NFT: Noah Syndergaard expected to undergo Tommy John surgery

And they weren't even playing baseball.

Where did this come from? Great job signing Wheeler.

deGrom, Stroman, Matz, Porcello, Wacha. Yuck.

such a Mets thing to have a player injured during a quarantine.

seems like everyone is getting Tommy John surgery.

too much masterbating? wtf

-love the Mets

elective surgeries at this time.

In comment 14848594 Matt M. said:

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elective surgeries at this time.

A lot of orthos have surgical centers.

where the injuries just destroy that ability for a big contract.

As for the Mets, better now in this mess of a season than next year.

bad thing they let Wheeler go. Gee, can't believe they didn't see that coming.

the next most Met thing is going to be when they sign Harvey, get a month of press around it, he throws a gem in his first game back, and then falls apart.

second best 2019 starter (per fWar) walk to our division rival. Rotation looks pretty ugly in 2020 now. A real shame our GM mortgaged the farm in 2019, and had an abnormally (by MLB standards) healthy rotation yet we still failed to even make the play-in game.

It seems 50/50 whether there's an MLB season anyway at this point. Hopefully the owners stick to the letter of the CBA and no one accrues service time.

Mets players respond to TJS, this will take him out of 2021 too, or most of it, and then he's a FA in 2022.

Wilpons are going to regret not selling the team sooner.

not related to this per se, but the market in general. They probably lost a 3rd of the value by waiting.

Let’s see. DeGrom had it, Matt had it, Harvey had, Wheeler had it. Only makes sense Syndergaard has to have it Unfreaking real

And Stroman just made himself a lot of money

Not in a hospital -- they had a small surgery center in Beverly Hills. Assume it's similar. Not a great moment for this kind of thing but right now there doesn't seem to be any move to appropriate those beds for other kinds of care. Also, those surgery centers aren't connected with urgent care or anything else where there'd be walk-ins. Hope they're testing everyone though.

That is brutal news. I hate to see good pitchers miss significant time due to TJ surgery regardless of whether or not they play for a division rival. I've always had a great deal of respect for Thor and deGrom. The NL East is the toughest division in baseball and this will dramatically decrease the Mets chances.

In comment 14848667 Jay on the Island said:

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That is brutal news. I hate to see good pitchers miss significant time due to TJ surgery regardless of whether or not they play for a division rival. I've always had a great deal of respect for Thor and deGrom. The NL East is the toughest division in baseball and this will dramatically decrease the Mets chances.

Thanks for telling us this hurts their chances.

We thought it helped!

before the first pitch!

Is this really a surprise to anyone? Seriously? Come on. I literally predicted this years ago.

The joke is that this comes off a season where he has no injury, a quiet offseason, a normal spring training, a quarantine where baseball stops...and then this comes out??? Haha, fuck the Mets. Seriously, fuck this embarrassing, dumbass franchise. Retract the team and save me from the next 50 years of ineptitude. The Wilpons and this team kill any enjoyment out of baseball.

We were finally set to have the most complete roster I've seen in years.

Just devastating. But not at all surprising considering this franchise's luck.

In comment 14848833 Chris684 said:

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Thanks for telling us this hurts their chances. We thought it helped!

Happy to help.

In comment 14848919 ZGiants98 said:

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We were finally set to have the most complete roster I've seen in years. Just devastating. But not at all surprising considering this franchise's luck.

A trade could lift your spirits. I can’t think of any names right now because I haven’t spent any time thinking about baseball with everything going on. I would expect a trade once things start up again.

In comment 14848606 Eric on Li said:

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bad thing they let Wheeler go. Gee, can't believe they didn't see that coming. the next most Met thing is going to be when they sign Harvey, get a month of press around it, he throws a gem in his first game back, and then falls apart.

So true.

They will also trade McNeil for a Zambrano type pitcher to replace him

In comment 14848884 PhiPsi125 said:

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Is this really a surprise to anyone? Seriously? Come on. I literally predicted this years ago. The joke is that this comes off a season where he has no injury, a quiet offseason, a normal spring training, a quarantine where baseball stops...and then this comes out??? Haha, fuck the Mets. Seriously, fuck this embarrassing, dumbass franchise. Retract the team and save me from the next 50 years of ineptitude. The Wilpons and this team kill any enjoyment out of baseball.

And we were SO CLOSE to a complete cult tie change away from the Coupons.

And they even screwed that up

So not the worst year to have this happen.

Plus, it probably explains why his slider did not have the same bite last year. Elbow was probably allready bothering him.

In comment 14848863 pjcas18 said:

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the actual clip... - ( New Window )

In comment 14848978 Milton said:

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In comment 14848863 pjcas18 said: Quote: the actual clip... - ( New Window )

thank you, we've all seen it.

I always expect disaster. Somehow these owner have jinxed the team on top of being cheap.

In comment 14848977 Vanzetti said:

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So not the worst year to have this happen. Plus, it probably explains why his slider did not have the same bite last year. Elbow was probably allready bothering him.

He's been pretty vocal about this lately. Said it was the stitches in the 2019 ball. The ball was very slick. Thor said it felt like gripping an "ice cube". Took many pitchers a while to get a feel for it last year.

This is no longer a conspiracy either as MLB has now admitted what happened.

In comment 14848941 Jay on the Island said:

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In comment 14848919 ZGiants98 said: Quote: We were finally set to have the most complete roster I've seen in years. Just devastating. But not at all surprising considering this franchise's luck. A trade could lift your spirits. I can’t think of any names right now because I haven’t spent any time thinking about baseball with everything going on. I would expect a trade once things start up again.

Yeah. Mets might need to be in the market for another TOR starter in season if they want to win the whole thing now. This is really no different than most teams expecting to compete though. Losing Thor just brings our rotation down from "special" to good/average. Yankees got Cole (deGrom), Tanaka (Stroman), and a bunch of question marks. Same boat. Matz looked great this spring. Somebody like him could take a step forward out of nowhere and suddenly we are fine again. Not saying that will happen, but you have to play the games. I could see David Peterson making an impact mid-season also. Obviously, losing Thor SUCKS though. Not trying to sugar coating. Just trying to be optimistic. Our lineup is still probably one of the best in baseball and our bullpen "could" be elite.

That every one of the "Fab 5" we once all dreamt on now ALL have now had Tommy John surgery.

We always get worked up by the flame throwers and dream on them (Izzy, Wilson, Pulsipher anyone?), but the reality is there is almost no chance for them to stay healthy in modern baseball.

I think Sandy was right to shift to the more of the "David Peterson" type prospect or at least try to go for more of a blend near the end of his tenure.

Starters that throw 99 mph are ticking time bombs. Its just a matter of when.

My 2 cents.

Mets had 6 SP for 5 spots. Start with the 5 you have even if the backend looks terrible on paper for now. Lugo is my next man up for the rotation but he starts in the pen. Let him stabilize the pen early in the season and allow Diaz, Betances, Familia, etc to all stay out of high pressure appearances early in the season.

If the rotation isnt performing (Wacha, Porcello) make the swap 1/3rd of the way in. Lugo has been begging to start again and in a reduced innings season, now might be that time. (Again this assumes bullpen performance from the rest of the guys at that point and bad performances from Wacha/Porcello).

I also dont allow Gsellman to make the team. Send him to AAA and stretch him out again. He isnt that valuable as the last guy in the pen anyway. Somebody like Lockett or Sewald can fill that spot. Gsellman is young enough and has success as a SP. Stretch him out and now you have "some" depth again. If he isnt needed you can always call him up for the pen again later in the year.

Doesnt fix things but probably makes the best of this situation and gives the Mets a few options/flexibility again without any additions.

Sale, Severino, and Syndergaard.

Pitchers break. I would definitely rethink my investment strategy for pitchers. Maybe higher AAV shorter duration or just try and avoid them in FA.

If the Mets are looking to acquire someone I'd reach out to Boston and see if they can pry away Eduardo Rodriguez by taking on Jackie Bradley Jr (or worst case JD Martinez).

In comment 14848612 pjcas18 said:

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Mets players respond to TJS, this will take him out of 2021 too, or most of it, and then he's a FA in 2022. Wilpons are going to regret not selling the team sooner. not related to this per se, but the market in general. They probably lost a 3rd of the value by waiting.

I'd hold him until the ASB next year, let him hopefully get tuned up for a month or two so he can lead the team to a WS championship in Cohen's first season as owner.

Also if anything I think this helps keep Syndergaard long term. We know this year was an unlikely year for them to go anywhere on the field anyway since the division is even better than last year, and since the ownership change got delayed for all practical purposes the negotiation with Thor was going to come down to next year's walk year. So If anything this lowers that price and makes it more likely he will be amenable to resign, even if just a short term deal to prove he is healthy.

If Thor won a CY during this transition/shortened year he'd be looking at a $200-300m extension and whoever the new owner is would be in a tricky negotiation right away. And him winning a CY wouldn't have even guaranteed the team making the playoffs.

But Id offer Syndergaard a friendly extension right now when he has no clue what his financial future might look like. He isnt going to have a full season on the books before he hits FA heading into 2022 and is looking at a "prove it" deal even under the best of scenarios in FA.

Everybody wants to extend players after they have proved themselves but nobody ever wants to be proactive on a guy when his chips are down.

I was screaming to give Wheeler a friendly extension 2 years ago and most fans then were talking about "1/2 seasons" and "injury history". You arent going to get a good deal without the risk.

for Matt Harvey (as is being discussed on twitter) if I was to be asked.

I don't see Harvey as having demonstrably more upside than any of the other shitty options and if it goes poorly it will end badly, and no one needs that.

I'd look for a trade and i wouldn't wait.

In comment 14849227 pjcas18 said:

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for Matt Harvey (as is being discussed on twitter) if I was to be asked. I don't see Harvey as having demonstrably more upside than any of the other shitty options and if it goes poorly it will end badly, and no one needs that. I'd look for a trade and i wouldn't wait.

Hell no on Harvey. He's finished. Agree 100%

let bygones be bygones.

I'd rather let him throw a few games and hope to catch lightning in a bottle than Corey Oswalt.

And yes to an extension with Thor, they should have been trying for both him and wheeler the past 2 years, but #wilponzis. Unfortunately it's unlikely there will be any extensions until new ownership - hopefully Cohen just comes in and gets a quick sale with the Wilpons likely completely freaking out and that's the first thing he does.

In comment 14849216 ZGiants98 said:

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But Id offer Syndergaard a friendly extension right now when he has no clue what his financial future might look like. He isnt going to have a full season on the books before he hits FA heading into 2022 and is looking at a "prove it" deal even under the best of scenarios in FA. Everybody wants to extend players after they have proved themselves but nobody ever wants to be proactive on a guy when his chips are down. I was screaming to give Wheeler a friendly extension 2 years ago and most fans then were talking about "1/2 seasons" and "injury history". You arent going to get a good deal without the risk.

I don't think it's cold. I see it as a win-win. Pay him a bit more while he is hurt and recovering, and get him on the cheap on the backend. Both parties are balancing risk.

As for Harvey, I'd take a flier on him on a minor league deal. Worst case scenario is he flames out.

I hope noone is suggesting an immediate trade. With nobody knowing what is going to happen this season, I think it would be foolish to trade beforehand at this point.

If Harvey really agrees to a minor league deal... That's fine.

I was thinking he was looking for a one year deal similar to what he got with the Angels. That's not happening.

Minor leagues? Sure, he can go to Syracuse and play with Tebow for a few months.

when it was signed and then he obviously tanked so hard he got DFA'd.

He will get a minimum or near minimum deal, if that.

And this may or may not be overly optimistic (not looking to argue about unknowns)

But let's say we can get a 2-3 week ST to start in early May with a opening day target of Memorial Day/June 1.

That could allow for:

-100 game season

-Expanded postseason tournament

Could still make for an interesting season and would allow more teams the opportunity to "go for it".

Holding out hope we still get to see something similar to that. Of course if this break goes into mid summer, the outlook of a "fun season" dwindles a lot more.

In comment 14849286 ZGiants98 said:

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If Harvey really agrees to a minor league deal... That's fine. I was thinking he was looking for a one year deal similar to what he got with the Angels. That's not happening. Minor leagues? Sure, he can go to Syracuse and play with Tebow for a few months.

ERA over 7 last year. Wouldn't shock me if he had to settle for a minor league deal

In comment 14849291 Eric on Li said:

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when it was signed and then he obviously tanked so hard he got DFA'd. He will get a minimum or near minimum deal, if that.

Yeah I meant more a one year "prove it" deal on a guaranteed contract, less about the AAV.

I think Harvey under any circumstance on a "major league" deal is a no no for me.

worst case you cut him. I could care less whether it's an MLB deal or a minor league deal, though I think it might make sense for him to have a minors option so he doesn't get himself outright cut right away again.

In comment 14849300 Eric on Li said:

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worst case you cut him. I could care less whether it's an MLB deal or a minor league deal, though I think it might make sense for him to have a minors option so he doesn't get himself outright cut right away again.

I do. How do you make it work even to start? Harvey is on record stating he doesnt want to relieve. We still hav 5 SP slated for spots. How does he even get a chance if he wont come out of the pen at least? Are we supposed to give him a rotation spot over Wacha/Porcello. No thanks. And that's before we get into what drama mouthpiece he can be.

If he's willing to go Syracuse at the start of the season, prove he can dominate there for a bit, and maybe give himself the option to be called up later... Im down. Otherwise, he's not worth the headache.

absolutely trade right now - with the uncertainty - it's a buyers market IMO.

What is the risk of the unknown? Worst case I believe is they don't play an inning this year in which case IMO things roll over to next year as they are currently (service time, contract, etc.)

And there are impacts to Harvey. No it wouldn't be a nice reunion, people have short memories it was shit show after shit show once Harvey's career began to crater.

IMO Harvey is the Mets way out - give the people what they want - but it's lazy - the Mets DO need to address the loss of Syndergaard, and it's not with Harvey.

Especially, Harvey.

I would be ok with a trade now if one presented itself. However, we did sign 2 SP for 1 spot this offseason. The only reason to do that was to guard against injury. Well, an injury happened. If you liked Wacha on a bounce back/age upside for almost 10 million in AAV with incentives reached, this shouldn't have changed that IMO. Im still ok with letting things unfold a little bit.

If Wacha stinks, Peterson isnt ready, nobody from the Gonzalves/Lockett pool proves capable, Lugo is needed in the pen and cant be moved, Gsellman stinks as a pen piece and rotation piece... Basically no internal options present themselves... Yeah, you need to make a trade. And that assumes the Mets lineup and pen is carrying them and they are still in it (because if not, what's the point?).

But I think there are a bunch of variables and unknowns still at this point.

if it's a buyer's market sure, make a move. But I doubt anyone does anything until they have an indication re: when the season may actually start. They may cancel the draft. The entire season could get cancelled, or moved back. The Olympics did. I'd be surprised if teams aren't just completely paralyzed right now.

As far as Harvey, he's currently unemployed so it's a different situation. He won't get paid much so it's a lot of discussion over something that is likely to be inconsequential. I see no downside to ever bringing a body into ST.

If/when ST ever resumes, and concludes, if everyone is pitching better than him he can stay in extended ST or something. Or vice versa. Thor going to the DL all year opens up a spot, there's zero reason to not give Harvey a shot for it unless there's someone better available. I haven't looked at who else is currently unemployed but I'd imagine there's slim pickings.

In comment 14849312 pjcas18 said:

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absolutely trade right now - with the uncertainty - it's a buyers market IMO. What is the risk of the unknown? Worst case I believe is they don't play an inning this year in which case IMO things roll over to next year as they are currently (service time, contract, etc.) And there are impacts to Harvey. No it wouldn't be a nice reunion, people have short memories it was shit show after shit show once Harvey's career began to crater. IMO Harvey is the Mets way out - give the people what they want - but it's lazy - the Mets DO need to address the loss of Syndergaard, and it's not with Harvey.

If you get a good deal with someone who is locked up contractually, certainly. But I'd rather look to FA next year and pick up a Bauer, a Minor, or a Robbie Ray. I don't want to be in a position where the Mets trade more prospects for a pitcher, have the pitcher not play at all, and then have better pitchers available in FA anyway.

were legitimate contenders in 2020 with Syndergaard. Without Syndergaard they are fringe at best.

My point of a trade was to improve the team for 2020.

I like to have a good farm system, but I'd rather have a major league contender. And the Mets are close.

Serious question: If te Hospital for Special Surgery in NYC has suspended non-essential surgery, how is Noah Syndergaard having his Tommy John surgery at HSS on Thursday? A doctor friend is incensed by this. Any answers?
https://twitter.com/garymyersny/status/1242547824623001602?s=21 - ( New Window )

And what transpires in an actual season are two very different things. Sure you want to look as good as you can heading in and have as many "knowns" as you can so that you can feel confident predicting a certain win total... But that's mostly fan/media stuff.

The reason depth is so important is that almost all teams will suffer significant injuries over the course of the season and your win total, and everything you thought would happen, quickly gets thrown out the window. In turns into a sand lot quickly after IMO.

We had a bunch of depth and a lot of upside plays hedging our knowns (Betances, Wacha, Porcello, Diaz, Familia, Cespedes, Nimmo, Davis, Dom, etc). Most of those players arent being factored into our win prediction totals based on what they did last year but if you even hit on a few of them, our outlook changes again.

The season is fluid.

And Im not disagreeing. Just throwing it out there. Id be fine with a trade now if it presented itself.

In comment 14849427 RicFlair said:

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Serious question: If te Hospital for Special Surgery in NYC has suspended non-essential surgery, how is Noah Syndergaard having his Tommy John surgery at HSS on Thursday? A doctor friend is incensed by this. Any answers? https://twitter.com/garymyersny/status/1242547824623001602?s=21 - ( New Window )

It was deemed essential.

In comment 14849453 ZGiants98 said:

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In comment 14849427 RicFlair said: Quote: Serious question: If te Hospital for Special Surgery in NYC has suspended non-essential surgery, how is Noah Syndergaard having his Tommy John surgery at HSS on Thursday? A doctor friend is incensed by this. Any answers? https://twitter.com/garymyersny/status/1242547824623001602?s=21 - ( New Window ) It was deemed essential.

He's also getting the surgery done in W Palm Beach I heard.

In comment 14849427 RicFlair said:

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Serious question: If te Hospital for Special Surgery in NYC has suspended non-essential surgery, how is Noah Syndergaard having his Tommy John surgery at HSS on Thursday? A doctor friend is incensed by this. Any answers? https://twitter.com/garymyersny/status/1242547824623001602?s=21 - ( New Window )

Not viewed as elective. Quality of life "acutely torn UCL".

medical staff?

for some levity, I couldn't stop laughing at this.

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Super 70s Sports @Super70sSports · Mar 24 Mike Cubbage hit .282 in 1978 which is still the American League record for a 48-year-old lesbian librarian.

In comment 14849018 pjcas18 said:

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In comment 14848978 Milton said: Quote: In comment 14848863 pjcas18 said: Quote: the actual clip... - ( New Window ) thank you, we've all seen it.