for display only
Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

Nick Gates was the worst OL I’ve ever seen tonight

Josh in the City : 9/14/2020 11:13 pm
And that includes Erick Flowers.I was looking forward to see how he would play at Center but tonight was as bad as it gets. I get that it was against one of the best DLines in the NFL but that performance was unacceptable. I’d like to give him another week to see if he improved but I wouldn’t be surprised to see Pulley start next week. The play linked below is just a small sample of what he looked like tonight...
Gates - ( New Window )
Pages: 1 2 3 | Show All |  Next>>
....  
BleedBlue : 9/14/2020 11:14 pm : link
First start at center against a great front with a young and 2 new OL in the unti. I expected a poor showing but they need time to gel
The Giants took a 5th round right tackle  
islander1 : 9/14/2020 11:17 pm : link
and taught him to play center in COVID-19 season.

Why the hell did anyone think it was going to go well in the short term.

It is entirely possible we could look 20 games from now and go WOW, that was a hell of a couple drafts Gettleman had. It's going to be awful for a while though. At least these guys are young, athletic, and not re-treads.
Spencer pulley is  
Ned In Atlanta : 9/14/2020 11:17 pm : link
The next guy in line. Can’t make chicken salad out of chicken you know what in the NFL
He was an  
Peter from NH (formerly CT) : 9/14/2020 11:18 pm : link
UDFA
RE: The Giants took a 5th round right tackle  
Anakim : 9/14/2020 11:18 pm : link
In comment 14972300 islander1 said:
Quote:
and taught him to play center in COVID-19 season.

Why the hell did anyone think it was going to go well in the short term.

It is entirely possible we could look 20 games from now and go WOW, that was a hell of a couple drafts Gettleman had. It's going to be awful for a while though. At least these guys are young, athletic, and not re-treads.


Shane Lemieux was a RG. Nick Gates was an undrafted OT.
RE: The Giants took a 5th round right tackle  
sb from NYT Forum : 9/14/2020 11:18 pm : link
In comment 14972300 islander1 said:
Quote:
and taught him to play center in COVID-19 season.

Why the hell did anyone think it was going to go well in the short term.

It is entirely possible we could look 20 games from now and go WOW, that was a hell of a couple drafts Gettleman had. It's going to be awful for a while though. At least these guys are young, athletic, and not re-treads.


Um, Gates was a 5th round RT?!?
Gates  
AcidTest : 9/14/2020 11:22 pm : link
was very bad. But he was a UDFA, is in his second year, and is playing a position he has never played at any level. The Steelers are also a top run defense.
Worse than Ereck Flowers?  
Angel Eyes : 9/14/2020 11:24 pm : link
That’s quite the achievement, I remember lots of penalties against Flowers when he was here, not so much with Gates.
RE: Gates  
sb from NYT Forum : 9/14/2020 11:24 pm : link
In comment 14972319 AcidTest said:
Quote:
was very bad. But he was a UDFA, is in his second year, and is playing a position he has never played at any level. The Steelers are also a top run defense.


Undrafted free agent OTs that never played Center before in their lives shouldn't be starting against a top run defense.

Gettleman made some nice OL picks but he's wiffed on OC for the third year in a row.
RE: Gates  
Anakim : 9/14/2020 11:24 pm : link
In comment 14972319 AcidTest said:
Quote:
was very bad. But he was a UDFA, is in his second year, and is playing a position he has never played at any level. The Steelers are also a top run defense.


And that's what I don't get. Gettleman's job is on the line. He remarks that he wants to fix the O-Line once and for all. And yet, he did nothing to address the C position. The 'Pio fascination was weird to begin with, but to rely on a mediocre veteran like Pulley and a novice UDFA as your starting C?

I don't get it. I really don't get it. Maybe now that veteran contracts are not guaranteed he looks at a veteran option (Justin Britt?)
Typical Giants move..  
prdave73 : 9/14/2020 11:25 pm : link
UDFA why not start him.. lol And we wonder why the Giants suck every year.. Put in Pulley at least the guy has NFL experience.. smh
Giants should have taken a Center with their 3rd round pick  
LBH15 : 9/14/2020 11:25 pm : link
and put Gates at Right Tackle.

Oh...they trade their 3rd round pick?
hyperbole, much?  
speedywheels : 9/14/2020 11:29 pm : link
JFC....
RE: RE: Gates  
Simms11 : 9/14/2020 11:30 pm : link
In comment 14972323 sb from NYT Forum said:
Quote:
In comment 14972319 AcidTest said:


Quote:


was very bad. But he was a UDFA, is in his second year, and is playing a position he has never played at any level. The Steelers are also a top run defense.



Undrafted free agent OTs that never played Center before in their lives shouldn't be starting against a top run defense.

Gettleman made some nice OL picks but he's wiffed on OC for the third
year in a row.


He could of grabbed one this year in the draft. Gates May turn out ok, however I think it was bad personnel management to go into the season with no real plan at Center. It was a big risk and still is.
RE: Giants should have taken a Center with their 3rd round pick  
Anakim : 9/14/2020 11:34 pm : link
In comment 14972328 LBH15 said:
Quote:
and put Gates at Right Tackle.

Oh...they trade their 3rd round pick?


One of 'em :P
Josh  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/14/2020 11:35 pm : link
It was his first game as a center in his entire career. At any level.

And you want to pull him after next week?
he was beyond putrid  
GiantsFan84 : 9/14/2020 11:36 pm : link
and i got yelled at on this board when i said why would they sign nick gates to an extension
Ummm..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 9/14/2020 11:38 pm : link
if the Giants did absolutely nothing to address the C position, wouldn't Halapio or Pulley be the starter?

By definition of having a different starter, they absolutely did something to address it
3 drafts,  
Enzo : 9/14/2020 11:39 pm : link
3 cracks at free agency, and the sell-off of several veterans for picks....and still a big huge gaping hole in the offensive line. Pure incompetence.
RE: Josh  
Anakim : 9/14/2020 11:39 pm : link
In comment 14972345 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
It was his first game as a center in his entire career. At any level.

And you want to pull him after next week?


Eric, isn't that pretty reckless? Especially when there was an abbreviated Training Camp and no preseason. We're betting on a complete novice to be our starting C?
Anakim  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/14/2020 11:41 pm : link
"Reckless"? No. Growing pains yes.

Or we could waste time on Spencer Pulley. Is that what you want?
RE: 3 drafts,  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/14/2020 11:42 pm : link
In comment 14972357 Enzo said:
Quote:
3 cracks at free agency, and the sell-off of several veterans for picks....and still a big huge gaping hole in the offensive line. Pure incompetence.


The line is going to be fine.

I used to think Giants fans were smart.

I don't think that anymore.
RE: Ummm..  
LBH15 : 9/14/2020 11:44 pm : link
In comment 14972351 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
if the Giants did absolutely nothing to address the C position, wouldn't Halapio or Pulley be the starter?

By definition of having a different starter, they absolutely did something to address it


But definition of their rushing stats, they absolutely didn’t.
RE: RE: 3 drafts,  
sb from NYT Forum : 9/14/2020 11:45 pm : link
In comment 14972366 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 14972357 Enzo said:


Quote:


3 cracks at free agency, and the sell-off of several veterans for picks....and still a big huge gaping hole in the offensive line. Pure incompetence.



The line is going to be fine.

I used to think Giants fans were smart.

I don't think that anymore.


Right, like how Mike Remmers was going to be a kick-ass ROT because he had tattoos and looked like a Viking?
RE: Anakim  
Anakim : 9/14/2020 11:47 pm : link
In comment 14972364 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
"Reckless"? No. Growing pains yes.

Or we could waste time on Spencer Pulley. Is that what you want?


I want a starting C with a track record of some sort. I don't want a guy who is completely new to the position (Gates) or a guy who has been historically mediocre (Pulley). Wouldn't you feel comfortable if we had someone with proven experience (either a veteran like Justin Britt or a highly-thought of rookie like Matt Hennessy or Lloyd Cushenberry III).

I understand why the predicament. There's no other way to get Gates playing time, but it seemed like they forced the issue. I don't like how our starting C is a guy with no experience at that position. You're essentially flirting with disaster.
sb from NYT Forum  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/14/2020 11:50 pm : link
WTF are you talking about? Almost everyone on this site knew Remmers was a placeholder with a bad back.

You guys sound like a bunch of crying babies. Jesus. Use your head.
Anakim  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/14/2020 11:50 pm : link
And if Gates ends up being better than those other options?
RE: RE: 3 drafts,  
Enzo : 9/14/2020 11:51 pm : link
In comment 14972366 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 14972357 Enzo said:


Quote:


3 cracks at free agency, and the sell-off of several veterans for picks....and still a big huge gaping hole in the offensive line. Pure incompetence.



The line is going to be fine.

yup, just give DG a few more years. Those hog mollies are on the way!

Quote:
I used to think Giants fans were smart.

I don't think that anymore.

BBI...where fanboy bullshit qualifies as expert opinion!
RE: RE: 3 drafts,  
prdave73 : 9/14/2020 11:51 pm : link
In comment 14972366 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 14972357 Enzo said:


Quote:


3 cracks at free agency, and the sell-off of several veterans for picks....and still a big huge gaping hole in the offensive line. Pure incompetence.




The line is going to be fine.

I used to think Giants fans were smart.

I don't think that anymore.



Snell ran 19 times for 119 yds?! BARKLEY probably the best RB in the game ran 15 times for .5 yds??!?!??!

Something is very wrong everyone.. Even rebuild a line from scratch this shouldn't happen. Sorry it doesn't make sense. The Giants have been ignoring th eOline for years and its just now coming back to bite them in the ASS! Everyone know in the NFL, you build a good team it start with the OLINE. EVERY great team in the NFL that will make it to the playoffs has a great Oline period..
...  
christian : 9/14/2020 11:52 pm : link
There’s no more reason to assume the line will be fine than there is they won’t. Gates could perform at the level of fringe NFL player most UDFA do. Fleming could be the journeyman, career backup/ spot player he’s been so far. Hernandez could be the fringe starter he appeared to be last year.

Or this could be a young progressing unit that finally will gel and catch a break.

All we saw today is the interior of the line got curb stomped by a good team. Today was bad, and outside of Thomas, coming just from this performance, there wasn’t a lot of good.
RE: Anakim  
Anakim : 9/14/2020 11:52 pm : link
In comment 14972379 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
And if Gates ends up being better than those other options?


"If" being the keyword. What confidence do you have that he will be better? No NFL experience at the position. No college experience at the position. And yet he's the starter?
prdave73  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/14/2020 11:53 pm : link
Wrong.

THREE new starters with a total of 14 practices. No preseason. No OTAs.

You don't just throw a new line together in 14 practices and play one of the best defensive fronts in football (and most complicated too with all of their stunts) and expect them to play well.

Jesus Christ.
Anakim  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/14/2020 11:54 pm : link
Because I trust Jason Garrett and Marc Colomobo.
RE: prdave73  
Anakim : 9/14/2020 11:54 pm : link
In comment 14972390 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Wrong.

THREE new starters with a total of 14 practices. No preseason. No OTAs.

You don't just throw a new line together in 14 practices and play one of the best defensive fronts in football (and most complicated too with all of their stunts) and expect them to play well.

Jesus Christ.


I agree with you there and like I said, I understand the predicament, but isn't that all the more reason to start a center with a proven track record?
Anakim  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/14/2020 11:55 pm : link
If you are asking me if we should have started Spencer Pulley, then I would say we are wasting time.

Fuck, why not bring Eli back?
RE: RE: 3 drafts,  
John In CO : 9/14/2020 11:59 pm : link
In comment 14972366 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 14972357 Enzo said:


Quote:


3 cracks at free agency, and the sell-off of several veterans for picks....and still a big huge gaping hole in the offensive line. Pure incompetence.



The line is going to be fine.

I used to think Giants fans were smart.

I don't think that anymore.


One of the things that drives me nuts about fans in general....they dont seem to understand that there is a thing called player development. Its always you are what you are, and thats what you will continue to be. This was this kids FIRST COMPETITIVE GAME EVER at Center,-no OTA's, no preseason games...nothing.. and he did it against the friggin Pittsburgh Steelers!Oh, and with a new OL coach as well. He had a bad game...so thats that, throw that experiement out, pull him. End of story. JFC, were people really expecting him to play like Mike Webster right out of the box?
RE: Anakim  
PatersonPlank : 9/15/2020 12:00 am : link
In comment 14972394 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Because I trust Jason Garrett and Marc Colomobo.


Garrett and Colombo will get this figured out. They already started in the 2nd half by changing formations (more TE's etc). Also a lot of it is the RB's and TE's too. I feel confident that we have good enough talent, and that the coaches know what they are doing
Fleming wasn't too far behind him either  
Breeze_94 : 9/15/2020 12:02 am : link
the sack where Jones got nailed was awful...Fleming pretty much let two guys run by him.

Also got pushed back resulting in a few negative runs.

How long until we see Peart at RT? Can't get much worse tbh.

Don't want to give up on Gates just yet. This was his first game at a new position, with no live reps in preseason going against a strong PIT DL to boot.
I thought he was ok in pass pro...  
BillKo : 9/15/2020 12:03 am : link
...but was getting tossed around in the run game.

First game at center, let's see how he progresses.

Again, this was a vet defense and a good defense with virtually no changes from last year.

Tough matchup for our new OL.
RE: Fleming wasn't too far behind him either  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/15/2020 12:05 am : link
In comment 14972410 Breeze_94 said:
Quote:
the sack where Jones got nailed was awful...Fleming pretty much let two guys run by him.

Also got pushed back resulting in a few negative runs.

How long until we see Peart at RT? Can't get much worse tbh.

Don't want to give up on Gates just yet. This was his first game at a new position, with no live reps in preseason going against a strong PIT DL to boot.


Everyone knows that Flmeing is a placeholder for Peart.

But again, do you know who Fleming was playing against?

Do you guys know anything about the Steelers front seven? They have three All-Pros up there.
RE: Anakim  
Anakim : 9/15/2020 12:05 am : link
In comment 14972398 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
If you are asking me if we should have started Spencer Pulley, then I would say we are wasting time.

Fuck, why not bring Eli back?


Neither. Pulley and Halapio suck, but Gates is completely unproven and new to the position. I'm asking you whether you wouldn't have preferred a C with a good track record either in college (like Matt Hennessy or Lloyd Cushenberry III) or in the pros (like Justin Britt, but I'm not sure what his health status is). Pio and Pulley have proven they can't be starting C in the NFL, but Gates hasn't proved it either and the only reason we have some confidence that he can is because we trust the coaching staff.


Gates could work out and let's hope he does, but it essentially feels like we have blind faith that it happens.
RE: Anakim  
WillVAB : 9/15/2020 12:05 am : link
In comment 14972379 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
And if Gates ends up being better than those other options?


The Giants haven’t had a good OL in 10+ years. They haven’t earned the benefit of the doubt.

A shitty team with a decade of shitty OL play throwing a project in as the starting Center? Yea smart money is on that guy not being the next O’Hara.
RE: RE: RE: 3 drafts,  
Enzo : 9/15/2020 12:05 am : link
In comment 14972402 John In CO said:
Quote:
In comment 14972366 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


In comment 14972357 Enzo said:


Quote:


3 cracks at free agency, and the sell-off of several veterans for picks....and still a big huge gaping hole in the offensive line. Pure incompetence.



The line is going to be fine.

I used to think Giants fans were smart.

I don't think that anymore.



One of the things that drives me nuts about fans in general....they dont seem to understand that there is a thing called player development. Its always you are what you are, and thats what you will continue to be. This was this kids FIRST COMPETITIVE GAME EVER at Center,-no OTA's, no preseason games...nothing.. and he did it against the friggin Pittsburgh Steelers!Oh, and with a new OL coach as well. He had a bad game...so thats that, throw that experiement out, pull him. End of story. JFC, were people really expecting him to play like Mike Webster right out of the box?

Call me crazy, but I'd like to root for a team that doesn't have to play a guy in his first game at a key position in a professional fucking game.
RE: prdave73  
prdave73 : 9/15/2020 12:06 am : link
In comment 14972390 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Wrong.

THREE new starters with a total of 14 practices. No preseason. No OTAs.

You don't just throw a new line together in 14 practices and play one of the best defensive fronts in football (and most complicated too with all of their stunts) and expect them to play well.

Jesus Christ.


Eric Wrong.. I get what your trying to say trust me, but this kind of stuff doesn't happen much if at all. We are talking about one of the best RB in the game, and he gets .5 yds for entire 4 quarters of FOOTBALL??!? I don't care how good Pitts Def is, no excuse. We have seen other teams rebuild their Olines, this rarely happens. Even when Ex pro-bowlers like Zeitler regress somehow and play like average joes when they join this team?! It doesn't make sense..
Enzo  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/15/2020 12:06 am : link
So you would have started Pulley and started the Gates experiment when?

Answer the question.
RE: Enzo  
Enzo : 9/15/2020 12:08 am : link
In comment 14972423 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
So you would have started Pulley and started the Gates experiment when?

Answer the question.

that's a stupid question. A competent front office gives the coaches better options than that.

prdave73  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/15/2020 12:08 am : link
WRONG.

It makes perfect sense.

14 practices. 14. That's never happened before.

We have three new starters, one center who has never played the position and a rookie.

We're facing three all-pros in the front seven of the Steelers defense and their other front seven guys are damn good too.

I can't help you anymore than explain it that way.
Enzo  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/15/2020 12:11 am : link
No. It's not a stupid question. The Giants had 14 practices to get decide to start Gates, Pulley, Lemieux, Haycraft, or Halapio.

14.

You are avoiding the question now.

Garrett and Colombo - who coached in Dallas - made the decision that Gates is the best long-term option.

You on the other hand, want immediate results, no matter how unrealistic they are.
Colombo is going to have his hands full  
Anakim : 9/15/2020 12:12 am : link
Basically the only guy he can "leave alone" is Zeitler. He has two rookies in Thomas and Peart, a guy who is completely new to the position in Gates, and a young guard who took a step back last season in Hernandez. Not to mention the project that is Shane Lemieux.


He's going to be one busy man all season long. He'll earn his paycheck.
...  
christian : 9/15/2020 12:12 am : link
I’m struggling to understand why getting absolutely rolled by a very good defense is a positive indication. At best, I’d argue hopefully the Giants line isn’t this tremendously, historically bad (if you consider the rush stats.)

Hopefully the line gels and this was by far the low point. Because even incremental progress and an adjustment for level competition isn’t getting this to an acceptable level.
Pages: 1 2 3 | Show All |  Next>>
Back to the Corner