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Is this forgotten QB on the Giants draft checklist?

YANKEE28 : 3/31/2020 1:19 am
In the years that Joe Judge worked for Bill Belichick, he certainly observed one thing- have a young high potential quarterback slowly grooming behind your starter. Whether it was Jimmy Garoppolo, Jacoby Brissett, or Jarrett Stidham, it seems that Belichick always saw the value of having a young high potential backup being developed for an NFL future role.

The Giants have 10 draft picks, and I expect the Giants to enter training camp with 4 quarterbacks by using a Day 3 Draft Pick to get the 4th-someone with high potential that can be developed.

Think back to January 1,2018. It was the Sugar Bowl, and Alabama would need to knock off the top team in the country, Clemson and its 12-1 record, to get the Tide to the Championship game. Jalen Hurt would be masterful for Alabama, with a convincing 24 to 6 upset victory.

The game would end the season for Clemson. But we would later learn it was also the end for the young quarterback who led Clemson to that outstanding 2017 season, Kelly Bryant.

In 2018, Clemson would turn the keys to the offense to an incredible young freshman quarterback, Trevor Lawrence, and see Bryant moved to the sidelines. Bryant could see what Clemson's addition of Lawrence meant to his future. Bryant would use his time wisely, earning his degree and knowing that he had football eligibility left as a graduate student for the 2019 season. He just had to find the right fit and the right coach at the right school.

Bryant's search was thorough, but at the end of the day, he felt most comfortable with a coach that had doubled as both the offensive coordinator and quarterbacks coach for a highly sought 2019 drafted quarterback, Drew Luck.

Luck was the quarterback for the University of Missouri, and that coach who would convince Kelly Bryant to get his football future back on the map in a final college season was Derek Dooley.

The team of Dooley and Kelly Bryant was hot right out of the gates. Though Missouri would lose the season opener to Wyoming, it was no fault of Bryant, who threw for 423 yards in his inaugural game. Next came 5 straight impressive wins for Missouri. Consider Bryant's stats last year after 6 games:

12 TD passes
Only 3 interceptions
A 66% completion record
An incredible 162.1 quarterback rating

But then the injury bug hit. A sprained knee against Troy followed by a nagging hamstring injury that hampered his play so much that he couldn't even suit up for the Georgia game.

It wouldn't be until the season was over that he would be back to full health. He was picked to play in the East West Shrine game. He had a great week of practice and was named the starter for the West team. He would go 8 for 13 and throw for 103 yards.

That performance really helped his real goal, getting an invitation to the NFL Combine. His Combine appearance was solid with the following results:

Ht 6' 3 1/8
Wt 229 pounds
Hands 9.5 inches
40 4.69 seconds
Vertical 35 inches

Kelly Bryant will not be a high priority top draft pick this April. His college career certainly had its up and downs. Put the ups working with Dooley, especially in the beginning of the season were noticeable. And lets remember that Bryant took Clemson to the # 1 ranking in college football in 2017 until their Sugar Bowl loss.

Could there be any better coach in the NFL to judge Bryant's future potential than Derek Dooley?

The Giants have a bunch of Day 3 picks. They also have a ton of positional needs more important than finding a developmental quartrback. But I think that Joe Judge will want to follow in the lessons from Bill Belichick. Have a high potential young backup to learn. Perhaps the Giants will use a 7th rounder, to see if Kelly Bryant can become their Mr. Relevant a few years down the road.

(and that in no way is a knock on Daniel Jones. Just look at the draft capital Belichick acquired after he developed Garoppolo and Brissett)





Frankly I think you're overrating both his play and his upside  
Torrag : 3/31/2020 2:35 am : link
I've seen a number of his starts and his play would best be described as uneven. I don't think he's a dynamic runner or thrower. I think his toughness is his greatest asset. Ultimately I'd predict he goes undrafted but will be a desirable UDFA for teams like the Giants looking to improve the depth and youth of the pipeline at the position.
I'd like to add it's a terrible depth pool at QB in this Draft  
Torrag : 3/31/2020 2:42 am : link
Bad year to go fishing for developmental guys. Very few intrigue me in the mid to late rounds. Maybe that helps him get the nod late on day 3.
There are several "names" at QB that have definitely fallen off  
George from PA : 3/31/2020 6:40 am : link
I would also put Fromm in that catagory.....as he too was touted as a top draft pick at one time.

I really have no idea how good or bad will these guys turn out, but we now start hearing their names in HS, and expect them to all develop into these studs....

Granted, a transition has started from the Bradys, Brees, Rivers, Big Ben, Eli...to the Mahomes, Jackson and hopefully Jones....so I do expect several young guys stepping up in the near future....
No thanks  
mdthedream : 3/31/2020 7:47 am : link
we need all the players we can get to help this team out. Stop wasting picks on QB that will never play.
I think the more important point is the Pats tendency to carry a third  
Ivan15 : 3/31/2020 7:56 am : link
QB.

Picking a QB to develop is like reaching into a grab bag blindfolded. When you pull out a prize, you still don’t know what you have. Tony Romo? Tom Brady? That’s why it is ridiculous to fret over why a team would carry 3 QBs, even Alex Tanney.
RE: I'd like to add it's a terrible depth pool at QB in this Draft  
Gatorade Dunk : 3/31/2020 8:13 am : link
In comment 14854747 Torrag said:
Quote:
Bad year to go fishing for developmental guys. Very few intrigue me in the mid to late rounds. Maybe that helps him get the nod late on day 3.

There are a few developmental guys in this draft that are interesting, IMO. Josh Love and Jake Luton in particular are two that I've been reading up on quite a bit.

Full disclosure, Love is only on my radar because of the PFF sleepers discussion on NFL radio a few days ago - he seems like a UDFA candidate whose only real knock is his size and his level of competition (but that's enough to make him a UDFA, obviously). Luton is the opposite - great size and played in a power 5 program (Oregon State) - he would make sense with one of our compensatory picks in the 7th, if he's still on the board.
RE: I think the more important point is the Pats tendency to carry a third  
Gatorade Dunk : 3/31/2020 8:19 am : link
In comment 14854784 Ivan15 said:
Quote:
QB.

Picking a QB to develop is like reaching into a grab bag blindfolded. When you pull out a prize, you still don’t know what you have. Tony Romo? Tom Brady? That’s why it is ridiculous to fret over why a team would carry 3 QBs, even Alex Tanney.

I agreed with you right up until then end. You're right that you don't always know what you have, but at a certain point, you can be pretty sure that you know what you don't have. Alex Tanney is not going to turn into Tom Brady, or Tony Romo, or even Jake Delhomme.

It's savvy to always be developing a QB on your roster. And you do sometimes need to mesh that with a veteran backup in order to provide some stability at the position while that development is happening (especially when it's your QB1 that you're focused on developing). But that doesn't mean that Tanney falls under the lotto ticket category.

Sometimes a middling journeyman isn't underrated - most of the time, he's just a middling journeyman. And when other teams have already had a chance to scratch the lottery ticket and figured out that there's no prize there, it's a waste of time to keep scratching the edges of the ticket to see what they might have missed.
RE: No thanks  
Gatorade Dunk : 3/31/2020 8:24 am : link
In comment 14854781 mdthedream said:
Quote:
we need all the players we can get to help this team out. Stop wasting picks on QB that will never play.

Tom Brady was drafted right around the same time that the Patriots gave Drew Bledsoe a 10-year, $103M contract. Brady was a QB that was drafted to never play.

You're going to carry at least one backup QB anyway, and quite often, you may carry two backup QBs. Some players - at any position - are drafted for depth and development. The same goes for QBs.

Are you suggesting that if you have an established starting QB, you should only pick up UDFA prospects to fill out the rest of your QB depth chart?

That seems like a foolish strategy to me, but if you have some more thoughts on it, I'd definitely be open to understanding your POV.
Conceptually, I like the OP  
NYG22 : 3/31/2020 8:26 am : link
But I like James Morgan as a late rounder and developmental QB.
Developmental QB isn’t the worst idea  
LBH15 : 3/31/2020 8:30 am : link
mentioned this before that since a new Offense is going in anyway, it would be efficient to have another young guy learn it along with DJ.

I know they picked up McCoy as veteran backup but you all better get used to idea that DJ is not Eli and he is likely going to get hurt.
RE: No thanks  
Mr. Bungle : 3/31/2020 8:42 am : link
In comment 14854781 mdthedream said:
Quote:
we need all the players we can get to help this team out. Stop wasting picks on QB that will never play.

Never play? Daniel Jones has already been injured.

The Eli years are over. The Giants need a QB2 who can start and win.
Nice thread YANKEE28  
X : 3/31/2020 9:07 am : link
Why not draft a development QB with a 7th? Giants probably won't because they need a lot more NFL talent to fill out the roster

BBI needs more thinkers like you. You always have quality info to share.
Belicheck  
Archer : 3/31/2020 9:24 am : link
Belicheck had Tom Brady who was in his thirties he knew there would be a transition to a young QB
The Giants have their young development QB on the roster.
It is always good to have competition but this is really low priority
I would rather use draft picks to find players who can help the team rather than hold a clipboard
Another  
AcidTest : 3/31/2020 9:39 am : link
great post. I am no longer a fan of day three QBs, so I don't think Bryant is for us, especially since we have so many other needs. But given how many seventh round picks we have, I wouldn't be opposed to using one on him. As you note, he has produced at the collegiate level, and against high quality competition.
Let's keep in mind...  
Southern Man : 3/31/2020 9:48 am : link
YANKEE28's intent with these posts is to interestingly present the rest of us with scenarios that might be attractive with our later round picks. It is not a recommendation he is making. I'm enjoying the series...thanks Y28!
Let's keep in mind...  
Southern Man : 3/31/2020 9:48 am : link
YANKEE28's intent with these posts is to interestingly present the rest of us with scenarios that might be attractive with our later round picks. It is not a recommendation he is making. I'm enjoying the series...thanks Y28!
RE: Belicheck  
Gatorade Dunk : 3/31/2020 9:50 am : link
In comment 14854853 Archer said:
Quote:
Belicheck had Tom Brady who was in his thirties he knew there would be a transition to a young QB
The Giants have their young development QB on the roster.
It is always good to have competition but this is really low priority
I would rather use draft picks to find players who can help the team rather than hold a clipboard

The irony here is almost impassably thick.

Brady himself was a developmental QB who should have fit the description of a wasted draft pick. The Patriots had Bledsoe in his prime at the time, three years removed from a Super Bowl appearance and the ink was still wet on his 10-year, $103M contract before Brady ever set foot on the field in a meaningful context.

Brady was never supposed to be part of a transition plan when he was drafted. But every team needs QB depth, and sometimes they turn into something more, even when you have a franchise QB at the helm.

That's why you draft them.
RE: Another  
Gatorade Dunk : 3/31/2020 9:50 am : link
In comment 14854876 AcidTest said:
Quote:
great post. I am no longer a fan of day three QBs, so I don't think Bryant is for us, especially since we have so many other needs. But given how many seventh round picks we have, I wouldn't be opposed to using one on him. As you note, he has produced at the collegiate level, and against high quality competition.

Lauletta alone steered you away from Day 3 QBs?
RE: RE: Another  
AcidTest : 3/31/2020 9:54 am : link
In comment 14854894 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 14854876 AcidTest said:


Quote:


great post. I am no longer a fan of day three QBs, so I don't think Bryant is for us, especially since we have so many other needs. But given how many seventh round picks we have, I wouldn't be opposed to using one on him. As you note, he has produced at the collegiate level, and against high quality competition.


Lauletta alone steered you away from Day 3 QBs?


Nope. Lauletta, Nassib, and Bomar did. Most day three QBs also never become more than a journeyman backup. Everybody thinks they've found the next Brady, but no position is as scrutinized as QB. We also have a lot of needs, but I nonetheless wouldn't be opposed to using a seventh round pick on Bryant.
RE: RE: RE: Another  
Gatorade Dunk : 3/31/2020 10:06 am : link
In comment 14854903 AcidTest said:
Quote:
In comment 14854894 Gatorade Dunk said:


Quote:


In comment 14854876 AcidTest said:


Quote:


great post. I am no longer a fan of day three QBs, so I don't think Bryant is for us, especially since we have so many other needs. But given how many seventh round picks we have, I wouldn't be opposed to using one on him. As you note, he has produced at the collegiate level, and against high quality competition.


Lauletta alone steered you away from Day 3 QBs?



Nope. Lauletta, Nassib, and Bomar did. Most day three QBs also never become more than a journeyman backup. Everybody thinks they've found the next Brady, but no position is as scrutinized as QB. We also have a lot of needs, but I nonetheless wouldn't be opposed to using a seventh round pick on Bryant.

You're absolutely right that most don't become more than a journeyman backup. And yet, every team ends up signing journeyman backups, too.

I don't think it's fair to associate Reese/Ross failures with only one position more than the rest. Would Wilson have scared you off from Barkley? Do Apple and Amukamara rule out Okudah for you?

The beauty of the late round QB is that he can simultaneously bust out against his highest upside and still provide exactly the role you drafted him for in the first place.

Nassib, for all his detractors, capably filled the role he was drafted for, but happened to sit behind one of the most indestructible QBs of all time. Bomar was always a longshot, drafted on his high school buzz more than his college production - he was basically the QB version of Marvin Austin. And he's also exactly the kind of draft pick - at any position - that illustrated Marc Ross's biggest weakness as a talent evaluator.

And Lauletta was, IMO, just poorly timed. Gettleman drafted him in the same offseason that he has since admitted that he read the roster incorrectly. It seems reasonable that Gettleman, in the context of believing that Eli had a few years left, might see an opportunity for Shurmur to develop Lauletta while Eli continued to man the QB1 role. When that plan shifted a year later and Jones was drafted as the immediate de facto successor, the opportunity to develop Lauletta evaporated. Add to that his immature run-in with the cops a few months earlier, and Lauletta was a dead man walking from the moment they drafted Jones. I'd still rather have Lauletta on the roster than Tanney.
If we're going to take a flier on a QB  
Jeever : 3/31/2020 10:08 am : link
I'd prefer a QB who ran the option. Why? We could use him as a kick returner, a slot option in a pinch, a gadget play option. Option QBs are not in great demand in the NFL but they tend to be great athletes. Find one with good hands who can shake and bake and put the swiss army knife in your tool box. Just a thought.
I’d like to add one thing  
Jay on the Island : 3/31/2020 10:08 am : link
Former teammate Deshaun Watson once said that Kelly Bryant would become a better QB than him.
to both  
YANKEE28 : 3/31/2020 10:29 am : link
X and Southern Man- thanks for understanding my intent.

Glad you and others on BBI have enjoyed it.
Y28  
Jay on the Island : 3/31/2020 10:40 am : link
I also think the Giants will use a day 3 pick on a QB to serve as the 3rd QB in hopes that he will become a cheap backup to Jones in a year or two. It will most likely be one of their 7th round picks but Kelly Bryant is at the top of my wish list unless someone like James Morgan surprisingly falls.

Y28, Thanks a lot for these threads. Know that they are greatly appreciated especially with everything going on.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Another  
NYG22 : 3/31/2020 11:09 am : link
In comment 14854915 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 14854903 AcidTest said:


Quote:


In comment 14854894 Gatorade Dunk said:


Quote:


In comment 14854876 AcidTest said:


Quote:


great post. I am no longer a fan of day three QBs, so I don't think Bryant is for us, especially since we have so many other needs. But given how many seventh round picks we have, I wouldn't be opposed to using one on him. As you note, he has produced at the collegiate level, and against high quality competition.


Lauletta alone steered you away from Day 3 QBs?



Nope. Lauletta, Nassib, and Bomar did. Most day three QBs also never become more than a journeyman backup. Everybody thinks they've found the next Brady, but no position is as scrutinized as QB. We also have a lot of needs, but I nonetheless wouldn't be opposed to using a seventh round pick on Bryant.


You're absolutely right that most don't become more than a journeyman backup. And yet, every team ends up signing journeyman backups, too.

I don't think it's fair to associate Reese/Ross failures with only one position more than the rest. Would Wilson have scared you off from Barkley? Do Apple and Amukamara rule out Okudah for you?

The beauty of the late round QB is that he can simultaneously bust out against his highest upside and still provide exactly the role you drafted him for in the first place.

Nassib, for all his detractors, capably filled the role he was drafted for, but happened to sit behind one of the most indestructible QBs of all time. Bomar was always a longshot, drafted on his high school buzz more than his college production - he was basically the QB version of Marvin Austin. And he's also exactly the kind of draft pick - at any position - that illustrated Marc Ross's biggest weakness as a talent evaluator.

And Lauletta was, IMO, just poorly timed. Gettleman drafted him in the same offseason that he has since admitted that he read the roster incorrectly. It seems reasonable that Gettleman, in the context of believing that Eli had a few years left, might see an opportunity for Shurmur to develop Lauletta while Eli continued to man the QB1 role. When that plan shifted a year later and Jones was drafted as the immediate de facto successor, the opportunity to develop Lauletta evaporated. Add to that his immature run-in with the cops a few months earlier, and Lauletta was a dead man walking from the moment they drafted Jones. I'd still rather have Lauletta on the roster than Tanney.


Best/smartest post of the day. Nice work articulating your points.
i'd rather have Kelly Bryant than  
markky : 3/31/2020 11:53 am : link
most of the backup QBs we've drafted lately. But I doubt he ever becomes a starter in the NFL.

On a side note, I'm betting that Trevor Lawrence's backup, Chase Brice (who has transferred) does become an NFL starter down the road.
Y28 ... I don’t know who you are but I’ve really enjoyed your posts.  
Spider56 : 3/31/2020 12:28 pm : link
I like the way you think and I agree taking Bryant with a late 7th is a real possibility. It’s clear from FA that DG and JJ are trusting the input from their staff and Dooley has had a great insider view of Bryant’s skills. Let’s be real, he comes from a much higher pedigree than our other recent day 3 QB picks and a 3rd QB for the roster is a real need.
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