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Take My Lumps: 2019 Secondary Re-Build

christian : 8/8/2020 10:55 pm
After the developments this week, with Beal and Baker both likely out for the 2020 season, the Giants at best will have a single 2019 day one secondary starter back this year — Peppers.

At the time, I thought the secondary was in dire need of investment last year and the cluster drafting and veteran acquisitions were a home run. I thought it was a bigger need than the defensive line, offensive line, and linebacker.

Outside of Love, who had some rough patches, but really showed well for making a position move, not much went right. I really hope the reinvestment this year nets more, but I’ll certainly be more conservative in my expectations.

- Jenkins was retained as a top 5 paid corner, only to be cut after a second straight year of uneven performance and acting out like a total idiot (after the GM put the trust of mentoring the group to him)

- Bethea was DOA, after signing a relatively decent 2 year deal, where he looked like a vet minimum or worse contributor

- Forget about the legal woes, first round pick Baker looked way in over his head, and came off like an asshole to boot

- Incumbent Grant Haley made no improvement, and was sat down the 2nd of the year as his snaps declined

- Peppers, as the other first-round value in the Beckham trade had an up-and-down year in coverage, and had issues with missed tackles

- Beal looked the part, but was picked on in coverage, with a really bad completion % and rating against

- Ballentine, got a rude awakening to the NFL, giving up nearly 15 YPC and 4 TDs in part time action
I will still stand by my statement  
robbieballs2003 : 8/8/2020 11:06 pm : link
that you can throw the stats out on Ballentine. He was playing out of position. I'm happy with the Cockrell signing but I am also interested to see Ballentine on the outside instead of in the slot. His skill set is not a fit in the slot. They are completely different positions.
...  
christian : 8/8/2020 11:24 pm : link
I agree, Ballentine taking over for Haley was not a fit and pretty unfair on him. He’s going to get his shot outside, have to figure he’s top of the depth chart now.
I’d like to see Love move back to CB  
eric2425ny : 8/8/2020 11:48 pm : link
One of his biggest strengths in college was ball skills, not just picks, but batted passes.
RE: I’d like to see Love move back to CB  
BlueLou'sBack : 8/9/2020 1:19 am : link
In comment 14946355 eric2425ny said:
Quote:
One of his biggest strengths in college was ball skills, not just picks, but batted passes.


The Giants might have to move Love back to CB, but I think it'd be a mistake given how comfortable he started to look at S last year and also given that (just a hunch) 3 safety sets with Peppers,Love and McKinney all playing S are gonna be featured in Graham's D at times.

If you can field 3 superior S, why fork with that?

Meanwhile the Giants are looking hard at finding 2 CBs who can simply play, one outside on the boundary and the other in the slot.

One of those two is likely Darnay Holmes, in the slot, and the other...

Let's hope Corey Ballentine takes the bull by the horns.

I'm encouraged Robbieballs likes him. It sucks that Beal isn't in the mix, but hopefully he hits the weights and comes back thicker and more injury resistant in 2021.
Good points regarding  
Lines of Scrimmage : 8/9/2020 6:47 am : link
Ballentine. Division 2 program to NFL. Let's be reasonable with expectations. People talk about the speed of the NFL. Imagine that jump.

I still think Peppers can be a player. The high safety pick I think will be a good one.

Good players matter in coaching. Last year though the defense just seemed so confused and out of place. Hopefully Graham does better. If he learned well from Belichick then we can expect more man concepts. I think the run D will be much better which will help the secondary. We have better Linebackers this year.

So while not a strength good coaching and a above average front seven will help a lot. Dallas and Philly both rely on the run for their pass offense to work. Washington.....is Washington for now.

Last year......the players seemed more confused  
George from PA : 8/9/2020 8:03 am : link
....then lack of talent.

I blame much of last year on the coaches
I thought Ballentine  
mittenedman : 8/9/2020 8:18 am : link
easily out-played Baker in the preseason last year and if it wasn't for draft status, deserved to start.

Contrast the attitudes and Ballentine further separates himself. 1 guy battles back from losing his best friend while the other guy is being an a-hole in the building & out gambling and robbing people. But the actual football was in Ballentine's favor too. Both coverage and tackling.

RE: Love - agree with BlueLou above. Did not like him at CB but thought he showed very well at SS. He is definitely a Malcolm Jenkins-type. The "problem" with Love is that he's a SS (IMO - that is the position he looked good in last year). And of course Jabrill Peppers looks to be the starting SS on this football team. I would use Peppers in more of a roaming role with Love and McKinney at S, but that's me.

Since I doubt there will be a season or any to speak of,  
Big Blue '56 : 8/9/2020 8:58 am : link
we’ll just re-invest during the 2021 draft, however it’s run.

I have zero worry about anything right now in terms of plusses or minuses.
Our Previous Coaching Staff...  
Jim in Tampa : 8/9/2020 10:01 am : link
Didn't think Love had the cover speed to play CB.

Say what you want about our old coaches... but all NFL coaches know how to evaluate a player to determine if they have the basic skill set requirements to play a position.

I think when our current coaches get Love on the field, they'll come to the same conslusion and keep Love at S.
Re: Love  
RicFlair : 8/9/2020 10:17 am : link
I think he can be a good nickel cb as well. Probably will be more of a third safety who also often covers the slot.
The extra attention paid in 2020  
JonC : 8/10/2020 9:26 am : link
tells you what they think of the talent level, even beyond the odd circumstances that took out Beal and Baker. It's why I suggested CB would get long looks and additional investment via UFA and the draft. They're still not there, more changes will happen before they have a winning backend.
I had the same hopes last year and generally buy in to the new trend  
Eric on Li : 8/10/2020 10:18 am : link
towards allocating resources to the back end coverage unit. I think there are 3 key reasons why we haven't seen it succeed here.

1. Bettcher gave hot garbage a bad name. Just look at the job Greg Williams did with the NYJ in year 1 with Moseley and many others injured, terrible, or both (Trumaine Johnson). Their starting CB's were Daryl Roberts and Brian Poole and as a unit they were top 5 in yards per play, top 10 in % of drives ending in a score, and middle of the pack in points allowed. Meanwhile here blown coverages and miscommunications were the most constant thing about this team the past 2 years. The impact of good or bad coaching can not be overstating - and all we can do is hope we have it with Graham. I'd have personally preferred someone more experienced like Williams who has simply proven himself many times over but understand you need to let Judge pick his own guys.

2. Poor drafting with premium picks. To some degree this bundles the last 2 regimes because this essentially amounts to Baker and Apple. How either got through the psych eval with someone thinking these guys were building block investments I have no idea - and I actually suspect on the Baker side it may have gotten the SEC scout fired this year. Beal was a semi-premium pick and he was damaged goods. Hopefully McKinney is the curse breaker.

3. Lack of FA investment. There's a storyline some have bought into overdramatizing how much they've invested in the secondary to the point they thought a pick like Holmes was unnecessary, but the reality is that I believe this is the first offseason they added a non-minimum CB FA since signing Jenkins 4 years ago. Adding a bunch of young talent is fine but there needs to be some base level of experienced competence too. Bradberry will provide that, and hopefully Cockerill will as well.

They've taken steps to improve in all 3 areas but whether or not it will work remains to be seen.
...  
christian : 8/10/2020 10:28 am : link
I’m careful not to confuse cracking the Giants lineup with being a quality NFL player — so I have very cautious optimism for Ballentine and Love. I hope both develop into nice depth, at their respective draft positions that would be success.

I love the Bradberry acquisition — he’s not a star, but he’s a reliable true no. 1 corner. I suspect Cockrell grabs the other starting position. That’s a reliable, if not spectacular starting duo, with question marks in the slot.

I love McKinney. He was my favorite player in the draft and I was thrilled he dropped.

The player I really hope puts it all together is Peppers. He’s got much to prove as a tackler and cover safety. He’s clearly athletically a notch above, hopefully this is the program that gets the best out of him.
I thought Peppers was really good in man coverage vs. TE's  
Eric on Li : 8/10/2020 10:36 am : link
it's hard to not just compare him to Collins, and that was the 1 area where I thought he was a very noticeable upgrade.

The downside was the missed tackles. I didn't have a good feel for his deep coverage because it seemed like we put Bethea in that spot.

I like all 3 of Peppers, Love, and McKinney in some version of interchangeable slot safeties. I'm not sure any of the 3 is a + deep safety though, so that would be the area where I'm concerned. Can they scheme to protect those guys from playing single high? Or is McKinney like Fitzpatrick, a guy who has been used as a swiss army knife who can play single high if that's where you let him settle in?

Solving the CF coverage role is probably going to be Graham's biggest test because that's where this defense got decimated by big plays, breakdowns, and penalties the past couple years. IMO even more so than the pass rush.
Ballantine was used completely wrong  
Torrag : 8/10/2020 2:22 pm : link
He doesn't have the CoD twitch necessary to play the slot. He's a boundary guy and that's where he has to stay. He may even be able to contribute at S if he can handle the tackling aspect of that job.

Peppers was playing better as the year progressed. One of very few we can say that about. Peppers/McKinney/Love should be the best safety group we've had since Guyton/Jackson.

For me Love is a safety. Another guy I don't see the first step quickness, long speed and quick twitch CoD to play CB. I do think he's smart, tough and competitive though. IF he's one of those guys that's a step ahead of the QB progressions he could carve out a role as a nickel/dime CB. With him that will rely on mental strengths though, not physical ones.

So the camp battles and how our defensive staff aligns these guys is one of the critical decisions and probably the first major test of Graham's ability to assess talent and delegate roles.
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