That's why the 2011 Championship Game will always live as one of the greatest Giants games to watch.
+1
Look, it's not an Eli vs. Rodgers comparison. But Eli led the Giants on two SB runs facing literally the hardest schedule (record wise) to get there. He won 5 road games - not including the neutral site SBs - to do so. He was the SB MVP in both SBs. And he did it with Kevin Gilbride as his OC in both.
Eli is 2-0 in NFC Title Games and hasn't thrown a pick in either. Rodgers is 1-3 in 4 appearances and has more INTs to TDs. He fumbled the snap yesterday and made no effort to even recover the ball. That's not on the D, that is on him.
Eli was at his biggest in the biggest of games. Other than really the Carolina loss in his second season - in which he was terrible - Eli was routinely good to great in PO games. It is not his fault that they lost in GB in 2016 - despite the final score - where his WRs went to Mexico and then couldn't catch a thing in that game.
I'm not saying GB wasn't outmanned in that game. They were. But even Tennessee kept it close for a while against KC before dooming themselves to a loss by playing ultra conservatively.
Look at the list of QBs Eli has beaten on his way to SB titles: Rodgers; Favre; Brady (2). In all those games, the Giants were underdogs (if not massive ones). It takes a team effort to win, but tell me when Rodgers has been at his best. He was fantastic in 2010, but otherwise has not been that great in the postseason.
I think Rogers is a great QB, but this is a good post that puts Eli in perspective
Quote:
can’t appreciate Eli without the unnecessary comparisons or bad takes on Rodgers particularly.
For once I agree with you. It's strange.
It is strange. You should probably be agreeing with me far more often...
What a classic game. Watching it still makes the hairs stand up on one's neck, like the Giants could still lose it.
Some thoughts:
-That was a mean game up front. SF came to play, and the Giants knew what they were getting into. Eli took every snap anticipating a nasty rush, and the guys in the trenches on both sides are getting completely boxed and banged around. Just flinging themselves at full speed into the lines. Speed, and power and fatigue and disgust from the weather that day... You don't see many games like that anymore.
-3rd down conversions. The Giants were only 7-21, but SF was 1-13. At least 6, maybe all 7 of those third downs were converted passing the ball. Deadly. Including 3rd and 15 for the 4th quarter TD to Manningham.
-Where the hell did Victor Cruz come from in 2011? He didn't just make play after play after play in season, but look at the respect that he gets from SF defense... after only 16 or so professional starts. Incredible. 10-142 in the game. Eli highlights at SF 2011 ship - ( New Window )
Eli took such a beating in that game and just kept getting back up. INcredible grit he showed that day. It wasn't the game winner but the play I remember most was his scramble on 3rd down alte in the 4th quarter to get away from the rush and flinging it downfield to Bradshaw at midfield for a 29 yard gain and extend that drive.
I would too, but (and I'm not suggesting you're saying this) that doesn't make Eli a better QB than them. Lots of luck and teammates' contributions go into winning SBs.