I want a defensive stud, someone who can change the game for us. Maybe that's unrealistic to ask of a player. When I see Simmons, I don't see where he would dominate the game, so I might be self limiting this kid.
Those that advocate for him. what do you envision he will become? Do you have a good player comp for him? How do you see him impacting the game?
But I ve read a good comparison might be Jesse Armstead
Really.... who? Who fits your bill as a "stud" player on the D? Who is left that is a true stud player? Brown? That position is overrun with players and using a high round pick on there doesn't make sense.
Who are YOU taking?
Simmons is a rare player that can literally change the game by potentially eliminating that deficiency on defense immediately.
Ertz over the middle? Simmons is a favorable matchup.
Passes in the flat? Simmons can make it to the outside and make a stop for a loss when lined up almost anywhere.
Man coverage on fast slot receivers? He covered them WELL in college and he has the speed to do so.
He IS a game changer. Just not in the way of what people traditionally used to value (pass rush).
Oh by the way, he is an effective blitzer, tackler, and more than willing in the run game.
Watch some tape and judge for yourself.
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I think he will be a good player in the NFL but I'm not 100% convinced he will be the force up front that you guys expect.
I think he will be a good player in the NFL but I'm not 100% convinced he will be the force up front that you guys expect.
Guy can run. When was the last time we had a LBer that could cover a TE or RB? He’s very good in space and has great length. I think he could also get to the QB with his speed. If used properly by the DC, he’s a great asset to have on D and will most likely become the best player on that D the moment he’s drafted.
If we want our new coach to be able to implement the versatile schemes that he's talked about, then let's give him the tools to make it happen. Or, we can watch a whole other season of teams converting 3rd and 9s on us all season long.
That gets me pretty excited.
Bob Papa is very high on this kid. Said last night he would be the perfect pick at 4. Compared him to AP, and reminded everyone that AP wasn't widely hailed as a great signing. Turned out to be a great Giant. I'd like the pick. Maybe more than Young.
Walter Football listed his strengths and weaknesses (you can read their write-up)
https://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2020isimmons.php
Strengths:
Instinctive
Sideline-to-sideline speed
Very good run defender
Excellent pass-coverage linebacker
Can cover running backs, tight ends, receivers
Rare cover skills for a linebacker; covers like a safety
Has covered slot receivers in man-to-man
Can run down the middle seam
Good vision
Reads plays well
Sideline-to-sideline speed
Superb at knowing when to fire off
Good pursuit defender
Closing quickness
Athletic
Dangerous blitzer
Excellent tackler
Open-field tackler
Hard hitter
Is an enforcer in the middle of the field
Never hesitates to get physical
Natural build
Covers a lot of ground in zone coverage
Can break down in space
Ability to redirect
Could also contribute on special teams
Weakness:
Could stand to get better at taking on and shedding blocks
If I had to pick one player that had very similar write up as Simmons that played in the Pros- it would be Ryan Shazier - Read this write on him you will - it sounds a like like Simmons profile https://www.sbnation.com/nfl-mock-draft/2014/4/14/5611854/ryan-shazier-scouting-report
He gives you a player who can cover pass catching TE and possibly some WRs from the LB position which allows your safeties to double WR or cover over the top in a zone.
He gives you the ability to catch up to running backs running to the outside edge.
He gives you the ability to play zone in the middle of the field and keep eyes on the mobile QB who tend to take off and run.
He gives you a player that would help blow up screen passes.
I would forget trying to put a label on him, but does not mean he is position-less, it just mean his role in the defense changes depending on the play called which gives you versatility.
You have watched Peppers and Landon play linebacker on plays because it is needed in today's NFL to have a player who is fast enough to attack and cover - but that is because our linebackers are not capable. Simmons would be capable which means another player to do that job.
You have watched your team get demoralized by Zach Ertz and Jason Witten - that might not happen because you have Simmons.
You have watched your team get punked by that Penn State SB back up who plays for the Eagles by running the same dink pass over and over again. - that might not happen if you have Simmons because he is fast enough to get to the outside.
Did someone say "positional flexibility" Simmons could be your guy. What happens when there is an audible called and a Running back is sent out in to the Wide out position your slow ass LB has to cover him - oh wait - thank God we drafted Simmons he at least gives us a chance.
No - he is not going to be a run stuffing up the middle LB - but he is not supposed to be - your high priced/highly drafted Defensive Line is supposed to do that. There are other LBs on the team who can play that role.
Now the question is - do you believe he can do those things or not? More importantly - do the Giants think he can do those things or not?
If so - I think its a no brainier at 4
If you say he is actually a FS, I don’t think you can possibly justify taking a player that high who hasn’t really played that position in the NCAA, especially because Julian Love flashed potential in that role late last season.
And I’m underwhelmed by Simmons’ pash rush skills. Though he had gaudy stats, he was completely unblocked in almost all of the 2019 sacks I viewed. You combine that with his problems in traffic against rushing plays, and I can’t possibly see how he can play OLB in a 3-4.
So the guy’s most likely position duplicates a Giants player already in the squad. It’s as if we were focusing on a really talented HB coming out this year insisting that the guy along with Barkley could be utilized creatively to get them on the field at the same time. I think that idea would be criticized heavily. Yet it looks like a similar argument to the one being made for Simmons.
Finally, an argument being made is Judge’s “multiple” statement. But the Patriots have starting safeties and LBs who fit traditional profiles and use them flexibly. Their LBs in fact tend to be large, in the 250-260 lb range and their DBs, who tend to be pretty big, are all in the 190-200 lb range. The Pats have NOT been using a nonstandard rover as far as I can tell. So the Pats don’t provide a template for how Simmons would be used.
I just don’t see how Simmons fits with the Giants.
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I'd wager he's a backend player in the NFL, and not a good use of the #4 overall pick, imo.
Bob Papa is very high on this kid. Said last night he would be the perfect pick at 4. Compared him to AP, and reminded everyone that AP wasn't widely hailed as a great signing. Turned out to be a great Giant. I'd like the pick. Maybe more than Young.
Papa, while beloved as an announcer, isn't a really astute football mind. AP was an old school MIKE, Simmons isn't that either.
It's about physicality and want to, and Simmons views himself as Honey Badger 2. That's a backend player, a safety hybrid.
Looking at the Pats LBs, maybe Mayo would be the closest player? Most of their backers are big like Hightower/Brushci.
To me though, the LB position is about physicality and most importantly, reading the defense instinctively. I like the Dallas LBs like Lee, Smith and Vander Esch, maybe Smith is also a good comp here?
If he's just a stud off ball linebacker and there are cornerstone 10+ year left tackles on the board? You take the tackle to support your young QB, no question. It's been said a million times but if you take him, you have to have a plan for him on Day 1.
If he's just a stud off ball linebacker and there are cornerstone 10+ year left tackles on the board? You take the tackle to support your young QB, no question. It's been said a million times but if you take him, you have to have a plan for him on Day 1.
Aces, that's a good comp, James is very good, that defense was not the same without him.
I'd agree with that. I think that's what's in my head, I keep seeing the LB hybrid and it wasn't enough imo. Because then why not trade down and pick up Murray who can do that role very well.
I think Giants brass have to see him more than a + LB or a + S.
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Giants picked a freaking RB at #2 and a QB at #6 the past few years.
The line is a mess and IMV, that is priority #1.
Just a old HS Assistant's view....It is going to depend on the Giant's board and how they rate him against the OTs. Non of the tackles are sure things. Andrew Young is the only one to play LT for most of his career. He is steady but some question how high his ceiling is. Wirfs has huge upside, he is young, extremely athletic and his ceiling could be very high. Lower body looks like Saquan ony bigger! Again, he played RT! If you want your tackles to pull he is your man! Becton is RAW! Huge but tape is not great! Dave T thinks he is a RT and that's it. He will be a beast in the run game. Willis does not have the length people want in a Tackle. Measured shorter than 6'5" with short arms! Will be solid! Granted WE NEED A RT! But do you draft a RT at 4? I think there are reasons Simmons could be higher on boards. Joe Judge and Graham want versatility. The Pats changed there Defensive look game to game. He fits the philosophy of the new staff. Move him around every week. He won't be a safety or a slot corner in the NFL! But he can play many hybrid positions. MLB in Dime Package watch him cover a tight end or a back Blitz with 4.39 speed, combine him with Connelly and watch them shoot gaps! I'd prefer Chase Young but I would not be totally surprised If Simmons goes before him!
Shazier was more physical than Simmons and wasnt exactly lighting it up in the NFL. He was a good player. In his 4 seasons he never made the pro bowl or all pro. He was selected 15th overall. Kalil Mack was selected at 5 overall in that same draft and had a much better career up to the same point.
The one thing you cant teach is Physicality. College players dont get more physical in the NFL. The guy is one of the most physical specimens to come out but he is more athlete than football player. I dont even think you will be getting a Shazier. To me he is a mid to late 1st rounder and will probably have a good career. He will make great plays and you will say why don't we see that more often? It's because he is an open field player and not an attacker. Teams like SF and Tennessee will eat this guy up.
This assumes that the Giants have graded any of the OTs as a franchise LT. That is not a given.
He'll likely be a top 10 pick next year.
but if you are running a defense that really is going to be different each week depending on the opponent then Simmons could be a legend. he can line up almost anywhere on the field and handle the responsibilities of 3 positions (lb, S, cb). if the Giants are able to keep the gameplan secret so the other team doesn't know where he'll be lining up going into the game, he could change how opposing offenses have to prepare for our defense.
A good defensive coordinator could come up with a lot of different looks with both Peppers & Simmons in the back 7.
Plus it's not hyperbole to say that it could be years before another player with Simmons skillset comes along. Keep in mind he's 5 inches taller and 25 pounds heavier than Jabrill Peppers.
Not being argumentative but I recall similar thoughts about Ray Lewis before the 1996 draft.
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I'd wager he's a backend player in the NFL, and not a good use of the #4 overall pick, imo.
Not being argumentative but I recall similar thoughts about Ray Lewis before the 1996 draft.
If the Giants think he's Ray Lewis, sign me up for that asap.
He jumps off the screen.
He's a difference-maker.
And we have no difference-makers on defense.
If he's gone at 4, I vote with many other BBIers:
Trade down if we can and get a starting offensive tackle (and extra pick or two).
I never got that. Wouldn't knowing what he can AND can't do help put him in the best position to succeed?
We concentrated on D in free agency. Yes they may not be probowlers but they're serviceable. OL this year Defense next year and then start picking and choosing after that. Let's face it. We're not a good team. We should be better next year but I have no illusions that we're a superbowl team let alone a playoff team. Maybe they surprise me but we shall see. FIX THE OLINE.