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Isaiah Simmons, 6-4, 230 pounds, Clemson, junior When discussing Clemsons do-it-all defender, it is important to first understand how he was deployed by the Tigers this season. Check these numbers out: * Of his 822 snaps this season, Simmons lined up in the box as a traditional linebacker 299 times (36 percent), according to Pro Football Focus. * He served as Clemsons deep free safety 132 times (16 percent), and as a defensive end or edge rusher on 116 snaps (14 percent). * Most impressively, Simmons lined up in the slot as a souped-up nickel corner 262 times (32 percent), proving more than capable of defending the nations best tight ends and slot receivers in space. As the numbers show, Simmons can play anywhere. Which is why defining him as a linebacker or safety is pointless. Pro Football Focus gave Simmons a 92 coverage grade this season, meaning he locked up the nations best tight ends and slot receivers. He scored 85 overall or higher in pass rushing, run defense and tackling. Simply, he doesnt have a weakness. There isnt much to dislike. As a safety, he is the best in his class. The same can be said as a linebacker. At his size, he projects as an every-down player who can do it all. Usually, Simmons spent his Saturday afternoons overpowering blockers and proving too fast and too big for ball carriers to juke him. Simmons is as much a cant miss prospect as there is in this class. |
Look, I get that Simmons may not be Lawrence Taylor. All I know is the kid is an utter freak of an athlete and seems to love the game, and is always around the ball. With good coaching, it seems this is the type of player where the the potential is just through the roof. Id rather take a chance on this guy becoming an all pro than taking a right tackle at 4.
Backend run and chase safety hybrid? Don't agree that is what he is, but I see what you are saying.
A Jaylon Smith or Leighton Vander Esch tybe LB would be phenomenal. Is there one you see in this draft?
Look, I get that Simmons may not be Lawrence Taylor. All I know is the kid is an utter freak of an athlete and seems to love the game, and is always around the ball. With good coaching, it seems this is the type of player where the the potential is just through the roof. Id rather take a chance on this guy becoming an all pro than taking a right tackle at 4.
Youre not taking a RT at 4. Youd be taking a guy who competes with Solder for LT, with the loser moving to RT. And, should that be the draft pick, hes your long term LT in 2021 when Solder is cut. That being said, Okudah has potential all pro cb written all over him. And, at 4, isnt that what youre looking for? A potential all pro player? Can we truly say that about Simmons? Or any of these OTs right now?
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Regarding the argument as to whether Simmons is worth the pick at 4, I think we are severely undervaluing a few factors when it comes to draft picks. Work ethic, the actual person himself, coaching, and fit. We always try to pigeon hole the player and say well hes this or well he cant play X and then we see 3rd round and 4th round picks become pro bowl players.
Look, I get that Simmons may not be Lawrence Taylor. All I know is the kid is an utter freak of an athlete and seems to love the game, and is always around the ball. With good coaching, it seems this is the type of player where the the potential is just through the roof. Id rather take a chance on this guy becoming an all pro than taking a right tackle at 4.
Youre not taking a RT at 4. Youd be taking a guy who competes with Solder for LT, with the loser moving to RT. And, should that be the draft pick, hes your long term LT in 2021 when Solder is cut. That being said, Okudah has potential all pro cb written all over him. And, at 4, isnt that what youre looking for? A potential all pro player? Can we truly say that about Simmons? Or any of these OTs right now?
Why not take a RT at #4 if he projects as all pro? Left side/right side does it really matter anymore? Teams often have two ERs or switch sides to give them a better chance to get to the QB. Yeah, the QB has a blindside, but with blitzes and stunts it isn't that big a difference like it once was.
He was recruited as a db by Clemson. His sophomore year he was told he would play closer to the line of scrimmage in a rover safety role and that was most likely the first time he was ever taught any kind of block shedding technique. If you want to let that impact your evaluation of him, I think youre missing the Forest for the trees.
Block shedding at a high level comes from footwork, explosion, and want to. Not including arm length and all the other minor factors. I dont know how much he wants it, but I know he has the other two. People who want a finished product at the college level arent going to like Simmons, that simple.
Game changers come in many shapes and sizes. They don't have to be traditional in the box players. An All Pro at any position is a huge asset to any defense. A chip you can build around.
Game changers come in many shapes and sizes. They don't have to be traditional in the box players. An All Pro at any position is a huge asset to any defense. A chip you can build around.
How do you feel about his hips? He doesnt necessarily travel low to the ground, but then I see the elite cod on the j.k. Dobbins tackle and I dont really care. But I see him try to cover a slot corner and if it wasnt for recovery speed and length, hed definitely be burned.
I dont expect nfl d coordinators to put him 1 on 1 on a slot receiver. Stiff hips havent hurt Jalen Ramsey much but I was interested if you saw the same on film
Game changers come in many shapes and sizes. They don't have to be traditional in the box players. An All Pro at any position is a huge asset to any defense. A chip you can build around.
This is what many of the scouts seem to be saying. No guarantees of course, but thats predominantly what Ive been reading.
There are also any number of really good linebackers that don't go running face first into blockers. Deion Jones and Ryan Shazier come to mind. They win with speed and instincts.
I also think Simmons potential as a pass rusher is not being 'overlooked' but may be undersold. He really only added this facet to his game last season and he had a natural flair for it. I've always thought to an extent the good pass rushers are born not made.
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a prospect who projects best to a backend run and chase LB safety hybrid is not a priority to my build plan. It's that simple for me.
Backend run and chase safety hybrid? Don't agree that is what he is, but I see what you are saying.
A Jaylon Smith or Leighton Vander Esch tybe LB would be phenomenal. Is there one you see in this draft?
Yes even better. His name is Kenneth Murray
There are also any number of really good linebackers that don't go running face first into blockers. Deion Jones and Ryan Shazier come to mind. They win with speed and instincts.
I also think Simmons potential as a pass rusher is not being 'overlooked' but may be undersold. He really only added this facet to his game last season and he had a natural flair for it. I've always thought to an extent the good pass rushers are born not made.
Cool, I see a lot of Ryan Shazier in my projection of him, others say its not realistic but thats what I see. He has that long femur length that makes it hard to get low but makes him so darn athletic and explosive, almost in the Lebron James mold. Cant wait to see what happens in April
I am in the group of fans that sees the NFL changing drastically right in front of me. Defense today is not the defense of 10 years ago. The reason our defense has sucked is because the Giants have not adjusted the personnel to fit today game and the game of the future.
In the box safeties are new linebackers. That is why you saw peppers playing that spot all the time last year and you say Landon Collins playing there before him.
If you take Peppers 5'11 215 or Collins 6'0" 218 and made them 6'4" 235 - that is a linebacker in today's NFL.
This conversation reminds me of the NHL 7 years ago. The Pittsburgh Penguins showed the league that Puck moving defencemen and speed was more effective moving forward than big body punishing guys that were slow. Now everyone is looking for fast players and teams that refused to change look like the LA Kings - they were great but did not change with the times.
Players like Simmons failed before in the past just like there were fast smaller defensemen in the NHL that did not make it back then either. But now, in today's game these types of players could be all the rage.
Today's NFL - Lamar, Mahomes, Foles, Rodgers, even the Giants got a more mobile QB then before. Then there is the Ertz, Kelce, Kittle's of the league. You need to be able to counter that.
So the question I have - Can Simmons do that? Can he cover the Mobile TE, can he spy on the mobile QB? If the answer is no - then he is not what we need, but if the answer is yes then this is a no brainer for today's NFL. Stop with the semantics of position name - lets call it Striker. If you want to counteract what offenses are doing today, you dont want your safety doing that anymore - they need to help cover the back end, you need a specialist for the middle of the field you is fast enough to get the outside.
First off, LOL.
You are comparing a dude who was a 7th rd pick with barely any production at the college level to a top 5 projected pick.
And not only that but Kearse ran a 4.6 40 and had a 31 vert. Simmons has an 1110 reach... that means he can jump and touch the top of the backboard... he will likely jump closer to 42 and he ran a 4.31 at clemsons spring combine. There is no comparison athletically, Im not even gonna get into the football traits.
+1
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Everything has pretty much been covered but the bottom line is he has too many holes in his game to be a top 5 pick.
Too many holes? About the only thing he is not rock solid in is taking on olineman straight up...
So you have some magical scheme you can send to Judge so Simmons can run free all game long?
Simmons isnt a physical player. Massive hole imv. He makes plays when hes unblocked or trying to run around players. That wont fly at the NFL level.
Hes prob best suited for a Simmons (Denver) type role (safety/slot corner) in the NFL but you dont take that top 5.
At best hes another niche player and the Giants dont need another one of those.
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In comment 14811000 JonC said:
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a prospect who projects best to a backend run and chase LB safety hybrid is not a priority to my build plan. It's that simple for me.
Backend run and chase safety hybrid? Don't agree that is what he is, but I see what you are saying.
A Jaylon Smith or Leighton Vander Esch tybe LB would be phenomenal. Is there one you see in this draft?
Yes even better. His name is Kenneth Murray
+1 on Murray. I think hes the best LB in the class.
Simmons can do a helluva of a lot and what he cannot do is a much smaller and shorter list.
Again looking for unicorns means you miss out on a lot of good horses.
Where was Kearse asked to do these things? At Florida?
Kearse had double digit sacks his first three years in the NFL. And while he sack totals did tail off, he was still getting excellent pressure. But then he had a bad knee injury in 2006 that started the decline.
So I'm not sure what you mean by Kearse's "struggles in the NFL..."
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Jayron Kearse is a good example of what simmons is. Kearse was asked to do the same exact thing Simmons did but Kearse refuses to switch to that hybrid role. They are very similar. Kearse struggles in the nfl and is a situational player at best. The d coordinator at Clemson saw similarities between these guys. At 4 I would break my tv if Simmons is the pick
Where was Kearse asked to do these things? At Florida?
Kearse had double digit sacks his first three years in the NFL. And while he sack totals did tail off, he was still getting excellent pressure. But then he had a bad knee injury in 2006 that started the decline.
So I'm not sure what you mean by Kearse's "struggles in the NFL..."
I think he means a different Kearse who played safety on Deshaun Watsons Clemson team. The NFL hasnt seen a player like Simmons in a long time, athletes with his build are usually playing basketball. You can not compare him to Taylor Mays because Mays played a majority of his snaps at cover 2 safety and still had less interceptions then Simmons. Justin Simmons ran a 4.6 at the combine and has crazy loose hips, again, not a solid comp at all.
And to answer the thought of a magical scheme, you dont need a magical scheme, the regular 3-4 is designed to have free roam LB, thats why the d lineman in front are 2 gapping so that the linebackers can run free. Betcher ran a 1-gap 50 front, which would not be a good fit for Simmons unless he played money backer.
I like Kenneth Murray but he misdiagnoses a lot of plays and gets caught in no mans land, his acceleration and movement through trash is elite though. I think they will both be good to great players in the NFL. My preference is Simmons but I like both for NYG. You just cant coach length and pure speed.
My bad. Thanks.
Need to start using my glasses when I try to read BBI off my phone... ;)
You guys are missing the point. If the all world Clemson D coordinator saw similarities in those players you want him at 4. He’s a weak player. Look at his full game highlights. Look at bectons full game tape vs Clemson in that film Focus on Simmons everyone will change their mind after seeing that tape. The guy couldn’t stay on his feet in the run game. Kearse was smart enough to realize he can’t mix it up inside at linebacker. Simmons will be a safety in the nfl. He is not a linebacker. “Only weakness is shedding blocks” lmao. Only weakness. That’s half of fucking football is shedding locks if you plan to play anywhere near the los. Show me where you see blitz ability. His tackles for a loss are free rush lanes due to a hell of a talented defense. An impact linebacker who can shed blocks and use his hands as well as his body and fight through blockers is Kenneth Murray. Also, for everyone pointing out his size and weight etc. size and weight doesn’t equate to a physical player. To me simmons at best will be a Keenan Robinson. My guess is Simmons will fall on draft day and everyone on this board will be shocked.