Read in the paper today that the White House might want businesses to reopen in 2 weeks with people going back to work. If the WH goes forward with that but the Governors of the States don’t agree and keep the stay at home directives, who has the final authority in those States?
Having people out and about will only extend the amount of time that this goes on for, thereby prolonging the economic shutdown. So it seems counter-productive to me.
I hope that Adams, Fauci and Brix make them wait. If it is true the rate is slow, then do not change a thing. Keep things shut until the virus is totally under control as best as can be discerned.
I hope that Adams, Fauci and Brix make them wait. If it is true the rate is slow, then do not change a thing. Keep things shut until the virus is totally under control as best as can be discerned.
has slowed...sorry.
That's a good plan but it only works if Fauci hasn't been tied up and gagged.
And sadly many of them never will reopen.
All we can do is isolate now and take the pain. The virus does not give a shit about the economy. Need to take our medicine and hope we’re back to something resembling normal in two months or so. Or we can jump the gun and be dealing with this in fits and starts for a year plus with far more significant ramifications.
This is not a red/blue thing. Everyone wants to return to normal as quickly as possible. This is not some conspiracy to impact the election or whatever. Tanking the economy is bad for everyone but unfortunately there is a virus running through the country and ignoring it won’t make it go away. The isolation approach is the best option in a scenario where there are no great options.
There are a lot of hard working small businesses that are that backbone of our economy that may lose everything. This isn't just about "rich" people.
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that is going to cost people their lives so that rich people can keep their portfolios growing. Nothing like prioritizing money over actual lives...
There are a lot of hard working small businesses that are that backbone of our economy that may lose everything. This isn't just about "rich" people.
Exactly. Mom and pops are built to sustain weeks/months of no revenue. How do you expect people to live when you strip them of their livelihoods and life savings( must have them all invested in their businesses). It is silly to think the Fed is just going to take care of everyone with firing up the printing presses and dumping helicopter money to the masses without serious negative consequences.
The best option for all businesses is to implement and adhere to significant restrictions now.
I am of the opinion that every citizen should get money to hold them over and every small business should get money directly from the government as well. I’m not talking about McDonald’s or American Airlines, small businesses need financial help which the government is capable of providing in the short term.
On the latter side of the coin, you have to factor in the tremendous strain and burden on a healthcare system that has been gutted, revamped, gutted again, revamped again, and is still an absolute mess. What do you think will happen to the healthcare workforce if we tell them that we are willing to put their lives (and their family's lives) in danger to restart the economy? Mass retirings would not be out of the question.
At this point, a premature end to the quarantine will likely be worse than a full lockdown for a few more months.
One of the biggest fallacies is that lifting national restrictions will spur economic activity. It won't. You have to consider what will happen globally as well. Disparate reactions by different countries are not going to be viewed kindly.
I don’t think saying (In general, not you specifically) “you know what this is doing more harm than good, let’s get back to normal” is an accurate or reasonable approach to the situation. I can see why it’s tempting but I believe it will just make things worse in the long run.
Right now we need collective action and government support and hopefully we can get back to normal soon.
The best option for all businesses is to implement and adhere to significant restrictions now.
I am of the opinion that every citizen should get money to hold them over and every small business should get money directly from the government as well. I’m not talking about McDonald’s or American Airlines, small businesses need financial help which the government is capable of providing in the short term.
It is not just small businesses... People work at those small business and are currently being laid off or let go or if lucky a company may float some workers for a certain amount of time. People have to pay bills and a lot of people are going to struggle for the next 6 months to a year at least I would assume on unemployment which is going to be hit hard with requests and backlogs. Economically big businesses are in much better shape than small businesses and people that work at them.
Saying that, what can we do? We can't have this spread throughout our country and getting people sick and killing people. This is a disaster and it is going to be rough.
Lol - don’t worry rich people are still rich... its the middle class who are hurting from income shutdowns and 401k shrinkage.
And what that could do is even further depress the economy in the future if businesses decide to leave; not for cost, regulation, or control measures, but because of an exogenous (viral) shock. That would wreak havoc above and beyond a national quarantine.
Also, consider what to do with children. Do you re-open schools and pre-schools? Given that we have limited childcare help in this country for two working parent households, we will not achieve anywhere close to full employment. Consider also that schools and preschools are vectors of transmission, because kids will be kids and touch stuff and cough and sneeze.
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that's when I'll be going out to restaurants, gyms, bars, etc. again.
That's a good plan but it only works if Fauci hasn't been tied up and gagged.
Hey Dorgan. Hope you are doing well, my friend!
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In comment 14848387 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
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that's when I'll be going out to restaurants, gyms, bars, etc. again.
That's a good plan but it only works if Fauci hasn't been tied up and gagged.
Hey Dorgan. Hope you are doing well, my friend!
+1
Bingo. I love how people act as if it some simple black and white issue. What a complete false dichotomy. There will be plenty of public health concerns with a ton of people out of work. Suicide. Substance abuse. Domestic violence. Etc.
That would mean over a quarter of U.S. GDP is being affected in some way. Even a relatively mild contraction of GDP in these states (unlikely), you are seeing losses of several hundred billions in economic activity.
You cannot restart the economy without most (if not all) of the states on board.
World renowned political scientist Mike Francesa wants April 6 - I'm guessing he's done the math and estimated that's the day he officially goes into the red.
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But April 13 seems like a far fetched delusion at this point given how the number of cases is doubling every 3 days currently in NYS. They’re playing with fire.
World renowned political scientist Mike Francesa wants April 6 - I'm guessing he's done the math and estimated that's the day he officially goes into the red.
No more tp at the palatial Francesa estate?
We had bailouts for banks, we’re gonna have bailouts for corporations that spent the last decade borrowing money at will to buy back their own stock, now the actual American people need a fucking bailout. Give it to them.
Those who keep their jobs/work from home/have the money can pay it back next year or just not use it. It shouldn’t be that hard.
How much of that is testing a lot more also, it doesnt necassarily mean it is spreading more either, those positives reflect a week ago, next week you should see the effects of the lockdown..
Xuomo also said he needs to get people back to work also to get the economy going, it is not just the president
You can’t let a doctor make that call, that’s an executive decision.
Did McCoy decide when a landing party was beamed down? That was Captain Kirk’s duty. The executive officer. McCoy wasn’t the captain, he was a doctor, damn it.
Exactly. Just because the federal government may say they are ready to lift state of emergency and may put forth guidance that the American people are ready to go back to work, individual states/localities are not prohibited from their local governmental powers. By some of the comments, they really need to bring civics education back...
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and the last poster bashing the President is not allowed on these sites. Do you potentially lose 100,000 people from the virus by opening the country earlier or do you potentially lose the same people in suicides if you wait until June or July and they are bankrupt. Their life savings gone. Either way, there is hardship. The powers that represent us may make the wrong decisions as this is unprecedented, but I believe they are trying very hard. All of them. I also believe that the people of this country are not like Europeans. People will start going back to work sooner rather than later no matter what the federal, state or local government say. It's just, right or wrong, in our nature.
Bingo. I love how people act as if it some simple black and white issue. What a complete false dichotomy. There will be plenty of public health concerns with a ton of people out of work. Suicide. Substance abuse. Domestic violence. Etc.
Just read a great article, in it was a quote by Vladimir Lenin that is fitting for our current situation in time: “There are decades where nothing happens; and there are weeks where decades happen.” We are certainly living in such a time and are merely in the beginning of a huge turning for civilization in our time.
The best option for all businesses is to implement and adhere to significant restrictions now.
Words of wisdom.
I am of the opinion that every citizen should get money to hold them over and every small business should get money directly from the government as well. I’m not talking about McDonald’s or American Airlines, small businesses need financial help which the government is capable of providing in the short term.
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that's when I'll be going out to restaurants, gyms, bars, etc. again.
You can’t let a doctor make that call, that’s an executive decision.
Did McCoy decide when a landing party was beamed down? That was Captain Kirk’s duty. The executive officer. McCoy wasn’t the captain, he was a doctor, damn it.
If you wait for Fauci to make the call or any doctor to make the call you are going to be waiting until they get a vaccine
That would mean over a quarter of U.S. GDP is being affected in some way. Even a relatively mild contraction of GDP in these states (unlikely), you are seeing losses of several hundred billions in economic activity.
You cannot restart the economy without most (if not all) of the states on board.
If that happens, I hope the Governor of NY realizes that there is more to the state than the NYC area. Lots of counties up here with very little virus activity and the capacity to deal with what's going on.
What happens if one locale decides to remain sheltered in place, while others open? At this point, the economy doesn't work.
And what happens if certain localities tell businesses that they are willing to provide tax credits or other incentives to have them relocate to those areas? At that point, you are picking economic winners and losers based on nothing but what areas are more risk averse than others.
We have a massive demand problem in our economy right now. Re-opening the economy isn't going to magically eliminate it.
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In comment 14848469 rmc3981 said:
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and the last poster bashing the President is not allowed on these sites. Do you potentially lose 100,000 people from the virus by opening the country earlier or do you potentially lose the same people in suicides if you wait until June or July and they are bankrupt. Their life savings gone. Either way, there is hardship. The powers that represent us may make the wrong decisions as this is unprecedented, but I believe they are trying very hard. All of them. I also believe that the people of this country are not like Europeans. People will start going back to work sooner rather than later no matter what the federal, state or local government say. It's just, right or wrong, in our nature.
Bingo. I love how people act as if it some simple black and white issue. What a complete false dichotomy. There will be plenty of public health concerns with a ton of people out of work. Suicide. Substance abuse. Domestic violence. Etc.
Just read a great article, in it was a quote by Vladimir Lenin that is fitting for our current situation in time: “There are decades where nothing happens; and there are weeks where decades happen.” We are certainly living in such a time and are merely in the beginning of a huge turning for civilization in our time.
Yeah, interesting times indeed. I personally loved history, but especially political philosophy in college. This reminds me of one of the essay questions we would used to have on tests, with some bizarre scenario that you had to analyze using various political philosophies. Unfortunately the bizarre scenario has become reality, and it's not so easy to deal with in real life...
But some people put their own interests first. It's an aspect of human nature that can be sublimated.
What happens if one locale decides to remain sheltered in place, while others open? At this point, the economy doesn't work.
And what happens if certain localities tell businesses that they are willing to provide tax credits or other incentives to have them relocate to those areas? At that point, you are picking economic winners and losers based on nothing but what areas are more risk averse than others.
We have a massive demand problem in our economy right now. Re-opening the economy isn't going to magically eliminate it.
I think the tri state area will follow cuomo, if he lifts the ban new jersey and connecticuit will, if he doesnt they wont..
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But April 13 seems like a far fetched delusion at this point given how the number of cases is doubling every 3 days currently in NYS. They’re playing with fire.
How much of that is testing a lot more also, it doesnt necassarily mean it is spreading more either, those positives reflect a week ago, next week you should see the effects of the lockdown..
Xuomo also said he needs to get people back to work also to get the economy going, it is not just the president
Agree. I heard Cuomo say the same thing. I think you’ll see a lot of employees choosing to wait until they’re comfortable going back. It’ll be like the beach scene on the 4th of July in Jaws. Nobody wanting to go into the water (initially).
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Again, we have tremendous regional linkages in our economy.
What happens if one locale decides to remain sheltered in place, while others open? At this point, the economy doesn't work.
And what happens if certain localities tell businesses that they are willing to provide tax credits or other incentives to have them relocate to those areas? At that point, you are picking economic winners and losers based on nothing but what areas are more risk averse than others.
We have a massive demand problem in our economy right now. Re-opening the economy isn't going to magically eliminate it.
I think the tri state area will follow cuomo, if he lifts the ban new jersey and connecticuit will, if he doesnt they wont..
Hence the regional linkages. At this point, I don't see a way that NY lifts shelter in place in a few weeks.