I started a thread about Dexter Lawrence, who I think is the most important player on D but there's been relatively little discussion of. I thought I'd do the same for our most important player, period.
Due to the lack of preseason there's been relatively little discussion of Daniel Jones heading into season 2. Jones blew away all skeptics with his rookie performance. He clearly belongs in the league and now it's just a question of what his ceiling is.
Many quarterbacks make a leap in their second year. For example the Mannings both had big losing records their rookie year with middling stats, year two saw 13-3 and 11-5 with big jumps in their stats. More recently Mahomes and Lamar had explosive breakout seasons in their second year after not getting much playing time their rookie years.
The Giants prediction thread had a lot of 6-10 in there and given the past few years I can't really say that's wrong. But what I think people are not necessarily accounting for is a massive leap from our QB. As we all know, this is a QB league and Giants have a promising one. Unlike the others listed above, Jones actually had an impressive rookie year when it comes to his stats.
Am I the only one who is expecting (hoping for?) a big season from DJ? 4500 yards, 30+ TDs, & lt;15 INTs, etc., that kind of thing. Obviously the most important stat is Ws which is the biggest question mark.
Personally I can't wait to see what he looks like on Monday. The Steelers have a good D but a good QB beats a good D these days and we might just have one of the best on his way up.
Showed a lot of good things as a rookie, and now he's learning an entirely new system. Will he take a step back or a step forward? And what is the next step up for him aside from cutting down on his fumbling?
What do we actually have in Daniel Jones?
Is he a really good system QB when everything around him is up and running? Or, can he ever elevate his game to the point where we can say Daniel Jones has a little magic to his game? How about a little more maneuvering in the pocket rather standing like a statue? We have no guarantee in writing about the future course of our second year QB.
One prediction: If Daniel Jones doesn't break the habit of holding the ball at his waste when he sets up to throw, we could see more of the same -- fumbles.
Just a high school QB but I will hold off on criticizing his holding on to the ball as poor anticipation for now. I think part of the issue was a poor running game forcing terrible down and distance situations and no game changing receiver. So I think it may have been him trying to make a play and it was challenging to find a good target. Shurmur did him no favors putting him in those situations imo.
Seems like he is very focused on developing his game and becoming a leader which is great. His offensive targets seem pretty healthy going into the new season which is good. His OL is going to give up a lot of pressure but the pieces are better than last year given more experience playing together.
Key parts of his game that need development include better pocket awareness, ball security, reading zone coverages and adjusting plays at LOS. Improve on these things and the guy has a nice future.
It's refreshing to know that DJ is surrounded by competent coaches and staff. This year may not be filled with lots of wins, maybe 6-10/7-9 but I feel like we are laying the foundation for a solid competitive team.
I hope I am too. And I’m certainly not pretending to know more than the next guy, but the weaknesses are evident. I’m just unsure of whether or not they’re surmountable. If he can’t fix em, and there’s more film on it, he could turn into a TO machine.
i'm concerned with his feel for the pocket, he seems to just look downfield and doesnt know when he needs to slide or step up. (hence the fumbles)
IMO, it takes about 3 years to see the true growth of a QB, unless he's in the untra talented Mahomes territory.
Guys like Watson, Goff, Wentz, Jimmy G are still question marks because they have not been consistent. It took Alex Smith quite a few years to develop.
After 8 games, there are comments that DJ is the best QB in the divison already...
I think they will protect DJ as much as they can with that young offensive line.
It will be good see the Giants run the ball on 2 and 6 again like back in the old days instead of going empty backfield.
Even a blind squirrel finds a nut sometime...
Colin -- Yep. This is what has been gnawing at me about Daniel Jones' game since last season.
I don't think a QB can be "taught" pocket awareness. Either you've got the eyes to look downfield and simultaneously "feel" pressure, or you don't!
Daniel Jones will stand tall and strong in the pocket, but we haven't seen a lot of stepping up and/or sliding around in the pocket. Unfortunately, he takes a lot of hits he never saw coming!
I dont disagree with you at all, but I thought how he won the tampa game was a hopeful point. A robot QB doesn't make the running play to score that TD. I'd like to see more of that.
Here is what he dealt with last year. Team can't run very well. Receivers are not game changers (yet).
So a repeated occurrence was 3rd down and 9/10 yards to go. Defense does not need to send extra rushes (bad OL) and the receivers can't get open downfield. So what then? Checkdown and punt? Nobody knows if he was trying to just make a play. Let's give it time with Garrett.
This is where I am too. I am interested in reading what others see in terms of weaknesses though.
He needs to work on things, for sure. Time will tell if the fumbles were a fluke, or a problem - and if a problem how fixable it is. On the whole I like a QB that keeps looking downfield. He just has to speed up his clock. Better than a QB who won’t keep his eyes downfield.
Sadly, he has to learn a new system in a shortened preseason, and may be behind a Swiss cheese line yet again At least to start the year. I think what’s realistic is to hope by the end of this year we see good progress. I think we are set up for a rough start.
Next year is, IMO, make or break on him. He’ll repeat the same system (we hope) have a full preseason, 2 full years in, and the OL should gel some. There will be few excuses.
DJ: the fumble...
JJ: the fumble on the slide and the fumble with the ball swinging..."
I think there will still be some issues with pocket presence/fumbling as well....at least early on into the season. The OL getting better and gelling should help this, but it may not happen overnight.
He'll be fine long term and I'm ok with whatever hiccups the first few games present.
Maybe DJ just needs to learn his limits, maybe he feels the pressure but thinks he can get the ball out it time because he doesnt mind taking a hit for that extra second of time.
Link - ( New Window )
He has fumbling issues but I think like a lot of young QBs he was holding on to the ball too long or staying in the pocket too long. I expect that to improve this year (1) because of experience, and (2) no more Shurmur and his sucky playcalling.
Kevin Clark is a huge Gettleman hater and shat all over the DJ pick, he'll be slow to come around.
Warren Sharp is great, he's a successful better and analytics guy. I'm looking for to hearing him regularly on the pod.
From 2006-2016 Romo was the league's premier QB in fourth-quarter situations when the score differential was 7 points or fewer.
Romo never had a good OL or Zeke Elliot. I think Tony was a highly underrated QB.
Here is what he dealt with last year. Team can't run very well. Receivers are not game changers (yet).
So a repeated occurrence was 3rd down and 9/10 yards to go. Defense does not need to send extra rushes (bad OL) and the receivers can't get open downfield. So what then? Checkdown and punt? Nobody knows if he was trying to just make a play. Let's give it time with Garrett.
I'll keep my fingers crossed and hope your scenario plays out. In any event, Daniel Jones made some very big plays last season and -- fumbling aside -- he put up very strong rookie stats on a not-so-good team!
From 2006-2016 Romo was the league's premier QB in fourth-quarter situations when the score differential was 7 points or fewer.
Romo never had a good OL or Zeke Elliot. I think Tony was a highly underrated QB.
Wtf? His offensive line might have been the best in football in 2007. He had two HOF targets (Owens and Witten). Granted he was more inexperienced but he has played with lots of talent. He also missed a couple key throws in very big moments. I do think he was a very good QB though.
He needs to work on things, for sure. Time will tell if the fumbles were a fluke, or a problem - and if a problem how fixable it is. On the whole I like a QB that keeps looking downfield. He just has to speed up his clock. Better than a QB who won’t keep his eyes downfield.
Sadly, he has to learn a new system in a shortened preseason, and may be behind a Swiss cheese line yet again At least to start the year. I think what’s realistic is to hope by the end of this year we see good progress. I think we are set up for a rough start.
Next year is, IMO, make or break on him. He’ll repeat the same system (we hope) have a full preseason, 2 full years in, and the OL should gel some. There will be few excuses.
Eli's first games were against great defenses if I recall. I am optimistic that Jones will be a franchise QB but doubt he can win the big games like Eli did.
It's refreshing to know that DJ is surrounded by competent coaches and staff. This year may not be filled with lots of wins, maybe 6-10/7-9 but I feel like we are laying the foundation for a solid competitive team.
Garrett's hiring maybe turn out to be the most important move made in the 2020 off-season. We will see ...
It's refreshing to know that DJ is surrounded by competent coaches and staff. This year may not be filled with lots of wins, maybe 6-10/7-9 but I feel like we are laying the foundation for a solid competitive team.
Couldn’t agree more. Garrett hire could go down as one of the best we have made here in a long time. Giants have done right by jones. They have given him a super star RB, good crop of WRs and you know we won’t stop drafting them, a blue chip talent LT and still going. And he’s got Garrett.
I think we might even be higher on Jones if he was anywhere else. First round qb with his skill set and size, putting up decent numbers on a shitty team now going into year 2.
Could get interesting here. If Thomas and Jones are the goods sweet glory be...
PS had a thought that jerry Jones was desperate to keep Garrett away from the giants and that’s why the whole Garrett jerry Jones thing dragged on fir some long. Jones tried to sway him or sway the process and it failed. And now jones is scared that Garrett is going to help the giants kick their ass every year as long as dak and zeke and all Garrett’s guys are in Dallas. Sort of the Jon gruden effect when he left Oakland went to Tampa and then killed Oakland in the super bowl. Hey i can dream. Why not?
I read his arm strength seems to have improved some due to his weight-lifting and off-season work. Lets hope so!
He works hard and likes the game so I'm optimistic. But he needs Barkley to be a workhorse.
If he has the tools and the O is on all cylinders.
Do we have the tools?
Are we a well oiled smooth running machine?
To early in his career to tell and a loss on Monday night means nothing at this point in his career.
Last year he was a rookie. This year he is learning an entirely new offense ... hardly a grisled veteran.
He is still very young and so is the whole team .... I kind of like that. The offense can grow together. They will.
Jones
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TDs vs INTs 24-12 2.0 ratio
TDs per pass attempt 5.2%
Eli
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TDs vs INTs 366-244 1.5 ratio
TDs per pass attempt 4.5%