that they werent social distancing during their 'summer' training because their stadium wasnt set up for it... which i found out considering Miami has a retractable roof dome.
when you are home jist stay home? When you go to the grocery store wear a mask, do not talk to anyone get in and go home?
What is the need to go strip clubs and parties?
This was always the worry. The real answer to this question gets way off topic but for young rich players the rules were never going to be followed. Even worse for the NFL when these guys spend all their time and energy risking their well being to play, only to tell them they can't go unwind the way they want.
Premier league got through like half a season with travel and barely a case. MLB cant get through a week without having to cancel a game.
Like an idiot i thought everyone involved would take this so seriously that once we got the ball rolling sports would be fine. The leagues would pump tons of money into keeping the players safe. But you can do all that, setup a bubble with all the tech that the NBA used and still end up screwed when an idiot decides to go to a strip club (for wings, its his favorite wing place, i believe him).
Sports like MLB and NFL where the players will go home to their families who are doing god knows what are in trouble.
Premier league got through like half a season with travel and barely a case. MLB cant get through a week without having to cancel a game.
Like an idiot i thought everyone involved would take this so seriously that once we got the ball rolling sports would be fine. The leagues would pump tons of money into keeping the players safe. But you can do all that, setup a bubble with all the tech that the NBA used and still end up screwed when an idiot decides to go to a strip club (for wings, its his favorite wing place, i believe him).
Sports like MLB and NFL where the players will go home to their families who are doing god knows what are in trouble.
this really isnt that hard..i have worked every day, never stopped, i did the grocery shopping for 2 households..wear a mask, wash your hands and keep your distance...
We shouldnt be in this same situaion 5 months later..
it shouldnt be that hard. The difficulty of it doesnt seem to be the issue, its everyone involved (including these guys family/friends) doing the right things.
have to do with this Marlins outbreak? I dont understand.
I do recall reading last week that the Marlins for some reason no one has explained, while they were training, weren't following social distancing guidelines/rules that MLB had provided. Something about the stadium not being set up for it ... but they play in a retractable roof dome.
have to do with this Marlins outbreak? I dont understand.
I do recall reading last week that the Marlins for some reason no one has explained, while they were training, weren't following social distancing guidelines/rules that MLB had provided. Something about the stadium not being set up for it ... but they play in a retractable roof dome.
It was an example. If there NBA players doing dumb shit and breaking the rules (in the bubble I might add) it wouldn't be a stretch to assume players in other sports will be following suit, especially when they aren't confined to a designated area for the season.
have to do with this Marlins outbreak? I dont understand.
I do recall reading last week that the Marlins for some reason no one has explained, while they were training, weren't following social distancing guidelines/rules that MLB had provided. Something about the stadium not being set up for it ... but they play in a retractable roof dome.
jist soeaking to the general selfishness of athletes
that they werent social distancing during their 'summer' training because their stadium wasnt set up for it... which i found out considering Miami has a retractable roof dome.
What does this even mean? You have to take measures to make the stadium work. Every other team in the league was able to social distance in their ballpark to train except the Marlins? That's on the front office and manager.
Asking these men to act like monks was & remains laughable. It's not going to happen. And all you need is for one idiot & it spreads like wildfire.
Not going to a strip club is acting like a monk? That's a very un-fine line there.
Bill L, I wasn't necessarily referring to a strip club, but more the idea that these guys-rich, young, & probably feel invincible-are not going to lock themselves in their house/hotel rooms after getting back from the ballpark.
Asking these men to act like monks was & remains laughable. It's not going to happen. And all you need is for one idiot & it spreads like wildfire.
Not going to a strip club is acting like a monk? That's a very un-fine line there.
Bill L, I wasn't necessarily referring to a strip club, but more the idea that these guys-rich, young, & probably feel invincible-are not going to lock themselves in their house/hotel rooms after getting back from the ballpark.
you dont have to lock yourself in your room...
But you cant stop partying for a few months? you cant cook at home for a few months? maybe its becaise i have kids and i am passed the need to go out party phase of my life but i dont understand this constant need to do go out and do stuff that puts you in harms way...
Miami Marlins manager Don Mattingly says adjustments to MLB pandemic protocols are a work in progress, as Tuesday’s exhibition game at Atlanta showed.
“Our dugout was a mess,” Mattingly said Wednesday. “They weren’t set up to have guys in the stands. It was raining. There were no tents. So we had all these guys, and nowhere to go. Then we have a zillion guys in the dugout, so there’s no way we were social distancing. Those are the things we’ve got to work through.”
Another problem Mattingly said he needs to solve: When he wears a mask, his glasses keep fogging.
they've got reserves practicing in Jupiter I read earlier. I would assume the sports leagues have planned for these contingencies... though you bring up a good point about your QB being exposed if he's playing behind a makeshift OL.
Because you're thinking reasonably & responsibly. Not everyone thinks like that. I hate the say 'it is what it is', but it applies here. Some people are going to do what they want, regardless of how it might impact others. I know that's not breaking news...
Because you're thinking reasonably & responsibly. Not everyone thinks like that. I hate the say 'it is what it is', but it applies here. Some people are going to do what they want, regardless of how it might impact others. I know that's not breaking news...
Like, it's no surprise that most athletes aren't very bright, but this might take the cake. It's actually scary how stupid one would have to be to go to a strip club during this pandemic.
Premier league got through like half a season with travel and barely a case. MLB cant get through a week without having to cancel a game.
Like an idiot i thought everyone involved would take this so seriously that once we got the ball rolling sports would be fine. The leagues would pump tons of money into keeping the players safe. But you can do all that, setup a bubble with all the tech that the NBA used and still end up screwed when an idiot decides to go to a strip club (for wings, its his favorite wing place, i believe him).
Sports like MLB and NFL where the players will go home to their families who are doing god knows what are in trouble.
I guess Premier League should be advising the WHO cause their the only ones without issues. Link - ( New Window )
doing ok. KBO, Bundesliga, Italian soccer league (im blanking on the name), le liga. I believe basketball has been playing in some countries. Premier league was just my main example cause it was the one i was following the most.
I know people want to see sports, but lets not go singling out athletes like they are suppose to be above everyone else. Lots of people are not doing what they are supposed to do..
but I also think its pretty hard to replicate. First, big cultural difference between Europe (England) and the US which is probably the biggest factor. Its also the sole major sport so policies aren't being influenced by other leagues. The teams are small and the field is big. Teams don't really need to travel far and stay in hotels for the most part either.
Its just a different animal, IMO.
But my guess is the other people at the strip club...
werent supposed to be working in a bubble with the rest of the company and some of the people in their companies families. And could risk that company losing like a billion dollars if it spread and they had to cancel the big company roll out.
I know people want to see sports, but lets not go singling out athletes like they are suppose to be above everyone else. Lots of people are not doing what they are supposed to do..
So, I guess Lou Williams would jump off a bridge (as my mam used to say...)?
doing ok. KBO, Bundesliga, Italian soccer league (im blanking on the name), le liga. I believe basketball has been playing in some countries. Premier league was just my main example cause it was the one i was following the most.
KBO has a lot going for it.
Korea had only 299 total deaths and something like 15,000 total cases. They also have rules in place such as... ENTIRE stadiums being quarantined if a single player tests positve, a schedule which allows for them to shut down the league entirely for 3 weeks at a time with an outbreak (see the Marlins), proper contact tracing, far less travel. Also timeline wise they as a country are viewed as 4-6 months ahead of us. This season may have looked different 6 months into the future.
but they arent completely different either. Again they went through like half a season with barely an issue. So even when we factor that stuff in you would have hoped MLB was doing better.
Shows you the odds the NFL is facing just getting out of training camp
if teams and the leagues did all the right things. Its clear that wont be the case. I think NHL and NBA will be ok in their bubble since they will be able to limit positives even from the idiots and hopefully catch them as they return and quarantine them immediately.
MLB. Using a bubble was the only way this was ever going to work. EPL succesfully pulled off an entire season. NBA so far so good.
Bingo. Add it to the list of things MLB botched during their 2-3 month non-negotiation, when the NBA and NHL put together far superior plans. In addition to the EPL there are a bunch of baseball roadmaps to follow from other leagues, but I suppose MLB couldn't even copy/iterate competently. Emblematic of the entire response here.
Also I almost completely agree with nygiants16. Seeing how kids have handled this gives hope that we can adapt to have an almost normal despite the behavior of so many supposed adults/leaders providing the exact opposite. Someone needs to dust off the "It's so easy a kid can do it" commercials.
says both Yankees and Phillies players felt unsafe, and thus the cancelation of today's game. Not sure what the next step is. On it's face all teams playing in a handful of stadiums likely made the most sense but even then I'm not sure it would have avoided this.
Because you're thinking reasonably & responsibly. Not everyone thinks like that. I hate the say 'it is what it is', but it applies here. Some people are going to do what they want, regardless of how it might impact others. I know that's not breaking news...
SFGF - I was disagreeing with you on another thread about risk of cancelling season. Have to therefore acknowledge this is bad news. I'm holding out hope they can contain this shit and other teams/players will learn lessons...but not nearly as optimistic as I was Friday or whenever it was.
But they did make some changes and had a lot of testing. The virus is also a lot more widespread in the US right now because we suck at this.
Project Restart (Premier League) succeeded because there was far lower spread of coronavirus in the UK. They handled the outbreak better than the US did
if teams and the leagues did all the right things. Its clear that wont be the case. I think NHL and NBA will be ok in their bubble since they will be able to limit positives even from the idiots and hopefully catch them as they return and quarantine them immediately.
Definitely agree that the NHL and NBA have a chance to finish their seasons in the bubble, but the bubble was an option because their seasons were nearly complete. The NHL decided to skip the rest of their regular season and go right to the playoffs while the NBA decided to hold a few "seeding games" (basically warmup scrimmages that count) before their playoffs begin
plans to cancel other games today. Presumably they are going to have to find a way to have multiple double headers throughout the season ( I know they wanted to avoid this) but it's doubtful this will be the only time a game is canceled and the league is apparently discussing what to do about stadiums with outbreaks. They didn't want the Blue Jays to play in "sub MLB lighting" but they are going to have to consider minor league parks as part of this "plan".
If it is true that they knew tests were positive before the game on Sunday...that is very very irresponsible by their
players. It doesn't matter if they thought they were asymptomatic, you just can't do that for this to have any
chance of working. Another outbreak by another team,
could cause the whole process to blow up!
with the amount of cases in this country these sports would only work in a bubble. You cant control thousands of people. And when you start factoring players, team employees, friends/family that those players and employees see, etc.. it just doesnt work. Way way way too many variables to control. But hey at least instead of figuring out the logistics over the course of months MLB and MLBPA fought over money and eventually the players just got forced to play by the owners anyway.
when you are home jist stay home? When you go to the grocery store wear a mask, do not talk to anyone get in and go home?
What is the need to go strip clubs and parties?
Explain that to a large chunk of America. Strip clubs and parties make for good stories, but really we're talking about any tight indoor space where people are congregating.
plans to cancel other games today. Presumably they are going to have to find a way to have multiple double headers throughout the season ( I know they wanted to avoid this) but it's doubtful this will be the only time a game is canceled and the league is apparently discussing what to do about stadiums with outbreaks. They didn't want the Blue Jays to play in "sub MLB lighting" but they are going to have to consider minor league parks as part of this "plan".
.
Yeah, they might have to play some doubleheaders.
They should go the 7 inning route for game 2, like in the minors maybe?
You could have pulled off 3-6 bubbles in areas where the COVID spread rate isn't as high. MLB tried to do what the EPL did but it failed because COVID spread in the US is far greater than in the UK. No coincidence that a Florida based team (Marlins) got hit first because Florida is one of the US epicenters of the outbreak. It's highly likely the Marlins were just going about their business and taking as many precautions as possible, but still got unlucky because the virus is so out of control in FL
Premier league got through like half a season with travel and barely a case. MLB cant get through a week without having to cancel a game.
Like an idiot i thought everyone involved would take this so seriously that once we got the ball rolling sports would be fine. The leagues would pump tons of money into keeping the players safe. But you can do all that, setup a bubble with all the tech that the NBA used and still end up screwed when an idiot decides to go to a strip club (for wings, its his favorite wing place, i believe him).
Sports like MLB and NFL where the players will go home to their families who are doing god knows what are in trouble.
Its all about levels of spread in the area. Europe took care of its shit. Certain regions of the USA did not and this is the result.
Its comfortable to lay the blame on one or a few people, but the problem is much much bigger.
cancelling a couple games and the risk to so many players might be the kind of thing to get everyone to take this more seriously. I mean how many people will lose how many millions of dollars if in two weeks the season is cancelled.
All it takes is one or two key players going out for an extended period to wreck the playoffs.
Yep, the NBA and NHL had great, well thought-out plans for their restarts but they could still get an outbreak if the bubble gets broken by someone pulling what Lou Williams reportedly did and what Porzingis and Millsap did by not getting a daily test
the 1 big positive to this happening is awareness and education
perhaps now people will realize asymptomatic (or pre-symptomatic) spread is a real thing that can't just be played through.
sports leagues and players will hopefully realize how careful they need to be and teams will realize how quickly mistakes can turn into a team wide outbreak. Hopefully there's time for adjustments to be made.
and hopefully there will be renewed energy into continued improvement of the testing situation which is insanely crappy even for sports leagues likely investing millions privately in the best facilities they can.
perhaps all of that will be at MLB's expense and if so maybe it will have been worth it even if the season gets cancelled. It will be if it wises people up enough to listen to the experts more.
and MLB should send anyone who doesnt think this is...
it's logistically close to impossible but imagine being able to dip into your entire organization to fortify the roster. 2020 HS picks (kids picked this month!) pitching in the bigs?
Because you're thinking reasonably & responsibly. Not everyone thinks like that. I hate the say 'it is what it is', but it applies here. Some people are going to do what they want, regardless of how it might impact others. I know that's not breaking news...
SFGF - I was disagreeing with you on another thread about risk of cancelling season. Have to therefore acknowledge this is bad news. I'm holding out hope they can contain this shit and other teams/players will learn lessons...but not nearly as optimistic as I was Friday or whenever it was.
This is my week in the office. Some people are good with masks, some aren't. I mask up, lather up with hand sanitizer. Others don't. This is the nature of the beast we're dealing with. Some are really good, some aren't. We're dealing with people. It's as simple as that. In an ideal world, everyone would mask up & we could kick COVID's ass, but it's not realistic unfortunately.
And I don't see how the NFL gets off. Guys breathing, sweating over each other for 60 minutes? But the NFL is focused on the important issues, like no jersey swaps after the game...Haha.
they are basically living inside a fancy hospital. Daily testing, monitoring and strict containment parameters are in place.
for MLB and NFL there are none of these being implemented
The NBA doesn't have all the equipment required inside the bubble to treat serious injuries. Players who get hurt badly enough to have to get an MRI reportedly have to leave the bubble because I don't think there's an actual hospital on the Wide World of Sports campus
Because you're thinking reasonably & responsibly. Not everyone thinks like that. I hate the say 'it is what it is', but it applies here. Some people are going to do what they want, regardless of how it might impact others. I know that's not breaking news...
SFGF - I was disagreeing with you on another thread about risk of cancelling season. Have to therefore acknowledge this is bad news. I'm holding out hope they can contain this shit and other teams/players will learn lessons...but not nearly as optimistic as I was Friday or whenever it was.
This is my week in the office. Some people are good with masks, some aren't. I mask up, lather up with hand sanitizer. Others don't. This is the nature of the beast we're dealing with. Some are really good, some aren't. We're dealing with people. It's as simple as that. In an ideal world, everyone would mask up & we could kick COVID's ass, but it's not realistic unfortunately.
And I don't see how the NFL gets off. Guys breathing, sweating over each other for 60 minutes? But the NFL is focused on the important issues, like no jersey swaps after the game...Haha.
NFLs plan is like wearing a condom throughout dinner and taking it off for the sex.
its probably team or NBA medical people transporting the player to a hospital. That player will then im sure be tested and even quarantined before returning to the bubble, if they are able to return (if the injury isnt serious). Its not like the guy has to call an uber to take him to an MRI machine inside a walmart with a strip club attached to it.
needs to go off campus for an MRI they will get tested daily in quarantine before they are cleared to go near another person.
That's the best the NBA could do because it wasn't in the cards for the Orlando, Florida community to move essential resources for fighting COVID from the community into the bubble. Hopefully it works
Matt Breen
@matt_breen
The Marlins learned before Sunday’s game that three players had tested positive for COVID-19. So they held a player’s meeting to decide if they should play against the Phillies. Can’t find that protocol in MLB’s 101-page manual.
Matt Breen
@matt_breen
The Marlins learned before Sunday’s game that three players had tested positive for COVID-19. So they held a player’s meeting to decide if they should play against the Phillies. Can’t find that protocol in MLB’s 101-page manual.
So they knew guys were sick & then held a player's meeting? Like...WTF?
Matt Breen
@matt_breen
The Marlins learned before Sunday’s game that three players had tested positive for COVID-19. So they held a player’s meeting to decide if they should play against the Phillies. Can’t find that protocol in MLB’s 101-page manual.
There ya go, let the experts decide what is best. Everyone thinks they are.
Matt Breen
@matt_breen
The Marlins learned before Sunday’s game that three players had tested positive for COVID-19. So they held a player’s meeting to decide if they should play against the Phillies. Can’t find that protocol in MLB’s 101-page manual.
How on earth could they have gone ahead with the game? If I were on the Phillies I'd be pissed right now
Matt Breen
@matt_breen
The Marlins learned before Sunday’s game that three players had tested positive for COVID-19. So they held a player’s meeting to decide if they should play against the Phillies. Can’t find that protocol in MLB’s 101-page manual.
How on earth could they have gone ahead with the game? If I were on the Phillies I'd be pissed right now
Is this any different than what we see around the nation? I mean MLB has explicit rules obviously which obviously weren't followed....but again, this is what we see from people. A blatant disregard - which is going to have this most likely stick around longer than we want.
This Marlins decision is just a microcosm of our society.
you cannot run a team like this, or let the players make this call. Just a complete lack of awareness and if they really want people to take it seriously, drop the hammer.
an outbreak, you can only (hopefully) dramatically reduce the risk. The percentages that these seasons were going to fly successfully was low. The NFL should try, but I’ve never been optimistic. Christian said above “ what if 2-3 starting lineman are out. Do we want to trot DJ out there?” I agree with that. What if he or Saquon test positive, are susceptible and end up in the hospital, they could be done Permanently. Scares the crap out of me.
as the Marlins had been out of town for a week, Flowers and D'Arnaud were out with COVID symptoms and pulled game 1 vs. Mets, and the Marlins played the Braves prior to the start of the regular season. Link - ( New Window )
as the Marlins had been out of town for a week, Flowers and D'Arnaud were out with COVID symptoms and pulled game 1 vs. Mets, and the Marlins played the Braves prior to the start of the regular season. Link - ( New Window )
Nothing against the author but he's just a Braves fansite writer. Doesn't mean he's wrong but he's not a journalist.
as the Marlins had been out of town for a week, Flowers and D'Arnaud were out with COVID symptoms and pulled game 1 vs. Mets, and the Marlins played the Braves prior to the start of the regular season. Link - ( New Window )
Nothing against the author but he's just a Braves fansite writer. Doesn't mean he's wrong but he's not a journalist.
Yes, it is speculation. That is exactly what I said. It was my first though when Alfaro was out and the couple Marlins yesterday, as I recalled those two playing each other.
Henry Winter
@henrywinter
Zero positive tests from 1,574 Premier League players and club staff tested for Covid-19 between Monday July 20 and Sunday July 26.
Of course he is not to blame for an outbreak as that situation is out of his control, however, as has been pointed out by any number of analysts as well as health experts MLB's plan was the weakest of the major sports. There were a number of health experts who said this would happen because they could not believe MLB was just flying around 30 mobile units as if nothing was happening.
I just don't see why anyone, players, owners, would trust his leadership on any major issue moving forward. What evidence has he given that he should be trusted as competent?
RE: If the season is cancelled how can Manfred remain commissioner?
Of course he is not to blame for an outbreak as that situation is out of his control, however, as has been pointed out by any number of analysts as well as health experts MLB's plan was the weakest of the major sports. There were a number of health experts who said this would happen because they could not believe MLB was just flying around 30 mobile units as if nothing was happening.
I just don't see why anyone, players, owners, would trust his leadership on any major issue moving forward. What evidence has he given that he should be trusted as competent?
Are you fucking kidding ? This is Manfred's fault ? I'm no big fan of his, but I don't see how you blame him for this. Getting this season is was problematic at best.
No I'm not fucking kidding. The failure may be a collaborative effort but does the buck not stop with commissioner of a league?
They thought the protocols they put in place would limit an outbreak to 2 or 3 players at the most at any one time. They would then quarantine those players and be able to move along. But they were warned this was wishful thinking by any number of health experts.
If they can't stop it from overwhelming a clubhouse, then that means the current protocols aren't sufficient. Regardless of what they thought about them, it means they were not good enough, not competent enough, and not thought out enough.
Miami Marlins manager Don Mattingly says adjustments to MLB pandemic protocols are a work in progress, as Tuesday’s exhibition game at Atlanta showed.
“Our dugout was a mess,” Mattingly said Wednesday. “They weren’t set up to have guys in the stands. It was raining. There were no tents. So we had all these guys, and nowhere to go. Then we have a zillion guys in the dugout, so there’s no way we were social distancing. Those are the things we’ve got to work through.”
Another problem Mattingly said he needs to solve: When he wears a mask, his glasses keep fogging.
That's different than his other statement about their stadium not being set up for social distancing. This is on the Braves and MLB.
players are going nuts right now. I would be beyond furious.
Imagine what's going through Zack Wheeler's mind? His wife gave birth to twins 10 days ago.
I guess it would depend on how well informed he is.
If he's read the data and the medical research, he would know that he and his young wife are at FAR more risk driving to and from the stadium than from contracting COVID, and especially his babies are at zero risk from COVID (there has been negative excess death nationally among people under 25 this year).
If he is poorly informed, he would likely be very concerned.
to get into a car accident on the way to work? What kinda nonsense is that? Especially just below a post about a 27 year old who is dealing with some heart issues stemming from covid. But sure.
RE: so he shouldnt be concerned cause he is more likely...
to get into a car accident on the way to work? What kinda nonsense is that? Especially just below a post about a 27 year old who is dealing with some heart issues stemming from covid. But sure.
"Dealing with heart issues" is a very strong way of putting it for a guy who's treatment regiment is rest, and who would likely be cleared to play in a week.
RE: gee Florida is a shit show filled with dumb fucks...
“ MIAMI MARLINS YOU BE RESPONSIBLE OTHERWISE I BREAK YOUR FUCKING NECK” https://twitter.com/the_ironsheik/status/1287767730528104448?s=21 - ( New Window )
Haha. This is how you do it the proper way. Take notes.
RE: so he shouldnt be concerned cause he is more likely...
to get into a car accident on the way to work? What kinda nonsense is that? Especially just below a post about a 27 year old who is dealing with some heart issues stemming from covid. But sure.
Also, it is well established that for people under 40 and probably even under 50, that the normal seasonal flu is more deadly than covid.
So, and this is a serious question, do people think that with the benefit of what we know now, the Michael Jordan "flu game" should have been canceled?
RE: RE: so he shouldnt be concerned cause he is more likely...
Also, it is well established that for people under 40 and probably even under 50, that the normal seasonal flu is more deadly than covid.
So, and this is a serious question, do people think that with the benefit of what we know now, the Michael Jordan "flu game" should have been canceled?
Increasing quality!
RE: RE: so he shouldnt be concerned cause he is more likely...
to get into a car accident on the way to work? What kinda nonsense is that? Especially just below a post about a 27 year old who is dealing with some heart issues stemming from covid. But sure.
Also, it is well established that for people under 40 and probably even under 50, that the normal seasonal flu is more deadly than covid.
So, and this is a serious question, do people think that with the benefit of what we know now, the Michael Jordan "flu game" should have been canceled?
No it is not well established, haha. Where do you people come up with this stuff?
to get into a car accident on the way to work? What kinda nonsense is that? Especially just below a post about a 27 year old who is dealing with some heart issues stemming from covid. But sure.
Also, it is well established that for people under 40 and probably even under 50, that the normal seasonal flu is more deadly than covid.
So, and this is a serious question, do people think that with the benefit of what we know now, the Michael Jordan "flu game" should have been canceled?
No it is not well established, haha. Where do you people come up with this stuff?
Then you can go here and see the estimates that the flu in the past few years killed 266, 115, 126, 180, 396 people age 0-4 over the past five years. So yes, seasonal flu killed 5-20x in the 0-4 age group as COVID.
For older groups, let's take as an example Arizona, where we have 3304 deaths total, and 203 deaths among people under 45. Arizona has ~4 million residents under age 45. This means about 50 people per million under age 45 have died of COVID.
Serology studies in Arizona show 15% of people have had COVID as of July 19. But we know that it takes a couple weeks for antibodies to form, and also that a great many people kill off COVID purely with a T-cell response and would not even show antibodies.
Taking all that into account, I'm going to estimate that 25% of the state has had the disease. I think it is probably higher, but I think it's very hard to argue for lower.
So I'm estimating 1 million AZ residents under age 45 have had the disease (and more have been exposed and didn't catch it, thanks to natural cross immunity). And 203 are dead. 203 in a million is 0.02%, and I'm more likely to be conservative than aggressive in my estimate. That rate would be lower than the flu mortality rate, or perhaps in-line if you want to nitpick.
well considering there are 10x the number of positive Flu cases
than that of Covid, i'm not really sure what you are talking about. And why are we talking about 1-4 year olds in a thread about athletes aged 18-40 for the most part?
than that of Covid, i'm not really sure what you are talking about. And why are we talking about 1-4 year olds in a thread about athletes aged 18-40 for the most part?
fewer than 2000 people have died from covid between ages 19-40 to date. Assuming 20% of the population has been exposed which at this point feels understated but we have no way of knowing -- gets you to a 99.989% survival rate.
Certainly the Red Sox pitcher news is concerning, hope he makes a speedy recovery, but its still pretty early in his recovery and oh by the way, do they even know if he picked it up at a ballpark? Its not like our risks are 0 by not going to work.
But everyone certainly has the right to make their own decision on this - and if this COL pitcher can survive a year off economically, all the power to him.
in the 18-49 range (all athletes) 2,800 people died out of 14m+ confirmed cases. That's less than 2%.
It took about 10 weeks for there to be 2,800 dead from COVID in that 35-44 group.
So yeah, I have no idea where you are coming up with your conclusion from.
Where did you get the information on ages 35-44? CDC through July 11 (they update on Wednesdays) shows 2400 deaths ages 35-44 (with most of those over age 40... very few athletes over 40 ... coaches another matter of course)
to get into a car accident on the way to work? What kinda nonsense is that? Especially just below a post about a 27 year old who is dealing with some heart issues stemming from covid. But sure.
"Dealing with heart issues" is a very strong way of putting it for a guy who's treatment regiment is rest, and who would likely be cleared to play in a week.
Is it? The article makes no mention of him likely being cleared to play in a week. He is resting for a week before getting another MRI to see if the swelling of his heart has resumed. Good analysis, Big Chief Data.
in the 18-49 range (all athletes) 2,800 people died out of 14m+ confirmed cases. That's less than 2%.
It took about 10 weeks for there to be 2,800 dead from COVID in that 35-44 group.
So yeah, I have no idea where you are coming up with your conclusion from.
Where did you get the information on ages 35-44? CDC through July 11 (they update on Wednesdays) shows 2400 deaths ages 35-44 (with most of those over age 40... very few athletes over 40 ... coaches another matter of course)
In the link he provided.
If you go to page 2 under the graph it breaks it out by week. Starting the week ending of 3/28 there's 100+ deaths in that age bracket for 9 straight weeks. I didn't add them up manually, and now that i just did so its closer to 2,000 over a 10/11 weeks timespan. By bad there, looked like more when I estimated it.
But my point was that it dwarfs the Flu and has done so in a much quicker timespan. here - ( New Window )
But you have to love the site. Blame Florida, when the Marlins caught it in Atlanta? Florida is bad, but the Marlins were clean until the exhibition game after a couple/few Braves tested positive.
Also, seemed weird to me all the guys sitting in the dugout without masks on. So the players not scheduled to play have to stay away, but the rest of the team sits in a dugout breathing on each other..
its about states that are populated as much or more than Taiwan being able to freely travel (up until recently) to any other state. There's 23 million people in the tristate area alone (the entire size of the Phillipines). in 2017 60m passengers flew through JFK alone...
It just isn't the same, basically the polar opposite.
But you have to love the site. Blame Florida, when the Marlins caught it in Atlanta? Florida is bad, but the Marlins were clean until the exhibition game after a couple/few Braves tested positive.
Also, seemed weird to me all the guys sitting in the dugout without masks on. So the players not scheduled to play have to stay away, but the rest of the team sits in a dugout breathing on each other..
I agree with those crapping on MLBs protocols..
Good point on the dugout. Even the viral video of Rizzo sanitizing that Brewer players hands... you've got Rizzo, a middle aged 1B coach and the Brewers runner all congregating and laughing. I cant tell if the Brewer has a mask on, but the coach and Rizzo certainly dont. I get that its hot out and its uncomfortable, but you'd think players would mask when they are within 6 feet of other players, and especially older coaches.
players are going nuts right now. I would be beyond furious.
Imagine what's going through Zack Wheeler's mind? His wife gave birth to twins 10 days ago.
I guess it would depend on how well informed he is.
If he's read the data and the medical research, he would know that he and his young wife are at FAR more risk driving to and from the stadium than from contracting COVID, and especially his babies are at zero risk from COVID (there has been negative excess death nationally among people under 25 this year).
If he is poorly informed, he would likely be very concerned. CDC Excess Death Stats - ( New Window )
a link between MIS-C and influenza (first known potential case), and it has taken less than a few months for COVID-19 to be linked with it, it's become the intellectually lazy analysis to compare COVID-19 with influenza or car accidents, or anything else. I mean, the short-term death rates of COVID-19 are higher than AIDS...
Beyond that, we are well aware of the effects of the influenza viruses. Not only are we still learning about the mortality and morbidity effects of the NOVEL coronavirus, we are learning that the morbidity impacts may outweigh the mortality impacts.
We're not going to go back to full-on shutdowns (that horse shit in the stable months ago), but we need to make informed decisions that take into account the fact that there could be some long-term health harms from this.
you have got to get the players to buy into compliance. It's got to start with seniors leaders of the locker room and the entire coaching staffs, no matter what their personal opinions of the virus are. Without that, people will run amok.
Being somewhat facetious, but let the players smoke as much weed as they want at home (with no suspensions), and that may cut down on foot traffic to places that could lead to infections during the season.
I won't comment much becasue the thread will wind up deleted
Some teams will have to shut down. Large blocks of games will have to be postponed. More players will opt out.
As long as there are a few games a day to put on TV, the season won't stop. But I would expect the playoffs to be late, and to be held in a bubble somewhere. They'll be late because it'll take a couple of extra weeks to play the makeup games, while in the meantime, some teams go right into quarantine ahead of the bubble
Because it’s a pay site but the Athletic has an article today suggesting the Phillies were concerned all weekend because the Marlins were not following proper protocols from the time they arrived in Philly. They didn’t stagger their arrivals and not many were wearing masks in the dugout at all. Not good
It's just a microcosm of a not insignificant portion
The Jets made a great trade. Picked up draft picks for a guy who won’t be playing this year. Nobody will.
They can’t get baseball going for 1 week. Football has no chance. They won’t be able to play. How do you handle it when several teams can’t send out an OL? Or when the QBs test positive?
We won’t have football in 2020. No NFL. No college. No HS.
Because it’s a pay site but the Athletic has an article today suggesting the Phillies were concerned all weekend because the Marlins were not following proper protocols from the time they arrived in Philly. They didn’t stagger their arrivals and not many were wearing masks in the dugout at all. Not good
Besides coaches and Frazer, did you see any Yankees wearing masks...?
Because it’s a pay site but the Athletic has an article today suggesting the Phillies were concerned all weekend because the Marlins were not following proper protocols from the time they arrived in Philly. They didn’t stagger their arrivals and not many were wearing masks in the dugout at all. Not good
Besides coaches and Frazer, did you see any Yankees wearing masks...?
You’re trying to make an argument where there isn’t one. Not wearing a mask in the dugout is a league wide issue. The reason the Phillies are upset about the Marlins in this instance is because they KNEW they had several positives on their team and were waiting on results for others (which also turned out positive). Hell, they had a team meeting about it to discuss whether to play or not.
I didn’t write the article, I was just passing it along.
I just don't get why it's up to the players to decide
if the game should be played. That doesn't seem right.
There should be a 3rd party involved and they should provide a recommendation based on the status of the team. If the 3rd party feels like they shouldn't play, then cancel the games. If they feel like its ok to play then it should go to the team/players to approve.
But players shouldn't have a say at all if its considered unsafe. Mattingly really shit the bed here (along with their GM I would imagine).
well i guess the silver lining in the postponed Orioles/Marlins games
is its unlikely they'll need to reschedule them. Even with 16 playoff teams its hard to imagine either team is within 2 games at that 58 game mark. Doesnt seem worth the cost of a charter trip to Miami.
Supposedly they are going to try and play in Baltimore tomorrow night... probably a lot of taxi squad players called up from Jupiter.
Will be interesting, assuming NYY at PHL play tonight, if players seem a little more cautious out there than they've been. I certainly hope they can play - that was a series i was looking forward to seeing, two very good teams.
Will be interesting, assuming NYY at PHL play tonight, if players seem a little more cautious out there than they've been. I certainly hope they can play - that was a series i was looking forward to seeing, two very good teams.
Postponed again tonight. Hopefully they'll at least be able to play tomw and thurs.
for the yanks/phils, but why today? Are they still waiting on results from PHI players? Hopefully this isnt a sign that PHI has had a few positive results as well.
I know nobody in MLB likes doubleheaders, but that seems like the easiest way to make these games up. They dont have to worry about losing money or shuffling all of the fans out.
to get into a car accident on the way to work? What kinda nonsense is that? Especially just below a post about a 27 year old who is dealing with some heart issues stemming from covid. But sure.
Also, it is well established that for people under 40 and probably even under 50, that the normal seasonal flu is more deadly than covid.
So, and this is a serious question, do people think that with the benefit of what we know now, the Michael Jordan "flu game" should have been canceled?
But how did the players make this decision? One, the results should go back to MLB and they should make the call. Two, is there nobody in the Marlins organization that makes decisions? How did this get past ownership, upper management, the manager, etc? So the players find out they have it and they get to choose if they can play or not? WTF?
for the yanks/phils, but why today? Are they still waiting on results from PHI players? Hopefully this isnt a sign that PHI has had a few positive results as well.
I know nobody in MLB likes doubleheaders, but that seems like the easiest way to make these games up. They dont have to worry about losing money or shuffling all of the fans out.
They said the Phils tested negative but are going to test them all again later today and the postponement was a precaution.
for the yanks/phils, but why today? Are they still waiting on results from PHI players? Hopefully this isnt a sign that PHI has had a few positive results as well.
I know nobody in MLB likes doubleheaders, but that seems like the easiest way to make these games up. They dont have to worry about losing money or shuffling all of the fans out.
They said the Phils tested negative but are going to test them all again later today and the postponement was a precaution.
It takes like a day to get the results back. It isn't immediate so it makes sense that they'll go on hiatus for multiple days.
But how did the players make this decision? One, the results should go back to MLB and they should make the call. Two, is there nobody in the Marlins organization that makes decisions? How did this get past ownership, upper management, the manager, etc? So the players find out they have it and they get to choose if they can play or not? WTF?
I dont think any of the players that "voted" were known to have had it. I think 3 of their teammates tested positive back at the hotel... not that it makes the process of what occurred any less absurd of course, but no one played knowing they were ill.
they voted against or the playing MIA at all. Curious if they could make MIA come to WAS. I mean sure WAS gets more home games, but how much does that matter right now. When MLB crammed 60 games in 66 days or whatever it was they didnt leave themselves room to be cancelling games left and right.
they voted against or the playing MIA at all. Curious if they could make MIA come to WAS. I mean sure WAS gets more home games, but how much does that matter right now. When MLB crammed 60 games in 66 days or whatever it was they didnt leave themselves room to be cancelling games left and right.
they voted against or the playing MIA at all. Curious if they could make MIA come to WAS. I mean sure WAS gets more home games, but how much does that matter right now. When MLB crammed 60 games in 66 days or whatever it was they didnt leave themselves room to be cancelling games left and right.
Thats a slippery slope - i get there arent crowds anyway, but there is still an advantage to playing in the confines of your own park and sleeping in your own bed. If you do this for the Nats, then you need to proclaim the Marlins are playing their entire season on the road.
Its also troubling that teams seem to be taking votes now on things the league and players association was supposed to agree to before the season started. I'm not a "fire" people in a pandemic type person, but this is not remotely a good look for Manfred or for Clark. This is planning 101.
keep in mind the Nats were just gifted two extra home games
vs Toronto this week. Do they expect to demand to play their entire season at home?
I think they are doing this because their manager has been vocal about his fears given a heart condition... my view is they should keep him home on roadtrips if its that serious.
They should forfeit these games. They clearly violated protocol and have been doing so for some time. I don't blame the Nationals one bit for not wanting to go there. They're being asked to go into a hotspot to play a team that is not taking this seriously.
Is it the concern that the Marlins' stadium facilities are potentially contaminated? The Marlins haven't even been there in more than a week, so that seems baseless. And even if you accept concerns about the stadium, it can obviously be thoroughly cleaned by Friday (and given that infection from surfaces is now viewed as pretty unlikely anyway, this really seems like a non-issue).
Is it that Florida is an unsafe place to be. Aside from the fact that that concern is no more legitimate than it was before the Marlins' outbreak, if you're unwilling to hold games in certain places then you don't have a season. Game over. The time to do a bubble, or at least restrict play to certain regions, has come and gone, hasn't it?
Is it concern that there may be infected players who haven't yet tested positive, so there's risk of exposure playing with them. Obviously moving the game doesn't change that.
I just don't see how moving the game addresses any legitimate concern. I can understand Martinez being worried, but dispassionately, I don't think there's any legitimate reason to move the game (other than not wanting to go to Florida at all, which, again, is kind of a game over scenario imo).
They should forfeit these games. They clearly violated protocol and have been doing so for some time. I don't blame the Nationals one bit for not wanting to go there. They're being asked to go into a hotspot to play a team that is not taking this seriously.
You're making a lot of accusations and assumptions in this post. I'm not sure what is real and what is exaggerated re: what Marlins have been doing relative to other teams. They likely picked this up in Atlanta last week by the way, and one of the Nats players Soto got this too... lets not make Miami out to be villains. That's not reasonable.
Martinez should stay home if he's "12" on a scale of 10 concerned. They can play without him, the league should move on without him. Take the year off if its that much of a personal concern.
My view is if they refuse to travel/play - you either shut the entire league down or you forfeit their weekend games. Think the latter is the better approach but i could see both responses.
I think that you should treat Miami (probably Tampa, Houston, Phoenix.
vs Toronto this week. Do they expect to demand to play their entire season at home?
I think they are doing this because their manager has been vocal about his fears given a heart condition... my view is they should keep him home on roadtrips if its that serious.
I don't see the "gift" here. Even if these games are physically played in Washington isn't Toronto the "home" team (i.e. they bat last ) ?
RE: I think that you should treat Miami (probably Tampa, Houston, Phoenix.
as if they were Katrina cities. Yuu wouldn't force the players to go nor would you have the home teams forfeit.
The problem is that Miami has ignored the protocols and have been mismanaged. I'm basing that on the comments in the Athletic in which Miami was violating protocols in Philly and Mattingly's own comments about how they were all crowded into the dugout in Atlanta. Thats what we know about. How much don't we know about ?
Craig Mish of SportsGrid reports that the Marlins' season has been "paused" for the time being.
It was the only real choice with a COVID-19 outbreak in their clubhouse. By last count, 17 individuals (including 15 players and two coaches) have tested positive. In addition to all of the safety concerns, the Marlins simply can't field a competitive team right now. There has also been talk about the Phillies (who played the Marlins over the weekend) pausing their season at least for a few days. There should be more clarity on the situation soon, but this is not what anybody wants to see less than one week into the season.
“We made the decision that we’re going to continue to do this and we’re going to continue to be responsible and just play the game as hard as we can,” Rojas said.
Rojas tested posted...
RE: RE: keep in mind the Nats were just gifted two extra home games
if these games are physically played in Washington isn't Toronto the "home" team (i.e. they bat last ) ?
I imagine every player ever would find playing as the road team in their home stadium preferable to actually traveling for a road game. Sure, it's largely minimized in an empty stadium, but getting to stay home and not have to schlep to another stadium is still something I think just about anyone would welcome.
They should forfeit these games. They clearly violated protocol and have been doing so for some time. I don't blame the Nationals one bit for not wanting to go there. They're being asked to go into a hotspot to play a team that is not taking this seriously.
Actually, it was probably Atlanta that violated the protocols by not having adequate space for players to distance during the rain delays(and I guess they didn't try hard either). And in case you were not watching the Yankees games, they were not wearing masks, they were sitting right next to each other, they were high fiving or doing similar greetings. Miami was healthy when they left Florida as far as we know. They appear to have gotten infected after Atlanta and the Braves had a few players that became infected during that period.
Now two Miami players that tested positive have now tested negative. How does that work in two days? Did it just go away?
So IDK.....
RE: RE: RE: keep in mind the Nats were just gifted two extra home games
if these games are physically played in Washington isn't Toronto the "home" team (i.e. they bat last ) ?
I imagine every player ever would find playing as the road team in their home stadium preferable to actually traveling for a road game. Sure, it's largely minimized in an empty stadium, but getting to stay home and not have to schlep to another stadium is still something I think just about anyone would welcome.
Toronto has been banished from their true homes. I suspect they are living in hotels whether they are playing "home" games in Pittsburgh or if they're playing elsewhere. The entire NBA is playing on the road. They seem to be dealing with it.
RE: keep in mind the Nats were just gifted two extra home games
vs Toronto this week. Do they expect to demand to play their entire season at home?
I think they are doing this because their manager has been vocal about his fears given a heart condition... my view is they should keep him home on roadtrips if its that serious.
I'm not sure how much of an advantage they are getting, with no fans in the stadium and all...
RE: I think that you should treat Miami (probably Tampa, Houston, Phoenix.
Toronto has been banished from their true homes. I suspect they are living in hotels whether they are playing "home" games in Pittsburgh or if they're playing elsewhere. The entire NBA is playing on the road. They seem to be dealing with it.
I'm not sure what your point it. Neither I, nor anyone else in this thread, said the burden of traveling to play a road game is something teams can't deal with or aren't accustomed to doing. But if you don't think it's a benefit for a team to get to play a road game at home instead of traveling to it, even in an empty house, I think you're being pretty silly.
They should forfeit these games. They clearly violated protocol and have been doing so for some time. I don't blame the Nationals one bit for not wanting to go there. They're being asked to go into a hotspot to play a team that is not taking this seriously.
Actually, it was probably Atlanta that violated the protocols by not having adequate space for players to distance during the rain delays(and I guess they didn't try hard either). And in case you were not watching the Yankees games, they were not wearing masks, they were sitting right next to each other, they were high fiving or doing similar greetings. Miami was healthy when they left Florida as far as we know. They appear to have gotten infected after Atlanta and the Braves had a few players that became infected during that period.
Now two Miami players that tested positive have now tested negative. How does that work in two days? Did it just go away?
So IDK.....
Yeah, I heard that excuse. Its Atlanta's fault. I'm not buying it. They had an entire empty stadium to spread out into. The protocols are pretty clear that the only people that are supposed to be in the dugout are the players and coaches that are currently in the game. The bench players are supposed to be in the stands. But I guess they didn't want to get wet.
They should forfeit these games. They clearly violated protocol and have been doing so for some time. I don't blame the Nationals one bit for not wanting to go there. They're being asked to go into a hotspot to play a team that is not taking this seriously.
Actually, it was probably Atlanta that violated the protocols by not having adequate space for players to distance during the rain delays(and I guess they didn't try hard either). And in case you were not watching the Yankees games, they were not wearing masks, they were sitting right next to each other, they were high fiving or doing similar greetings. Miami was healthy when they left Florida as far as we know. They appear to have gotten infected after Atlanta and the Braves had a few players that became infected during that period.
Now two Miami players that tested positive have now tested negative. How does that work in two days? Did it just go away?
So IDK.....
Yeah, I heard that excuse. Its Atlanta's fault. I'm not buying it. They had an entire empty stadium to spread out into. The protocols are pretty clear that the only people that are supposed to be in the dugout are the players and coaches that are currently in the game. The bench players are supposed to be in the stands. But I guess they didn't want to get wet.
Well why the hell would they have to get wet? You dont find Atlanta at fault here? Odd take.
But the testing someone brought up above is an equal mess - apparently Soto has tested negative 6x since Thursday.. but still cant get cleared i guess because he's also testing positive sometimes too?
If they cant rely on these tests, then that's kind of a show stopper...
Toronto has been banished from their true homes. I suspect they are living in hotels whether they are playing "home" games in Pittsburgh or if they're playing elsewhere. The entire NBA is playing on the road. They seem to be dealing with it.
I'm not sure what your point it. Neither I, nor anyone else in this thread, said the burden of traveling to play a road game is something teams can't deal with or aren't accustomed to doing. But if you don't think it's a benefit for a team to get to play a road game at home instead of traveling to it, even in an empty house, I think you're being pretty silly.
I never said it was a benefit. I'm saying that the penalty for playing a "home" game on the road is minimal compared to ordinary times. The burden that is placed on these players is trying to stay healthy, live in relative isolation and follow these difficult protocols. Compared to that I would think that which hotel they're living in and which empty park they're playing is pretty inconsequential. This is especially true for the Toronto Blue Jays, who at the last minute were kicked out of their own country.
RE: RE: I think that you should treat Miami (probably Tampa, Houston, Phoenix.
as if they were Katrina cities. Yuu wouldn't force the players to go nor would you have the home teams forfeit.
Why not LA and all of California? What data and science are you using in that approach?
Add them too. Play everything in NY. I don't think they should have started in the first place but even if they did, I can't see punishing a team for not wanting to play in a biohazard zone.
Well why the hell would they have to get wet? You dont find Atlanta at fault here? Odd take.
No I don't. Atlanta may be guilty of a minor logistical error but that does not excuse gross violations of COVID protocols by Miami. As a fan thats been caught in the rain in Yankee Stadium, I and thousands of other fans were able to scurry to some place where it was dry. A few dozen players couldn't do the same ? Did Mattingly even complain to Atlanta that there facilities were not in place ? Or did he just say "Fuck it"? It looks like the later. As of yesterday the positive percentage for the Miami Marlins was something like 33%. Its probably higher now. Thats higher than a meatpacking plant. I suspect that there was a lot of other carelessness and violations that have not been made public that occured prior to the trips to Atlanta or Philly.
Andy Slater
@AndySlater
JUST IN: Miami-Dade @MayorGimenez
says the Marlins should follow the 14-day quarantine protocol when returning to South Florida after they were knowingly exposed to COVID-19.
They should forfeit these games. They clearly violated protocol and have been doing so for some time. I don't blame the Nationals one bit for not wanting to go there. They're being asked to go into a hotspot to play a team that is not taking this seriously.
You're making a lot of accusations and assumptions in this post. I'm not sure what is real and what is exaggerated re: what Marlins have been doing relative to other teams. They likely picked this up in Atlanta last week by the way, and one of the Nats players Soto got this too... lets not make Miami out to be villains. That's not reasonable.
Martinez should stay home if he's "12" on a scale of 10 concerned. They can play without him, the league should move on without him. Take the year off if its that much of a personal concern.
My view is if they refuse to travel/play - you either shut the entire league down or you forfeit their weekend games. Think the latter is the better approach but i could see both responses.
I don't think it's fair to make Miami out to be the villains either. I'd rather just make the entire state of Florida out to be the villain, save for the few normal people down there that don't insist on pissing into the wind at every turn.
All of these states had months of horror stories from NYC to go on. And what did they do along with some leaders? They pissed right in everyone's face and laughed about it. It's all about the money? Yea, Fuck them.
I have a bridge to sell you if you honestly believe the florida culture didn't play a huge part in this.
Well why the hell would they have to get wet? You dont find Atlanta at fault here? Odd take.
No I don't. Atlanta may be guilty of a minor logistical error but that does not excuse gross violations of COVID protocols by Miami. As a fan thats been caught in the rain in Yankee Stadium, I and thousands of other fans were able to scurry to some place where it was dry. A few dozen players couldn't do the same ? Did Mattingly even complain to Atlanta that there facilities were not in place ? Or did he just say "Fuck it"? It looks like the later. As of yesterday the positive percentage for the Miami Marlins was something like 33%. Its probably higher now. Thats higher than a meatpacking plant. I suspect that there was a lot of other carelessness and violations that have not been made public that occured prior to the trips to Atlanta or Philly.
The more games teams miss the more difficult it becomes to makes the games up. They have not built in many off days to do this. And even with doubleheaders it's difficult. I cannot imagine they'd be okay with a scenario where some teams play 60, some play 55, some play 50, etc.
So I don't see how MLB can deal with this if they truly are committed to not canceling the season.
with Miami's mayor saying all Marlins players need to quarantine for 14 days. Why they decided to play in everyones home parks with 30 different sets of local rules, regs, mayors... when there are no fans... good call!
I'd like to see the season play out, especially since the Yankees
Im sure its been cleaned and disinfected from top to bottom. Plus, they will thoroughly do it again before Yanks get there
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Also, yankees play at philly tonight which is same clubhouse marlins were in past 3 days.
Im sure its been cleaned and disinfected from top to bottom. Plus, they will thoroughly do it again before Yanks get there
That is a concern with this damn virus, it's so contagious. We'll find out how this plays out,
moving forward overall.
What is the need to go strip clubs and parties?
What is the need to go strip clubs and parties?
This was always the worry. The real answer to this question gets way off topic but for young rich players the rules were never going to be followed. Even worse for the NFL when these guys spend all their time and energy risking their well being to play, only to tell them they can't go unwind the way they want.
What is the need to go strip clubs and parties?
Is there reports of marlins players hitting the strip clubs?
Like an idiot i thought everyone involved would take this so seriously that once we got the ball rolling sports would be fine. The leagues would pump tons of money into keeping the players safe. But you can do all that, setup a bubble with all the tech that the NBA used and still end up screwed when an idiot decides to go to a strip club (for wings, its his favorite wing place, i believe him).
Sports like MLB and NFL where the players will go home to their families who are doing god knows what are in trouble.
Quote:
when you are home jist stay home? When you go to the grocery store wear a mask, do not talk to anyone get in and go home?
What is the need to go strip clubs and parties?
Is there reports of marlins players hitting the strip clubs?
i was speaking in general, Lou Williams had an excuse to leave and then decided to go get food at a strip club
Like an idiot i thought everyone involved would take this so seriously that once we got the ball rolling sports would be fine. The leagues would pump tons of money into keeping the players safe. But you can do all that, setup a bubble with all the tech that the NBA used and still end up screwed when an idiot decides to go to a strip club (for wings, its his favorite wing place, i believe him).
Sports like MLB and NFL where the players will go home to their families who are doing god knows what are in trouble.
this really isnt that hard..i have worked every day, never stopped, i did the grocery shopping for 2 households..wear a mask, wash your hands and keep your distance...
We shouldnt be in this same situaion 5 months later..
I do recall reading last week that the Marlins for some reason no one has explained, while they were training, weren't following social distancing guidelines/rules that MLB had provided. Something about the stadium not being set up for it ... but they play in a retractable roof dome.
I do recall reading last week that the Marlins for some reason no one has explained, while they were training, weren't following social distancing guidelines/rules that MLB had provided. Something about the stadium not being set up for it ... but they play in a retractable roof dome.
It was an example. If there NBA players doing dumb shit and breaking the rules (in the bubble I might add) it wouldn't be a stretch to assume players in other sports will be following suit, especially when they aren't confined to a designated area for the season.
I do recall reading last week that the Marlins for some reason no one has explained, while they were training, weren't following social distancing guidelines/rules that MLB had provided. Something about the stadium not being set up for it ... but they play in a retractable roof dome.
jist soeaking to the general selfishness of athletes
Quote:
Asking these men to act like monks was & remains laughable. It's not going to happen. And all you need is for one idiot & it spreads like wildfire.
Not going to a strip club is acting like a monk? That's a very un-fine line there.
Bill L, I wasn't necessarily referring to a strip club, but more the idea that these guys-rich, young, & probably feel invincible-are not going to lock themselves in their house/hotel rooms after getting back from the ballpark.
Don't see how football is going to play this season without an outbreak either.
Quote:
In comment 14938981 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
Asking these men to act like monks was & remains laughable. It's not going to happen. And all you need is for one idiot & it spreads like wildfire.
Not going to a strip club is acting like a monk? That's a very un-fine line there.
Bill L, I wasn't necessarily referring to a strip club, but more the idea that these guys-rich, young, & probably feel invincible-are not going to lock themselves in their house/hotel rooms after getting back from the ballpark.
you dont have to lock yourself in your room...
But you cant stop partying for a few months? you cant cook at home for a few months? maybe its becaise i have kids and i am passed the need to go out party phase of my life but i dont understand this constant need to do go out and do stuff that puts you in harms way...
the whole thing just pisses me off
“Our dugout was a mess,” Mattingly said Wednesday. “They weren’t set up to have guys in the stands. It was raining. There were no tents. So we had all these guys, and nowhere to go. Then we have a zillion guys in the dugout, so there’s no way we were social distancing. Those are the things we’ve got to work through.”
Another problem Mattingly said he needs to solve: When he wears a mask, his glasses keep fogging.
The counter argument that these guys essentially won’t die, so what’s the problem has always been silly. A team can’t operate if 9 guys are sidelined.
Now imagine this playing out in football — an actual dangerous game. Imagine 3 lineman out for a game — do you really want Jones trotting out there?
They had a dance recital friday and saturday night outside, every kid social distanced, washed their hands after each dance..
Each family was seperate from each other, wore masks if they were going near anyone or inside..
My 2 year old asks me every time i come home from can i touch you? they know, so how is it a grown adult cant follow yhose rules?
The counter argument that these guys essentially won’t die, so what’s the problem has always been silly. A team can’t operate if 9 guys are sidelined.
Now imagine this playing out in football — an actual dangerous game. Imagine 3 lineman out for a game — do you really want Jones trotting out there?
Link - ( New Window )
there are other factors but i wont get into that
The more this goes on the more we are learning about potential long term effects - most of which aren't similar to the flu.
Like an idiot i thought everyone involved would take this so seriously that once we got the ball rolling sports would be fine. The leagues would pump tons of money into keeping the players safe. But you can do all that, setup a bubble with all the tech that the NBA used and still end up screwed when an idiot decides to go to a strip club (for wings, its his favorite wing place, i believe him).
Sports like MLB and NFL where the players will go home to their families who are doing god knows what are in trouble.
I guess Premier League should be advising the WHO cause their the only ones without issues.
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I know people want to see sports, but lets not go singling out athletes like they are suppose to be above everyone else. Lots of people are not doing what they are supposed to do..
Its just a different animal, IMO.
I know people want to see sports, but lets not go singling out athletes like they are suppose to be above everyone else. Lots of people are not doing what they are supposed to do..
So, I guess Lou Williams would jump off a bridge (as my mam used to say...)?
KBO has a lot going for it.
Korea had only 299 total deaths and something like 15,000 total cases. They also have rules in place such as... ENTIRE stadiums being quarantined if a single player tests positve, a schedule which allows for them to shut down the league entirely for 3 weeks at a time with an outbreak (see the Marlins), proper contact tracing, far less travel. Also timeline wise they as a country are viewed as 4-6 months ahead of us. This season may have looked different 6 months into the future.
Just sheer stupidity.
Bingo. Add it to the list of things MLB botched during their 2-3 month non-negotiation, when the NBA and NHL put together far superior plans. In addition to the EPL there are a bunch of baseball roadmaps to follow from other leagues, but I suppose MLB couldn't even copy/iterate competently. Emblematic of the entire response here.
Also I almost completely agree with nygiants16. Seeing how kids have handled this gives hope that we can adapt to have an almost normal despite the behavior of so many supposed adults/leaders providing the exact opposite. Someone needs to dust off the "It's so easy a kid can do it" commercials.
SFGF - I was disagreeing with you on another thread about risk of cancelling season. Have to therefore acknowledge this is bad news. I'm holding out hope they can contain this shit and other teams/players will learn lessons...but not nearly as optimistic as I was Friday or whenever it was.
Project Restart (Premier League) succeeded because there was far lower spread of coronavirus in the UK. They handled the outbreak better than the US did
Definitely agree that the NHL and NBA have a chance to finish their seasons in the bubble, but the bubble was an option because their seasons were nearly complete. The NHL decided to skip the rest of their regular season and go right to the playoffs while the NBA decided to hold a few "seeding games" (basically warmup scrimmages that count) before their playoffs begin
If it is true that they knew tests were positive before the game on Sunday...that is very very irresponsible by their
players. It doesn't matter if they thought they were asymptomatic, you just can't do that for this to have any
chance of working. Another outbreak by another team,
could cause the whole process to blow up!
What is the need to go strip clubs and parties?
Explain that to a large chunk of America. Strip clubs and parties make for good stories, but really we're talking about any tight indoor space where people are congregating.
Yeah, they might have to play some doubleheaders.
They should go the 7 inning route for game 2, like in the minors maybe?
Like an idiot i thought everyone involved would take this so seriously that once we got the ball rolling sports would be fine. The leagues would pump tons of money into keeping the players safe. But you can do all that, setup a bubble with all the tech that the NBA used and still end up screwed when an idiot decides to go to a strip club (for wings, its his favorite wing place, i believe him).
Sports like MLB and NFL where the players will go home to their families who are doing god knows what are in trouble.
Its all about levels of spread in the area. Europe took care of its shit. Certain regions of the USA did not and this is the result.
Its comfortable to lay the blame on one or a few people, but the problem is much much bigger.
I'm afraid so. The odds of the NFL starting/completing an entire season are nil IMO.
But it sure sounds like she's warming up real fast.
Yep, the NBA and NHL had great, well thought-out plans for their restarts but they could still get an outbreak if the bubble gets broken by someone pulling what Lou Williams reportedly did and what Porzingis and Millsap did by not getting a daily test
sports leagues and players will hopefully realize how careful they need to be and teams will realize how quickly mistakes can turn into a team wide outbreak. Hopefully there's time for adjustments to be made.
and hopefully there will be renewed energy into continued improvement of the testing situation which is insanely crappy even for sports leagues likely investing millions privately in the best facilities they can.
perhaps all of that will be at MLB's expense and if so maybe it will have been worth it even if the season gets cancelled. It will be if it wises people up enough to listen to the experts more.
for MLB and NFL there are none of these being implemented
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Because you're thinking reasonably & responsibly. Not everyone thinks like that. I hate the say 'it is what it is', but it applies here. Some people are going to do what they want, regardless of how it might impact others. I know that's not breaking news...
SFGF - I was disagreeing with you on another thread about risk of cancelling season. Have to therefore acknowledge this is bad news. I'm holding out hope they can contain this shit and other teams/players will learn lessons...but not nearly as optimistic as I was Friday or whenever it was.
This is my week in the office. Some people are good with masks, some aren't. I mask up, lather up with hand sanitizer. Others don't. This is the nature of the beast we're dealing with. Some are really good, some aren't. We're dealing with people. It's as simple as that. In an ideal world, everyone would mask up & we could kick COVID's ass, but it's not realistic unfortunately.
And I don't see how the NFL gets off. Guys breathing, sweating over each other for 60 minutes? But the NFL is focused on the important issues, like no jersey swaps after the game...Haha.
for MLB and NFL there are none of these being implemented
The NBA doesn't have all the equipment required inside the bubble to treat serious injuries. Players who get hurt badly enough to have to get an MRI reportedly have to leave the bubble because I don't think there's an actual hospital on the Wide World of Sports campus
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In comment 14939000 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
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Because you're thinking reasonably & responsibly. Not everyone thinks like that. I hate the say 'it is what it is', but it applies here. Some people are going to do what they want, regardless of how it might impact others. I know that's not breaking news...
SFGF - I was disagreeing with you on another thread about risk of cancelling season. Have to therefore acknowledge this is bad news. I'm holding out hope they can contain this shit and other teams/players will learn lessons...but not nearly as optimistic as I was Friday or whenever it was.
This is my week in the office. Some people are good with masks, some aren't. I mask up, lather up with hand sanitizer. Others don't. This is the nature of the beast we're dealing with. Some are really good, some aren't. We're dealing with people. It's as simple as that. In an ideal world, everyone would mask up & we could kick COVID's ass, but it's not realistic unfortunately.
And I don't see how the NFL gets off. Guys breathing, sweating over each other for 60 minutes? But the NFL is focused on the important issues, like no jersey swaps after the game...Haha.
NFLs plan is like wearing a condom throughout dinner and taking it off for the sex.
That's the best the NBA could do because it wasn't in the cards for the Orlando, Florida community to move essential resources for fighting COVID from the community into the bubble. Hopefully it works
Matt Breen
@matt_breen
The Marlins learned before Sunday’s game that three players had tested positive for COVID-19. So they held a player’s meeting to decide if they should play against the Phillies. Can’t find that protocol in MLB’s 101-page manual.
https://twitter.com/the_ironsheik/status/1287767730528104448?s=21 - ( New Window )
Matt Breen
@matt_breen
The Marlins learned before Sunday’s game that three players had tested positive for COVID-19. So they held a player’s meeting to decide if they should play against the Phillies. Can’t find that protocol in MLB’s 101-page manual.
So they knew guys were sick & then held a player's meeting? Like...WTF?
Matt Breen
@matt_breen
The Marlins learned before Sunday’s game that three players had tested positive for COVID-19. So they held a player’s meeting to decide if they should play against the Phillies. Can’t find that protocol in MLB’s 101-page manual.
There ya go, let the experts decide what is best. Everyone thinks they are.
WTF.
Matt Breen
@matt_breen
The Marlins learned before Sunday’s game that three players had tested positive for COVID-19. So they held a player’s meeting to decide if they should play against the Phillies. Can’t find that protocol in MLB’s 101-page manual.
How on earth could they have gone ahead with the game? If I were on the Phillies I'd be pissed right now
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Matt Breen
@matt_breen
The Marlins learned before Sunday’s game that three players had tested positive for COVID-19. So they held a player’s meeting to decide if they should play against the Phillies. Can’t find that protocol in MLB’s 101-page manual.
How on earth could they have gone ahead with the game? If I were on the Phillies I'd be pissed right now
Is this any different than what we see around the nation? I mean MLB has explicit rules obviously which obviously weren't followed....but again, this is what we see from people. A blatant disregard - which is going to have this most likely stick around longer than we want.
This Marlins decision is just a microcosm of our society.
Imagine what's going through Zack Wheeler's mind? His wife gave birth to twins 10 days ago.
hopefully all of their tests today come back negative
This is like basic 101 level shit that's already turning into an issue.
Yikes.
Sounds promising....
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players are going nuts right now. I would be beyond furious.
hopefully all of their tests today come back negative
And for the next 14 days..............
“NightMERE”
-Bert Kreischer
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conference call among all 30 owners.
Sounds promising....
was already previously scheduled
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Nothing against the author but he's just a Braves fansite writer. Doesn't mean he's wrong but he's not a journalist.
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as the Marlins had been out of town for a week, Flowers and D'Arnaud were out with COVID symptoms and pulled game 1 vs. Mets, and the Marlins played the Braves prior to the start of the regular season. Link - ( New Window )
Nothing against the author but he's just a Braves fansite writer. Doesn't mean he's wrong but he's not a journalist.
Yes, it is speculation. That is exactly what I said. It was my first though when Alfaro was out and the couple Marlins yesterday, as I recalled those two playing each other.
Henry Winter
@henrywinter
Zero positive tests from 1,574 Premier League players and club staff tested for Covid-19 between Monday July 20 and Sunday July 26.
Scrapped meaning no make up date? I don't know how MLB thinks they can play a season if this starts happening.
Know when to fold 'em
Know when to walk away
And know when to run
I just don't see why anyone, players, owners, would trust his leadership on any major issue moving forward. What evidence has he given that he should be trusted as competent?
I just don't see why anyone, players, owners, would trust his leadership on any major issue moving forward. What evidence has he given that he should be trusted as competent?
They thought the protocols they put in place would limit an outbreak to 2 or 3 players at the most at any one time. They would then quarantine those players and be able to move along. But they were warned this was wishful thinking by any number of health experts.
If they can't stop it from overwhelming a clubhouse, then that means the current protocols aren't sufficient. Regardless of what they thought about them, it means they were not good enough, not competent enough, and not thought out enough.
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Miami Marlins manager Don Mattingly says adjustments to MLB pandemic protocols are a work in progress, as Tuesday’s exhibition game at Atlanta showed.
“Our dugout was a mess,” Mattingly said Wednesday. “They weren’t set up to have guys in the stands. It was raining. There were no tents. So we had all these guys, and nowhere to go. Then we have a zillion guys in the dugout, so there’s no way we were social distancing. Those are the things we’ve got to work through.”
Another problem Mattingly said he needs to solve: When he wears a mask, his glasses keep fogging.
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floating around that the Orioles players have been informed they are leaving Florida tonight which would mean the entire series is being scrapped.
Scrapped meaning no make up date? I don't know how MLB thinks they can play a season if this starts happening.
It's only a rumor for now but makeup dates for any canceled games are currently up in the air.
Red Sox pitcher Eduardo Rodriguez confirms he's dealing with heart issue stemming from COVID-19 infection - ( New Window )
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players are going nuts right now. I would be beyond furious.
Imagine what's going through Zack Wheeler's mind? His wife gave birth to twins 10 days ago.
I guess it would depend on how well informed he is.
If he's read the data and the medical research, he would know that he and his young wife are at FAR more risk driving to and from the stadium than from contracting COVID, and especially his babies are at zero risk from COVID (there has been negative excess death nationally among people under 25 this year).
If he is poorly informed, he would likely be very concerned.
CDC Excess Death Stats - ( New Window )
"Dealing with heart issues" is a very strong way of putting it for a guy who's treatment regiment is rest, and who would likely be cleared to play in a week.
Yell this very same thing to everyone sitting out on the beaches today in smart Jersey.
Much sure you curse multiple times to make your statement more impactful as well.
Haha. This is how you do it the proper way. Take notes.
Also, it is well established that for people under 40 and probably even under 50, that the normal seasonal flu is more deadly than covid.
So, and this is a serious question, do people think that with the benefit of what we know now, the Michael Jordan "flu game" should have been canceled?
So, and this is a serious question, do people think that with the benefit of what we know now, the Michael Jordan "flu game" should have been canceled?
Increasing quality!
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to get into a car accident on the way to work? What kinda nonsense is that? Especially just below a post about a 27 year old who is dealing with some heart issues stemming from covid. But sure.
Also, it is well established that for people under 40 and probably even under 50, that the normal seasonal flu is more deadly than covid.
So, and this is a serious question, do people think that with the benefit of what we know now, the Michael Jordan "flu game" should have been canceled?
No it is not well established, haha. Where do you people come up with this stuff?
https://twitter.com/johnjharwood/status/1287817568896667649?s=21 - ( New Window )
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In comment 14939245 Italianju said:
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to get into a car accident on the way to work? What kinda nonsense is that? Especially just below a post about a 27 year old who is dealing with some heart issues stemming from covid. But sure.
Also, it is well established that for people under 40 and probably even under 50, that the normal seasonal flu is more deadly than covid.
So, and this is a serious question, do people think that with the benefit of what we know now, the Michael Jordan "flu game" should have been canceled?
No it is not well established, haha. Where do you people come up with this stuff?
For me, it's all about data.
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm
Table 1, Tab 2. You'll be able to count up all the deaths from COVID for people age Under 1 Year and 1-4 Years Old pretty fast. That number is 20.
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/2017-2018.htm
Then you can go here and see the estimates that the flu in the past few years killed 266, 115, 126, 180, 396 people age 0-4 over the past five years. So yes, seasonal flu killed 5-20x in the 0-4 age group as COVID.
For older groups, let's take as an example Arizona, where we have 3304 deaths total, and 203 deaths among people under 45. Arizona has ~4 million residents under age 45. This means about 50 people per million under age 45 have died of COVID.
Serology studies in Arizona show 15% of people have had COVID as of July 19. But we know that it takes a couple weeks for antibodies to form, and also that a great many people kill off COVID purely with a T-cell response and would not even show antibodies.
Taking all that into account, I'm going to estimate that 25% of the state has had the disease. I think it is probably higher, but I think it's very hard to argue for lower.
So I'm estimating 1 million AZ residents under age 45 have had the disease (and more have been exposed and didn't catch it, thanks to natural cross immunity). And 203 are dead. 203 in a million is 0.02%, and I'm more likely to be conservative than aggressive in my estimate. That rate would be lower than the flu mortality rate, or perhaps in-line if you want to nitpick.
That same week for 35-44 year olds there were 2,000 deaths, 280 due to COVID - that's 14%.
And the AZ Dept of Health lists it at 4.9% on their dashboard.
Link - ( New Window )
It took about 10 weeks for there to be 2,800 dead from COVID in that 35-44 group.
So yeah, I have no idea where you are coming up with your conclusion from.
fewer than 2000 people have died from covid between ages 19-40 to date. Assuming 20% of the population has been exposed which at this point feels understated but we have no way of knowing -- gets you to a 99.989% survival rate.
Certainly the Red Sox pitcher news is concerning, hope he makes a speedy recovery, but its still pretty early in his recovery and oh by the way, do they even know if he picked it up at a ballpark? Its not like our risks are 0 by not going to work.
But everyone certainly has the right to make their own decision on this - and if this COL pitcher can survive a year off economically, all the power to him.
It took about 10 weeks for there to be 2,800 dead from COVID in that 35-44 group.
So yeah, I have no idea where you are coming up with your conclusion from.
Where did you get the information on ages 35-44? CDC through July 11 (they update on Wednesdays) shows 2400 deaths ages 35-44 (with most of those over age 40... very few athletes over 40 ... coaches another matter of course)
Oh and Taiwan is one of the most densely populated places on earth. 24 million people.
Taiwan Baseball - ( New Window )
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to get into a car accident on the way to work? What kinda nonsense is that? Especially just below a post about a 27 year old who is dealing with some heart issues stemming from covid. But sure.
"Dealing with heart issues" is a very strong way of putting it for a guy who's treatment regiment is rest, and who would likely be cleared to play in a week.
Is it? The article makes no mention of him likely being cleared to play in a week. He is resting for a week before getting another MRI to see if the swelling of his heart has resumed. Good analysis, Big Chief Data.
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in the 18-49 range (all athletes) 2,800 people died out of 14m+ confirmed cases. That's less than 2%.
It took about 10 weeks for there to be 2,800 dead from COVID in that 35-44 group.
So yeah, I have no idea where you are coming up with your conclusion from.
Where did you get the information on ages 35-44? CDC through July 11 (they update on Wednesdays) shows 2400 deaths ages 35-44 (with most of those over age 40... very few athletes over 40 ... coaches another matter of course)
In the link he provided.
If you go to page 2 under the graph it breaks it out by week. Starting the week ending of 3/28 there's 100+ deaths in that age bracket for 9 straight weeks. I didn't add them up manually, and now that i just did so its closer to 2,000 over a 10/11 weeks timespan. By bad there, looked like more when I estimated it.
But my point was that it dwarfs the Flu and has done so in a much quicker timespan.
here - ( New Window )
Oh and Taiwan is one of the most densely populated places on earth. 24 million people. Taiwan Baseball - ( New Window )
Stop. So an island of people is what's realistic for the US? It isn't just population density, its how travel magnifies it.
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What sports looks like in a country with sane policies. Only 462 cases 7 deaths.
Oh and Taiwan is one of the most densely populated places on earth. 24 million people. Taiwan Baseball - ( New Window )
Stop. So an island of people is what's realistic for the US? It isn't just population density, its how travel magnifies it.
Yes it does prove it's possible. Let's not forget most of the US mainland is still empty space. That size argument really is the dumbest of all.
Also, seemed weird to me all the guys sitting in the dugout without masks on. So the players not scheduled to play have to stay away, but the rest of the team sits in a dugout breathing on each other..
I agree with those crapping on MLBs protocols..
It just isn't the same, basically the polar opposite.
Also, seemed weird to me all the guys sitting in the dugout without masks on. So the players not scheduled to play have to stay away, but the rest of the team sits in a dugout breathing on each other..
I agree with those crapping on MLBs protocols..
Good point on the dugout. Even the viral video of Rizzo sanitizing that Brewer players hands... you've got Rizzo, a middle aged 1B coach and the Brewers runner all congregating and laughing. I cant tell if the Brewer has a mask on, but the coach and Rizzo certainly dont. I get that its hot out and its uncomfortable, but you'd think players would mask when they are within 6 feet of other players, and especially older coaches.
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In comment 14939099 Italianju said:
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players are going nuts right now. I would be beyond furious.
Imagine what's going through Zack Wheeler's mind? His wife gave birth to twins 10 days ago.
I guess it would depend on how well informed he is.
If he's read the data and the medical research, he would know that he and his young wife are at FAR more risk driving to and from the stadium than from contracting COVID, and especially his babies are at zero risk from COVID (there has been negative excess death nationally among people under 25 this year).
If he is poorly informed, he would likely be very concerned. CDC Excess Death Stats - ( New Window )
You know, ZERO Risk... - ( New Window )
Beyond that, we are well aware of the effects of the influenza viruses. Not only are we still learning about the mortality and morbidity effects of the NOVEL coronavirus, we are learning that the morbidity impacts may outweigh the mortality impacts.
We're not going to go back to full-on shutdowns (that horse shit in the stable months ago), but we need to make informed decisions that take into account the fact that there could be some long-term health harms from this.
Being somewhat facetious, but let the players smoke as much weed as they want at home (with no suspensions), and that may cut down on foot traffic to places that could lead to infections during the season.
But those Canadians look pretty smart about now don't they?
Plus I would have never guessed that Bettman would ever rise to the level of 2nd best sports commissioner.
Impressive job by Manfred being even worse than Selig. Not easy to pull off.
As long as there are a few games a day to put on TV, the season won't stop. But I would expect the playoffs to be late, and to be held in a bubble somewhere. They'll be late because it'll take a couple of extra weeks to play the makeup games, while in the meantime, some teams go right into quarantine ahead of the bubble
They can’t get baseball going for 1 week. Football has no chance. They won’t be able to play. How do you handle it when several teams can’t send out an OL? Or when the QBs test positive?
We won’t have football in 2020. No NFL. No college. No HS.
Besides coaches and Frazer, did you see any Yankees wearing masks...?
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Because it’s a pay site but the Athletic has an article today suggesting the Phillies were concerned all weekend because the Marlins were not following proper protocols from the time they arrived in Philly. They didn’t stagger their arrivals and not many were wearing masks in the dugout at all. Not good
Besides coaches and Frazer, did you see any Yankees wearing masks...?
You’re trying to make an argument where there isn’t one. Not wearing a mask in the dugout is a league wide issue. The reason the Phillies are upset about the Marlins in this instance is because they KNEW they had several positives on their team and were waiting on results for others (which also turned out positive). Hell, they had a team meeting about it to discuss whether to play or not.
I didn’t write the article, I was just passing it along.
There should be a 3rd party involved and they should provide a recommendation based on the status of the team. If the 3rd party feels like they shouldn't play, then cancel the games. If they feel like its ok to play then it should go to the team/players to approve.
But players shouldn't have a say at all if its considered unsafe. Mattingly really shit the bed here (along with their GM I would imagine).
Supposedly they are going to try and play in Baltimore tomorrow night... probably a lot of taxi squad players called up from Jupiter.
Will be interesting, assuming NYY at PHL play tonight, if players seem a little more cautious out there than they've been. I certainly hope they can play - that was a series i was looking forward to seeing, two very good teams.
So far no philly players
Given the ages/physical conditions of coaches and other grounds crew/club house staff, there's clearly significant risks going ahead.
Postponed again tonight. Hopefully they'll at least be able to play tomw and thurs.
Well that matters since the Yankees are good. Florida and Baltimore? who cares. :)
I know nobody in MLB likes doubleheaders, but that seems like the easiest way to make these games up. They dont have to worry about losing money or shuffling all of the fans out.
Yes.
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to get into a car accident on the way to work? What kinda nonsense is that? Especially just below a post about a 27 year old who is dealing with some heart issues stemming from covid. But sure.
Also, it is well established that for people under 40 and probably even under 50, that the normal seasonal flu is more deadly than covid.
So, and this is a serious question, do people think that with the benefit of what we know now, the Michael Jordan "flu game" should have been canceled?
Stop talking.
I know nobody in MLB likes doubleheaders, but that seems like the easiest way to make these games up. They dont have to worry about losing money or shuffling all of the fans out.
They said the Phils tested negative but are going to test them all again later today and the postponement was a precaution.
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for the yanks/phils, but why today? Are they still waiting on results from PHI players? Hopefully this isnt a sign that PHI has had a few positive results as well.
I know nobody in MLB likes doubleheaders, but that seems like the easiest way to make these games up. They dont have to worry about losing money or shuffling all of the fans out.
They said the Phils tested negative but are going to test them all again later today and the postponement was a precaution.
It takes like a day to get the results back. It isn't immediate so it makes sense that they'll go on hiatus for multiple days.
I dont think any of the players that "voted" were known to have had it. I think 3 of their teammates tested positive back at the hotel... not that it makes the process of what occurred any less absurd of course, but no one played knowing they were ill.
THey should forfeit the 3 game series. Thats an easy one.
"In Miami" is how it's been phrased.
Thats a slippery slope - i get there arent crowds anyway, but there is still an advantage to playing in the confines of your own park and sleeping in your own bed. If you do this for the Nats, then you need to proclaim the Marlins are playing their entire season on the road.
Its also troubling that teams seem to be taking votes now on things the league and players association was supposed to agree to before the season started. I'm not a "fire" people in a pandemic type person, but this is not remotely a good look for Manfred or for Clark. This is planning 101.
I think they are doing this because their manager has been vocal about his fears given a heart condition... my view is they should keep him home on roadtrips if its that serious.
Ok so instead of WAS just have them go to some other MLB park that is not being used. At least then its neutral.
Is it that Florida is an unsafe place to be. Aside from the fact that that concern is no more legitimate than it was before the Marlins' outbreak, if you're unwilling to hold games in certain places then you don't have a season. Game over. The time to do a bubble, or at least restrict play to certain regions, has come and gone, hasn't it?
Is it concern that there may be infected players who haven't yet tested positive, so there's risk of exposure playing with them. Obviously moving the game doesn't change that.
I just don't see how moving the game addresses any legitimate concern. I can understand Martinez being worried, but dispassionately, I don't think there's any legitimate reason to move the game (other than not wanting to go to Florida at all, which, again, is kind of a game over scenario imo).
You're making a lot of accusations and assumptions in this post. I'm not sure what is real and what is exaggerated re: what Marlins have been doing relative to other teams. They likely picked this up in Atlanta last week by the way, and one of the Nats players Soto got this too... lets not make Miami out to be villains. That's not reasonable.
Martinez should stay home if he's "12" on a scale of 10 concerned. They can play without him, the league should move on without him. Take the year off if its that much of a personal concern.
My view is if they refuse to travel/play - you either shut the entire league down or you forfeit their weekend games. Think the latter is the better approach but i could see both responses.
I think they are doing this because their manager has been vocal about his fears given a heart condition... my view is they should keep him home on roadtrips if its that serious.
It was the only real choice with a COVID-19 outbreak in their clubhouse. By last count, 17 individuals (including 15 players and two coaches) have tested positive. In addition to all of the safety concerns, the Marlins simply can't field a competitive team right now. There has also been talk about the Phillies (who played the Marlins over the weekend) pausing their season at least for a few days. There should be more clarity on the situation soon, but this is not what anybody wants to see less than one week into the season.
Rojas tested posted...
I imagine every player ever would find playing as the road team in their home stadium preferable to actually traveling for a road game. Sure, it's largely minimized in an empty stadium, but getting to stay home and not have to schlep to another stadium is still something I think just about anyone would welcome.
Actually, it was probably Atlanta that violated the protocols by not having adequate space for players to distance during the rain delays(and I guess they didn't try hard either). And in case you were not watching the Yankees games, they were not wearing masks, they were sitting right next to each other, they were high fiving or doing similar greetings. Miami was healthy when they left Florida as far as we know. They appear to have gotten infected after Atlanta and the Braves had a few players that became infected during that period.
Now two Miami players that tested positive have now tested negative. How does that work in two days? Did it just go away?
So IDK.....
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if these games are physically played in Washington isn't Toronto the "home" team (i.e. they bat last ) ?
I imagine every player ever would find playing as the road team in their home stadium preferable to actually traveling for a road game. Sure, it's largely minimized in an empty stadium, but getting to stay home and not have to schlep to another stadium is still something I think just about anyone would welcome.
I think they are doing this because their manager has been vocal about his fears given a heart condition... my view is they should keep him home on roadtrips if its that serious.
I'm not sure how much of an advantage they are getting, with no fans in the stadium and all...
Why not LA and all of California? What data and science are you using in that approach?
And Manfred said yesterday he expected their season to restart tomorrow. So its hard to take any of this seriously.
I'm not sure what your point it. Neither I, nor anyone else in this thread, said the burden of traveling to play a road game is something teams can't deal with or aren't accustomed to doing. But if you don't think it's a benefit for a team to get to play a road game at home instead of traveling to it, even in an empty house, I think you're being pretty silly.
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They should forfeit these games. They clearly violated protocol and have been doing so for some time. I don't blame the Nationals one bit for not wanting to go there. They're being asked to go into a hotspot to play a team that is not taking this seriously.
Actually, it was probably Atlanta that violated the protocols by not having adequate space for players to distance during the rain delays(and I guess they didn't try hard either). And in case you were not watching the Yankees games, they were not wearing masks, they were sitting right next to each other, they were high fiving or doing similar greetings. Miami was healthy when they left Florida as far as we know. They appear to have gotten infected after Atlanta and the Braves had a few players that became infected during that period.
Now two Miami players that tested positive have now tested negative. How does that work in two days? Did it just go away?
So IDK.....
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In comment 14939913 Ron from Ninerland said:
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They should forfeit these games. They clearly violated protocol and have been doing so for some time. I don't blame the Nationals one bit for not wanting to go there. They're being asked to go into a hotspot to play a team that is not taking this seriously.
Actually, it was probably Atlanta that violated the protocols by not having adequate space for players to distance during the rain delays(and I guess they didn't try hard either). And in case you were not watching the Yankees games, they were not wearing masks, they were sitting right next to each other, they were high fiving or doing similar greetings. Miami was healthy when they left Florida as far as we know. They appear to have gotten infected after Atlanta and the Braves had a few players that became infected during that period.
Now two Miami players that tested positive have now tested negative. How does that work in two days? Did it just go away?
So IDK.....
Yeah, I heard that excuse. Its Atlanta's fault. I'm not buying it. They had an entire empty stadium to spread out into. The protocols are pretty clear that the only people that are supposed to be in the dugout are the players and coaches that are currently in the game. The bench players are supposed to be in the stands. But I guess they didn't want to get wet.
Well why the hell would they have to get wet? You dont find Atlanta at fault here? Odd take.
But the testing someone brought up above is an equal mess - apparently Soto has tested negative 6x since Thursday.. but still cant get cleared i guess because he's also testing positive sometimes too?
If they cant rely on these tests, then that's kind of a show stopper...
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Toronto has been banished from their true homes. I suspect they are living in hotels whether they are playing "home" games in Pittsburgh or if they're playing elsewhere. The entire NBA is playing on the road. They seem to be dealing with it.
I'm not sure what your point it. Neither I, nor anyone else in this thread, said the burden of traveling to play a road game is something teams can't deal with or aren't accustomed to doing. But if you don't think it's a benefit for a team to get to play a road game at home instead of traveling to it, even in an empty house, I think you're being pretty silly.
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as if they were Katrina cities. Yuu wouldn't force the players to go nor would you have the home teams forfeit.
Why not LA and all of California? What data and science are you using in that approach?
Add them too. Play everything in NY. I don't think they should have started in the first place but even if they did, I can't see punishing a team for not wanting to play in a biohazard zone.
Well why the hell would they have to get wet? You dont find Atlanta at fault here? Odd take.
@AndySlater
JUST IN: Miami-Dade @MayorGimenez
says the Marlins should follow the 14-day quarantine protocol when returning to South Florida after they were knowingly exposed to COVID-19.
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They should forfeit these games. They clearly violated protocol and have been doing so for some time. I don't blame the Nationals one bit for not wanting to go there. They're being asked to go into a hotspot to play a team that is not taking this seriously.
You're making a lot of accusations and assumptions in this post. I'm not sure what is real and what is exaggerated re: what Marlins have been doing relative to other teams. They likely picked this up in Atlanta last week by the way, and one of the Nats players Soto got this too... lets not make Miami out to be villains. That's not reasonable.
Martinez should stay home if he's "12" on a scale of 10 concerned. They can play without him, the league should move on without him. Take the year off if its that much of a personal concern.
My view is if they refuse to travel/play - you either shut the entire league down or you forfeit their weekend games. Think the latter is the better approach but i could see both responses.
I don't think it's fair to make Miami out to be the villains either. I'd rather just make the entire state of Florida out to be the villain, save for the few normal people down there that don't insist on pissing into the wind at every turn.
All of these states had months of horror stories from NYC to go on. And what did they do along with some leaders? They pissed right in everyone's face and laughed about it. It's all about the money? Yea, Fuck them.
I have a bridge to sell you if you honestly believe the florida culture didn't play a huge part in this.
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Well why the hell would they have to get wet? You dont find Atlanta at fault here? Odd take.
No I don't. Atlanta may be guilty of a minor logistical error but that does not excuse gross violations of COVID protocols by Miami. As a fan thats been caught in the rain in Yankee Stadium, I and thousands of other fans were able to scurry to some place where it was dry. A few dozen players couldn't do the same ? Did Mattingly even complain to Atlanta that there facilities were not in place ? Or did he just say "Fuck it"? It looks like the later. As of yesterday the positive percentage for the Miami Marlins was something like 33%. Its probably higher now. Thats higher than a meatpacking plant. I suspect that there was a lot of other carelessness and violations that have not been made public that occured prior to the trips to Atlanta or Philly.
Gee you think?
Of course this is the case.
So I don't see how MLB can deal with this if they truly are committed to not canceling the season.