for display only
Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

DJones highest PFF graded offensive player last evening

Andrew in Austin : 9/15/2020 10:29 am
I know we simultaneously like to pan and celebrate PFF, so take it however you would like.

DJ was the highest graded offensive player last night with 2 interesting notes:

1. Highest grade of his career
2. Under pressure more than any other QB this past weekend (26 times)

I'm definitely in the positive camp after the game. First time in a while I didn't feel sick watching the team after a loss. They played tough and were in the game!

Yay for actual coaching . . .


PFF NY Giants Link ... - ( New Window )
Not happy about the loss (who is)  
Dave on the UWS : 9/15/2020 10:35 am : link
but the arrow I think, is pointing up. The teaching from this staff was evident, and is ongoing. I think the weak areas will improve week to week. If they can play the Steelers tough, then they can play the Bears, Niners, Rams and Cowboys tough too. And as they improve, the wins WILL follow.
This..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 9/15/2020 10:42 am : link
is yet another highlight on the incompetence of PFF ratings
I'm a Jones fan  
GiantsRage2007 : 9/15/2020 10:48 am : link
And he did some good things last night, but the 2 picks is just a continuation of his turnover propensity.

I have to say that last td drive in garbage time prob padded his stat line pretty good.

No way this game was better than the TB game or Wash game last yr.

said it on Britt's thread but his and Garrett's performances  
Eric on Li : 9/15/2020 11:01 am : link
were by far the biggest bright spot.

A 2nd year QB
Game 1 of a new offensive install
An OC in his first game with that QB and first game calling plays in almost a decade
running game unable to get on track
OL with new starters in 3 positions and a first time center

vs.

the best defense in the NFL a year ago, 100% healthy, applying relentless pressure all night

PFF's grade is hard to quantify but just look at the raw stats from Jones:

63% completions (+1% over last year)
280 yards (+50 over last year per game avg)
2tds (would pace to 30+ for the season)
8/15 on 3rd down (+20% over last year)
1/1 on 4th down
2 first downs rushing

Obviously the 2 turnovers were disastrous. But pressure busts pipes. Being under siege from a pass rush like that will result in turnovers and mistakes. That is part of the maturing process as the season moves along.

But if last night is the floor, that's one hell of a high floor for him and Garrett. It's certainly a higher floor than what he did last year - which was already near record setting even missing a few games.
Outside of the Goalline O  
Biteymax22 : 9/15/2020 11:07 am : link
Jones played well. How this grades as his best game is beyond me though, just off the top of my head the Redskins game last year should have graded higher.

I just don't understand PFF grades at all.
.  
Gruber : 9/15/2020 11:11 am : link
It wasn't a game I expected us to win. I take away the positive that we didn't embarrass ourselves as the Jets did.
I mean our overall performance held up. Obviously the run game was historically absent. But otherwise I believe we can build upon last night's experience.
RE: Outside of the Goalline O  
Bill L : 9/15/2020 11:14 am : link
In comment 14972974 Biteymax22 said:
Quote:
Jones played well. How this grades as his best game is beyond me though, just off the top of my head the Redskins game last year should have graded higher.

I just don't understand PFF grades at all.

Me either.

But I wonder if that performance under pressure metric carries a ton of weight in their calculations?
the PFF metrics definitely take into account situational difficulty  
Eric on Li : 9/15/2020 11:20 am : link
they have individual stats they input into the calculation like high difficulty throws and throws under pressure. Jones likely fared very well in those stats.
RE: said it on Britt's thread but his and Garrett's performances  
allstarjim : 9/15/2020 11:27 am : link
In comment 14972967 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
were by far the biggest bright spot.

A 2nd year QB
Game 1 of a new offensive install
An OC in his first game with that QB and first game calling plays in almost a decade
running game unable to get on track
OL with new starters in 3 positions and a first time center

vs.

the best defense in the NFL a year ago, 100% healthy, applying relentless pressure all night

PFF's grade is hard to quantify but just look at the raw stats from Jones:

63% completions (+1% over last year)
280 yards (+50 over last year per game avg)
2tds (would pace to 30+ for the season)
8/15 on 3rd down (+20% over last year)
1/1 on 4th down
2 first downs rushing

Obviously the 2 turnovers were disastrous. But pressure busts pipes. Being under siege from a pass rush like that will result in turnovers and mistakes. That is part of the maturing process as the season moves along.

But if last night is the floor, that's one hell of a high floor for him and Garrett. It's certainly a higher floor than what he did last year - which was already near record setting even missing a few games.



I didn't see the first pick. The second one, down by the goal line...just a horrible play. You know Dupree is right there bearing down, you have to throw that ball away, which he had time to do. He's outside of the tackle box, and he has to understand there's nowhere to go with the football, recognize it, get rid of it and move on, and he just hangs on to it too long.

I know it's one play, but those kinds of plays are the difference between winning and losing. There's a lot to be encouraged about, but that play was infuriating...it's a rookie-level mistake and he needs to not make more of those.
Agree  
Andrew in Austin : 9/15/2020 11:32 am : link
with the folks in that I didn't think it was Jones best game ever. What it did point out to me was that Jones overall did well under duress. It also made me realize that maybe our pass blocking wasn't as good as I thought. Perhaps Jones bailed out the OL a bit.

Hopefully he can get rid of some of the mistakes / interceptions, but I still like him playing aggressive overall. Our offense is going nowhere with our running game in its current state.
Yes two INT's are more than you want your QB to throw  
jsuds : 9/15/2020 11:41 am : link
But seriously, the pick by Watt was just a phenomenal play by a very talented player. The replay showed Watt was virtually invisible to Jones whose view was obstructed by the blocker in front of Watt.
I was encouraged  
Josh in the City : 9/15/2020 11:44 am : link
by what I saw from Jones last night. He needs to clean up the turnovers but he showed me a lot.
RE: RE: Outside of the Goalline O  
Biteymax22 : 9/15/2020 11:45 am : link
In comment 14972991 Bill L said:
Quote:
In comment 14972974 Biteymax22 said:


Quote:


Jones played well. How this grades as his best game is beyond me though, just off the top of my head the Redskins game last year should have graded higher.

I just don't understand PFF grades at all.


Me either.

But I wonder if that performance under pressure metric carries a ton of weight in their calculations?


It may, I can see them giving a higher grade for "plays under duress" than in a clean pocket.
PFF..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 9/15/2020 11:59 am : link
has far too much subjectivity, reviewed by some analysts with little to no football experience to be even directionally reliable in most of their rankings. And they continue to take away from the analytics movement because they are positioning opinions as factual data points.
RE: I'm a Jones fan  
Toth029 : 9/15/2020 12:28 pm : link
In comment 14972926 GiantsRage2007 said:
Quote:
And he did some good things last night, but the 2 picks is just a continuation of his turnover propensity.

I have to say that last td drive in garbage time prob padded his stat line pretty good.

No way this game was better than the TB game or Wash game last yr.


They don't care about stat lines.

It's in context play and drive basis. How the amount of times he's rushed, guys covered or open, and so on.

He was hurried 26 times last night. Most of any QB in Week 1.
And  
Toth029 : 9/15/2020 12:29 pm : link
Keep in mind they didnt love the Jones pick by the Giants. So he's getting rare love.
"Under pressure more than any other QB this past weekend (26 times)"  
Dave in Hoboken : 9/15/2020 12:35 pm : link
And our OL's pass-protection (which apparently was the worst in the league this week) was actually better than their run-blocking. That is absolutely pathetic on every level. I know the Steelers have a very good defense, but come on. They're not the '85 Bears, and they are NOT the 2000 Ravens. How many more seasons do we have to have a terrible OL? I'm not even asking for a great OL. Hell, not even a very good OL. Just give me a serviceable/competent OL and I'll be happy. Our OL is consistently awful for so long now spanning TWO GM's and almost a full decade now. How is this even possible? Yes, their are other bad and really bad OL's out there. But not all of those teams have had sub-par OL's for nearly a full decade now. But the Giants HAVE. It's like a never-ending twilight zone of failure with this team's OL. Absolutely maddening.
Unfortunately  
crick n NC : 9/15/2020 12:41 pm : link
When adding new players (rookie at LT, experienced player at Center, while learning a whole new system) we are going to have to give them time to work together. I was absolutely frustrated with the run blocking more than anything last night, but I'm afraid some of it is part of the process I described above.
More from PFF  
pjcas18 : 9/15/2020 12:48 pm : link
Nick Falato
@nickfalato
per...@PFF_Giants



Lorenzo Carter ranked 10th best EDGE on week
Blake Martinez 7th best off-ball LB
Martinez also led league in STOPS (11)
Daniel Jones ranked 8th in OFF on the week
Tomlinson and DLaw top 15 in DEF for DL on week
Slayton 20th in OFF for WRs on week
RE:  
Bill L : 9/15/2020 12:55 pm : link
In comment 14973130 Dave in Hoboken said:
Quote:
And our OL's pass-protection (which apparently was the worst in the league this week) was actually better than their run-blocking. That is absolutely pathetic on every level. I know the Steelers have a very good defense, but come on. They're not the '85 Bears, and they are NOT the 2000 Ravens. How many more seasons do we have to have a terrible OL? I'm not even asking for a great OL. Hell, not even a very good OL. Just give me a serviceable/competent OL and I'll be happy. Our OL is consistently awful for so long now spanning TWO GM's and almost a full decade now. How is this even possible? Yes, their are other bad and really bad OL's out there. But not all of those teams have had sub-par OL's for nearly a full decade now. But the Giants HAVE. It's like a never-ending twilight zone of failure with this team's OL. Absolutely maddening.


How about one that grows, develops, and improves?
His first interception  
montanagiant : 9/15/2020 1:10 pm : link
Had more to do with Watts making an amazing play then Jones messing up
RE: RE:  
Dave in Hoboken : 9/15/2020 1:12 pm : link
In comment 14973186 Bill L said:
Quote:
In comment 14973130 Dave in Hoboken said:


Quote:


And our OL's pass-protection (which apparently was the worst in the league this week) was actually better than their run-blocking. That is absolutely pathetic on every level. I know the Steelers have a very good defense, but come on. They're not the '85 Bears, and they are NOT the 2000 Ravens. How many more seasons do we have to have a terrible OL? I'm not even asking for a great OL. Hell, not even a very good OL. Just give me a serviceable/competent OL and I'll be happy. Our OL is consistently awful for so long now spanning TWO GM's and almost a full decade now. How is this even possible? Yes, their are other bad and really bad OL's out there. But not all of those teams have had sub-par OL's for nearly a full decade now. But the Giants HAVE. It's like a never-ending twilight zone of failure with this team's OL. Absolutely maddening.



How about one that grows, develops, and improves?


I'm all for that. But...when does that actually begin to take place? Been about an 8 year wait at this point.
RE: RE: RE:  
Bill L : 9/15/2020 1:14 pm : link
In comment 14973218 Dave in Hoboken said:
Quote:
In comment 14973186 Bill L said:


Quote:


In comment 14973130 Dave in Hoboken said:


Quote:


And our OL's pass-protection (which apparently was the worst in the league this week) was actually better than their run-blocking. That is absolutely pathetic on every level. I know the Steelers have a very good defense, but come on. They're not the '85 Bears, and they are NOT the 2000 Ravens. How many more seasons do we have to have a terrible OL? I'm not even asking for a great OL. Hell, not even a very good OL. Just give me a serviceable/competent OL and I'll be happy. Our OL is consistently awful for so long now spanning TWO GM's and almost a full decade now. How is this even possible? Yes, their are other bad and really bad OL's out there. But not all of those teams have had sub-par OL's for nearly a full decade now. But the Giants HAVE. It's like a never-ending twilight zone of failure with this team's OL. Absolutely maddening.



How about one that grows, develops, and improves?



I'm all for that. But...when does that actually begin to take place? Been about an 8 year wait at this point.


I guess, but really one year for Hernandez, one (here) for Zeitler, none (here) for Fleming, none (at OC) for Gates, none (at all) for Thomas.
RE: RE: RE: RE:  
Dave in Hoboken : 9/15/2020 1:17 pm : link
In comment 14973221 Bill L said:
Quote:
In comment 14973218 Dave in Hoboken said:


Quote:


In comment 14973186 Bill L said:


Quote:


In comment 14973130 Dave in Hoboken said:


Quote:


And our OL's pass-protection (which apparently was the worst in the league this week) was actually better than their run-blocking. That is absolutely pathetic on every level. I know the Steelers have a very good defense, but come on. They're not the '85 Bears, and they are NOT the 2000 Ravens. How many more seasons do we have to have a terrible OL? I'm not even asking for a great OL. Hell, not even a very good OL. Just give me a serviceable/competent OL and I'll be happy. Our OL is consistently awful for so long now spanning TWO GM's and almost a full decade now. How is this even possible? Yes, their are other bad and really bad OL's out there. But not all of those teams have had sub-par OL's for nearly a full decade now. But the Giants HAVE. It's like a never-ending twilight zone of failure with this team's OL. Absolutely maddening.



How about one that grows, develops, and improves?



I'm all for that. But...when does that actually begin to take place? Been about an 8 year wait at this point.



I guess, but really one year for Hernandez, one (here) for Zeitler, none (here) for Fleming, none (at OC) for Gates, none (at all) for Thomas.


So, you can see why some might not be that confident along with the last 8 years of sub-par offensive lines.
Overall, but I'm not sure that you can assume that past is prologue  
Bill L : 9/15/2020 1:18 pm : link
.
your damn right he was...  
BillKo : 9/15/2020 3:31 pm : link
....played outstanding (minus the one pick).
RE: This..  
Section331 : 9/15/2020 4:45 pm : link
In comment 14972913 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
is yet another highlight on the incompetence of PFF ratings


This. No need to harp on DJ's mistakes, but to think he played better than Ben or Benny Snell is pretty ridiculous.
RE: Outside of the Goalline O  
BleedBlue : 9/15/2020 5:03 pm : link
In comment 14972974 Biteymax22 said:
Quote:
Jones played well. How this grades as his best game is beyond me though, just off the top of my head the Redskins game last year should have graded higher.

I just don't understand PFF grades at all.


because skins were sacks of shit last year lol PFF knows


jokes aside, the steelers are fucking good, jones played fine. he isnt close to our problems. out problems are run blocking, catching the ball (engram) and second corner. those 3 things could have changed the game last night
I'm sure people would say his best game  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/15/2020 5:08 pm : link
Was the game where he had the most touchdowns but that isn't how advanced stats work. Grade takes into account degree of difficulty of individual plays. A wide open TD against blown coverages weighs less than a tight throw against good coverage for a TD.

Completed passes in the face of heavy rush weigh more than basic completions.
RE: I'm sure people would say his best game  
FatMan in Charlotte : 9/15/2020 5:34 pm : link
In comment 14973591 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
Was the game where he had the most touchdowns but that isn't how advanced stats work. Grade takes into account degree of difficulty of individual plays. A wide open TD against blown coverages weighs less than a tight throw against good coverage for a TD.

Completed passes in the face of heavy rush weigh more than basic completions.


PFF has shown time and again that their subjectivity in determining a "heavy rush" or a "basic completion" renders their results useless.
Snakeoil salesmen  
Sneakers O'toole : 9/15/2020 9:10 pm : link
.
Back to the Corner