NGT: OBJ

Are there two more overrated players than Mayfield and Beckham? Time for the NFL pundit class to admit Mayfield is not a good QB and Beckham's best years are now long behind him.

a year too early versus a year too late. That said, it's one game. Let's see what happens in the next 15.

accuracy is below average. He can't stand in the pocket and deliver a throw, he bails way too early. He's so manic back there. Even we saw with Jones last year, we had a shit OL and he was poised. Sometimes you can just tell.

looks bad, if you watch some of those throws, they are way off. He could have made maybe 1-2 of them, but the accuracy is not good.

is spelling it out pretty correctly today on TV. He's basically saying that the Browns roster is meant for a ground and pound, 1-2 read type QB play. Mayfield feels like he has to make a huge play every single down and it is killing them.

In comment 14969852 PatersonPlank said:

Quote:

In comment 14969849 broadbandz said: Quote: In comment 14969847 PatersonPlank said: Quote: Some folks just can't admit when there were wrong. OBJ has joined a long list of WR's whose good years were with Eli. At this rate OBJ will be near the top of a lot of "biggest draft busts" lists. same people still think Rosen is a good QB. They cannot accept reality. I think we should make a team of Rosen, OBJ, Baker at DB, Trent Richardson at RB, and let Dodge be the kicker. We can build from there.

Add in the 1st round pick we are due from the saints for Shockey and we’re cooking!

and that game he’ll probably go off. He’s certainly not showing to be the top 5 receiver in the league anymore however.

Darnold and Mayfield are looking like average QBs at best, and Rosen has gotten lost in the shuffle. Josh Allen is developing nicely with a much better team and coaching staff. Overall though, that class doesn't appear worthy of the crazy hype it got, and Lamar wasn't even really part of the that hype.

Not enough dump offs between Mayfield and Beckham

made the right move at the time. Some just did not want to see it

In comment 14969840 figgy2989 said:

Quote:

You are correct, it was the third. Glad to see you are back, hope all is well on your end.

Thanks, buddy. Same to you!

To form, that ship sailed with the ankle injury. He's 27 and adding lower body injuries and apparently still doesn't understand hydration. I watched most of the game too, I was curious to see this great coach and great team and they got skunked. Freddie Kitchens is smiling somewhere.

Odell looked disinterested most of the game, it was pretty sad to see actually, he's just a shell of what he could have been.

In comment 14969827 Marianne at PSU said:

Quote:

before the end of his career.

I'm also putting money on Miami lol

He is clearly not the receiver he was early in his career with us. I noticed after his injuries he was no longer able to get separation from DB’s and he isn’t big enough to win many of those 50/50 balls.
Having said that it’s clear Mayfield is part of the problem too. He hasn’t developed as I expected he might. Cleveland is screwed.

might well end up being by far the best player involved in that trade.

In comment 14969893 Matt in SGS said:

Quote:

might well end up being by far the best player involved in that trade.

Could you imagine if all 3 guys in D from the OBJ trade have a big Gaa me? Not too shabby

In comment 14969812 Enzo said:

Quote:

yesterday but apparently Odell also drew 3 penalties (two pass interference and one holding). Nothing earth shattering but the raw stats don't always tell the whole story. Apparently the bigger concern is that Mayfield looked pretty bad overall.

Those were all on the same drive. He then failed to get open from coverage by Peters and Humphrey. In the end, he had 10 targets with just 22 yards to show for it.

In comment 14969889 Giant John said:

Quote:

He is clearly not the receiver he was early in his career with us. I noticed after his injuries he was no longer able to get separation from DB’s and he isn’t big enough to win many of those 50/50 balls. Having said that it’s clear Mayfield is part of the problem too. He hasn’t developed as I expected he might. Cleveland is screwed.

His ankle breaking cuts just aren’t there anymore. His routes and ability to separate just aren’t there. Pair that with an inaccurate QB and the inability to hydrate and you got trouble.

Never heard of anyone outside heavy drinkers needing an IV as often as he does.

In comment 14969860 ryanmkeane said:

Quote:

looks bad, if you watch some of those throws, they are way off. He could have made maybe 1-2 of them, but the accuracy is not good.

Odell has/had a great catch radius.

That, along with his separation, isn't what it used to be.

he beat his man deep twice and the ball was overthrown. Mayfield didn't play well.

Keep in mind that he played through a sports hernia all last season, played in all 16 games and still had over 1000 yards.

He had off-season surgery and now is returning. And his QB sucks..

is better at the end of his career than this site wants to give him credit for. If you gave Eli time he was great even at the end.

Know there are fans who still want to see him succeed. He isn't a bad guy. He does love attention and that isn't a crime. But truth is, injuries have limited his big play ability for the last three seasons. Did he have 1K last year? Sure. But over 25 receivers did last season. He is capable of much more. He was a TD monster in New York with Ben friggin' McAdoo as the play caller and an aging Eli as his QB. An aging Eli still knew what Odell was capable of and made terrific downfield throws. Kitchens did phenomenal in 2018 (with Mayfield and weaker personnel) with the Browns which is why he was promoted; now the Browns play caller is Stefanski who have Kirk Cousins and his outside targets career years. He did great in Philly too.

Maybe Odell rebounds. He did play hurt (which we are told about... a lot). But how many more excuses does he get?

In comment 14969847 PatersonPlank said:

Quote:

Some folks just can't admit when there were wrong. OBJ has joined a long list of WR's whose good years were with Eli. At this rate OBJ will be near the top of a lot of "biggest draft busts" lists.

I think you are looking for a fight that isn't there. Beckham has his warts - is it a crime to also point to the bigger problem in Cleveland, the QB?

I wanted Beckham to work out here and it didn't. I've moved on from that. Doesn't mean everything he does is right or wrong.

I guess all those TD' she scored taking it to the house was and out running defense was all Eli??

In comment 14969855 GiantEgo said:

Quote:

Are there two more overrated players than Mayfield and Beckham? Time for the NFL pundit class to admit Mayfield is not a good QB and Beckham's best years are now long behind him.

The NFL pundit class? How about the Browns' front office. They drafted him with the #1 overall pick!
I said this right at the time: they could have drafted Barkley with #1 and still had the choice of a QB with #4. Imagine that!

In comment 14969966 GManinDC said:

Quote:

I guess all those TD' she scored taking it to the house was and out running defense was all Eli??

I don’t think he made him better, but I think it’s fair to acknowledge that Beckham had his best seasons with Manning, and also acknowledge that Beckham insinuated that Manning was holding him back.

It’s also fair to acknowledge, that in Manning’s long 16 year career, that there was never a WR or TE that went on to a better career elsewhere. Now I’m not saying that’s a pattern, there were a myriad of reasons, but I don’t think it’s a coincidence either.

It’s fair to acknowledge.

and I am even more happy about it now.

great talent. but not a guy who makes a team better and may not have been good for D Jones (ala Shockey & Eli)

it's starting to turn.
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 14969992 Britt in VA said:

Quote:

In comment 14969966 GManinDC said: Quote: I guess all those TD' she scored taking it to the house was and out running defense was all Eli?? I don’t think he made him better, but I think it’s fair to acknowledge that Beckham had his best seasons with Manning, and also acknowledge that Beckham insinuated that Manning was holding him back. It’s also fair to acknowledge, that in Manning’s long 16 year career, that there was never a WR or TE that went on to a better career elsewhere. Now I’m not saying that’s a pattern, there were a myriad of reasons, but I don’t think it’s a coincidence either. It’s fair to acknowledge.

Britt, I agree with all your points. i can acknowledge al lof that.

The whole, no other player WR or TE played better when they left is full of reasons and yes it is a coincidence. Almost every single one of them left injured.

Eli was had some of the best skill position players almost throughout his career.

I think he made a lot of guys too. The Steve Smiths, Jake Ballards, Kevin Bosses, Mario Manninghams, and Rueben Randles of the world...

Even his very best: Plax, Nicks, Cruz.... were never considered “the” best. Except Beckham.

They were just very good “teams/units”. Other than OBJ, it’s not like we ever had Megatron on the roster.

OBJ never got back to the HOF '14-'16 level few have ever reached in the first place
He's still a lot more capable than he's shown with Mayfield
Eli didn't make or break him
Just like Shockey, his attitude and poor judgement hold him back more than any opponent (and are why he's in the situation he's in right now)

Very good QB play complimenting very good unit play equaling GREAT results.

In comment 14970044 Eric on Li said:

Quote:

OBJ never got back to the HOF '14-'16 level few have ever reached in the first place He's still a lot more capable than he's shown with Mayfield Eli didn't make or break him Just like Shockey, his attitude and poor judgement hold him back more than any opponent (and are why he's in the situation he's in right now)

well said

Hmmm, maybe that's why they're called the Browns.

In comment 14969920 GManinDC said:

Quote:

Keep in mind that he played through a sports hernia all last season, played in all 16 games and still had over 1000 yards. He had off-season surgery and now is returning. And his QB sucks..

You've actually illustrated why I thought it was a good move to get rid of him when we did. It wasn't just the off field stuff. The injuries have taken their tool. Even his last year here, I didn't see the sustained burst he had early in his career that made him special. And without Eli throwing to him, now he's just a guy. Who is being paid like THE guy.

As far as Mayfield goes - he looked good his rookie year and hasn't since. I don't know if it's system, if his early success got to his head, or the NFL got the book on him after his first year.

Someone mentioned Darnold but Darnold's best receiver is Jamison Crowder. A little perspective between the two situations.

In comment 14969771 BigBlueJ said:

Quote:

who was his QB again when he was rocking the world?

The same QB he couldn't wait to move on from? Yea, Eli held poor old Odell back. Sure he did!

Funny how those comments NEVER get revisited by EVERYONE who spouted that bullshit. Where are they know? Crickets...and it wasn't just Odell who hinted at this. Media types did too.

In comment 14969853 ryanmkeane said:

Quote:

Mayfield. He's lingering on bust status.

One read wonder. Can make all the throws. Looks like a QB. Acts like a confident QB. Can't read defenses and just isn't the cerebral presence you need out there.

I loved him out of college, but Mayfield isn't looking long for the NFL starting game if this keeps up.

was the correct pick all along

In comment 14969966 GManinDC said:

Quote:

I guess all those TD' she scored taking it to the house was and out running defense was all Eli??

Eli was the QB changing plays at the LOS. Eli was the guy moving Beckham around and getting the offense into position to succeed.

Yes, Eli did help Beckham succeed because Beckham DID succeed here. It is that simple.

Agree with others that he clearly lost a step after the injury that was never regained. Still has the talent but its not that same breakaway ability.

Best move Gettleman ever made.

ever since he ragged on Eli in his Lil Wayne interview, I lost all respect for OBJ. His actions to get attention were understandable, but you just don't do that to your current teammate, especially Eli.

In comment 14970124 averagejoe said:

Quote:

was the correct pick all along

Donald.

In comment 14970125 djm said:

Quote:

In comment 14969966 GManinDC said: Quote: I guess all those TD' she scored taking it to the house was and out running defense was all Eli?? Whoa, I never said Eli nexver helped Beckham. They were a great tandem but i think Beckham bought a lot more to the table those years than p[eope are giving him credit for. Imagine if the Giants had a credible line that gave OBJ time to get through his breaks. Eli was the QB changing plays at the LOS. Eli was the guy moving Beckham around and getting the offense into position to succeed. Yes, Eli did help Beckham succeed because Beckham DID succeed here. It is that simple.

Landry. then that stopped , maybe Beckum through a hissy fit and Mayfield started feeding Beckum to no avail

In comment 14970148 GManinDC said:

Quote:

In comment 14970125 djm said: Quote: In comment 14969966 GManinDC said: Quote: I guess all those TD' she scored taking it to the house was and out running defense was all Eli?? Whoa, I never said Eli nexver helped Beckham. They were a great tandem but i think Beckham bought a lot more to the table those years than p[eope are giving him credit for. Imagine if the Giants had a credible line that gave OBJ time to get through his breaks. Eli was the QB changing plays at the LOS. Eli was the guy moving Beckham around and getting the offense into position to succeed. Yes, Eli did help Beckham succeed because Beckham DID succeed here. It is that simple.

Beckham was legendary good here from 14-16. Nothing short. Any fan who questions his level of play those 3 years doesn't know what they are looking at. He helped Eli too, No doubt.

I'm happy he is stuck in Cleveland. And I don't care if it's on Baker, Kitchens or his grandmother. I am happy to see his arrogant ass humbled. He is so Great, OMG, he is so great...pffft.

The Browns are spending an awful lot on a player whose success is heavily dependent on Baker "franchise" Mayfield.

In comment 14970163 djm said:

Quote:

In comment 14970148 GManinDC said: Quote: In comment 14970125 djm said: Quote: In comment 14969966 GManinDC said: Quote: I guess all those TD' she scored taking it to the house was and out running defense was all Eli?? Whoa, I never said Eli nexver helped Beckham. They were a great tandem but i think Beckham bought a lot more to the table those years than p[eope are giving him credit for. Imagine if the Giants had a credible line that gave OBJ time to get through his breaks. Eli was the QB changing plays at the LOS. Eli was the guy moving Beckham around and getting the offense into position to succeed. Yes, Eli did help Beckham succeed because Beckham DID succeed here. It is that simple. Beckham was legendary good here from 14-16. Nothing short. Any fan who questions his level of play those 3 years doesn't know what they are looking at. He helped Eli too, No doubt.

Thats the end. They were a legendary duo. I wish they had a better line and better coaching fter TC.

Eli suffered from not having a better line. So did Beckham..