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Matt Miller: Scouts Think NYG will Draft Isaiah Simmons

Anakim : 3/27/2020 5:27 pm
"As mock drafts begin to come together, many NFL scouts believe the New York Giants will select Clemson linebacker/safety Isaiah Simmons at No. 4 overall. One scout said: "They kept Nate Solder and added an OK right tackle in [Cameron] Fleming. I think they're set up to wait on a tackle."
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Keeping solder  
Tuckrule : 3/27/2020 6:51 pm : link
And adding Flemming on a one year deal doesn’t mean they are set up to wait on the tackle position. Some very strange reasoning. Simmons May be the pick but that isn’t because we solidified the tackle position temporarily
Brown  
UGADawgs7 : 3/27/2020 6:58 pm : link
If they take Brown, why would they? They have enough DT, and not OT/Edge/LB. DT should be the last 1st round possibility on their minds.
RE: Simmons but at 6.  
KeoweeFan : 3/27/2020 7:00 pm : link
In comment 14851786 Ivan15 said:
Quote:
.

That would be nice if DG is going for Best athlete no matter who it is, after trading down.
But we also know if he has his sights set on a specific player he'll grab him from the #4 spot so as to not be disappointed.

I've watched just about every one of Simmon's games; from the tall and somewhat clumsy safety who looked lost at times or wiffed on a tackle but still showed his potential on the next play; to Venable's secret weapon - no one knew where he'd line up, or even at any spot what role he was assigned.

I agree that he will be effective only in the "right" scheme, but from what I've heard from Judge and Graham, the Giants defense is the "right" spot.
Big Blue '56: "They have no idea what Judge/DG will do"  
Torrag : 3/27/2020 7:01 pm : link
So true. The annual 'the Giants will do this or like this guy' etc is speculative. And every year there are those that believe 'someone knew' conspiracy nuts. No one knew jack shit.

There are only a few possible conclusions and with hundreds if not thousands of people putting in their guesses you know what? A lot of them will be right. Even on BBI. Haha.

Now what they 'should do' is draft an OT in Round 1. It's the best class in many years with multiple Top 10 prospects to choose from. We've a shit ton invested in Jones and Barkley. It just makes too much sense for me to put my chips on a different position.
Can't talk yourself out of the best players  
ghost718 : 3/27/2020 7:01 pm : link
We're playing for keeps here,can't hit the reset button
RE: The Scout that said this...  
MeadowlandsMike : 3/27/2020 7:03 pm : link
In comment 14851844 LBH15 said:
Quote:


Quote:


One scout said: "They kept Nate Solder and added an OK right tackle in [Cameron] Fleming. I think they're set up to wait on a tackle."




should be demoted to scouting the Alaska-region.

In just two short sentences he managed to not understand that Solder's cap hit is greater than his value as a LT, overstate Fleming as a 16-game starter and understate that the draft is for longer term investing in things such as OL.


Seriously
RE: The Scout that said this...  
robbieballs2003 : 3/27/2020 7:03 pm : link
In comment 14851844 LBH15 said:
Quote:


Quote:


One scout said: "They kept Nate Solder and added an OK right tackle in [Cameron] Fleming. I think they're set up to wait on a tackle."




should be demoted to scouting the Alaska-region.

In just two short sentences he managed to not understand that Solder's cap hit is greater than his value as a LT, overstate Fleming as a 16-game starter and understate that the draft is for longer term investing in things such as OL.


It is worse. Jerry Reese is unemployed.
RE: Trade down  
section125 : 3/27/2020 7:12 pm : link
In comment 14851792 JonC said:
Quote:
gain an extra #2 and do as you wish, we need a helluva lot more than Simmons.


ding, ding, ding, ding...we have a winner...at least as far as I am concerned.
RE: If he takes Brown at 4  
mphbullet36 : 3/27/2020 7:16 pm : link
In comment 14851852 AcesUp said:
Quote:
he should be fired on the spot.


if he was planning to take Brown he should be fired right now before he screws up the pick.
Miller is not plugged in  
Sy'56 : 3/27/2020 7:17 pm : link
Fleming signed a 1-year deal. He has started 12 games in 3 years BECAUSE OF, AND ONLY BECAUSE OF, injuries.

He is a backup swing tackle. That is why he is here.

He is not going to factor in to NYG draft plans at all.
RE: They  
jeff57 : 3/27/2020 7:20 pm : link
In comment 14851790 Toth029 said:
Quote:
Also signed a LB and have a young kid inside, plus have Peppers and Love at S. The logic there isn't sound.

I do fully believe it's Simmons or OT though.


Love is not the answer.
If Tua is off the board  
AcesUp : 3/27/2020 7:21 pm : link
I'd take a 3 to move down a couple of spots, I wouldn't even get greedy if the fallback is Simmons or OT.

As long as it isn't for Brown. There's a clear hole in the trigger mans thought process if that is who we land on with our premium draft pick.
RE: The Scout that said this...  
Sy'56 : 3/27/2020 7:22 pm : link
In comment 14851844 LBH15 said:
Quote:


Quote:


One scout said: "They kept Nate Solder and added an OK right tackle in [Cameron] Fleming. I think they're set up to wait on a tackle."




should be demoted to scouting the Alaska-region.

In just two short sentences he managed to not understand that Solder's cap hit is greater than his value as a LT, overstate Fleming as a 16-game starter and understate that the draft is for longer term investing in things such as OL.


A scout did not say that - Matt made it up
The Logic Behind Simmons  
Big Blue Beerguy : 3/27/2020 7:55 pm : link
I can see some logic behind Simmons. Let's start with the assumption (because I certainly don't know enough to say otherwise) that the draftnicks are right and that none of the offensive tackles (or WRs, etc.) are as likely to succeed in the NFL as Young, Burrows, Okudah, Simmons and Brown. Analytics indicate that the likelihood of picking "blue chip" players is vastly better at the top of Round 1 of the draft - to me that says those five are the best (but certainly not sure-thing) bets. Conversely, the probability curve for getting good/above average players is much flatter. So if you want to plug more holes and put less weight on getting a top (pro-bowl/all-pro, etc.) player, you trade down. The series of articles from Hogs Heaven (Pt. 3 linked here), the Redskins site, lays this out well.

In my mind, I want to plug more holes, and offensive tackle is a bigger need than any of the "top five" except edge rusher (likely he's gone by pick #4). So my gut says if Young or Burrows are gone at #4, best bet is trade down, get additional picks, and take a good (but not consensus top draft candidate) offensive tackle later in Round 1. But if we find no takers for a trade down (and many of the trade-down scenarios I see are highly fanciful), then the question is whether to over-draft an offensive tackle or take a consensus top five/six candidate like Simmons or Brown, even if they do not play at a position of glaring need (like offensive tackle or edge rusher). There is strong logic - "best player available" - for taking Simmons.

In addition, of the "top 4" defensive players, Simmons seems the best fit for the Giants, outside of Young. Okudah and Brown both play positions where we have spent considerable draft and free agency resources in the past two years. Simmons can play multiple roles, which seems a good match for the general philosophy of Joe Judge and Pat Graham. And, let's face it, wouldn't it be nice to have someone who can excel at covering tight ends and running backs?

So I see the logic, especially if we don't find a trade down partner.
Stats, Bias and the Draft, Pt. 3 - ( New Window )
No need to draft an olinemen for your supposed franchise QB,  
Silver Spoon : 3/27/2020 7:58 pm : link
another putrid front line will be just fine.
If Simmons is the pick, I will be super excited  
Jim in Forest Hills : 3/27/2020 8:07 pm : link
Because I literally have no idea what he”ll do on the field.
i think its simmons too  
mpinmaine : 3/27/2020 8:26 pm : link
but i am hoping for an OT
Hard to Draft Good Football Players  
Samiam : 3/27/2020 8:36 pm : link
Extra hard to draft great football players. Extra extra hard to draft good football players at a particular position. Extra extra extra hard to draft great football players at a particular position. If they take an OT with the 4th pick, or any pick if Simmons is available, they better have that OT rated at the same level as Simmons. For what this is worth, I miss the days when the Giants had a dominant defense.
Take the BPA in this and every draft  
SGMen : 3/27/2020 8:38 pm : link
I would NOT be shocked if it was Simmons, Okudah, or Young if he fell due to QB's being taken early!

Simmons has a rare skillset but he isn't "Mr. Sure thing" either so there is a shade of risk. However, I think he can be a demon blitzing and certainly covering. I think he projects to NFL SS or possibly even a big FS.
RE: RE: They  
Saquads26 : 3/27/2020 8:50 pm : link
In comment 14851893 jeff57 said:
Quote:
In comment 14851790 Toth029 said:


Quote:


Also signed a LB and have a young kid inside, plus have Peppers and Love at S. The logic there isn't sound.

I do fully believe it's Simmons or OT though.



Love is not the answer.


😂😂😂😂😂
RE: RE: If Simmons goes #3  
Rjanyg : 3/27/2020 9:03 pm : link
In comment 14851809 JonC said:
Quote:
In comment 14851804 Carl in CT said:


Quote:


Brown likely the pick. Trust me (if no trade down).



I've speculated and heard the same.


This is my biggest fear. Good player but we are loaded at interior DL. We need Edge or play maker
If they trade Tomlinson  
Sy'56 : 3/27/2020 9:07 pm : link
Brown makes sense
RE: RE: The Scout that said this...  
LBH15 : 3/27/2020 9:10 pm : link
In comment 14851896 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
In comment 14851844 LBH15 said:


Quote:




Quote:


One scout said: "They kept Nate Solder and added an OK right tackle in [Cameron] Fleming. I think they're set up to wait on a tackle."




should be demoted to scouting the Alaska-region.

In just two short sentences he managed to not understand that Solder's cap hit is greater than his value as a LT, overstate Fleming as a 16-game starter and understate that the draft is for longer term investing in things such as OL.



A scout did not say that - Matt made it up


The NYG front office takes a lot of crap, but they are not waiting on a Tackle based on this rational.

If they do, then they should take a lot of crap.
RE: If they trade Tomlinson  
The_Boss : 3/27/2020 9:11 pm : link
In comment 14851959 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
Brown makes sense


What sort of market is there for him? Recoup a third we lost in the LW trade?
But  
AcesUp : 3/27/2020 9:21 pm : link
What is Tomlinson bringing back in a trade in a contract year? A 4? That's probably optimistic. The league doesn't value interior DL like the Giants do, Campbell and Snacks got a 5. I get that they were older...but they were also the best. Just a 5. I don't see Tomlinson fetching anything meaningful on his last year.

I'd sign Tomlinson at 10m/yr and grab an OT/Simmons instead of taking Brown at 8m/yr and a 4-5th/rounder. Outside of Tomlinson being a vestige of Reese, I don't understand why he wouldn't be a priority for this staff and a guy that closes the door on interior DL prospects.


RE: No need to draft an olinemen for your supposed franchise QB,  
Optimus-NY : 3/27/2020 9:34 pm : link
In comment 14851910 Silver Spoon said:
Quote:
another putrid front line will be just fine.


Word up. Trade down 1 pr a few spots and pick up another 2nd rounder, but an OT is the target for RD 1. I would draft a Center in RD 2 as well.
RE: RE: No need to draft an olinemen for your supposed franchise QB,  
GiantsFan84 : 3/27/2020 10:19 pm : link
In comment 14851978 Optimus-NY said:
Quote:
In comment 14851910 Silver Spoon said:


Quote:


another putrid front line will be just fine.



Word up. Trade down 1 pr a few spots and pick up another 2nd rounder, but an OT is the target for RD 1. I would draft a Center in RD 2 as well.


Agree w this 100%
RE: If Simmons goes #3  
LauderdaleMatty : 3/27/2020 10:59 pm : link
In comment 14851804 Carl in CT said:
Quote:
Brown likely the pick. Trust me (if no trade down).


If Det turns down a trade at 3 Gettleman will get a kings ransom for that 4th pick. Both Miami and the Chargers will be going for Tua.
RE: Imagine  
Ned In Atlanta : 3/27/2020 11:31 pm : link
In comment 14851794 Nine-Tails said:
Quote:
Thinking Nate Solder and Cam Fleming means you could wait on a tackle. More like a billboard asking for help


This is so accurate. But the defense also desperately needs a player like Simmons. This is why I hope that Gettlemans tenuous job status doesn’t result in the team making shortsighted decisions. The team has so many needs. And he largely made his bed by halting the rebuilding and acquiescing to two years of “retool, not rebuild.”
Of course they wil take Simmons or Okudah.  
TMS : 3/27/2020 11:56 pm : link
with the 4th pick in the draft. We will get Ol help later in the draft or develop it. This is a no brainer. for everyone almost.
RE: Big Blue '56:  
Big Rick in FL : 3/27/2020 11:59 pm : link
In comment 14851874 Torrag said:
Quote:
So true. The annual 'the Giants will do this or like this guy' etc is speculative. And every year there are those that believe 'someone knew' conspiracy nuts. No one knew jack shit.

There are only a few possible conclusions and with hundreds if not thousands of people putting in their guesses you know what? A lot of them will be right. Even on BBI. Haha.

Now what they 'should do' is draft an OT in Round 1. It's the best class in many years with multiple Top 10 prospects to choose from. We've a shit ton invested in Jones and Barkley. It just makes too much sense for me to put my chips on a different position.


Idk how you can say no one knew jack shit. I believe it was Charles Robinson who tweeted that we had Daniel Jones as our top rated QB. I'd have to look, but I believe Hitdog called us drafting him at 6. Don't remember if it was Hitdog or someone else, but someone put it out that Dexter Lawrence was the favorite for the 17th pick.
RE: If they trade Tomlinson  
mphbullet36 : 3/28/2020 1:02 am : link
In comment 14851959 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
Brown makes sense


I still disagree with that. You would then have a a 16 mm dollar cap hit player + 2 1st round picks (lawerence and now Brown). And all 3 don't get to the QB in pass rushing situations consistently. So again the allocation for a non premium position makes little sense to me.

The Giants still would have protection issues for there QB not addressing OT, you still can't rush the passer because you are weak on the edge. And you stil can't defend the middle of the field because you have very little speed at LB.

You can't keep pumping assets into the interior D-line. Especially when a couple of those guys don't even see the field in passing situatins with 3-WR sets which is literally 50% of the game now.

BPA  
Breeze_94 : 3/28/2020 2:08 am : link
is such a made up theory.

We should use-
BPATFAN- Best player available that fills a need.
HVPA- Highest valued player available.

Very few teams can go into a draft in a position to take the very best player available, regardless of position.

Also, BPA isn't necessarily followed because some positions just have more value then others.
The addition of Toilolo  
hammock man : 3/28/2020 5:44 am : link
gives strength to one of the tackles if we don't go first round OT. This could make the Simmons choice viable. I hope so because He'll be fun to watch. It's been awhile since our defense had a player we couldn't wait to come on the field.
ZERO chance Brown is the pick  
ZogZerg : 3/28/2020 8:14 am : link
You guys are going batty with this thought.

There is a chance that Simmons could be the pick,
But, it's pretty obvious with what the Giants have done in FA that they are going OT at 4,5 or 6.
RE: Remember....  
Gatorade Dunk : 3/28/2020 8:25 am : link
In comment 14851850 edavisiii said:
Quote:
we have 9 more picks after #4

3 of those are in the last 18 picks of the entire draft.
Miller knows  
ryanmkeane : 3/28/2020 10:02 am : link
absolutely nothing and has somehow convinced people on Twitter that he is connected. I give him kudos for making people believe it though.
Also if we took  
ryanmkeane : 3/28/2020 10:02 am : link
Brown at 4 I would not be mad. The dude is an absolute beast.
RE: RE: Big Blue '56:  
Scuzzlebutt : 3/28/2020 10:46 am : link
In comment 14852010 Big Rick in FL said:
Quote:
In comment 14851874 Torrag said:


Quote:


So true. The annual 'the Giants will do this or like this guy' etc is speculative. And every year there are those that believe 'someone knew' conspiracy nuts. No one knew jack shit.

There are only a few possible conclusions and with hundreds if not thousands of people putting in their guesses you know what? A lot of them will be right. Even on BBI. Haha.

Now what they 'should do' is draft an OT in Round 1. It's the best class in many years with multiple Top 10 prospects to choose from. We've a shit ton invested in Jones and Barkley. It just makes too much sense for me to put my chips on a different position.



Idk how you can say no one knew jack shit. I believe it was Charles Robinson who tweeted that we had Daniel Jones as our top rated QB. I'd have to look, but I believe Hitdog called us drafting him at 6. Don't remember if it was Hitdog or someone else, but someone put it out that Dexter Lawrence was the favorite for the 17th pick.


So many things get said between all the mock drafts, etc. someone is bound to be right.
RE: Take the BPA in this and every draft  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 3/28/2020 10:56 am : link
In comment 14851936 SGMen said:
Quote:
I would NOT be shocked if it was Simmons, Okudah, or Young if he fell due to QB's being taken early!

Simmons has a rare skillset but he isn't "Mr. Sure thing" either so there is a shade of risk. However, I think he can be a demon blitzing and certainly covering. I think he projects to NFL SS or possibly even a big FS.

My biggest concern is that he doesn't play with his hair on fire, which is what you love to see out of a LB. He's smooth, almost in a bad way.

However he is so versatile and has such an interesting skillset, you can man him up a against elite TEs or prototypical X receivers and shut them down.
Not saying he is right about this but Miller does a pretty good job  
Eric on Li : 3/28/2020 10:58 am : link
it's popular to bag him because he's been really successful, but he does a pretty good job, has some interesting opinions, and has been right both with his intel and analysis as much as any of the other amateur 'draftniks'.

I don't believe he's making something up out of thin air but I also believe just about everyone this time of year is embellishing stuff they are hearing that isn't even all that accurate in the first place.
.  
Kev in Cali : 3/28/2020 12:29 pm : link
Do you think teams are already in cahoots with one another, scheming on a plan based on the very same scenarios we all discuss everyday?

Or do they only have time during the draft to talk?
the rationale behind the BPA theory is based on  
markky : 3/28/2020 1:09 pm : link
1. you never know which prospects will succeed in the NFL and to what degree, so you want to pick players with the highest chance of success.

2. your needs this year are unlikely to be your needs 3 years from now when the player matures, hits his peak, etc.
RE: RE: If Simmons goes #3  
Nomad Crow on the Madison : 3/28/2020 7:15 pm : link
In comment 14851995 LauderdaleMatty said:
Quote:
In comment 14851804 Carl in CT said:


Quote:


Brown likely the pick. Trust me (if no trade down).



If Det turns down a trade at 3 Gettleman will get a kings ransom for that 4th pick. Both Miami and the Chargers will be going for Tua.


Apparently, there is lots of concern about Tea and his injuries. Some think Herbert and Jordan Love might pressure that #2 QB spot (in the draft).
That should say  
Nomad Crow on the Madison : 3/28/2020 7:17 pm : link
Tua, not Tea
RE: They  
Paulie Walnuts : 3/28/2020 11:56 pm : link
In comment 14851790 Toth029 said:
Quote:
Also signed a LB and have a young kid inside, plus have Peppers and Love at S. The logic there isn't sound.

I do fully believe it's Simmons or OT though.
this
RE: RE: Take the BPA in this and every draft  
SGMen : 3/29/2020 6:03 am : link
In comment 14852156 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
In comment 14851936 SGMen said:


Quote:


I would NOT be shocked if it was Simmons, Okudah, or Young if he fell due to QB's being taken early!

Simmons has a rare skillset but he isn't "Mr. Sure thing" either so there is a shade of risk. However, I think he can be a demon blitzing and certainly covering. I think he projects to NFL SS or possibly even a big FS.


My biggest concern is that he doesn't play with his hair on fire, which is what you love to see out of a LB. He's smooth, almost in a bad way.

However he is so versatile and has such an interesting skillset, you can man him up a against elite TEs or prototypical X receivers and shut them down.
Coach, I honestly see Simmons more and more as a standout FS who is moved around to SS, WLB (nickel LB) and the like to create matchup problems. I don't think he is a POA LB type at all. He is better in space using his skills that way.

If we don't trade down, and Simmons and Okudah are there at #4, well you still take Okudah whom I believe is a "sure fire rookie blue chipper" whereas Simmons has upside but isn't "as sure" a stud. IMHO
this team is always bringing O line help  
Jersey55 : 3/31/2020 5:05 pm : link
and I think its passed time for us to get a defensive playmaker, Simmons...
To me, Simmons  
Bill2 : 3/31/2020 6:24 pm : link
requires special scheming.

That is different than being scheme flexible
The trade down crew...  
Amtoft : 3/31/2020 6:27 pm : link
Don't trade down and trade again and trade some more down and lose a potential super star. Trade down when the rankings are close, but if you think Simmons, Young, or Okudah is special you don't take chances just to get an extra two and a 4. I wouldn't go below Chargers.
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