Matt Miller: Scouts Think NYG will Draft Isaiah Simmons

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Also signed a LB and have a young kid inside, plus have Peppers and Love at S. The logic there isn't sound.

I do fully believe it's Simmons or OT though.

Judge witnessing the Patriots win the Super Bowl in 2017 with Solder and Fleming as their tackles? Who knows, I hope it works out, if true

gain an extra #2 and do as you wish, we need a helluva lot more than Simmons.

Thinking Nate Solder and Cam Fleming means you could wait on a tackle. More like a billboard asking for help

He’s the best value at 4 pending what DET does

At this point. Giants are looking for a game wrecking defensive leader in the mould of Strahan. Young and Simmonds are the two players most able to fill that role, and Young won’t be there.

In comment 14851794 Nine-Tails said:

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Thinking Nate Solder and Cam Fleming means you could wait on a tackle. More like a billboard asking for help

Seriously. We may well draft Simmons, but anyone who thinks it’s bc the Giants are set at tackle is out of their mind.

Brown likely the pick. Trust me (if no trade down).

will do

In comment 14851804 Carl in CT said:

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Brown likely the pick. Trust me (if no trade down).

I've speculated and heard the same.

Is worthy of the #4 overall pick in this draft.

In comment 14851804 Carl in CT said:

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Brown likely the pick. Trust me (if no trade down).

You hearing they like Simmons?

That’s true and we do get him.

In comment 14851804 Carl in CT said:

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Brown likely the pick. Trust me (if no trade down).

With the presumption that Young doesn't miraculously fall to us and Okudah is gone to Detroit, I have no problem with Brown at #4 with the assumption that only defense is considered for our pick. I really want an OL, but if for some reason the logic stated above prevails and they are only looking at defense, then take Brown.

In comment 14851800 BlueManCrew said:

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At this point. Giants are looking for a game wrecking defensive leader in the mould of Strahan. Young and Simmonds are the two players most able to fill that role, and Young won’t be there.

I don’t see Wayne Simmonds being able to wreck a game. I don’t think Isaiah Simmons has that ability either.

In comment 14851809 JonC said:

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In comment 14851804 Carl in CT said: Quote: Brown likely the pick. Trust me (if no trade down). I've speculated and heard the same.

I would think everyone in the top 10 is high on Brown, but with Hill, Tomlinson, Lawrence, and LW, where would he fit? If they didn’t have intentions on bringing back LW, then I could see it.

In comment 14851792 JonC said:

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gain an extra #2 and do as you wish, we need a helluva lot more than Simmons.

+1

DG couldn't sell that to the media or the fan base. They have so many interior players already.

they have so many needs and they are going to stash another interior DL when they already have Williams, Lawerence, Tomlinson, and Hill. They also just signed Austin Johnson. They are not picking a guy in the top 5 that would play less then 50% of the snaps in a year that if the giants don't win DG will be fired.

In comment 14851818 The_Boss said:

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In comment 14851809 JonC said: Quote: In comment 14851804 Carl in CT said: Quote: Brown likely the pick. Trust me (if no trade down). I've speculated and heard the same. I would think everyone in the top 10 is high on Brown, but with Hill, Tomlinson, Lawrence, and LW, where would he fit? If they didn’t have intentions on bringing back LW, then I could see it.

Agreed. Like I said above. DG's job on the line he isn't going to draft a guy in the top 5 that wouldn't even be a starter on this roster. He needs a major impact player whether that is Simmons or a starting Tackle. Or a trade down that acquires more high end picks that will be starters as well.

Guaranteed an excellent player with 1st pick. Trade down 2 spots ideal.

picks. Otherwise we take who is left. If both are there it will be interesting to say the least. Both are top four talent and BPAs. DG will have a tough call.

In comment 14851837 TMS said:

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picks. Otherwise we take who is left. If both are there it will be interesting to say the least. Both are top four talent and BPAs. DG will have a tough call.

If Simmons and Okudah are not there, that means one of Burrow or Young has slipped down to us... either way, that would be a GOLD MINE for us... we either get Young or some team trades a king's ransom to us to get Burrow.

Too bad there is no way that scenario is happening.

and Fleming mean they won't take an OT? Nonsense. Both are likely gone after this year, certainly Solder.

There is no place for Brown, unless they trade Tomlinson on draft day.

The most likely scenario is either an OT at #4 or after a small trade down, probably Wirfs.

if Detroit trades out should the Giants have no good offers to #4

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One scout said: "They kept Nate Solder and added an OK right tackle in [Cameron] Fleming. I think they're set up to wait on a tackle."

should be demoted to scouting the Alaska-region.

In just two short sentences he managed to not understand that Solder's cap hit is greater than his value as a LT, overstate Fleming as a 16-game starter and understate that the draft is for longer term investing in things such as OL.

looks like a monster, but I do agree that it's concerning having two first rounders, a franchise tagged player, a third rounder and a 2nd rounder all at DL in a 3-4. Seems like a very poor allocation of resources.

In comment 14851792 JonC said:

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gain an extra #2 and do as you wish, we need a helluva lot more than Simmons.

Relying on Soldier and Fleming is not a good sign to the health and future of Jones and Barkley.

we have 9 more picks after #4

he should be fired on the spot.

I know he's possibly worthy of 4. Absolutely not for the Giants though. If you have a 50 dollars to spend on dinner, you don't spend 40 dollars on one side dish.

and what do they want. Simmons, an OT or a QB.

And adding Flemming on a one year deal doesn’t mean they are set up to wait on the tackle position. Some very strange reasoning. Simmons May be the pick but that isn’t because we solidified the tackle position temporarily

If they take Brown, why would they? They have enough DT, and not OT/Edge/LB. DT should be the last 1st round possibility on their minds.

In comment 14851786 Ivan15 said:

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That would be nice if DG is going for Best athlete no matter who it is, after trading down.
But we also know if he has his sights set on a specific player he'll grab him from the #4 spot so as to not be disappointed.

I've watched just about every one of Simmon's games; from the tall and somewhat clumsy safety who looked lost at times or wiffed on a tackle but still showed his potential on the next play; to Venable's secret weapon - no one knew where he'd line up, or even at any spot what role he was assigned.

I agree that he will be effective only in the "right" scheme, but from what I've heard from Judge and Graham, the Giants defense is the "right" spot.

So true. The annual 'the Giants will do this or like this guy' etc is speculative. And every year there are those that believe 'someone knew' conspiracy nuts. No one knew jack shit.

There are only a few possible conclusions and with hundreds if not thousands of people putting in their guesses you know what? A lot of them will be right. Even on BBI. Haha.

Now what they 'should do' is draft an OT in Round 1. It's the best class in many years with multiple Top 10 prospects to choose from. We've a shit ton invested in Jones and Barkley. It just makes too much sense for me to put my chips on a different position.

We're playing for keeps here,can't hit the reset button

In comment 14851844 LBH15 said:

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Quote: One scout said: "They kept Nate Solder and added an OK right tackle in [Cameron] Fleming. I think they're set up to wait on a tackle." should be demoted to scouting the Alaska-region. In just two short sentences he managed to not understand that Solder's cap hit is greater than his value as a LT, overstate Fleming as a 16-game starter and understate that the draft is for longer term investing in things such as OL.

Seriously

In comment 14851844 LBH15 said:

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Quote: One scout said: "They kept Nate Solder and added an OK right tackle in [Cameron] Fleming. I think they're set up to wait on a tackle." should be demoted to scouting the Alaska-region. In just two short sentences he managed to not understand that Solder's cap hit is greater than his value as a LT, overstate Fleming as a 16-game starter and understate that the draft is for longer term investing in things such as OL.

It is worse. Jerry Reese is unemployed.

In comment 14851792 JonC said:

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gain an extra #2 and do as you wish, we need a helluva lot more than Simmons.

ding, ding, ding, ding...we have a winner...at least as far as I am concerned.

In comment 14851852 AcesUp said:

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he should be fired on the spot.

if he was planning to take Brown he should be fired right now before he screws up the pick.

Fleming signed a 1-year deal. He has started 12 games in 3 years BECAUSE OF, AND ONLY BECAUSE OF, injuries.

He is a backup swing tackle. That is why he is here.

He is not going to factor in to NYG draft plans at all.

In comment 14851790 Toth029 said:

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Also signed a LB and have a young kid inside, plus have Peppers and Love at S. The logic there isn't sound. I do fully believe it's Simmons or OT though.

Love is not the answer.

I'd take a 3 to move down a couple of spots, I wouldn't even get greedy if the fallback is Simmons or OT.

As long as it isn't for Brown. There's a clear hole in the trigger mans thought process if that is who we land on with our premium draft pick.

In comment 14851844 LBH15 said:

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Quote: One scout said: "They kept Nate Solder and added an OK right tackle in [Cameron] Fleming. I think they're set up to wait on a tackle." should be demoted to scouting the Alaska-region. In just two short sentences he managed to not understand that Solder's cap hit is greater than his value as a LT, overstate Fleming as a 16-game starter and understate that the draft is for longer term investing in things such as OL.

A scout did not say that - Matt made it up

I can see some logic behind Simmons. Let's start with the assumption (because I certainly don't know enough to say otherwise) that the draftnicks are right and that none of the offensive tackles (or WRs, etc.) are as likely to succeed in the NFL as Young, Burrows, Okudah, Simmons and Brown. Analytics indicate that the likelihood of picking "blue chip" players is vastly better at the top of Round 1 of the draft - to me that says those five are the best (but certainly not sure-thing) bets. Conversely, the probability curve for getting good/above average players is much flatter. So if you want to plug more holes and put less weight on getting a top (pro-bowl/all-pro, etc.) player, you trade down. The series of articles from Hogs Heaven (Pt. 3 linked here), the Redskins site, lays this out well.

In my mind, I want to plug more holes, and offensive tackle is a bigger need than any of the "top five" except edge rusher (likely he's gone by pick #4). So my gut says if Young or Burrows are gone at #4, best bet is trade down, get additional picks, and take a good (but not consensus top draft candidate) offensive tackle later in Round 1. But if we find no takers for a trade down (and many of the trade-down scenarios I see are highly fanciful), then the question is whether to over-draft an offensive tackle or take a consensus top five/six candidate like Simmons or Brown, even if they do not play at a position of glaring need (like offensive tackle or edge rusher). There is strong logic - "best player available" - for taking Simmons.

In addition, of the "top 4" defensive players, Simmons seems the best fit for the Giants, outside of Young. Okudah and Brown both play positions where we have spent considerable draft and free agency resources in the past two years. Simmons can play multiple roles, which seems a good match for the general philosophy of Joe Judge and Pat Graham. And, let's face it, wouldn't it be nice to have someone who can excel at covering tight ends and running backs?

So I see the logic, especially if we don't find a trade down partner.
Stats, Bias and the Draft, Pt. 3 - ( New Window )

another putrid front line will be just fine.

Because I literally have no idea what he”ll do on the field.

but i am hoping for an OT

Extra hard to draft great football players. Extra extra hard to draft good football players at a particular position. Extra extra extra hard to draft great football players at a particular position. If they take an OT with the 4th pick, or any pick if Simmons is available, they better have that OT rated at the same level as Simmons. For what this is worth, I miss the days when the Giants had a dominant defense.