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My 9yo son asked me if I would trade Barkley for Chase Young

Essex : 5/20/2020 9:27 am
straight up. Typical silly question from a nine year old who is watching too much YouTube and NFL network during the COVID emergency while locked up in a NYC apartment. I immediately answered yes because Edge is so much more important than RB. But as I have been thinking about it all morning it has gotten me to wonder if with the position differential, we have already seen that Barkley can thrive in this league, is it smart to trade a less important position although established star (budding maybe superstar) for a more important position but potential superstar without knowing if he will be able to make it in this league. I still would do it, but was wondering what other people had thought (knowing obviously it will never happen).
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Absolutely not  
Tuckrule : 5/20/2020 9:29 am : link
Barkley has yet to play behind a line with a competent OC. I would not trade one of the best offensive weapons in the league for an edge rusher regardless of who that edge guy is. I can’t think of one guy I would make the trade with.
Absolutely.  
Brown Recluse : 5/20/2020 9:30 am : link
I love Barkley but if we're talking "gold jackets," you take the gold jacket ER over the RB any day of the week.

Shouldn't even be a question for the objective fan.
RE: Absolutely.  
Big Blue '56 : 5/20/2020 9:32 am : link
In comment 14907278 Brown Recluse said:
Quote:
I love Barkley but if we're talking "gold jackets," you take the gold jacket ER over the RB any day of the week.

Shouldn't even be a question for the objective fan.


And Young has proven what beyond college?
RE: Absolutely.  
crick n NC : 5/20/2020 9:33 am : link
In comment 14907278 Brown Recluse said:
Quote:
I love Barkley but if we're talking "gold jackets," you take the gold jacket ER over the RB any day of the week.

Shouldn't even be a question for the objective fan.


What if their careers are unknown? Barkley has shown how much of a force he can be in this league, although his entire career is still a question mark.obviously.

Young still has to show he belongs in this league and that he was worthy of such a high pick.
RE: RE: Absolutely.  
Brown Recluse : 5/20/2020 9:34 am : link
In comment 14907280 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
In comment 14907278 Brown Recluse said:


Quote:


I love Barkley but if we're talking "gold jackets," you take the gold jacket ER over the RB any day of the week.

Shouldn't even be a question for the objective fan.



And Young has proven what beyond college?


I don't care. Barring injury...I think Young is going to be fantastic, even if he is a Redskin. As sure a thing if not more than Bosa last year. And I'd trade Barkley for Bosa without hesitation.
Yes  
pjcas18 : 5/20/2020 9:34 am : link
in part because Barkley has 2 years left before the 5th year option/getting paid and Young will be a rookie. I think Young's timeline aligns more with where the Giants are than Barkley.

Plus, I think RB's can be found much easier than a pass rusher and defensive playmaker.
RE: RE: Absolutely.  
Brown Recluse : 5/20/2020 9:35 am : link
In comment 14907281 crick n NC said:
Quote:
In comment 14907278 Brown Recluse said:


Quote:


I love Barkley but if we're talking "gold jackets," you take the gold jacket ER over the RB any day of the week.

Shouldn't even be a question for the objective fan.



What if their careers are unknown? Barkley has shown how much of a force he can be in this league, although his entire career is still a question mark.obviously.

Young still has to show he belongs in this league and that he was worthy of such a high pick.


Thats entirely fair. I should probably retract the last sentence from my post. I would do it in a heartbeat though.
RE: Absolutely.  
EricJ : 5/20/2020 9:37 am : link
In comment 14907278 Brown Recluse said:
Quote:
I love Barkley but if we're talking "gold jackets," you take the gold jacket ER over the RB any day of the week.

Shouldn't even be a question for the objective fan.


We are handing out gold jackets already?
RE: RE: RE: Absolutely.  
crick n NC : 5/20/2020 9:38 am : link
In comment 14907286 Brown Recluse said:
Quote:
In comment 14907281 crick n NC said:


Quote:


In comment 14907278 Brown Recluse said:


Quote:


I love Barkley but if we're talking "gold jackets," you take the gold jacket ER over the RB any day of the week.

Shouldn't even be a question for the objective fan.



What if their careers are unknown? Barkley has shown how much of a force he can be in this league, although his entire career is still a question mark.obviously.

Young still has to show he belongs in this league and that he was worthy of such a high pick.



Thats entirely fair. I should probably retract the last sentence from my post. I would do it in a heartbeat though.


I see your point and understand your thinking. ✌
RE: RE: Absolutely.  
Brown Recluse : 5/20/2020 9:39 am : link
In comment 14907290 EricJ said:
Quote:
In comment 14907278 Brown Recluse said:


Quote:


I love Barkley but if we're talking "gold jackets," you take the gold jacket ER over the RB any day of the week.

Shouldn't even be a question for the objective fan.



We are handing out gold jackets already?


I'm speaking on level of talent, obviously. Didn't think that required an explanation.

Barkley is a HoF talent. He's at the top of the league. I think Young will be as well. All things being equal, I'll take the ER over the RB.

Thats my point.
Also  
pjcas18 : 5/20/2020 9:39 am : link
interesting topic and discussion, but I will say I've been conditioned to automatically detect BS when anyone online says "my 9 year old asked me..."

it's a common internet trope to illustrate a point or scenario you want to discuss. Not accusing you of this, lol, I believe your 9 year old could have asked this. just saying.
What about  
crick n NC : 5/20/2020 9:41 am : link
If someone's 8 year old asks a question?
RE: What about  
pjcas18 : 5/20/2020 9:44 am : link
In comment 14907295 crick n NC said:
Quote:
If someone's 8 year old asks a question?


same thing. any age of the child (within reason) asking a question. same radar goes off. I'm sure it's me and sorry to clutter the thread with it.
RE: Yes  
Bramton1 : 5/20/2020 9:45 am : link
In comment 14907285 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
in part because Barkley has 2 years left before the 5th year option/getting paid and Young will be a rookie. I think Young's timeline aligns more with where the Giants are than Barkley.

Plus, I think RB's can be found much easier than a pass rusher and defensive playmaker.


Then why did we spend years trying to convince ourselves that Paul Perkins was the man?
Yeah  
crick n NC : 5/20/2020 9:46 am : link
I was just being a jackass. It's my profession.
RE: What about  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 5/20/2020 9:46 am : link
In comment 14907295 crick n NC said:
Quote:
If someone's 8 year old asks a question?


Hitchhiker: 7's the key number here. Think about it. 7-Elevens. 7 dwarves. 7, man, that's the number. 7 chipmunks twirlin' on a branch, eatin' lots of sunflowers on my uncle's ranch. You know that old children's tale from the sea. It's like you're dreamin' about Gorgonzola cheese when it's clearly Brie time, baby. Step into my office.

Ted: Why?

Hitchhiker: 'Cause you're fuckin' fired!
Well done  
crick n NC : 5/20/2020 9:47 am : link
SF
RE: RE: RE: Absolutely.  
Big Blue '56 : 5/20/2020 9:51 am : link
In comment 14907293 Brown Recluse said:
Quote:
In comment 14907290 EricJ said:


Quote:


In comment 14907278 Brown Recluse said:


Quote:


I love Barkley but if we're talking "gold jackets," you take the gold jacket ER over the RB any day of the week.

Shouldn't even be a question for the objective fan.



We are handing out gold jackets already?



I'm speaking on level of talent, obviously. Didn't think that required an explanation.

Barkley is a HoF talent. He's at the top of the league. I think Young will be as well. All things being equal, I'll take the ER over the RB.

Thats my point.


If you can assure me that he’s going to be an Aaron Donald/JJ Watt talent-wise, I would certainly give it tremendous consideration to it. If healthy, even a virtually one-legged SB showed he’s headed for the jacket. Lots of “sure-bets” at all positions, tanked once turning pro..
RE: RE: Yes  
pjcas18 : 5/20/2020 9:53 am : link
In comment 14907300 Bramton1 said:
Quote:
In comment 14907285 pjcas18 said:


Quote:


in part because Barkley has 2 years left before the 5th year option/getting paid and Young will be a rookie. I think Young's timeline aligns more with where the Giants are than Barkley.

Plus, I think RB's can be found much easier than a pass rusher and defensive playmaker.



Then why did we spend years trying to convince ourselves that Paul Perkins was the man?


A lot of reasons, but that same year that Perkins was "supposed to be" the man, Orleans Darkwa and Wayne Gallman combined for over 1200 yards rushing and averaged 4.4 ypc. and caught another 53 passes.

If you're trying to convince me that a RB is more valuable than a DE you won't.

ask me in 5 years  
Paulie Walnuts : 5/20/2020 9:59 am : link
then I'll know

by the conventional wisdom, Young is the better choice

this one is going to be debated for years
RE: Yes  
Spider43 : 5/20/2020 10:07 am : link
In comment 14907285 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
in part because Barkley has 2 years left before the 5th year option/getting paid and Young will be a rookie. I think Young's timeline aligns more with where the Giants are than Barkley.

Plus, I think RB's can be found much easier than a pass rusher and defensive playmaker.


Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding...
Well, since I would have drafted Bradley Chubb instead of Barkley...  
Klaatu : 5/20/2020 10:08 am : link
Then, yes, I'd trade Barkley for Young.
Similar question  
jestersdead : 5/20/2020 10:09 am : link
was posed during the draft about taking a QB at 4 and then forcing the Dolphins or Chargers to make a trade with you. 90% of BBI said no, b/c Jones has already shown you signs he can play in the league. So why would you trade for an edge college player who hasn't shown anything vs an all pro running back?

Chase Young could be the next Clowney. Is that what you want to trade your best player for?

That's a no for me
Not a silly question  
penkap75 : 5/20/2020 10:10 am : link
Every Giants SB was won with elite edge rushers and good (but not generational) RBs.

I personally would take an NFL unproven Young over Saquon right now.
Young is overrated ...  
Spider56 : 5/20/2020 10:12 am : link
Watch the Clemson game... the biggest game of the year and he flames out ... he did absolutely nothing ... yeah, it’s only 1 game but it shows he’s far from Superman.
RE: What about  
EricJ : 5/20/2020 10:19 am : link
In comment 14907295 crick n NC said:
Quote:
If someone's 8 year old asks a question?


The fetus on the sonogram held up a note during the procedure asking about Barkley vs Young...
I was high on Young  
Tim in VA : 5/20/2020 10:19 am : link
Early last year but then keyed on him consistently during the back half of the season. I did not see a dominant force. Not sure what changed but it seemed to me, even in 1-on-1 situations he was not much of a factor. I think he may get swallowed up by NFL Olinemen.

Barkley all day.
RE: Not a silly question  
Big Blue '56 : 5/20/2020 10:22 am : link
In comment 14907347 penkap75 said:
Quote:
Every Giants SB was won with elite edge rushers and good (but not generational) RBs.

I personally would take an NFL unproven Young over Saquon right now.


Are you serious?
For those saying Young wasnt  
crick n NC : 5/20/2020 10:24 am : link
Good during the back-end of the schedule, consider the possibility of injury.
I love Barkley  
Matt in SGS : 5/20/2020 10:34 am : link
but pass rushers and corners are harder to find than a RB. Assuming Young's career plays out as we think it will, yes, you make that trade.

Look back at Clinton Portis for Champ Bailey. Do you think the Redskins would do that trade again?

The deal seemed pretty even for the first 4 or so years. Portis went over 1000 yards in 4 of his first 5 seasons with the Redskins. But after he rushed for nearly 1500 yards in 2008 at age 27, he fell off a cliff and was out of the league before age 30.

Bailey played at a Pro Bowl level well into his 30s and played 10 years in Denver and went to the Hall of Fame.
My hypothetical question two years ago  
joeinpa : 5/20/2020 10:40 am : link
When we were arguing positional value regarding quarterback vs R , sans, Darnold, was this.

Would you prefer Marshal Falk or Eli? I agree with the OP s pt. For many reasons, there is some validity to the argument against drafting a RB with the second pick in the draft.

Of course it turned out well for the Giants because they got Jones. But there was no guarantee about getting a quarterback in the next draft at that time.
Young  
PaulN : 5/20/2020 10:43 am : link
Is no sure thing, and running backs like Barkley can not be found in many drafts at all. Young people who have not lived through the NFL changing time after time on the keys to winning, the biggest key is great players, they define what the next key thing is. Barkley leads the Giants to a superbowl win, dominating in the process, then everyone will have to have one, how do you think LT's legend was created. I believe with great running back with a good oline and good qb, you can win it all. I am cheering for that, Barkley must bust his ass to become that, he must want that, more then anything, a running back can effect the game as much as a pass rusher, if you are the right running back.
No.  
D HOS : 5/20/2020 10:44 am : link
Barkley is so much more important to the franchise than as just a RB. If they were in the same draft, I'd want Young. But at this point right now, no - stay with Saquon.
RE: Yes  
Section331 : 5/20/2020 10:47 am : link
In comment 14907285 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
in part because Barkley has 2 years left before the 5th year option/getting paid and Young will be a rookie. I think Young's timeline aligns more with where the Giants are than Barkley.

Plus, I think RB's can be found much easier than a pass rusher and defensive playmaker.


Agreed. The only hesitation is that Barkley has proven he can do it at this level, and Young has not, but a great ER >>>> a great RB.
RE: Absolutely.  
tyrik13 : 5/20/2020 11:01 am : link
In comment 14907278 Brown Recluse said:
Quote:
I love Barkley but if we're talking "gold jackets," you take the gold jacket ER over the RB any day of the week.

Shouldn't even be a question for the objective fan.


No one knows if Young will be a gold jacket recipient as he has yet to play a down in the NFL. Barkley is a proven pro bowl talent, one of the best offensive weapons in the game and a top 5 RB. I wouldn’t do it
RE: RE: Absolutely.  
TheMick7 : 5/20/2020 11:03 am : link
In comment 14907280 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
In comment 14907278 Brown Recluse said:


Quote:


I love Barkley but if we're talking "gold jackets," you take the gold jacket ER over the RB any day of the week.

Shouldn't even be a question for the objective fan.



And Young has proven what beyond college?


I watched the last few games that Ohio State played from start to finish,scouting Young when I thought he would be a Giant.Now I know that many times he was double-teamed but he really was a non-factor in those games. I wasn't as upset as many when we picked 4th instead of 2nd. I know he is a tremendous athlete & scouts rave about him,but I didn't see a dominant player when I watched him those last few games against better teams!
RE: RE: Absolutely.  
Pete from Woodstock : 5/20/2020 11:06 am : link
BARKLEY!!!

In comment 14907280 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
In comment 14907278 Brown Recluse said:


Quote:


I love Barkley but if we're talking "gold jackets," you take the gold jacket ER over the RB any day of the week.

Shouldn't even be a question for the objective fan.



And Young has proven what beyond college?
Thats a good question  
lax counsel : 5/20/2020 11:06 am : link
All things being equal, you take the ER. They have the ability to change games, seasons, and franchises. It's very difficult for a running back to do anything of those things, as we are seeing now with Barkley and the Giants. The position is just too dependent on other things being good to great.
RE: RE: RE: Absolutely.  
Scott in Montreal : 5/20/2020 11:06 am : link
In comment 14907282 Brown Recluse said:
Quote:
In comment 14907280 Big Blue '56 said:


Quote:


In comment 14907278 Brown Recluse said:


Quote:


I love Barkley but if we're talking "gold jackets," you take the gold jacket ER over the RB any day of the week.

Shouldn't even be a question for the objective fan.



And Young has proven what beyond college?



I don't care. Barring injury...I think Young is going to be fantastic, even if he is a Redskin. As sure a thing if not more than Bosa last year. And I'd trade Barkley for Bosa without hesitation.


Maybe but if I am an O-line coach I am talking to Robbie Caldwell and asking him about his game plan that essentially shut Young down and made him look very average.
RE: Not a silly question  
BlueLou'sBack : 5/20/2020 11:07 am : link
In comment 14907347 penkap75 said:
Quote:
Every Giants SB was won with elite edge rushers and good (but not generational) RBs.

I personally would take an NFL unproven Young over Saquon right now.


3/4 Giants SB victories were won with really good OLs, with the notable exception of 2011 when Eli put on his Achilles' suit and carried the team to a victory over the 49ers that the Giants had no business winning.

Thank goodness for Alex Smith's 0 for 13 on third down conversions via the pass.

As good as Barkley has been it's been behind a sub par OL as noted above.

And I begin to have a radical idea about NFL prospects entering the league, that we have it all wrong...

As an adide, it bugs me that Young didn't join in the underwear Olympics and perform various tests, especially the agility and explosion ones.

Barkley had phenomenal game tape too, but then went out and aced the underwear Olympics at the combine, too. There's a huge character and desire picture that Barkley is well into painting (not finished as his pass blocking needs radical improvement) and Young has yet to lift the paintbrush to the canvas as a pro, however well he was regarded in Columbus.

So my answer is no, although I too believe Young will be a fantastic pro.

Difference being between BELIEF and KNOWLEDGE. We know Barkley is and will be awesome, especially if our OL comes together by 2022.
RE: For those saying Young wasnt  
tyrik13 : 5/20/2020 11:07 am : link
In comment 14907364 crick n NC said:
Quote:
Good during the back-end of the schedule, consider the possibility of injury.


What injury? After his suspension he wasn’t the same player, he essentially got locked up the last few games of the year. Don’t remember anything about an injury
Yes but that's primarily due to their contracts  
UConn4523 : 5/20/2020 11:11 am : link
Young has 5 years control left, Barkley has 3. IN theory this would be a no-brainer for Young anyway due to the value of EDGE but I need to also see it first. If he puts up a modest 12-15 sacks his first 2 years then he's not what they drafted (yet) and Barkley's value would be much higher.
RE: Also  
Essex : 5/20/2020 11:15 am : link
In comment 14907294 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
interesting topic and discussion, but I will say I've been conditioned to automatically detect BS when anyone online says "my 9 year old asked me..."

it's a common internet trope to illustrate a point or scenario you want to discuss. Not accusing you of this, lol, I believe your 9 year old could have asked this. just saying.


I get it but he really did, I am not saying my posts are ever really worth reading, but I have been on here for over 8 years and I don't normally bring up implausible scenarios trade topics such as this one. I mean this would never happen, but I was just wondering what people thought because when he asked me this morning, it seemed like a no-brainer to me at first, but then it really got me thinking about the gamble of not knowing Chase at the next level versus a different position but we know the SB is going to be good (just how good is the only real debate).
Next time he asks a question like that  
Geomon : 5/20/2020 11:16 am : link
you'll know what to do.

Classic case of proven vs unproven  
Giants in 07 : 5/20/2020 11:16 am : link
I really think Barkley is going to dominate this year, but it's an interesting question

I guess you have to weigh how much better you think the Giants defense would get adding Young vs how much worse the Giants offense would get subtracting Barkley

I think I would keep Barkley. I think it's a little bit more difficult to completely phase out Barkley in a defensive gameplan than it would be for an offensive gameplan to negate Young
If Barkley was just a running back  
Giantimistic : 5/20/2020 11:23 am : link
Then yes, however I see him having at least a 10 year career and has the potential to be our number one running threat and top three receiving threat . Nothing batter against a good pass rush with a good screen game and the abilitiy to check to a running back that can pick up first downs on 3rd.
RE: RE: Not a silly question  
penkap75 : 5/20/2020 11:24 am : link
In comment 14907363 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
In comment 14907347 penkap75 said:


Quote:


Every Giants SB was won with elite edge rushers and good (but not generational) RBs.

I personally would take an NFL unproven Young over Saquon right now.



Are you serious?


Totally serious. Both our trenches are horrid, so our generational back has been useless. He is no doubt a great RB, but he can't do it with a shitty O line.

I grew up watching strong Giants D, and our pathetic D's have made games painful to watch.

I give two shits about Chase Young as a specific player (I don't watch college FB). But I had wish we restarted rebuilding our D and O Line sooner, rather then picking a luxury RB such as Saquon. Its easy to say in hindsight because Gettleman was not rebuilding when he picked Saquon, and was trying to get Eli another shot.
RE: No.  
lax counsel : 5/20/2020 11:28 am : link
In comment 14907381 D HOS said:
Quote:
Barkley is so much more important to the franchise than as just a RB. If they were in the same draft, I'd want Young. But at this point right now, no - stay with Saquon.


How exactly has that been the case? They are 9-23 with him and he's had an injury issue. As of right now, his impact to the franchise is very much up in the air.
RE: Young is overrated ...  
markky : 5/20/2020 11:32 am : link
In comment 14907349 Spider56 said:
Quote:
Watch the Clemson game... the biggest game of the year and he flames out ... he did absolutely nothing ... yeah, it’s only 1 game but it shows he’s far from Superman.


What struck me in that game was that whenever he was in pursuit behind the play he never got there. I thought he was the third best defender on the field that day. (Okaduh was the best).
standard black jack theory -- you  
gidiefor : Mod : 5/20/2020 11:35 am : link
never draw if you are sitting with two tens/pictures - even if the dealer is showing an ace

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