and I love his measurables, but damn if I'd like it where one year we pick a player and EPSN doesn't call it an overdraft or start out the segment by mentioning his band membership over his on-field play.
Warmed to Thomas after watching more interviews and clips of him. Seems like a great dude and an absolute mauler in the run game and projects really well to LT. Let’s fucking go.
I like this pick. I think out of all the tackles he's the one that really is the most complete and I think he's going to be a very good player for us for many years. Now let's get some defensive guys, and a center!
David Syvertsen
@Ourlads_Sy
·
30m
#4 NYG: Andrew Thomas - OT/Georgia
A must for a team that has given Saquon Barkley nothing to work with up front. If they want to own the line of scrimmage, Thomas is the guy you want in your corner
ours is the one which stands out as an overdraft. Not sufficient value for the #4 pick. Unfortunately, I am not surprised.
I would say Okudah was bigger overdraft. No other player at 4 was going to look like less of an overdraft than Thomas. We don’t know how the spread was among our OT rankings.
Really was hoping for a trade down, but I don't hate this pick. He did a really did a good job against Josh Allen in 2018 and K'Lavon Chaisson in 2019.
If Marc Colombo can clean up his feetwork, including his kick-slide and his work against speed rushers, Thomas could be an excellent LT.
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"With the 4th overall pick, the Giants select Andrew Thomas"
Probably the best left tackle in the draft, high character, top conference and competition, and his best game tape is excellent. He didn't always play as well as hoped in the post-season, otherwise there would be fewer questions on his projection to the NFL. He put some stuff on tape that is reminiscent of Flowers with the waist bending, chasing, and grabbing. But, the Giants got their target and have their LT of the future.
Him or Wills was my preference. Pleased with the pick. I really didn't want Wirfs.
+1
I’m sure Wirfs will be a solid player, but sounded like the most likely to be kicked to guard in the NFL. Giants have been desperate for an anchor at tackle for a long time. Let’s hope we picked the right guy
Was a little surprised they went this route after hearing who the backup options were the past 2 years.Bradley Chubb and Josh Allen.I figured it might be time this year.Than Detroit really opened things up with there selection.But I guess it wasn't meant to be.
And I'll say one more thing,after spending 3 top 10 picks on a running back,QB,and offensive tackle.If we could do it over again,I'm not sure I would take Barkley.The Giants are gonna have to get lucky with some of these mid round defensive guys.
a weak spot. I’m not criticizing the pick. They were going grab an OT and thought Thomas was the best. But if the consensus was at all correct, there is not much difference among the top several guys at that spot. It all came down to whether Jacksonville wanted to move up for a QB. If didn’t.
a weak spot. I’m not criticizing the pick. They were going grab an OT and thought Thomas was the best. But if the consensus was at all correct, there is not much difference among the top several guys at that spot. It all came down to whether Jacksonville wanted to move up for a QB. If didn’t.
Probably the best left tackle in the draft, high character, top conference and competition, and his best game tape is excellent. He didn't always play as well as hoped in the post-season, otherwise there would be fewer questions on his projection to the NFL. He put some stuff on tape that is reminiscent of Flowers with the waist bending, chasing, and grabbing. But, the Giants got their target and have their LT of the future.
What worries me is the Flowers traits, like you said. Didn’t like when DJ was shitting on the pick, either:
“I don’t see elite athleticism..I had him as my 4th OT...I thought there were better options”....
I think I would have accepted Wills/Thomas/Wirfs/Becton in that order and would've preferred one in a trade down.
I respect those who loved Simmons and I see what he could bring to the table, but I'm glad we went this direction. We need to build on our cornerstone combo of Jones/Barkley.
We’ll see. Has to be a pro bowl type player at 4. Could have been had with a trade down.
It takes two to trade.
Apparently the reports of the last few days that Gettleman could not find a partner were accurate.
It also suggests that some of us enamored with Simmons were over rating him with respect to what Pro teams felt his rank should be.
a weak spot. I’m not criticizing the pick. They were going grab an OT and thought Thomas was the best. But if the consensus was at all correct, there is not much difference among the top several guys at that spot. It all came down to whether Jacksonville wanted to move up for a QB. If didn’t.
Great pick. He played LT in the SEC and dominated. Go look at what he did against Chaisson and Okwara. Dude is a mauler. Long arms. His technical issues can be fixed with good coaching. High character.
Probably the best left tackle in the draft, high character, top conference and competition, and his best game tape is excellent. He didn't always play as well as hoped in the post-season, otherwise there would be fewer questions on his projection to the NFL. He put some stuff on tape that is reminiscent of Flowers with the waist bending, chasing, and grabbing. But, the Giants got their target and have their LT of the future.
Reminiscent of Flowers... what an absolute nightmare and every Giants fans biggest fear.
a weak spot. I’m not criticizing the pick. They were going grab an OT and thought Thomas was the best. But if the consensus was at all correct, there is not much difference among the top several guys at that spot. It all came down to whether Jacksonville wanted to move up for a QB. If didn’t.
a weak spot. I’m not criticizing the pick. They were going grab an OT and thought Thomas was the best. But if the consensus was at all correct, there is not much difference among the top several guys at that spot. It all came down to whether Jacksonville wanted to move up for a QB. If didn’t.
And we aren’t even at pick 15 yet and some of you insist the giants could and should have traded down and taken Thomas. What the hell is wrong with some of you? First off it takes two to tango and more important, you lose your guy if you trade down too far.
We needed this pick for ten friggin years now. And the real life scouts, you know the actual people who have drafted players for real and know what they are looking at love Thomas.
He put some stuff on tape that is reminiscent of Flowers with the waist bending, chasing, and grabbing. But, the Giants got their target and have their LT of the future.
And we aren’t even at pick 15 yet and some of you insist the giants could and should have traded down and taken Thomas. What the hell is wrong with some of you? First off it takes two to tango and more important, you lose your guy if you trade down too far.
We needed this pick for ten friggin years now. And the real life scouts, you know the actual people who have drafted players for real and know what they are looking at love Thomas.
He put some stuff on tape that is reminiscent of Flowers with the waist bending, chasing, and grabbing. But, the Giants got their target and have their LT of the future.
Paul Schwartz
@NYPost_Schwartz
·
Apr 23
Joe Judge said he used his contacts to fill in the gaps about the draft prospects. Judge worked with Kirby Smart at Alabama, and Smart was Andrew Thomas' coach at Georgia.
It’s possible the Chargers and Dolphins simply liked different QBs.
Whether they whispered in each others’ ears or not, they don’t seem to have been terribly concerned about which of them picked first. So any trade-down would have involved a steeper drop than #5 or #6. I’d have been fine with that, but if Thomas was the Giants’ guy they had to be wary of Arizona, Cleveland and others.
Significantly upgrades the weakest unit on the team
but the rub on Wills is undersized, there's concern his ceiling is very good RT, but not pro bowl caliber LT.
You think Thomas is a pro bowl type LT??
I think he's the best LT in this draft, and they're hard to come by to begin with. He's got to clean up the pass pro, but he's got top notch experience and plenty of tools.
Who was BPA? I bet it was Derrick Brown, and fans who wanted OL got what they wanted! No trade down to be had, dudes.
but the rub on Wills is undersized, there's concern his ceiling is very good RT, but not pro bowl caliber LT.
You think Thomas is a pro bowl type LT??
I think he's the best LT in this draft, and they're hard to come by to begin with. He's got to clean up the pass pro, but he's got top notch experience and plenty of tools.
Who was BPA? I bet it was Derrick Brown, and fans who wanted OL got what they wanted! No trade down to be had, dudes.
and a sliver of deductive reasoning skills could see that a trade down wasn't there. If he's their top rated OL its the perfect pick. If 3 years down the road it's clear that 1-2 other OTs are better, then they screwed up.
The thing about Thomas is that he's clearly a LT. I agree that the lines have blurred between the two tackle spots, with Jones' lack of feel from the blindside, it adds a little more weight to that OL spot.
And we aren’t even at pick 15 yet and some of you insist the giants could and should have traded down and taken Thomas. What the hell is wrong with some of you? First off it takes two to tango and more important, you lose your guy if you trade down too far.
We needed this pick for ten friggin years now. And the real life scouts, you know the actual people who have drafted players for real and know what they are looking at love Thomas.
He was the best all around OT and really the only true LT unless you count Becton who is more run than pass blocker. This guy has the best tape, player LT at a high level in both pass and run blocking in the toughest conference, and has over 36” arms with good feet. Guy is a stud!
Is it though? Maybe they simply think Thomas is better? If Judge is getting talked into taking players based on past relationships we've got problems.
Clearly the Giants DO think Thomas was better cause they could have had their pick. MAYBE the Alabama folks told them (somehow) that WIlls was maybe NOT worth the 4. Or SOMETHING that put him behind Thomas on their board. Maybe it was that he never played the left side. We'll never know.
All I'm saying is that WHATEVER the Alabama guys said about WIlls -- good, bad, or indifferent, wasn't enough to move him ahead of Thomas on the Giants' board. And I do find that interesting.
one scout said that all 4 tackles playing at their best
We’ll see. Has to be a pro bowl type player at 4. Could have been had with a trade down.
What trade? Nobody has made a trade. Nobody wants to trade. Why is this so hard to understand....
I understand. Why so hostile? Would have preferred BPA.
You did not say you would have prefered BPA(maybe on the Giants board Thomas was). You said he could have been had later on with a trade. Big difference, don't you think.
Wasn't hostile, I was pissed.
RE: Significantly upgrades the weakest unit on the team
The Giants felt he was the best of the OTs and probably the best LT of the group. Disappointed the Jets got Becton, he was my guy and I hate seeing him in green.
Let's hope Thomas is the best of the bunch for 10 plus years in blue. This will help the whole team. The best defense is a good offense.
very good run blocker. If you can run the ball at will then the passing games gets a lot easier. When you have to pass because you can't run the ball - pass blocking gets a lot harder
But I heard from multiple sources that Thomas and Wirfs were best fits for what Garrett has typically liked to do offensively. I'm not going to sit here and pretend to know who I think is going to be the better pro between Thomas and Wirfs, so I'll trust the experts on this one. I think the fact that Thomas has a high floor and is a more natural LT is probably what sold the Giants. This simply CANNOT be a bust after all the busts we've had with OL 1st rounders, and I've heard Thomas is a "what you see is what you get" type of dude, so I'll take that.
DG might have also valued LT more with it being the #4 overall pick, considering he's old school, because the new school doesn't place as much emphasis on LT vs. RT since pass rushers can line up all over... BUT-- having played QB in high school myself with a TERRIBLE OL for much of my career, hell I personally still would prefer my stud OL be protecting my blindside, that's for sure.
no big surprise besides the Raiders taking a speedy WR which is very unsurprising.
Pretty boring. Would have gone Wirfs but they obviously saw a need to make sure they got a LT at 4. I have been on the take the best lineman period band wagon.
Given how highly the Giants think of him, and how highly regarded he was, it probably was some rough seas here and there. Like I said, his good game tape is excellent and there's plenty of it.
DG knows his "molliehogs". Joe Judge had to be convinced that even with his personal connections to the Alabama and Iowa tackles, that Thomas is the answer.
On top of that, Jason Garrett and Marc Colombo have to be convinced that Thomas is the top choice of the 4 OT's. Those guys know what a a great OT looks like.
Had to laugh that both talking heads on ESPN were dissing the pick right away, the first of the 4 picks to be questioned...
I would be fine if they go OL in the second round too, center please?
We couldn't have moved down 1 spot with Miami to grab an extra pick??
Yeah, in addition to being a high school band geek, Thomas was:
First-team All-American (2019)
SEC's 2019 Jacobs Blocking Trophy (UGA's first recipient of the award in 21 years)
First-team All-SEC by Coaches and Associated Press (2019)
Semifinalist for the 2019 Outland Trophy
One of four permanent team captains (2019)
Co-winner of 2019 Vince Dooley Offensive MVP Award
SI.com first-team All-American (2018)
Second-team All-American by Associated Press & Walter Camp (2018)
All-America Second Team
First-team All-SEC by Coaches (2018)
Freshman All-Americas by ESPN, USA Today and the Football Writers Association of America (2017)
a weak spot. I’m not criticizing the pick. They were going grab an OT and thought Thomas was the best. But if the consensus was at all correct, there is not much difference among the top several guys at that spot. It all came down to whether Jacksonville wanted to move up for a QB. If didn’t.
do you think if we picked third it would have been a different pick? I don't.
Had the best tape in the of the OTs, actually played LT unlike Wills and Wirf, and was a complete player with elite arms. If you don’t like this pick you are crazy
Sy said Thomas looked like the only “blue goose” OT (his words) in the draft with the criticism being sometimes he took plays off.
Not saying the red flag isn’t significant but Thomas going into fall of 2019 was the overwhelming stud OT. I like the pick and think we are sensitized, rightfully so, by Flowers. Thomas isn’t Flowers
The thing is, he's not the most talented, and isn't the most ready player, of the bunch, so what's the likelihood that he turns out to be the best? He definitely doesn't look the best on tape to me, but hey what do I know?
It seemed to me that, if Miami had traded up with Detroit to grab Tua, then Jaguars would've traded up with us to grab Okudah. I'm pretty sure Thomas would've been there at 9. So Detroit kinda fucked us. And too bad Chargers didn't have the hots for Tua.
To me, although it's difficult to second guess and go through all the permutations, but it won't be easy to dismiss in the future if Tua or Herbert turns out to be great and Jones is merely good.
Taken with the 4th overall pick of the NFL Draft???
Oh, boy.
Time will tell.
But for now... WTF?
In what world is a guy who allowed one sack last year in the best conference in college football considered inconsistent? It’s not like Fromm is very mobile either.
wanted to trade. It's that sample. Whether they would have been more likely to if we'd had a normal offseason is unknown. But this is the offseason that happened. So we took the highest OT on our board.
RE: Disappointed we couldn't pull off a trade down, and not inspired by
The thing is, he's not the most talented, and isn't the most ready player, of the bunch, so what's the likelihood that he turns out to be the best? He definitely doesn't look the best on tape to me, but hey what do I know?
It seemed to me that, if Miami had traded up with Detroit to grab Tua, then Jaguars would've traded up with us to grab Okudah. I'm pretty sure Thomas would've been there at 9. So Detroit kinda fucked us. And too bad Chargers didn't have the hots for Tua.
To me, although it's difficult to second guess and go through all the permutations, but it won't be easy to dismiss in the future if Tua or Herbert turns out to be great and Jones is merely good.
It's all about timing. Before the pads came off for the combine, Thomas was thought to be the top OT by many people. So saying he's not the most talented or the most ready is just an opinion from a guy on a couch.
Lack of imagination and guts. Not much to be excited about.
Here’s something to be excited about - your young quarterback might have 3 seconds to survey the field, and your all pro running back might not have to make 2 guys miss to make 4 yards.
Taken with the 4th overall pick of the NFL Draft???
Oh, boy.
Time will tell.
But for now... WTF?
Inconsistent? Seriously? Have you watched him.
M.S. loves to bitch and moan about everything NYG do. Nothing to see here...
Written by Sy’56:
“The second issue, he looks like a train wreck in pass protection at times. He struggles to reach his point against speed and he shows his numbers to the ground too often. While his power and reach can partially make up for it, he simply needs to get better there or he will get eaten alive by the top end pass rushers.”
Andrew Thomas was the #1 OT I saw on most boards way back at the end of the college season / beginning of offseason. Him and Wills were the top 2 from everything I saw, with Thomas having the slight edge. That speaks volumes to me about them being the 2 best pure football players of the OT class. As time went on, Becton shot up suddenly because of his mammoth size combined with his impressive combine, and Wirfs I think people started to fall in love with his high ceiling as well.
But again-- I still believe based purely on the impression most people had at the end of the college football season, without overthinking it, Thomas seemed to be the favorite to be the top OT, maybe tied with Wills (and I'm sure being the natural LT might have given him the slight edge over RT Wills on many boards).
Not saying it's a sure thing, just saying I think we just got a pretty good football player, and by all accounts a pretty good guy. Two very important things when hoping you got a "sure thing" in the top 5-10 picks, and he plays one of the most important positions on the entire team. Tons of experience in the toughest conference in the nation, and the award for best OL in the SEC last year on top of that. We all knew we weren't getting an Ogden/Pace type of guy in this draft, we're kidding ourselves if we think any of these 4 are going to be at that level, but I don't see how anyone could say they know FOR SURE that this was a bad pick in any sense.
Agreed, there's no super clean OT prospect in this draft, but Giants got the #1 LT, despite what the espn draftniks are saying.
I love the pick, I do wonder what trade offers were on the table, if any, but a battle tested, physical left, thrilled.
Given no trades until #13, got to think assets like #2 picks are being held tightly. I wouldn't risk my target for a #3 pick. Giants got their guy at LT, I wanted defense and even I'm onboard with picking Thomas.
wanted to trade. It's that sample. Whether they would have been more likely to if we'd had a normal offseason is unknown. But this is the offseason that happened. So we took the highest OT on our board.
Not for nothing, but you don’t know that. I’m happy with the pick, but again, just have to wonder what was offered, if anything.
RE: Disappointed we couldn't pull off a trade down, and not inspired by
The thing is, he's not the most talented, and isn't the most ready player, of the bunch, so what's the likelihood that he turns out to be the best? He definitely doesn't look the best on tape to me, but hey what do I know?
It seemed to me that, if Miami had traded up with Detroit to grab Tua, then Jaguars would've traded up with us to grab Okudah. I'm pretty sure Thomas would've been there at 9. So Detroit kinda fucked us. And too bad Chargers didn't have the hots for Tua.
To me, although it's difficult to second guess and go through all the permutations, but it won't be easy to dismiss in the future if Tua or Herbert turns out to be great and Jones is merely good.
jesus christ...exactly you dont know so do us a favor and dont distribute your opinion like a fact. Based on about 5 different articles I read Thomas is regarded as the most NFL ready.
Not the player. But the first of a block of four. (You always want the last for value). So if any of the three behind him (yes 7+ slots at least) become a better player, he will be deemed a bust. At #4 you expect an All Pro LT. Tough standards to live up to. I see a little (for you old folks) William Roberts in him. A high LT drafted out of OSU. Never lived up to his draft status but a quality OL (played guard) and started for years.
Sy saw the pass issues as well, Jeremiah mentioned he sees lack of AA
The draftniks are typically mentioning some of the same things. It is what it is. Don't get bent I said he looked like Flowers at times, Thomas' pedigree and upside is much stronger.
Who played the most LT? Thomas.
Who played in the toughest conference? Thomas (Wills too).
Who had the best wonderlic? Thomas.
Who had the best size? Thomas is more prototypical than Wirfs/Wills even though he isn't as big as Becton (whose size is both advantage + concern).
I know PFF is frowned upon but Thomas even graded out the highest there.
Wirfs may have been the best athlete, but I'm not sure he's even a tackle (Bob McGinn for example ranked him as a G, and also correctly had Thomas as his OT1). Wills tape is really good and he may have been in the conversation, but I'm not sure he has the upside Thomas has. Becton is a unicorn - ultimate boom/bust.
None of these guys are perfect - ideally you'd want to see a little better movement from Thomas and more consistency in pass pro - but of the 4 he's the cleanest and closest to a true blue goose LT.
RE: Sy saw the pass issues as well, Jeremiah mentioned he sees lack of AA
The draftniks are typically mentioning some of the same things. It is what it is. Don't get bent I said he looked like Flowers at times, Thomas' pedigree and upside is much stronger.
Unhappy we skipped on Wills, happy we skipped Wirfs. Thomas floor is not Flowers it is a pretty good but not great tackle. His ceiling is a close to dominant Tackle. Bectons flags proved too much, Wirfs is a better OG.
I think it’s clear they wanted to trade down. Thomas seems like another prospect where the league was higher on him than the media. Rumors Miami loved him too.
“The second issue, he looks like a train wreck in pass protection at times. He struggles to reach his point against speed and he shows his numbers to the ground too often. While his power and reach can partially make up for it, he simply needs to get better there or he will get eaten alive by the top end pass rushers.”
Another reach or 2 in this first and Ruiz becomes a real option @ 36.
Who played the most LT? Thomas.
Who played in the toughest conference? Thomas (Wills too).
Who had the best wonderlic? Thomas.
Who had the best size? Thomas is more prototypical than Wirfs/Wills even though he isn't as big as Becton (whose size is both advantage + concern).
I know PFF is frowned upon but Thomas even graded out the highest there.
Wirfs may have been the best athlete, but I'm not sure he's even a tackle (Bob McGinn for example ranked him as a G, and also correctly had Thomas as his OT1). Wills tape is really good and he may have been in the conversation, but I'm not sure he has the upside Thomas has. Becton is a unicorn - ultimate boom/bust.
None of these guys are perfect - ideally you'd want to see a little better movement from Thomas and more consistency in pass pro - but of the 4 he's the cleanest and closest to a true blue goose LT.
Not the player. But the first of a block of four. (You always want the last for value). So if any of the three behind him (yes 7+ slots at least) become a better player, he will be deemed a bust. At #4 you expect an All Pro LT. Tough standards to live up to. I see a little (for you old folks) William Roberts in him. A high LT drafted out of OSU. Never lived up to his draft status but a quality OL (played guard) and started for years.
If a player behind him becomes a better player he is a bust? Genius. I guess every single player drafted before Tom Brady was a bust
RE: Sy saw the pass issues as well, Jeremiah mentioned he sees lack of AA
The draftniks are typically mentioning some of the same things. It is what it is. Don't get bent I said he looked like Flowers at times, Thomas' pedigree and upside is much stronger.
I remember watching Flowers in college, and whenever they played competitive teams, he struggled. They played the Gators, and he couldn’t handle their speed and power.
Thomas, who’s been a 3 year starter at Georgia, has at times looked dominant against the most competitive teams. You just didn’t see that at all with Flowers. I don’t expect Thomas to be a perfect left tackle, not many are, but I do expect something we haven’t had in my lifetime, a solid and at times dominant left tackle.
“The second issue, he looks like a train wreck in pass protection at times. He struggles to reach his point against speed and he shows his numbers to the ground too often. While his power and reach can partially make up for it, he simply needs to get better there or he will get eaten alive by the top end pass rushers.”
And Dave Diehl and Shaun O’Hara both ranked him as the top tackle in the draft.
Agreed, there's no super clean OT prospect in this draft, but Giants got the #1 LT, despite what the espn draftniks are saying.
I love the pick, I do wonder what trade offers were on the table, if any, but a battle tested, physical left, thrilled.
The Lions wanted to trade down and they were in the best position to do it, they used every second on the clock before making their pick. The Giants wanted to trade down, they used every second on the clock before making their pick. A trade wasn't made until 13, and it was a one pick swap.
Sy actually graded both exactly the same coming out too (83). The reason why is because both guys were kind of boring picks, and they had some holes if you really wanted to pick them apart. But their entire CFB careers both were considered blue chips and all they did was play well. Neither was flashy but when you go through the checklist they hit most of the boxes for top tier LT traits. 36 inch arms, 310 lbs+, solid but unspectacular 40 time, and lots of games started at LT against good competition in CFB.
Stanley was probably smoother in pass pro as a prospect and Thomas looks a little more tenacious as a run blocker. Hopefully this comp holds up and we've got our first pro bowl OL since Snee.
I don't discount Thomas as the best left tackle in the draft. He's a clean prospect, he's a good, smart kid, and the Giants certainly need a left tackle.
Was he the 4th best player in the draft? Is he a top 5 type player? Those are legitimate questions.
I suspect history will be the Giants drafted for need and Thomas will be a sturdy player.
The Giants deserve a break picking a college left tackle. The last couple haven't panned out.
It sucks that we had to be the first team to actually make a decision, but I'm glad we actually took the safe choice who has the highest floor at a position that's been trash on this team for a nearly a decade.
Maybe some of the other OTs will be better, BUT not all of them will be, and I hope people look back on this with hindsight and realize that we NEEDED a safe pick along the OL.
Would have been happy with Simmons though as well, as he is the type of player you need for the modern NFL. And he's the type of player you want for the NFL 4 years from now.
Having said that:
1) anyone cheering us winning the Redskins game has a ton of egg on their face. Yeah, we all knew seconds after the game this would happen, but maybe now the ramifications are much clearer. You better hope Thomas doesn't get abused by Young into the 2030s (first time in my life I've written out 2030s... shit, times flying).
2) The Skins and Cowboys got IMPACT players while we took a safe pick. This was a result of our awful previous draft classes, but it hurts to see Young and C-D on the cobwoys. Do not have any disillusionments, this is a decade of playing against players who are "problems", as coaches say it.
But, I also don't know that I would take him at #4. I still think Simmons would be the impact player there. But, he is a solid player who will start at RT out of the gate.
If he's the better player immediately and is a rock while 1-2 of the other 3 flame out, who gives a shit?
You can't look at the draft in a vacuum. We NEEDED a dependable pick that could contribute. You wanna take a shot on Beckton and find him to be another flowers?
But, I also don't know that I would take him at #4. I still think Simmons would be the impact player there. But, he is a solid player who will start at RT out of the gate.
+1
If you watch the OL video posted above of the Georgia-LSU
game, Thomas was matched up with Chaisson all game. He only got beat 1 time in pass pro, and that wasn't a sack. He just hit Fromm when he threw. Looked really good in pass pro, good in the running game, against the best team in college football. Definitely is a stud
Experts Jeremiah had Justin Jefferson as the first wr At 13 he still hasn’t been picked. Haven’t we learned yet to take everything with a grain of salt
Or any other pundits but I'll trust the talent evaluation of our new coach with SEC ties, our offensive coordinator who knows a thing or two about offensive lineman and our new offensive line coach who coaches the best o-line in the league.
Thomas was, by far, my favorite offensive lineman in this draft because he was the only one that I was certain can play left tackle.
Thomas wasn't only the best LT in the draft he may be the only one
Wills didn't play there.
Wirfs played limited snaps there, and may even move off RT like Scherff did.
Becton who knows. The guy is just a mammoth. Maybe he is the new prototype or maybe there's a reason there's never really been a 370 pound LT before.
We collectively may have discounted that fact more than we should have since our vacancy is at RT - but as much as things have equalized a little bit LT's are still worth more.
with Thomas. Too much time on the ground. Too much lean in his game to get movement. He does look good agianst good competition. He needs to refine his punch and pass sets to get in balance, and get stronger. He's smart and a great kid.. so i'll be rooting for him to work hard and get us what we need for Jones and Barkley.
I believe we've been traumatized by Flowers. So we might be over-analyzing something that our current staff feels is fixable.
Everyone bitching about OUR pick is missing the point
We got backed into a corner by our awful roster construction and couldn't pick a consensus player at the spot we needed. Every division rival got a guaranteed to likely impact player.
This is not about the Giants making a bad pick -- the story of this draft is the rest of the division drafting gamechangers.
RE: If you watch the OL video posted above of the Georgia-LSU
game, Thomas was matched up with Chaisson all game. He only got beat 1 time in pass pro, and that wasn't a sack. He just hit Fromm when he threw. Looked really good in pass pro, good in the running game, against the best team in college football. Definitely is a stud
georgia taught their lineman in pass protection open your hands put them on the shoulders of the defender rather than punch the defender in the chest and keep the hands inside..
When you watch games the other tackle did the same exact thing..
For a strange reason I have more confidence at Solder at RT
We got backed into a corner by our awful roster construction and couldn't pick a consensus player at the spot we needed. Every division rival got a guaranteed to likely impact player.
This is not about the Giants making a bad pick -- the story of this draft is the rest of the division drafting gamechangers.
A good OT who can actually block is not a game changer? Someone who doesn’t get the QB creamed, and doesn’t have the RB constantly getting hit behind the line of scrimmage isn’t a game changer?
I don't discount Thomas as the best left tackle in the draft. He's a clean prospect, he's a good, smart kid, and the Giants certainly need a left tackle.
Was he the 4th best player in the draft? Is he a top 5 type player? Those are legitimate questions.
I suspect history will be the Giants drafted for need and Thomas will be a sturdy player.
The Giants deserve a break picking a college left tackle. The last couple haven't panned out.
This is a fair question. When we were on the clock other than the trade down I was kind of hoping we'd shock everyone and take Simmons. For a team completely lacking speed on D putting perhaps the fastest LB ever into the equation could be game changing. He was the ultimate upside pick.
That said I get it. It's a little bit of a safer pick - but if he's the guy they think he is he could be a fixture for a decade. Even when OT's lose a step they can still be impact players.
I don't expect this to happen but if they spent then next 4 picks on defensive players with speed they could end up with the best of both worlds to a degree. Especially if they get lucky with Murray or Queen or Baun sliding to 36.
No, you finish the job and get a center. No half assing it. Get the line fixed. Get some fresh OL backups to work on and then watch Barkley be in the secondary before the LBs know he's gone...
Nothing against Murray. Just want the OL finished.
No, you finish the job and get a center. No half assing it. Get the line fixed. Get some fresh OL backups to work on and then watch Barkley be in the secondary before the LBs know he's gone...
Nothing against Murray. Just want the OL finished.
that people dont see drafting a LT who can potentially protect your young franchise QB for the next 10-12 years as IMPACTFUL....
just mind boggling...
For me, he has to show he can improve his technique in the passing game before I count on him playing LT for 10 years. But, I do think he instantly improves the line and should help Barkley a ton. If they can get a Center, their line will be decent.
Despite the unique tools and how he was deployed in college, it's much harder to achieve the same in the NFL. ILB/FS backend hybrid isn't a premium position when you're talking top 5 and badly in need of an OT. It's a roster construction basic when you have premium holes.
It’s not all about Oline. Our D sucks if you haven’t noticed.
The D does suck. But it sucks with young players like Baker, Lawrence, Love, Ximines, Connelly, Ballentine, Beal. We also signed a starting MLB in Martinez. We literally have the worst center position in the league right now.
Wouldn’t have been my pick but hoping for the best.
As for the clowns asking for “tape” go look for yourselves.
There was a college game this past season where the BBI thread was active where SY was hyping up Thomas pre-game. He looked like shit. Played stiff, high, and technically lazy.
We’ll see. Hopefully he can at least be a decent RT considering the Giants avoided seriously addressing OL in FA to save a starting spot for this pick.
It’s not all about Oline. Our D sucks if you haven’t noticed.
The D does suck. But it sucks with young players like Baker, Lawrence, Love, Ximines, Connelly, Ballentine, Beal. We also signed a starting MLB in Martinez. We literally have the worst center position in the league right now.
. They are both needs. The Oline or bust crowd seldom acknowledges needs on D. Our D has been among worst in the league for ever.
there is a good chance that Andrew Thomas starts his NFL career at right tackle, then moves over to the left.
I don't know. If Thomas is the future I would put him at LT, and let the short term vet Solder pick up the nuances of RT. One of them has to play a different position, might as well be SOlder
It’s not all about Oline. Our D sucks if you haven’t noticed.
The D does suck. But it sucks with young players like Baker, Lawrence, Love, Ximines, Connelly, Ballentine, Beal. We also signed a starting MLB in Martinez. We literally have the worst center position in the league right now.
. They are both needs. The Oline or bust crowd seldom acknowledges needs on D. Our D has been among worst in the league for ever.
Understandable but we spent a lot of resources on the defense last draft. Have to hope they take strides under new coaching.
Conversely, if Spencer Pulley is our starting center, it’s a failure.
For all his various warts, what I do fully trust is DGs OL evaluation
We got backed into a corner by our awful roster construction and couldn't pick a consensus player at the spot we needed. Every division rival got a guaranteed to likely impact player.
This is not about the Giants making a bad pick -- the story of this draft is the rest of the division drafting gamechangers.
Dallas was drafting OL for years while we were drafting receivers. How'd that work out for us.
No, you finish the job and get a center. No half assing it. Get the line fixed. Get some fresh OL backups to work on and then watch Barkley be in the secondary before the LBs know he's gone...
Nothing against Murray. Just want the OL finished.
Probably the best left tackle in the draft, high character, top conference and competition, and his best game tape is excellent. He didn't always play as well as hoped in the post-season, otherwise there would be fewer questions on his projection to the NFL. He put some stuff on tape that is reminiscent of Flowers with the waist bending, chasing, and grabbing. But, the Giants got their target and have their LT of the future.
Reminiscent of Flowers... what an absolute nightmare and every Giants fans biggest fear.
Not at all. One was an All-American and played in the bets conference and the other one was not close to this pick. Sorry but you get the overreaction of the day trophy
Hopefully the LSU kid, Cushenberry will be available for us to at least consider. He and Ruiz appear to be the best available centers and then there is a fairly big drop off to the Temple kid.
Hopefully the LSU kid, Cushenberry will be available for us to at least consider. He and Ruiz appear to be the best available centers and then there is a fairly big drop off to the Temple kid.
And we dodge the issue of Wirfs getting thrown outside when he's possibly (probably) best suited inside.
A pity the way this season broke, pretty damn bad but just not bad enough, end result with Chase Young in Washington unfortunately.
I also do hope this need-ish driven pick doesn't look silly in four years when Thomas is a solid player if Simmons turns out to be a stud.
Very well said. It's a shame that we wouldn't draft an impact player at 4. Out of the top 8 , 3 teams aligned value and need with the QB position, the most important position on the field. 4 teams took the best defensive player available that their teams can build around. The Giants surely picked a starter at LT and will hopefully help keep Jones upright which is a positive. Of the 7 players in the draft coveted by most teams, we had a chance to draft 2 of them on defense. There wasn't a trade down option so we stayed put and put need over BPA for certain. God bless Big Blue, it gets more challenging every year.
gets a look in rounds 3-4, unless they got to have the Temple kid and reach for him.
Agreed Jon that makes the most sense. A lot of interior prospects in this draft, I wouldn't be shocked if they pick a conversion like Bredson from Michigan in the 4th/5th. I'm sure Biadasz will be on the radar in the 3rd/4th. Cushenberry if he's still there. Nick Harris or Muti could be as well.
Certainly not all that meaningful but a nice little snapshot of Thomas' overall solid athleticism. Ironically his size + strength grades were lowest, but that's probably a good thing because I don't think any scouting reports consider either of those to be weaknesses
RE: Judge spoke about coaching up potential & Thomas was the bluest goose
Who played the most LT? Thomas.
Who played in the toughest conference? Thomas (Wills too).
Who had the best wonderlic? Thomas.
Who had the best size? Thomas is more prototypical than Wirfs/Wills even though he isn't as big as Becton (whose size is both advantage + concern).
I know PFF is frowned upon but Thomas even graded out the highest there.
Wirfs may have been the best athlete, but I'm not sure he's even a tackle (Bob McGinn for example ranked him as a G, and also correctly had Thomas as his OT1). Wills tape is really good and he may have been in the conversation, but I'm not sure he has the upside Thomas has. Becton is a unicorn - ultimate boom/bust.
None of these guys are perfect - ideally you'd want to see a little better movement from Thomas and more consistency in pass pro - but of the 4 he's the cleanest and closest to a true blue goose LT.
Hopefully the LSU kid, Cushenberry will be available for us to at least consider. He and Ruiz appear to be the best available centers and then there is a fairly big drop off to the Temple kid.
Sy had the Temple kid as his top center.
Hmmm, The Athletic has the Temple kid Rated in the 60s. Ruiz and Cushenberry in the 30s.
Uber, hope to have info tomorrow. Just looking on my own, I like Edge (Gross-Matos, Baun even though he's more of a Van Noy and less of a pure Edge) and WR (Pittman Jr, Claypool).
RE: Mind blown that BBIers that wanted OT are upset with this pick
Giants are in rebuild mode and getting cornerstone OT is great first step at righting the ship. Simmons was tantalizing but not an exact fit in position of need. Improving the Offense will improve the Defense. Go Giants!
next to Hernandez and it would be even better putting
a new young center next to him . This will make Barkley
happy when he is not getting stuffed in the backfield
I really liked Simmons but this also helps keeping
Jones upright . Why would anyone call him a reach
geesh never happy no matter what !
he's very slow and plodding with poor agility. he can work in a power scheme only. but he's not someone you want blocking out in space or doing a lot of pulling
he's very slow and plodding with poor agility. he can work in a power scheme only. but he's not someone you want blocking out in space or doing a lot of pulling
Thomas, Hernandez, Zeitler... we had better be a power scheme.
he's very slow and plodding with poor agility. he can work in a power scheme only. but he's not someone you want blocking out in space or doing a lot of pulling
Thomas, Hernandez, Zeitler... we had better be a power scheme.
If we want power then Cushenberry should be the pick.
Sy, Daniel Jeremiah, and Bucky Brooks, for starters, all mentioned seeing some issues with pass pro, footwork, and AA. I'm confident they saw what I saw. Joey and Torrag are two more BBIers who understand OL play who also saw some rough moments.
That said, I think Thomas is an excellent pick for NYG righ now, and I've made it abundantly clear.
Sy, Daniel Jeremiah, and Bucky Brooks, for starters, all mentioned seeing some issues with pass pro, footwork, and AA. I'm confident they saw what I saw. Joey and Torrag are two more BBIers who understand OL play who also saw some rough moments.
That said, I think Thomas is an excellent pick for NYG righ now, and I've made it abundantly clear.
Good info. Some don’t want to hear that he isn’t a totally clean prospect. None of the OTs were. Lots of OTs selected today. Just have to put faith in our scouts that they saw the right guy.
I saw mentioned often before the draft was D'Brickashaw Ferguson. And it really does seem to be a good comparison in terms of their body type and the way they move on the field. Ferguson was also selected 4th overall, although he was more highly regarded as a prospect relative to Thomas at the time.
Ferguson became a 10 year starter who went to 3 Pro Bowls. Let's hope Thomas can deliver similar results.
But I think Biadasz will easily be there at our late 3/early 4 swing and may fall much further. He's the type of prospect that will be hurt by the visit and medical restrictions this year.
RE: RE: Everyone bitching about OUR pick is missing the point
We got backed into a corner by our awful roster construction and couldn't pick a consensus player at the spot we needed. Every division rival got a guaranteed to likely impact player.
This is not about the Giants making a bad pick -- the story of this draft is the rest of the division drafting gamechangers.
A good OT who can actually block is not a game changer? Someone who doesn’t get the QB creamed, and doesn’t have the RB constantly getting hit behind the line of scrimmage isn’t a game changer?
I'm not calling Thomas a bad player at all. In fact, I have NO issue with any of the top 4 OTs. You're misundesrtanding me -- I'm just annoyed the Cowboys, Eagles, and Skins drafted skill position players with (potential) huge impacts.
OL is a cohesive unit, so it's rare one player comes in and changes the whole thing; having said that, I have no issue with the pick. This team has had no OL since 2012. We gotta plug our holes.
Saying Thomas was a sensible pick isn't mutually exclusive from lamenting that Chase Young and CeeDee Lamb went to Washington and Dallas. Sort of just wish they blew their picks and didn't (in Dallas's case) have a gem to fall to them.
But fuck it, I felt the same about Dez and that didn't work out, so let's see what happens...
We got backed into a corner by our awful roster construction and couldn't pick a consensus player at the spot we needed. Every division rival got a guaranteed to likely impact player.
This is not about the Giants making a bad pick -- the story of this draft is the rest of the division drafting gamechangers.
Dallas was drafting OL for years while we were drafting receivers. How'd that work out for us.
Nicks was drafted in 09, Cruz was also 09, Steve Smith was 07, Manningham was was 08. OBJ was obv 14.
travis frederick, connor wiliams, tyron smith, zack martin, la'el collins, all drafted everyone on that list other than OBJ.
they've been a fuckload better than us since '14.
I WANTED OL this year, its about time -- but don't try to lessen the impact of a CDLamb, Galllup, Cooper WR corp.
I saw mentioned often before the draft was D'Brickashaw Ferguson. And it really does seem to be a good comparison in terms of their body type and the way they move on the field. Ferguson was also selected 4th overall, although he was more highly regarded as a prospect relative to Thomas at the time.
Ferguson became a 10 year starter who went to 3 Pro Bowls. Let's hope Thomas can deliver similar results.
With all due respect, this is a mom-and-pop operation run by a 52-year old relic with no IT experience and a shoe-string budget.
Want faster speeds, dish it up at donation time.
Damn, when you put it like that, it really drove home that you were the age I currently am when I first started looking at this site. Shit Eric, thanks for creating the best Giants community and the one that was my connection to fellow fans from like 10 years old on.
I understand your point of view. But the need and value where there with the OL. All four tackles went fast.
If we were left with what's left after the 1st round, we'd be screwed.
In hindsight I like the pick more than when it was originally done. Didn’t expect all of this talent on Defense to fall. Outside of Jones and Cleveland every OL I expected to go in Round 1 did but neither of those 2 I would feel comfortable starting right away. Thomas is a Day 1 starter and guys like Baun or Winfield Jr. may fit our scheme better than Simmons.
I saw mentioned often before the draft was D'Brickashaw Ferguson. And it really does seem to be a good comparison in terms of their body type and the way they move on the field. Ferguson was also selected 4th overall, although he was more highly regarded as a prospect relative to Thomas at the time.
Ferguson became a 10 year starter who went to 3 Pro Bowls. Let's hope Thomas can deliver similar results.
I always thought Ferguson was a little more finesse.
I think Thomas' upside is more brutish like Trent Williams. I think his floor is pretty safely in the ballpark of Cam Robinson/Jawaan Taylor.
And in all likelihood the outcome lands someplace in between.
I understand your point of view. But the need and value where there with the OL. All four tackles went fast.
If we were left with what's left after the 1st round, we'd be screwed.
Totally agree. I wouldn't have had an issue with Simmons tbh, since that's also a hole that's been on this team other than Armstead and Boley, BUT, I know the smart choice was an OT. I just hope we made the vest decision.
The real lamentable part of this is that every avenue to trade down and still grab one of the 4 fell apart.
I obviously like the pick overall. I had high grades on all four of the OT's and Thomas was my OT2. Only Chase Young would have presented a grading value I couldn't have passed on over one of them. I felt it was far and away the priority position on this roster and needed to be upgraded. Solder/Fleming/Gates just isn't a functional unit when contending with the explosive defenders attacking you in the NFL.
As far as developing Thomas I saw a player that needs some improvement as a pass blocker. He would get overextended out over his toes with forward lean causing his head to dip making him susceptible to push pull moves and hurt his recovery steps and balance. He didn't do it all the time and it's coachable. His elite arm length, foot talent, and high end anchor bode well for his chances to correct this. This is important to note: he does not get pushed around or run around. His issues are not athletic but technique based imo.
He's a mauler in the run game. He can strike you, root you out and put you on the ground. Not much more to say about that. He's top notch in this area.
As Sy said he has a very high ceiling if he sorts out a few things and he's a young player at only 21 years of age. Sy believed he had the highest potential of the four OT's but to me he was second in this regard with only Becton rated higher in upside projection. Thomas upside though is an All Pro level imo.
Looking forward to the flame jobs coming and slicing you all into pieces with my mental riposte and repartee in the coming debate.
Also looking forward to tomorrow and the convo of whether to pick the BPA at #36 or trade down.
Eric: "With all due respect, this is a mom-and-pop operation"
during what I assume will be a limited a offseason. It's the same kind of jump from left to right as vice versa, I hope people keep that in mind his rookie year.
Many of the draft evaluators and BBI hobbyists saw that Thomas gets sloppy in pass protection when he gets tired or beat off the snap. That's the classic Achilles heel of many underachieving lineman, and the difference between a day one left tackle and a guy who ends up on the right side and you hope works his way over.
I don't think Thomas has the rawness and holes Flowers had, and he's not the jerk Flowers is. He's a solid, but unspectacular pick. But he does have that one flaw with his technique Flowers has. It's not a tragedy, and doesn't mean he will be a bad pro.
Just like Solder and Tyron Smith did in their rookie years (and just like Flowers was supposed to before Beatty got hurt).
Now go get a Center. I'd get him at @36. I'd rather not wait until 99 or 110.
Day three, get a decent OT prospect worth developing.
I think we have a solid shot at an ER who can contribute at 36, and that's the route I'd prefer to go. Hopefullly Gross-Matos. If not, than Winfield.
We do need defensive help, and Centers in rd 3 are still serviceable players (plus, consider the fact our centers are total ass)_
If we still had the 68th pick, I might risk waiting, but for me waiting until 99 is too great a risk.
I understand we need defensive help (and a WR, too), but in my view Center is more important. I didn't want to wait until 36 to draft an OT, and I don't want to wait until 99 to draft an OC.
Similar height/weight, but Brick was kind of the reverse of Thomas as a player. Thomas is a powerful run blocker who has some struggles with speed rushers when. Pass blocking. Brick was a technician with very quick feet. Great pass blocker but not a particularly powerful run blocker.
I obviously like the pick overall. I had high grades on all four of the OT's and Thomas was my OT2. Only Chase Young would have presented a grading value I couldn't have passed on over one of them. I felt it was far and away the priority position on this roster and needed to be upgraded. Solder/Fleming/Gates just isn't a functional unit when contending with the explosive defenders attacking you in the NFL.
As far as developing Thomas I saw a player that needs some improvement as a pass blocker. He would get overextended out over his toes with forward lean causing his head to dip making him susceptible to push pull moves and hurt his recovery steps and balance. He didn't do it all the time and it's coachable. His elite arm length, foot talent, and high end anchor bode well for his chances to correct this. This is important to note: he does not get pushed around or run around. His issues are not athletic but technique based imo.
He's a mauler in the run game. He can strike you, root you out and put you on the ground. Not much more to say about that. He's top notch in this area.
As Sy said he has a very high ceiling if he sorts out a few things and he's a young player at only 21 years of age. Sy believed he had the highest potential of the four OT's but to me he was second in this regard with only Becton rated higher in upside projection. Thomas upside though is an All Pro level imo.
Looking forward to the flame jobs coming and slicing you all into pieces with my mental riposte and repartee in the coming debate.
Also looking forward to tomorrow and the convo of whether to pick the BPA at #36 or trade down.
Good summation bro . Excited it wasn't Wirfs. But more importantly think this kid has tremendous upside as a Left Tsckle. How long has it been?
Just like Solder and Tyron Smith did in their rookie years (and just like Flowers was supposed to before Beatty got hurt).
Now go get a Center. I'd get him at @36. I'd rather not wait until 99 or 110.
Day three, get a decent OT prospect worth developing.
I think we have a solid shot at an ER who can contribute at 36, and that's the route I'd prefer to go. Hopefullly Gross-Matos. If not, than Winfield.
We do need defensive help, and Centers in rd 3 are still serviceable players (plus, consider the fact our centers are total ass)_
If we still had the 68th pick, I might risk waiting, but for me waiting until 99 is too great a risk.
I understand we need defensive help (and a WR, too), but in my view Center is more important. I didn't want to wait until 36 to draft an OT, and I don't want to wait until 99 to draft an OC.
We 10000% need a C, but we have literally no edge rushers. I'd love to take a shot on an ER who fell to the top of round 2.
Our centers are awful and we desperately need one, but drafting Thomas and moving Solder should solidify the line to some degree.
It's funny, I hear a lot of NYG fans older than me (my dad included) lament the fact there are no imposing, awesome LBs who can dictate the game. But for my generation (born in 89), I feel the same way about the dearth of DEs and absolute dog shit ERs. The first team I remember was the 97 Armstead, Sehorn, Strahan, Sparks team. Yeah, most of those guys weren't rushers, but you can see why I loved strahan and how he led to the era of Osi, Tuck, Kiwi, JPP, the NASCAR formation.
The way you slightly older guys find the lack of LBs appalling (though I guess you'd be used to it by now, lol).... I find the lack of DEs to just be the antithesis of Giants football.
Really had hopes for players like Owa and 'damonster', but fuck man, these never pan out! I want to take one high again
Sy, Daniel Jeremiah, and Bucky Brooks, for starters, all mentioned seeing some issues with pass pro, footwork, and AA. I'm confident they saw what I saw. Joey and Torrag are two more BBIers who understand OL play who also saw some rough moments.
That said, I think Thomas is an excellent pick for NYG righ now, and I've made it abundantly clear.
Thanks for all your posts and insight. I and a lot of other BBIers really appreciate them.
First of all, I doubt they move Solder to RT, as I said above. Maybe they will, but I doubt it.
Second, we do have ER's. They may not be great ER's but we do have them. It's up to our DC and his staff to get the most out of them, along with the rest of the defense.
We have nothing at Center. Zero, zip, zilch. I was hoping the Giants would sign at least a "place-holder" in free agency, allowing them to wait until later on to draft a decent prospect worth developing, but they didn't.
As I also said, if they still had the 68th pick, I'd be fine with them waiting to fill that hole, but they don't. Barring a trade down, if I'm Dave Gettleman I'm not waiting until 99 to look for an OC.
First of all, I doubt they move Solder to RT, as I said above. Maybe they will, but I doubt it.
Second, we do have ER's. They may not be great ER's but we do have them. It's up to our DC and his staff to get the most out of them, along with the rest of the defense.
We have nothing at Center. Zero, zip, zilch. I was hoping the Giants would sign at least a "place-holder" in free agency, allowing them to wait until later on to draft a decent prospect worth developing, but they didn't.
As I also said, if they still had the 68th pick, I'd be fine with them waiting to fill that hole, but they don't. Barring a trade down, if I'm Dave Gettleman I'm not waiting until 99 to look for an OC.
I agree we have absolute trash at Center. Basically two players who would be lucky to have roster spots on another team.
I just think you have a better chance of either picking up a servicable C in FA (Jamon Brown style, or even someone like Jason Whittle, who, while a G, was just stopgap) -- or finding one in later rounds... than you do of getting an ER.
And yeah, I guess we have "ERs", the same we "have" a center. The centers are worse at their positions than the ERs, but the ERs we have are awful, definitely bottom 20% of the league, and have a more important role on the team as it's currently constructed (I do understand that Centers are the brains of the OL).
Idk. 36 is also VERY high to take a center, and we wouldn't even be taking the first one off the board...
The LW trade was fucking dumb
Judge says he already told all the OT's they are competing for LT & RT
all of them have played both, everything is an open competition, will sort it out in training camp.
I'd be surprised if a rookie beats out Solder with a limited offseason, but stranger things have happened. Who knows maybe Solder would be better at RT.
Then you have two spots where your starters are adjusting to a different game. The Giants just signed a 280lb TE, they'll probably put the rookie at RT and let that guy help him.
Before the draft, I said half-jokingly that we should've drafted Tua and traded him to the Dolphins, then traded Herbert and traded him to the Chargers. In retrospect, I think that would have worked, because both teams proved those were their guys. We could have netted another 3rd rounder from both and still gotten our guy, Andrew Thomas. I wish we had shown some more guts and brains. Gettleman doesn't inspire any confidence. Thomas may be a good player, but there was no need to reach for him with the 4th pick.
Now, we should take the best center available, because we have nothing at that position.
We put Thomas next to Hernandez on the left side. That would be some real growing pains for Mr. Jones. Thomas starts at right tackle. Plays next to a vet. Solder is gone after this year and Thomas moves over to left. The flip side to this is let Thomas grow with Hernandez and let Thomas continue playing the same side he’s played for the last 2 years. My advice, stick him at right tackle day 1. Solder struggles move Thomas over or insert cam flemming
First of all, I doubt they move Solder to RT, as I said above. Maybe they will, but I doubt it.
Second, we do have ER's. They may not be great ER's but we do have them. It's up to our DC and his staff to get the most out of them, along with the rest of the defense.
We have nothing at Center. Zero, zip, zilch. I was hoping the Giants would sign at least a "place-holder" in free agency, allowing them to wait until later on to draft a decent prospect worth developing, but they didn't.
As I also said, if they still had the 68th pick, I'd be fine with them waiting to fill that hole, but they don't. Barring a trade down, if I'm Dave Gettleman I'm not waiting until 99 to look for an OC.
for the team at this time. Solder (most definitely) and Zeitler (strong maybe) are likely done after this year. Talent always matters but for OL continuity is a strong second imo.
Hernandez, Thomas and hopefully a strong C/G in the next rounds and maybe we are looking at a young, talented group that can grow together.
I was a little higher on Wills but after reading more on Thomas and his dominating in the run game I am convinced the Giants are going to be a very physical, heavy run team under Judge. I'm happy and this will play better to DJ's development growth and maximize his potential.
but Jason Garrett was involved in drafting 3 all-pro OL (Smith, Martin, Frederick). I'd say it's safe to say he's got a pretty good idea of what type of players thrive in his offensive system and assuming he was involved in these discussions*, it should give you some more confidence that Thomas was the best OT available.
*based on everything Judge has said, no reason to think JG wasn't heavily involved in scouting and providing feedback.
ours is the one which stands out as an overdraft. Not sufficient value for the #4 pick. Unfortunately, I am not surprised.
you cant voluntarily trade down....
Not that I advocate the strategy, but technically a team can draft at a lower slot by just not handing in the card. No compensation in draft picks, but the cost savings on signing bonus/salary is the only benefit in such a strategy. Of course, DG would never live down the "asleep at the wheel" criticism if he just held the card until whatever slot the fans felt was appropriate.
You put him at RT to start. You have a very good vet G next to him in Zeitler
Now, at some point a C is going to be needed....but if Gros-Matos is there I am getting him. If I am going defense I want a guy who appears he can get to the QB
Traded back and still got him.
But what makes this hurt is JR drafted Flowers who is supposed to be at LT in his Prime now instead we are here backfilling.
He's the best tackle in this draft class. I think he's the cleanest tackle. This kid's going to be a longtime starter on the left side. This year he'll start on the right. (Pete Prisco)
Similar height/weight, but Brick was kind of the reverse of Thomas as a player. Thomas is a powerful run blocker who has some struggles with speed rushers when. Pass blocking. Brick was a technician with very quick feet. Great pass blocker but not a particularly powerful run blocker.
.
Hopefully Thomas can last a decade in this league like
Ferguson did! I could see Thomas starting at RT, then switched to LT. If there wasn't the pandemic going on,
and more time with the players, I could see Thomas starting at LT. The film on Solder was not good at LT
last year, and he already said months ago, he would be willing to move. He knows he didn't play well last year.
019 All American First Team
ALl SEC
SEC OL player of the year
Georgia Offensive MVP
He achieved all these while playing against the top players and teams in college football. LSU, Bama, Auburn, etc.
Watch the OL youtube video of all the Georgia offensive plays vs LSU. He was matched up against Chaisson, the #20 pick in the draft, and Chaisson sniffed Fromm 1 time total, and that wasn't a sack but an incompletion. I actually had to do a double check that this was Chaisson, he looked like that outmatched.
With all due respect, this is a mom-and-pop operation run by a 52-year old relic with no IT experience and a shoe-string budget.
Want faster speeds, dish it up at donation time.
I’m going to offer again, I’d really like to help with these server issues. You say it yourself that you don’t have the experience, I’m willing to donate my time and at this point I’ll help cover costs to keep the site up on big days.
to know we have 3 clear cut answers along the OL now, assuming Thomas is at least a capable long term starer, which I don't think is a huge stretch. And we also have GAtes.
I know the OL wasn't good last year but it also wasn't as bad as the crap we saw in 16-17. Maybe we are finally turning a corner and with Barkley and Jones here, the O might be on to something. One can dream.
I know we needed an O linemen but I really wanted Simmons....
This pick continues the Giants third second year pick of a player on PFF's All PFF-Era Prospect Team.
2016 - Sterling Shepard
2018 - Saquoun Barkley
2020 - Andrew Thomas
I would have like Simmons but out of the tackles I like this pick. A good athlete, tough demeanor, mauler in the run game.
Go Giants! https://www.pff.com/news/draft-all-pff-era-prospect-team-2020 - ( New Window )
I like this pick. I think out of all the tackles he's the one that really is the most complete and I think he's going to be a very good player for us for many years. Now let's get some defensive guys, and a center!
@Ourlads_Sy
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30m
#4 NYG: Andrew Thomas - OT/Georgia
A must for a team that has given Saquon Barkley nothing to work with up front. If they want to own the line of scrimmage, Thomas is the guy you want in your corner
I would say Okudah was bigger overdraft. No other player at 4 was going to look like less of an overdraft than Thomas. We don’t know how the spread was among our OT rankings.
Agreed! I'd like to see the Giants get Cesar Ruiz at C. Great kid, great character and he'll bring his best to the field for every game.
If Marc Colombo can clean up his feetwork, including his kick-slide and his work against speed rushers, Thomas could be an excellent LT.
2016 - Sterling Shepard
2018 - Saquoun Barkley
2020 - Andrew Thomas
I would have like Simmons but out of the tackles I like this pick. A good athlete, tough demeanor, mauler in the run game.
Go Giants!
https://www.pff.com/news/draft-all-pff-era-prospect-team-2020 - ( New Window )
Not so sure. I think he was the top OT on a few boards so could have missed him if we dealt to 9
"With the 4th overall pick, the Giants select Andrew Thomas"
"D'OH!"
We don’t need the boom or bust right now. We need a guy who we can trust to start at RT this year and LT after that.
I have confidence Thomas can do that. Proven starter in the SEC. This is a building block.
How is he an overdraft? All college season he has been mentioned as a top OT. Good God. Have you watched the Giants OL?
Was there ever a draft day in BBI's history when the site did not crash?
What trade? Nobody has made a trade. Nobody wants to trade. Why is this so hard to understand....
I hope they don't have him start at RT.
I hope that’s how it plays out. Keep Solder at RT this year and let’s hope Gates earns the C job with a draft pick backing him up.
You people do realize that to trade your pick, you have to have someone that wants to move up to your pick and pay a premium in picks to do so, right?
He was clearly the top tackle on their board, and he clearly was a top 10 worthy player. Take him and don't look back.
Good, solid pick.
I really loved Simmons but we didn’t have the luxury this year. Oh well, I hope they can land Chaisson by trading up in the back end of round 2
But FINE. I'm just glad the Giants got ONE of the good OTs. Hope they know a TON more than I do about these guys.
But FINE. I'm just glad the Giants got ONE of the good OTs. Hope they know a TON more than I do about these guys.
+1
I’m sure Wirfs will be a solid player, but sounded like the most likely to be kicked to guard in the NFL. Giants have been desperate for an anchor at tackle for a long time. Let’s hope we picked the right guy
Thomas will be judged vis-a-vis Becton
I really loved Simmons but we didn’t have the luxury this year. Oh well, I hope they can land Chaisson by trading up in the back end of round 2
I meant back end of round 1.
And I'll say one more thing,after spending 3 top 10 picks on a running back,QB,and offensive tackle.If we could do it over again,I'm not sure I would take Barkley.The Giants are gonna have to get lucky with some of these mid round defensive guys.
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We’ll see. Has to be a pro bowl type player at 4. Could have been had with a trade down.
What trade? Nobody has made a trade. Nobody wants to trade. Why is this so hard to understand....
I understand. Why so hostile? Would have preferred BPA.
But FINE. I'm just glad the Giants got ONE of the good OTs. Hope they know a TON more than I do about these guys.
Is it though? Maybe they simply think Thomas is better? If Judge is getting talked into taking players based on past relationships we've got problems.
What worries me is the Flowers traits, like you said. Didn’t like when DJ was shitting on the pick, either:
“I don’t see elite athleticism..I had him as my 4th OT...I thought there were better options”....
I respect those who loved Simmons and I see what he could bring to the table, but I'm glad we went this direction. We need to build on our cornerstone combo of Jones/Barkley.
It takes two to trade.
Apparently the reports of the last few days that Gettleman could not find a partner were accurate.
It also suggests that some of us enamored with Simmons were over rating him with respect to what Pro teams felt his rank should be.
Great pick. He played LT in the SEC and dominated. Go look at what he did against Chaisson and Okwara. Dude is a mauler. Long arms. His technical issues can be fixed with good coaching. High character.
Reminiscent of Flowers... what an absolute nightmare and every Giants fans biggest fear.
You think Thomas is a pro bowl type LT??
Exactly. Can't mess around. Get him in place at LT, at 4th overall needs to be.
We needed this pick for ten friggin years now. And the real life scouts, you know the actual people who have drafted players for real and know what they are looking at love Thomas.
I don’t like that he skipped his bowl game. Me guy versus team first guy?
Poor value at #4.
Link - ( New Window )
My source told me the Lions were not trading down a few minutes before the Lions pick was in.
Immediately it was Thomas vs. a trade down.
Not even 10 minutes later he told me it was Thomas. I tried to post but couldn't get on, so I emailed Eric.
Five minutes later it was announced.
So it appears we did really try to trade down but didn't.
We needed this pick for ten friggin years now. And the real life scouts, you know the actual people who have drafted players for real and know what they are looking at love Thomas.
shame ESPN doesn't employ any real life scouts.
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He put some stuff on tape that is reminiscent of Flowers with the waist bending, chasing, and grabbing. But, the Giants got their target and have their LT of the future.
People have bad games...
@NYPost_Schwartz
·
Apr 23
Joe Judge said he used his contacts to fill in the gaps about the draft prospects. Judge worked with Kirby Smart at Alabama, and Smart was Andrew Thomas' coach at Georgia.
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but the rub on Wills is undersized, there's concern his ceiling is very good RT, but not pro bowl caliber LT.
You think Thomas is a pro bowl type LT??
I think he's the best LT in this draft, and they're hard to come by to begin with. He's got to clean up the pass pro, but he's got top notch experience and plenty of tools.
Who was BPA? I bet it was Derrick Brown, and fans who wanted OL got what they wanted! No trade down to be had, dudes.
We couldn't have moved down 1 spot with Miami to grab an extra pick??
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but the rub on Wills is undersized, there's concern his ceiling is very good RT, but not pro bowl caliber LT.
You think Thomas is a pro bowl type LT??
I think he's the best LT in this draft, and they're hard to come by to begin with. He's got to clean up the pass pro, but he's got top notch experience and plenty of tools.
Who was BPA? I bet it was Derrick Brown, and fans who wanted OL got what they wanted! No trade down to be had, dudes.
The thing about Thomas is that he's clearly a LT. I agree that the lines have blurred between the two tackle spots, with Jones' lack of feel from the blindside, it adds a little more weight to that OL spot.
If you're being intellectually honest, I'm sure you can find it. Some of it was in the college post-season.
We needed this pick for ten friggin years now. And the real life scouts, you know the actual people who have drafted players for real and know what they are looking at love Thomas.
10 years? We tried. Pugh and Flowers, remember.
Clearly the Giants DO think Thomas was better cause they could have had their pick. MAYBE the Alabama folks told them (somehow) that WIlls was maybe NOT worth the 4. Or SOMETHING that put him behind Thomas on their board. Maybe it was that he never played the left side. We'll never know.
All I'm saying is that WHATEVER the Alabama guys said about WIlls -- good, bad, or indifferent, wasn't enough to move him ahead of Thomas on the Giants' board. And I do find that interesting.
I don’t like that he skipped his bowl game. Me guy versus team first guy?
Poor value at #4.
Nick Bosa chose not to return to OSU either
that ends now. this team MUST develop the QB. there should be no debate about that. you can't do that if he's running for his life.
you want to see a better defense? get some first downs consistently on offense. run the ball on offense consistently with positive plays.
you win upfront on offense and defense. it's time this team gets back to that. now go grab hennessey in rd 2 or rd 3 and we're in business.
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In comment 14880074 RDJR said:
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We’ll see. Has to be a pro bowl type player at 4. Could have been had with a trade down.
What trade? Nobody has made a trade. Nobody wants to trade. Why is this so hard to understand....
I understand. Why so hostile? Would have preferred BPA.
You did not say you would have prefered BPA(maybe on the Giants board Thomas was). You said he could have been had later on with a trade. Big difference, don't you think.
Wasn't hostile, I was pissed.
Anak called it.
I still like the pick, he fills a huge need, and I preferred defense.
He dominated Chaisson
Let's hope Thomas is the best of the bunch for 10 plus years in blue. This will help the whole team. The best defense is a good offense.
It's not a home run but it had to happen and it did. Hope the kid pans out.
Not really getting some of the anger getting tossed at JonC in recent days. He’s one of the most reliable posters on BBI.
DG might have also valued LT more with it being the #4 overall pick, considering he's old school, because the new school doesn't place as much emphasis on LT vs. RT since pass rushers can line up all over... BUT-- having played QB in high school myself with a TERRIBLE OL for much of my career, hell I personally still would prefer my stud OL be protecting my blindside, that's for sure.
Pretty boring. Would have gone Wirfs but they obviously saw a need to make sure they got a LT at 4. I have been on the take the best lineman period band wagon.
We couldn't have moved down 1 spot with Miami to grab an extra pick??
Clearly, the Dolphins weren't interested in trading down! Takes two to tango...
DG knows his "molliehogs". Joe Judge had to be convinced that even with his personal connections to the Alabama and Iowa tackles, that Thomas is the answer.
On top of that, Jason Garrett and Marc Colombo have to be convinced that Thomas is the top choice of the 4 OT's. Those guys know what a a great OT looks like.
Had to laugh that both talking heads on ESPN were dissing the pick right away, the first of the 4 picks to be questioned...
I would be fine if they go OL in the second round too, center please?
The Raiders did Raider things. The Giants made a solid pick.
Solder gets a pass due to his son’s illness. Plus, he has pride and is determined to show us he can still play.
All,of a sudden I feel a lot better with these two changes.
We couldn't have moved down 1 spot with Miami to grab an extra pick??
Yeah, in addition to being a high school band geek, Thomas was:
First-team All-American (2019)
SEC's 2019 Jacobs Blocking Trophy (UGA's first recipient of the award in 21 years)
First-team All-SEC by Coaches and Associated Press (2019)
Semifinalist for the 2019 Outland Trophy
One of four permanent team captains (2019)
Co-winner of 2019 Vince Dooley Offensive MVP Award
SI.com first-team All-American (2018)
Second-team All-American by Associated Press & Walter Camp (2018)
All-America Second Team
First-team All-SEC by Coaches (2018)
Freshman All-Americas by ESPN, USA Today and the Football Writers Association of America (2017)
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You are dishonest. Give us an answer instead of your usual evading.
Not really getting some of the anger getting tossed at JonC in recent days. He’s one of the most reliable posters on BBI.
Agreed. Nothing wrong with having opinions and disagreeing with each other, but a couple posters seem desperate to get into pissing matches
do you think if we picked third it would have been a different pick? I don't.
Nah, just listen to the GM
Taken with the 4th overall pick of the NFL Draft???
Oh, boy.
Time will tell.
But for now... WTF?
Dude, why don’t you tell us why you see Flowers in this pick? What is your basis of comparison?
Solder gets a pass due to his son’s illness. Plus, he has pride and is determined to show us he can still play.
All,of a sudden I feel a lot better with these two changes.
Solder at RT is light years better than anyone the past 2 years
I think they keep him at LT with Solder moving to the right side.
Not saying the red flag isn’t significant but Thomas going into fall of 2019 was the overwhelming stud OT. I like the pick and think we are sensitized, rightfully so, by Flowers. Thomas isn’t Flowers
The thing is, he's not the most talented, and isn't the most ready player, of the bunch, so what's the likelihood that he turns out to be the best? He definitely doesn't look the best on tape to me, but hey what do I know?
It seemed to me that, if Miami had traded up with Detroit to grab Tua, then Jaguars would've traded up with us to grab Okudah. I'm pretty sure Thomas would've been there at 9. So Detroit kinda fucked us. And too bad Chargers didn't have the hots for Tua.
To me, although it's difficult to second guess and go through all the permutations, but it won't be easy to dismiss in the future if Tua or Herbert turns out to be great and Jones is merely good.
Taken with the 4th overall pick of the NFL Draft???
Oh, boy.
Time will tell.
But for now... WTF?
Inconsistent? Seriously? Have you watched him.
Taken with the 4th overall pick of the NFL Draft???
Oh, boy.
Time will tell.
But for now... WTF?
In what world is a guy who allowed one sack last year in the best conference in college football considered inconsistent? It’s not like Fromm is very mobile either.
After Flowers, Solder, Omameh, Pugh, etc.
People don’t think the most solid, reliable tackle prospect with the highest floor would be appealing to them?
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You are dishonest. Give us an answer instead of your usual evading.
Not really getting some of the anger getting tossed at JonC in recent days. He’s one of the most reliable posters on BBI.
Agreed
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Taken with the 4th overall pick of the NFL Draft???
Oh, boy.
Time will tell.
But for now... WTF?
Inconsistent? Seriously? Have you watched him.
M.S. loves to bitch and moan about everything NYG do. Nothing to see here...
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You are dishonest. Give us an answer instead of your usual evading.
Not really getting some of the anger getting tossed at JonC in recent days. He’s one of the most reliable posters on BBI.
+2.
Much quicker then Flowers...i do not see a Flowers comparison.
I think he needs to spend more time in weight room....love the 36+ arms.
Far more prepared to step into LT....then the other 3.....maybe not the upside....will need to see how that plays out.
Like that Judge and the Georgia coach worked together.....should get real.skinny.
I love the pick, I do wonder what trade offers were on the table, if any, but a battle tested, physical left, thrilled.
Another asshole who bitches about every move NYG make. Sigh....
The thing is, he's not the most talented, and isn't the most ready player, of the bunch, so what's the likelihood that he turns out to be the best? He definitely doesn't look the best on tape to me, but hey what do I know?
It seemed to me that, if Miami had traded up with Detroit to grab Tua, then Jaguars would've traded up with us to grab Okudah. I'm pretty sure Thomas would've been there at 9. So Detroit kinda fucked us. And too bad Chargers didn't have the hots for Tua.
To me, although it's difficult to second guess and go through all the permutations, but it won't be easy to dismiss in the future if Tua or Herbert turns out to be great and Jones is merely good.
It's all about timing. Before the pads came off for the combine, Thomas was thought to be the top OT by many people. So saying he's not the most talented or the most ready is just an opinion from a guy on a couch.
Not really adding a whole lot of insight there.
Here’s something to be excited about - your young quarterback might have 3 seconds to survey the field, and your all pro running back might not have to make 2 guys miss to make 4 yards.
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You are dishonest. Give us an answer instead of your usual evading.
Dude, why don’t you tell us why you see Flowers in this pick? What is your basis of comparison?
That is not what he said.
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In comment 14880216 M.S. said:
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Taken with the 4th overall pick of the NFL Draft???
Oh, boy.
Time will tell.
But for now... WTF?
Inconsistent? Seriously? Have you watched him.
M.S. loves to bitch and moan about everything NYG do. Nothing to see here...
Written by Sy’56:
“The second issue, he looks like a train wreck in pass protection at times. He struggles to reach his point against speed and he shows his numbers to the ground too often. While his power and reach can partially make up for it, he simply needs to get better there or he will get eaten alive by the top end pass rushers.”
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Taken with the 4th overall pick of the NFL Draft???
Oh, boy.
Time will tell.
But for now... WTF?
Inconsistent? Seriously? Have you watched him.
Thomas having his way against LSU
Link - ( New Window )
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You are dishonest. Give us an answer instead of your usual evading.
Not really getting some of the anger getting tossed at JonC in recent days. He’s one of the most reliable posters on BBI.
There are some nasty people out there
But again-- I still believe based purely on the impression most people had at the end of the college football season, without overthinking it, Thomas seemed to be the favorite to be the top OT, maybe tied with Wills (and I'm sure being the natural LT might have given him the slight edge over RT Wills on many boards).
Not saying it's a sure thing, just saying I think we just got a pretty good football player, and by all accounts a pretty good guy. Two very important things when hoping you got a "sure thing" in the top 5-10 picks, and he plays one of the most important positions on the entire team. Tons of experience in the toughest conference in the nation, and the award for best OL in the SEC last year on top of that. We all knew we weren't getting an Ogden/Pace type of guy in this draft, we're kidding ourselves if we think any of these 4 are going to be at that level, but I don't see how anyone could say they know FOR SURE that this was a bad pick in any sense.
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Agreed, there's no super clean OT prospect in this draft, but Giants got the #1 LT, despite what the espn draftniks are saying.
I love the pick, I do wonder what trade offers were on the table, if any, but a battle tested, physical left, thrilled.
Given no trades until #13, got to think assets like #2 picks are being held tightly. I wouldn't risk my target for a #3 pick. Giants got their guy at LT, I wanted defense and even I'm onboard with picking Thomas.
Not for nothing, but you don’t know that. I’m happy with the pick, but again, just have to wonder what was offered, if anything.
The thing is, he's not the most talented, and isn't the most ready player, of the bunch, so what's the likelihood that he turns out to be the best? He definitely doesn't look the best on tape to me, but hey what do I know?
It seemed to me that, if Miami had traded up with Detroit to grab Tua, then Jaguars would've traded up with us to grab Okudah. I'm pretty sure Thomas would've been there at 9. So Detroit kinda fucked us. And too bad Chargers didn't have the hots for Tua.
To me, although it's difficult to second guess and go through all the permutations, but it won't be easy to dismiss in the future if Tua or Herbert turns out to be great and Jones is merely good.
jesus christ...exactly you dont know so do us a favor and dont distribute your opinion like a fact. Based on about 5 different articles I read Thomas is regarded as the most NFL ready.
I sure hope so, and is not an eventual guard convert (as Pugh and Flowers) are.
There's and old i& cruel idiom that says "Those who can, do; those who can't, teach". We're is DESPERATE need at LT.
Great pick. They know a helluva lot more than we do.
Who played the most LT? Thomas.
Who played in the toughest conference? Thomas (Wills too).
Who had the best wonderlic? Thomas.
Who had the best size? Thomas is more prototypical than Wirfs/Wills even though he isn't as big as Becton (whose size is both advantage + concern).
I know PFF is frowned upon but Thomas even graded out the highest there.
Wirfs may have been the best athlete, but I'm not sure he's even a tackle (Bob McGinn for example ranked him as a G, and also correctly had Thomas as his OT1). Wills tape is really good and he may have been in the conversation, but I'm not sure he has the upside Thomas has. Becton is a unicorn - ultimate boom/bust.
None of these guys are perfect - ideally you'd want to see a little better movement from Thomas and more consistency in pass pro - but of the 4 he's the cleanest and closest to a true blue goose LT.
Unhappy we skipped on Wills, happy we skipped Wirfs. Thomas floor is not Flowers it is a pretty good but not great tackle. His ceiling is a close to dominant Tackle. Bectons flags proved too much, Wirfs is a better OG.
“The second issue, he looks like a train wreck in pass protection at times. He struggles to reach his point against speed and he shows his numbers to the ground too often. While his power and reach can partially make up for it, he simply needs to get better there or he will get eaten alive by the top end pass rushers.”
you cant voluntarily trade down....
Who played the most LT? Thomas.
Who played in the toughest conference? Thomas (Wills too).
Who had the best wonderlic? Thomas.
Who had the best size? Thomas is more prototypical than Wirfs/Wills even though he isn't as big as Becton (whose size is both advantage + concern).
I know PFF is frowned upon but Thomas even graded out the highest there.
Wirfs may have been the best athlete, but I'm not sure he's even a tackle (Bob McGinn for example ranked him as a G, and also correctly had Thomas as his OT1). Wills tape is really good and he may have been in the conversation, but I'm not sure he has the upside Thomas has. Becton is a unicorn - ultimate boom/bust.
None of these guys are perfect - ideally you'd want to see a little better movement from Thomas and more consistency in pass pro - but of the 4 he's the cleanest and closest to a true blue goose LT.
Outstanding post.
If a player behind him becomes a better player he is a bust? Genius. I guess every single player drafted before Tom Brady was a bust
I remember watching Flowers in college, and whenever they played competitive teams, he struggled. They played the Gators, and he couldn’t handle their speed and power.
Thomas, who’s been a 3 year starter at Georgia, has at times looked dominant against the most competitive teams. You just didn’t see that at all with Flowers. I don’t expect Thomas to be a perfect left tackle, not many are, but I do expect something we haven’t had in my lifetime, a solid and at times dominant left tackle.
“The second issue, he looks like a train wreck in pass protection at times. He struggles to reach his point against speed and he shows his numbers to the ground too often. While his power and reach can partially make up for it, he simply needs to get better there or he will get eaten alive by the top end pass rushers.”
And Dave Diehl and Shaun O’Hara both ranked him as the top tackle in the draft.
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Agreed, there's no super clean OT prospect in this draft, but Giants got the #1 LT, despite what the espn draftniks are saying.
I love the pick, I do wonder what trade offers were on the table, if any, but a battle tested, physical left, thrilled.
The Lions wanted to trade down and they were in the best position to do it, they used every second on the clock before making their pick. The Giants wanted to trade down, they used every second on the clock before making their pick. A trade wasn't made until 13, and it was a one pick swap.
A trade wasn't on the table.
I sure hope so, and is not an eventual guard convert (as Pugh and Flowers) are.
There's and old i& cruel idiom that says "Those who can, do; those who can't, teach". We're is DESPERATE need at LT.
That saying is bullshit. “Those who can, do, those who UNDERSTAND and know how to communicate, teach.”
Stupid ass saying... how the fuck can someone teach if they don’t know it...seriously, it’s one of the dumbest and misquoted sayings ever.
Stanley was probably smoother in pass pro as a prospect and Thomas looks a little more tenacious as a run blocker. Hopefully this comp holds up and we've got our first pro bowl OL since Snee.
Was he the 4th best player in the draft? Is he a top 5 type player? Those are legitimate questions.
I suspect history will be the Giants drafted for need and Thomas will be a sturdy player.
The Giants deserve a break picking a college left tackle. The last couple haven't panned out.
There was a lot of smoke around this guy. The last three first first round picks have been telegraphed.
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I sure hope so, and is not an eventual guard convert (as Pugh and Flowers) are.
There's and old i& cruel idiom that says "Those who can, do; those who can't, teach". We're is DESPERATE need at LT.
That saying is bullshit. “Those who can, do, those who UNDERSTAND and know how to communicate, teach.”
Stupid ass saying... how the fuck can someone teach if they don’t know it...seriously, it’s one of the dumbest and misquoted sayings ever.
Lol you're not getting the joke dude. Those who can play left tackle, those who can't move to guard.
Maybe some of the other OTs will be better, BUT not all of them will be, and I hope people look back on this with hindsight and realize that we NEEDED a safe pick along the OL.
Would have been happy with Simmons though as well, as he is the type of player you need for the modern NFL. And he's the type of player you want for the NFL 4 years from now.
Having said that:
1) anyone cheering us winning the Redskins game has a ton of egg on their face. Yeah, we all knew seconds after the game this would happen, but maybe now the ramifications are much clearer. You better hope Thomas doesn't get abused by Young into the 2030s (first time in my life I've written out 2030s... shit, times flying).
2) The Skins and Cowboys got IMPACT players while we took a safe pick. This was a result of our awful previous draft classes, but it hurts to see Young and C-D on the cobwoys. Do not have any disillusionments, this is a decade of playing against players who are "problems", as coaches say it.
No he is inconsistent! Hahaha what a joke
Thomas you know can play left tackle and he did it in the best conference in the country and gave up 1 sack..
Drafted your starting left tackle for the next 10 to 12 years
You can't look at the draft in a vacuum. We NEEDED a dependable pick that could contribute. You wanna take a shot on Beckton and find him to be another flowers?
Thomas was, by far, my favorite offensive lineman in this draft because he was the only one that I was certain can play left tackle.
Wirfs played limited snaps there, and may even move off RT like Scherff did.
Becton who knows. The guy is just a mammoth. Maybe he is the new prototype or maybe there's a reason there's never really been a 370 pound LT before.
We collectively may have discounted that fact more than we should have since our vacancy is at RT - but as much as things have equalized a little bit LT's are still worth more.
I believe we've been traumatized by Flowers. So we might be over-analyzing something that our current staff feels is fixable.
This is not about the Giants making a bad pick -- the story of this draft is the rest of the division drafting gamechangers.
Oh, and Chaisson just went #20 in the 1st rd
Thomas is the best tackle this team will be starting in decades.
Now we need DG to just find another OT and a Center, and finally turn this team in the right direction.
When you watch games the other tackle did the same exact thing..
This is not about the Giants making a bad pick -- the story of this draft is the rest of the division drafting gamechangers.
A good OT who can actually block is not a game changer? Someone who doesn’t get the QB creamed, and doesn’t have the RB constantly getting hit behind the line of scrimmage isn’t a game changer?
You do realize he is a LT right?
Thomas you know can play left tackle and he did it in the best conference in the country and gave up 1 sack..
Drafted your starting left tackle for the next 10 to 12 years
Sonic, and now we root for Thomas to be the Young Stopper.
Some WTF, some feeling it was a reach, etc etc
I think the pick was a good one last year in hindsight. We just have to trust the pick for now.
Plus, Judge has his fingerprints on it too and I think he likes the toughness
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It's a reach for me. I realize Gettleman's drafted well but to me I don't see how you can reconcile picking a RT at 4.
You do realize he is a LT right?
No. Yikes. Thanks
Was he the 4th best player in the draft? Is he a top 5 type player? Those are legitimate questions.
I suspect history will be the Giants drafted for need and Thomas will be a sturdy player.
The Giants deserve a break picking a college left tackle. The last couple haven't panned out.
This is a fair question. When we were on the clock other than the trade down I was kind of hoping we'd shock everyone and take Simmons. For a team completely lacking speed on D putting perhaps the fastest LB ever into the equation could be game changing. He was the ultimate upside pick.
That said I get it. It's a little bit of a safer pick - but if he's the guy they think he is he could be a fixture for a decade. Even when OT's lose a step they can still be impact players.
I don't expect this to happen but if they spent then next 4 picks on defensive players with speed they could end up with the best of both worlds to a degree. Especially if they get lucky with Murray or Queen or Baun sliding to 36.
BTW, the guy was born in 1999.
Fuck.
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It's a reach for me. I realize Gettleman's drafted well but to me I don't see how you can reconcile picking a RT at 4.
You do realize he is a LT right?
Yeah that may be the most puzzling comment here
This is classic. You first don't even know what fucking position the guy plays, then you call that position a reach??
Fuck us all.
No, you finish the job and get a center. No half assing it. Get the line fixed. Get some fresh OL backups to work on and then watch Barkley be in the secondary before the LBs know he's gone...
Nothing against Murray. Just want the OL finished.
just mind boggling...
Ruiz, the LSU kid, the Temple kid. Rd. 2 or 3 has to be a center.
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Make it happen.
No, you finish the job and get a center. No half assing it. Get the line fixed. Get some fresh OL backups to work on and then watch Barkley be in the secondary before the LBs know he's gone...
Nothing against Murray. Just want the OL finished.
Im with you.. fix the OL.. Once and for all..
Gone
just mind boggling...
(Video) - ( New Window )
There goes Murray, Uber.
You aren’t trading up unless you move 36
The D does suck. But it sucks with young players like Baker, Lawrence, Love, Ximines, Connelly, Ballentine, Beal. We also signed a starting MLB in Martinez. We literally have the worst center position in the league right now.
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And hoping that Patrick Queen slips to 36....
You aren’t trading up unless you move 36
Right. It was two separate thoughts.
I’d go WR (Mims?), but Dave might be sitting there saying to himself he could set this OL up for a decade at LT and Center from this one draft.
As for the clowns asking for “tape” go look for yourselves.
There was a college game this past season where the BBI thread was active where SY was hyping up Thomas pre-game. He looked like shit. Played stiff, high, and technically lazy.
We’ll see. Hopefully he can at least be a decent RT considering the Giants avoided seriously addressing OL in FA to save a starting spot for this pick.
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It’s not all about Oline. Our D sucks if you haven’t noticed.
The D does suck. But it sucks with young players like Baker, Lawrence, Love, Ximines, Connelly, Ballentine, Beal. We also signed a starting MLB in Martinez. We literally have the worst center position in the league right now.
no way he was going 36
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no way he was going 36
I would have tried to trade up
I don't know. If Thomas is the future I would put him at LT, and let the short term vet Solder pick up the nuances of RT. One of them has to play a different position, might as well be SOlder
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Now.
I’d go WR (Mims?), but Dave might be sitting there saying to himself he could set this OL up for a decade at LT and Center from this one draft.
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In comment 14880456 UberAlias said:
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It’s not all about Oline. Our D sucks if you haven’t noticed.
The D does suck. But it sucks with young players like Baker, Lawrence, Love, Ximines, Connelly, Ballentine, Beal. We also signed a starting MLB in Martinez. We literally have the worst center position in the league right now.
. They are both needs. The Oline or bust crowd seldom acknowledges needs on D. Our D has been among worst in the league for ever.
Understandable but we spent a lot of resources on the defense last draft. Have to hope they take strides under new coaching.
Conversely, if Spencer Pulley is our starting center, it’s a failure.
And we dodge the issue of Wirfs getting thrown outside when he's possibly (probably) best suited inside.
A pity the way this season broke, pretty damn bad but just not bad enough, end result with Chase Young in Washington unfortunately.
I also do hope this need-ish driven pick doesn't look silly in four years when Thomas is a solid player if Simmons turns out to be a stud.
This is not about the Giants making a bad pick -- the story of this draft is the rest of the division drafting gamechangers.
Dallas was drafting OL for years while we were drafting receivers. How'd that work out for us.
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Make it happen.
No, you finish the job and get a center. No half assing it. Get the line fixed. Get some fresh OL backups to work on and then watch Barkley be in the secondary before the LBs know he's gone...
Nothing against Murray. Just want the OL finished.
Our defense is horrific.
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Probably the best left tackle in the draft, high character, top conference and competition, and his best game tape is excellent. He didn't always play as well as hoped in the post-season, otherwise there would be fewer questions on his projection to the NFL. He put some stuff on tape that is reminiscent of Flowers with the waist bending, chasing, and grabbing. But, the Giants got their target and have their LT of the future.
Reminiscent of Flowers... what an absolute nightmare and every Giants fans biggest fear.
Not at all. One was an All-American and played in the bets conference and the other one was not close to this pick. Sorry but you get the overreaction of the day trophy
It also depends on what Solder looks like.
Judge already said he has not made up who will be playing where. TBD.
This is the player we’ve been hoping for for 10 years.
This is the player we’ve been hoping for for 10 years.
All American First Team 2019
All SEC 2019
SEC OL player of Year
Georgia Player of the Year
Played and dominated against LSU, Bama, A&M, Auburn, and the rest, plus major Bowl Games. Toughest schedule in the NCAA.
But sure, he is Eric Flowers.
Sy had the Temple kid as his top center.
Thomas is a very good player and a true LT.Plus a very good person.
And we dodge the issue of Wirfs getting thrown outside when he's possibly (probably) best suited inside.
A pity the way this season broke, pretty damn bad but just not bad enough, end result with Chase Young in Washington unfortunately.
I also do hope this need-ish driven pick doesn't look silly in four years when Thomas is a solid player if Simmons turns out to be a stud.
Very well said. It's a shame that we wouldn't draft an impact player at 4. Out of the top 8 , 3 teams aligned value and need with the QB position, the most important position on the field. 4 teams took the best defensive player available that their teams can build around. The Giants surely picked a starter at LT and will hopefully help keep Jones upright which is a positive. Of the 7 players in the draft coveted by most teams, we had a chance to draft 2 of them on defense. There wasn't a trade down option so we stayed put and put need over BPA for certain. God bless Big Blue, it gets more challenging every year.
Agreed Jon that makes the most sense. A lot of interior prospects in this draft, I wouldn't be shocked if they pick a conversion like Bredson from Michigan in the 4th/5th. I'm sure Biadasz will be on the radar in the 3rd/4th. Cushenberry if he's still there. Nick Harris or Muti could be as well.
Where? I watched the entire video and he snuffed out Chaison throughout the game. The only hit was late in the game.
Who played the most LT? Thomas.
Who played in the toughest conference? Thomas (Wills too).
Who had the best wonderlic? Thomas.
Who had the best size? Thomas is more prototypical than Wirfs/Wills even though he isn't as big as Becton (whose size is both advantage + concern).
I know PFF is frowned upon but Thomas even graded out the highest there.
Wirfs may have been the best athlete, but I'm not sure he's even a tackle (Bob McGinn for example ranked him as a G, and also correctly had Thomas as his OT1). Wills tape is really good and he may have been in the conversation, but I'm not sure he has the upside Thomas has. Becton is a unicorn - ultimate boom/bust.
None of these guys are perfect - ideally you'd want to see a little better movement from Thomas and more consistency in pass pro - but of the 4 he's the cleanest and closest to a true blue goose LT.
Excellent analysis.
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Hopefully the LSU kid, Cushenberry will be available for us to at least consider. He and Ruiz appear to be the best available centers and then there is a fairly big drop off to the Temple kid.
Sy had the Temple kid as his top center.
Hmmm, The Athletic has the Temple kid Rated in the 60s. Ruiz and Cushenberry in the 30s.
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but cleaned it up in the second half, that speaks well of him.
Where? I watched the entire video and he snuffed out Chaison throughout the game. The only hit was late in the game.
I sometimes don’t get people watching football. I just don’t know what they are watching
as i said earlier, the key is to develop jones and he needs a competent C (not pulley or pio). i'd rather take the C a little earlier than miss out.
gross matos or baun are not some can't miss prospects where i'd say it's worth the chance of not having a C.
Uber, hope to have info tomorrow. Just looking on my own, I like Edge (Gross-Matos, Baun even though he's more of a Van Noy and less of a pure Edge) and WR (Pittman Jr, Claypool).
This is the player we’ve been hoping for for 10 years.
Yup.
a new young center next to him . This will make Barkley
happy when he is not getting stuffed in the backfield
I really liked Simmons but this also helps keeping
Jones upright . Why would anyone call him a reach
geesh never happy no matter what !
Thomas, Hernandez, Zeitler... we had better be a power scheme.
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he's very slow and plodding with poor agility. he can work in a power scheme only. but he's not someone you want blocking out in space or doing a lot of pulling
Thomas, Hernandez, Zeitler... we had better be a power scheme.
If we want power then Cushenberry should be the pick.
Ashtyn Davis too.
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McKinney and Winfield. Don’t know how much we love Love but it can be argued.
Ashtyn Davis too.
Ummm hello Grant Delpit!
There was nobody else taking an OT before them, so why would they even need a smokescreen? I do like the pick, go giants.
That said, I think Thomas is an excellent pick for NYG righ now, and I've made it abundantly clear.
Mims is my target
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That said, I think Thomas is an excellent pick for NYG righ now, and I've made it abundantly clear.
Agreed, when he gets healthy he could return to his 2018 form and prove to be an excellent center.
Ferguson became a 10 year starter who went to 3 Pro Bowls. Let's hope Thomas can deliver similar results.
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We got backed into a corner by our awful roster construction and couldn't pick a consensus player at the spot we needed. Every division rival got a guaranteed to likely impact player.
This is not about the Giants making a bad pick -- the story of this draft is the rest of the division drafting gamechangers.
A good OT who can actually block is not a game changer? Someone who doesn’t get the QB creamed, and doesn’t have the RB constantly getting hit behind the line of scrimmage isn’t a game changer?
I'm not calling Thomas a bad player at all. In fact, I have NO issue with any of the top 4 OTs. You're misundesrtanding me -- I'm just annoyed the Cowboys, Eagles, and Skins drafted skill position players with (potential) huge impacts.
OL is a cohesive unit, so it's rare one player comes in and changes the whole thing; having said that, I have no issue with the pick. This team has had no OL since 2012. We gotta plug our holes.
Saying Thomas was a sensible pick isn't mutually exclusive from lamenting that Chase Young and CeeDee Lamb went to Washington and Dallas. Sort of just wish they blew their picks and didn't (in Dallas's case) have a gem to fall to them.
But fuck it, I felt the same about Dez and that didn't work out, so let's see what happens...
Sonic, and now we root for Thomas to be the Young Stopper.
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We got backed into a corner by our awful roster construction and couldn't pick a consensus player at the spot we needed. Every division rival got a guaranteed to likely impact player.
This is not about the Giants making a bad pick -- the story of this draft is the rest of the division drafting gamechangers.
Dallas was drafting OL for years while we were drafting receivers. How'd that work out for us.
travis frederick, connor wiliams, tyron smith, zack martin, la'el collins, all drafted everyone on that list other than OBJ.
they've been a fuckload better than us since '14.
I WANTED OL this year, its about time -- but don't try to lessen the impact of a CDLamb, Galllup, Cooper WR corp.
Sorry guys! /sniffle
All the snide comments about the Giants tech and IT and the BBI hamster fails again.
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This is what O'Hara says - makes a lot of sense
If we were left with what's left after the 1st round, we'd be screwed.
Ferguson became a 10 year starter who went to 3 Pro Bowls. Let's hope Thomas can deliver similar results.
Shaun O'Hara said he reminds him of Jason Peters.
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God damnit, wtf am I doing with MY ilfe?...
If we were left with what's left after the 1st round, we'd be screwed.
In hindsight I like the pick more than when it was originally done. Didn’t expect all of this talent on Defense to fall. Outside of Jones and Cleveland every OL I expected to go in Round 1 did but neither of those 2 I would feel comfortable starting right away. Thomas is a Day 1 starter and guys like Baun or Winfield Jr. may fit our scheme better than Simmons.
Ferguson became a 10 year starter who went to 3 Pro Bowls. Let's hope Thomas can deliver similar results.
I always thought Ferguson was a little more finesse.
I think Thomas' upside is more brutish like Trent Williams. I think his floor is pretty safely in the ballpark of Cam Robinson/Jawaan Taylor.
And in all likelihood the outcome lands someplace in between.
If we were left with what's left after the 1st round, we'd be screwed.
The real lamentable part of this is that every avenue to trade down and still grab one of the 4 fell apart.
Now go get a Center. I'd get him at @36. I'd rather not wait until 99 or 110.
Day three, get a decent OT prospect worth developing.
Now go get a Center. I'd get him at @36. I'd rather not wait until 99 or 110.
Day three, get a decent OT prospect worth developing.
We do need defensive help, and Centers in rd 3 are still serviceable players (plus, consider the fact our centers are total ass)_
As far as developing Thomas I saw a player that needs some improvement as a pass blocker. He would get overextended out over his toes with forward lean causing his head to dip making him susceptible to push pull moves and hurt his recovery steps and balance. He didn't do it all the time and it's coachable. His elite arm length, foot talent, and high end anchor bode well for his chances to correct this. This is important to note: he does not get pushed around or run around. His issues are not athletic but technique based imo.
He's a mauler in the run game. He can strike you, root you out and put you on the ground. Not much more to say about that. He's top notch in this area.
As Sy said he has a very high ceiling if he sorts out a few things and he's a young player at only 21 years of age. Sy believed he had the highest potential of the four OT's but to me he was second in this regard with only Becton rated higher in upside projection. Thomas upside though is an All Pro level imo.
Looking forward to the flame jobs coming and slicing you all into pieces with my mental riposte and repartee in the coming debate.
Also looking forward to tomorrow and the convo of whether to pick the BPA at #36 or trade down.
I don't think Thomas has the rawness and holes Flowers had, and he's not the jerk Flowers is. He's a solid, but unspectacular pick. But he does have that one flaw with his technique Flowers has. It's not a tragedy, and doesn't mean he will be a bad pro.
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Just like Solder and Tyron Smith did in their rookie years (and just like Flowers was supposed to before Beatty got hurt).
Now go get a Center. I'd get him at @36. I'd rather not wait until 99 or 110.
Day three, get a decent OT prospect worth developing.
I think we have a solid shot at an ER who can contribute at 36, and that's the route I'd prefer to go. Hopefullly Gross-Matos. If not, than Winfield.
We do need defensive help, and Centers in rd 3 are still serviceable players (plus, consider the fact our centers are total ass)_
If we still had the 68th pick, I might risk waiting, but for me waiting until 99 is too great a risk.
I understand we need defensive help (and a WR, too), but in my view Center is more important. I didn't want to wait until 36 to draft an OT, and I don't want to wait until 99 to draft an OC.
As far as developing Thomas I saw a player that needs some improvement as a pass blocker. He would get overextended out over his toes with forward lean causing his head to dip making him susceptible to push pull moves and hurt his recovery steps and balance. He didn't do it all the time and it's coachable. His elite arm length, foot talent, and high end anchor bode well for his chances to correct this. This is important to note: he does not get pushed around or run around. His issues are not athletic but technique based imo.
He's a mauler in the run game. He can strike you, root you out and put you on the ground. Not much more to say about that. He's top notch in this area.
As Sy said he has a very high ceiling if he sorts out a few things and he's a young player at only 21 years of age. Sy believed he had the highest potential of the four OT's but to me he was second in this regard with only Becton rated higher in upside projection. Thomas upside though is an All Pro level imo.
Looking forward to the flame jobs coming and slicing you all into pieces with my mental riposte and repartee in the coming debate.
Also looking forward to tomorrow and the convo of whether to pick the BPA at #36 or trade down.
Good summation bro . Excited it wasn't Wirfs. But more importantly think this kid has tremendous upside as a Left Tsckle. How long has it been?
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In comment 14880837 Klaatu said:
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Just like Solder and Tyron Smith did in their rookie years (and just like Flowers was supposed to before Beatty got hurt).
Now go get a Center. I'd get him at @36. I'd rather not wait until 99 or 110.
Day three, get a decent OT prospect worth developing.
I think we have a solid shot at an ER who can contribute at 36, and that's the route I'd prefer to go. Hopefullly Gross-Matos. If not, than Winfield.
We do need defensive help, and Centers in rd 3 are still serviceable players (plus, consider the fact our centers are total ass)_
If we still had the 68th pick, I might risk waiting, but for me waiting until 99 is too great a risk.
I understand we need defensive help (and a WR, too), but in my view Center is more important. I didn't want to wait until 36 to draft an OT, and I don't want to wait until 99 to draft an OC.
Our centers are awful and we desperately need one, but drafting Thomas and moving Solder should solidify the line to some degree.
It's funny, I hear a lot of NYG fans older than me (my dad included) lament the fact there are no imposing, awesome LBs who can dictate the game. But for my generation (born in 89), I feel the same way about the dearth of DEs and absolute dog shit ERs. The first team I remember was the 97 Armstead, Sehorn, Strahan, Sparks team. Yeah, most of those guys weren't rushers, but you can see why I loved strahan and how he led to the era of Osi, Tuck, Kiwi, JPP, the NASCAR formation.
The way you slightly older guys find the lack of LBs appalling (though I guess you'd be used to it by now, lol).... I find the lack of DEs to just be the antithesis of Giants football.
Really had hopes for players like Owa and 'damonster', but fuck man, these never pan out! I want to take one high again
That said, I think Thomas is an excellent pick for NYG righ now, and I've made it abundantly clear.
Thanks for all your posts and insight. I and a lot of other BBIers really appreciate them.
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Lol, you could basically apply that to my whole life
Second, we do have ER's. They may not be great ER's but we do have them. It's up to our DC and his staff to get the most out of them, along with the rest of the defense.
We have nothing at Center. Zero, zip, zilch. I was hoping the Giants would sign at least a "place-holder" in free agency, allowing them to wait until later on to draft a decent prospect worth developing, but they didn't.
As I also said, if they still had the 68th pick, I'd be fine with them waiting to fill that hole, but they don't. Barring a trade down, if I'm Dave Gettleman I'm not waiting until 99 to look for an OC.
Second, we do have ER's. They may not be great ER's but we do have them. It's up to our DC and his staff to get the most out of them, along with the rest of the defense.
We have nothing at Center. Zero, zip, zilch. I was hoping the Giants would sign at least a "place-holder" in free agency, allowing them to wait until later on to draft a decent prospect worth developing, but they didn't.
As I also said, if they still had the 68th pick, I'd be fine with them waiting to fill that hole, but they don't. Barring a trade down, if I'm Dave Gettleman I'm not waiting until 99 to look for an OC.
I just think you have a better chance of either picking up a servicable C in FA (Jamon Brown style, or even someone like Jason Whittle, who, while a G, was just stopgap) -- or finding one in later rounds... than you do of getting an ER.
And yeah, I guess we have "ERs", the same we "have" a center. The centers are worse at their positions than the ERs, but the ERs we have are awful, definitely bottom 20% of the league, and have a more important role on the team as it's currently constructed (I do understand that Centers are the brains of the OL).
Idk. 36 is also VERY high to take a center, and we wouldn't even be taking the first one off the board...
The LW trade was fucking dumb
I'd be surprised if a rookie beats out Solder with a limited offseason, but stranger things have happened. Who knows maybe Solder would be better at RT.
Now, we should take the best center available, because we have nothing at that position.
Man, I just got a custom O'Hara jersey over christmas, and now I think maybe the next one should be a 67 Kmac. I really loved that line so much.
Second, we do have ER's. They may not be great ER's but we do have them. It's up to our DC and his staff to get the most out of them, along with the rest of the defense.
We have nothing at Center. Zero, zip, zilch. I was hoping the Giants would sign at least a "place-holder" in free agency, allowing them to wait until later on to draft a decent prospect worth developing, but they didn't.
As I also said, if they still had the 68th pick, I'd be fine with them waiting to fill that hole, but they don't. Barring a trade down, if I'm Dave Gettleman I'm not waiting until 99 to look for an OC.
Klaatu don’t sleep on Pio
Hernandez, Thomas and hopefully a strong C/G in the next rounds and maybe we are looking at a young, talented group that can grow together.
I was a little higher on Wills but after reading more on Thomas and his dominating in the run game I am convinced the Giants are going to be a very physical, heavy run team under Judge. I'm happy and this will play better to DJ's development growth and maximize his potential.
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*based on everything Judge has said, no reason to think JG wasn't heavily involved in scouting and providing feedback.
High floor, 10 year starter in the NFL. Protects Jones and Barkley. Good kid. What's not to like. Nice pick!
Huh?
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ours is the one which stands out as an overdraft. Not sufficient value for the #4 pick. Unfortunately, I am not surprised.
you cant voluntarily trade down....
Not that I advocate the strategy, but technically a team can draft at a lower slot by just not handing in the card. No compensation in draft picks, but the cost savings on signing bonus/salary is the only benefit in such a strategy. Of course, DG would never live down the "asleep at the wheel" criticism if he just held the card until whatever slot the fans felt was appropriate.
Now, at some point a C is going to be needed....but if Gros-Matos is there I am getting him. If I am going defense I want a guy who appears he can get to the QB
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The best OT to stop Chase Young
Huh?
Could be wrong, but I think what he meant was out of the top 4 OTs, Thomas would be the best of the 4 in stopping Chase Young
And, if not Center, I'm A.O.K circling back for another OT at #36 -- either Ezra Cleveland or Josh Jones.
Most likely. If not, then my original comment "Huh?" stands.
Others feel when you have a shot to draft your LT of the next dozen years, you do it too.
Thomas isn't wart-free. But let's not treat Simmons with no flaws. For all we know, he could be Taylor Mays.
But what makes this hurt is JR drafted Flowers who is supposed to be at LT in his Prime now instead we are here backfilling.
He's the best tackle in this draft class. I think he's the cleanest tackle. This kid's going to be a longtime starter on the left side. This year he'll start on the right. (Pete Prisco)
FYI
Thomas - ( New Window )
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When your defense sucks and you have a chance to draft a potential game changing defensive weapon in Simmons, you take him.
Others feel when you have a shot to draft your LT of the next dozen years, you do it too.
Thomas isn't wart-free. But let's not treat Simmons with no flaws. For all we know, he could be Taylor Mays.
Of course no player is a sure thing. I didn't state Simmons was a sure thing. Note the use of the word "potential" in my original comment.
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Hopefully Thomas can last a decade in this league like
Ferguson did! I could see Thomas starting at RT, then switched to LT. If there wasn't the pandemic going on,
and more time with the players, I could see Thomas starting at LT. The film on Solder was not good at LT
last year, and he already said months ago, he would be willing to move. He knows he didn't play well last year.
ALl SEC
SEC OL player of the year
Georgia Offensive MVP
He achieved all these while playing against the top players and teams in college football. LSU, Bama, Auburn, etc.
Watch the OL youtube video of all the Georgia offensive plays vs LSU. He was matched up against Chaisson, the #20 pick in the draft, and Chaisson sniffed Fromm 1 time total, and that wasn't a sack but an incompletion. I actually had to do a double check that this was Chaisson, he looked like that outmatched.
3-Time Pro Bowler who made 160 consecutive regular season starts and never missed a game in his entire career.
We will be very fortunate if Andrew Thomas comes close to Ferguson's career.
Very.
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I’m going to offer again, I’d really like to help with these server issues. You say it yourself that you don’t have the experience, I’m willing to donate my time and at this point I’ll help cover costs to keep the site up on big days.
Playing in the sec no less.
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The best OT to stop Chase Young
Huh?
Hahaha meant Thomas is the best OT to stop Chase Young.
Thank you for that. Crazy stat. Made me feel much better about the pick and gave me something to shut my friends up with.
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37 pressures in 1,035 pass snaps. That is unreal.
Thank you for that. Crazy stat. Made me feel much better about the pick and gave me something to shut my friends up with.
All 37 from last year's SEC Championship versus LSU
:-)
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In comment 14880835 ryanmkeane said:
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37 pressures in 1,035 pass snaps. That is unreal.
Thank you for that. Crazy stat. Made me feel much better about the pick and gave me something to shut my friends up with.
All 37 from last year's SEC Championship versus LSU
:-)
Actually he allowed Chaisson only 1 pressure, and was matched up with him all game. Chaisson was the #20 pick
BTW - I was at that game. Thomas was extremely active and held up fine.
BTW - I was at that game. Thomas was extremely active and held up fine.
Oh ok. I must have missed that, Sorry
I know the OL wasn't good last year but it also wasn't as bad as the crap we saw in 16-17. Maybe we are finally turning a corner and with Barkley and Jones here, the O might be on to something. One can dream.
2016 - Sterling Shepard
2018 - Saquoun Barkley
2020 - Andrew Thomas
I would have like Simmons but out of the tackles I like this pick. A good athlete, tough demeanor, mauler in the run game.
Go Giants! https://www.pff.com/news/draft-all-pff-era-prospect-team-2020 - ( New Window )