Here is all 22 looks at both Becton and Wills...my 2 favs

I'd be happy with either of these guys. Wirfs not so much. I'm far from an expert, but Kollman's comparison of Wills and Wirfs really put me off the latter. If LT was set and we had a crying need at RT, I'd say, sure: Wirfs. But I have to say, I found Kollman's analysis scary.

He is going to be a very good guard, but his arm length scares me...we will have the "pick of the litter" at OT this year...Becton could scare them off due to the recent Ereck Flowers debacle, but he is the one with the highest ceiling, but I think Wills is the safest pick and will be a fine player in his own right.

He doesn’t have the “flash” plays where he chucks a defender 5 yards like Becton does (multiple times) but doesn’t have bad reps and wins his assigments.

In comment 14852488 Russ in Queens, NYC said:

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I'd be happy with either of these guys. Wirfs not so much. I'm far from an expert, but Kollman's comparison of Wills and Wirfs really put me off the latter. If LT was set and we had a crying need at RT, I'd say, sure: Wirfs. But I have to say, I found Kollman's analysis scary.

Cosell and Tucker and Jeremiah all had close to the same take on Wirfs in pass pro. Tremendous athleticism doesn't translate he likes tight and coiled in pass pro sets. Becton and Wills much more smooth and natural looking in pass sets in space.

In comment 14852495 Biteymax22 said:

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He doesn’t have the “flash” plays where he chucks a defender 5 yards like Becton does (multiple times) but doesn’t have bad reps and wins his assigments.

Which is what you want at LT. Consistent wins or stalemates vs. A few dominant reps mixed in with total whiffs or quick losses

In comment 14852498 MeadowlandsMike said:

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In comment 14852495 Biteymax22 said: Quote: He doesn’t have the “flash” plays where he chucks a defender 5 yards like Becton does (multiple times) but doesn’t have bad reps and wins his assigments. Which is what you want at LT. Consistent wins or stalemates vs. A few dominant reps mixed in with total whiffs or quick losses

Agree 100%. If I were Daniel Jones and you had me watch these films then asked me who I wanted blocking for me, it would be Wills by a landslide.

what the debate is. Maybe I'm wrong but I think is the delta between their ceilings is much narrower than the delta between their floors.

carry the same scar tissue re Flowers that the old regime did -- and fans still do. I trust they'll make OT draft decisions objectively.

then Wirfs or Wills if you are looking for a successor to Soldier.

In comment 14852522 GFAN52 said:

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then Wirfs or Wills if you are looking for a successor to Soldier.

Yes but Wills is so smooth that I don't see an issue with him on either side granted he has enough time to prepare. What I mean by that is if he has all offseason to prepare then he should be fine. If he is our RT and Solder gets injured I wouldn't feel the same way if he were to move in the middle of the season.

In comment 14852526 robbieballs2003 said:

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In comment 14852522 GFAN52 said: Quote: then Wirfs or Wills if you are looking for a successor to Soldier. Yes but Wills is so smooth that I don't see an issue with him on either side granted he has enough time to prepare. What I mean by that is if he has all offseason to prepare then he should be fine. If he is our RT and Solder gets injured I wouldn't feel the same way if he were to move in the middle of the season.

It's hard to say. I'd much rather draft a LT that has played that position in college. If they are comfortable drafting a Wirfs or Wills to be the RT of the future, then so be it. Then perhaps, they can draft a future LT (a player that has played LT in college) in rounds 2-4 for example.

In comment 14852522 GFAN52 said:

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then Wirfs or Wills if you are looking for a successor to Soldier.

Bingo, my thinking as well.

In comment 14852488 Russ in Queens, NYC said:

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I'd be happy with either of these guys. Wirfs not so much. I'm far from an expert, but Kollman's comparison of Wills and Wirfs really put me off the latter. If LT was set and we had a crying need at RT, I'd say, sure: Wirfs. But I have to say, I found Kollman's analysis scary.

Kollman cherry picked a few bad reps from Wirfs and a few great reps from Wills and made his comparison.
It’s disingenuous to label a player based on such a small sample size. I’ve watched a lot of Wirfs film and he really doesn’t have much of a problem with staying square in his angle sets as Kollman will have you believe.

More evidence of bias is when Wirfs initiates a reach block and doesn’t get his head across, Voch lights him up. But when Mekhi Becton does the absolute same thing he’s praised for being able to move so well with a 360 lb frame.

Tough to call this honest scouting, imo

Great Feet and bvery fluid movement. Not an enormous powerhouse, but he can move and be very versatile.

Becton...Huge, Huge Man and unusual athlete. He can move his feet, but there's not a single technical thing that He needs to do that He does well. I would need to ahve a heavy belief in him and his horizon to take him anywhere near where they will be drafting.

Keep in mind if the new RB coach too and his familiarity with Wills.

Becton is too raw and too much of a risk to take that high.

In comment 14852539 aGiantGuy said:

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In comment 14852488 Russ in Queens, NYC said: Quote: I'd be happy with either of these guys. Wirfs not so much. I'm far from an expert, but Kollman's comparison of Wills and Wirfs really put me off the latter. If LT was set and we had a crying need at RT, I'd say, sure: Wirfs. But I have to say, I found Kollman's analysis scary. Kollman cherry picked a few bad reps from Wirfs and a few great reps from Wills and made his comparison. It’s disingenuous to label a player based on such a small sample size. I’ve watched a lot of Wirfs film and he really doesn’t have much of a problem with staying square in his angle sets as Kollman will have you believe. More evidence of bias is when Wirfs initiates a reach block and doesn’t get his head across, Voch lights him up. But when Mekhi Becton does the absolute same thing he’s praised for being able to move so well with a 360 lb frame. Tough to call this honest scouting, imo

Jeremiah, Cosell , Tucker, and other pretty good draft guys see the same thing on Wirfs. PFF talks about it as one of his weaknesses too. While both recieved top coaching between Wills and Wirfs, Wirfs for all his athleticism looks nowhere near as natural in pass pro as Wills does.

Another Willis fan.
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 14852586 jeff57 said:

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Another Willis fan. Link - ( New Window )

Is their future at RT or LT is what I wonder how the Giants see them.

In comment 14852586 jeff57 said:

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Another Willis fan. Link - ( New Window )

Kollman and Voch also agree. Wills over Wirfs. Most of draft network sees Wills over Wirfs too.

Wills, Becton, WIrfs, and Simmons. I'd pick Wills and plug him in for 10+ years. Simmons would be my second choice.

Being a lefty was why Wills played RT

And move to LT in 2021.

Doesn’t come from who’s the better prospect. If you like Wills over Wirfs, that’s fine. But when the reasoning behind it isn’t consistent and shows obvious bias, I sour on these draft analysts.

Just like when we signed Blake Martinez and there were 2 videos reviewing the same game. In the same play, one guy praised him for his reaction time and the other guy just roasted him. I posture that one of the analyst was a heavily biased Green Bay fan that wanted to blame losses on personnel before even watching the film.

than he was as a Packer because our DL is a much better group against the run than the Green Bay DL. You heard it hear. He together with Connelly will be very good as our ILBs.

Dave T has Wirfs #4 on his big board ahead of the other 3 because, in part, of his ability to blocks at the 2nd level! Plus he is young and is not done growing.

Dave T has Wirfs #4 on his big board ahead of the other 3 because, in part, of his ability to blocks at the 2nd level! Plus he is young and is not done growing.

In comment 14852539 aGiantGuy said:

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In comment 14852488 Russ in Queens, NYC said: Quote: I'd be happy with either of these guys. Wirfs not so much. I'm far from an expert, but Kollman's comparison of Wills and Wirfs really put me off the latter. If LT was set and we had a crying need at RT, I'd say, sure: Wirfs. But I have to say, I found Kollman's analysis scary. Kollman cherry picked a few bad reps from Wirfs and a few great reps from Wills and made his comparison. It’s disingenuous to label a player based on such a small sample size. I’ve watched a lot of Wirfs film and he really doesn’t have much of a problem with staying square in his angle sets as Kollman will have you believe. More evidence of bias is when Wirfs initiates a reach block and doesn’t get his head across, Voch lights him up. But when Mekhi Becton does the absolute same thing he’s praised for being able to move so well with a 360 lb frame. Tough to call this honest scouting, imo

Fair enough. As I said, I certainly wouldn't advertise myself as an expert. I believed (erroneously, it seems) that the plays Kollman selected were representative of both players. Thanks for pointing out what appears to be a flaw in his method. I'll start looking at this stuff with a more critical eye.

Wills, Becton, Thomas, Wirfs. I hope that's the way the Giants have it, too.

In comment 14852498 MeadowlandsMike said:

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In comment 14852495 Biteymax22 said: Quote: He doesn’t have the “flash” plays where he chucks a defender 5 yards like Becton does (multiple times) but doesn’t have bad reps and wins his assigments. Which is what you want at LT. Consistent wins or stalemates vs. A few dominant reps mixed in with total whiffs or quick losses

Find me tape of Becton whiffing or taking a quick loss
I eould be fine with Wills, and his technique is inarguably better but that argument is nit fair to Becton.

The fact that Wills' technique is perfect, with similar production, is a point for Becton imo.

Wills is a fine player and probably plug and plat at RT but when you consider upside and positional value I am leaning towards Becton. There's no guarantuee Wills can play LT and he just doesn't have the upside of saquon running behind him being a sure thing

at pick four. We need a starter,day one.

In comment 14852783 edavisiii said:

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Dave T has Wirfs #4 on his big board ahead of the other 3 because, in part, of his ability to blocks at the 2nd level! Plus he is young and is not done growing.

This part; "Plus he is young and is not done growing." is partly what absolutely killed Marc Ross and Jerry Reese with 21 year old guys like Flowers and Apple - the assumption that young guys will get better with NFL coaching seems to vary greatly among individual prospects.

And your first parts, about the OT who performs better at the second level (run blocking), to my unprofessional eye Thomas is much better than the other 3, with Wills in second place.

The younger thing is definitely not an advantage nowadays with the metrics premium on performance above replacement value player.