What the 49ers are or aren't (and all of the yammering about them always somehow elides the fact that Garappolo missed most of 2018) is completely immaterial to the fact that the Giants are a flaming bag of dogshit. And Jerry Reese hasn't been employed by the team in two years. Here's a quarter, go buy a new excuse. That one has passed the sell-by date.
What the 49ers are or aren't (and all of the yammering about them always somehow elides the fact that Garappolo missed most of 2018) is completely immaterial to the fact that the Giants are a flaming bag of dogshit. And Jerry Reese hasn't been employed by the team in two years. Here's a quarter, go buy a new excuse. That one has passed the sell-by date.
Wait..so circumstances only apply to teams that aren't the Giants? Evaluating other teams success or failures is not just about W-L record, only for DG and the Giants?
and the reason we are in the situation we are in today is because of nearly 10 years of poor drafting.
Say what you want about Gettleman but he has been doing a good job with the draft.
70 starts from the rookie class, and while there were some bumps there was more good than bad. If the new coaching staff can do what Judge has talked about and teach/develop these guys its a nice foundation.
still applies, although I'm glad to hear that you build through the draft counts when we're not talking about handing over 3rd and 4th round picks to sign FAs or trading up to draft Baker.
Seems like he's applying some of that hopeful logic to guys like Love and Baker. You have to do the same with Jones as well, because if he can't fix his turnover problem the Giants don't have a solution at QB.
Gettlement missed a big opportunity to improve the OL in 2019 Draft Â
You know, then think he said he'd improve the day he was hired? Here are all the guys he could have taken either instead of Baker at #30 or at #37 and kept the 4th and 5th round picks.
Kaleb McGary OT #31
Jawan Taylor OT #35 (NFL, PFF All-Rookie)
Greg Little OT#37
Cody Ford OT#38
Dalton Risner OT#41 (NFL, PFF All-Rookie)
Elgton Jenkins C#44 (NFL PFF All-Rookie)
Erik McCoy C#48 (NFL, PFF All-Rookie)
It wasn't a mystery that we sucked at OT and C in 2018. Anyone one of they guys would have been a better pick than Baker, especially considering Gettlemen's plan to continue to draft CBs in 2019 (and Beal, who cost a high 3rd rounder in the 2019 draft).
RE: RE: I don't think his drafting is particularly impressive at all, no Â
What the 49ers are or aren't (and all of the yammering about them always somehow elides the fact that Garappolo missed most of 2018) is completely immaterial to the fact that the Giants are a flaming bag of dogshit. And Jerry Reese hasn't been employed by the team in two years. Here's a quarter, go buy a new excuse. That one has passed the sell-by date.
Wait..so circumstances only apply to teams that aren't the Giants? Evaluating other teams success or failures is not just about W-L record, only for DG and the Giants?
Just trying to figure out your stance on things.
You want him to make sense? Good luck
RE: Gettlement missed a big opportunity to improve the OL in 2019 Draft Â
You know, then think he said he'd improve the day he was hired? Here are all the guys he could have taken either instead of Baker at #30 or at #37 and kept the 4th and 5th round picks.
Kaleb McGary OT #31
Jawan Taylor OT #35 (NFL, PFF All-Rookie)
Greg Little OT#37
Cody Ford OT#38
Dalton Risner OT#41 (NFL, PFF All-Rookie)
Elgton Jenkins C#44 (NFL PFF All-Rookie)
Erik McCoy C#48 (NFL, PFF All-Rookie)
It wasn't a mystery that we sucked at OT and C in 2018. Anyone one of they guys would have been a better pick than Baker, especially considering Gettlemen's plan to continue to draft CBs in 2019 (and Beal, who cost a high 3rd rounder in the 2019 draft).
Maybe you don’t remember that our starting tackles were Ereck Flowers and Bobby Hart when he got here, Pugh, and Jerry Jones at guard.
Btw, McGary looked terrible for Atlanta and he’s being moved to Guard, Taylor was ok, little and Ford were not plus starters in their first year. Jenkins and McCoy are studs. But who would’ve played CB for us? Beal?? Ballentine?? Would I take McCoy or Jenkins over Baker? Yes. The rest of them, I personally wouldn’t but what do I know
Did the 49ers struggle for two years before putting together a Superbowl roster or not?
Did Jerry Reese have ten years of awful drafts or not?
Best I can give him is an incomplete. I don't care how anyone grades his drafts. Until it translates to wins it is a fairy tale. I am to the point that NOTHING but results on the field matter to me. Improve this year and I might start to think the drafts were good. Win.
“If I had the 2nd and 6th overall drafts slots in successive years, I’d do well also...”
I don't think that's the whole story when people attempt to infuse a bit of realism into the conversation. Gettleman is doing better than Reese. TBD whether he's doing better than league average.
Lauletta - wasted pick
McIntosh - wasted pick (to date)
Asafo-Adjei - TBD, hasn't played yet
Baker - showed some promise, but question marks remain (especially the whispers about work ethic and learning the playbook)
Hernandez, Carter, Hill - various levels of 2nd year drop-off, with Hill's being severe enough to trigger the trade for Williams
Even without getting into the positional value element of the Barkley pick or whether it makes any sense at all to take a RB at the beginning of a rebuild instead of closer to the upswing coming out of the rebuild, Gettleman's drafts have had some real misses mixed in with the success.
I'll give you this though, drafting is the best part of what Gettleman has done so far with the Giants, though that's faint praise.
and the reason we are in the situation we are in today is because of nearly 10 years of poor drafting.
Say what you want about Gettleman but he has been doing a good job with the draft.
Absolutely and replacing 50+ players including 11 starters is easy to do with uhh 3 or 4 players a year.. Some Giant fans are clueless. The man is building a beast -if you cant see it your blind. Just give it time.
How can you blame DG for the record his first season here? He just joined in the offseason. Things don't change that fast.
Because by his own fucking admission he screwed up his evaluation of the roster going into 2018. If he's openly taking the blame, why are so many fans in a rush to defend him for that season?
and the reason we are in the situation we are in today is because of nearly 10 years of poor drafting.
Say what you want about Gettleman but he has been doing a good job with the draft.
Absolutely and replacing 50+ players including 11 starters is easy to do with uhh 3 or 4 players a year.. Some Giant fans are clueless. The man is building a beast -if you cant see it your blind. Just give it time.
Why is DG's burner account still allowed to post here? Building a beast? Buy a fucking clue.
That was a great draft. Jones, Lawrence, Love, Connelly and Slayton Â
“If I had the 2nd and 6th overall drafts slots in successive years, I’d do well also...”
I don't think that's the whole story when people attempt to infuse a bit of realism into the conversation. Gettleman is doing better than Reese. TBD whether he's doing better than league average.
Lauletta - wasted pick
McIntosh - wasted pick (to date)
Asafo-Adjei - TBD, hasn't played yet
Baker - showed some promise, but question marks remain (especially the whispers about work ethic and learning the playbook)
Hernandez, Carter, Hill - various levels of 2nd year drop-off, with Hill's being severe enough to trigger the trade for Williams
Even without getting into the positional value element of the Barkley pick or whether it makes any sense at all to take a RB at the beginning of a rebuild instead of closer to the upswing coming out of the rebuild, Gettleman's drafts have had some real misses mixed in with the success.
I'll give you this though, drafting is the best part of what Gettleman has done so far with the Giants, though that's faint praise.
and the reason we are in the situation we are in today is because of nearly 10 years of poor drafting.
Say what you want about Gettleman but he has been doing a good job with the draft.
Absolutely and replacing 50+ players including 11 starters is easy to do with uhh 3 or 4 players a year.. Some Giant fans are clueless. The man is building a beast -if you cant see it your blind. Just give it time.
Forgive us. The last 3 years are 12-36 worst in the NFL. DG is 9-23. I don't see the beast and I am not blind. He was worse in year 2 over year 1.
I feel like they are serving us shit for dinner and some of you are waiting in line with bibs smiling like the Mad Hatter. There is no reason for them to change the menu if you love shit so much. I don't want shit. I want wins that matter.
DG had a good draft, so fucking what? we were 4-12 last year, yay good draft! Get the fuck out of here.
Absolutely and replacing 50+ players including 11 starters is easy to do with uhh 3 or 4 players a year.. Some Giant fans are clueless. The man is building a beast -if you cant see it your blind. Just give it time.
He's had some good picks within the draft, but it remains to be seen if he's on the path towards building a good team with it. You can say that about a lot of other bad teams too.
and later is nonsense. most 3rd rounders and later are not even starters.
Starters are found throughout the draft, but fine. That said, I think you're assigning the drop-off probably about a round too early. 3rd rounders should be looked at as potential starters. If you want to say that 4th and beyond are lottery tickets and developmental prospects that may predominantly serve as depth, I'll buy that. But not 3rd round - you're talking about top 100 prospects at that point, and where DG has been drafting in the 3rd round, it's more like top 70.
RE: I choose to be in the glass half full (OK, 25% full) camp but Â
I don't fault Greg and others for their views, which on the present state of facts are not unreasonable.
I don't fault them for their views. You are what your record says you are.
However, I do think some of their justifications for their views are a little near sighted and possibly unfair.
We are at rock bottom. We are trying to climb out of a gigantic hole that's been dug over nearly the course of a decade. I see more positive in the youth of this team than I have in a LONG time. It allows me to be optimistic.
I think one of the biggest things people get wrapped up in is separating the old from the new. We are only two years post Jerry Reese and four post Tom Coughlin. We have clearly not found the right coach.
However, one of the biggest things that needed to be addressed has been addressed. The transition from Eli Manning at QB.
Eli/Coughlin/Reese are the old era. We are barely removed from them yet. Those demanding immediate results are being unfair.
And yes, I know I predicted 10-6 this past year. I do it every year. I'm hopeful. It gives me reason to watch.
So let's get "10-6" and "Eli Manning Revenge Tour" out of the way.
The lengths you people will go to defend the indefensible
Greg from LI : 10:00 am : link : reply
Does throwing up 9-23 after every reference to Gettleman really add anything?
The lengths people will go to crap on anything remotely positive about the team is a much more pervasive issue.
What does a draft rating get anyone? In the scheme of things what does it matter if someone THINKS DG had a good draft.
9-23 is ONLY thing that matters. Advanced metrics, analytics, draft grades are all just worthless bullshit. A distraction. FMiC I desperately want to throw my support and enthusiasm behind DG. I CANNOT do it until the arrow is definitively pointing up. Sick of losing.
I am a BIG fan of Daniel Jones, I THINK it will turn out to be a great pick but I don't know for sure yet. 9-23 should be everyone's mantra until it turns around. I am tired of watching a terrible product on the field. 9-23 is not good enough for me.
Right now, we are 0-0. Regurgitating 9-23 as if it indicates we'll be 18-46 two years from now is ridiculous. It was pointed out above that the Niners were 10-22. Did they have reason to be optimistic this year? Of course.
9-23 is a fantastic response to valid criticisms. It isn't commentary of the drafts. It isn't commentary that needs to be said when somebody gives any praise. It's just a pithy comment and a throwaway line that really doens't mean jackshit today.
and later is nonsense. most 3rd rounders and later are not even starters.
Starters are found throughout the draft, but fine. That said, I think you're assigning the drop-off probably about a round too early. 3rd rounders should be looked at as potential starters. If you want to say that 4th and beyond are lottery tickets and developmental prospects that may predominantly serve as depth, I'll buy that. But not 3rd round - you're talking about top 100 prospects at that point, and where DG has been drafting in the 3rd round, it's more like top 70.
here is some analysis from 2015 about draft rounds and starters. More than 50% of the 3rd rounders are not "starters". I would like to see other data, not easy to find
and later is nonsense. most 3rd rounders and later are not even starters.
Starters are found throughout the draft, but fine. That said, I think you're assigning the drop-off probably about a round too early. 3rd rounders should be looked at as potential starters. If you want to say that 4th and beyond are lottery tickets and developmental prospects that may predominantly serve as depth, I'll buy that. But not 3rd round - you're talking about top 100 prospects at that point, and where DG has been drafting in the 3rd round, it's more like top 70.
here is some analysis from 2015 about draft rounds and starters. More than 50% of the 3rd rounders are not "starters". I would like to see other data, not easy to find
The problem with the way that data is presented is that it treats the entire third round as a single value. The third round begins with pick #65 and, depending on compensatory picks, can include 40 selections (or more). To look at the overall success rate for the round without applying any sort of specific expectations based on where in the round the pick falls seems faulty to me.
Gettleman has selected #2 (#66 overall) in 2018, and would have picked #4 (#68 overall) last year but used that pick on Sam Beal. This year, he would have been picking at #4 again (#68 overall) but that pick was traded for Leonard Williams.
Do you feel that all 3rd round picks have the same likelihood of success, or would you agree that players chosen closer to the top of the round should be looked at with an expectation that more closely resembles a 2nd round prospect, whereas those selected nearer to the end of the round should be assigned a success expectation that is more similar to a 4th round pick?
and later is nonsense. most 3rd rounders and later are not even starters.
Starters are found throughout the draft, but fine. That said, I think you're assigning the drop-off probably about a round too early. 3rd rounders should be looked at as potential starters. If you want to say that 4th and beyond are lottery tickets and developmental prospects that may predominantly serve as depth, I'll buy that. But not 3rd round - you're talking about top 100 prospects at that point, and where DG has been drafting in the 3rd round, it's more like top 70.
here is some analysis from 2015 about draft rounds and starters. More than 50% of the 3rd rounders are not "starters". I would like to see other data, not easy to find
The problem with the way that data is presented is that it treats the entire third round as a single value. The third round begins with pick #65 and, depending on compensatory picks, can include 40 selections (or more). To look at the overall success rate for the round without applying any sort of specific expectations based on where in the round the pick falls seems faulty to me.
Gettleman has selected #2 (#66 overall) in 2018, and would have picked #4 (#68 overall) last year but used that pick on Sam Beal. This year, he would have been picking at #4 again (#68 overall) but that pick was traded for Leonard Williams.
Do you feel that all 3rd round picks have the same likelihood of success, or would you agree that players chosen closer to the top of the round should be looked at with an expectation that more closely resembles a 2nd round prospect, whereas those selected nearer to the end of the round should be assigned a success expectation that is more similar to a 4th round pick?
Even if you look at 2nd round, only OL and LB have better than 50% chance of starting. I would love to see more data, I haven't been able to find it. But calling 4th rounders or later wasted picks is just not genuine. Very few teams hit on those picks.
Right now, we are 0-0. Regurgitating 9-23 as if it indicates we'll be 18-46 two years from now is ridiculous. It was pointed out above that the Niners were 10-22. Did they have reason to be optimistic this year? Of course.
9-23 is a fantastic response to valid criticisms. It isn't commentary of the drafts. It isn't commentary that needs to be said when somebody gives any praise. It's just a pithy comment and a throwaway line that really doens't mean jackshit today.
9-23 is DG's record.
It is the only meaningful way a GM is measured.
As a fan, i could not give a shit less how well someone grades a fucking draft. Have a nice pat on the back, good job boy.
I care if they win regular season games.
I care if they reach the postseason.
I care if they win postseason.
Everything else is fucking bullshit.
Until they actually start winning games they credit for nothing.
Because the Niners went 10-22 and reached the Super Bowl I should believe we are? What evidence do you have that supports the correlation? Nevermind.
Say what you want about Gettleman but he has been doing a good job with the draft.
Say what you want about Gettleman but he has been doing a good job with the draft.
Agreed
No you wouldn't, you doddering, old, tater tot stuffing fool!
I suppose you think the 49ers front office sucks too then.
Quote:
have a nice day
I suppose you think the 49ers front office sucks too then.
10-22
Did Jerry Reese have ten years of awful drafts or not?
Wait..so circumstances only apply to teams that aren't the Giants? Evaluating other teams success or failures is not just about W-L record, only for DG and the Giants?
Just trying to figure out your stance on things.
How can you blame DG for the record his first season here? He just joined in the offseason. Things don't change that fast.
Say what you want about Gettleman but he has been doing a good job with the draft.
70 starts from the rookie class, and while there were some bumps there was more good than bad. If the new coaching staff can do what Judge has talked about and teach/develop these guys its a nice foundation.
You've got a point there - the second season was such a drastic improvement.
Seems like he's applying some of that hopeful logic to guys like Love and Baker. You have to do the same with Jones as well, because if he can't fix his turnover problem the Giants don't have a solution at QB.
Kaleb McGary OT #31
Jawan Taylor OT #35 (NFL, PFF All-Rookie)
Greg Little OT#37
Cody Ford OT#38
Dalton Risner OT#41 (NFL, PFF All-Rookie)
Elgton Jenkins C#44 (NFL PFF All-Rookie)
Erik McCoy C#48 (NFL, PFF All-Rookie)
It wasn't a mystery that we sucked at OT and C in 2018. Anyone one of they guys would have been a better pick than Baker, especially considering Gettlemen's plan to continue to draft CBs in 2019 (and Beal, who cost a high 3rd rounder in the 2019 draft).
Quote:
What the 49ers are or aren't (and all of the yammering about them always somehow elides the fact that Garappolo missed most of 2018) is completely immaterial to the fact that the Giants are a flaming bag of dogshit. And Jerry Reese hasn't been employed by the team in two years. Here's a quarter, go buy a new excuse. That one has passed the sell-by date.
Wait..so circumstances only apply to teams that aren't the Giants? Evaluating other teams success or failures is not just about W-L record, only for DG and the Giants?
Just trying to figure out your stance on things.
You want him to make sense? Good luck
Kaleb McGary OT #31
Jawan Taylor OT #35 (NFL, PFF All-Rookie)
Greg Little OT#37
Cody Ford OT#38
Dalton Risner OT#41 (NFL, PFF All-Rookie)
Elgton Jenkins C#44 (NFL PFF All-Rookie)
Erik McCoy C#48 (NFL, PFF All-Rookie)
It wasn't a mystery that we sucked at OT and C in 2018. Anyone one of they guys would have been a better pick than Baker, especially considering Gettlemen's plan to continue to draft CBs in 2019 (and Beal, who cost a high 3rd rounder in the 2019 draft).
Maybe you don’t remember that our starting tackles were Ereck Flowers and Bobby Hart when he got here, Pugh, and Jerry Jones at guard.
Btw, McGary looked terrible for Atlanta and he’s being moved to Guard, Taylor was ok, little and Ford were not plus starters in their first year. Jenkins and McCoy are studs. But who would’ve played CB for us? Beal?? Ballentine?? Would I take McCoy or Jenkins over Baker? Yes. The rest of them, I personally wouldn’t but what do I know
Did Jerry Reese have ten years of awful drafts or not?
Losing their starting QB might have had something to do with that.
I don't think that's the whole story when people attempt to infuse a bit of realism into the conversation. Gettleman is doing better than Reese. TBD whether he's doing better than league average.
Lauletta - wasted pick
McIntosh - wasted pick (to date)
Asafo-Adjei - TBD, hasn't played yet
Baker - showed some promise, but question marks remain (especially the whispers about work ethic and learning the playbook)
Hernandez, Carter, Hill - various levels of 2nd year drop-off, with Hill's being severe enough to trigger the trade for Williams
Even without getting into the positional value element of the Barkley pick or whether it makes any sense at all to take a RB at the beginning of a rebuild instead of closer to the upswing coming out of the rebuild, Gettleman's drafts have had some real misses mixed in with the success.
I'll give you this though, drafting is the best part of what Gettleman has done so far with the Giants, though that's faint praise.
Say what you want about Gettleman but he has been doing a good job with the draft.
Absolutely and replacing 50+ players including 11 starters is easy to do with uhh 3 or 4 players a year.. Some Giant fans are clueless. The man is building a beast -if you cant see it your blind. Just give it time.
Quote:
have a nice day
How can you blame DG for the record his first season here? He just joined in the offseason. Things don't change that fast.
Because by his own fucking admission he screwed up his evaluation of the roster going into 2018. If he's openly taking the blame, why are so many fans in a rush to defend him for that season?
Quote:
and the reason we are in the situation we are in today is because of nearly 10 years of poor drafting.
Say what you want about Gettleman but he has been doing a good job with the draft.
Absolutely and replacing 50+ players including 11 starters is easy to do with uhh 3 or 4 players a year.. Some Giant fans are clueless. The man is building a beast -if you cant see it your blind. Just give it time.
Why is DG's burner account still allowed to post here? Building a beast? Buy a fucking clue.
Quote:
“If I had the 2nd and 6th overall drafts slots in successive years, I’d do well also...”
I don't think that's the whole story when people attempt to infuse a bit of realism into the conversation. Gettleman is doing better than Reese. TBD whether he's doing better than league average.
Lauletta - wasted pick
McIntosh - wasted pick (to date)
Asafo-Adjei - TBD, hasn't played yet
Baker - showed some promise, but question marks remain (especially the whispers about work ethic and learning the playbook)
Hernandez, Carter, Hill - various levels of 2nd year drop-off, with Hill's being severe enough to trigger the trade for Williams
Even without getting into the positional value element of the Barkley pick or whether it makes any sense at all to take a RB at the beginning of a rebuild instead of closer to the upswing coming out of the rebuild, Gettleman's drafts have had some real misses mixed in with the success.
I'll give you this though, drafting is the best part of what Gettleman has done so far with the Giants, though that's faint praise.
Doesn’t it seem like Lauletta was ages ago?
^ THAT IS ALL!
Quote:
and the reason we are in the situation we are in today is because of nearly 10 years of poor drafting.
Say what you want about Gettleman but he has been doing a good job with the draft.
Absolutely and replacing 50+ players including 11 starters is easy to do with uhh 3 or 4 players a year.. Some Giant fans are clueless. The man is building a beast -if you cant see it your blind. Just give it time.
I feel like they are serving us shit for dinner and some of you are waiting in line with bibs smiling like the Mad Hatter. There is no reason for them to change the menu if you love shit so much. I don't want shit. I want wins that matter.
DG had a good draft, so fucking what? we were 4-12 last year, yay good draft! Get the fuck out of here.
Absolutely and replacing 50+ players including 11 starters is easy to do with uhh 3 or 4 players a year.. Some Giant fans are clueless. The man is building a beast -if you cant see it your blind. Just give it time.
This is funny!
LOL
Greg from LI : 10:00 am : link : reply
Does throwing up 9-23 after every reference to Gettleman really add anything?
The lengths people will go to crap on anything remotely positive about the team is a much more pervasive issue.
With Jerry Reese's Fingerprints
Quote:
The lengths you people will go to defend the indefensible
Greg from LI : 10:00 am : link : reply
Does throwing up 9-23 after every reference to Gettleman really add anything?
The lengths people will go to crap on anything remotely positive about the team is a much more pervasive issue.
As others have pointed out, just look at the source.
It's the best "Greg from the comments section" can do.
Starters are found throughout the draft, but fine. That said, I think you're assigning the drop-off probably about a round too early. 3rd rounders should be looked at as potential starters. If you want to say that 4th and beyond are lottery tickets and developmental prospects that may predominantly serve as depth, I'll buy that. But not 3rd round - you're talking about top 100 prospects at that point, and where DG has been drafting in the 3rd round, it's more like top 70.
I don't fault them for their views. You are what your record says you are.
However, I do think some of their justifications for their views are a little near sighted and possibly unfair.
We are at rock bottom. We are trying to climb out of a gigantic hole that's been dug over nearly the course of a decade. I see more positive in the youth of this team than I have in a LONG time. It allows me to be optimistic.
I think one of the biggest things people get wrapped up in is separating the old from the new. We are only two years post Jerry Reese and four post Tom Coughlin. We have clearly not found the right coach.
However, one of the biggest things that needed to be addressed has been addressed. The transition from Eli Manning at QB.
Eli/Coughlin/Reese are the old era. We are barely removed from them yet. Those demanding immediate results are being unfair.
And yes, I know I predicted 10-6 this past year. I do it every year. I'm hopeful. It gives me reason to watch.
So let's get "10-6" and "Eli Manning Revenge Tour" out of the way.
Quote:
The lengths you people will go to defend the indefensible
Greg from LI : 10:00 am : link : reply
Does throwing up 9-23 after every reference to Gettleman really add anything?
The lengths people will go to crap on anything remotely positive about the team is a much more pervasive issue.
9-23 is ONLY thing that matters. Advanced metrics, analytics, draft grades are all just worthless bullshit. A distraction. FMiC I desperately want to throw my support and enthusiasm behind DG. I CANNOT do it until the arrow is definitively pointing up. Sick of losing.
I am a BIG fan of Daniel Jones, I THINK it will turn out to be a great pick but I don't know for sure yet. 9-23 should be everyone's mantra until it turns around. I am tired of watching a terrible product on the field. 9-23 is not good enough for me.
Why not call it 12-36?
Right now, we are 0-0. Regurgitating 9-23 as if it indicates we'll be 18-46 two years from now is ridiculous. It was pointed out above that the Niners were 10-22. Did they have reason to be optimistic this year? Of course.
9-23 is a fantastic response to valid criticisms. It isn't commentary of the drafts. It isn't commentary that needs to be said when somebody gives any praise. It's just a pithy comment and a throwaway line that really doens't mean jackshit today.
Opinions about the past: Opinions
Re-living the past: Boring. And Pointless
Speculation about the future: Much wider range of reasonable speculation than unjustified certainty wants to admit or is emotionally able to handle.
imo
Quote:
and later is nonsense. most 3rd rounders and later are not even starters.
Starters are found throughout the draft, but fine. That said, I think you're assigning the drop-off probably about a round too early. 3rd rounders should be looked at as potential starters. If you want to say that 4th and beyond are lottery tickets and developmental prospects that may predominantly serve as depth, I'll buy that. But not 3rd round - you're talking about top 100 prospects at that point, and where DG has been drafting in the 3rd round, it's more like top 70.
here is some analysis from 2015 about draft rounds and starters. More than 50% of the 3rd rounders are not "starters". I would like to see other data, not easy to find
https://www.arrowheadpride.com/2015/2/20/8072877/what-the-statistics-tell-us-about-the-draft-by-round
Quote:
In comment 14808902 uther99 said:
Quote:
and later is nonsense. most 3rd rounders and later are not even starters.
Starters are found throughout the draft, but fine. That said, I think you're assigning the drop-off probably about a round too early. 3rd rounders should be looked at as potential starters. If you want to say that 4th and beyond are lottery tickets and developmental prospects that may predominantly serve as depth, I'll buy that. But not 3rd round - you're talking about top 100 prospects at that point, and where DG has been drafting in the 3rd round, it's more like top 70.
here is some analysis from 2015 about draft rounds and starters. More than 50% of the 3rd rounders are not "starters". I would like to see other data, not easy to find
https://www.arrowheadpride.com/2015/2/20/8072877/what-the-statistics-tell-us-about-the-draft-by-round
The problem with the way that data is presented is that it treats the entire third round as a single value. The third round begins with pick #65 and, depending on compensatory picks, can include 40 selections (or more). To look at the overall success rate for the round without applying any sort of specific expectations based on where in the round the pick falls seems faulty to me.
Gettleman has selected #2 (#66 overall) in 2018, and would have picked #4 (#68 overall) last year but used that pick on Sam Beal. This year, he would have been picking at #4 again (#68 overall) but that pick was traded for Leonard Williams.
Do you feel that all 3rd round picks have the same likelihood of success, or would you agree that players chosen closer to the top of the round should be looked at with an expectation that more closely resembles a 2nd round prospect, whereas those selected nearer to the end of the round should be assigned a success expectation that is more similar to a 4th round pick?
Quote:
In comment 14808943 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 14808902 uther99 said:
Quote:
and later is nonsense. most 3rd rounders and later are not even starters.
Starters are found throughout the draft, but fine. That said, I think you're assigning the drop-off probably about a round too early. 3rd rounders should be looked at as potential starters. If you want to say that 4th and beyond are lottery tickets and developmental prospects that may predominantly serve as depth, I'll buy that. But not 3rd round - you're talking about top 100 prospects at that point, and where DG has been drafting in the 3rd round, it's more like top 70.
here is some analysis from 2015 about draft rounds and starters. More than 50% of the 3rd rounders are not "starters". I would like to see other data, not easy to find
https://www.arrowheadpride.com/2015/2/20/8072877/what-the-statistics-tell-us-about-the-draft-by-round
The problem with the way that data is presented is that it treats the entire third round as a single value. The third round begins with pick #65 and, depending on compensatory picks, can include 40 selections (or more). To look at the overall success rate for the round without applying any sort of specific expectations based on where in the round the pick falls seems faulty to me.
Gettleman has selected #2 (#66 overall) in 2018, and would have picked #4 (#68 overall) last year but used that pick on Sam Beal. This year, he would have been picking at #4 again (#68 overall) but that pick was traded for Leonard Williams.
Do you feel that all 3rd round picks have the same likelihood of success, or would you agree that players chosen closer to the top of the round should be looked at with an expectation that more closely resembles a 2nd round prospect, whereas those selected nearer to the end of the round should be assigned a success expectation that is more similar to a 4th round pick?
Even if you look at 2nd round, only OL and LB have better than 50% chance of starting. I would love to see more data, I haven't been able to find it. But calling 4th rounders or later wasted picks is just not genuine. Very few teams hit on those picks.
Combine participants - ( New Window )
Why not call it 12-36?
Right now, we are 0-0. Regurgitating 9-23 as if it indicates we'll be 18-46 two years from now is ridiculous. It was pointed out above that the Niners were 10-22. Did they have reason to be optimistic this year? Of course.
9-23 is a fantastic response to valid criticisms. It isn't commentary of the drafts. It isn't commentary that needs to be said when somebody gives any praise. It's just a pithy comment and a throwaway line that really doens't mean jackshit today.
9-23 is DG's record.
It is the only meaningful way a GM is measured.
As a fan, i could not give a shit less how well someone grades a fucking draft. Have a nice pat on the back, good job boy.
I care if they win regular season games.
I care if they reach the postseason.
I care if they win postseason.
Everything else is fucking bullshit.
Until they actually start winning games they credit for nothing.
Because the Niners went 10-22 and reached the Super Bowl I should believe we are? What evidence do you have that supports the correlation? Nevermind.
There ya go, you set the bar.
Win in 2020 or GTFO.