He was the one who reassigned those scouts in 2018. I get keeping them around for that year and then moving on if that is your choice in 2019, but it is pretty clear to me that the decision to let those guys go was not DG's. Now, whether it was Judge or ownership or a collaboration of the two I don't know, but I don't believe those decisions were DG driven.
I think after the draft you will see a restructuring of the organization. Maybe DG will gracefully bow out due to "health concerns" or something. I am not an asshat - I don't have any insider information - just a gut feeling that the guy is not running the show there anymore.
Some may call it wishful thinking, and it is. I think people know I'm not DG's biggest fan. But I am just reading the tea leaves. I do like that the organization appears to be moving towards a more analytical approach. I don't think teams can lose sight of the football aspect of things, but it is crucial that this team incorporate analytics into its approach as well.
On a final note, DG could learn a thing or two from Judge's PCs. He gives the media nothing to work with. Just straightforward answers. DG dials up the Boston accent intentionally and tries to be a comic. It's ridiculous, and the schtick is getting old. Offenses evidently now consist of someone snapping the ball, receiving the snap, and then throwing it or handing it off. Thanks, man!
There was a tweet today that said some GMs are playing chess. Others are playing checkers. DG is playing tic tac toe.
I know I will get filleted for this, but I don't know why Mara and Tisch continue to allow this guy to be a face for the organization.
No one else, especially coaches had anything to do with it, especially Mr. Clean Slate.
Could he have had time to review the scouts work? Maybe, but does that seem logical when they need to see who they are cutting and prepping for FA?
I’m a guy who wants Gettleman’s role reduced because I think he’s fallen into the category as one of the worst GMs in the NFL. But Mara just isn’t giving up on him. There are just too many ties to the “Giants Way” of doing business that Mara prefers in his GM. To think he would suddenly pivot and give an unknown like Judge these broad powers just doesn’t jive...
A lot of peoples bashing on Genttleman is do to decisions that were made above him. He got the job because he aggreed to stick with Eli and to try and compete while rebuliding. Everyone sees this half in half out stuff as DGs rebulidjng plan but it is clearly not completly his call. Which also made it hard to find a coach that would except that plan.
If anything I see it playing out as Mara has taken a step back and allowed more transition. If/when Chris Mara gets reassignned I will belive its fully DGs show.
Pretty simple...he's doing a shitty job.
A lot of peoples bashing on Genttleman is do to decisions that were made above him. He got the job because he aggreed to stick with Eli and to try and compete while rebuliding. Everyone sees this half in half out stuff as DGs rebulidjng plan but it is clearly not completly his call. Which also made it hard to find a coach that would except that plan.
If anything I see it playing out as Mara has taken a step back and allowed more transition. If/when Chris Mara gets reassignned I will belive its fully DGs show.
If you want to put your head in the sand, go right ahead. Mara interviewed Marc Ross for the job. When DG got in, the first move he made was dumping him. You don't promote scouts to regional directors upon your hire and two years later dump them of your own accord. Is it possible? Sure. But my thoughts are that DG's power has been reduced.
Could I be wrong? Of course. DG said he didn't sign ODB to trade him, then traded him. So it is what it is. But Mara has already said DG was on thin ice. Maybe that motivated this move, I don't know.
What Pat Leonard is saying is irrelevant. Yesterday we had our coach and GM refuse to name Daniel Jones the starting QB. Sometimes, what is said to the media just isn't true. I am doing my best to read the tea leaves. It is what it is.
Judge saying you don’t sign players to coach or build culture. That’s the coaches and organizations job.
Link - ( New Window )
Judge says nothing, Gettlemen says a lot of things that amount to nothing.
He repeatedly calls Gettleman DSG.
Dave Shitbag Gettleman.
Think about that - and then ask yourself if you really want to listen to what this fucking moron is speculating.
- Yes there is a restructuring going on and needs to continue for a bit longer. It kind of needed to be going at least two years ago but it wasn't taken seriously (despite the roster turnover which happens a lot anyway whether a team wins or loses).
- Gettleman doesn't do well in press conferences and yesterday was no different. Yes, it would be nice if he took a few cues from Judge but we all know that isn't going to happen. He is what he is at this point but at least he provides plenty to talk about on BBI.
If you want to put your head in the sand, go right ahead. Mara interviewed Marc Ross for the job. When DG got in, the first move he made was dumping him. You don't promote scouts to regional directors upon your hire and two years later dump them of your own accord. Is it possible? Sure. But my thoughts are that DG's power has been reduced.
Could I be wrong? Of course. DG said he didn't sign ODB to trade him, then traded him. So it is what it is. But Mara has already said DG was on thin ice. Maybe that motivated this move, I don't know.
No, it is not "I could be wrong" It is you are wrong.
Marc Ross was dumped because he sucked. Even an "idiot" like DG saw that.
So he move two scouts to new regions and two years later fires them. BFD - they were given new assignments, failed to deliver and got canned.
Didn't sign OBJ to trade him. The HC said he was working well with Odell and would be able to work with him so he was signed. 6 months later OBJ was on TV belittling the HC and the organization...so no he did not sign him to trade him, but once the player started crap, he wasn't going to be kept while bad mouthing the coaches and team..why is that so hard to understand?
A lot of peoples bashing on Genttleman is do to decisions that were made above him. He got the job because he aggreed to stick with Eli and to try and compete while rebuliding. Everyone sees this half in half out stuff as DGs rebulidjng plan but it is clearly not completly his call. Which also made it hard to find a coach that would except that plan.
This organization s inability to make “another run with Eli” led to some pretty awful football, that s for certain.
If anything I see it playing out as Mara has taken a step back and allowed more transition. If/when Chris Mara gets reassignned I will belive its fully DGs show.
Or maybe DG felt like he needed to simply make a move to respond to the poor results? Or maybe Judge pushed and DG relented because these guys weren't ones to die on the hill for? The point is, it could be any of those things. As fans, we won't ever know.
The point is, everytime something moves, it isn't because someone won a massive power struggle, or someone is being pushed out. That is not how most organizations work.
Or maybe DG felt like he needed to simply make a move to respond to the poor results? Or maybe Judge pushed and DG relented because these guys weren't ones to die on the hill for? The point is, it could be any of those things. As fans, we won't ever know.
The point is, everytime something moves, it isn't because someone won a massive power struggle, or someone is being pushed out. That is not how most organizations work.
The minute I saw your name, I knew it would be a reasoned post whether one is supportive of DG or not.
Bad Moves - ALL DG
This gets Tedious.
By the way its very Nauseating to see Marc Ross on NFL Network as a Draft expert.
Im sure his good friend Kim Jones vouched for him.
If you think Mara or Judge or Shurmur didn't have personnel input you are high. Just look at all the former Cardinals that were brought in for Bettcher. The problem with those moves is that none of those former Cardinals were Peterson, Honey Badger or Chandler Jones.
The GM wants the coaches to have players they have confidence in and trust. He went and got those players. That hasn't always worked out.
The draft has been better because The players are new to everybody and no prior knowledge other than film study, scouting and attending pre-draft events.
I like DG and think he wants to succeed here. I like the Judge hire as it is very outside the box for this organization.
I think this team is heading in the right direction.
If you think Mara or Judge or Shurmur didn't have personnel input you are high. Just look at all the former Cardinals that were brought in for Bettcher. The problem with those moves is that none of those former Cardinals were Peterson, Honey Badger or Chandler Jones.
The GM wants the coaches to have players they have confidence in and trust. He went and got those players. That hasn't always worked out.
The draft has been better because The players are new to everybody and no prior knowledge other than film study, scouting and attending pre-draft events.
I like DG and think he wants to succeed here. I like the Judge hire as it is very outside the box for this organization.
I think this team is heading in the right direction.
Good take. A lot of the free agent miscues were ex-Cardinals and Ogletree was also a player Bettcher had liked. The scouts were reassigned last year to the two weakest regions, they were not promoted. They had been with the team for a long time and I think they may have been kept because of that and given a chance to adapt to DGs way. My tea leaves say that was Mara. They did not adapt and are now gone.
LOL. Very true. There have been a few posters saying "Fire the scouts!". Then we fire the scouts and somehow that indicates Gettleman doesn't have any power.
Very bizarre.
He repeatedly calls Gettleman DSG.
Dave Shitbag Gettleman.
Think about that - and then ask yourself if you really want to listen to what this fucking moron is speculating.
Quote:
reference - and it can't be stated enough since it is a core reason this guy posts here.
He repeatedly calls Gettleman DSG.
Dave Shitbag Gettleman.
Think about that - and then ask yourself if you really want to listen to what this fucking moron is speculating.
No, I do not.
He was referring to me. And just because I do not like Gettleman doesn't mean I can't give an objective view on these moves or his job. Similarly, it doesn't mean I am wrong here. You are completely fair in saying I do not like Gettleman, and that's fine. But I have set forth my reasons for believing what I do. Last year, McCagnan hired Gase for the Jets, and after the draft and FA, Gase won the power struggle there and ousted McCagnan. I've heard people say we are not the Jets, so that won't happen. Well, after the last three years, we have the worst record in football. It is ridiculous reasoning to just say, well, we're not the Jets, so this won't happen here.
Before the last few years, we gave coaches three years at least to turn things around. McAdoo didn't even get two seasons (partially driven by the Eli debacle) and Shurmur got two seasons. We just hired a 38 year old ST coach as HC. That is a change from the past Giants' way. Who's to say he didn't insist on getting some power or some assurances that he'd have some say. It is my understanding that Kyle Shanahan and Lynch have clauses in their deals saying they both have 50% of power over personnel decisions. I'm not saying that is present here, but Judge may have some authority we don't know about.
People are free to discard my opinion. Many have. Some agree with me that something fishy is going on, and DG will be reassigned after the draft. Believe what you want.
So Handley got a 3rd season? How many coaches do you think we've even had to cycle through?
Quote:
In comment 14819409 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
reference - and it can't be stated enough since it is a core reason this guy posts here.
He repeatedly calls Gettleman DSG.
Dave Shitbag Gettleman.
Think about that - and then ask yourself if you really want to listen to what this fucking moron is speculating.
No, I do not.
He was referring to me. And just because I do not like Gettleman doesn't mean I can't give an objective view on these moves or his job. Similarly, it doesn't mean I am wrong here. You are completely fair in saying I do not like Gettleman, and that's fine. But I have set forth my reasons for believing what I do. Last year, McCagnan hired Gase for the Jets, and after the draft and FA, Gase won the power struggle there and ousted McCagnan. I've heard people say we are not the Jets, so that won't happen. Well, after the last three years, we have the worst record in football. It is ridiculous reasoning to just say, well, we're not the Jets, so this won't happen here.
Before the last few years, we gave coaches three years at least to turn things around. McAdoo didn't even get two seasons (partially driven by the Eli debacle) and Shurmur got two seasons. We just hired a 38 year old ST coach as HC. That is a change from the past Giants' way. Who's to say he didn't insist on getting some power or some assurances that he'd have some say. It is my understanding that Kyle Shanahan and Lynch have clauses in their deals saying they both have 50% of power over personnel decisions. I'm not saying that is present here, but Judge may have some authority we don't know about.
People are free to discard my opinion. Many have. Some agree with me that something fishy is going on, and DG will be reassigned after the draft. Believe what you want.
I haven’t met too many people, if at all, who do not like someone that can honestly give an objective opinion.
Dave its time to retire...enjoy your family !
Makes sense that Gettleman has now learned enough to pull the trigger. My only question is timing. I thought these things happened right after the draft?
I discard your opinion because your NOT objective!
In comment [url=index.php?
mode=2&thread=595183&show_all=1#14819957]14819957[/url] Giants38 said:
Quote:
In comment 14819409 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
reference - and it can't be stated enough since it is a core reason this guy posts here.
He repeatedly calls Gettleman DSG.
Dave Shitbag Gettleman.
Think about that - and then ask yourself if you really want to listen to what this fucking moron is speculating.
No, I do not.
He was referring to me. And just because I do not like Gettleman doesn't mean I can't give an objective view on these moves or his job. Similarly, it doesn't mean I am wrong here. You are completely fair in saying I do not like Gettleman, and that's fine. But I have set forth my reasons for believing what I do. Last year, McCagnan hired Gase for the Jets, and after the draft and FA, Gase won the power struggle there and ousted McCagnan. I've heard people say we are not the Jets, so that won't happen. Well, after the last three years, we have the worst record in football. It is ridiculous reasoning to just say, well, we're not the Jets, so this won't happen here.
Before the last few years, we gave coaches three years at least to turn things around. McAdoo didn't even get two seasons (partially driven by the Eli debacle) and Shurmur got two seasons. We just hired a 38 year old ST coach as HC. That is a change from the past Giants' way. Who's to say he didn't insist on getting some power or some assurances that he'd have some say. It is my understanding that Kyle Shanahan and Lynch have clauses in their deals saying they both have 50% of power over personnel decisions. I'm not saying that is present here, but Judge may have some authority we don't know about.
People are free to discard my opinion. Many have. Some agree with me that something fishy is going on, and DG will be reassigned after the draft. Believe what you want.
+1 Completely agree
Quote:
that all subtle shifts in power do not involve restructurings or people on their way out? Maybe DG made the moves with the scouts because he believed implementing a different rating process would improve results and it didn't?
Or maybe DG felt like he needed to simply make a move to respond to the poor results? Or maybe Judge pushed and DG relented because these guys weren't ones to die on the hill for? The point is, it could be any of those things. As fans, we won't ever know.
The point is, everytime something moves, it isn't because someone won a massive power struggle, or someone is being pushed out. That is not how most organizations work.
The minute I saw your name, I knew it would be a reasoned post whether one is supportive of DG or not.
Ha! I have fooled at least one person! :)
Gettleman is villainized? People blame Jerry Reese as if he was ray handley himself despite two historic championships.
Gettleman has been fully in charge of a two-year disaster of a head coaching hire and a record of 9-23, and people reach really hard to make him out to be a victim of circumstance and downplay his mistakes.