I don't think fans understand just how bad Darnold is. He is very very bad, at everything.
The Giants messed up by drafting Saquon at #2 in 2018, but it could have been worse - they could have picked Darnold. Thank God they didn't.
Bottom-of-the-barrel Intermediate passer, Deep passer, 3rd Down passer, and Play-action passer
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Really? What was your first fuckin’ clue?
Honestly gidie -- what aren't threads like this an automatic check of the IP and an easy cut?
I am glad we didn’t take Darnold, but by no means is he a horrible QB
I am glad we didn’t take Darnold, but by no means is he a horrible QB
Agree with this. It took Eli three years. I don’t see Darnold being Eli in any way shape or form, but I don’t think he is horrible. I also think Barkley was an excellent pick.
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For a team that was horrible to pick a RB #2 was a horrible move. Who the hell is going to want to pay a RB big money after his rookie deal is up? The only way that it ends up no being a bad pick is if the Giants are legit contending for a super bowl during his rookie contract which is highly doubtful at this point. Maybe his last year. Nobody in NY cares about individual accolades it’s all about winning here.
Given what was available I think the pick has been justified. Those QBs are not very good.
Fuck contracts. You pick the best player.
You guys do way too much hand wringing about money than is justified in today's NFL. I swear half of you are stuck in 2002.
Justified? We passed over Bradley Chubb and Quentin Nelson. Hindsight is not 20/20 on that either. Nelson was touted as the best OL ever scouted and Chubb was clearly in play as a top 5 pick. I love Barkley and think he’s great but he made no sense for a team that needed to fill much bigger holes than skill players. The Giants could have easily traded down in that draft too considering that the Jets and Bills both moved up. You don’t take RBs in the first round unless you have a team that’s ready to win now. That’s my opinion.
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In comment 14894580 Doubledeuce22 said:
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For a team that was horrible to pick a RB #2 was a horrible move. Who the hell is going to want to pay a RB big money after his rookie deal is up? The only way that it ends up no being a bad pick is if the Giants are legit contending for a super bowl during his rookie contract which is highly doubtful at this point. Maybe his last year. Nobody in NY cares about individual accolades it’s all about winning here.
Given what was available I think the pick has been justified. Those QBs are not very good.
Fuck contracts. You pick the best player.
You guys do way too much hand wringing about money than is justified in today's NFL. I swear half of you are stuck in 2002.
Justified? We passed over Bradley Chubb and Quentin Nelson. Hindsight is not 20/20 on that either. Nelson was touted as the best OL ever scouted and Chubb was clearly in play as a top 5 pick. I love Barkley and think he’s great but he made no sense for a team that needed to fill much bigger holes than skill players. The Giants could have easily traded down in that draft too considering that the Jets and Bills both moved up. You don’t take RBs in the first round unless you have a team that’s ready to win now. That’s my opinion.
I think it depends on the RB. Barkley is a pretty unique talent. He’s not Fournette.
a shitty OL,
and an odd group of WRs - good to great deep threat, who could do little else, and a good to great slot who was not a deep threat. Other WRs were basically non-entities.
An informed evaluation of SD is an incomplete based on the lack of a necessary supporting cast.
As far as the OP and it's backdoor agenda to bash Barkley it's yet another terrible post by a terrible poster.
Lets not put the carriage before the horse and worry about contracts 3 years down the road
Fans are too intelligent for their own good lately. Talk about paralysis by analysis. you have fans that have completely lost sight of Barkley’s overall impact on the game and how close we are to winning because of this kid, nope let’s worry about the money. And 3 frigging years from now. Never
Mind how many giants players NOT playing rb that haven’t even made it tie their second contract here but Barkley won’t be worthy. Just fucking stop already with this crap. Please.
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Darnold is not a horrible QB -- he's a decent QB -- jsut will never be a championship QB -- there are short-comings in his demenaor and his game for that
Honestly gidie -- what aren't threads like this an automatic check of the IP and an easy cut?
if he continues to post this way he will get the axe -- but there's nothing matching his ip when he registered and nothing comes up now either
As it turned out they got Jones and Barkley, so passing on Darnold turned out a positive. But let s remember, they had a chance at Jones because they fell way short of the desired result when they picked Barkley, the play offs.
Had Eli and the Giants made the play offs that season, where would the Giants be at quarterback now.
I just believed at #2, you address the most important position in sports. Totally disagree Darnold s a bust.
That said, he is not horrible. He just isn't a franchise QB and none of the other top guys are.
I thought that with Barkley the Giants would always be too good to land another pick high enough to draft a top QB. I didn't want a Alex Smith, Andy Dalton, Kirk Cousins type of starting QB.
Now with the benefit of hindsight I am very happy with the pick. Daniel Jones was better than Darnold last season despite being a rookie, dealing with a terrible OL and coaching staff, and all the injuries at WR.
a shitty OL,
and an odd group of WRs - good to great deep threat, who could do little else, and a good to great slot who was not a deep threat. Other WRs were basically non-entities.
An informed evaluation of SD is an incomplete based on the lack of a necessary supporting cast.
Certainly the Coach Cookie Monster's fantasy football ESPN highlight based draft picks of Becton and Mims will help him out next year. Love Jets trainwrecks and you can see this coming XD
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We have 5th year option
Lets not put the carriage before the horse and worry about contracts 3 years down the road
Fans are too intelligent for their own good lately. Talk about paralysis by analysis. you have fans that have completely lost sight of Barkley’s overall impact on the game and how close we are to winning because of this kid, nope let’s worry about the money. And 3 frigging years from now. Never
Mind how many giants players NOT playing rb that haven’t even made it tie their second contract here but Barkley won’t be worthy. Just fucking stop already with this crap. Please.
What impact has Barkley had to this team? They've won 4 and 5 games since drafting him. A RB is going to have very little impact on a teams W/L record when you have no offensive line to run behind. Best case scenario he's Barry Sanders who won absolutely nothing in the same kind of situation. Barkley is no doubt a good player and would be very impactful to the right team just not a bottom feeder like the Giants have been.
A "winning record" including two wins in which they scored a total of 13 points as Buffalo rested all of their starters and only needed to score 16 points to beat a Duck Hodges led Steelers team...
Has nothing to do with whether or not he's a bust. He's only going into his third year but he hasn't proven anything so far and not too many QB's make a big leap in year 3. Plus I'm not sure why anyone would be confident in Gase getting his best football out of him either.
It is a crying shame that we couldn't sign a veteran OC to shore up the line. But I would NOT be surprised if we somehow landed a veteran who is cut or in some type of trade (player plus late pick for a starting OC?).
But lets just say RT Thomas starts as a rookie and really holds his own. Solder is healthy and focused now that his son is recovering. Hernandez gets coached up. Gates is the real deal at OC if no veteran. Zeitler heals up as well and returns to probowl caliber form. If things fall well this offense will improve as the season moves along.
We have to hope we get lucky early wins as the team may not have it together early on due to CV19.
PSA/Friendly Reminder: Coach Red is the alter ego of fanofthejets.
but...I'm pretty sure a similar thread could have been started about Eli Manning in 2006 after his second year.
And Eli had Tiki, Plax, Toomer, Shockey etc. in his huddle. So, Darnold may wind up a shitty QB, but sometimes QB's take a while to develop, even highly drafted ones.
lol f-it.
but...I'm pretty sure a similar thread could have been started about Eli Manning in 2006 after his second year.
And Eli had Tiki, Plax, Toomer, Shockey etc. in his huddle. So, Darnold may wind up a shitty QB, but sometimes QB's take a while to develop, even highly drafted ones.
Spot on. Anyone making definitive statements on Darnold or Jones is doing nothing more than venturing a guess at this point. How many wrote off Eli after year 2, heck year 3? Give them both a couple of more years.
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In comment 14894602 twostepgiants said:
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We have 5th year option
Lets not put the carriage before the horse and worry about contracts 3 years down the road
Fans are too intelligent for their own good lately. Talk about paralysis by analysis. you have fans that have completely lost sight of Barkley’s overall impact on the game and how close we are to winning because of this kid, nope let’s worry about the money. And 3 frigging years from now. Never
Mind how many giants players NOT playing rb that haven’t even made it tie their second contract here but Barkley won’t be worthy. Just fucking stop already with this crap. Please.
What impact has Barkley had to this team? They've won 4 and 5 games since drafting him. A RB is going to have very little impact on a teams W/L record when you have no offensive line to run behind. Best case scenario he's Barry Sanders who won absolutely nothing in the same kind of situation. Barkley is no doubt a good player and would be very impactful to the right team just not a bottom feeder like the Giants have been.
Yeah and how many games have the Colts won with that all world guard of theirs? They have won more games than the Giants but they haven't won jack shit either. How about the Broncos and Chubb? Or the teams that drafted QBs early on in that same draft?
Are you really questioning the impact Barkley can have on an NFL team? Do you think dallas would be SOOOOO much better off had they drafted Jalen Ramsey instead of Zeke? Would they be any better or could they be even worse right now?
Best case scenario Barkley has a Barry Sanders type impact here, I just can't even take you seriously.
first off, Barry Sanders had a terrific impact on the Lions back in the day. Those were the fucking glory days for Det. They actually MADE the playoffs more than once and won a playoff game. Second, BEST CASE SCENARIO? So you're telling me the Giants can't win a championship with Barkley.
I can't take it anymore.
The jury is obviously out -- and I will admit, I wanted Darnold and he has not lived up to expectations - but he still has time, and I genuinely believe he'd be better on the Giants as opposed to the Jets. Yes, we are not a great franchise in recent years either, but we're doing a hell of a lot better of a job bringing Jones along than Darnold, and I do genuinely think Darnold has more physical talent than Jones (Jones has more escapability for sure and might have more between the ears -- it's close).
Look, nearly nobody wanted us to take Nelson, so I don't want to be revisionist here. But this team WOULD be better with Nelson and Nick Chubb than Barkley and Hernandez. It's honestly not even arguable.
The truth of the matter is that the Giants were taking Darnold or Barkley. That alone is bad, as they boxed themselves into a corner.
I wanted Darnold, but as it stands now, theres a very viable case that Barkley was the better pick (if Darnold busts).
BUT -- this team would have been better hitting on ANYONE who was capable in the top of the 1st round and going Nick Chubb in the 2nd.
having said that, and going back to my point above, it was either Barkley or a QB, so all that shit's moot. The litmus test here is whether any of these QBs end up way better than Jones.
Best case scenario Barkley has a Barry Sanders type impact here, I just can't even take you seriously.
first off, Barry Sanders had a terrific impact on the Lions back in the day. Those were the fucking glory days for Det. They actually MADE the playoffs more than once and won a playoff game. Second, BEST CASE SCENARIO? So you're telling me the Giants can't win a championship with Barkley.
I can't take it anymore.
You know - it is madness. If you look at Detroit in the modern era, their best stretch of football BY FAR was when Sanders was there. And because they didn't win a Super Bowl, people rip him like he was on the winless Buccaneers and contributing to the ineptitude.
i encourage anyone to look at the stretch when the Lions played there. Count the number of years prior to him arriving that they made the playoffs and count the number of times since he retired that they made the playoffs and then try to make a case that he didn't have a major impact.
Those kind of posts are moronic.
What do you mean it isn't arguable? Would Nelson and Chubb have given us more wins last season and position us better? It most definitely is arguable.
Not to mention that the argument isn't Barkley/Hernandez vs. Chubb/Nelson.
It is Barkley/Jones vs. Darnold/Allen.
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Look, nearly nobody wanted us to take Nelson, so I don't want to be revisionist here. But this team WOULD be better with Nelson and Nick Chubb than Barkley and Hernandez. It's honestly not even arguable.
What do you mean it isn't arguable? Would Nelson and Chubb have given us more wins last season and position us better? It most definitely is arguable.
Not to mention that the argument isn't Barkley/Hernandez vs. Chubb/Nelson.
It is Barkley/Jones vs. Darnold/Allen.
Well, Nelson is unequivocally better than Hernandez.
And the dropoff between Chubb vs Barkley i smaller than the Nelson vs Henandez dropoff.
On top of that, Chubb's play style is much better suited towards an OL in progress. He's much more physical and a more north-south runner. Barkley can get in his head and dance too much - we all saw it last year.
Additionally, idk where Jones is coming from. Barkley, Chubb, Nelson, and Hernandez were all h in the same draft.
We went RB - Guard. We could have gone Guard - RB, and been better off. Both Nelson and Chubb could have been Giants picks - neither was drafted yet. We took Hernandez a pick before Chubb.
Can any Giants fan honestly tell me they wouldn't trade Hernandez and Barkley for Nelson and Chubb??
Having said that, I don't think you can project that the next draft would have gone the same way if Darnold was taken.
That's the exact rationale I use to make myself feel better about the 02 SF game and '10 Eagles game -- you change one thing, and theres a butterfly effect that changes everything else.
Regardless, I'd definitely swap hernandez and barkley for chubb and nelson in a heartbeat -- and if anything, its more of an indictment on hernandez, NOT barkley. Chubb is better for a team with a dogshit OL (like ours), but its not like Barkley isn't an amazing player. He might be the best RB in the league (has the potential to be at least), but his play-style is illsuited to a team with a dogshit OL.
But hey, that's why we drafted all those OL this year right? Let's give the guy a line
Or just picked Chubb.
So you're telling me the Giants can't win a championship with Barkley.
I can't take it anymore.
With Barkley and because of Barkley are two different things, right?
I know you're smarter than your pollyanna routine suggests, and we all can agree that the choice of "with" is a much lower bar than "because of."
Best case scenario Barkley has a Barry Sanders type impact here, I just can't even take you seriously.
first off, Barry Sanders had a terrific impact on the Lions back in the day. Those were the fucking glory days for Det. They actually MADE the playoffs more than once and won a playoff game. Second, BEST CASE SCENARIO? So you're telling me the Giants can't win a championship with Barkley.
I can't take it anymore.
how many RBs taken in the top 10 make it just to a championship game with the team that drafted them? You can go back 10-15 years if you want. Hint - it's not that many.